The Greater Call Podcast – Joseph Father of Jesus - Paternal Leader | Ben Pellicani

In this episode of The Greater Call, Mark Immelman is joined by longtime friend and Nashville golf instructor (and high school golf coach) Ben Pellicani to explore Joseph—the earthly father of Jesus—as a model of quiet, decisive, faith-filled leadership. Joseph never speaks a recorded word in Scripture, yet his actions reveal a powerful blueprint for paternal leadership, integrity, obedience, and “leadership without spotlight.”

Ben and Mark walk through Joseph’s defining moments—choosing mercy toward Mary, obeying God without hesitation, protecting his family, and faithfully stewarding his role as a carpenter and father. The conversation lands on a simple but challenging truth: often the greatest legacy is built through excellence in the simple things, done consistently, even when no one is watching.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

 🎙️ Why Joseph is a powerful example of leadership without spotlight
 🎙️ The mercy and integrity behind Joseph’s decision to protect Mary’s dignity
 🎙️ The phrase “fear not”—and why the fear was bigger than the angel moment
 🎙️ “Obedience without hesitation” and how Joseph models decisive leadership
 🎙️ Why faith isn’t just a feeling—it’s an act of response
 🎙️ “Beast Mode” = Be Excellent at Simple Things (and why that’s a leadership key)
 🎙️ Leading in the shadows: how real leaders build foundations, not headlines
 🎙️ A practical fatherhood rhythm: “I love you. I’m proud of you. Go be a leader.”
 🎙️ Where to find Ben + his free faith-based accountability journal

Key Themes

Leadership Without Spotlight
Joseph leads through action, protection, and steadiness—without needing attention or recognition.

Mercy + Integrity in Private
Joseph chooses righteousness and compassion even when the law and culture gave him other options.

Obedience Without Hesitation
When God speaks, Joseph moves—decisive, steady, and faithful.

Be Excellent at Simple Things
The “mundane” habits of faithfulness are often the very building blocks of legacy.

Leading When No One Is Watching
True leadership shows up in the quiet work—cleaning up, serving, building foundations, and doing the next right thing.

 Key Scripture Mentioned

• Matthew 1:20 — Joseph’s dream and the angel’s message (“Do not be afraid…”)

🔥 Takeaways

➡ Real leadership often looks like service, not being served.
➡ Obedience can be ordinary—and still world-changing.
➡ Your legacy is shaped by what you do consistently—especially in private.
➡ Excellence in the simple things is a spiritual discipline.
➡ Build others up so they can flourish in their calling—without needing your name in the spotlight.

About Ben Pellicani

Ben Pellicani is a Nashville-based golf instructor and coach who is passionate about leveraging his platform to serve others. He also created a free faith-based accountability journal focused on finding joy, comfort, and peace while building daily consistency.

🎙️ Follow Mark Immelman

• IG/YouTube: @MarkImmelman
• Facebook: @markimmelmangolf
• X: @mark_immelman
• LinkedIn: @mark-immelman-87ab46162
• Website: markimmelman.com

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Website→ https://markimmelman.com/the-greater-call/

✨ Be full of joy in all things, no matter where you are. Be thankful. Go and be a legend! ✨

Transcript

[00:00:00] Welcome to This Greater Call podcast. I'm your host, mark Immelman, and I'm so very thankful you would download episode 23. Uh, the far about Joseph the father of Jesus. I've entitled this paternal leader and I'm so thankful that a longtime friend, great golf instructor in Nashville, Tennessee, Ben Pellicani would join me.

Ben, how are you? I'm doing great. How are you doing, mark? I'm good. You know, this is so cool because you've been on my other podcast, that one behind me there, that, that direction you on the mark show and you dropped some serious golf nuggets. And for folks, uh, who are golfers who are listening to this, you can go check it out because Ben is one of the best.

And Ben, then you reached out to me and you're like, Hey, I like this idea of the greater coal. I'd love to join you. I was like, what a blessing. Thank you. So I, I, I appreciate you for, for, for coming alongside me here. Yeah, absolutely. And I know we were talking a little bit [00:01:00] before this, but you know, leveraging our platform to serve those around them, like.

That's why I coach golf, and that's why I'm super excited about, about this podcast and, and starting to talk, uh, about Joseph. Joseph, the father of Jesus. Uh, I have been joked with me on a text because, uh, here in a recent episode, daddy Pepper. It talked about Mary, the mother of Jesus amongst others. And of course, again, this Greater Cult podcast is to highlight life, leadership, and legacy lessons from the heroes of the faith.

All just to help you and me, um, get this life thing and this leadership, the leadership thing down a bit better. Um, so Ben jokes with me and he goes, nice, you're gonna have me follow Dotie Pepper, who's a legend in our industry. And then talking about Joseph, the father of Jesus. And I kind of giggled. And then when you did that, Ben, I was like, he's right.

'cause this Joseph, this is some sort of character to dive into. Yeah, it is. You know, there's not a lot written about Joseph and, and I think one of the [00:02:00] cool things, anytime there isn't a big spread of content. One of my favorite words to use is ruminate. We love to ruminate. It's, it means chew on. It's how cows chew grass, right?

And so to ruminate on Joseph in this small little snippet of the Bible that, that he shows up, uh, it just allows you to just kind of really dive in to that one little segment. And, uh, I've been, I, I've been fired up because I've been able to do this over a period of weeks now and, and just keep revisiting and seeing how.

You know what, what's being said to me through that small snippet of, of the Bible, I feel led to go here. Kyle Jackson, who started the show with me, he talks about reading the Bible with a soap method, which is scripture observation, application, prayer, and, and you're right when I've, um, embarked on this journey that is highlighting heroes of the faith and lessons to learn from them, I find myself reading the [00:03:00] Bible differently.

And every time Ben, I dive into one of these characters, I'm like, golly, this guy should be a movie hero. And then I'm like, gosh, the more I read it, the more, even though like with Joseph who never has a recorded word in all of scripture, yet he was the father of Jesus. Um, even though this guy was never quoted as saying anything, just his actions demonstrate some incredible, you know, paternal lessons and certainly leadership and life lessons.

Absolutely. And you know, Joseph to me is, and I'll, I'll, you know, we'll get there eventually, but like there's a, there's a line in scripture that if I can be the dad. That produces. And this is, this is, I think is a super cool, you know, there's these, these snippets in Jesus' life, and I call it the fast forward moments.

You know, they go from one month to 12 years and then 12 to to 30, when, when he starts, uh, living it out [00:04:00] in, in a much bigger picture. And those fast forward moments has the same line in it. And it says, Jesus grew in wisdom. Stature in the favor of God and men. It was said almost exactly the same twice.

Yeah. And I was thinking, what would it be like if you were a dad or you coached and they said, Hey, we took a, we fast forward this kid's life. And he grew in wisdom, in stature, in favor with God in men. I was like, that's a dad right there. Like, what? How amazing would that be if that's what you're known for?

And so again, like you said, not a lot recorded about him, but man, those two lines, if that, if that's what my coaching or, or my, my parenthood ends up being boiling down to, I'm in. Yeah, I'm remiss folks that I didn't say. Ben is also a high school golf coach, and again, leadership to me, Ben, it's parenthood.

It's being a [00:05:00] coach. It's not just being a business leader. And the real leaders like Joseph are sometimes the strong silent type. And I wrote some notes in his character, you know, just from kinda reading the story over and over. And you can find a story in Matthew, folks, if you go to the Bible. Um. To me, he was strong, he was silent, he was steadfast, given, we'll highlight the story, all the things he had to go through.

Decisive. Gosh, when this guy got a word from God, he was like not hanging around. Um, he was almost a model for the fatherhood, like you say. And then he was merciful. He was humble and very much selfless, which I want your take here because oftentimes as a leader, we confuse what the role actually is and you start expecting to be served.

Joseph was the other way. He was always in service to his wife and to his son. Yeah. And, and, and I, I kind of boil it down to this phrase, right? It's leadership without spotlight. Yeah. And, and I think [00:06:00] that's a really, really unique character trait. And, and you kind of laid it out there of Joseph, is that he can be a leader.

Without seeking the spotlight. And when you look at, you know, where, where Joseph shows up in Matthew, which tends to be, you know, they always say the gospel of Matthew is more kind of presented for the Jewish populations to resonate with that, with that group. And, you know, they speak of Joseph in that way that a, a, a dad or, or a husband would lead a family.

And then the, the view of Joseph through Luke. Where it's seen more through the, the lens of Mary. Yeah. And Joseph Joseph's supporting role within that as well. But yeah, it's that, it's that leadership without spotlight piece, and that's a really, really hard one. I think, um, as coaches, as, as parents is what it, you know, I always think of one of the, the really [00:07:00] cool dads and I, and I think you've recently, uh, talked to this too, is like Scotty Scheffer's dad.

Talk about, uh, a dad, a leader without spotlight. He just loves supporting his son. Yeah. And most people can walk right side by side in golf tournaments with Mr. Scheffler and they never know. Mm-hmm. Because he doesn't want spotlight. He just wants his son. Again, it goes back to that term that, that grow in wisdom and stature in favor with God and men.

Like that's what he wants for his son. And, and I think that's what Joseph displays throughout, um, some of the, the actions he does. I, I'm so glad you brought up Scott Scheffler for the Nongo, folks watching this. Scotty Scheffler is a year in 2026, the world's number one golfer. He is awfully humble. He's awfully professional.

Um, he's a hard worker. He takes great delight in his craft, which is playing golf. He's a fantastic husband. In fact, if you watch [00:08:00] him, he will go to his family. In last week, I shouldn't date this, but it was at the RBC Heritage event and it went down to a playoff. And um, I was calling the playoff alongside Dottie Pepper, who I've mentioned.

And, um, Scotty ended up getting beaten by Matt Fitzpatrick. And so. My job, my, uh, producer calls on me and he said, I want you to grab Scotty, uh, for a couple questions. So it's the loser interview. So this is not the funnest interview in the world, lemme tell you. 'cause the guy has just been, you know, been beaten.

But I reached out to him and he was putting his things in his golf bag and I said to him, Scotty would just, just a moment or two, and he said, oh, absolutely. But all a while, you're sort of looking around to see where his family is. Okay. So, so I could see how his emphasis was his family, but he was doing the job with me and he was very gracious, answered the questions beautifully.

Um, magnanimous, if you will, complimenting, uh, Matthew on his play. Now I get back to Scott Scheffler, his father, [00:09:00] who many times I've walked on the golf course and Scott greeted me and I will be like. Scott, wow, congratulations on Scotty's play. And every single time, Ben, he looks at me and he goes, do you know what?

I just want him to be a good guy. He goes, the golf is cool and everything, but I'm more interested in the man that Scotty is than the golfer who's become, yeah. And, and, and again, I think the idea that you can do that. But also live out excellence. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Right. And, and I think that's, I think sometimes people look at, well, if I, if I take this leadership role and I'm not looking for spotlight, that means I have to do less than, I mean, Joseph's task with a really, really hard task.

Right. He's, his job is to be the earthly dad of, of what will become the, the risen savior. Right. That is, that is an incredible task that he's given. And to be a, to [00:10:00] some degree, a footnote of this story. Mm-hmm. And but, but to have that impact and instill in all those ways, right? The wisdom that comes with being a, a, a good person and, and a great man is, I mean, that's really Joseph's legacy right there.

Yeah. Um, and does it without spotlight, which is, it's really, you know, it's, it's not seen a lot these days. Okay. For the folks who don't know, let's quickly give the whistle stop journey through Joseph's life before we dive into lessons to be learned. Um, he was a carpenter from Nazareth, little town in, uh, Israel.

Um, he is in love with a young lady called Mary. Mary miraculously falls pregnant out of wedlock, which was frowned upon in those days, uh, much more so than what they are nowadays. Anyway. So now Joseph, she reveals this to him and he knows that he is not the [00:11:00] father of this child that she is pregnant with.

And he had two decisions. So he considered her, considered divorcing her in private. 'cause if a spectacle was made, he'd bring shame on her. Now, interrupt me if I'm missing something here, Ben, please. No, I, I think I, so far right. It's the respect he has for Mary without even knowing what's to come. Right.

There's a, you know, if that angel shows up before that and says, Hey, your, your betrothed wife is pregnant. It's after. And so there's a, there's a respect level before this next piece. Big time. Big time. And that's a lesson for all of us men watching year two, where real love, you know, real love does things differently in a merciful full of grace sort of a way.

And you talk about that, um, that, that, that brush with the angel, the Bible verses in Matthew one 20 and it basically goes. While he thought about all these things, this is, [00:12:00] uh, Joseph, considering, oh my gosh, what am I gonna do? My wife's pregnant. It's not me. This is not right. Uh, so while he's thinking about all these things, an angel of the Lord appears to him in a dream and says Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary as your wife for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit.

Okay, let's be real. If I have an angel appear to me in a dream, I'm like, yikes. But right away he's decisive and he makes plans to marry her. And, and so all of a sudden it's all those things he was thinking about. They in the rear view and there's no looking back. Joseph is right where he is being decisive, doing the job that he should that, that he's basically called to do.

Yes. Yeah. And, and think and think about this. This is interesting to me. How many times when an angel appears, the first thing is, is said, fear not. Yeah, exactly. Don't, don't be afraid. Yeah. But, but the angel doesn't say, fear not of me. Fear not of this [00:13:00] action. So if you think about the weight of the decision is greater than an, like you said, if an angel shows up, like again, every time an angel shows up, the same thing is said, fear not, except this time it says.

Fear not of me. Don't fear not of this decision. So that means he, this is weighing on him with, with a lot of, you know, again, if an angel shows up, I'm gonna be freaked out. Yeah. But this decision, because you go back to the love of Mary and, and what does that look like and not wanting to bring disgrace to her.

And it's weighing so much that the fear of an angel showing up is, is actually less than the decision he has to make. I, I love you man, because you know what you've highlighted for me, and this is where the Bible is the living word. For those folks who don't read it this thing, every time you read it and you truly read it, don't skim read like I used to.

It's gonna [00:14:00] highlight something else. And you know, Ben, through it all, when I've seen fear not, I was thinking more of the angel going, yeah, I know I'm this massive being, this supernatural. Don't be afraid. I'm okay. But you're so right. There's all these other fears. He's the angel saying, don't worry about that stuff, man.

You are now within your purpose. You're on track. We got you. Yeah. And, and then ultimately, right. It's, it's a, a, a little key phrase that I think of through this whole journey. It's the obedience without hesitation. And, and you, you made note of that, right? As soon as. The angel or, or the word kind of gets to him.

There is no hesitation in Joseph. The, the obedience with, without hesitation is it's, it's challenging to, you know, you look at a lot of prophets and there, that, that trait's not there. I mean, look at Mo I mean, Moses fought back Yeah. On, on a lot of things and not Joseph, Joe. I mean, every time [00:15:00] Joseph answers the call without hesitation, it's, it's a really.

It's a trait that I wonder how you balance between how do I, uh, know it's not a false saying, and how do I know that it's coming from God? And Joseph had that ability to do that in a way that allowed him to do it without hesitation. And it's definitely one that I, I wrestle with because I don't know if I'm as good as Joseph as that one.

I know we're not in the comparison game, but. That's one that I, I, I'm envious of that. You can, you can be obedient without hesitation. Yeah. Hi Jax. I think that's a podcast for the future, but going on. So here's the thing. So he marries, um, Mary, uh, he then gets another word from the angel to say, you know, now she's gotta go and con, uh, have the baby.

And so they go to Bethlehem. And I can imagine a father sitting there. After his [00:16:00] beloved wife, who he knows is carrying the son of man and the son of God, he can't find a place for them to live or, or for her to give birth. So they stay in, it's called a, a stable, but it's ostensibly a cave. And then she brings this child into the world, and all the while he's just a silent one looking upon all this.

And then the shepherds show up, um, to, you know, offer their praises. And then the three wise men show up. And all the while Joseph was just the dude in the back. He was like the, the, he, he was just a transport guy, if you will. But it seems still though, that he was okay with all of that, uh, um, uh, to, to me being a father of two girls, you know, you're involved in this now.

He wasn't involved in the physical act, but he is now involved. Still, he's just there silently in the background protecting his wife and protecting his new son. I mean, again, you've pointed this out, it's like the ultimate in silent, steadfast leadership. [00:17:00] Yeah. And, and I'm a, I'm a dad of four girls, so it re it resonates just as much.

Uh, yeah. I mean, I, I think, you know, the Christmas story, it becomes a story of Mary and rightfully so. Uh. But it is, it's, it's Joseph's role without having to, to be the, the main role. And, and what's really cool about the Bible is when you think of it through Eastern eyes, the idea that the story's mostly about the mom is so rare, right?

That's why when you see these amazing women in the Bible, it's, it's so unique that Jesus puts them in the story. 'cause that resonates even stronger with, uh, you know, uh. That, that early BCAC switchover of, of the calendar, that that is so rare and in his, his, his willingness to be just a part of that story and not try to dominate that story, at least that's how it's presented.

Um, I think is is a [00:18:00] really, really interesting, mostly as a parent, how do we parent. Where the story isn't about us, it's about how we, you know, ultimately support our kids in whatever endeavor they, they want to take on. Kids are a legacy, right? And this show's about legacy. And if you look at Joseph, you know, he's a carpenter and you talk about the fast years and the slow years.

Um, clearly, well, let's go on roll fast. We'll brush through the story. So baby Jesus is born, then Joseph gets another word from an angel saying, yo, bro, it's time for you to gas, to escape to Egypt. Now, it's not like they've got a Yukon and they pile everything in there. They're on donkeys and stuff. And so they make the long trip down to Egypt in, because you know, Herod, I believe it was at the time, was basically after the firstborn children all over the place.

So once again, this decisive leadership. So Egypt comes and goes, they move back. And then I wanna highlight a part of the story where Joseph was a very devout man and he observed all the, [00:19:00] all the Jewish festivals like the Passover. They were in Jerusalem, in the temple, and they turn around and they've lost their kid, and all of a sudden they see him, you know, talking with the Pharisees and the scribes, you know, wowing people with his knowledge of the, the scriptures.

And I'm thinking first off, as a dad there, and as a leader, as a father, I'm like, I can, I've lost my children in Walmart for a few minutes and I know that just doesn't feel very good. But now you, the father of God Almighty. You lose your child. I mean, that's gotta be hair raising. And then they turn around and then Jesus is like, why are you even looking for me?

You know, this is my father's house. I, I, I am where I'm supposed to be. I, I found that entire, um, segment of the story really mind numbing, and it forced me into a lot of, um, you know, time spent just thinking about what it must have felt like to be Joseph at that juncture. Yeah, and I actually [00:20:00] wanna, I wanna rewind just a little bit more 'cause I think there's a cool little segment here.

And this one you, you know, you talk about, you read the Bible and you read it enough and eventually there's like these like hair tingling, like, oh my gosh, how did I read this from the start? So Mary Conceives, traditional Jesus gets circumcised at eight days. G and, and Luke, it speaks how he goes to the temple in Jerusalem.

So I, I did a little research on this and this is where it started getting cool, right? So first born males at that time were taken to Jerusalem at one month old to be in a very similar arc of the Passover type, uh, presentation. And so they would sacrifice two dos. One month old. So Joseph went in, sacrificed the two doves.

Uh, I believe that's when the Simeon interaction happens, uh, where Simeon [00:21:00] says, my life is now fulfilled because I've seen it. Uh, so he goes in and sacrifice these, these two doves. So somehow, again, you talk about, we skimmed through too often, but I've been sitting on this, I've been, I've been ruminating on this, and all of a sudden I thought, dove.

I said, what was, there's, there's like. A big part of the story that talks about doves. So I go to the baptism of Jesus. So fast forward 30 years, when the baptism of Jesus comes, a doves appear, and I, and I'm thinking, would it have been cool if the dove that was sacrificed is this, is this dove that transcends down?

So I'm telling this to someone at church who, who has a lot of, uh, knowledge. And in of, of the Jewish, um, word usage. And he said, you know what you should do, go read the word that they use. And it's this, this, this word for basically hovering. Yeah. And the other place [00:22:00] that word is used is in Genesis one, when it speaks of how the Holy Spirit is hovering over the void before there's order brought to the world.

And so here's this obedience of Joseph going through the traditional custom of the Passover, which is again the freedom of slavery in which they walk through water to to re, and here comes the baptism of water in which this dove comes hovering down with the same usage of words where God hovers over before he brings order to the world.

To me there was this, this, this, like hair tingling. I still get it where there's this full circle moment. To me, I was like, oh my gosh. There's this moment in which the obedience of a simple carpenter to do the, the act of our firstborn to go to the [00:23:00] temple. And again, that that's not a simple journey in its own right.

Is then revisited through, you know, again, the hallmark entry of Jesus in, into his mission field. And that to me like was, was hair tingling a little bit because the simple obedience of a dad led to, again, my view of this full circle, and, and again, we're, no one ever says that, that the book's written for one person, but I do think God.

Writes into the story of man, potentially for a select few. And, and when I read that, I went, wow, God, thank you for, for showing me that. Because simple acts of obedience can have this lasting value that again, he's doing just what is right and, and then fast forward 30 years and here's the grand entrance.

Um, with, that's really no difference than God [00:24:00] creating the order to the world with, with a similar type word usage. I don't know. It, it got me going. That's it. Well, me too. I can feel the tingle in my arms that you're talking about and I'm glad you would share, share that. And you, you keep talking about the power of the obedience and oftentimes obedience is sort of mundane.

And you're talking about here, Joseph is just observing custom. As a leader. He says, he says to his kid, and he's, um, well, it says to his child, he says to his wife, we've gotta go to the temple so we can have Jesus baptized. Right? And she pled. It's the actionist. Like I I, I can see myself on a Sunday morning when you're like, oh gosh, no, I don't wanna go to church.

Well, I don't wanna get up and do this work. Whatever it might be. You're a businessman and you have a tough night that, or a tough day, and you're just exhausted. But there's something to be done. My wife calls it eating the frogs. You gotta eat the frogs and, and do certain things where that is one of the life lessons from Joseph where his life to me sort of [00:25:00] shows that faith isn't just a feeling, it's an act of response.

And it seems to me like Joseph, in everything that he did, again, we never heard from the guy he is never quoted. But when something was said, he was the do guy. And so often that, so often to me that is. As mundane and boring is what it sounds. That's sort of the key to success in life, don't you think? Yeah.

We have a saying here at, here at Lipscomb Academy. Uh, some of this is just because it's fun to say, but we call it beast mode and, and it stands for be excellent at simple things. Okay. And I think that's Joseph, I think he's excellent at simple things, you know? 'cause if, if people know Jesus as son of the carpenter, that means he's a good carpenter.

He was good at what he did, and so they knew Joseph and they knew him as someone who did good things. And you know, 'cause that's really, you know, [00:26:00] after Matthew one, Luke two, the rest of the references of Joseph are always in lieu of this son of a carpenter, isn't he? The the son of And but, but if people know who he is.

That means he's, he's good at his craft. Mm-hmm. And, and you can be good at your craft, obedient and have, and, and, and also instill in your kids this ability to, to have this great wisdom of how to, to navigate things. And, and I think that's the, the most interesting part of Joseph is his greatness. Is not seen by what, uh, what he's doing from the stage.

His greatness is seen by his support of what's to come, and, and that's, that's really the part that I walk away from being able to spend some time into saying, what can, you know, what, what am I pulling out of, out of [00:27:00] this story? Is it sat right there? So you can, you can be great without having that spotlight and, and you can be obedient without hesitating and.

I think, you know, that's, that's tough to do. Uh, but Joseph did it in, in such a cool, unique way, beast mode. Back to beast mode. That's simple things. That's Scottish scheffler for all you non-golfers if you watch golf, and for all you golfers who do watch golf that probably haven't realized this, this guy is militant about how he gets his hands on the golf club for each and every shot.

He actually, on one of his practice clubs has a molded handle, a molded grip that he, he puts his hands on and every day this is the number one player in the world. Every day he puts his hands on that thing and he hits some shots with it just to make the simple act of putting his hands on the golf club as perfect as what he can make [00:28:00] it 'cause the reality of it.

In golf folks, um, your hands are your only direct point of contact with a golf club. So they're sort of your tip of your spear and, and, and where Scotty does that, and people talk about Scotty being, well, he's so great, but he's kind of boring, but you've just said it. Beast mode is being excellent at the simple things.

And that's know who Joseph was is Yeah. And, and then so ultimately how do we create those, you know, like Scotty does with his grip, what do we do in our lives mm-hmm. That we can put in place where we go, this is. This is my simple thing that either I'm being called to do, um, it's been put on me to do and, and really I think when you look at, in every instance in which Joseph lives out, his, his, again, small snippet of this story, um, he does it with obedience to Jewish [00:29:00] custom Jewish.

Uh, you know, religion at, at that time, he's doing everything as it's supposed to be done. And again, that's, that's impressive. Uh, mostly for a guy who, you know, an angel is a peer to him in a dream, and that doesn't even face him. So I think that's, you know, again, these, these really cool snippets about a, a guy who, again, is just in the background.

But, but his support obviously changed the world. You've heard of that? Uh, cliche actions speak louder than words. How many of us leaders, coaches, whatever. So many words, but the actions don't jive with a message we're trying to give off. There. There's a life lesson, there's a legacy, there's a leadership lesson in itself.

You know, where Joseph, the guy should have been quoted. Man, I'm sure he had a lot to say. Well, they should have written more about him, or at least once, something he said to his wife. But [00:30:00] there was never anything said. It was all just action. Yeah. Well, and, and maybe that's, maybe that's something for us to say is that we don't always need to be the headline in, in the word in, in the quoted word.

Right. Um. And, and so yeah, it, that's, that's definitely hard in the, in the current culture, right? We live in a social media driven world, and, uh, it says we're snippets and, and eyeballs matter. And, you know, Joseph is saying that, you know, you can, it just, it just keeps coming back to me. This idea that you can, you can help those around you to grow in wisdom, in stature, in favor of God and men.

Like that just keeps. Keeps talking to me is like, man. Can you do it? Now, obviously it's nice to have platforms. Sometimes God gives you that, right? He gave Moses that. Um, and so some of us are called to be, that. Some of us are called to be Joseph. And, and, and I just think that [00:31:00] when, when you accept the role that God has given you, you can then flourish within that role instead of this comparison game.

And, and man, I wish I had his role. Um. It's, it's hard to do, but it, it is kind of the, the world we live in, it's, it's, it's the uphill challenge that we currently are given. They're very well said. And, and you're so right about the social media. It's who, like, who's gonna be heard the most of, um, it reminds me of the quote speaks softly and carry a big stick.

That's what the real leaders do. But they also, then they show a lot of integrity. And, and that's a life lesson too that I kind of gleaned from the story. Um, where. You know how people say you should act the same in private that you do in public and you know, because public is what people think about me.

Here's Jacob, uh, pardon me, Joseph in private doing the right thing by his wife. 'cause [00:32:00] the law at that time gave him every right to divorce her and basically say enough of this. But in an effort to show her mercy, um, to show his character. To be protective of the woman he loved. I mean, that is the ultimate in being just a quality human being.

Especially nowadays, you know, so easy to, to hit the exit, the, the eject button and just get out of the situation. Yeah. And, and you throw into the fact that, uh, because of the time they're in, that that means his faith. Is gonna be ridiculed. So here's this very obedient, very faithful person. And, and you know that by all the actions that, that he, that are at least written about.

Mm-hmm. And he knows that people are gonna look and question him on that. And he was okay with that because he knew at heart where his heart was in what he was doing. [00:33:00] And that's hard to do. It's hard to do that in spite. I mean, because that ridicule today is way softened compared to what that ridicule was then.

I mean, that culture would've probably really challenged him on that. And again, he knows what's to come and, and he's just kind of sitting there, not standing up and saying, guys, you don't understand. There's this angel that appeared to be and you can't wait. It's, you're right that that would be, that would be bad, but.

We're just, we're gonna do the right, the next right thing. Um, as far as the leadership goes, well, well, first off, I wanna say this. Joseph didn't know then that in the Western world now, he, in every nativity scene, he's been memorialized. Okay. And then of course, he's St. Joseph in, in the Catholic church. So.

Even though he was a man of few words and just a mere carpenter, he was used for something very, very special and he was recognized for it eventually. And there's a lesson in that too, because we are all in the habit [00:34:00] of being in the, now what, what do I get now out of the whole deal? But I do wanna talk about this leadership lesson where it's, I call it leading in the shadows.

And so many people, and I've said this in all of the twin, the previous episodes of the show. Leadership doesn't necessarily have to have a title. You don't have to be the chairman or the captain or the coach or whatever. And how many times, Ben, have you seen on teams that you've had where the real leader wasn't the captain?

He, he might've been the young kid in the shadow, the number two guy, whatever the case might be, but just his way influenced the team, and that's who I see Joseph as. He wasn't the main player in this show. But everything about it, I mean, he was crucial to everything that happened. If he's not around, they don't make it to Egypt.

And there's every likelihood that Jesus becomes a victim of Herod's evil plan to, to eliminate, you know, the future [00:35:00] King of Israel. So it's, to me, this leading in the shadow thing, he models that, and you've used the spotlight. He, he, he was always doing the right thing, yet leading quietly in the shadows.

Yeah, it, you know, when I hear that, I think about something that I heard early as a parent and it, I, I'm fortunate enough that on some days, not every day, but some days I get to go drop my kids off at school. And I know not every parent gets that opportunity, but, but I would say about 30% of the time I get to go drop my, my daughters off at school, and I heard this early on that said, if you can say the same thing to them.

Make it impactful and, and mine is, I love you, I'm proud of you, and go be a leader. And I've said that to my daughters every day. When I drop 'em off at school from kindergarten up to my oldest is now in fifth grade. And even my little three-year-old now, when I drop her off, she'll go, go be a leader. And it's it.

And so, you know, [00:36:00] to some degree, like they kind of joke with me about it. And one day my daughter got in the car and said, um. She was saying something about school and they, she was helping to clean up, uh, when nobody was watching. And I said, now that's being a leader. She goes, no, no, dad, you don't understand.

Like, uh, I just, I was cleaning up when nobody was watching. And I said, but that's being a leader. And, and I think you're a hundred percent right. Being a leader is not always the one who's the loudest. The one out in front, the one standing on the tallest chair. The leader sometimes is the one who is, who is building up the, the, the firm foundation that will eventually be able to be launched off and again, not always by that person, maybe by those who, who you've helped build up.

And that's really my hope for my kids is my, my hope is that my kids know that they are loved. Mostly by their Heavenly Father. Mm-hmm. More than [00:37:00] anything else, I want my kids to know that they're being, I'm proud of them no matter what action they do the day before. And lastly that you are equipped to be a leader because every character in the Bible that we speak of is a leader in their own way.

Right. We, we, of, of the great ones that we we're not talking. The, the, the bad kid. We're not talking about Herod here, but the, the good characters in the Bible, they're all leaders and they're all flawed leaders. Right. Part of probably why we don't make a big deal of Joseph is he's probably flawed and they're like, eh, we could kind of not talk about all those parts, but I think those parts are just as impactful as the other.

That's why I'm excited to go, like, I wanna learn more about Joseph. I wanna hear about all the flawed parts, which by the way, they do make note of, like you said before, he left his kid for three days somewhere where they didn't know where he was. So he's just as flawed as we are. But, but it's, it is, right.

It's leadership saying, I don't have it all. Right. Yeah. [00:38:00] But, but I, but I'm gonna do my next best thing and I'm gonna try, you know, again, that's why I use that phrase, beast mode. I'm gonna try to go do the next simple thing. Excellent. If those pile up enough, I think, I think we're gonna be able to have some people around us who are, who are, again, if you grow in wisdom, in favor of God, man, what a legacy to leave behind.

Well, for folks who haven't listened to every episode of this show, not that I'm trying to, you know, plug this thing gratuitously. Every single one of these heroes of the faith that were listed in the book of Hebrews, and we are going beyond that a little bit now. They all, you're right, they're deeply flawed human beings.

I think back to Gideon, you know, who was called brave and mighty warrior by the angel of God. He was a guy hiding away. And then Peter, who was tempestuous at best, you know, and he was the rock on which the church, church was built. And it's, so, it's, it's, it makes me feel okay about myself, maybe a little bit Ben, where I'm like, gosh, despite all of this.[00:39:00] 

The, the, we talk about the grace that Jo, uh, Joseph showed his wife, the grace that we get from God to go, I made you, I know who you are, you made for this role. Stop thinking about all the stuff that you can't do and just focus beast mode on the, on your job and the things that you're supposed to do. And that's what it seemed like Joseph did, because he was decisive.

You know, it's easy to be wishy-washy and put things off when he got the message, it was go time. And, and that sort of speaks to the fact that he is like, right, this might be my job, but I'm doing my job. I'm not gonna worry about what's going on otherwise. Yeah. Very, very well said. Okay, let's go ahead. Um, legacy, you've talked about the modeling fatherhood there no doubt did that.

You've talked about him being a carpenter and taking great pride in, in his carpentry, and he became known for that and he taught his son Jesus to become a carpenter as well. Which I find fascinating in its own way. 'cause this is the [00:40:00] savior of the world and God almighty in, in the form of man yet, you know, yeah.

We, we are becoming a carpenter. But I, I wanna just talk about how through it all, because Jesus turned out into who he was and Joseph was this quiet guy in the background, just making sure that the kid grew up fine and didn't hurt himself. Okay. And it was a faithful, sort of a stewardship he had about him.

And through it all, you got the fact that he was always in the background just looking over his son and, and you know, it's not said, but I'm only, I'm trying to put myself in Joseph's shoes 'cause I've been given this gift that I've gotta now develop for the next, what these teenage years, certainly before when Jesus began his ministry at 33.

So here's the father who's just a steward of this gift to earth. He's super faithful about his job and to me it sort of [00:41:00] teach shows that the legacy teaches us that the greatest success isn't oftentimes the big deal that we do or the big coaching job that we do. It's just that we are there and we are faithful with whatever we've been given or whatever role we have.

We are there and we are a hundred percent all in. To me, that's the legacy amongst others that he leaves the most. What, what say you. Yeah. And I think that's mirrored somewhat by, by Jesus as well, right? He doesn't publicly start his ministry until he, until he changes water into wine, but his mom's gotta bring that out of him.

Jesus is very good with being. A part of that, of that story. Jesus sits in weeps when his friend Lazareth dies, when he knows what's about to come. He's present and just there with his people. And I think you see that a little bit through Jesus as well. Jesus is as comfortable with the woman at the well as he is in the temple holding court, [00:42:00] and I wonder if some of that, some of that.

You know, ability to be obedient without the spotlight shows up a little bit in Jesus as well. And I know Jesus is, is everything in, in, in all things. And he can be, but I, I wonder still a little bit of, is he still a little bit of a byproduct of his dad? Like his dad would've instilled that into him a little bit.

That you don't need to be the one out in front and it's good to be. A carpenter, it'd be excellent at your craft. And you know, you see some of that and you wonder if some of that is just seeing that model through Joseph and, and I might be absolutely wrong in that too, right. But I think some of that, that gentleness that, that Jesus shows is a little bit from that, a little bit of that being modeled to him in his younger years of do the Right thing.

Um, be in the right spot, right Do [00:43:00] when, when God calls, you're gonna go, because that's what we do. Um, and that's again, that, that's just some observations I've had of, of how someone, Joseph might have been seen a little bit past that. And again, we don't know when he passes away. I think by most scholars, he passes away prior to Jesus's big, you know, entrance into the world.

To who he, who he is ultimately to become. And so there's a period in there where, you know, I'm curious of how Jesus worked through the passing of, of his, of his earthly dad. Right. Those are kind of some interesting things that, that I've kind of been wrestling with over this as well is because when he enters, you know.

Into his, into his ministry. I mean, there's no more mention of Joseph, and so Jesus has worked through all that and seeing how he's worked through that with his extended family. I'm [00:44:00] just really curious of how he sat through that with his own family, but obviously did it in a way where you're, you know, his entrance to the world that nobody is, you know, everyone knows the family still, so he is, he's doing the right thing.

Yeah, I mean, that's a beautiful account that you share and, and I keep getting the word in my head complete because people might not know that the meaning of Joseph is let him add and, and you draw the comparison. Look, we can't compare, compare ourself to God Almighty, but Jesus heavenly father and Jesus earthly father in many ways, with the being merciful, being full of grace, being selfless, decisive.

I've heard, you know, God has God of the details. I can imagine a carpenter, if you're putting something together, the details have to be all right in case this table or chair falls in. So, so I, I certainly see the parallels, how Jesus came down to some, an individual that was similar in nature to his [00:45:00] heavenly Father, and we can learn from that.

And then the whole thing about God Almighty is, you know, to let him add 'cause with God and his Holy Spirit. He made us, he made Joseph, when you let the spirit move in your life, things get added and bad things get subtracted and, and, and, um, I, I thought you, you put a beautiful bow on the story when you shared that because it just elicited these, these, these feelings and these thoughts inside of me when you were describing, because the Jo Joseph did the job so well when, when he pa when he passed on.

Jesus was ready for his, his, his job ultimately. Yeah. It's, it's, again, I might be a footnote, but man, what an impactful, like I said, I, I got fired up to talk about this because I've, I've spent, you know, four or five weeks just really sitting on this and, and just seeing how all these layers get put together.

I'm so glad you did, and I'm so glad you would've joined [00:46:00] us. Um, for the folks watching and listening to this, Ben, um. You're a golf instructor coach, obviously, if people are looking to reach out to you or follow you or find out more information, where would they go? Yeah. Peli Golf, P-E-L-L-I-G-O-L-S. Um, for those who are in the golf world, I'm really excited.

I, I, I put out a faith-based accountability journal, um, that I'm really excited for people. It's free. It's, it's just on my website. Go download it. Um, but it's finding your joy, comfort, and peace and, and having some accountability to, to your actions and how you see God, uh, on a daily basis. So I'm really excited, uh, to see how that, that's part of people's journey because, you know, kind of like, kinda like Joseph, right?

Like, we all need, we need to all have that accountability figure. And, and so I'm really excited for people, uh, to, to, to get step into that and, and just see where, where God's got them moving to. You know, and [00:47:00] I stand accused, I hear things like journal. I'm like, oh, that's just something else to have to do.

But given kind of the thread in this entire conversation where you're in beast mode and you're being excellent at the simple things, and those are additive and enhance our lives, this to me sounds like a must, folks. So the website is P-E-L-L-I-G-O-L-F, peli golf.com. You got it. And. Thank you. God bless you man.

Same to you. Mark. Thanks so much for downloading this show. All of you, if you wanna reach out, please go and comment on our YouTube channel, search and subscribe. Over there. It's easy, the greater call, uh, social media, the handles are the same. Go check out Ben. He's PE golf. But as always, thank you for downloading this one.

Share it with your friends. And remember, this show is here to highlight lessons from just regular human beings like you and me, who did their small little role in life correctly. Enjoy it. Go bless someone and [0