Kim Titus: Thumbs Up Foundation

 "There comes a time when we need to stop pulling people out of the river and go upstream to find out why they're falling in." Kim Titus didn't just start a foundation to honour her son, Braden; she started a movement to dismantle a broken system. From a personal tragedy that "transfigured" her world to securing over $1M in funding to pilot a new provincial standard of care, Kim shares the blueprint for moving from "sick care" to true "brain health."

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

What is the cost, though, to the system if they're not getting the help that they need when they need it? What's the cost to uh law and enforcement? What's it to urgent care systems? What's to society?

SPEAKER_00 0:17

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode of Airdrie Inside. I am your host, Chris Glass, and I am here with Kim Titus from the Thumbs Up Foundation. Kim Titus, welcome to the show. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 0:30

Uh thank you for having us.

SPEAKER_00 0:31

We're happy to be here. Well, I'm uh really excited to have you on the show uh to tell your story and to tell uh uh us about the great work that you're doing with the Thumbs Up Foundation. But I want to start off by talking about an event I was at uh a little over a month ago now, I think, uh, where Flacher was playing, uh, and it was called One More Light, and it was just such an excellent event, and it was all in the Thumbs Up Foundation's name.

SPEAKER_02 0:58

Yeah, they're they're amazing. We love them, uh, and we're grateful that they love us too.

unknown 1:04

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:05

Uh and so it was their fifth time of having the event and their fourth time in in support of thumbs up, fourth year. Um, and um we're bonded through our love of music and through our experience with suicide.

SPEAKER_00 1:20

Yeah. And uh I wanted to talk about the music first because I I love seeing our artists rally around your organization. I was at an event in the summer that was chock full of musical talent in support of the Thumbs Up Foundation. So it's great to see everybody rallying behind you.

SPEAKER_02 1:39

Well, when we um started Thumbs Up, uh, we decided, uh consciously decided to focus on the way Braden lived and not how he left. And how he lived was with through a love of music. He was a big foodie, he um loved nature, um, had a chocolate lab reel. Or uh, and so all of that we decided to that's how we and that because we fundamentally believe that's how we're gonna change the world is changing the energy.

SPEAKER_01 2:09

Right.

SPEAKER_02 2:09

Um, that we need to turn the music up, get the good food out, and bring people together um to change a world that needs changing.

SPEAKER_00 2:20

Right. I I love I love hearing good music and good food. Those are two things that hit my my heart uh really close. Uh you mentioned your son. Uh why don't we start there? Uh, because I believe that's the genesis of the thumbs up foundation. So why don't you tell me a little bit about your son?

SPEAKER_02 2:39

Sure. Uh he's um someone we always love to talk about. Uh and I'm sorry that you never got the chance to meet him because um he touched the lives of everyone he met. And so his story was he was 31 years old, grew up born in Airdrie. Um, I like to say this. He came into the world in a rather spectacular way. Um the night he was born, we'd had some friends over. He has two older brothers, uh, and we had some friends, and Kim had a couple of beers, much to my chagrin. And so um I'm like, it's time to go. We gotta go. So we got stopped for speeding on Main Street in Airdrie by the RCMP. There was no Peter Laheat in those days. So he came over and the police officer Kim's like, my wife's having a baby. Um, so he came over and he's like, and I'm like, yeah, we gotta go. Uh so he drove us um lights, flashings, uh, sirens, everything, all the way to Foothills. We ran every red light between Main Street Airdrie and Foothills Hospital.

SPEAKER_00 3:52

Which back then there's like three lights in Airdrie.

SPEAKER_02 3:55

So yeah, but but a lot more in Calgary. Right, right. Uh and when we got there, he said, Give me your keys, I'll park your car, you go. Uh, and so we did. And he when he brought the keys back, brought his card and said, In case it's a boy and you want to name him after me. Oh, wow. Amazing. I talked, I never get an opportunity or miss an opportunity to tell that story to first responders. And I told one the other day, and he's like, that would not happen today.

SPEAKER_01 4:24

No.

SPEAKER_02 4:24

Right? And um, so and then he left in a spectacular way.

SPEAKER_01 4:28

Right.

SPEAKER_02 4:29

Different police force, uh, Calgary police that time, uh, we would not have made it through the day uh without him. Um that's as primal as I've ever got or ever hoped to be. And one of the words that has been introduced to me since um was transfigured. When people go through an event like that, that means to never return to the original state of being, and that your whole view of the world shifts as a result of. Um, and so we uh I individually, uh we as a husband and wife and our family was transfigured by that event. Um, and that set us on a path and a purpose that we need to change the world. Um when I say when six foot one, hundred and ninety-pound men through fall fall through the cracks, there's we can do better. Yeah, we can do better. Uh, and that set us on the mission.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

Now, I'm always blown away by people who take personal tragedies, and this is definitely a personal tragedy, and turn it into something so positive and something that can uh give back so much. Uh we were talking about uh Michelle Bates from the uh Airdre Health Foundation off camera, another person who uh went through something traumatic and turned it into something quite positive. Uh, talk to me about you use the word transfigured, talk to me about that process.

SPEAKER_02 5:52

Um, well, the process itself was a to sit in the grief um and process it um and unpack what grief means. It means it's a little word um that packs a lot of emotions, um, sorrow, regret, loss. Yeah, right. And so getting in touch with that, um, but and then also remembering the essence of the man himself. And he was um his character. And um I know that he would if we surrounded ourselves only in our grief and kind of wrapped it around us like a warm winter coat, uh he would kick our ass. Yeah, he would and say, This is not, this is not what I want you to focus on. And so I know people think of it as strength or it's not, it's a way of honoring him um and and honoring the people who struggle to say it doesn't have to be this way, and so that's that's why we do what we do.

SPEAKER_00 7:01

Well, and then that turned into the Thumbs Ups Foundation. So, how did the idea for thumbs up come about?

SPEAKER_02 7:10

Well, in the beginning, um I was just phoning God and everybody saying we need to make some changes, um, you know, head of Albert Health Services, etc. etc. Anybody would take my call uh and persist with those who who didn't want to first time around. Um, and then um Susan, my for good friend Susan, uh she used to be my boss back in the day, said to me, You need to start a foundation. Yeah, and I said, I am too busy phoning God and everybody, and I wouldn't even know the first um way to start a foundation. And she said, That's what I'm for. So we blame her. Okay. And she um, you know, it hasn't been an easy journey. We've been pushing a very, very big and heavy boulder uphill. Um, we don't fit in easily into a box, which is part of why we're grateful to for you to to extend an invitation to us, um, because we're we're not a food bank. Um, we don't we're not trying to build a hospital, uh, we're not trying to um work with the homeless, we're trying to change a system. Yeah. And uh that is, I say this, we're kind of how we paraphrase it is helping heal healthcare. Yeah. Uh, and I've said this in other rooms is if you don't know that healthcare needs some healing, I want your life.

SPEAKER_00 8:39

Yeah. But I think you I you bring up such an interesting point uh about um not fitting into a box because a lot of times when we think about fixing healthcare, you know, we think of building a hospital, we think of ambulance response times, we think of how long it takes for a knee replacement or a hip replacement. Mental health is really such a hidden, uh hidden area of healthcare. And, you know, it's funny, even when you go to work, right? You can take a sick day for having COVID, you could take a sick day if you break your arm, but taking a mental health day is really doesn't fit into the sickness bucket, if you will, for a lot of employers. So a lot of people fight through it and uh end up putting themselves at risk. What do you see the system needing to do?

SPEAKER_02 9:30

That's a loaded question.

SPEAKER_00 9:32

We have a lot of time on the show, and the less I talk, the better. So I like to ask powerful questions.

SPEAKER_02 9:38

Yeah, that's a hugely loaded question. Uh, and thank you for asking it. Um so there's in 2019 we did a um mental health task force. Uh so thumbs up funded it. We were the catalyst for it, and we brought together RCMP, Rocky View School Division, primary care, the mayor sat on. Um, and we were very, very fortunate to have a doctor, Tom Feesbee, who um his background is neurology and he's a past dean of the coming school of medicine, uh, facilitate it for us. So we worked together for a year. One of the things that Thumbs Up insisted on, because that's who we are, is the people, um, is that we would survey the community because we thought Airdrie's pretty typical demographic, maybe slightly younger demographic than a typical, but pretty typical. Uh, and so when we surveyed the community, um, 50% of them told us that their needs were either not being met addressed or were being inadequately addressed. So everything we do, that's a part of our approach as well, is not to, oh, we got to overhaul, start it all from the beginning, you know, scratch. It's keep doing the 50% that we're doing well, and let's focus on the room for improvement in the other 50%. Yeah. And that's the space that we take up in the beginning, since we started them, that people were reaching out. And I had when we did the mental health task force, um, someone that sat around the table said, Why are they calling you? And I'm like, that might be a question y'all might want to ask yourself.

SPEAKER_01 11:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:13

Why aren't they calling you?

unknown 11:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:16

Because we're not we're not a service provider, we're an advocacy group trying to change a system.

SPEAKER_01 11:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:21

And so, in many cases, you've had them. And they haven't found 50% of them told us that they haven't found the help and the support that they needed.

SPEAKER_01 11:29

Right.

SPEAKER_02 11:30

Right. I say this if if you had a restaurant in your town and you had a 50% chance of getting a good meal.

SPEAKER_00 11:36

Yeah, you probably wouldn't go back to that restaurant.

SPEAKER_02 11:38

Right? You certainly wouldn't take your company there if they're visiting from out of town. Yeah, you can't do it. You know, that that kind of thing. So it's it's that we can do better, right? It's not to villainize and demonize the good works that uh the your other organizations and approaches are doing. It's we can do better. And so, um, you know, the best way I can explain uh thumbs up is Desmond is a Desmond quote. Okay. And he says, Um, there comes a time when we need to stop uh pulling people out of the river, and we need to go upstream and find out why they're falling in in the first place. And that's that's I can't think of a better way to describe thumbs up is yes, we um work with people who reach out. We're not a service provider, yeah, but we need to know broader than our own personal lived experience. Yeah, and it's it's sadly all too common. Um, it's very prevalent. Um, it is here in our alive and well, and I use that um term loosely in our community.

SPEAKER_01 12:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:44

Um, we it's not as visible perhaps as other communities, but we have our issues uh in in the community, and um we can do better.

SPEAKER_00 12:56

So that is how the thumbs up started, and uh you're an advocacy group uh looking to change the system. What are some changes you'd like to see?

SPEAKER_02 13:08

Well, um we've been very, very fortunate. I want to give a shout out to um Emily Pitt. She's been very helpful. She had her and Braden actually went to school together.

SPEAKER_00 13:18

Oh yeah. I coach uh her son over at George Mackinac. Oh, do you? Shout out, Brady. You made the show.

SPEAKER_02 13:24

Another Brady.

SPEAKER_00 13:26

No, Brady.

SPEAKER_02 13:27

Oh Brady. Yeah, but uh well, there were those that called our Braden Brady as well. So, but um, you know, she was very instrumental in helping um shine a light on us and the world, what we were trying to change. We've received over a million dollars of funding from the government to test uh whether our approach to care produced better outcomes or not. Um, and so as I said, we're not a service provider. What we do is um approach mental health with a hub and spoke uh mentality. And our our where we're trying to get to is to build a brain center, which will be the hub. Um we're right now um at the early stages of in um entering into an agreement with the Veterans Association of Calgary. They approached us because they say they their words not mine, um, they don't get them off the hamster wheel. And they are so appreciative of the work that we've done in testing our system. We've had it professionally evaluated to very good outcomes. Um, and they want us to teach them how to uh fish in our harmonized health pool and embed that into their infrastructure. Right. So we're just currently trying to raise the funds to take that initiative on, uh both them doing it and us doing our own. Um, and um we have the University of Calgary on standby to because we're looking to have someone um take us it on as a research project as well, in terms of um, because it's not just about in when you're talking about systemic change, um, it's not just about um cost and it's about value for clients, participants, yeah. Um, but also what's the cost-benefit savings? So if you're moving it upstream, then how what's the downstream uh savings? Yeah, right. And um one of the statistics that we use is a um mental health and loss predict productivity, um, which you alluded to earlier, about mental health days, etc., is a$51 billion opportunity within within the country.

SPEAKER_01 15:49

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 15:50

Um about two and a half billion in Alberta um based on population, uh, six and a half billion for veterans. Um, and so it's that can we, what's the cost benefit saving if we move upstream and start. We have a government right now that's very focused downstream. And I'm I I my language, I only know one way to speak, kind of straight up, straight at, but yeah, is we're focused on the wrong end of the horse. Yes, we need to, but we know what comes out of that. Let's move upstream and let's put treatment centers out of business. Yeah, there's an idea, right? I mean, it's grandiose, obviously, but I'm and I'm being facetious when I say it, but it's that we don't want people because we we have a system that's very focused on sick care, yeah, acute care, yeah. But and there's some of it, mental health and and addiction being one, is it's in a a chronic it's a chronic illness. So where does that fit in? And when are we going to to move upstream and start to change it so that you know we have a crises now from COVID, you know, and we're starting to see that in terms of populations, younger and younger, kids that you know have been impacted by it because the world was crazy there for a while.

SPEAKER_01 17:09

Yeah, right?

SPEAKER_02 17:10

Human connection, the brain research shows human connection is a big part of keeping our meaningful human connection, is a big part of keeping our brains healthy. Music is a big part of keeping our be brains healthy, nature is a big part of keeping our brains healthy. All of those, so let's incorporate that into the system, uh, and still doing the cute care when it needs to, yeah, but that's not the focus. If we move it upstream, what could happen?

SPEAKER_00 17:39

Well, it's just it's just like anything, right? You you fix your car, uh, you do the preventative maintenance on your car, you don't have an engine failure, right? So do you want to spend 20,000 bucks getting a new engine, or do you want or a new vehicle, or do you want to spend the the 30 bucks getting your oil changed all the time?

SPEAKER_02 17:56

Right? Yeah, right. And and it's about that awareness and education. You know, there's so much opportunity to just yeah, we've done a I was at a um mental health kind of symposium and um they had a panel that was talking about it because it's a hot topic to talk about, yeah. Um, and say we've done a much, much better job of um, you know, uh removing, and I don't use the word stigma, uh there's a reason for that, but removing stigma um so that people will actually talk about, etc. But she said, but what hasn't kept pace is the services, yeah. Right? Um part of when we wear our advocacy hat when is that why can I take my Alberta healthcare card to my family physics? If health is health and there's equality between physical and mental health, which we all talk that talk now, um if there is equality, how come I can take my health care card to my family physician, but I can't take it to my counselor? Yeah, it's the number two cost is the number two reason why people don't seek help.

SPEAKER_01 19:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:04

Right? And so what and what are and so what is the cost though to the system? If they're not getting the help that they need when they need it, what's the cost to uh law and enforcement? What's it to urgent care systems, what's to society, you know, what's the cost of not uh paying for that, right?

SPEAKER_00 19:27

Yeah, and you know, it's it's funny that we sit around and talk about costs like it's dollars and cents. Um, and and in a lot of ways it is, and I understand that side of it, but these are people we're talking about, yes, right? And that can't really be measured. That's not something you could put a price tag on if somebody loses their life uh due to suicide. There's not a price you can put on that. So, you know, there's a whole nother cost to it that's not being considered. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 19:54

And that's what that's one of the things that I say, I don't know, what's the cost of a human life these days? Right? And you know, I've talked to people who they who we're trying to engage them to help help us change the world. Um, and it's it it's that it's it's like is one suicide enough? I mean, the numbers are going like this, so you know, at what point in time do we get attention? Because it's not just speaking in the language of dollars and cents, it's the human cost, it's the emotional cost, it's the um the wreckage, right? Right, that what's left in the wake when these things happen, and suicide being the extreme end of it, but I I talked to families almost daily who are in fact, I talked to a woman last week, and it was I said to her, I'm overwhelmed hearing your story. Yeah, I can't imagine what it is living that, and so how can we help? Yeah, right, and so that's that's a part of what we do. So their stories now become uh interwoven into the fabric of ours, right? It's their stories are um as tragic and overwhelming and as as Brayden's, yeah. Um the different the outcomes are different at this point in time. Um, but that's why we need to change the world.

SPEAKER_00 21:23

Yeah. I want to pick on something you said there because I I I think it was interesting. You talked about stigma and you don't like to use that word. Tell me why. I will I'm happy to.

SPEAKER_02 21:33

Thanks for asking. So early on with thumbs up, we were at a um an event in Calgary. Um, I think it was drug overdose awareness day or something. We were invited to it. Uh, and there was, I don't know, five, six, eight um keynote speakers, kind of guest speakers speaking. Um, and I should say this in my other life, uh prior to losing Braden, uh, I used to write poetry. Okay. And so So uh even though I've been known on occasion to have a bit of a potty mouth, um uh words are really important uh to me. And it's you know, that is poetry trying to say make the most impact with the fewest amount of words. Um and that night I heard Kim and I heard um stigma, stigma, stigma, stigma. And I'm like, what is this word stigma? I think I know, but do I? And so after went searching, and stigma is identified as or is described as um a stain or a mark of disrespect on someone's character or reputation. Yeah, and so that would say if I were to accept that there is stigma, this is just how I process it, uh, if I were to accept that there was stigma around suicide, I would have to accept that there's a mark or a stain of disrespect on Braden's character or reputation, and I don't, and I won't, right? And so we use these words and we do that, and it becomes the norm, and we just bandy this around. It's like, and then um Buddha told us if someone presents us with a gift and we don't accept it, then to whom does the gift belong? Yeah, and so if we don't accept the gift of stigma, sometimes we are stigmatizing people who may not feel stigmatized, right? But we're telling them they should be because you're homeless or you have addiction or or or and their stigma is like, is there? There doesn't have to be, right? It could be a situation, and I know other people have a different context of the word stigma, and but that's kind of how I process it. And so, and I had a conversation about this early on with thumbs up, uh, and a woman said to me, Well, if you don't use the stigma, what do you use? And I'm like, Great question.

SPEAKER_00 23:54

Well, that was gonna be my next question.

SPEAKER_02 23:56

Yeah, okay. Well, great question. Perfect.

SPEAKER_00 23:59

You said that three times, so I think I'm doing my doing my job as an interviewer today.

SPEAKER_02 24:04

It's uh I use the word uh fear, yeah. I use the word ignorance in the truest sense of the word, uh, meaning lack of information and knowledge, not to be ignorant to say it, that you're ignorant because you use that word. It's that there's ignorance there, there's lack of understanding, there's lack of knowledge, there's it's fear-based. We it's there's a lot of different it's it's sort of like I said earlier about grief, packs a powerful lot of emotion, right? There's a lot packed into, and so it's unpacking it and saying because when we look at where and unpack it, that's where the opportunities lie in terms of making change. And that woman that day said, I'll never use the word again.

SPEAKER_00 24:52

Well, I just made a mental note not to use it myself because I I wouldn't want people to think uh that I was thinking of a stain or a mark on someone's character. Uh I I I think uh the reason why people suffer in silence is because conversations like this and conversations that are taking place uh now that weren't taking place before uh just weren't happening. So people didn't see the connection between my personal story and my personal experience with mental health addiction or suicide with your uh story. And then when we get to a point where we're sharing information and sharing stories, we find out that this is touching everybody. It's not it's not your silo, it's the whole world that's facing this.

SPEAKER_02 25:38

A hundred percent. Um and that even um there was um and he actually and he introduced me to the word transfigured. He's a Catholic priest at a Calgary, and um who we we had a mutual association. Uh his friend that he grew up with and a guy that we were working with. Um and at the time he did a sermon, um, I'm not Catholic, I think they're called sermons, um on um suicide, right at the time that COVID was changing the world.

SPEAKER_01 26:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:14

And he's like, We we shut down the world, but the co the suicide statistics have been far outpacing COVID.

SPEAKER_01 26:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:26

So what's the difference here? Right? What's the difference? And why that and not here, right? And part of it is because it has been stigmatized, people don't talk about it, they don't know what to do with all of those feelings and emotions that come up. They don't want to, you know, some really bad things happen to really good families, yeah. Right? That that's and we don't, but we don't have that because we want to sometimes put them in a box, oh you know, that that kind of thing. And it's it's about that. It's like kick the doors open, yeah, shine the light on it, turn the music up, get the food out. Let's talk about this, right? Right, you know, because you because too, once we do and we're we share our vulnerabilities, it's that it's what um um Dr. Seuss, it's that you what you too? Yeah, right, exactly. And and because to your point, 100% of it. And if you haven't been personally affected by you know someone who has, yeah, right. And if you don't even know someone personally that has, it's in your community, and so you're being impacted one way or another, whether you're conscious and aware of it in the moment and could put a face to it, it's still the energy's still here.

SPEAKER_00 27:45

Yeah, and and I and I think that's really the future. That's where I think we we can start making that change, is by having uh having that commonality and uh you know, even small things, right? Like um I think it starts in the workplace of uh work uh starting to take mental health uh and addiction on the same level as a physical uh I broke a leg kind of situation, you know. Like let's take it seriously from all avenues, and and you know, you throw out cost, right? I I can just see some employer saying, if we did that, do you know how many more sick days we'd have to give? I'm like, isn't that better than having somebody going through a mental health crisis in your place of work? But I would also challenge that kind of thinking too, saying would you because if you move it upstream, right?

SPEAKER_02 28:33

And or how many people want to come and work at your your place of employment because you've normalized this and you're now you're an employer of choice because you you get it. Um the other um thing about the whole journey is the whole um when we say mental and physical health, right? We speak now more in the language of brain health. Yeah, right. I'm a I'm a big believer there's gonna come a time when we're distinguishing old school thinkers and new school thinkers by language, yeah. And mental health and addiction, okay, yeah, but it's there's there is a physiology to it. There's an organ in the body called the brain, and when it isn't working optimally, it can manifest itself in some ways that are not conducive to good healthy living.

SPEAKER_01 29:23

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 29:24

So it isn't um, you know, for because for me, mental health is kind of like leprechauns and unicorns, like okay, and it's been treated as such.

SPEAKER_00 29:33

Absolutely, 100% it's been treated that way, right? You know, it's it's funny, it's it's by nowhere near on the same level, but uh the parallel that I think of is concussions in football. So when I started coaching, actually it started when I was a player. If you got a concussion, it was kind of funny. You know, I didn't I don't remember that half of the game, you know. Oh, he's a chicken, you know what I mean? Like and people would joke about it, and then you know, we saw some real downstream consequences that the cost was too much for the community to bear. So instead of treating the concussions when you're 40 or 50 and your brain has a bunch of holes in it from the proteins that are going wrong, uh, we're fixing it at the beginning of the game. We're teaching coaches how to tackle differently. Uh we're teaching players uh how to protect themselves. Uh when somebody has a concussion, instead of treating it like a joke, they get removed from the game and there's a return to play protocol that's mouth guards now. It's mouth guards and new helmets. But even fundament, but like I said, fundamentally, we had to go back to the very start and change the way we played football in order to get a better outcome that the cost wasn't so high. Yes. So it can be done. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 30:46

It can't impossible. No, and it but it takes a shift, a paradigm shift in thinking to some degree. And we often have to get so the problem is is escalating, then it's like, oh, okay, we need to fix this now, right? And and that's that's where we are with mental health and addiction, what we now call brain health, right? It's like there is a better way. Uh, and it's not just about talk therapy, right? There's not, it's not that, you know, one of the things that we've coined, you know, that um commercial, what's in your wallet?

SPEAKER_01 31:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:20

Okay. Well, as I've taken that and kind of coined that and adopted in my own, is it's is what's in your toolkit.

SPEAKER_01 31:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:26

Right. And it's about building that personal toolkits for people because what's in your toolkit will be different than mine. There's some core things that could can be helpful. Um, what we have is um our professionals have developed what we call a comprehensive treatment evaluation, which we, when we wear an advocacy hat, thinks it should be the standard. So it's a it's not a psych evaluation, it's not a psychological evaluation, it's a bio, psychosocial, spiritual, meaning direction or purpose in life.

SPEAKER_01 31:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:54

That that should be the starting point. And then and then counseling for sure, because we can all benefit from from that. So that's the kind of the hammer and the screwdriver. But then it's um empowering people to build their own toolkit. Yeah, it's based on values, your value system, your belief system, your hobbies, your the things that grab your attention, football or music or art, or you know, if you're you're a culture guy, right? It's all of those. That's those are things that belong in a tool, in certain people's toolkits.

SPEAKER_00 32:27

And that sense of belonging to a larger community is is huge.

SPEAKER_02 32:31

Huge.

SPEAKER_00 32:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:31

Huge. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 32:33

And and I find when we start making some of those connections, like uh, like you brought up the culture side of it with Airdrie Culture Fest, one of the things we saw was like-minded communities finding each other. And then the next year, that's now like a tighter circle uh of people who feel a belonging to their own culture, and you can see the change, right? You could see how happy and how proud and how much more of a sense of purpose people have.

SPEAKER_02 32:58

Um that's community. Yeah, absolutely. That's community.

SPEAKER_00 33:01

Yeah. Yes. So speaking of communities, you have laid out a model, you've laid out kind of a framework. Is there places that are doing this now? Is there countries that are on the forefront of this or communities that are pushing this, or which which doctors are really the ones who are on the forefront of this? Um, I was gonna say good question because it's you can. Um I think we're the number one rated podcast in air drink, so um three, I think.

SPEAKER_02 33:31

So we've done been very fortunate in having a um a relationship and it's growing all the time with the University of Calgary. Um, and we're so the ha had some students from the Haskian School of Business picked us up as their capstone project. Um, and we asked them to go and because part of the brain center concept is bringing best practices.

SPEAKER_01 33:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:59

Um, and they went outside the boundaries of Alberta and couldn't find another organization doing what we're doing. Um that's what we're creating a future that has not existed yet. That's part of why the boulder is so big and heavy and the side of the mountain is so steep. Um, and so um they couldn't find that. Um, the last summer, the masters of management students um did a slightly different approach to what they were um typically doing. So they used to bring in different organizations like Thumbsa, divide the class, and get them each to do their piece. And what they found was organizations like ours are complex, we don't fit into a box, so it was hard to sort of get below the surface.

SPEAKER_01 34:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:45

And so what they did as a trial kind of pilot last year was they brought in one organization, Thumbsa, and divided the 40 students into and said each take a piece. And so we asked them to focus on the brain center concept, which is the future we're trying to create that doesn't exist yet.

SPEAKER_01 35:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:05

And they told us these 40 were really smart. Our future's in pretty good hands. Yeah, it's a pretty smart school. Oh yeah, they're impressive. Um, the only thing they didn't tell was how to for us how to take them with us on the journey, but yeah, um, but what they told is feasible, it's doable, and the value is there, right? So we just that it helped us keep on keeping on, right? Because because of that, right? So it's and uh last f and she'll she'll be happy um or given has given me permission in the past to share her story. I met with a woman who lost her son to suicide. Uh we actually went for lunch at Sorso's. She doesn't live in Eirdry, and um in that she had two sons and she lost one to suicide. And she said, you know, he's not the son we worried about. And I'm like, no. And she said, no. And the one that we did worry about, she said, we did everything right. We took him to California, we had grain imaging, neurofeed imaging, etc., etc. And I said, Yeah, why is that? And she's like, Why is what? I said, Why do you have to leave not just your province but your country? Yeah, that's what we're trying to bring here. That's what we're trying to bring here, and not to, and you you kind of alluded to earlier as well, not just for mental health and suicide, or what we typically call that for brain health. So concussions for stroke victims, for all of that, because they suffered the same thing as people with mental health and addiction, what we currently call saying, I don't know where to go, I don't know where to start. Um, we've we've met people with those different um that have those different focus, that they're as siloed as what what the current system is with mental health. Like nobody knows the number one reason where people don't seek help is based on our mental health task force, um, the feedback that we got there, the number one reason was um awareness of where to go. Number two was cost. Yeah, number three was access, and number four was a bad previous bad experience.

SPEAKER_01 37:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:18

Right? When you know those things, those are not problems, those are opportunities for improvement.

SPEAKER_00 37:23

They're also not um they're not insurmountable. Those seem like all very reasonable things that are easy, easy to fix, right? I'd like to think so. Yeah, it's just time, money, and effort that goes into it.

unknown 37:37

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 37:37

So speaking of time, money, and effort, uh, I've been to two fundraisers of yours already. Uh thumbs up was relatively new to me uh the last two years, so I didn't really have a lot of exposure to it in the past, but I've been to two fundraisers now. Uh, music and uh uh energy is a big part of them. Uh tell me what you have on the go. Tell me what's the next thing that we could help you raise some money and get you on your next mission.

SPEAKER_02 38:05

Uh well, what we have on the go is our um what we're looking to raise funds for is this an initiative with the Veterans Association to build this spoke component and learn what we're going to learn from it because it's not about changing the system from the top down, it's changing it from in a control environment, et cetera, et cetera. So that's what we are trying to. Um, we will continue to do it with music. We've got Peace in the Park coming up. It, you know, we will go back to the city. We've had a coffee with Mayor Spearman last week and said we still want you to proclaim September is Resiliency Awareness Month. Our signature event there is Peace in the Park. Um, so we've already started on that. Um, we'll run our songwriting contest again. Um, and um uh all of that, and one of the tag the names for Peace in the Park is Rockin' for a Reason.

SPEAKER_01 39:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:03

Right? And it's I I love that. I didn't coin it, um, but I love that, and it's kind of where we identify with it more and more. Part of Peace in the Park as well is um another tagline is healers, helpers, and heroes. So it's recognizing those people in our community who either on a personal level or on an organizational level have been a healer, helper, or hero to someone that have helped them in the change the trajectory, either on a personal level or within the community level. And so we put that out there and ask for people to make a nomination of someone or something that has been a healer, help, or a hero. Um, and so to to honor and recognize that as well, because as we say, we didn't again didn't coin it, but not all heroes wear capes, yeah, right? And so if you it's it could be a random kind of act of kindness, it's to start to change that energy. I mean, we've got this whole doom scrolling world out there that how and so why are we scratching our hands saying, how come some people can't get out of bed? It's like, do you check what we're feeding everybody?

SPEAKER_00 40:12

Yeah, and the world is getting crazier by the second. I mean, it's not a it's not an easy place to be observing at the moment.

SPEAKER_02 40:21

Uncertainty, right? Nothing is there, the ground under our collective feet is not as solid as it used to feel like it was, yeah. Uh right, so it's it's shifting all the time. Where's it gonna end? Where's it gonna land? Those are unknowns. With uncertainty, can come anxiety, yeah, right?

SPEAKER_00 40:40

Okay, so if somebody wants to find out more information, where do they go?

SPEAKER_02 40:44

Well, I just want to qualify this is that um our website, www.the thumbsupfoundation.com, yeah. Um part of the fine line that we walk is that we're not a service provider, as I said. Uh what we do is we remove cost as a barrier. So we're not looking for people to be reaching out. That's kind of an organic thing, because we've our focus is on um testing the system and validating the approach to which we do with real people, right? Um, but it's not we're not that service call. If you're if you're in crises or whatever, give thumbs up a call. That's not who we are. Yeah, right. So I just want to be clear.

SPEAKER_00 41:31

And we'll make sure to put some contacts in the show notes to make sure that when people, if somebody is in crisis, they know who to reach out to. So yes, right.

SPEAKER_02 41:39

We'll take care of that. Okay, thank you. And then because we do have that on our website as well, is like that's kind of not. Um, but if anybody wants to, we do we're running a campaign right now on um call it, we call it moving the needle. Yeah, um, because um a report last year, I think it was, or 2024, maybe from CMHA National, was that in spite of the 51 billion that Canada is um paying out each year, or the cost to it, um, that Canada has not significantly moved the needle.

SPEAKER_01 42:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 42:10

And we say we are, right? And so um what we have a campaign right now that's on our website that call it we're calling it moving the needle. Um, and so we're asking people to donate$20 and 26 cents. Do it online, you get an automatic tax receipt for it, uh, and just let's see how many$20.26 is we can because that's grassroots. That's creating a movement, right?

SPEAKER_00 42:39

So that's our challenge to all of our listeners to go uh to thethumbsupfoundation.com and donate uh twenty dollars and twenty-six cents to the audience with the needle. Perfect. Kim Titus, this world and airdree is better because you're in it. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_02 42:55

Thank you.