22 Trauma-Informed Parenting: How to Move from Triggered to Thriving Using Faith-Based Strategies For Special Needs Parents

How do you respond when your child is having a meltdown and you feel yourself getting triggered? Do you find yourself asking "Why?" or do you shift to asking "How do I survive this moment?"

When you're in your "shark waters" - those moments when your own past wounds get activated by your child's behavior - what physical sensations do you notice in your body?

Are you more focused on correcting your child's behavior or connecting with their heart? How might shifting this focus change your family dynamics?

In this powerful conversation, Debbie Simmons shares her journey from devastating loss to purposeful legacy-building. After losing quadruplets and walking through infertility struggles, Debbie discovered life-changing questions that transformed how she navigates challenges. Now a mother of nine through adoption and founder of AnchorPoint ministry, she teaches the revolutionary "BEST" strategy that helps families move from survival to thriving, especially when dealing with trauma and special needs.

Connect with Debbie:

• AnchorPoint Ministry: anchorpoint.us (Check out Pathway to Hope Camps under Events)
• Personal Website: thedebbiesimmons.com
• Book: The Heart of Legacy
• Download: FREE BEST Strategy tools available on her website

Resources Mentioned:

• Trust-Based Relational Intervention (Dr. Karen Purvis, TCU)
• Pathway to Hope Therapeutic Camps
• The BEST Strategy (Breathe, Evaluate, Step back, Take action)
• AnchorPoint Ministry - faith-based nonprofit supporting families in crisis

Get the FREE PEACE Decision Making Guide when you sign up for our newsletter! Never miss an episode and be supported through a devotional and prayer that follow along with the weeks theme!

www.speakinglife.co/peace

While you're here, please leave a quick rating or review! I pray this episode blesses you! Remember, you don't just have to survive mama- you can thrive!

Connect with the host: Elyse Scheeler

• Subscribe: Speaking Life Into Motherhood
• Website: www.speakinglife.co/motherhood
• Email: hello@speakinglife.co
• Facebook Group: Speaking Life Into Motherhood
• Email Newsletter: https://speakinglife.co/subscribe/
• Essential Oils: my.doterra.com/speakinglife

Disclaimer
The views and opinions expressed in this episode are those of the guests and hosts and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Speaking Life Into Motherhood. None of the advice or discussion on the podcast is medical advice. Always consult with your medical provider before using any supplements, essential oils, or therapy methods.

Transcript

Elyse Scheeler (00:02)
Welcome back everyone. Today I am so excited to welcome Debbie Simmons. She is a mother of nine through the miracle of adoption and is a woman whose legacy was born through loss. After the heartbreaking death of her quadruplets, her journey through grief became a catalyst for purpose-driven growth. Today, she's the CEO and founder of AnchorPoint, a faith-based nonprofit that empowers families, supports women in crisis, and equips leaders to navigate trauma with clarity and strength.

Debbie Simmons (00:02)
Welcome back everyone. Today I also would like to welcome Dasha Simmons. She is a 5-year-old 9 through the miracle of adoption and is a woman whose legacy was born with her voice.

who sees this video in fact, at Waterpoint. ⁓

Elyse Scheeler (00:29)
In addition to her nonprofit work, Debbie leads the Debbie Simmons LLC, where she empowers entrepreneurs, ministry leaders, and business owners to build legacies that outlast them. As a legacy coach, she helps others turn adversity into impact, guiding them to build businesses and missions that align with their God-given purpose. Welcome, Debbie. Thank you so much for joining us today.

Debbie Simmons (00:51)
Yes, I'm excited to be here.

Elyse Scheeler (00:53)
So tell us a little bit more about yourself. It sounds like you have a really long history of going through some different challenges and now have nine amazing children through adoption. Our ⁓ listeners here are all Christian moms who have kiddos with maybe some additional needs. And I would just love to know what kind of brought you to this place and to all these missions that you're now working through.

Debbie Simmons (01:17)
Well, yes, I do. I am excited to be here and I can tell you that yes, I have a long history because I'm getting older. but if you go back in my journey, I became, I fell in love with Jesus when I was in elementary school and I had this beautiful idea because I had no grandparents kind of growing up and I had a lady who kind of adopted us that I wanted to be this young grandma.

And so I knew I needed to find a husband, get married, have children, and then I could have grandkids, right? And so off I went on my journey and I can accomplish just about anything I set my mind to and went on my merry little way and got married after college and wanted to start having kids. then we spent years with the issue of infertility.

And infertility really causes you to question your worth, your value, I'm a failure as a mom, as a potential mother, a wife, all these things. And on our last ⁓ opportunity to try and get pregnant through a fertility study, we got pregnant and ⁓ originally thought it was twins, thought we were gonna miscarry, then they diagnosed us with four, then... ⁓

We ended up in the hospital at 26 weeks and the boys were just placed in my arms after they were born ⁓ and they passed away into eternity. And if the boys had been born now, medically they would have been saved. We see that with children now. So in that center of that space, ⁓ sitting in the hospital that night, I looked around for anywhere I could turn to see if I could like...

I can't get to my goal and I don't know how to get there and now I got all this pain and I don't know what to do. And I know when I run into difficult things, the number one thing that pops up in me when I run into a challenge with my kids at work or whatever, the big question that comes out of me is why? Why me, why now, why this, why God, why, why, why, why, why, why? It's the only question I have and I'm like, So, you of course I have that same question sitting there with the boys, right, after losing these boys.

Elyse Scheeler (03:22)
Mm-hmm. ⁓

Debbie Simmons (03:29)
And I could find nowhere else to go but to trust God in my situation. And the why question, God just whispered in my ear, he's like, I need you to give me your why. And I'm like, no, it's like my security blanket invalidates all these feelings, right, that I have. as, know, just think about it, as we as parents are frustrated, you know, we just, it just validates everything. And he's like, give it to me. And what I realized was that, you know,

Elyse Scheeler (03:44)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (03:58)
no matter what anybody would have said that day, or if God himself would have showed up, stood in front of me, and told me the answer to why, nothing would satisfy. Nothing. It wouldn't bring my voice back. wouldn't change the pain. wouldn't do it. So why is, for all of us, a stuck question? It means I can't go anywhere because I'm now stuck. I can't get the answer. just can't. And so the reason he wanted me to lay it down was because he wanted me to be able to figure my way.

Okay, and so finally I was like, okay God, I'll give you my why. And then I'm like, what do I do next? Because yeah, yeah, I'm like, what? know, because I can't figure it out. I can't fix it. And you know, it's so frustrating. And he said, ask me a different question. And I'm like, what's that? You know, and he was like, ask me, how do I survive? So that's the question I began asking. You know, how do I get through this situation? How do I survive?

Elyse Scheeler (04:33)
Now it's a what, right? What do we do?

Debbie Simmons (04:55)
and it came down to something very simple. I needed to breathe deeply because breathing puts me in my prefrontal cortex, which means I think, it also means I'm alive, okay? ⁓ And then the very next thing is what is my next best step, okay? And I just sat there and I was like, okay, what can I do next? And it doesn't have to be super complicated, it just has to be something.

Elyse Scheeler (05:06)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (05:25)
It has to be a step. has to be movement. And in those early days, that might look something like taking the covers off my head, getting out of the bed, brushing my teeth, walking around for 30 seconds and getting back in the bed. And that was it. And that was success, right? And then the next day, maybe I could do something bigger. But the reality is, is when I in faith and obedience took a step, God met me there. He lit up the ground at my feet to show me the next step.

And in faith and obedience, I took that step. He met me there. He shined a light. And that took me through a healing process. And it took me through the ability to figure my way in a situation. And eventually my question changed. My question went from, how do I survive to how do I thrive? Because I didn't want to be the same person, feeling the same things. I wanted to have joy. I wanted to live. I wanted to be able to smile.

I wanted to figure my way, you know, and when you ask that question, that gives God the opportunity to take our difficult situations and our difficult stories and redeem them and use them for His glory. So it gave me the opportunity to work with women who have lost children, to lead grief groups. It ultimately led us on the journey of adopting.

nine children with trauma backgrounds and their histories and all that good stuff, which has been a joy ride. And then it led to the starting of Anchor Point, which is a ministry that impacts thousands of families every year. And we get to be a part of that. And it led to writing the book, The Heart of Legacy and telling the story. So all of the things that I do now come out of that deep loss ⁓ and learning how to ask those questions. And I have found that I use those questions

everywhere all the time, even now, even today, even this morning, you know, and in my CEO, my world work, my family work, everything. And that is just, it's just revolutionized how I think about the world and how I go about trying to make my way and make my impact and be a difference maker. ⁓

Elyse Scheeler (07:33)
Yeah, I

love that. I'm actually getting like a little emotional just thinking about it.

also went through infertility and had one miscarriage and I am now blessed with two beautiful children, but that is what you do in that moment is why? Why me? Why did I do something wrong? What's wrong with me? All of those things. And I think sometimes, and not that you need to, but for myself, and it sounds like kind of where you were at too, it's like that...

God uses those moments, not that he does those moments to us, but he uses those moments because that's when we are, I think, most open to maybe being able to listen. And when we're at those really, really dark and hard, you know, I have nothing. So I'm just going to give it up to you. And then all of a sudden, he's like, I've been trying to tell you, you know, and you just for whatever reason, you know, those we haven't been open to hearing those things. And then as you start taking those steps, like you said, I

Debbie Simmons (08:13)
Mm-hmm.

Elyse Scheeler (08:35)
It really opens up for you. So I love that and I hope that you know as for our listeners that that if they're in one of those places or you know, I think it's peaks and valleys right as a mom and then especially as a mom who has kiddos with special needs but knowing that that you can open yourself up to God and and being ready and willing to thrive and maybe that just means you know taking that small step forward and I think that it it resonated with me like I said I was getting a little teary-eyed as I was as I was listening to you

One of the things that we had talked about previously, and you kind of touched on it a little bit, but I'm hoping maybe we can break it down a little bit, is you talk about your best strategy. ⁓ And we talked about it a little bit, but could you maybe break it down ⁓ so that it's very tangible for those moms and let us know, how do you use that? Is that something that you typically use for mom when they're ⁓ like they're having a difficulty, or is it something that you work on teaching the kids or maybe a convo-

Debbie Simmons (09:12)
Mm-hmm.

Elyse Scheeler (09:34)
combination of both.

Debbie Simmons (09:36)
Yeah, and so and I'll tell you I use it at work. I use it on staff. I use it everywhere. You know, and those questions kind of lead into that that how do I figure my way and then how do I thrive right? And so this concept of breathing and next best step. So I use that best acronym that it's very simple. OK, I try to keep everything very simple in life and the B is simply breathe, which we already talked about, and the reason for that is.

Elyse Scheeler (09:40)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (10:03)
deep breaths get us to the prefrontal cortex, right? ⁓ Generally when we are, ⁓ when we are freaking out, our kids are freaking out, or my staff member is freaking out, it is because we are in the emotional part of our brain. And we've affectionately blown our lid and we can't really think. So we gotta get this thing back down so we can get to this prefrontal cortex. And we do that by breathing.

It's amazing that that can do it. So two or three deep breaths in and in through the nose, out through the mouth, or just all kind of different breathing techniques where you hold your breath for five seconds and you breathe out and then you hold your breath for five seconds, breathe in. And I teach those to kids all the time. So you can watch my little grandkids, they walk around going, I'm like, that's good breathing. So that's the first thing is to get oxygen flowing in your body and it gets you to your prefrontal cortex.

Elyse Scheeler (10:51)
Yep.

Debbie Simmons (10:59)
There is, I cannot remember the book, but it says that, you know, when we face an immediate situation, if we respond immediately, it'll always be emotional. If we wait three to five seconds, will be the second thought that we have will be way better than the first, because it is our thinking brain that is doing the second answer. So that's why they always tell you, you know, don't send the email when you're mad.

Elyse Scheeler (11:25)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (11:26)
Write the email,

but don't hit send because you know the next one is always the better one, right? Same thing for us, right? What comes out of me as a mom if I'm reacting to my kid initially. Is usually very emotional, cause it's probably struck something in me that lit something in me up and I'm like wow and vomit on them. And then if I would have waited two or three seconds, I'm like, ⁓ it could have been better. So the breathe is the first step, OK?

Elyse Scheeler (11:51)
I'm going to hop

into as an airway centric ⁓ SLP, it's super important and you touched on it, but like breathing in through your nose is huge. And if you are a mouth breather, then listen in and find or message me and we can talk about why that's not good. But breathing in through your nose activates the parasympathetic nervous system. So like you were saying, it's going to slow your body down versus the sympathetic nervous system when you're breathing in through your mouth, which that's fight or flight. We don't want to be in fight or flight, right? So like just under

Debbie Simmons (12:11)
Yes.

Elyse Scheeler (12:21)
understanding, you know, some of that is is absolutely amazing and I love all of those strategies too. I will I'll link I'm in the show notes I can make sure that I link I think I might even have some on my website with some of those breathing breathing strategies because yeah, those are great and the kids can learn them and then you know what then they go mom are you doing your breathing strategies and we go maybe I should Okay, I'll work on it. Thank you. I didn't mean to interrupt

Debbie Simmons (12:26)
YES

You guys right? Yeah!

⁓ No, but kids are great for pointing those things out.

what you said is true with your sympathetic nervous system and your parasympathetic, you know, it is all a circle. And so we've activated one side. Now we've got to calm it down. And this is actually healthy. ⁓ So breathing in like that. So the first step is very easy. OK, the second step is evaluate. And that simply means write down real quickly, like the facts.

Elyse Scheeler (12:57)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (13:13)
what's kind of happening, you know, like this happened or this happened and just get away from the emotional and just get the things on paper. Okay, doesn't have to be super complex and doesn't have to be in the heat of a battle either. It can be post something. You can do these things too, right? Okay, but you want to just write things down, eliminate the emotional, just see what lands on the paper. Okay, then the S is step back and that means

Elyse Scheeler (13:29)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (13:41)
walk away from this situation, from looking at that paper and go do something different. Go do something that kind of stimulates your brain. Take a walk around the block, ⁓ do a little exercise, do some fun hobby, five minutes, 10 minutes, anything. ⁓ I love the walking because removing myself from inside and going outside and just breathing in that air and seeing God's creation, it just gives you a whole new perspective.

A lot of people will tell you that ⁓ if you are working your body, you're exercising your body, it actually gives your brain a break and you can actually process more stuff. It's really fascinating. So I just say, do something that's not like looking at that paper, freaking out over the situation and just step back for a few minutes. And then when you come back, look at your thing and you'll have a whole new perspective. And then all you're doing is figuring out, okay, based on this,

Elyse Scheeler (14:28)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (14:40)
What is the next best thing I can do? So you're gonna take some action, some small step, okay? And if we apply God to this in faith, then we're not looking for the next right step, because the right step will cause us to freeze, because I'm going, is that right? Or should I be, and then I might never do anything. So it's the next best thing that I can come up with. If you have a...

support group or whatever, get their input, get people to come alongside you. But do something, and it does not have to be big, just do something. ⁓ And that is where we go, okay God, in faith and obedience, I'm going to do this. And I'm trusting that you're gonna show me the way, right? You're gonna help me figure my way through. How do I survive, right? And so I do it, and God has promised in his word that he will be faithful.

Elyse Scheeler (15:27)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (15:37)
Can you still hear me? I. OK, yeah, no, no, no, no. I think it's a bad weather. It just took everything out for a second, so yes, yes. Yeah. ⁓

Elyse Scheeler (15:39)
Yep, you can hear well, are you okay? Sorry.

It just froze for a second. I think if you just want to pick up with like, cause I can edit

it like that he will be faithful as you are, he said something with like following through with obedience.

Debbie Simmons (15:54)
Yes, yes, okay.

Yeah, so as you and I take our out of faith and obedience, take our first step, God meets us and then he reveals the next step and we can do it over and over again. But God promises that if you and I are faithful and we are obedient and we ask for wisdom, he gives generously to each one of us and he will show us how to do this. He will show us if we need to move our shift a little bit or he closes a door and he opens a window.

He will reveal all of that. And you know what? We can trust that our daddy God is writing a good story with each of our lives and our children's lives. And we can lean into that and we don't have to know all the answers. We just need to know what the next step is. And you know what? If I knew all the answers, I couldn't handle it. Cause I'd be like, my gosh, you're gonna make me, no, no, And so I'm like, I just need the next step. And so that is the best strategy is, hey, breathe, evaluate what you're doing.

Step back from it all, get a breather, and then take an action step. ⁓ And keep it simple and just do the best you can and he is gonna show up. Do the best you can, he's gonna show up.

I can't hear you.

Elyse Scheeler (17:16)
Here we go. We'll try again. Could you give us some examples? have nine kids through adoption of how some of these strategies maybe have helped more specifically. ⁓ I know I had another ⁓ guest on earlier in the year who really talked about that. And I think that there are a lot of families, especially Christian families, who feel very strongly about adoption and bringing those children into our lives and being pro-life. But there can be a lot of challenges that come with that. And you were talking about

how your kiddos have had some trauma. So how does that factor into all of this or maybe some of the challenges that you faced, you know, along throughout the years to get to this point?

Debbie Simmons (17:58)
Yeah, my kids are a little older now, so we don't have quite as much trauma running around in the house. So they're 19 to 34 now, and I have about 15 grandkids that I get to still do life with. And not all of my children make good choices. Some of their trauma histories have carried on into their adult life. And so sometimes even with my grandkids, getting to help them figure their way, you know, and stuff like that too.

But I will tell you this, ⁓ we all have baggage, all of us. Our parents did the best they could with us, with what they knew how to do. And guess what? I bear the scars of some of that. ⁓ But I get to take responsibility for my life and I get to figure my way. And am I gonna get better? Am I gonna get bitter? so Debbie Simmons is a package and she has issues. So that's the first thing, okay? And then my husband, Scott.

Elyse Scheeler (18:39)
Mm-hmm.

You

Debbie Simmons (18:56)
has his issues and then you bring in children, whether biologically or adoptive or whatever, and you start complicating the system. And what happens is our children ⁓ run into challenging things and they don't know how to deal with it. And so the only thing they know is to pitch a fit or to...

know, throw a tantrum because they're just frustrated and they don't know how to handle these huge emotions that they have and they can't communicate yet what they really need. So that's why a little kid screams and cries, right? And so ⁓ now what happens is a lot of times for you and me as a parent, what the child is doing is then hitting somewhere in me where I have some woundedness.

Elyse Scheeler (19:33)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (19:49)
And it's like causing my heart to start going faster and palpitating. And it is because it's my history that's getting tapped on. And when my history gets tapped on, then I become that little girl that was in that situation. And now I'm like freaking out, right? And so I'm the big girl, but I'm in my little girls coming out. And I will respond out of that if I don't realize that that's what's happening. So one of the things I teach parents is,

Elyse Scheeler (20:07)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (20:18)
Basically when that starts happening to us, you've just entered into your shark waters. Okay, and it's like Jaws is like I'm going to die if I don't kill this thing, you know, and so but the most powerful thing for us is When we can identify we've entered into our shark waters to just say ⁓ I've entered my shark waters Okay, because if I can name it I can tame it. Okay

Elyse Scheeler (20:25)
Yeah

Debbie Simmons (20:47)
And so I always ask parents, I'm like, you know when you start to lose it, do you feel it somewhere in your body? Okay, do you can, you know, and if you think about it long enough, usually there's some way you feel it. For me in particular, I feel it across my chest, it starts getting tight and I'm just like, you know, and I've had other people go, my whole body just like locks up, you know, or I feel it in my head, wherever it is, it doesn't matter.

Elyse Scheeler (20:58)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (21:16)
As soon as I start to feel it, before I lose it, if I can go, that's my shark water, then I'm still in my prefrontal cortex and I have the ability to stop it right there. If I let it go, then I'm going to emotionally respond. And when I emotionally respond, it's not gonna be pretty. ⁓ And then when I emotionally respond wrong, my child is going to emotionally respond wrong. And guess what? I'm gonna respond wrong again. And this is gonna now be...

This huge tornado that we have to figure out how to land without killing all of us and everybody gets bruised in the process, right? And so if you have a kid that has a trauma background, then this is going to be like escalated. OK, so if it's my biological child, I know the environment that they've been raised in and all this stuff makes it a little simpler to understand. Does it make it simpler to implement?

Elyse Scheeler (21:56)
Yeah, absolutely.

Debbie Simmons (22:13)
But if I have a kid with a trauma history that I don't quite understand and they're losing it over just seems like crazy stuff, ⁓ I don't know what happened in that situation. You know, when I'm evaluating later, I don't know what happened in their life that would cause them to lose it like this. And then it feels very personal to me. So I go, hey, this best strategy really helps me, may not in the very moment that I'm sitting in a heated situation, but definitely.

when we've survived, okay? And we get off to the side and I can go, okay, what was really happening? And now let me get some fresh perspective. Let me get some other input from other parents. What can I learn? Where can I go get training? And then how can I adjust it for next time? ⁓ That is super powerful. So I had kids that would, know, certainly like if I moved too fast, they might flinch. And it's probably because they were beat.

⁓ And so or they would tell me all the time all the time They would tell me you are yelling you yell all the time and I'm thinking in my head I'm going I ain't even got started yet I'm fixing to yell and but you know what what they what they sensed was my shark waters and it was like ⁓ and they they're very because they live with this super alert thing they can sense the change in just a little bit and

Elyse Scheeler (23:24)
Yeah. ⁓

Debbie Simmons (23:41)
literally my voice maybe had gone up just a little bit and they're going you're screaming and I'm like nah I got more buddy I can give you more but I'm not gonna do it but when we realized that then I realized okay if I can go into a situation and I can actually lower my voice and slow my pace then see they don't get alerted then and put up walls that don't give us the ability to get through those things and so

Elyse Scheeler (23:48)
Yeah.

Debbie Simmons (24:11)
Those are really important things to learn ⁓ when we're trying to deal with kids. it also, whenever I get in a situation like that and I get triggered and I say, you know, this is my shark quarters or whatever, I also have just been super committed to finding ⁓ someone in my life that could.

help me process through that. I use God a lot for life. I'm like, God, just show me what it is that's hung up so you can heal that spot in me. But I'm like, I gotta get better. I gotta do the hard work on me because if my stuff keeps getting in the way, it keeps me from being fully present for my child. And God has given me this child, even this challenging child.

Elyse Scheeler (24:40)
Mm-hmm.

Absolutely.

Debbie Simmons (25:01)
He has gifted me with this child and this is a privilege. what I need to be able to hear my child say when they're screaming or they're cussing at me or whatever the situation is, what I need to be able to hear them say, because I need to be able to look in their eyes, see their preciousness and hear them say to me, mom, I need you now more than ever, but I don't know how to tell you. And they're screaming and they're going off and all this stuff and I'm going, okay.

I hear you. feels personal, but you know I want to be able to stay in that space and you and I cannot lead a child. Anywhere that we have not gone ourselves. So if I haven't done my hard work, then God's going to give me opportunity to do it. I can skip it. You know what? And guess what? We're going to have another one of those interactions and God's going to say, are you ready yet? And I'm going to be like, yeah, so a lot of times I would be in the middle of a with my kids because there were so many and it seemed like.

If somebody lost it one day, all nine of them would lose it. So it's just one after the other after that. And I'm going, and we start at 10 o'clock at night and I'm like, dude, it's two in the morning. Can we stop this craziness? And so, but God is just so gracious to not let us stay where we are. And we get the cool thing as parents of getting the opportunity to be Jesus to them. And so.

Elyse Scheeler (26:09)
Yeah.

Debbie Simmons (26:24)
grace and mercy and love and joy and peace and patience, all these things he says I can have even in these challenging times. And I'm going, I want that God. So I would find myself in the middle of heated situations and I'm texting this prayer group and I'm going, can you sign me up for breakthrough prayer? Cause I need to get me fixed and I'm about to lose it as a mama and I want to be successful. those are, you know, those types of things happen all the time. You know, just think about it.

How many times have we been in the store? My kid loses it and I am just losing it in the store because I'm going, everybody is looking at me, they're thinking I'm a bad mother and da da da da. And you know what? Nobody is looking at us thinking that. You know what they're thinking? They're thinking, my gosh, I am so glad that's not me today.

Elyse Scheeler (27:04)
Mm-hmm.

Yep, it's not me today, it was yesterday.

⁓

Debbie Simmons (27:17)
Yeah, or I'm a grandma now. I don't have to deal with that. You

know, they're not looking at us going, she's terrible. But that's what we play in our head, right? And so, so that does, I think you, before we started this show, you were talking about, you know, how that has a tendency to isolate us. And we definitely need to have more compassion with each other and encouragement and isolation is how Satan gets us. He gets us.

Elyse Scheeler (27:43)
Absolutely. And

I think one of the things that you're really touching on is, so I've been doing more market research and talking to moms as I'm really trying to find the topics and...

delve forward with the podcast. the common ground is that when I ask the moms, know, okay, are you, what are you, what do you want? Do you want to work on things for yourself or no, I just want to focus on my kid. I just want to focus on my kid. I'm not worried about myself. I can't worry about my health. I can't worry about my wellness. I can't worry about my mental health. Like it's just, I don't have time for that. But what you're saying, and I think what, you know, hopefully we, I can, you know, project as well is that

If we want to focus on our kids, we have to focus on ourselves too. I think that that's a very not not easy, but it's a tendency that tends to happen is we're so focused and we're just going to we're going to fix them and we have to focus on helping them with whatever the challenges are. But once we recognize that, like we're going to be able to help them and do the best that we can. But the one way that we can do that or one of the ways that we can do that is thinking about how we're reacting. Right. I it's exactly like you're saying.

So let's say, I know we had talked about this earlier, like I am a family, I'm like, I need this, I need help. What kinds of things, I think you mentioned earlier before we started recording, that you have maybe some opportunities available for families where they could really kind of dig into this training and focus on some ways that they could be more trauma-informed and move forward successfully.

Debbie Simmons (29:05)
We have some opportunities available for families.

Yeah, first of all, let me go back to your comment you just said, OK, the best thing that we can offer our children is the best version of us. And if we do not do that, then we cannot help our kids. I mean, that's how high this priority has to be. It doesn't mean I abandoned my kids. It doesn't mean I do it. But you know what? If I'm not doing my hard work, ⁓ then.

I, they watch me, they're watching and they're learning how I walk through things and they're, so all the things that I may not be saying, they pick up on that way more than anything I say with them. And so if I am healthy and if I have love, joy, peace, patience flowing out of me, then you know, that is attractive and that creates a safe space for them to be able to do the hard work that they need to do.

You know, I just give you this one other example. had a kid that got, we were on speed dial for the school district. ⁓ Every day it seemed like I was getting a call. And ⁓ one time the, my son in high school and they called and ⁓ he had done something with a girl in the library. It was not pretty. And I was like, ⁓ my gosh, what have you done? anyway, so when I first met that child, that child,

already carries a ton of shame and our children do, okay? A ton of shame and guilt and stuff like that. And I'm telling you, when I pick that kid up, when I go to see him and the first thing he hears out of me is, know, ⁓ condemnation, how did you get in so much trouble? Why did they call me da-da-da-da-da? You know, it just piles on this other layer on them. So I went to the school with this kid and I get this son of mine and I'm like, ⁓ dude.

I don't know how you decided what you were gonna do today, but that was the most creative thing I have ever heard of. Most people don't do this at school. ⁓ And I said, but this was extremely creative. So you know what that means? Is that if we can channel this energy in the right direction, you can be powerful, powerful. And I said, now I love you and we got a mess to clean up, but.

we can redirect your energy and you can't do this at school. But I'm like, dude, that was super creative. Nobody in their right mind thinks of these things. And I'm like, wow, you're talented. And so for him, he's laughing and I'm like, it doesn't excuse the behavior. It doesn't make it right. But I'm like, what did I get there? I gained his heartstrings, right? And I guarantee you because I have the heartstrings.

I can then work on the other stuff and he knows that no matter where I am, no matter what happens, no matter what I do, mom loves me. And mom is a safe place that when I totally screw up, I can come to. And think about it, this is exactly what Jesus does with us, right? He doesn't look at us and go, ⁓ my gosh, look at that big pile of trash between you and me and all the junk you got down there. I just can't have, no.

Elyse Scheeler (32:24)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (32:34)
No, you gotta straighten this up. No, he doesn't do that. He walks around my Paula trash and he puts his arm around me and he goes, wow, that's a super big pile of trash and we're going to do it together. We're going to do this journey together and we're going to figure out how to deal with your Paula trash and I'm like, ⁓ you're not mad at me. You're not upset with me and he goes, no, I love you. And so that's what we want our kids to experience, right? And so ⁓ I would tell you it.

Elyse Scheeler (32:43)
Yeah

Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (33:03)
It's me that's gotta change the most. God gave me nine children because I needed to do a lot of work. And so ⁓ it's been a wonderful journey. But the work that we do with kids ⁓ and families is we run through Anchor Point, we run therapeutic camps every summer ⁓ based on the trust-based relational intervention, the work of Dr. Karen Purvis out of TCU. We're certified in that. works. The camps are revolutionary for kids with trauma backgrounds. So if you have adopted children and stuff like that.

but it is also equally valuable for biologically intact children. Because we don't realize that the trajectory of children can get off if you have stress in your pregnancy, positive or negative, ⁓ if you have premature deliveries, if you have NICU stays. Those are three other reasons that your kids have trauma backgrounds. And so it's a lot of times why parents look at their kids and they go, just don't get them.

Okay, because their trajectories are off from when they're born. Think about it. I had a grandbaby that was born at 23 weeks and they were able to save this little girl. She's two and a half now. And they put what they do, whisk her away, put her in NICU, put needles in her, put her in a sterile environment. She has lost connection with everything she ever knew. The voice of her mom, the warmth of her mom, all this good stuff. And I'm telling my daughter-in-law, I'm like,

we're going in that NICU 24-7 and get that baby on you as soon as possible because I know we've got issues, we've got to rectify to get this child's trajectory back on path, right? And so, touching that baby, singing to that baby, doing all the things for the time that she was in there for the three or four months. ⁓ And that little baby is doing good, but I still see in her. ⁓

attachment type issues that we have to work on, insecurity and different things. ⁓ And then she's learned how to manipulate her way ⁓ with those things to get what she wants. And so now she needs high structure, high nurture. So when we do these camps, we teach the family comes as a whole, but each child is given a buddy and that buddy ⁓ redoes the umbilical cord. So we bring them back and they can never be more than five feet from their buddy.

And then we learn ⁓ co-regulation and then self-regulation. And we see miraculous changes in the children in about two days of a week-long camp. It's about two years of therapy in 40 hours. ⁓ But we bring the parents also. And the reason we bring the parents is a lot of times parents come thinking, I'm coming for my child. And in the end, if you listen to their videos and stuff, they'll say, this is what I learned about me.

And their kid grew, they grew, they've got common ground, common terminology. How can I use my words to get my needs met? And then, know, simple things like, wouldn't we like it if our children use their words, if they listened and obeyed, if they, ⁓ you know, ⁓ are you asking, are you telling me? You know, just these skills that they need to be successful in life. And sometimes I think, you know, this is one thing I want parents to walk away with.

Elyse Scheeler (35:56)
Mm-hmm.

Debbie Simmons (36:24)
If we get it right about 30 % of the time, our kids are gonna be all right. ⁓ And actually, it's more healthy for us to not always get it right because in the action of not getting it right and fixing it and restoring the relationship, this is where resilience is taught. And resilience is what our kids need because life is not going to be easy. They're gonna run into bumps along the way, right? And we need them to be able to overcome them.

and to continue going. And so a trauma kid is one that has just had issues happen and no resolution. So if we can begin to give create an environment where that parasympathetic all these other things can come back around, then we create an environment where that kid is safe and now they can begin to process their stuff. And so same thing goes for you and me. What happened when I was a kid? Maybe I was a molested, maybe this, maybe whatever, and there was disruption and now I've.

Elyse Scheeler (37:12)
Yeah.

Debbie Simmons (37:22)
I have maladaptive behaviors that I use. So when we ask children and us to give up maladaptive behaviors, but we don't give them something to use in place of it, it's actually kind of child abuse. Because these maladaptive behaviors have kept this child alive.

Camp works on all of that and we look at the adults history and every time I tell the adults I'm like I'm so glad you're here. You survived all this stuff and now we just gotta work on. You're getting triggered and now if we can name it and we can work on those things and you can get some outside help to help you process through you are. It's going to rock because now your family is all on the same system and you can go together.

and you understand and the biggest thing that we want with our children. You know, I had one child, extremely hard child, she's number eight. I was like, oh Lord, it's just, you know, and I was like, you know, I need, this girl came to me when she was 11 and I was like, I got like 2,585 things that I gotta have her learn before she gets out of here at 18. I got seven years. I ain't got much time. I'm like, duh. And you know what? The reality is,

What I really need is I need her heart. And so I have to connect, connect, connect, connect and lay down my list of 2,858 things or whatever number it was ⁓ and go, okay, let me connect with her because when she turns 18 and she says, I'm an adult, I don't have to listen to my mom anymore. And the world she takes on the world, the world is gonna be a painful place and it's gonna be hard. And the world is gonna go after her.

And I need to have that heart string so that she knows I'm a safe place to return to that will help her figure her way, right? Because that's all I have. If not, I might lose her to the world. ⁓ And she might die, she might get on the street, she might do all these things. And I've had children do all of those types of things, but we had the heart strings in the end. And we got to walk through drug abuse, we got to walk through all these things. ⁓ And so I say, stay the course now.

Get the heart connection. Don't worry about like everything. When we do the heart connection right, we unlock learning. We unlock working through stuff. It's powerful. But a lot of times you and I like to correct a lot. I like to correct a lot. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. And so I have to learn to kind of lay that down. Still guiding and everything like that and go.

What is it that you really need? So I'm really good with my grandkids. My grandkids start losing it. I'm not super emotionally attached. You know, I love them and everything, but I'm like, hey dude, you must have had a hard morning. I think you need some loving. Come get in my lap and let me fill your love cup. And then, okay, now that you tore my living room apart or whatever you did, we're gonna fix it and we're gonna figure our way. And then we're gonna celebrate that he's back on track.

Elyse Scheeler (40:16)
Mm-hmm.

Yep, absolutely.

Debbie Simmons (40:30)
and we're going to have a great day

together. You know, so those are just some things I'm rambling now, but those are I love that stuff and working with kids and so those camps are. Revolutionary in just helping a family move forward, so I would encourage him to check those out at the anchor point.

Elyse Scheeler (40:47)
Yeah, I'll make sure that I include

all of that information in the show notes as well. So we're gonna wrap things up. I just appreciate your time and I ⁓ am so blessed by this conversation for myself as well. And I know that I have some probably my own family, but other families in mind that I'm gonna be sharing all of this information with. Can you just remind our listeners if there is any places online that they can find you?

Debbie Simmons (40:51)
Thank

Sure, if they want to know about the ministry stuff, which is where we do the work with the camps and stuff like that, it's anchorpoint.us and then under events you can look up the pathway to Hope Camp. And then there's all the social media tags, you can follow all that, get all that good stuff. And then for me and for some of the coaching is thetadebbysemons.com and you can follow and do all that stuff and you can get insights on what does it mean to...

leave a legacy in your family and how can we can be really intentional and stuff like that and they can find the book, The Heart of Legacy, which will help with that and stuff like that. So that's all there. They can also download the best strategy and some tools around that. So those are all there. So those two websites and get you everything. Yes.

Elyse Scheeler (41:53)
All right, well thank you so much for your time, Debbie.