The Greater Call Podcast – Lessons on Transformation, Passion and Faith | Kyle Jackson on Speaking Life and "God Winks"

In this recap episode of The Greater Call, host Mark Immelman is joined by Kyle Jackson (now Lead Pastor at Cape Christian Church) to reflect on the previous seven heroes-of-the-faith episodes—and pull out the leadership, life, and legacy lessons that keep showing up across every story.

Kyle shares his own leadership journey and a powerful reminder: God’s plans are often fulfilled through ordinary people who fail, learn, heal, and keep stepping forward—one day at a time. Then Mark and Kyle revisit Jacob, Job, Isaac, Peter, three impactful women (Mary, Mary Magdalene, the Woman at the Well), the Canaanite woman’s persistent faith, and Joseph as a model of quiet, decisive, integrity-driven leadership.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

 🎙️ Why most leaders in Scripture are proof that failure doesn’t disqualify your calling
 🎙️ Kyle’s “Not for kings” principle—and how struggle often produces the deepest transformation
 🎙️ Jacob’s story of redemption: transformed through wrestling, not comfort
 🎙️ Job’s leadership lesson: staying faithful when outcomes don’t make sense
 🎙️ Isaac’s quiet strength: consistency over conflict, obedience over flash
 🎙️ Peter’s arc: leadership is restoration + resilience, not perfection
 🎙️ The strength of women in Scripture—and why Jesus dignifies the dismissed
 🎙️ Persistent faith (Matthew 15): refusing offense and staying anchored until breakthrough
 🎙️ Joseph’s “quiet impact”: protecting and positioning the Son of God without spotlight
 🎙️ The SOAP Bible method: a simple way to make Scripture come alive daily

Key Themes

Not for Kings

Kyle unpacks Proverbs 31’s “not for kings” idea: some “acceptable” comforts can still keep you from becoming who God’s called you to be. The question becomes: what do you run to first—God, or lesser comforts?

Failure Isn’t Final

Across every recap, the pattern is clear: God uses imperfect people—when they refuse to stay paralyzed in failure and keep taking steps forward.

Faithfulness Over Outcomes

Job’s story reminds leaders that faith isn’t transactional. God is still worthy—even when life doesn’t make sense and heaven feels silent.

Consistency Beats Flash

Isaac shows that “quiet faithfulness” and consistency can be more powerful than flashy leadership—especially over decades.

Restoration Builds Leaders

Peter’s life proves calling isn’t canceled by failure. God restores, rebuilds, and uses the resilient.

Jesus Dignifies People

Mary Magdalene and the Woman at the Well show that Jesus doesn’t only save—He restores dignity, identity, and purpose.

Persistent Faith Moves the Heart of God

The Matthew 15 woman refuses offense and discouragement. Her persistence becomes the doorway to breakthrough.

Quiet Leadership Still Changes Everything

Joseph models humble, decisive obedience. His actions protected and positioned Jesus—without spotlight.

Kyle Jackson
• Website: kchristian.com
• Social: @kylejackson1

✨ Speak life in every situation. Go out and be a legend. ✨ 

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Transcript

[00:00:00] A very warm welcome to this Greater Call podcast. I am your host, Mark, alongside my dear friend and now the lead pastor at Cape Christian Church down in South Florida. Kyle Jackson, how are you doing? Good, Mark. Love you, man. Excited to be back with you. Look so happy. Uh, to all of you- ... I hope you're as happy as Kyle.

Thanks for joining the show. As, of course, this is the place you can come, um, and you can learn from heroes of our faith, and you can learn lessons on life and how to leave a legacy and, a- and then moreover, some lessons in leadership. And every so often, in fact, every seven podcasts, um, Kyle and I do a recap of the previous seven.

We've had a couple before, and so this is the third recap we are doing, and we've got some interesting characters to recap, Kyle. The podcast went as follows: First, it's Jacob. The podcast name was Jacob Ladder. Jacob's Ladder, pardon me, [00:01:00] and I did that with Wesley Bryan, PGA Tour winner, um, also a YouTuber, if you watch YouTube at all.

Um, next podcast with the, was with p- uh, Pastor Patrick Khaim from Highlands Church. We talked about Job. The show's name was Integrity and Faith. Uh, then came Isaac. I did that with Cam Tringale, who, if you watch LIV Golf, former PGA Tour player, um, went to Georgia Tech, a really good player, devout Christian man.

I love him. We talked about Isaac, and the show's name was A Patriarch Laughs. Then Pastor J.C. Worley of GO Church joined me, and we spoke of Peter, spoke about Peter, The Impulsive Rock. Then Dottie Pepper, my dear friend- ... and colleague joined me, uh, first woman on the show, and we spoke about three impactful women: Mary, mother of Jesus, Mary Magdalene, and the woman at the well, who we have no name for.

This show's name was A Female Touch. Then- What a g- what a great episode, by the way, just to interrupt [00:02:00] you. She crushed. No, no, no problem. Well, look, she crushed so much, Kyle, that the next one we did with Emily Trotter. Yeah. Amazing. On a whim, and she said to me she wanted to speak about the woman in Matthew 15- Mm

who doesn't have a name, so we called her Constance. The show's name was Persistent Faith. And it's amazing how, Kyle, just a f- it wasn't even a full chapter in the Bible. This is of the story, the story of this woman who was managerial smart. It, it was an incredible story. Anyway, we'll talk about that more in a second.

Then the final one that we'll talk about in the show was done with Ben Pelikani, great golf instructor from Nashville, Tennessee, and we spoke about Joseph, the father of Jesus. The title was named Paternal Leader. Kyle, befo-, I'm gonna spring this on you before we dive into these characters. Yours, your story as a person and a pastor to me is admirable.

It is exciting. [00:03:00] Um, and to watch you grow in s- your stature as a pastor and as a leader of people from, um, youth ministry to then leading a, a, a, a, a campus for Highlands Church in Columbus, Georgia, to now being the lead pastor of a church of 10,000 people strong. I mean, what a story. Uh, quick, quickly share-

the life story there and a less- a, a lesson you would take from it, because mine is it's a story of faithfulness, and it's a story of putting God first, and it's a story of going to a place where, again, you're like, "Well, I know I can do this, but I'm unsure because this is-" Mm-hmm ... "a church I'm going to lead."

So I'd love you to share a, a nugget or two, please. Well, I mean, so, yeah, I mean, it's really just the story of, uh, every leader that you've talked about on your podcast and, you know, majority of the leaders and people you read about in the Bible, which is, um, I think we live in a world that promotes, um, [00:04:00] everybody's successes and puts down everybody's failures, and the Bible is a s- is a book full of people's failures that God ends up using for- Mm

uh, His success. And, uh, took a lot of average people in the Bible to make a lot of mistakes and do a lot of things wrong, uh, to help people understand that, that God really is the, the way, the truth, and the life Jesus was. And so that, my, my story is simply that, a lot of mistakes. Um, average student in school, average athlete on an athletic field, average person overall that has some gifts and talents like everybody that's listening to the podcast.

And it's really a story of getting up after failures and putting two feet on the ground and not worrying about what everybody says about you from those failures, and taking a step towards the next season of life one day at a time, trying to figure it out, trying to get it right. And then the Bible's clear.

God's got a plan for your life, a hope, and a future. I think most people don't get there not because God doesn't want them there, but [00:05:00] because they, they live in those failures. And instead of taking steps forward, they remain paralyzed a little bit in that, that failure. And that's my story. That's the story of all the people we're gonna talk about today.

Most of the people we've talked about on the podcast is they failed. God had a plan for their life, and God redeemed that, and He reconciled that back to Him, and He used their gifts and talents towards the thing that was already planned for them. We talked about that on a podcast, Mark, that the Bible says that when you were knit together in your mother's womb, that He already had a plan and purpose for your life.

So the, the, the story of humanity is through the failures of the first 30 years of your life, are you willing to heal from those, learn from those, and then step into your 30s and 40s and 50s into a life of purpose, man. So that's all my story is, is a lot of failures that has now landed into, to an opportunity to lead an incredible church with incredible people, and I will fail there, and I will get up every morning and put two feet on the ground and not worry about what everybody says and take a step towards that day, [00:06:00] uh, and that, those goals that are in front of us.

So man, nothing, nothing different than you. Mm-hmm. I will say this people, as I have Kyle on the show and I'm gonna brag on him a little bit. Um, I would call Kyle a friend, and if you're watching on YouTube you can see he's just scratched the back of his head. And on the underside of his left arm, uh, there's a, a tattoo there that goes Not 4 Kings, Lemuel.

I want you to tell that. And then so I've learned two big things fr- from Kyle, the Not 4 Kings story, and then of course every day to speak life into every situation. 'Cause we're faced with so many situations where it's easy to take the negative road. And the reality is that, you know, to believe in something positive and to believe in something negative asks you to believe in something, um, something.

And so there's an element of faith involved. And Kyle is always, um sort of pro- um, [00:07:00] motivated me, sometimes admonished me as a friend, make sure I speak life into every situation and every person. But first, Kyle, um, here's the thing about these leaders, 'cause the first leader we're gonna talk about in Jacob, um, there's a profound life transformation story, and I think the not for kings Bible verse is a great way to start going about real life and the legacy change.

Please, uh, please share that. Yeah, I mean, Jacob, you know, if I summed up Jacob in a phrase, it would be that, you know, great leaders are transformed, uh, through struggle, not through comfort. And I think, you know, the not for kings thing is Proverbs 31 in the first three or four verses of that. King Lemuel's mom looks at him.

He was doing some things that kings were technically allowed to do, and, uh, nobody would've said anything about it because he was a king. Mm-hmm. But King Lemuel's mom looked at him and basically said, "You know, son, you're, you're doing [00:08:00] some things that are gonna keep you from being the best version of yourself.

And even though that it's acceptable to do those things, God's called you to more." So she looks at him and says, "Those things that you're doing are not for kings." And she didn't mean from the title, she meant from those that are called to do great things. Mm-hmm. Um, and I think we all have things in our life that we go to when we struggle.

You know, Jacob, he was transformed through the struggle, so we're going to go through struggles. God allows struggles in your life. He does not bring them on you because we serve a good God, New Testament. He loves you, He's for you, but we still live in a world full of sin, full of choices that we make, full of other people's choices that are made for us sometimes, and it creates a struggle.

And the question is, what do you go to during that struggle? Do you go to God and wrestle with those things? Or do you go to those things in life that the world says or culture says it's okay to go to to deal with your struggle, but they actually have a hold of your heart? And whatever you go to before you go to God might be something that God's asking you to give up and go to Him so that He can lead you to where He is leading you in the struggle.

So that's [00:09:00] my not for kings is just a reminder to myself of what are the things I've struggled with in the past that I go to that bring comfort when God's actually trying to grow me in the struggle and point me to Him. So you either go to God or you go to those things, and that's always been the not for kings thing for me with Jacob.

You know, uh, God often, you know, He does His deepest work sometimes through wrestling, not through comfort. Um, and Jacob limped after that encounter with God, but the limp became the mark of blessing for him. And sometimes weakness really is the evidence of transformation because in my weakness, He is strong.

So instead of going to the things that I think make me strong, I just take my weaknesses to God and He is strong. So that's, that's the Jacob not for kings thing for me. If you're watching this on YouTube, you'll see me smiling Because, uh, the, the lesson from Kyle is reconnecting with me personally. But behind that smile is like a, oh my gosh, here we go kind of a thing.

Because you speak of uncomfortable, and it's easy to sit here and listen to this podcast or watch it on YouTube. Go follow us if you, if you don't subscribe there. [00:10:00] Um, but there's, there's a challenge in this. A- and, and, and more on Jacob for folks who don't know. Look, the end of the story is that he's one of the three patriarchs of Israel, the guys who shaped the character and the destiny of this, um, Jewish nation.

Um, Abraham, Isaac, of course, the other two patriarchs. And he ... The theme of the entire story, and this gives me hope, and the theme was that he was essentially, because his name meant deceiver, Jacob. He was lying, he was deceitful. He, he l- But, but he went through this massive life transformation, and that resonates with me because kind of like me, he wasn't the perfect hero.

And whenever he was, he kept on trying, but kept on falling short of God. But in the end, Jacob became Israel. And Israel, let me get this right, m- it was a renaming of him, and it [00:11:00] means One who strives with God. Right. So he goes from deceiver- Mm-hmm ... there's lots much in a name, to Israel, one who strives with God.

It kept on falling over the entire way there. Mm-hmm. In the end, he's one of the three patriarchs of Israel. If you had to stop the Jacob story after one chapter, you'd be like, "Oh gosh." Brother, there was all sorts of stuff on the go, and in the end he's, he's in their hall of fame essentially. Yeah. And it's such a

It's one of the early stories in the Bible, right? And it's such a story of redemption that is something that I can take hold of and hope and just say, like you say every day, I put my feet on the ground, I say my morning prayer. I'm like, "God, lead my steps." Uh, that was a JC Werely thing on the Peter podcast.

A- and it's, it's like a new day. I'm gonna keep striving with God [00:12:00] now during this day I'm, I'm facing. It's awesome. Yeah, it comes back from our first podcast. We used the phrase fail forward. Yeah. And Jacob was a fail forward type of leader. He wrestled with God, kept failing forward until he went from deceiver to someone striving with God.

So incredible leader. Great leaders are transformed through struggle, not through comfort. I love the story in Jacob too when he has the moment, because of course he deceived his brother, and when they had the reunion. You know, that was ... It took a lot too, but that was a very cool story in there. Go check out Jacob in the Bible.

So much to learn. If you just spend time in it, again Kyle, and, and I want you to share the soap method of reading the Bible for those folks who have but don't, those folks who don't yet, 'cause I was a skimmer reader of the Bible. But thanks to your leadership and your teaching, I started using the soap method of reading the Bible, and then, um, these stories have come alive to me.

Mm-hmm. And every time I look into them, like when I went back over these shows and [00:13:00] I went back over my notes, there were more things that popped into my head just from the same story. It's the coolest. Yeah, SOAP is, you know, S-O-A-P. I think most people have struggled reading the Bible because, uh, it feels like it's too much.

It feels like it's too much to understand. And really the question is, what does this matter to me today? How does this apply to my life from something two thousand plus years ago? So SOAP is scripture, observation, application, prayer. So you take a passage of scripture, let's just say let's start in the Book of John.

If you've never really read the Bible, John's a great place to start, and Proverbs is a great place to start. So you go to John chapter one, you're gonna read one chapter for today. It's probably gonna take you seven to ten minutes to read that chapter, and you're gonna underline some verses as you read it.

Well, what, Kyle, what do I underline? You underline whatever pops out at you. It could be random, it could, you know, it could make you pause, it could just kinda jump in your spirit, and you just underline it and you keep reading. Then you come back to the four or five verses you underlined in John chapter one, and you pick one.

[00:14:00] Whichever one continues to stand out to you the most, you write that out in a little journal or piece of paper. That's scripture. You write down that one scripture. We'll say it's John 1:9. You write that out, then you write an observation. Oh, what are you observing about that verse? What do you think that means?

Why did you pick that verse? Then you got A, application, and you ask the question, how does this apply to my life today, in this season, in this moment? If it-- why, why did this scripture pop out to me today? You write out an application. Could be two sentences, could be one. And then P is prayer. You write down a prayer that simply just says, "God, help me to apply this verse to my life today in the meeting I'm going into, or with my kids, or with this financial decision I've gotta make."

And, and each one of those can be two sentences. Each one of those could be two paragraphs, Mark. It's just depending on your, the depth you wanna go, the time that you have, what it meant to you. Um, and then at the end of that, you just say, "God, you know, help me to apply all of this today to my life." And now you've started your day with God.

You've got one verse that popped out from a passage of scripture. I would say that didn't pop out randomly. I [00:15:00] think that popped out on purpose from God for you for that day. You asked how you could apply it to your life, and then you prayed that God would allow you to apply that in whatever situation you walked into today.

So it takes about fifteen minutes to do, seven to eight minutes to read that chapter, seven to eight minutes to write out that scripture, observation, application, prayer, and it makes the Bible come alive to you. I'm like, again, 'cause you're gonna come to a point in the day where you saw the need of that verse, and it's like, "Wow, God gave me a verse that I needed in my day today."

You say speak with, uh, you start with, I should say, not speak. Start with the Book of John. Um, I would advocate start with James. We've done a show on him. Yeah, James is a great too. James will, uh, slap you about the side of your head. Let's move on. James has so many life lessons. What, what ... It's called the Proverbs of the New Testament, right?

Yeah, he's ... If you wanna get punched in the nose, James is a good guy to wake you up. Yeah, one of Jesus brothers incidentally. Um, right, the next podcast we're gonna summarize is the story of Job, [00:16:00] and everyone knows of the patience of Job. Yeah. And I named after really wrestling with it to use a Jacob-ism, um, I called it integrity and faith because the patience of Job is a cliche, but he was long suffering.

Let's, let's, let's not beat around the bush. But through it all, he maintained his integrity and he ma- maintained his faith. And the things that jump out with me is, first off, that patience or being long suffering really requires strength. Mm-hmm. It's easy just to give in, and you can give into anything, um, substance, alcohol, um, uh, what- whatever, wherever you wanna go, just a negative attitude.

But the thing really, the more I go back to the story of Jacob, right? 'Cause he has this guy, very successful. Um, God and Satan essentially have a, a spiritual, what would you call this? Tete-a-tete. And Satan goes, "Yeah, that [00:17:00] man Job there can do no wrong. Give me a few days with him, I'll prove that he's not as faithful as you say."

So God goes, "Have at him," right? And the, it just, the hits kept on coming to Job losing his family- Mm ... and all his wealth, but he remained true. Yeah. There's one little stumble he had where he questioned God, but he still, he remained steadfast. But the thing about the whole story, if you're going to read the Book of Job, is that he's got these buddies, right?

Eliphaz- Mm ... Bildad, and Zophar, and these guys come in, they're all high and mighty, coming to console him in his time of mourning and loss and grief, and they start lecturing him And I c- I look at this, I'm like, "Am I ever that friend?" So how many of us are friends that way? Because I, I hate to say this, but sometimes we take great delight in someone [00:18:00] else's failings or misgivings.

Mm-hmm. A- and, and this, this whole chapter was not just about Job, who was the steadfast man, and, and I'm envious of it, I strive towards it, but it was more a lesson to not be like those other three dudes 'cause they just kept coming. And when the one stopped, the other one started. It, it was this, I was like, "How about these haters who call themselves-" Share your wisdom, please.

Well, yeah. I, I, we gotta get better as Christians in today's world 'cause we sure don't act like them on Twitter and social media. Um, we, we, we ... Being a hater as a Christian goes against about everything the Bible says we should do. You know, lift each other up, support each other, be the church, do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouth.

But yet we live in a culture where Christians are acting a lot like, uh, you know, people that don't know God yet, and can be some of the [00:19:00] greatest, they can be some of the greatest haters. I mean, uh, Job for me is simple. Here's what I wrote down, Mark. I just wrote down, "Job shows that true leadership stays faithful even when outcomes make no sense."

Um, and Job teaches us that faithfulness, uh, is not transactional. Um, a lot of people say they're faithful when things are going good, but then the question is, are you faithful when they're not going good? Um, it's really the lesson of like God is still worthy of our praise. God is still worthy of our time.

God is still worthy of our relationship with Him, even when life makes no sense, a- and God is silent. Um, God was silent a lot through Job's journey, but he just stayed faithful. And we want, we wanna be shown tomorrow what God wants, given what we want from God by tomorrow, and that's just not Job's story.

Job really showed us that, that faithfulness, uh, is really when life doesn't make sense, I'm gonna stay steady, um, which you talked about a minute ago. So incredible story. Hard story to read, but a lot to learn [00:20:00] from it. Yeah. I, I remember Patrick going ... 'Cause when we kicked the podcast off, as I said something to the effect of, and for folks who don't know Patrick Keim, he's just like Kyle.

He's young, he's vibrant, good athlete, point guard at the University of Auburn, basketball player. So he's, he's- Incredibly good-looking. A lot of similarities. Yeah. And I said to him, "Patrick, my gosh, man, this chapter of the Bible was like nothing but bad news." And, and he dealt with it so very well, and he highlighted so many lessons, um, and so many of these life lessons, because in the end it's, it's not like it's all sunshine lollipops in the end, but the good news in the end was that Job just remained faithful to God.

Right. Right. Well, Patrick was the first in person to talk about that as a walk-on in any sport. You'll know this, your daughter right now is, is, you know, a, a freshman on a golf team at a major university. Like, there's ... Whether [00:21:00] you're a walk-on or you're the newbie and you're young, there's something about it just every day at practice doesn't make sense sometimes.

Like, you're getting beat up. You're, you know, you're putting up the, the, the lowest, the highest score on a golf team, or you're, you're playing the least amount of minutes as a walk-on. Like, so but that faithfulness turns into three years, four years down the road. Sometimes you're not playing for the moment, you're playing for the future, you know?

And, and that's what I think Job did, is he just kept looking out at the future instead of being s- you know, uh, burdened by the present. Yes. I wanna say this too, this just popped in my head. I learned from Patrick, um, maybe I was f- I was asleep during your sermon about it, um, that obviously the Bible is not chronological, right?

Correct. Story of Job was one of the- Correct ... earliest stories in the Bible, but the book is farther back in the Old Testament. So for context, it, it was essentially- Right ... les- a lesson on faith at the very start of the Bible. Correct. I mean, if you read the Bible in actual [00:22:00] order, like you said, the Bible is put together in chapters and in sections.

But if you read a chron- if you read, uh, from the s- very first story of the Bible to the end, Job would be way more towards the front. Yes. Okay, cool. Let's move along. Another Old Testament character. Isaac. Say again? Let's go to Isaac. Yeah. Good. Um, the name means "he laughs." Um, and Isaac was just a maintainer, I would say.

He, he just- Yeah ... yeah, and, and I found this quote, and I wanna read this to you because this is a lesson, this, this is the insight and the lesson for me, and I feel like it'll be a helpful lesson to many. Because, you know, we live in this world where we all wanna be, like, the standout, right? Or we've got this- Right

dominion with it. And the quote goes like this: "In a world that celebrates pioneers and trailblazers-" Mm-hmm "... easy to underestimate the importance of those who faithfully carry on what others have established." Mm-hmm. "But a brief look at the life of Isaac will show that such [00:23:00] people are just as critical to God's plans as those who are making new trails for others."

'Cause Isaac's greatest achievement maybe, um, was that he was the miraculous son born to Abraham and Sarah. Yeah, right. Yeah. But he just took, he just, he, he didn't change anything. There was a legacy his father had put in place, and he just continued to develop it faithfully. Yep. Yeah, that's great. A- a- and that is, there's a lesson in life too, because it's so easy to come in and be the new broom that sweeps clean kind of thing.

Right. And how many times have we seen that in business or whatever the case might be? We're like, "Oh, I've got all the answers." And in the end it turns into failure sometimes, sadly. Yeah. Well, man, so there's so much there. I mean, Isaac chooses, you know... What I hear you saying is Isaac chooses consistency, um, over maybe, you know, in his story, unnecessary conflict.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. [00:24:00] He could have gone and fought over the wells, but he just decided to re-dig them. Um, and he just chose consistency over, over conflict. And, um, he reminds us, I think, that obedience often happens in quiet faithfulness sometimes, not flashy leadership. Mm-hmm. You know, one of my favorite things about my pastor, Chris Hodges, is flashy would not be a word used to describe Pastor Chris, but consistent would be.

And consistent isn't really a sexy word in our, in our culture today, somebody that's consistent. But man, you see a lot of people that are flashy and new and big quick, and then they fall. Um, whereas some of the leaders that have been consistent day in, day out, um, like you said, re-digging wells instead of digging new wells, you know, they don't get celebrated as much, but they're the ones that are making it 30, 35, 40 years.

Whereas some of the new flashy, younger, [00:25:00] new way of doing it, you know, social media presence, they're the ones that are falling quicker. So I just think we live in a culture that celebrates new and flashy and doesn't celebrate consistent. Um, and I think that's what Isaac teaches us there a little bit, is that quiet faithfulness sometimes is greater than new flashy leadership.

Yeah. I, I, while you were sharing that, I, I sort of was thinking of the struct- structure of most businesses where you have the president, CEO, who's the tip of the spear, whoever he or she is. And then you have marketing people that are flashy, and then you have the operating people, the chief operating officer, who is just- Right

making sure the ship stays on the right track kind of thing. Right. And he or she's most times in the meetings, well, kind of like the accountant, right? They're not the bad news bearers, but they're like, "Slow down, people. Let's just make sure that we do the right thing." Mm-hmm. Right. The- that's the consistency of it all.

Well, you have to [00:26:00] see this in your world all the time, right? I mean, if I were to ask you, name the most old school, consistent, goes to the range, works on his short game, puts for hours every day, puts in the work, doesn't have a huge social media following, he's not worried about being famous on TikTok or getting endorsements, you could name that golfer right now.

Yet the one that's probably getting the most news press and the most followers might not even be a good golfer, but he's just really good on social media and really good on YouTube and all the things. So we're, we're attracted towards new and flashy, but the one that's winning is the one that's probably the most consistent and just working on their game, re-digging the wells.

Like, I mean, so don't, don't talk about the flashy one, but if I were to ask you right now who's the golfer that re-digs wells all the time and just works on the basics consistently, who would you name? It's very easy. In fact, he doesn't even have social media. Mm-hmm. And here in 2026, he's currently the world's number one golfer in Scottie Scheffler.

There you go. He's been the number one golfer for [00:27:00] like three years straight right now. Yeah. The, the way the rankings go, he's not going- Just consistent, right? Yeah. Consistent. Mm-hmm. Consistent. And, and, and now he's, he's going through this segment in his career coming off a year last year when I think he had like seven victories or something.

Correct me if I'm wrong. Um, he has only won once, but he's had like a few runners up in a row Not to date this, but I just came from the Byron Nelson event in Dallas where Scotty finished, um, inside the top three again. Yeah. And the first question he gets is like, "Why aren't you winning?" It's crazy. It's amazing, yeah.

And, and yet he just keeps contending and, and if you watch him do it, it's the same thing on every shot. Yeah. Not to reinvent the wheel, he's just, to your point, digging wells. Yeah. And, and that's a great way of putting that too. Let's, let, let's not- If you ever [00:28:00] get Scotty on the podcast, that's the title of the podcast, Digging Wells.

I'm- Consistent leadership ... I'm trying. I, I'm trying hard to get him. His, uh, caddy Ted Scott has been on here and- Yep ... I talked about Paul. And it was, it was one of the happiest moments... Well, no, that's a, that's, that's a hyperbole, forgive me. It was a really happy moment a day and a half ago where we were on the driving range in preparation for the final round, and Scotty was in my group.

Mm. And Ted came walking past me to get some- something out of the cooler, and he looked over at me and he goes, "Morning, brother in Christ." Which was the coolest thing because Ted is a devout believer. Yeah. As Scotty is too, and it's an incredible combination because they just do the basics right. Yep, yep.

Nosily so. It's, it's, it's, its monotony is impressive. It's, it's unreal. Let's move on to the next leader who's probably the opposite of consistency Who's the host of this podcast? Peter. [00:29:00] Impulsive Rock. Yeah. When, when I teed this show up, I think JC, who's a good friend of yours and a pastor at Go Church- Yeah

he was like, "Oh, Peter, Peter, Peter." Poor guy. Poor guy. Right, you go. I'll go after you. Oh, I mean, Peter's simple. You know, Peter's the most relatable guy in the Bible to men, I think. I mean, because if I had to sum up Peter and leadership and all the things, it would be, you know, leadership's not about perfection, it's about restoration and resilience.

And if Peter was anything, he was resilient, um, and he was wide open to restoration of the mistakes that he made. And it really is just a simple thing, and I'll pass it to you, Mark. Failure doesn't disqualify you from your calling with God. You know, we live in a world where everybody wants to tell you if you're doing something for God or you're trying to shine His light, or you talk about Him, or you promote Him, as soon as you fail, talk about the haters, man, they come flying in.

And man, you gotta remember that we serve a God that at the core, He is a restoring God. [00:30:00] That's the whole point of the Bible is He wanted to restore humanity back to Himself. So your failures are not final, um, and they do not disqualify you from what God calls you to do. H- His love is unconditional for you, not conditional on your successes for Him.

Yeah. For the folks ... I'm led to say this. For the folks who have not read the Bible or people who don't know who Peter is, Peter is one of Jesus' 12 disciples. He was the first disciple. He was called to discipleship by Jesus. Peter was a blue collar fisherman. Yep. And Jesus said, "I'm gonna make you a fisher of men, not a fisherman."

And Peter was like, "Cool." He just left the boat down and he was off, with a wife incidentally, and he's like, "Listen, by the way, I'm leaving the family business. I'm gonna follow this dude and do what he says." Right. Um, Jesus at that stage, unproven, but apparently there was the aura that attracted Peter. And Peter did everything.

In fact, [00:31:00] Jesus said to him his name was Cephas. Mm-hmm. "You are gonna be the rock on which I build my church." Okay? It's the very same dude who chopped off a, a, a, a Roman legionary's ear. Right. Very same guy who denied Jesus three times when Jesus told him he was gonna do it, and Peter was like, "Never, ever.

Never, Jesus, ever. How dare you say something like that?" But he did it thereafter. I mean, the guy just kept on falling on his face. Yep. Story, like you say, is despite his failures, Jesus never gave up on him. Nope. And here's the cool part of it, right? At the start of Peter's story, Jesus said, "Come follow me."

At the end of the story, the last encounter before Jesus just, uh, ascended back up to heaven on Pentecost, Jesus goes, "You must follow me." Mm-hmm. "So if you wanna be a leader of the church, the rock on which I build this church, [00:32:00] you must follow me." Mm. It's not, "Oh, well, if you want to, uh, when it suits you."

That's sort of the story of Peter, because it resonates, like you say, with me, because gosh, I've been Peter plenty of times. Yeah. I'm gonna be Peter a whole lot more. Yeah. He is ... There was a passion about Peter. No doubt. And in the end, it's the rock on which the church was built, and he followed Jesus so much that when he was martyred for his beliefs- He was to be crucified- Mm-hmm

Jesus. Mm-hmm. But he didn't feel like he was worthy, so he asked to be crucified upside down. Yeah. And I'm like, golly, just an ordinary- Well, let me just, you know, like, let me pause there, Mark, because, you know, I, I do believe there's people that listen to the podcast because they love golf or, you know, they know you or maybe they even know me and they're, they're still struggling with...

You know, one of the questions I get asked all the time, you know, by atheists or people that don't [00:33:00] believe in God is just, you know, "Give me evidence," all these things, and I think we could go to a thousand things. I, I think this is one of the most unique places to point people who struggle with believing if God, if Jesus was real.

Mm-hmm. If, if Peter followed Jesus for three years, saw what Jesus did, saw that he was crucified on the cross, died, buried in a grave, and then three days later started popping in and visiting people as he resurrected from the grave, you know, what would lead you to go give your life for something and then to be, be, to be so radical about it that you would be hung upside down on a cross to die for something that didn't happen?

Yeah. And that, that's always been one of the stories for me that I'm like, listen, you can go try to contradict scripture, you can go try to figure out all those things, but man, when you look on at the history of the people that gave up their life in a radical fashion for something that didn't happen, that's...

I, I struggle with [00:34:00] that regardless of what I've learned about the Bible or growing up in a Christian home or being a pastor. I would really struggle with the way that people gave up their life for something that, that didn't happen. They obviously saw something that we were never able to see that allowed them to live that way.

Um, so just even for the person listening that struggles with wondering if Jesus was real, Peter, a great story to read the end of his life on how he gave up his life because he saw something that was greater than himself. Yeah. I want to add to that, and correct me if I'm wrong here because this is straight out of memory And hopefully the spirit here within.

Um, in Acts, 'cause after the Book of John, there's the, the chapter on Acts where it's essentially the acts of all of Jesus' followers, of the way they were called disciples. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And Peter was like the tip of the spear, and there was a brush where he and someone else were maybe in Jerusalem, and there was a beggar on the side of the street going, "Give me money.

Give me money." And Peter looked down at him and said, "Silver and gold [00:35:00] have I none, but I'll give you what I have-" Yeah ... "the s- Spirit of Jesus within me." And essentially in that, he healed this beggar alongside the road. Yes. So not to give him money or whatever, he was just like overflowing with, with, with this Jesus within.

It's, it's an incredible moving story as well if you just take the time to count. Yeah. Well, he could've given him temporary relief with a little bit of money or food, but he was trying to give him what would transform his life, not just what would relieve his life momentarily- Mm ... because it was overflowing out of him.

And all of these leaders, I mean, you know it, since the very start, your first one with me on this show was about Joseph. Mm-hmm. Every single one of these guys and girls, it, it was ... They were a hero. It wasn't instantaneous and overnight. There was periods of struggle, there was periods of survival, but it was continual transformation.

Correct. And at the time, I don't think they knew that they were gonna be heroes. No. But now looking back, all of them are canonized. They're all saints and stuff. They have [00:36:00] books named after them in the Bible. They're just incredible stories. Um, which is kind of sad because we all wanna know if we're gonna be a success or not, but I think there's a life lesson in that too.

Right. Um, moving along, Dottie Pepper was on here with me. She asked to do this. There were three ... There are three women that have touched her life. Yep. And Dottie Pepper doesn't ordinarily cry. She's ... No, she's a strong, strong woman, and she shed a tear or two on the show- Mm ... which was cool. So go back and listen to it or watch it.

And we talked about three women, the female touch. It was Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of Jesus- Mm ... and then the woman at the well. And the argument I made after really digging into these stories was these women- are as strong as anybody. Oh, yeah. I mean, Mary Magdalene, tormented, Jesus rescued her, um, saved her from the mental anxiety, anguish, demons that she had.

She is-- was one of the funders of Jesus' [00:37:00] ministry, that people don't know. Mary's mother, God forbid, imagine being the mother to Jesus, so there's a great strength there. She was at the foot of the cross when he was dying. Think of the strength of that, watching this all, your son die. Mm-hmm. And then the woman at the well, she was essentially a prostitute.

Yeah. Jesus could have picked anyone to pass the word- Yep ... to the Samarit- Samaritans. Yep. But he picked her. There's so much good stuff in the Bible, man. Okay. Well, share. Share your wisdom. Oh my gosh, I, I don't... I mean, these three ladies are amazing. I love that you brought Dottie onto the show, and she was the perfect person to, to chat through them.

'Cause even as you talk about, you know, I'm sure her journey in golf and being a, you know, a female commentator in a sport that's, you know, um, dominated mostly in that commentating world by men, I'm just sure she has such an incredible story to share on how her rise to, to the top of that. You know, these three women, that makes sense to me why she's crying, 'cause, you know, I think Mary, [00:38:00] mother of Jesus, I think her-- Mary, mother of Jesus, it's simple.

It's, you know, great leaders trust God before they fully understand assignment. Like, she was given an assignment, and if you go read her story, like, an angel pops in, she ends up being pregnant in a culture where she shouldn't have been pregnant before she was married. And then they also tell her it's gonna be the, the Savior of the world.

Like, you know, she had to trust, uh, before she fully understood what she was doing. And I think, I mean, she has one of the most powerful, um, script-- There's a, a scripture where she says something that I think is one of the most powerful statements in the Bible when it comes to trust. Um, she says, "Be it unto me according to your word."

And she just chose in the moment, "But God, you said it, I believe it. You said it, I trust it." And even when it didn't make sense to her, she just immediately, "Be it unto me according to your word. I'm just gonna trust in you." So Mary shows that strength of just when God assigns it, I'm just gonna move forward with it.

Go ahead, Mark. I'm waving the finger at you. My wife hates it when I do that. I want people just [00:39:00] for a minute to consider that you have some vision or whatever the case might be, and you're like, "I'm all in. I'm not gonna overthink this." You know, there's the Bible verse that says, "Your ways are higher. Your ways, God's ways are higher than our ways.

Um, we have limited understanding." So instead of trying to overthink the situation, just go, "Yes, I'm there." Yes. If you honestly consider that, Kyle, it is s- almost impossible to do without a complete shift in your mental approach to life. Correct. Correct. I mean, just go back to Peter. His yes is what started the whole journey.

Follow me, yes. Mary, mother of Jesus, you're pregnant. Yes. Like, God's looking for your yes way more than he is your expertise or your talent or your experience. He's just looking for, you know, your yes, and I think Mary is a beautiful picture of that. And then I think you bounce to Mary Magdalene. Um, I think maybe I relate with Mary because I, I, I actually would say I do this well.

I [00:40:00] don't do a lot of things well, but I do do this well. Um, I think great leaders never forget what they were saved from. Yes. Like, and, and Jesus doesn't just save pe- Go ahead. But she, but she never, ever lived in what had happened. Yes. Correct. From it, but she was always looking forward, um, since then.

Because Jesus doesn't just save people, he dignifies them. Yes. And, and, and the fact that the first witness of the resurrection was a woman that society wants to dismiss Tells you a lot about Jesus and Christianity that we've gotten away from. Um, because Christians are dismissing Christians for the smallest mistakes right now in our world, where Jesus used a woman in that culture, which would not have been popular, to be the first witness to the resurrect- for the resurrection.

And Mary came from some bad stuff too. You know, with the Samaritan woman at the well, but Mary wasn't living a life that was very holy until Jesus called her, and she said yes. And I just think it's a beautiful picture. Jesus doesn't just save you when you say a prayer. If you'll keep [00:41:00] walking the walk with Him and keep saying yes to Him, He dignifies you and brings dignity back to all the areas that the world tried to steal from you.

So man, I just, I wake up every day, Mark, I believe you do the same thing, and you go, "Listen, when I was at my worst, Jesus still loved me. Um, when I was the prodigal son in Luke fifteen, Jesus was still looking for me." Uh, when, when I-- the Romans says that even when I was still a sinner, Jesus died on the cross for me.

Like He went before I ever even said yes to Him. Um, and I just, man, I, I just remind myself of, you know, when I take communion, when I receive communion, uh, for those of you that are listening, whether you do it weekly at church or once a year at Christmas or Easter, or once every five years when you find yourself in a church for whatever reason.

You know, when I receive communion, I don't just remember Jesus dying on the cross. That's not my picture in my mind of like I'm receiving communion and I'm just picturing Jesus on the cross dying. Yes, but I'm also picturing me in my death moment. Yeah. Because the Bible says you go from death to life when you say yes to [00:42:00] Jesus.

Mm-hmm. And I just always take myself back to that dark moment of where I was not following God when I was at my worst, when I was doing things the world said brought satisfaction, but I woke up every morning empty. And I always take myself back to that moment. When I receive communion, it's just that picture of from death to life, from blind to sight, from deaf to being able to hear.

Um, and I think that's what Mary did really well, is that she just never forgot. She stayed grateful that even if Jesus didn't do anything else for her, He already did enough because He saved her. Yeah. And that's what I love about her. She, she fires me up. It's a true, to use the s- lyrics of the name of a song, it's a true God story.

Yes. Yeah. We all are. Yeah. Every human being on earth is on a journey, and that journey that we will spend 60, 70, 80 years for, we, we can't figure out what life's about. We fill that hole, that void, and life's a journey. From the day you were born until the day you die, it is about finding God again. That's the [00:43:00] Bible from start to finish.

It's a restoration story. It's a love story of, of God trying to show you that He loves you, He's for you, and your best life is with Him. And the reason we struggle and battle so much is because sin is real, our flesh is real, humanity's real. We want it our way. We wanna do things now. We wanna do it our way, and that's always the tension you feel because your entire life is a restoration story back to God.

And until you get there, uh, you'll always struggle with that. And Mary found it. Again, that's why I think she was so grateful. If you ever watch The Chosen, you know, she's one of my favorite characters in The Chosen, in the TV series, because you just see her, even in that, they portrayed her so well of just grateful.

Yeah. Just grateful. Jesus, whatever you ask me to do, I'll do it because I'm so grateful, uh, for what you did for me. That's Mary, and then you got the Samaritan woman at the well, and I think, you know, just to play off of Mary right there, the Samaritan woman at the well, I think what she teaches us is that your testimony really can become your greatest, uh, leadership platform in your life.

Mm-hmm. Uh, that your [00:44:00] past is not an embarrassment. It's your, it's your present testimony to the world. Um, and Jesus will cross every social, he will cross every racial, he will cross every moral barrier just to reach one person, uh, and the person most ashamed of her story became the first evangelist in her town.

She was the most ashamed. That's why she's sitting out by the well. In one encounter with Jesus, she becomes the first evangelist in her town's history, and, uh, just again, you're one moment away with God from, from all the stuff you've done in your past, being reconciled back, uh, to being the thing that actually gives you purpose the rest of your life.

Yeah, I, uh Yes. I, I, what you've said there is so beautiful and so appropriate. All I can add is this, um, that story of the woman at the well. Well, first off, Mary, if you watch The Chosen, when she was tormented, um- Mm-hmm ... and drinking and just- Mm-hmm ... you know, basically almost trying to drink herself to death, it look, it looked like they were [00:45:00] portraying her.

She was dirty, dirty clothing, ragged, beaten up hair- Yep ... disheveled. And then for the rest of the story when she was with Jesus, she was dressed in a beautiful white garment. Yep. Full cream. Always clean, always hair ... I mean, you could see the death to life- Yeah ... without someone telling you. Um, the song is by Anne Wilson, essentially.

Mm-hmm. It's called God's Story. But I, I was reminded of this, 'cause I typed in, I was researching this when I do these shows, and I was like, "Just tell me what heroes of the faith are." Mm-hmm. And it was this, "Figures throughout history who demonstrated extraordinary trust and obedience to God, oftentimes in the face of immense adversity."

Mm-hmm. Okay. Um, one thing about that woman at the well, think of the confluence of, of events and timing, 'cause there's no social media. There's no dropping a pin for someone to say- Right ... "Hey, I'll be right here at like 12:05." Um, Jesus is coming from elsewhere. They make a detour to go [00:46:00] through this town in Samaria, which was- Right

the Jews didn't go there. The Jews and the- Right ... Samaritans did not get along at all, and Jesus tells his 12 disciples, "Hey, we gotta head over there." And they had some words to say, but we're like, "We're going anyway." And so he goes, "Go find us food," and then he's waiting at the well in the middle of the day when it's not time to get water, and she shows up.

I mean, just, just that, if you think about that- Correct ... Jesus is waiting for you in sometimes the most I don't know, insignificant, strange Yeah. Yeah. No, it's just the sovereignty of God. I mean, just- Amen, brother ... you can see it all throughout your life. If you really pause and sit down, you can see it all throughout your life.

We should probably document more of those God moments in our life, 'cause when we go back and look at it two years, three years, four years later ... I've got a friend that's really good at documenting just moments in time that he could sense God. I call them God winks, where God just showed up at the right time, did the thing at the right time, put the relationship in your life at the right time, and he's just [00:47:00] incredible at documenting that.

And he goes back and looks at it, and it just shows the sovereignty of God in your life, that He is so much for you. Uh, in a world that wants to say that He's against you, He is so for you and is always trying to get you to move in that direction, uh, that He has for your life. So, like, again, that's a beautiful, uh, picture mark of just, right, all those things had to line up where they were there at the same time.

That's not by accident. I thought for a long time this show's name was gonna be Speak Life, but I feel like it could be God Winks now. Final one. Uh, final one of these seven. Again, you can go and listen to all of them wherever you get your podcasts. Share it with your friends. Um, Joseph, the father of Jesus, his name means let it add.

This is a cool thing. This guy, you ... He was, he was never quoted in the Bible, yet he's the father- Right ... of Jesus on Earth. I know, poor guy. Poor guy. Well, there was the lesson in this. He was that quiet leader in the background [00:48:00] who was decisive. Yeah. When God said to him, "Hey, it's cool to marry this girl despite the humiliation," and this is going against the rules of the day, so he was like, "Yes, God, I'm in."

When God said, "Move them to Egypt," he's like on the donkey overnight kind of thing. And again, this wasn't following, you know, GPS. Mm-hmm. This was a hard trip. Um, but the thing about me was how this man had a pri- ... In private, there was this integrity about him. Mm-hmm. The more you read about Joseph, this dude was solid, all right?

Oh, yeah. 'Cause if you look at- If you look at like the nativity scene that everyone sees at Christmas, it's Mary and Jesus. Yep. The shepherds get more of a for- and the three wise men get like more spotlight on them than Joseph just standing in the background. Yep. He was like the quiet enforcer. Joseph was a boss, okay?

Yeah. But he never spoke. Well, he did obviously, but we don't know anything he ever said. Yeah. But I will say this, [00:49:00] fathering Jesus, and he, Joseph was a carpenter, I'm sure he taught Jesus some pretty stern lessons- No doubt ... throughout Jesus' young life. No doubt. I mean, Joseph, it, it is, you, you said it already, but you know, not, not all impact is loud.

Yes. Mm-hmm. Um, and I think really if you thought about what Joseph did, I think Joseph, you know, his actions protected and positioned the Son of God. Like he just, like you said, you know, the lessons he taught him around the carpenter's table, the conversations they had at the dinner table, you know, he, he just protected, he knew that he was the Son of God, and he protected him, and he positioned him to do everything that God had called him to do.

He just didn't do it loud. He was, he was, you know, sometimes the greatest leadership happens quietly behind the scenes, you know, in a world that promotes the loud and flashy, again, in a social media culture where if you're not loud and flashy, you probably don't have a lot of followers. [00:50:00] Mm-hmm. But again, he was that consistent, steady, strong leader behind the scenes that, that fathered the greatest leader in the history of our world, and doesn't get a lot...

I bet Joseph has a, has a sweet s- a, a sweet seat in heaven I bet, you know what I mean? Like, uh, somebody who was humble, quiet, obedient, walked through the fire of his wife being pregnant before they were married, not by him. I mean, all the reasons to leave and to put somebody to shame, and he just, he quietly did what he was called to do.

I just, I think, I think, I think Joseph's got a sweet little space in heaven. Yeah, one thing looking at his life and looking at the women... Oh, shucks, we gotta talk about the women from Matthew 15. Uh, we can segue to this. But the thing about Joseph, you're so right. But what I see in these people, that humility- Yep

being humble, and boldness are not mutually exclusive. Here's Joseph, right? When he gets word to, like, get [00:51:00] up and act, there was no hanging around. Right. He's humble. He would follow the orders, but he would act right away, as did the, the women in Matthew 15, which is an incredible story. I want you to share it real fast and share your lesson that you've taken from it, because I did this with Emily Trotter.

The show's name was Persistent Faith. 'Cause this woman in Matthew 15, she's not named. We called her Constance on the show because she was so consistent. But, uh, it, it was a story that I probably had read. I never remembered it, and now this thing is etched in the back of my mind for how well-prepared this woman is.

She eliminated- ... middle management. She was like, "No, the disciples are no good. I'm going straight to Jesus for my-" Yep. Uh, it, it was a really cool story of persistent faith. Yeah, I mean, I think her story is that, you know, she refused to let offense, um, and discouragement keep her from Jesus. Um, she just, she could've been offended, she could've been [00:52:00] discouraged, and she just didn't allow any of that to keep her from what, you know, what she needed Jesus to do in her life.

So I, you know, her persistent faith, I think, would be a good way to say it. I think persistent faith moves the heart of God. I think you see that in a lot of stories in Bible, just the people that are persistent of like, "God, I need you to do this." Um, it's, it's the prayer warriors, you know, the people that get up and go pray every day for years for the same thing.

I think it gets the heart of God. Um, and she refused to let offense, uh, keep her from Jesus, and it really was the, the, the, what created the doorway that she needed for her miracle. Um, and I think, you know, like we said it in this podcast already, I think she stayed humble. I think she stayed persistent. I think she stayed focused, uh, on Jesus.

And because of that, she saw a breakthrough that maybe sometimes we often miss because we want it quicker, uh, and we get offended or we get discouraged through the journey and we give up. She is definitely the story of someone who chose not to give up but to stay persistent, humble, and [00:53:00] focused on what she needed Jesus to do in her life.

And because of that, she experienced the breakthrough, uh, that she was looking for. Beautiful story on persistency, uh, courage. Um, yeah, go ahead. Jump in. I, I wanna say this She, here's this woman whose child was sick. Right. She's like, "I've gotta go to this Jesus- Yep ... to get the child healed." So there was a faith there.

She gets the disciples trying to palm her off, she's like, "No." And she's- Right ... "I'm getting through." Could have offended, yeah. Then she makes the request, okay? She goes, "Jesus," whatever, and Jesus basically says no, but she keeps at him. And then Jesus goes something about, well, you know, eating the crumbs under the table.

Right. And she goes, "Well, even the crumbs are good for some people," and I'm paraphrasing. Yeah. And then Jesus- I think she says even dogs eat the crumbs or something like that. Yeah. Yeah. Then Jesus looks at her and he goes, "Okay, this woman's prepared. She is, [00:54:00] like, obstinate about her faith." Yeah. Right? And then he rewards her by saying, "Your child is healed."

And then he goes, "Woman, great is your faith." Yes. Yes, yes, yes, yes. And this too, you talked about the heart of God. The whole thing about that begins- Yeah ... with faith in something unseen. Am I right? Yes. No, I mean, she just, she refused to quit pursuing Jesus. I fucking love that. Even though she didn't ... Yeah. No, I mean, again, most of us would be offended.

Yeah. You know, if we came to a leader and we, we said some of those things, and that was the response back to us, we would leave offended, or we would get, you know, our feelings hurt and walk away discouraged. And man, she was just, she was just, she was, she was feet anchored in the ground. "Jesus, until you do this, I'm not gonna stop pursuing you."

So like, I think the funny thing is, you know, Jesus might have just did it so he'd, she'd leave him alone. But there's something to that, like, just you, you can keep going to God over and over and over and over again, and if [00:55:00] you think he's annoyed, he's not annoyed. Um, I think, I think that type of persistency actually catches the heart of God.

Yeah. Gets his attention. It's a show of faith. No doubt. I'm reminded of a verse in the Bible that says, "Pray unceasingly." Yes. Which means all the time. All the time. All right, folks. Thank you for downloading this one. He's Pastor Kyle Jackson, now of Cape Christian Church. You had me today, Kyle. I was hanging on every word you said, and I'm sure folks are too.

Yeah. So please tell them where they can go and follow you now, now that you've- Oh ... parted Highlands Church and you've moved down to South Florida. Yeah, I mean, just the website's kchristian.com. Great church. I'm just coming in and, and, and building on what others have already built, so it'll be a lot of fun and it'll be a humbling process.

And then all social media stuff is kylejackson1, the number one, kylejackson1. So would love, love to conversate with you. If you ever have any questions about any of this that we're [00:56:00] talking about, please feel free to DM and then we can set up a call or, uh, we can go back and forth on that. Anything we can do to encourage you, uh, in your walk, in your call with God.

That's why we call it The Greater Call. As Kyle says, speak life in every situation. It's hard, but speak it, because words are powerful. Use them for good. Um, as Kyle says, it's some things are not for kings. Now, this is in the back of my mind all the time, wherever I go. Of course, this show is, you can follow us.

Please do. Uh, the handles are @thegreatercall. Search for The Greater Call podcast on YouTube. Search and subscribe for that. Uh, give us a like, please. Give us a nice, uh, review. And as always, I appreciate you downloading the show. I hope you learned something from this. If you did, let us know. I'd love to hear from you.

And in all your daily endeavors, go out and be a legend. God bless.