The Greater Call Podcast – Isaac | A Patriarch Laughs with Cameron Tringale

In this episode of The Greater Call, host Mark Immelman welcomes professional golfer Cameron Tringale for a conversation on Isaac the often-overlooked patriarch whose quiet faith helped carry God’s promise forward. Together they explore Isaac’s life as a “steady builder,” the legacy lessons hidden in his story, and what it looks like to lead with integrity, peace, and trust when the spotlight isn’t on you.

From Abraham’s near-sacrifice on the mountain to Isaac’s persistence in reopening wells, this episode highlights the power of faithfulness in the everyday—and why doing the small things well can shape generations.

Key Themes

🎙️ Why Isaac matters, even with fewer “headline moments” in Scripture

🎙️ Quiet confidence: choosing peace over conflict and staying mission-focused

🎙️ Trust and obedience in the shadow of Abraham’s faith

🎙️ The wells: rebuilding legacy, perseverance, and “living water” imagery

🎙️ Leadership lessons from favoritism, integrity, and the power of words

🎙️ Faithfulness in the basics—how small daily choices build a lasting legacy

 Memorable Quotes

“Presence is often more powerful than explanations.” – Mark Immelman

“I say what I mean, and I mean what I say.” – Cameron Tringale

“Get in and read it… the secrets are in the dirt.” – Cameron Tringale

 Scripture References

Genesis 21 — Isaac’s birth and the promise fulfilled

Genesis 22 — Abraham and Isaac on the mountain (“The Lord will provide”)

Genesis 26 — Isaac’s blessing, conflict over wells, and choosing peace

Genesis 27 — Jacob’s deception, Esau’s grief, and the weight of blessing

John 4 — Jesus and the woman at the well (living water connection)

Matthew 28:18–20 — Faithfulness to the mission (Great Commission principle)

 About Our Guest

Cameron Tringale is a professional golfer who has competed around the world and is known for his steady approach, discipline, and measured leadership on and off the course.

🎙️ Follow Mark Immelman

Instagram & YouTube: @MarkImmelman

Facebook: @markimmelmangolf

X: @mark_immelman

LinkedIn: @mark-immelman-87ab46162

Website: markimmelman.com

Connect with Us:

📲 Follow us on social media: @TheGreaterCall (Instagram & X)
🎥 Subscribe on YouTube: Search ‘The Greater Call Podcast’
📩 DM us for prayer requests, leadership advice, or to share your story!
📺 Watch full episodes on YouTube: The Greater Call Podcast
💌 Send feedback or topic ideas via direct message

Website→ https://markimmelman.com/the-greater-call/

✨ Be full of joy in all things, no matter where you are. Be thankful. Go and be a legend! ✨

Transcript

[00:00:00] It's The Greater Call Podcast. Welcome. I'm your host, mark, and remember always this is the place you can come to learn lessons from the leader, heroes of our faith. Lessons on leadership. Life leading a good life, and of course leaving a legacy. And it is my thrill here in episode 19 to invite a good buddy, someone I've looked up to ever since he was playing golf in college at Georgia Tech.

Now he is jaunting around the world, still playing his trade. There he is, cam Tali Cameron, welcome man. How are you doing? Thanks, mark. Good to be with you. Oh man, I've missed you. I really have missed you. I hope you've been playing well. I know that you've been treating people right, 'cause of the good guy that you are.

It's, uh, I've been around the globe and, uh, it's, it's been a lot of fun to, uh, to see where the game of golf has taken me. Um, you know, personally, professionally, I've seen lots of places that I probably would never otherwise. Uh. [00:01:00] Have gotten the chance to see. And, um, it's, it's a great privilege to, uh, to be able to be doing it still all these years later.

No kidding. Well, you and me were aging gracefully. Are we? You mentioned, you mentioned Georgia Tech. I was thinking I haven't, uh. You know that, that it doesn't feel like that long ago. And, uh, but then you meet these young kids who, who are fresh outta school and it's like, oh yeah, I'm actually pretty old.

Well, whatever you are, I'm significantly older than you, so, but let's look at, let's get back to the job at hand. Um, episode 19 about Isaac. I'm calling it patriarchal laughs because Isaac. It was like this miracle baby. Um, who, when he was born eventually to Abraham and Sarah, um, Abraham was 100 years old and Sarah was 90 and she named him Isaac because she essentially laughed at the situation that she could have a child 'cause he was this.

Mm-hmm. [00:02:00] And before we get into Isaac, I pitched you the ideas and you were like, have at it. You tell me what to do. And I was like, the camera and I know is sort of softly spoken. He carries a big stick. He's wise. He, he, whatever he does is measured. Uh, I'm describing you from my experience. Of course. Yep.

Sure. Uh, and, and I think I, I'm, I'm pretty well onto it. And then like when I watch you work on your game, it's always like with some sort of a purpose. And in a way it's a tribute to you that I see Isaac and you and you and Isaac. Uh, do you think I'm crazy? Well, I'll, I'll, uh, I'll gladly take that. Uh, I would take it as a compliment, uh, that relation, um, because Isaac, um, you know, there's not really a lot about him.

Uh, in the scripture. If you look, I mean, there's a ton, you know, Genesis is full of. You know, it's an amazing story. The whole, the [00:03:00] whole arc and, uh, gen, uh, of the Bible is a, is an, is one continuous story. And in Genesis we sort of start to meet, um, what, what I've heard referred to as sort of the family of God.

Yes. And so you have these, you know, it started with Abraham and then you see his lineage. Mm-hmm. And um. It, it's a fun place to start because God, you know, it's sort of just the beginning of, of this greater story that, uh, that we get throughout scripture. But if you, I, I feel like Genesis is a, is one of those books that's, uh, it's, it's hard maybe for, for our western world to really.

Understand it as fully as it probably was intended. Uh, like our, our worldview growing up in the west is quite different than to, to what the, uh, you know, to an eastern reader to, to the values and the things that were important. [00:04:00] Well, I'll, I'll say this for folks who aren't familiar with this. If, if you're not a Bible reader or a Christian.

If you go to the Bible and you read some of these stories about these heroes, they read like movie scripts. I mean, you, you look at the story of Isaac, they're, they're the three patriarchs of Israel. You've mentioned Abraham. He was the father of many nations. God made a mm-hmm. With him, Isaac was. A child of his and then along comes Jacob.

Now we've done Jacob before. 'cause if you're right, you go to Genesis, there's a whole lot more on Jacob than what there is on Isaac. Isaac is kind of the guy, and I'm gonna read you a quote. 'cause I think this perfectly encapsulates what it is in the story. We can lesson, we can learn from him. And I wish I was the smart to make this quote, but I wasn't.

So I'm borrowing this. Yep. So here we go. In a world that celebrates pioneers and trailblazers. It is easy to underestimate the importance of those who faithfully carry on what others have [00:05:00] established. But a brief look at the life of Isaac, the son of Abraham, the father of Jacob, will show that such people are just as critical to God's plan as those who are making a trail for others.

Now, Isaac, he's a fire, was a farmer, fabulously wealthy guy, and essentially all he did, to your point, 'cause there's not much on him. He just built Abraham's wealth and fathered a child at a grand old age of 100, which was miraculous and there's so many miracles that gone along the way. But as I look at the person, so I'm gonna throw a few, uh, through descriptors at you and have you respond.

He seemed quiet. He seemed like a mind my own business, sort of a guy. Because remember when he was in one of the land of the Philistines, Philistines, his wife, then Rebecca, and we'll get to her a little in a little bit too. She was a beautiful [00:06:00] woman, and so he called, um, Rebecca, his sister. So he lied to them so that he wouldn't get, um, killed by them for, for his wife kind of thing.

Yep. So he wasn't, he wasn't averse to bending the truth a little bit, but he was a farmer. He is mind my own business. He was sort of resilient 'cause he kept re digging his father's wills to keep his father's, um, I don't know, legacy alive. He probably prioritize prioritized divine obedience of a conflict and he was tremendously trusting and faithful.

But again, he wasn't one of these guys' gonna blow your hair back kind of thing. But still he was fused fabulously by God throughout his lifetime. I mean, I, I think about someone who sort of has a quiet confidence. Yeah. Or a quiet trust. You know, you referenced, uh, the wells and, and we may get to that, but he, he clearly was taking the higher ground most of the time when he, [00:07:00] you know what, for, for those of you who may not be as familiar, basically he settles.

In, in the land where he lies about his wife. Um, and he settles there. He starts to, God continues to bless his, his, his livestock. He's growing in wealth. He's growing in stature. And they say, they basically tell him, you're too powerful. We need you to leave Uhhuh. Well, he's not done anything crazy, has he?

He's just continuing. To go about his business. And so the people of the land basically say, you, you gotta get outta here. Like, there, there's too much, you're, you're too big now for us. But they also see that he is received blessing, so they. They sort of send him on his way, but they say, Hey, you know, we wanna, we wanna make a, a deal with you that basically become allies because God is clearly with you [00:08:00] and we wanna be on the good side of, of you if things ever get, go, get Harry.

Where are. Yeah. And so, um, so then as he is, you know, moving on. The, I think it says like the herdsman or the, you know, the other people farming in, in, in that society. Obviously it's, it's kind of, it's a desert. Mm-hmm. They need water, so you gotta dig wells to get your water. So he is just going back and saying, Hey, well my dad set this well up, I'm gonna just renew the source.

And they said, no, you can't do that time after time again. And he just basically kept moving, said, okay, you want this one, have it, I'll go to the next one. And he, he just defers to the people that are already there and he keeps moving and um, God continues to bless him. So I think of that like quiet. Like you said, mining your own business.

But he is, he's doing so in a [00:09:00] way that's yielding to those, you know, that he could be in conflict with. He sort of says, okay, I'm not gonna, this isn't a battle. I'm gonna fight, I'm gonna stay focused on my, on the mission that mm-hmm. I've been given and he keeps, keeps going. I love the way you, the word yield that you use because there's such a life lesson in that too.

Especially nowadays, the bravado of the internet and social media and such. I can see you shaking your head. Last time I checked Karin was not on social media. Is this still the same or, uh, my wife runs my account for me, so, and it's, it's all golf. Yeah. Uhhuh. So here's the thing. So to me he was kind of conflict averse.

With the people around him, with the folks who worked for him, even with his wife, his wife, Rebecca, who was a power powerful lady in her own right. Mm-hmm. Was told to marry incidentally, his father Abraham's like, send a guy out to go and find a wife, bring her back. My boy will marry that. So Isaac was like, sure, yeah.

He was one of these [00:10:00] guys, was never upsetting the apple cart. And he sort of led. You put it correctly, quietly, but with his own, his, his own, he put his own spin on everything, even though he was sort of avoiding conflict wherever he went. Yeah, I mean like the, um, like with Rebecca and his wife, you know, he, he's trying to, he's, he's kinda looking out for his own bacon, uh, as, as he is trying to, you know, protect himself by, you know, being dishonest.

But he basically is trying to not. Upset anyone, right? He is trying to, he is, he is maybe averse to, to conflict and, and maybe that was, um, you know, you can see how God ended up writing his. Mistake of being dishonest. Um, and it, it ended up sort of working out. But yeah, he definitely was not one who was, um, looking for a fight.

[00:11:00] Yeah. And like you said, in, in today's world, like that's a total shift, you know, now it seems, you know, the world seems to be about, you know, what are my rights and I'm entitled to this and that. And anyone who's trying to get in the way, can, can come. We can go figure it out in the parking lot. Yeah. Um, or, or on a, you know, or over the internet more, more commonly.

But you know, there, there's just, I think a beauty to the trust that Isaac has. I, I think not having to have it sort of all figured out. I think that's something that I would say, um, she cha characterizes him. Like, there's great trust. I actually have this down here. One of them was being trusting of his father, because I Now take a step back into the journey a little bit.

Um, his father, Abraham was the guy, he was the first, [00:12:00] he was the guy who God made the covenant worth and he made the promise to Abraham that Abraham would be the father of many nations. Mm-hmm. Abraham did not have a son, so then his wife. Bora, his wife's maids servant bo, him a child, Ishmael, who incidentally now that started basically ostensibly, what is the Muslim race now.

Sure. And then eventually God comes and makes this province, this covenant, this promise to Abraham promising him a son. And this doesn't happen. It doesn't happen. Doesn't happen. We've done the show on Abraham already. If you wanna go and listen wherever you get your podcasts. Anyway, so Sarah Falls pregnant.

It's Isaac. Isaac is born, he's weaned. Um, he's called, uh, Isaac because again, of the laughing that he brought maybe joy, maybe she was incredulous at the same stage to be pregnant at age 90. Um, but then now he's a young [00:13:00] man and everything's going along swimmingly and Abraham is like, okay, well I've got the air to the throne kind of thing.

And the, uh, Israelite nation will now be perpetuated. And God comes to Abraham and says, yo, bigger, I need to see that. You trust me. And so Abraham's like, yes sir. And he goes, I need you to go up to mount whatever it is and go and sacrifice your son on an altar to me. Yep. Now, bearing in mind, of course, that is their only son, but bearing in mind of course too, that at that stage, a, uh, you know, child's sacrifice was a thing to a God called molik.

So it was. Kind of a deviant kind of a deal. Um, very common in that, yeah, very common timeframe. Time, era, era. So, so anyway, so I'm not trying to put myself in Isaac's shoes 'cause Isaac couldn't, I said this in the previous podcast 'cause they set off with a donkey and, uh, another man [00:14:00] of donkey barrow, if you will, and Isaac and dad and Abraham gives Isaac the wood to carry up the side of this mountain.

I couldn't have been a baby. This is obviously a strong dude. He's a teenager hero. He is. He's uh, probably built a camping guide. Yeah. And so they get to the halfway up and, um, Isaac again, I'm trying to put myself in his shoes, says, dad, uh, we've got wood, we've got a mountain, we've got rocks for the altar.

We don't have a lamb to sacrifice. And Abraham's response was, the Lord will provide. All the while knowing he's gonna have to put his son on that altar. So Isaac knowingly goes along. Sure. And this is where like you use the term trusting, imagine. 'cause at some stage now, and now they get to the top of the mountain, they build the altar, they put the wooden stuff on there, and then dad grabs little Isaac or Big Isaac, whatever.

I'm sure he wasn't a little, [00:15:00] he's like, Isaac, you gotta get on there 'cause you're the sacrifice. Mm-hmm. But does it Anyway, this, this is where I'm like. Perplexed. Right. And this, I'd love you to bring a little Georgia Tech smarts because, 'cause I'm like, either this guy's massively trusting or he was on something, th this is just mind numbing to me how, how much faith he had in his father and what his father represented.

Yeah. I mean, when I read that story, I, I have two daughters and when I read that story, I can't help but put myself in the position of Abraham and. Um, it's, it's incredibly challenging to imagine. Yeah. And you know, I, I don't, we're not really told a whole lot about, about the conversation. You know, they, I think they were gone, you know, I think it took 'em a couple days to get there.

So they're, they've, they've set out, he [00:16:00] is, you know, he thinks he is just going with dad and then like at some point. It's like, no, you're, you're getting on. Yeah, exactly. And they're, um, you know, I, I think most scholars have him around 13 or so at this time, and so like, he's, he is not a, it's not an infant, you know, he has, he has volition and he could.

Push back against his, you know, his dad's old, his dad is old. Exactly. I, I think, I think we know who would win in a, in a brawl there, but yeah, there's, there's clearly, um, there's clearly just a, a trust, you know, trusting dad and we, we don't know how. Common sacrifices were up until this point, like in their lives, like we don't really have much of a history.

Like we don't know if that's something they were doing, if they were part of the local culture of that time, that was where they were doing that. We [00:17:00] don't know. We're not really told that. Um, so I imagine just it being like, what do you mean dad? Um, like, yeah, I can trust you on the way, I can trust you when we're setting the altar up.

But then like, when you tell me to get on top, that's where I think you, you know, draw the line a little bit. Yeah. You're like, uh, what, what do you mean not me? You know, what's coming to me is you talking, you, you're kind of stir my spirits. Um, 'cause I did make a note here because I have a younger brother who's a really good golfer.

Um, you know. And all of us in a certain way. Like here's Isaac, who, Abraham was a guy that God Almighty cut a deal with and made a promise to. Mm-hmm. Isaac grew up watching his father communing with the God there, with God there creator. Right? And so there must have been this [00:18:00] immense faith in his dad who held such a high regard.

It was held in such a high regard by everybody that he was like, well, if dad says it, this is basically coming straight from the word of God Almighty. Mm-hmm. Which doesn't make it any more liberating, but I just see once again, as usual, with all these heroes we've covered so far, it's just a massive faith.

You know, we dunno what tomorrow or to an hour's time holds, whatever, but we're gonna trust that the Lord will provide a little bit in the situation. Yeah, I mean, as you're talking, my mind jumps like to the New Testament and jumps to Jesus because he, obviously, he is, he's asked to, you know, the Lord tell, basically tell, tells him like, Hey, you're gonna be handed over.

You're gonna, you're gonna suffer, you're gonna die. And you know, Jesus being fully human like that was, you know, fully God and [00:19:00] fully human. The, I wonder if the, you know, the human part of him, you know, if, if there's any, if he is experiencing any of the same kind of doubts or like, okay, this is like, I have to trust my father here, you know, in the guard.

And he praise and ask God, like if there's any other way, like, you know, let it be done another way. And, and he and he and the father says, no, no, this is it. And he says, all right, then thy will be done. So you know, you say that, and then I don't have it in front of me. I should have my Bible here. But I remember reading when I was doing the research that it was more than once, more than, it was definitely more than once in the Bible where God says to Abraham, I have provided a ram for the slaughter.

Because he's prepared to give up your son and what you say there is so true. So here's God testing Abraham to see if he's give, give, if he's g prepared to give up his [00:20:00] son just like God did in the form of Jesus many hundreds of years later. Yeah. One, one thing that that comes, comes to my mind that I, that I've heard, um, is, you know this story, I think.

A, as we're looking at the full, the full picture, right? If, if child sacrifice was very common in that region and that time, then like God asking Abraham to sacrifice Isaac wouldn't be that strange. Mm-hmm. Of an idea. But then I think what's so cool is God basically says. Don't do it. I'm not like the other so-called gods that are around.

I think like this is a distinct distinguishing God from the many Gods molik and, and, and others [00:21:00] who this was the, this was, Hey, those Gods want you to do this, but I'm different. I'm a God who is gonna be redeeming and like I will. I think it's just a, a beautiful foreshadowing of like, Hey, I will provide the sacrifice the same way he does with Jesus, you know, thousands of years later.

Well, so it all ends well. Um, they look over as, as I, um, Abraham's about to stab Isaac before he sets the altar, the, the wood or lights. Uh, the angel of the Lord comes and says, stop. Stop. And they look over and they see a ram or young sheep in a court, in a thicket. They sacrifice the sheep, which is, is the, um, the order of the day.

And they do the, they do the sacrifice to God almighty. They descend down the mountain, they meet the guy that was traveling with them, and all's well that ends well. And, and then, and then fast forward in the story, because then to your point, there's not a lot [00:22:00] on Isaac. It's still a lot about Abraham and such.

Um, then eventually Isaac gets married. Uh, he gets the wife provided for him, Rebecca, and then he goes about, you talk about, you know, rebuilding or re constituting all these worlds that these old man had built. Mm-hmm. And I was reading this. I'm getting to the leadership lesson, but first I, I'm gonna get a bit deep here 'cause we did with the sacrifice and how God provided and how Abraham was prepared to sacrifice his son, then all these wells that Isaac started reopening just outta pure discipline and they kept the, the local folks as you highlight, were sort of up in arms about this.

I kept on getting the fact that water is a life source and without the wells, no, there's [00:23:00] no life. Mm-hmm. While I'm reading the story too, I'm thinking not just of the water in the well, I'm thinking of Yes. Isaac whose Dodge Death basically by his father's hand now providing living water for people and everyone in his family and for the folks in the area around.

Because I did find it curious, because I know the well is a big deal in the desert, as you can say, but it's not just the, well, it's the water that comes from it. And, and as a real spiritual con connotation to that thing, as I was reading through that story, I, I'm, I'm keen to get your take there. On which part?

Well, like I was seeing not just water, physical water. Mm-hmm. But Jesus, speaking of like, I am the living water eventually, because this whole little brush up the mountain with a sacrifice. It was a preamble to Jesus eventually sacrificing himself and Jesus saying, come, if you come to me, you'll never thirst.

Just like I, Isaac was opening these [00:24:00] wells all over the desert. Yeah. Well, I'd have to do my research here because, because I didn't, but you know, that conversation, you know, the first time, um, when Jesus meets the, the woman at the, well, I think in John four. Mm-hmm. Um, you know, it may have been, I think it was one of the wells that Jesus, yeah.

That Jacob opened. Uhhuh. Yeah. So it's like she. She was looking in that story. You know, she is looking for physical water. What do you mean you'll gimme water? That will never make me thirsty. Like I have to come here every day to get water and, and when Jesus says no, like I have something, that I have a water that once you taste, you'll never thirst again.

I think he was speaking to a spiritual, you know, a spiritual need that she had where she is looking for just a physical need. And, you know, j Jesus, you know, it's one of the, one of the I am [00:25:00] statements that Jesus, uh, I think there's seven of 'em in the book of J, six or seven in the Book of John. And, you know, I, I am the living water.

So there, there's lot, you know, the, the Bible's so cool like this where you'll get a. You'll get a, a little story about wells and you think, what's the big deal? And then like, as you continue to read, you can connect the dots and see that. Exactly. Yeah. How, like, how, how this is incredible that like these, how much alignment there is in these stories and it's, and the imagery that's in these stories, um, you know, can, can be seen fully, especially.

On, on the other side of Jesus's resurrection. Like you see it making sense and, and it's just an, it's a, it's a really encouraging thing to my faith when I, when I can see like that the bible is, is so much more than [00:26:00] just, you know, do this and don't do that like that, that, that's how a lot of people I think, view the Bible like a list of rules and.

You know, it's just so much, there's so much more to it than that. You know, people spend their whole lives, you know, studying this book and, and only scratch the surface, but the fact that there's just so much continuity. An imagery that connects and, and aligns, um, really encourages my faith that, you know, this book is truly inspired, um, by, by God himself, even though it's written by, you know, 66 different books and a ton of different writers.

But the thousands of years too. Over a th Yeah, exactly. In different languages. Like all the things that, that overlapping and connect. And yet, like you do have a. One congruent arc of a story and a narrative that's being told. You know, from Genesis all the way to Revelations, it's very cool. Makes [00:27:00] me feel like a kid, a kid inside.

And every time I do one of these shows, no matter the guest, I'm like, you know, it's amazing to me because I was always having like drive by brushes with a Bible. And the mission behind the show folks is just to kind of make you go and open it and, and read it a little bit, but don't just read it like I used to, which was kind of go fast and just check the box.

Really read it and try and put yourself in the story. And when you do that, it's amazing the stuff that sort of gets highlighted within and, and I can't tell you how much reading this, the story sort of jumps out of the book at me as supposed to just reading about, uh, these guys, you know, like the story of David and Goliath or whatever, which is a cool story.

But when you humanize it a little bit, it becomes very cool. And I would, and I was getting this thing, and I didn't wanna say it, but I so was like, Wells living water. It's about the water. It's about the water. And then you're right, the first time Jesus declares who he is to someone that wasn't one of [00:28:00] the disciples was at one of Jacob's Wells and Jacob, of course.

Um, Isaac's second son who we gonna get to in just a minute. So it, it's, it's the ultimate legacy move. And, and, and the woman at the well was a descendant of Abraham, you know, like she acknowledges as much. Yeah. So, yeah, again, it's just another string tying back to, um, back to Isaac and, and Abraham and, you know, to get back to Isaac, I think.

You see, like you said, Abraham is, is the first, he is the, he is the father of the faith. And then, you know, as far as putting yourself in the story, like as a dad, I think about how can I like the, the faith, the what I've learned about God, how he is changed my life, how can I steward that to my children?

[00:29:00] And, you know, in, in the, in, in Abraham, he does so, so well with Isaac. Um, you see, you just see the faithfulness and the trust. Mm-hmm. Really, that, that was the staple of, of his father, the son, the son of Promise. Um, Isaac carries that through and then. It goes a little wonky with his kids, but I think you see the, the desire for him to take hold of what his father believed.

Yeah. And, and think, continue to press into that. I, I, I, I feel led to go here. And this is, we, we've, we've talked about a legacy move with the wills. Um. How, like for a business owner, what does make this practical? Uh, a lot of folks here in the south, um, you know, sort of inherit family businesses and stuff, and a lot of them will, uh, if it was certainly [00:30:00] me, I don't, but if it was me, you'd like to put your own fingerprint on something, you know?

Mm-hmm. Take ownership of something a little bit where Isaac to me proves that it's okay just to maintain the status quo. To continue to build on what was built and basically just grow it for the next generation kind of thing, which he did. So it's not like, like that quote that I read to you when we, at the top of the show, it's not like you're gonna have this barnstorming idea or whatever the case might be, leader, future, husband, whatever you're gonna be, um.

Sometimes just the status quo of doing the right thing, being faithful, doing all of the fundamental stuff correctly. I sound like a golf coach now. That's kind of the key to, um, leaving a, a lasting and worthwhile legacy. Wouldn't you agree? I I really would. And um, you know, as we, as we see in, in the story, he's just doing what God's called him [00:31:00] to do, which is to.

Continue to, to stay in the la you know, to stay in the land and to grow. Yeah. And then, you know, down the line, like God calls Jacob to something different and at that point it changes, but like, it's pretty clear, you know, what, what God has has called us to. And it's not always the most exciting or attractive to.

Ma the outside world. Like no one's making a, a movie about like the, the, the faithful dad who does the right things and, you know, raises his, that dude is almost taboo. That that dude is almost taboo in the 21st century. If you think about it. The guy that just doing the right thing all the time, think about it.

But, but I think there, I, I think that's okay. I, I think that's actually a good thing, you know? Um, again, like if we look at Jesus like. [00:32:00] He wasn't living a flashy look at me life. Like he, he tried to stay under the radar. Mm-hmm. And he tried to just be faithful with a few people. That the, that his father had given him.

Uh, it, it does, it's not like he went out looking to, you know, host, audit, you know, host stadiums full of people. Like he was faithful in the way he was called, and like, we each have our own calling. Mm-hmm. Um, so I think, you know, the question I, I would ask, you know, that I ask myself and I would encourage.

You know, anyone who, who's following Jesus or is curious about the Bible, like, what's my arena? What's my calling in my life, and how can I do that well? And and when you get an answer to that, like it becomes pretty clear. At least for me, like what is important? What, what are the [00:33:00] things to focus on? Um, it's impossible to do everything and, you know, to, to get to a golf coach, you know, like you said, like.

The basics are really important. Spending time with God, being, you know, under, trying to understand your Bible, being in prayer, being in community with other believers who can encourage you serving, um, like those things are really staples of, of, you know, a follower of Christ. So like, let's nail those and see what happens.

Like. Well, there's a promise in the Bible that says, seek first the kingdom of God, and all these things will be added unto you. So what you say there is so true. And, and, and then you said, when you said too, it took me to this morning when I dropped my daughter off at school, they started with a Bible study.

And the Bible study was about truth and, and the verse was to those who are faithful with a little will be given much. If you [00:34:00] are honest with a little, then you can be honest with a lot. And it's when you said, and you actually used, when you're faithful with small things, that big things can happen. And that is like a fundamental truth of everything in terms of being a good leader, a good father, a good mother, a good coach, whatever the case might be.

Mm-hmm. You all want the glory, right? But everything starts like a seed. Being faithful with that and doing the fundamental things correctly, that sets the table for future growth eventually, perhaps. Totally. I mean, like if we're gonna stay in the golf lane, um, you know, arguably the greatest coach of my generation, Butch Harman, like.

It's not like he was said, Hey, I'm gonna be the best, you know, I'm gonna coach Tiger and all these Nu world number ones. Like I'm just gonna start doing it. No, he, I don't know his story intimately. I know his father was a pro and there was this like gen, there was [00:35:00] this, um, you know, culture in their family of teaching.

Mm-hmm. And he got really good at teaching. Because he was really good and he was faithful in what he was teaching, and his players had some success. His star grew. But I guarantee you, it's not like you say, like you just can't say, I'm gonna do all these big things Like that happens by doing the small things every day.

Um, well. I've looked at the time and I've kept you for a long time already. So I wanna kind of zip through these because we've sort of, in a way covered everything I wanted to in a very conversational manner, which I appreciate very much. But we've talked about the person, we've talked about some of the legacy moves.

They just one, two leadership lessons I want to highlight that came to me and I'll pitch them at you, Cameron, and let you respond. Um, first off, we talked about his manner. He's sort of softly spoken, [00:36:00] uh, doesn't seek out. Combative sort of a style. And to me, he wasn't a harsh leader, but he certainly wasn't.

But he, and he was certainly peaceful. And even when there was, and I'm gonna get to it with one of the leadership lessons too, with his kids, even when there was the Jacob Deceit, when Jacob tricked his dad, Isaac, to getting the birthright instead of his twin brother, Esau. Mm-hmm. Afterwards, when Esau comes to Isaac.

I was like, dad, can't you do something from about this? And dad was like, no, son. This is a once off sort of a deal. This is how it works. This is part of the covenant from God Almighty. He's still blessed Esau, but not with what Esau was looking for. So even then, when he is having to let down one of his children after a mistake that he made.

He's still not like combative and like, get outta my face, son. He still blessed him. So I think there's a real leadership lesson in not [00:37:00] always being the antagonistic one, sometimes sort of looking for, for common ground, looking for peace, wouldn't you say? I would definitely, and, and specifically in, in that instance, you know, speaking of the eastern, you know, worldview and, you know, words are so important.

And, you know, I think they carried much more weight than they, they do in our, in our worldview. And it was like, Hey, I've said what I've said, like, that's it. I, I, I can't just like, there's no takebacks here. Like the, the giving of the blessing was such an important thing. It's like that he, he sort of used all his bullets and like he gave it, he gave it, and that's it.

And like. It may not have been. He obviously didn't intentionally give it to the, he thought he, you know, he thought he was giving it to Esau. Yeah. Now, the Lord had different plans, but [00:38:00] as far as we know, like his intention was, was to give it honestly, and he gave all of it in a one fell swoop. And so he basically in, in telling Esau, no, I can't take it back.

Give it back to you. I think you just, you see someone who, with integrity, who sort of says, you know what? I say what I mean, and I mean what I say. That's a great Yes. Amen. Second one, and this pertains to the brothers 'cause there were twin brothers. That Isaac and Rebecca had Esau, who was the oldest, who was an outdoorsman, hairy.

Um, he was the man after Isaac's own hearts. Yep. Jacob, who was not hairy, the Bible describes him more pale skinned and he loved to hang around the house a bit more. And he was Mom Rebecca's favorites. Mm-hmm. And um, mom caught wind of Isaac wanting to bless Esau, sending him out to hunt, bringing back dinner.

She was like, come Jacob, we're gonna get this for you. We're gonna get the birthright, which is a big deal. No, the birthright had, uh, [00:39:00] already been tricked. This was for the, the father's blessing. Yeah. Um, but I'm getting to the fact that Isaac had a favorite of the twins, and this turned into conflict because eventually Au and Jacob were at odds with each other.

Mm-hmm. Eventually they made up, but for a while there were ramifications from this favoritism. Sure. Basically, the lesson behind this as a leader is be careful of favorites, wouldn't you say? It's, it certainly seems that way. Uh, trying to, for me, trying to put myself in the story with, with, you know, I have two kids, it, it's an impossible to say which one's your favorite.

Um, you know, picking your favorite kid isn't possible, but I, I, I see in the story that you know that there is. A fallout, sort of because of the, his [00:40:00] preferences. Um, so as a, as a leader, I think, uh,

maybe better to keep those preferences to yourself. Exactly. Exactly right. Um, amen brother. Um, any asset goes on, the story goes on, and then you learn more about Jacob. I'm listening to you and I'm sort of considering what I've written down and what we've talked about, and this reads like one other, the six part drama on Netflix.

So folks, you should go read the story because it's worthwhile just like everything else. Eventually Isaac dies at the right old age of like 190 or something like that after living a very full life in which he left a lot of legacy because essentially as I look at it. He basically built up holdings, holdings, which established Israel, the nation.

Mm-hmm. Essentially. [00:41:00] So in his own quiet way, his own unassuming way, his own non antagonistic way, his own sometimes lying, deviant way, he left a massive footprint for generations to come. And in, in a weird sort of a way, and I'll give you the last word, the story of this. Sort of, sort of seemingly ordinary story about a guy that wasn't written about very much.

He's one of the three patriarchs of Israel, and the guy flexed a big influence on what's become, uh, you know, eventually the group of believers, the Jewish faith, all the rest of it, just by kind of doing who he is and not deviating from who he was created to be. You're, you're exactly right. Parting shot for you maybe?

Well, I mean, I, I, I just, I, I love talking about the Bible. I, I think there's, there's so much to it and, um, you know, for, for the listener, [00:42:00] I'd say you, I, I would encourage anyone, um, to remember, you know, just to, to get in and read it. It's like. It's so, it, it's a life changing practice. Um, and it's okay to, to not understand everything.

It's okay to. Um, be offended by some things. Like, it's okay to have a lot of questions. Um, it's okay to, to not understand like, oh, what this is, seems so wild. Why'd this happen? Like, there's just something magical about reading it for yourself. So my, my biggest, if I had a a, a platform, I'd say just get in and just get in and read it.

It's like, like eng golf, the secrets in the dirt. Like, there's no magic about the Bible in the sense of like, you, you need to just do the, you just need to get in and read it and, and get messy with it and, and, and look at it, you know, it's [00:43:00] okay to look at it honestly and objectively and, you know, it's okay to not be sure of it all the time.

Um, because, you know, we're, we're not, uh, you know, we're not, I don't know that we have the capacity to. I truly understand everything, right? But we, we have enough, um, in the, in the word of God. So getting in, reading it, um, bite-sized chunks, you don't need to, you know, read, sit down and read for an hour straight, like you were saying.

It's like. Find a story and, and, and really do the work of, of imagining like, what was this like, like the dad, you know, Abraham's going up the mountain with Isaac. How's Isaac feeling? What are they talking about? Like, really happened? You know, this isn't just, this isn't like a sci-fi thing. Like these were real people with real emotions, human emotions, human problems.

And, uh, I think that's a [00:44:00] great way to, to read it is, is to, uh, you know, really try and be imaginative as you're doing so. Amen Brother. I, I wanted to add to that quickly 'cause you did a beautiful job and you almost stirred me a little too. And I just wanted the word seek kept on coming to me. Seek like looking for like, if you go into the Bible endeavoring to find treasures within, because it is loaded with nuggets.

Treasures for, for life and for leadership and all these things. If you go in there seeking, you will find. But if you go in there reading like I used to, you see the, I'm thankful to the show because it makes me truly read the Bible. Yeah, you wanna be ready? I'm way more nervous doing this show than I am doing my golf podcast for 'cause I can fake that a little bit.

Um, but if you go in there seeking Cameron, um, that's when you find the gold man. That's when you find the gold. Yeah. Alright, where I'll let you go. Um, please share the social media [00:45:00] handle that your wife runs and if you have, if you have a foundation or anything, uh, the viewers or the listeners could go and support or anything you wanna share.

Please go ahead. Yeah. My, I think my Instagram is, uh, cam, at cam tr and um. That's pretty much the only place that there's anything relevant. I, I, I think I have Twitter as well, but it's, it's been silent for a, a, a long time and I don't plan on igniting that fire once again anytime soon. Leave that up to Phil Mickelson.

He tweets for the team, doesn't he? He, he is, he is. Got enough ammo for, uh, a, for a, for a few teams, but it's, it's been really nice to, uh, to do this, mark. Thanks for the invitation and, uh, wish you all the success and blessing and that you know, lot people's lives are. Touched by, uh, by this work. Oh, God bless you, mana.

So I'm thankful that you would join me. And for the rest of you, thanks so much for downloading [00:46:00] this. Please do share it with your friends. We wanna hear from you. Best ways to follow us on social message us. The handles on social are at the greater call, uh, on YouTube. You can watch Cameron's handsome mug there too and all the other shows.

Go search and subscribe. Their comment. We'd love to hear from you. Thanks again. Appreciate y