Risk & Resolve
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Risk & Resolve
From Chicago to the Big Ten: Kris Loving on Faith, Officiating, and Finding Ministry Everywhere
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In this episode of Risk & Resolve, Ben Conner and Todd Hufford sit down with Kristopher Loving, Big Ten football official, Fellowship of Christian Athletes leader, teacher, chaplain, and minister. Kris shares his journey from growing up in Chicago to officiating college football at the highest levels while discovering that ministry isn’t confined to a church building. This conversation explores faith, leadership, sports, purpose, and the courage to say yes when God calls.
Main Talking Points
- Growing up as an only child on Chicago’s west side
- The church influence that shaped Kris’s leadership and faith
- The moment he fully surrendered his life to Christ in 2011
- Learning leadership through church ministry and public speaking
- Moving from Illinois to Minnesota and entering a new season of life
- How a simple conversation led him into sports officiating
- Receiving a vision of ministry through officiating sports
- The unlikely path from first-year official to Division I football
- Working Big Ten football and the UFL
- The hidden preparation, study, and discipline required of elite officials
- Building relationships and ministry opportunities within officiating circles
- How sports became a platform for serving people outside church walls
- Workforce chaplaincy and meeting people where they are
- Creating a legacy of faith, stewardship, and service for future generations
Meet Chris And His Mission
SPEAKER_01Chris is the minister, teacher, preacher, and follower of Jesus Christ. He served God in the church in youth leadership, pastor's day, Sunday school teaching, Bible study teaching, preaching, and church planning. Chris now serves in full-time ministry through several unique avenues from Big Ten, from football and high school, basketball officiating, fellowship of Christian athletes area representative, substitutive teacher at Heritage Christian School, workforce chaplains and care partners, licensed financial professional teaching, financial literacy and biblical stewardship. He really just does it all. Chris, thanks for being with us today.
SPEAKER_00Ben, thank you. And Todd, thanks for having me. And uh I'm so humbled, and it's just a testimony when I hear those things uh read off. It's like, wow, God has done a lot for me and through me. So excited to be with you guys and the listeners today.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I love how you talk about your your work, and it's a where you get to practice your ministry. And from the minute I met you, that's exactly how you've worded it all along. So that's it's just really cool, even just to just read
Growing Up On Chicago’s West Side
SPEAKER_01it again through your bio. But um, just to give the listeners a little bit more about your uh background, can you tell us what it was like for you growing up?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so I was born and raised on the west side of Chicago, um, lived there in the city, I think until I was about 10 years old. Um my parents wanted to move us about 10 miles west to a near suburb, Bellwood, Illinois, and there, you know, went through finished elementary school and middle school, high school. And uh I was the only child, so grew up, I say, you know, lower middle class, was just us three. I mean, had everything I needed, you know, didn't didn't go without the basic things and was blessed to have a few things I wanted along the way, was a was a good student, stayed out of trouble. And, you know, some things that stood out to me growing up was um when we moved. It's funny, I kind of like don't remember much in my life before moving, but when we moved, I felt like that's when I really started making decisions and started like kind of like my life really took off, where my first big decision I can remember was um, you know, growing up, my family always went to church, aunts, uncles, grandmother, my mom. And so when we moved, we commuted back to the same church in Chicago for a couple years. And my mom, which I know this was God-led, uh, said to me, you know, hey, we've been here a couple years. If you want to go to a church close by, you know, you can. Um, it just so happened there was a church four blocks away, a life Christian center in Bellwood. And um a lot of my friends from school went there. I went to some like Six Flags Great America trips and other just events, fun stuff with them. And so I was like, yeah, I want to go there. And honestly, to me, looking back, that was like a huge turning point in my life going to that church where I was able to do all a lot of those things you just read off youth department and pastor's aid and Sunday school and all these things that was shaping me from uh the student side, recipient side, and grew up there and um eventually was on the other side as the teacher, as the leader, as the adult in the room. So yeah, growing up, you know, stayed out of trouble, stayed healthy, and played basketball growing up, you know, was the kid of our age group outside all the time, riding bikes at the swimming pool. You know, we didn't have cell phones, we didn't have um what's that find my friend? You have to literally go around the neighborhoods and find people. It was a blast. The good old days, right? That's right. Um yeah, I grew up there and lived in Illinois the majority of my life until uh getting married in 2013, and then 2014 we moved to Rochester, Minnesota, uh, to go to help my father-in-law, who's a pastor, who started different churches in different places and was led there. And my wife wanted to be closer to her family, and uh so we made the move and were there for eight years, and um that's when God shifted again, took me uh more out of the four walls of the church kind of ministry to four lines, you know, on the football field and uh doing FCA work and doing other other ministry that I hadn't really considered ministry in the past. I always thought ministry was inside the four walls of a church, behind a pulpit, you know, with a Bible in your hand and more formal, but he he took me from that to being in the community, being on the football field, basketball court, lacrosse field, and doing ministry there. So it's kind of what got me where I am today, and excited to share a little more in a little bit.
SPEAKER_01What uh you talked about just being involved in you know a lot of Bible studies and as the student part of it,
A Church That Trained Leaders
SPEAKER_01do you remember like the first few opportunities where you were asked, or maybe you felt the Holy Spirit kind of pulling you to where it's like, no, like you've been the student long enough, Chris. I'm gonna ask you to to be the leader. And that do you remember those first opportunities and kind of what you what you like kind of felt going on inside before you're trying to to lead other people in in a Bible study or whatever it may be?
SPEAKER_00That's an awesome question. Um don't know if I can pinpoint the first time, but I can say, you know, my pastor who pastored me there for most of my life, definitely my formative years, um, Bishop Glenn E. Miller Sr., he was he was so ahead of his time. I mean, you look at churches today, the way um the church is presented and the way the church focuses on like love and relationship and family, and you know, for things as simple as like the lighting being good in the church or you know, having a little cafe, just the simple things. He was ahead of his time with that in the 90s, doing that way back, putting scriptures on the screen, putting the lyrics to the the worship song. Like he was ahead of his time with that. But to answer the question, he was one that really pushed the young people. He loved the young people, he supported us, he cared about us, and he pushed us out of our comfort zone. And so I can remember many times he would, you know, absolutely encourage you to, you know, pray in front of the congregation or read something or recite a Bible verse or all these things to kind of not force you, but it just gets you in that mode of being up front. And I I'm pretty sure that's that helped mold me to be comfortable with that in time, and I didn't even know it. Um you know, thinking back now, it's like I got like first class public speaking lessons in church. I got first class project management teaching, like through church, and didn't look at it that way, but looking back now, I'm like, wow, I was doing that as a teenager, didn't even know. And to your point, eventually, it went from a nudge or encouragement to when I when I got saved truly, I would say when I surrendered, um, pretty much from that day, I felt like Paul, where the scripture says, straightway, he went to preach that Jesus is Lord. Once I surrendered, and I said, enough is enough. I want to do this for real. Like the next day, I was in his office and I said, What do I need to do to, you know, be licensed to be a preacher? What do I need to do to lead the young people? And so it was being built up in me all those young years, and then it was just in there. And when I surrendered, I was ready to go for a black. So when was that? What year was that? So,
The Question That Changed Everything
SPEAKER_00you know, I mentioned I've been in going to church and involved in church pretty much all my life, but I was like a lot of people, wayward, in and out, kind of doing my thing, kind of picking and choosing what I wanted to follow. But uh one night, and this would have been in 2011, so I would have been, I think I was 22, maybe somewhere in there. And I was at a service one night, and the preacher said, if Jesus came right now, would you be ready? And I was, and I was actually running the cameras that night. Another thing I didn't mention. I was I used to do the video and audio video and editing and stuff for the church. I was running the cameras that night, and I was behind the camera like this, and he asked that question, and I like kind of like looked to the side, and I like looked around, and I audibly said no, I wouldn't be ready. And so he finished his and to this day I still don't know what his message was about, I don't know what scriptures he used. I can't remember one word of what he said except that question. Would you be ready if Jesus came right now? My answer was no. And after service, I went up for prayer, went to the altar, and I vowed, I said, Lord, from this day forward, I never want to say no to that question again. Um, back in 2011. And that's been my my charge since I always want to be ready.
SPEAKER_02Did you say you got married in 2012?
SPEAKER_00Uh 13.
SPEAKER_0213. Yeah. He was getting you ready, wasn't he?
SPEAKER_00He was getting me ready. Big time.
SPEAKER_01Well, it's really uh interesting for a pastor, you know. See, I'm catching the vision of what you're saying about him being ahead of his time because you really don't necessarily see or hear a pastor using the pulpit or Sunday morning as a classroom, in in the sense of like usually it's a it's a very specific program that's being ran on a Sunday morning. But he's saying, No, you're gonna come up and you're gonna pray, and you're gonna come up and you're gonna read the scripture, and I want you to do this, and really pulling people in to teach. Yeah, and those using that opportunity to really uh grow people in their knowledge and love of the Lord, that's that's pretty unique.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it was it was, you know, at the time you'd get either annoyed or or maybe afraid because he didn't tell you ahead of time all the time. Sometimes you'd be just sitting there, all right, brother Chris, come on up and do this, and sister so-and-so come up and do. And we eventually got used to that, and and he would tell us, like, it kind of jokingly always have a sermon in your back pocket. And so you would always be ready. And that actually happened to me as I was older. I would go visit other churches, and the very first time I actually preached a like an actual sermon outside of my home church, I was just visiting, had no intentions on like sitting up front or any, I was just there to visit. And the the pastor recognized I was there, he called me up to sit up there with them. I'm like, all right, no problem. I'll sit up here and he's talking, and he literally, in the middle of the service, said, We're gonna make a change to the program. We're gonna hear from uh Minister Chris today. And Minister Chris is sitting there like, uh I was just here to, you know, to visit. But again, I was prepared, I was trained well and prepared, so I was able to let the Lord speak through me very briefly. You know, it's helped me in other parts of my life going forward.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I'm getting a uh a theme of your younger years that's probably in translated into what makes what what what makes you tick in what you do in ministry now, but of of readiness. It's kind of a word that you know, always be ready or would you be ready? Um so there is a readiness that is uh a theme, a theme for you.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, so you mentioned your ministry uh going from inside the four walls of a church to uh outside of that, but in in inside of uh lines of a
Officiating Starts As Side Hustle
SPEAKER_01field. Can we talk a little bit about like how that got going and and what that journey looked like?
SPEAKER_00Absolutely. And you know, scripture says the Lord works in mysterious ways. Um so you know, I mentioned I played basketball, you know, most of my my youth and through high school and stuff, and was a and but I was actually a really big football fan watching it. I just I just wasn't built to play it. Uh I think it's nuts to get hit and all that. But um, so I was a sports fan all my life. Played, I thought I would go into coaching, which I did for a little bit, and it wasn't really for me, and just you know, I mentioned got married in 13, and I mean we're all husbands, and early on, you know, some challenges, some things, trying to figure it out as a young couple, as a young man still, only 24, and she was 21 when we got married. So we're trying to figure things out. And so I was I had this great idea, like, man, I need to get out of the house a little bit more, but do something fun and and make a few extra bucks. So I'm like, what can I do? And somehow, I know it was God now, but there's a really good friend of mine, like a big brother of mine, mentor type figure, who had been a referee for many years at this point. He actually grew up at the same church that I've been referencing. Um, although he had gone away to college and he lives still where he went to college. So he wasn't, he'd come home every now and then. I knew his mom well from the church and stuff. And so somehow he popped in my head about refereeing. And so I reached out and said, hey, how do you how do you get started with this? And tells me where to register, tells me where to get all my gear. I'm like, great. I go follow all the steps he says and realize, wow, this is expensive. Um, you know, 50 bucks to register, $100 for the uniform, another $100 for shoes, and you know, $100 for the camp. And it was just, it was just adding up. And remember, my my vain reason at the time was to make extra money. So I'm like, this is not adding up. So I you know, I'll go back like, hey man, I'm I'm really interested, just I can't do it right now. And like two weeks later, in the mail comes a referee shirt and a pair of new pair of shoes from him. And I was like, wow. And he said, you know, hey, I hope this can help you get started. You know, let me know what else I can do. So he invested in me. And he, you know, literally invested in me, like financially and and with his time. So that actually pushed me to like take it serious and like really give it a shot. And so got into it, really enjoyed it. I was making it, you know, a few bucks and getting a little better at it. But again, at this point, my goal was just to make extra money, had no goals of going to the NBA or going to Division
A Vision For Sports Ministry
SPEAKER_00I. And one day I had a vision very clear, as clear as I can see YouTube on this screen, a vision of me ministering through officiating. And kind of like came back to reality, and I was like, wow, like what that sounds amazing, but like I had no idea what that would look like. But but I said yes to your point earlier. I felt okay, I'm ready to say yes to this. So from there, I just I what I thought that meant was like praying for people on my crews and players and coaches, and just like trying to share the gospel everywhere I went, which you know, I definitely did that as I was led. But what I've found even more was really God was preparing me. And this was, you know, 10 plus years ago when I got this vision, but now it's starting to manifest of like what that means. So I've led some prayer Zoom sessions uh with officials across the country. I've led uh prayer and fellowship in-person sessions at officiating camps and meetings and things, where we're already gathering anyway. Uh, we're doing a marriage retreat in a couple of weeks. It's traditionally been for coaches and their spouses, but now officials and their spouses are gonna be there too. Um, so all the things that like sports ministry has offered to coaches and athletes is what God is leading me to bring officials in that in that mix too. So I got into this for very vain reasons. And God totally shifted that. And and with that shift, he showed me the practical path of like, hey, if you go division one, if you go pro, you can actually reach more people, have a bigger platform, bigger influence. So that all came together when God showed me the vision. I said, oh, okay, well, let me pursue these paths so that I can make a bigger impact. And so I'm blessed to be on that path
Fast Track To Big Ten Crews
SPEAKER_00and make some of that change.
SPEAKER_02So, Chris, where do you what all levels do you officiate today?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so I'll briefly run through it. So I started mentioning basketball because that's what I played, and I was in a meeting with all the sports, and a guy from football was like, Yeah, if you basketball guys think you can officiate, you know, you should try football. Totally just joking, having fun. But for some reason that stuck with me, and I said, I'll give it a try. Now, mind you, remember, I'm in Minnesota at the time, so I was like, I'm not interested in being out in the cold and rain and snow and all. So that's what stopped me from doing it years before. But again, God working in mysterious ways, let his comment push me. Went, started it, fell in love with it from day one. And again, that's a God thing. Remember, I never played football, not one snap. Never coached, didn't know the game from that level, but for whatever reason, God let me move very fast in football, starting with youth level, high school, varsity level, only for two years, and then um worked division two in 2017, but also in 2017, I worked three division one games in the same year. This was my very first year of ever working college football at any level.
SPEAKER_03And what year was that?
SPEAKER_002017.
SPEAKER_032017.
SPEAKER_00And this is how my college career started. Division one, division one, Missouri Valley on TV with replay and everything, division two, division one. That was my first four college games I ever worked in my life, ever. And it just doesn't make sense. It doesn't make sense, it's not practical.
SPEAKER_01That's what's amazing about it.
SPEAKER_00It's not practical. There's nothing. I didn't play, I didn't coach, I don't have any uncles or dads that are in the business, I don't have any best friend that was the supervisor. And so, because people are like, well, how and why you? And it's all God, like it was all his plan from that vision in action. Like he put me in those spots so that I can tell this story to you and listeners, and so people can like see that like God can use you in officiating and open doors and do great things. So 2018, I got hired in the Missouri Valley Conference. I was there for two years, then in 2020. Famous, infamous 2020. Hired into the Mac for two years. And then in 2022, got hired in the Big Ten. And I'll be going into year number five in the Big Ten this fall. Also super blessed and grateful to be a part of the NFL development program, which are like officials in college that are prospects to work at that level. They train us, they coach us up. We work training camps and you know practices and we do all-star games and things like that. And so with that, I'm also working in the United Football League, the UFL, which was formerly the XFL. This is year four. Doing that, actually wrapping up the season this Sunday. And um, yeah, that's where I'm at. Um blessed to work pretty high levels of football and basketball. I got up to like division three level and below, but gave that up recently just more time at home and to forget.
SPEAKER_02So today you're you you're you've done five years, division one in the Big Ten. And also one year or two years at the UFL?
SPEAKER_00Uh this is year the year four working in the spring.
SPEAKER_02So those schedules overlap in such a way that you can do both.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so the UFL and USFL and all that is in the spring.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_00So it it goes from like uh March to June.
SPEAKER_02So how many hel help me understand how many officials, how many football officials are there in the Big Ten conference?
SPEAKER_00100. We got uh 10 crews of well, let me have 110. So we've got 10 crews, we have eight on the field, two in replay, and then one alternate official.
SPEAKER_02And do you stay, does the do that does that crew mostly stay together throughout the whole season?
SPEAKER_00Uh yeah, for the most part. Once you get put together, you you work most of the games together. Uh sometimes there's a conflict with one person, they'll get switched, like if you went to that school or your kids go to that school or something. But yeah, mostly we we stay together during the year.
SPEAKER_02And how many games is that per season?
SPEAKER_00Uh for us, anywhere between 11 to 12 um in the regular season, and then for those fortunate to work postseason, could potentially work one or two more.
SPEAKER_02Right. And what about the UFL? What's that season length?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, UFL is a 10-week season for the the teams, and currently every crew works five games. So we we work every other week, so every crew pretty even every other week, and then there is a championship game, then there's the the what's called the United Ball. So three crews will get an extra game.
SPEAKER_02So you could work between the two leagues as much as 20, maybe 20 games in the city.
SPEAKER_00Upwards of 20, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Tell me about the other your peers who are in this. Um, I'm sure they come from all walks of life, they do all sorts of different careers. It probably doesn't quite provide a full paycheck for 20 days of work, at least maybe not this level, maybe it does. What are what similarities and what differences are there with some of those peers on those crews?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, a lot of times people ask, you know, what's your favorite part of officiating, or what's your favorite part of being in the Big Ten, or whatever? It's the people. It's it's truly the people. I mean, what you just said is so true. I mean, our officials come from so many places and do so many things. I I promise you, if you named an industry, I guarantee I can find, I can think of an official in that industry at a high level. Like we've got guys that work in NASA, we've got people at the top of law, at the top of education, at the top of you know, health care. I mean, every profession, every sector is covered, every ethnicity, age group. And then now with you know expansion and stuff, we have officials in the Big Ten literally in every part of the country. Yeah um, almost dang near every state. Um and so it's it's amazing how you get to learn different cultures, different everything. And it's it's it's amazing. I love it practically, but then from a ministry standpoint, I get to reach people and learn about people I probably otherwise would not have and interact with them, and hopefully my light is shining before them.
SPEAKER_02Hey, how do rule
Rules Changes And Uniform Debates
SPEAKER_02changes get promulgated and then passed on to the officials? I I have this vision that there's a one room once a year, they come out and say, All right, guys, here's here we're gonna change the rules on you, you gotta do this, but it might not quite be like that. How does that actually work?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, there's a there's a rules committee. Um, and unfortunately, and I'm sure I'm right on, I don't believe officials are a part of the rules committee, as far as I'm aware. Probably not. Maybe we have a representative or something, but I don't think, but it's usually coaches and ADs and administrators, part of a rules committee, and they present rule changes amongst themselves, they vote on it, then they send those to another committee that like over like competition committee oversight, something like that committee to to look at what was proposed, and then that's where we get our changes from is through a couple different committees, and you kind of said it. They just tell us here's the new rule. Get it right. Get it right, you know.
SPEAKER_02Well, what's been one of the in the last five years, what's been one of the hardest ones to I guess adapt to? One of the hardest new rules or rule changes.
SPEAKER_00That's a good that's a good one. I'll honestly say on a positive note, the changes have actually made things easier for us, in my opinion. Easier for me. It was like this person can block low during this time, but then this one couldn't. And then if you're this far away, and if you're in the tackle box, and if you're here, if you're there. I think they really simplify like the low block rule. They've simplified the targeting rule. Um, it's still subjective, it means still very hard to get right in full speed, even in replay. You know, sometimes they get it wrong when they look at it too, but it's more clear, like we know what it is, and it's it's straightforward. So it's to me, it's gotten simpler, not easier, but just more simple and clear. Uh, the hardest thing, to be honest, I think we deal with is uniforms, believe it or not. Really? With the guys wearing the biker shorts and the pants that are really short, and exposure wear knee pads and all that. We you know it's a rule. We don't, you know, is it enforced 100%? No. And that's the hard part because it is a rule, but it's not necessarily meant to be enforced by us. You know, they don't want us to be the uniform police.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that seems like a weird one for you guys to be responsible for. I would think you guys would be a play rule versus a yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00That's so that's to be honest, one of the hardest is because it exists, but do we really want to focus on that? But it look it's a bad look. But so try there's discussion about making that like the NFL where the conferences or leagues police that and fine or do whatever adjudication and leave it out of our hands.
SPEAKER_01What's it been like over the last couple of years? Imagine being in the Big Ten for five years. You went, maybe it's not this direct, but you went to the games in your car, and now you're not necessarily going to all the games in your car. Um, what's that change been like as as the Big Ten is uh in the last couple
Coast To Coast Travel Realities
SPEAKER_01years gone coast to coast? How's that impacted you guys?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's funny. When that when that change first happened, I was honestly pretty against it. Um, especially like as a fan of the game, you know, I'm like, man, Oregon's not a Big Ten school in Washington. That's not, that doesn't feel like Big Ten, you know. I was kind of I like the old school, the regional aspect. And and yeah, the travel was different. So as a as a college official, or I would say as anything below a pro official, we're independent contractors, so all of our travel is on us. I mean, we pay our own flights, own hotels, and all that. So it's more expensive to go to games than it was before, and more more time away from home and more more travel, you know, considerations and stuff, changing time zones. So definitely some logistics that made it more challenging. But I would say once it actually happened, I actually like it now because never would have gone to Oregon, probably. I had never been to California before working games out there. I had been to Seattle once, but you know, working a game there was was fun, like seeing different venues. And I was able to uh a few years ago when we went to Oregon, uh, was my anniversary weekend, and I was able to bring my wife with me and spent a few days in Portland before and a few days after. So I was able to like, you know, have a good time in a place that probably wouldn't ever went to. So uh I'm I'm all good with it now, but at the time I was kind of like, ah, and you know, you just plan for it again, a little extra cost, but it's it's all good now. I actually like it.
SPEAKER_02But you mentioned uh two people of the crew are replay.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
Replay Booth Behind The Curtain
SPEAKER_02Do those individuals tend to be the senior members because they may not have to be running the field as much, or are they more junior members because they get to watch it in slow motion, they're not required to no, actually neither.
SPEAKER_00Um, I think when replay first came out, it was looked at as a retirement gig, you know, a second career gig. And I think maybe it was. That was a little before my time, but um in the past, especially since I've been in, that is not the case. Replay is very dedicated to being the best, just like we're dedicated to being the best on the field. It's it's not something where you work 20 years and oh yeah, just come work replay. No, it's you got to go to camps, you gotta do a lot of training, you got a lot of skill sets you gotta have in the door. And so it's it's its own animal. It's something that as comfortable as I feel on the field, I have zero interest in doing replay. Total different skill sets, total different mindset, just no interest. I don't know that I'll be a great fit, it just doesn't fit the skills you need and the personality. Um, so yeah, it's it you replay is diverse. You got really young officials working replay, you got older. Um, what's funny is a lot of replay officials never officiated on the field, believe it or not.
SPEAKER_02Oh wow, they're like uh Joyce Dick and Game Boy video game, video game officials.
SPEAKER_00Some of it, some of it, and and and it what makes a good replay official is a good communicator, very observant, very critical thinker, quick thinker, um, someone that can um be calm under pressure and you know be confident in their decision making. And so we've got people from the tech world, from the military world, from analytics, from you know, uh business leaders that that's what they do all day. They make decisions, they you know, so yeah, we've got quite a few, even in the NFL, that never officiated one snap of football, but they're really good replay officials.
SPEAKER_01Is that the difference between like a basketball and football official where basketball, I mean, you're you're officiating the entire game and you're kind of rotating around the court where football, you are you guys have more like specific positions. And is that is that true then that you become a master of a specific position or maybe a small, like uh just a couple positions, or what does that look like?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's a great uh great correlation. So I'm fortunate to work both sports, and so with basketball, pretty you said it basically everyone is working the same position. Once you toss the ball up, all three officials are completely equal, can make all the same calls, could potentially be in the same spots. Because in basketball, there's three positions the trail, who's up top, the lead, who's on the in line on the ball side, and then the center or the slot is is on the opposite side, usually free throw line. And they rotate based on how the plays go, who calls the foul. So, yeah, in basketball, it's all the same, basically. In football, every position is unique. You're looking at different things, you got different rulings you're gonna make, you got different mechanics you got to do. And certainly, if you know all the positions, that makes you better as an official, makes you more versatile. Um, but there are some officials that only work one position
Football Versus Basketball Officiating
SPEAKER_00their whole career, and that's just all they ever do for whatever reason. And that's that can be, that's possible. And there's some calls you would never have to make from that position, right? And that's just how it is. And that's the beauty of working multiple sports. You can pull something from both. In basketball, you gotta make quick decisions, you gotta react, you gotta process. And was that a foul or not? Was that a travel or not? Was that out of bounds, blue, white, was that a block of charge? You gotta like make quick decisions and be really solid, confident. In football is the exact opposite. You gotta make decisions and process it, but you don't have to do it immediately. Okay, that's the whole, that's the whole, that's the whole. Yeah, that's the whole. Now I'm throw my flag. You still finish the play, and and and then you come and report and do your thing. And what I like, what I found was basketball helped me process plays better and more quickly, but football helped me be more patient. So I when I work the different sports, I can do the both. So in basketball, I'm more patient. I know I gotta make a decision quicker than in football, but I can process that play better and more patient. And in football, I could be more decisive. Like, yes, that's the whole, but I still may not throw my flag immediately because I don't have to. So both sports, different animals. Football is way more fun, way more enjoyable. You have to work as a crew more than basketball. Because in football, you guys have seen it. I can throw a flag. You know, I saw one part of it. My partner saw something else and said, Well, Chris, that's not of this because of this. Oh, okay. There is no flag on the play. In basketball, once you put air in the whistle, as if most or most part, you can't take it back, can't change it.
SPEAKER_02Chris, how do you prepare? Uh and I'm specifically thinking physically, but also mentally thinking through
Study Habits Weekly Quizzes Film Review
SPEAKER_02all the rules. And not only all the rules, but all the current rules so that you don't glitch out and call something on one of those old rules that's no longer in play. How do you prepare the day before, the day of, the week before?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's a running joke for me when people are like, hey man, how's your off-season going? It's like that, I don't know what that is. I I don't know what an off-season is, at least especially the last four years doing spring football and stuff. But even before doing spring football, like officiating is pretty much year-round now. Because even when you're not working, like you said, you're preparing for the next season. And a lot of that is mental more than physical. And so we have so with, you know, the positive of the COVID era was more virtual options for things. There's so many virtual study groups and rules meetings and things that just never existed coming up where you can learn. There's no excuse to not learn the rules. If you want to, you can plug in somewhere. So, you know, I attend some rules studies like online virtually. I do some study groups here in Indy locally. Um, and then just do your own self-study. Uh, another good way to learn is watching games and officiating the game mentally. So when I'm sports are ruined for me forever. Like, I can never watch a sporting event and just watch it and just watch the players. I'm always like working the play in my brain. Like, where would I put that spot? Or is that a hole? Was that offside? Like, so I'm getting mental reps all the time, and that that adds up. So when you get out there, it's it's it's there, and we do rules tests like uh for the Big Ten every week, comes out on Monday. We got to submit it by Thursday. So yeah, so it's it's ongoing. Some of it is um sent from the top down, and then some of it, a lot of it, you just gotta go get it for yourself and do what works for you, what makes sense for for you individually.
SPEAKER_02Chris, what if I said, hey, you got so much knowledge as an observer, spectator of the sport of football, I'd love to be educated on the rules. Are you allowed to pop up a YouTube channel and just sort of train the world on what the rules are? Or are you limited by your contract to say uh you're not allowed to go be a personality, you're not allowed to have name, image, and likeness type money. You're separate from that deal.
SPEAKER_00No, I mean the the most the restriction we have as far as that is we can't like publicly um comment or like social media comment on you know some game, a play, something controversial play, and there and the whole world's like, oh, that's what you know, and I'm like, no, it's not because rules three. Like I can't I can't go on and publicly comment on a play that happened or situation or talk about some coach or talk about some player. I can't do that, but I can absolutely do education and like we're talking now. I mean, take you behind the curtain a little bit and kind of share what we do and what we what we're thinking about. That's my opinion, my vision is I wish we would do that more and just open the world up to who we are as maybe it's human beings and like what it's really like. And because it seemed like you were surprised when I said we're doing quizzes, and it's what may, and we're weekly quizzes. I was very surprised. Oh, yeah, weekly quizzes.
SPEAKER_02I mean, and that's your grade, Christopher. How are you doing so far?
SPEAKER_00Just the first one. I just submitted it last night, and the grades haven't come out yet. So we'll see.
SPEAKER_02Maybe someday they'll have the officials, you know. They all the ranking of the players and how fat all their stats, they'll have the official stats. You know, Christopher Loving scored a 96% on all of his weekly quizzes.
SPEAKER_00Hey, you know, it's funny you say that. I, you know, not I mean, kind of jokingly, but I I was kind of un had a thought like, what if officials had their stats pop up on the screen? Because, you know, and this is public knowledge, you can find it, like the pro, like foot NFL guys, they're like 97% accurate or something on their calls. And like as you, you know, as you go up higher, they're in the 90% of accuracy. There's no player that has ever played any sport has ever been 90% accurate and in you know on average. Yeah, and so when we get you know so much criticism for even if we do get that 3% wrong in the game, but nobody mentions the 97%. So what if we have stats like you know, this official is like 99% correct on off sides or whatever. And hey, why not?
SPEAKER_01I mean, maybe some contract negotiating power comes along with that too, right? Maybe that's why I'm the best in the business.
SPEAKER_02Um, what's what's the there's there's a pretty big pay difference between. The NFL level and the uh college level. We've got players now that are hanging out in college or going back to college to get more money. Do you see that sort of trickling down to the officials where maybe some of that dollar difference that gap closes at the official level between college and pro?
SPEAKER_00Um I to be truthfully honest, I don't exactly know what they make. Um, definitely more than us. And I know there's articles out there I've I've read, I believe they're in the six figures range, which starting out. We we definitely are not. Um I think part of it is there are some officials that their goal, their their heart is the college level. Like I know some guys who definitely could have gone to the pros, but they love the Big Ten, they went to the Big Ten school, they live in Big Ten country. Working in the Big Ten is like that's what they wanted to do. Or working in the SEC is that's what they wanted to do. And if you think about it, in the SEC towns, being an SEC official is a lot bigger deal than being an NFL official for the most part. Because if you can go to work and say, hey, I worked Alabama, Georgia last week, everybody's like, oh man, good at that, you know. And if you say, Oh, I work, you know, green base Seattle, like, oh, okay, that's that's cool. But so some of it is just preference. Um, some of it is just, you know, God's plan and just the way things shape that there's some people I know that are really good, and I'm just shocked that they haven't ascended to whatever level. Um, and it's just you just don't know why. Time is different. So I don't think any official that I know is like was invited to the NFL and they're like, ah, no, I'm good. You know, I think it's just more some people don't pursue it because they don't
Favorite Games And Big Moments
SPEAKER_00necessarily want to, or some are pursuing it, and just things, you know, time their time just hadn't come yet.
SPEAKER_01What's uh what's been the uh most fun enjoy think about the last maybe three or four years? What has been some of the most fun, enjoyable games that you have officiated?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, the most recent was uh, you know, the locals. One of the locals' favorites, the Indiana Penn State last year. Um just a phenomenal environment. Um, you know, Penn State had lost their coach and on a losing streak, and just it felt like Indiana was rolling, so it felt like, oh, this will be a you know runaway game. And Penn State fought. The crowd was super into it. They got loud, they got that that pick, I think a pick six, or they got a pick late. I was like, oh, okay. And so when Indiana got the ball late, in my mind, I was like, well, this is gonna say a lot about this team and what you know how how real they are and what this season is gonna turn out to be. And never in the wildest dreams would I imagine, and people forget there was another really great catch on the sideline, like two plays before. Yeah, that was an amazing catch. And then playing the end of the uh back to the end zone was just unbelievable, unbelievable. And again, selfishly, I'm even more impressed with that official that made the call. He was right spot, super sharp, super decisive, nailed it. Nailed it, nailed it. And that's one of my good friends that uh he's from Minnesota, so we I came up, you know, with him, like same town, and learned a lot, rolled with him to a lot of these meetings I'm talking about. So that was really cool. That was fun. Um uh working at Oregon, I had Oregon Boise State when uh Aston Genty was there, and that was the year they went to the playoffs. Um, that was their only loss that year, and really fun atmosphere, fun game. Um see, what's another good one? And I was really fortunate, this was in 2022. I worked the Big Ten Championship game, uh, Purdue in Michigan.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_00Um and Bronx last year. I think it was not Harbaugh was back the next year, but yeah, so that was fun. Um, that was actually the first year, that was my first year in the Big Ten. I had just moved to Indy. Um, you know, the local team was there. Yeah Michigan's got a bunch of fans here too. So it was a fun environment. Um, kind of on a kind of somber note. My my dad had passed that September. And I remember um I think it was during a timeout or something, standing next to another guy, and I just looked around. I was like, man, my dad would have just been through the roof if he could have seen this, you know, being in this kind of game and this kind of environment. So it was just a just a pretty cool experience uh all around.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01Thanks for sharing that. Um what's some of the obviously you mentioned the uh the catch for IU. You're right there for that. Is there any other plays that stand out to you? Maybe technically as an official, where you're like, this play was crazy, or just as an admirer of the sport, a play that stands out.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's a good question. Um, it's I'm so bad because it's funny that like I'll work a game and people will be like, oh man, you know, such and such had 200 yards, and you know, he did this and that. And I'm like, I man, I didn't even notice that because I'm so locked in. I'm just like, this play, my responsibilities, dead ball, period. Okay, the next play. I sometimes miss the magnitude of what's going on. Now I'll look back when I watch the game and like, oh man, that was pretty sweet. So yeah, other than that, other than that play last year, I can't even almost can't even think of one singular play that like jumps out that well. Um, no, I know there was a bunch of amazing plays, but I just my brain is so just locked in, I don't even get the chance to really at the moment.
SPEAKER_02How often do you watch the games that you officiate over afterwards in their entirety?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so we, you know, we're our our worst critic. If those that are that really care and are good at this, we're our worst critic. And so we certainly so when we work a game, any penalties we have, you have we have a system, you go plug in your penalties. So you gotta go find what plate number it is and plug that in. But but then you want to go and watch every play to just really critique yourself. Was I the right spot? What was my movement like? Did I miss something? You know, did I was my signal good? Was my spot good? So I go, I try to do it Sunday or the next day after the game. If if it's an early game, I'll do it that same night and just go through, take notes, take notes on plays, send it to some of my mentors or peers and say, hey, what do you think about this play? What could I have done different? So I'll I'll watch the game. My uh system is I watch the TV version because I just want to see how it played out as if I was a fan. Was it choppy? Was it did it flow well? You know, how did the game look on TV? I'll take note, like, okay, play seven, I want to look back at that. Okay, play 30. So I'll let it play, then I'll go back to another version where I can see like 13 different camera angles, and then I'll look at play seven from the angles that show me what I want to see, and then I'll I'll break that down, and then pretty much I'm done with it, unless my referee or another official or somebody's like, hey man, what tell me about you know play 20, what happened? Then I'll may revisit it. But otherwise, once I'm done breaking it down, I'm moving on to the next game, scouting those teams and prepping for those teams and all that.
SPEAKER_02What's the average number of plays per college football these days?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I would say for us, it's probably one say between 160 and 180 for most Big Ten games. If you go to like the Big
How Teams Push Rules To The Edge
SPEAKER_0012, you easily get in the 200s because they go fast. Yeah. A lot of our teams don't go fast anymore, which which I'm okay with that. Um it just all depends on the the way the teams play.
SPEAKER_02And what um, you know, you've been at five years, not a long time, but what's changed about the way the game is played in the last five years that makes it hard on officials?
SPEAKER_00Hmm. Good question. Um, I would just say teams are always looking to just push the line, as push as close to the line as they can, um, either without you know cheating or committing the file or just trying to just barely skate by. And so that's where rule changes a lot of times come in.
SPEAKER_02What kind of penalties do you normally see them pushing to the line on?
SPEAKER_00Um, like for example, um, this year they've changed the what's called scrimmage kick formation or like punk formation for a more simple term. And so in college, the rules are so different than pro. Like in college, you've seen these formations where like all these guys are spread out, and we got it's is it's crazy. And part of the reason they do that is to confuse the defense. Well, that can confuse us too sometimes. If we, you know, number 80 isn't normally eligible, but he's covered up, and then he runs out for a route, but then number 70 is usually not, you know. So they're trying to simplify that too, where it's just more simple for us and the defense. So just stuff like that formation, tricky formations they try to be tricky with. And you know, a couple years ago, they had one team put a 12-gallon defense on purpose because it was late in the game. The other team ran the play, didn't gain many yards, and we penalized them properly, but it was an advantage because they had an extra defender, so the team couldn't really go downfield, so it made them waste time, basically. So that's yeah, and it it forced the rule change the next week. The next week. Yeah, the next week. And what's the rule change? Uh, if a team has 12 on defense at the snap and it's not trying to run off, then the offense can elect to take the penalty or not and get the time back. So if I snapped it at 12 seconds, that was 12 on defense, I ran a play, gained 20 yards, or got sacked, I can take the penalty and get the time back. Uh or if they gain more yards, they can decline the penalty and still get the time back. So that you know there's no advantage to the defense.
SPEAKER_01So that probably necessitated a rule change. Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Smart. I can say they push it until they can't, and then things change.
SPEAKER_01Um, so one thing I want to talk about is
Workplace Chaplaincy Without Pressure
SPEAKER_01um just your role as uh a chaplain in a corporate study. Um, I think that's something that you've probably started more recently. Um how has your experience from uh being a pastor and being in a church to being an official, how has that uniquely gifted you with ability to walk into a workplace and have have conversations with people about wherever they're at in life?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's a great question. Um, so yeah, when I mentioned in 2011 when I made that decision and surrender, I was really like probably like most people, so gunk-ho and like trying to save the whole world and every conversation, like you need Jesus, you need Jesus, you need Jesus, and just so you know, had a zeal, but not maybe not necessarily with the wisdom and the the tact to really reach people. So over time, doing these different these different roles and just growing up as a person, I've learned how to minister without pressure, without judgment, without overwhelming people. Like just be yourself, just talk and more just listen and just be available for people. And God will open the door at some point to share the gospel or share it or pray or whatever. But what I've learned is really just to like meet people right where they are, to love them right where they are, to not be judgmental, to not be like, you know, look at them any different because they have a different lifestyle or different habits or different mindset. And being around so many people from officiating and other things, I I'm starting to like understand cultures and understand people's upbringings better. So when I meet someone similar, I'm like, oh, I know how to relate to them better. Even if I didn't grow up that way or have that experience, I know somebody who does, so that helps me really relate a lot better and just yeah, just be a friend and be a listener here. It's been that's the key to success. That's been my key to success, even in officiating, even in chaplaincy, even in FCA. Just be myself, be friendly, and listen.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, it's just as you were talking, I was just thinking, I was like, man, Chris has like a really wide aperture on the type of uh on the type of people that you're interacting with. Because I mean, obviously in the church setting, but officiating, FTA, workforce chaplain, obviously you you are at Heritage Christian with kids uh quite a bit, and you just got a lot of uh variety of age and everything uh that you get to talk to.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's it's it's unbelievable when I think about it and when you just said it, it's like, yeah, I can literally today I was with did open house for some camp families and had kindergartners and even some of their younger siblings, two and three-year-olds in the stroller, all the way up to you know, elders that were around and probably all types of different people at the birthday party later. So, yes, I'm blessed to be around just people all day, every day. I love it.
SPEAKER_01It's very cool, especially even though you say that. I mean, you grew up an only child. Yeah, you know what I mean, and now it's just people all the time.
SPEAKER_00And it see, my wife gives me a hard time, she's one of eight kids, and she always for some reason is like, oh, you you know, you missed out, and you it was boring for you. And I'm like, no, because I had a lot of friends, had cousins, I had stuff to do, had sports, and the difference was when I was done, then I can go home and be at peace. And and just, you know, everything I had set somewhere, it was still there. My food was never eaten, my toys were never missing. Like, it was great. Had a great life.
SPEAKER_01That's awesome, Chris. This has been epic. We could certainly have gone on for a lot longer. Um, but uh wanted to close this episode down with the two questions that we ask all our guests.
Risk Resolve And What’s Unfinished
SPEAKER_01We want to ask you, and I'll I'll go with the first one. Uh, what is a risk you have taken that's changed your life?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, we've we've really hit it today. Like doing full-time ministry is a huge risk, and honestly, it's come with some major challenges over the years, uh, financially and time management and things like that. Of, you know, um, are there jobs I probably could have worked, you know, getting a paycheck and salary and benefits and stuff that may have been better financially and things for my family. Probably, as a matter of fact, yes, certainly. But the risk was like God gave me a vision many years ago, and like most people he guides, he doesn't tell you all the steps, he doesn't tell you all the the hardships that are coming, and I just took the risk of saying yes and doing it and still doing it and still figuring it out, but a risk to to forego like the sure thing and um to do it his way.
SPEAKER_02Wow, that's awesome. Chris, our second question. Um, what is left yet unfinished in the life of Christopher Loving that you have the resolve to complete?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I'll say two. Uh a very personal one is just, you know, creating um just creating like a legacy for my my own children and their children and their children. Of I feel, you know, I'm I'm grateful for what God is doing spiritually. I feel I'm on track to leave a legacy there of serving God and serving people, but I want to leave a legacy, even practically, um, with wealth and with resources and with them being able to enjoy life and not have some of the stresses and pressures that I had had and have. And so that's undone. So I still got work to do to get where we want to be from a resource standpoint and um leaving an inheritance from our children's children. And um I know God is able to lead us to do that, and then from a big picture side, um in this officiating world, I want you know, ministry and like God's presence and like all these different fellowships we're doing to be the norm. Just like every team has a chaplain, you know, every coach, coaching group has some type of coaching's ministry, and every, you know, different groups and sports have a space for God that's pretty known. Like, yeah, if you want to do that, you go over there and officiating, we need that too, and it's coming. That's cool.
SPEAKER_01That's awesome. Well, Chris, thanks for joining us, and thanks to our audience for joining us on another episode of Risk and Resolve. We'll catch you next time. Thanks for tuning in to Risk and Resolve.
SPEAKER_04See you next time.
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