17. Downsizing Disagreements: Finding Common Ground As A Couple

Facing downsizing disagreements? Downsizing is never just about the stuff—it’s about timing, emotions, identity, and often... compromise. And when you’re not on the same page with your spouse or partner? The whole process can feel even more overwhelming. Listen now to find out how you can find common ground as a couple.

In this episode, we’re digging into one of the most common downsizing roadblocks: what to do when one person is ready to start letting go, and the other is dragging their feet—or holding on tightly.

Whether you’re feeling eager and motivated or hesitant and emotional (or maybe both at the same time), we’re giving you tools to make progress together, not in conflict.

You’ll learn:

• Why couples so often misalign on the downsizing timeline
• Simple, non-confrontational conversation starters to get the topic on the table
• How to divide the work fairly, even if one of you is doing more heavy lifting
• Strategies to reduce tension when you disagree on what to keep
• What to do when a health or mobility issue forces a faster timeline
• Small but powerful ways to celebrate progress as a team

We’re also introducing our Couples Communication Worksheet—a free tool designed to help you reflect individually and reconnect before you begin downsizing together. It's a great first step if one of you feels stuck or unsure where to begin.

💬 Contact Us at www.downsizingroadmap.com to request your FREE copy.

🎧 Listen now and take your first step toward downsizing with more clarity, compassion, and collaboration.

If you enjoyed this episode, don’t forget to leave us a review and Follow our show so you never miss a new episode. We’re here for your downsizing questions — on the podcast, in your community, and when you’re ready to move. As Realtors®, we can connect you with the right specialists to make your next chapter smoother. We’d love to hear from you!

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Let’s simplify, declutter, and create space for your next chapter—together!

Transcript

Jodi Rosko 0:01

Welcome back to another episode of the Downsizing Roadmap Podcast with your hosts Jody Roscoe and Heather Fisher. We're talking about all things downsizing, from our own experiences with clients to guest experts. Let's make downsizing easier, one conversation at a time. Welcome back to Downsizing Roadmap Podcast. I'm Jody Roscoe. I'm Heather Fisher. And today we are going to talk about downsizing as a couple.

Heather Fisher 0:26

It's such an interesting one. We we do our in-person um downsizing workshops, and sometimes we have a couples there, and oftentimes we have one person from the couple and they say, Oh, my wife needs to come, my husband needs to come, but they couldn't get them to come.

Jodi Rosko 0:49

Or they come, one of them has their arms crossed, and one of them doesn't. Yes. And one of them is saying, they have so much junk, and the other one's saying, Stop calling it junk. Right. Right.

Heather Fisher 1:03

Right. So we find a lot of um mismatch, which I think in life this is not new. Right. You married you marry someone that is likely fairly different, and that's why you love them so much. So that's the key. Remember, this is why you love them so much, because opposites attract. Right. But when it comes down to some of these tasks, we often see the two people on opposite ends of the spectrum, the collector and the thrower-outer are married to each other.

Jodi Rosko 1:37

Very, very often.

Heather Fisher 1:38

Yes. Yeah. So I don't know. I think I'm the thrower-outer in in my marriage. I'm definitely the collector. Yes. It's the same as in our, you know, in our working relationship. You're the stuffer. Yes.

Jodi Rosko 1:53

Although I'm getting better and better about letting things go, like much better. So I think that's, I mean, we'll get into it more, but I genuinely think it's very like based in your childhood and like what you learned and what your values were and what they were taught to you as. And so I think that all of the surface bickering is really actually some pretty deep stuff that you need to get through.

Heather Fisher 2:21

Absolutely. And the stuff that you love, you're not l loving it most likely for what it is. It's for your own story around it. Yeah. Or your own experiences, maybe something you didn't have, felt you didn't have enough of earlier in life, or, you know, all of those things come to ahead.

Jodi Rosko 2:43

They're much bigger than whether, you know, we keep this one thing or not.

Heather Fisher 2:49

Yeah. Yeah. So we'll dive into that today on uh this episode and how to get on the same page. Yeah. Um, because that's a win win for everybody. So first step is what it always is. You have to start talking about what what the end game is, what's the plan, what's the dream.

Jodi Rosko 3:12

And make sure you have the same plan, which that's a whole nother piece, you know. Do you you know you often we get somebody wants to stay in the house and somebody doesn't. Yeah. So what so so how are you gonna work through that and and the pros and cons of that and having, you know, some pretty deep conversations about what your future's gonna look like.

Heather Fisher 3:35

And and talking about why someone is struggling with the current situation or um, you know, maybe finding some resources to make the current situation work for a little longer, but by easing those burdens that one person might be feeling that the other one isn't. Um because people are at different health levels, mobility levels, emotional attachment to that place, and ready to move forward on different timelines. So just talking through all of that and why different things are important to each person is what we're gonna talk about. So then the stuff can just be stuff and you can move through that a little easier.

Jodi Rosko 4:21

Yeah, maybe it's one person's you know job to take care of all the things and the other person thinks it's fine to stay, and the and the one that's jobs to take care of it all is like I'm tired.

Heather Fisher 4:31

Yeah.

Jodi Rosko 4:31

You know?

Heather Fisher 4:32

Yeah.

Jodi Rosko 4:32

And looking at, you know, objectively. I think I think we talk a lot about that, but kind of getting a bird's eye view, whether it's of your stuff and your house or whether it's of your situation and your future. But like we very rarely in life we just kind of go along day to day and we don't stop and just take a bird's eye view of all of that stuff. And so that's number one, what is each of your views, right? Yeah. And then how are we gonna come together for a a combined joint view?

Heather Fisher 5:05

Yeah, and I and just talking through um, you know, what the other person is hoping for, if it's just a a a little bickering about you need to get rid of your stuff and you know, the the actual reason why you're you know scared of change or you don't know what's coming or you're you know suffering through something if you're only saying those words of go clean out the garage, go your sewing room is overloaded, those words aren't being productive to get you both on the same page.

Jodi Rosko 5:42

Well, they're not the problem. Right. And so you need to get down to the root of that and you know you might have to ask a few questions deep, you know, why are you you know, why are you wanting to keep this thing or these things? Um, and then what's that gonna mean if you don't have them, you know, asking yourself some kind of hard questions actually.

Heather Fisher 6:05

Yeah, we pulled a list of um some questions that can start this conversation if you're not sure how to start it. Um but before we dive into the questions, I would say um you definitely you could do it one of two ways. You could just talk about the questions together in conversation. Um but if you're struggling with that um, you know, and that and that's not working very well, you could do it on paper, each of you separately, the same questions, and then come back after you've had time to to process it yourself. Um but I would say start, don't do it in the middle of a stressful situation. Yeah. This is something to do. Um, you know, prepare the other person that you want to have a conversation about that, if you're the one instigating it. Don't throw it on someone when they're in the middle of doing some something else, and and just like any hard conversation, don't don't throw it in at that inopportune time because the results will not be what you're hoping for and it won't move things forward. Right, pushing too hard or at the wrong time doesn't usually get you where you're yeah, or unexpected where the the other person isn't hasn't had a chance to think through it for themselves.

Jodi Rosko 7:20

Well, yeah, because if you have been thinking about that silently for, you know, six months or a year, and then you have this whole plan in your head because you've been thinking about it for so long, and then you're like, hey, we need to do this, and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And they're like, wait, what? You know, like they haven't had a chance to think about it. Um, so I think give them giving them that that place.

Heather Fisher 7:41

That space to think it through as well and come back with some answers can be beneficial. So do we want to go through um these questions? I think some of them can really get things, the conversation moving.

Jodi Rosko 7:54

Yeah. So um, so uh I was just looking at the stat from before. 64% of couples, uh, one person is more attack more emotionally attached to their belongings than the other, and I would think it would be more than 64%. Yeah. That's interesting. But um definitely I think there are people who get really emotionally attached to things and people who really don't. So, okay, the questions. Um so uh questions to ask each other. I'm just gonna kind of go down the list. Yeah. Um what do you want the next chapter of your life to look like?

unknown 8:28

Uh-huh.

Jodi Rosko 8:28

And those are some big that's a big question. That that's a big one. Yeah. Um and you can uh just be really dreamy about it and just write down any crazy thing, just you know, any big thing, any anything. Yeah. Um just really write that, right, just really think about a big picture of what you your next chapter could look like.

Heather Fisher 8:47

Yeah, I think that sometimes one person, like you said, could have been thinking about something for months and months in their head, and it just it's not even that the other person objects to that plan. They just it never occurred to them. Like life is good the way it's always been and it never occurred. But if you know, if moving closer to your kids and grandkids is, you know, what you're wanting to do, and you know, you have to talk about those things, not just hold resentment that they haven't happened. Right.

Jodi Rosko 9:18

Right. Right. So this is what I see it looking like. What do you see it looking like and how can we, you know, come together on that? Um what scares you most about downsizing? Um, and that can be different from definitely different from different people, but fears, fears can absolutely stop you from living your future. Absolutely. Yeah. And so how can you walk through those fears and get to the other side of whatever that is?

Heather Fisher 9:42

Yeah. And I think the fears can dissipate when you have that plan of what downsizing means for you as a couple or as a person.

Jodi Rosko 9:51

Yeah.

Heather Fisher 9:52

Um the fears dissipate because it's not just this word and you suddenly think you own nothing and you're in a 10 by 10 room.

Jodi Rosko 9:59

And I mean, well, let's take the example of you're gonna go move closer to your kids, right? So now that's not a place that you've been in all these times. Who's gonna be your doctor? Who's gonna cut your hair? You know, you start you can spin out on those kind of things and get really freaked out about what that is, or you can be like, you know, I just really want to be in my grandkids' life and go to their games and be there for their birthday, and we'll figure it out.

Heather Fisher 10:23

Yeah, yeah. And let's start exploring next time we go visit.

Jodi Rosko 10:28

Yeah, right. Like let's start seeing what that looks like. So uh okay, here's another question. What are you most excited about for I'm sorry, what are you most excited for about simplifying or moving? So like what is most really basically the question is what do you hate about your house or what do you hate that you're doing? Or like what are you most excited about not having to do? Hate dusting all of this stuff and shuffling papers and those flower beds that I used to love, I just can't get in there and do it anymore. Even though I love them, I can't do it, and then I feel terrible that they don't look as good as they used to, or whatever that is. Like, what is it that you're gonna be like, oh, this is gonna be amazing when I don't have to fill in the blank?

Heather Fisher 11:09

Yeah. Yeah. Motivation.

Jodi Rosko 11:12

What items are must-keeps for you and why?

Heather Fisher 11:15

Yeah. I think that question is so important because if it's somebody else's stuff and it doesn't hold that same significance for whatever reason, it's easy to say we can get rid of this. We often have couples at our class that are like, yeah, everything we're getting rid of is his stuff, and then that'll be plenty of room for mine. You know, like Yeah, and they they say it in jest, but I think there's a bit of that in all of us, like, well, if they got rid of, you know, 90% of their stuff, then it leaves plenty of room for for mine.

Jodi Rosko 11:55

So what's that compromise? Like, I can get rid of this, this, and this, and you can get rid of this, this, and this, and that leaves room for my favorite thing and your favorite thing, you know.

Heather Fisher 12:05

And an understanding of why it's important to the other person. And I think once you've had to define that on paper in conversation, why it's important, you realize, is it truly important? Like, well, wait, mate, I want to pick something different. This is a a silly reason to keep it. So you're you're narrowing it down. But then once you've decided that these are the must-keeps, and I'm not gonna, you know, nag you about getting rid of that because that's the decided upon, that takes a little bit of the um, you know, obstacle out of that constant bickering about well, if I'm getting rid of this, you have to get rid of that kind of a thing.

Jodi Rosko 12:49

Yeah.

Heather Fisher 12:50

Um you can narrow down on on a few of those protected things that this is important to me for this reason, and it's a must-keep, and and just respect that importance to the other person, not have to have the same feeling around whatever it is.

Jodi Rosko 13:07

Well, and the answer for both of you can't be everything. Right. So it can't be like you have to go into that must must-keeps with the with the understanding that this is like the really critical stuff, right? If there's three hundred thousand items in your house, what you know, hundred things are really important to you or fifty things are really important to you that you have to that you really have to have.

Heather Fisher 13:30

Yeah.

Jodi Rosko 13:31

Um and I we get so many people whose houses still have all the stuff from their mom and dad or whatever that they got dumped on when they had to clean out their house and didn't have the time or didn't have the emotional, you know, bandwidth to go through it and never then never did. Um, tons of people who have that whole pile of things and tons of people who have all their kids' things who their kids moved out and their kids don't want to take those things and their parents are keeping them for them, quote, you know, quote unquote keeping them for the kids, and the kids either need to come and get them or they need to go, you know, and so there's a whole bunch of stuff that's neither of your must keeps because they're not even yours.

Heather Fisher 14:15

Yeah.

Jodi Rosko 14:16

You know.

Heather Fisher 14:17

Yeah. Always start with the easier things.

Jodi Rosko 14:20

Um, how do you imagine spending time in your next home?

Heather Fisher 14:24

I think that's a an important thing because that also will define what you want to keep.

Jodi Rosko 14:31

And what you what that looks like. Are you in a ranch home um with a smaller yard and you're still, you know, mowing and taking care of and you, you know, can do a little bit of gardening because you love that? Are you in a condo where you just don't want to deal with it and you can leave, you know, whenever you want to and go travel and it's not gonna matter? Are you in an in a uh community where there's tons of people and you want to be hanging out and playing bingo and doing all the things? You know, what what does it look like?

Heather Fisher 14:56

Yeah. And what hobbies are you taking with you? And what uh can you let go that you're not going back to that you need rooms? And that's okay. Yeah.

Jodi Rosko 15:07

Yeah. Okay. How can you define uh divide the downsizing work fairly?

Heather Fisher 15:14

I think this might be a challenging question to get to an answer on at the beginning, especially if one person came to this downsizing party reluctantly.

Jodi Rosko 15:23

Yeah.

Heather Fisher 15:24

Um but it will make everything going forward so much easier if you know what that end goal is. You have a um a at least a broad timeline of we hope for this to happen in the next six months, in the next two years, you know, in the future. You have that timeline, then you can look at what those projects are and divide them up and give you know some space for them to get done.

Jodi Rosko 15:56

When I was thinking about this question and I kind of just put it to me, I was thinking, okay, you know, most of the stuff, some of it is mine, but most of the stuff in the garage is Mark's stuff that he could deal with and handle. Yeah. Most of the stuff in the basement is like stuff that I would need to handle, and there's tons of like holiday things and you know, just stuff that he wouldn't know how to manage or get rid of. And and in fairness, I do honestly think it won't be equal because the thrower outer just doesn't have as much stuff as I'm done here. Yeah. As the keeper. And I'm telling you, the keeper does not really want the thrower outer always to be helping with that. Hovering. Yeah. Why do you need that? Why do you need that? Why do you need that? Right? You don't want to that that's not a productive thing. So if it's it might take more time for the keeper to go through their things than the thrower outer, and you're gonna have to talk about what that time is gonna look like. But you know, you can still say, you can do the garage and I'll do the basement, and that time may not be the same and equal, you know what I'm saying?

Heather Fisher 17:06

But I think giving a de definition of we will have both of those projects done by such and such gives you the freedom to fit it in in your own way, your own time, take off chunks that you can handle of the piece you're responsible for without, I mean, sometimes a a full weekend of togetherness, togetherness going through rooms or basements or attics or whatever, that is not going to lead to as much success as sometimes dividing, doing it, revisiting and then celebrating that both places are done.

Jodi Rosko 17:48

Right. And to be supportive of what that looks like, right?

Heather Fisher 17:52

So and any progress is progress. So I I do think um if you're the the overachiever of the duo, you have to the same with if your kids are learning how to do their own laundry or clean something, you have to let your expectations be that done not perfect or done but not your way. Right. That if progress is made, that is something to celebrate and that is a win. It's not oh well I would have, you know, fill in the blank, whatever.

Jodi Rosko 18:28

Just throwing out that whole room in the neck in an hour and I would have been done or whatever.

Heather Fisher 18:31

Yeah. So as long as the other person is meeting that expectation of of making progress by a deadline, then that that's all we need for it to be a win.

Jodi Rosko 18:43

So that rolls right into the question of what support do we need. Do we need family, professionals, some kind of emotional support? You know, there are there are definitely third-party people that can help you, um, people that can, you know, organizers and people that can help with downsizing like that that can come in and help you, or your best friend who's a thrower outer who can come in and you know talk you through that and maybe have a little bit less emotional, you know, ties to those things. So a a more a different lens that they're looking through.

Heather Fisher 19:17

I think um I love that it's where um where it is on this list of questions too, because pulling in that third-party resource when you've already defined what are the must keeps for each person, so like you can feel safe in that. Okay, you know, I know that you don't want to tackle going through all of these rooms. I would like to have, you know, so and so do that. Here's what that looks like, you know, and being supportive of investing in those resources if you don't want to be doing it yourself and having gone through what the end plan is, what you're working towards, and what is already defined as okay, I'm you're not gonna go into the garage and throw away all my stuff. I will handle that, but yes, get some help for this, that, or the other.

Jodi Rosko 20:13

So Yeah. How will we know when we're making progress and how should we celebrate it? I love this. I love to be to that you build in right up front, you're gonna build in, okay, when we've done X, we're gonna, you know, celebrate, we're gonna go out to dinner, or when we've done Y, we're gonna whatever. I don't know.

Heather Fisher 20:33

Yeah, I mean I think obviously defined by whatever feels celebratory to you, but definitely plan that from the get-go. And as we've said so many times, define what what it is you're doing so that you know when you're done.

Jodi Rosko 20:51

Yeah.

Heather Fisher 20:52

If it's just uh I just want to downsize Yeah, it's too big.

Jodi Rosko 20:57

It's too big and overwhelming. And not just like any goals that you know, any to anybody that talks to you about how to create goals, they have to be measurable, they have to have a time frame, you know. Written down. Yeah, they have to be written down. So that's what you want to do. You wanna write down what you're doing. You're getting almost making a little contract with each other um about what these what your expectations are, each of your expectations and how you're gonna meet them, and then how you're gonna celebrate yourselves around those.

Heather Fisher 21:26

Yeah, and I would say build in those celebrations along the way.

Jodi Rosko 21:30

Yeah, not at the end. Not at the end, not I mean you can do it at the end too, but not wait till the end to celebrate.

Heather Fisher 21:36

Right. Celebrate whether it's each week or whatever that is. You did the things, celebrate it, and have fun.

Jodi Rosko 21:45

Yeah. Okay, so section three is divide and conquer. How to start when you're at different stages. Uh we we see this all the time too. We've talked about this, you know, somebody's ready and somebody isn't. Um Let each person handle their own categories. That's kind of what we've been talking about. Start with neutral or shared areas first. I mean you could probably clean out the pantry together. There's probably not a lot of emotional, you know, the food's expired or it's not expired. Right. All your spices are probably expired.

Heather Fisher 22:17

Right. That's a a queen clean sweep. Just put it all in the trash bag. They're all expired.

Jodi Rosko 22:24

But there are some areas that, you know, aren't going to be confrontation or you know, there won't be much friction over those. So you can start with those together, or you can, you know, assign each other each yourselves, you know, certain areas that are like that, either one. Yeah. Create shared wins and choose one goal that you both want. Um so we've talked about that. We kind of talked about that when we were doing when we were talking the about the questions, but um make sure that you are on the same page. I guess that's what we're saying in all of that. Just be on the same page, ris respecting your uh each other's pace and you know, yeah.

Heather Fisher 23:00

And each other's emotions around it. If you're feeling like you're just struggling to get on on the same page, it really probably means going deeper on the questions and figuring out because like you said at the beginning, it's rarely about whatever trinket you're you know, maybe bickering about, but something is a bigger fear or attachment, there's a bigger emotion. Yeah. So give give the other person grace to express where they're coming from and ask those questions to get to that. Yeah. And then you can likely move past it once you have that understanding amongst each other.

Jodi Rosko 23:43

Yeah, if somebody's really throwing up a a wall around something, there's a deeper there's a deeper piece to it. Because stuff is just stuff when it really gets right down to it. Stuff is just stuff. And so um what is making them want to hold on to it? And that's really what you want to get.

Heather Fisher 24:00

Yeah, and how can you respect that? I think too, we've talked so much about decision fatigue and make sure to recognize that if you are working on something together, you know, when we talk about that 10-minute-a-day challenge, um, you know, some days 10 minutes is all you can do, and some days you're on a roll, just be aware that the day you're on a roll, the other person might be in that wow, 10 minutes is the worst 10 minutes of my life. Right. And so figuring out how to balance that, either continue on your role, you know, on your own for that day, or be willing to stop and regroup. Um, but don't expect someone's energy level to match your own every day.

Jodi Rosko 24:47

Like quietly frustrated with them that I'm still going and they're not going anymore. And you know, the ten minutes is the win, period, right? And if you're still going because you got on a roll, great. But I'll bet tomorrow you won't be feeling like you're on a roll. You know, tomorrow you might be having feeling that decision fatigue and your ten minutes is plenty the next day. Um or maybe you've created some momentum and you're just ready to bl you know plow through it. But if they haven't gotten to that place, again, their ten minutes is their win, let them have it.

Heather Fisher 25:19

Yeah.

Jodi Rosko 25:19

Right?

Heather Fisher 25:20

Yeah, revisit it. Don't hold those different energy levels against someone else each day. It will balance out and you know you might be surprised and they see your your wins and go, oh, while you were while you were gone, I cleaned out this, this, and this, and and it'll surprise you. So just be patient.

Jodi Rosko 25:40

Yeah, set timelines that allow that breathing room. So when you're setting the timeline, like we were talking about, the thrower outers timeline might be able to be faster than the keeper's timeline, but but that's not fair, right? Like set a timeline that will work for both of you and make you know make that reasonable that the keeper can go through all the things too.

Heather Fisher 26:02

Yeah. Um I like this quote. I don't have um who to attribute it to, so I'm sorry, whoever said this wonderful thing, but uh it says different doesn't mean wrong, it just means different. So that's back to when you set those expectations up front, you can both get to the end of the road without taking the same route.

Jodi Rosko 26:24

So as long as you're both moving forward and you've talked about what a winning plan for you both is and decided on those expectations, someone doesn't have to do it exactly your way as long as they're I think all fights in all relationships or all things that don't seem to go quite right is because of expectations that are not spoken. You know, somebody has an expectation, has not told the other person what their expectation is and is mad at them for not meeting that expectation even though that other person has no idea what it is. Yeah. And I think that happens, you know, when we're feeling like we don't have great customer service somewhere, it's because we had an expectation that wasn't met even though that person, you know, might not have known what our expectation is and that they're supposed to be living up to it. But in our relationship, especially with our spouse, I feel like there's when you are in trouble, there's because there's expectations that um somebody didn't verbalize or and the other person didn't agree to be, you know, help to. Yeah. And that's where that's where we're in trouble. So that's why the upfront conversation is so important, is because you're gonna air air all those expectations, like I want it done in six months, I don't think six months is reasonable, whatever you're you know, whatever that is, you're gonna get all those expectations out um into the open and get them agreed upon one way or another, and then as we move forward, it's easier to give grace because we know what the expectations are.

Heather Fisher 27:56

Yeah, absolutely. So, so right there. Okay, so sometimes um, you know, despite all of these great plans, there's a little extra conflict and friction, emotional tension. So um just some a couple tips on on getting through that. Um, you know, you still want your relationship to be amazing and you want um to not to not be frustrated each day. So um avoid, we talked about this, but avoid decluttering and diving into this when emotions are high. So schedule things, um, you know, schedule how long you're gonna work on something, whether that's separately or together. You know, make that plan. Don't throw in at the last minute, like, I know you're watching this right now or doing your crossword, but I want to declutter the pantry right now. You know, don't don't just throw it in.

Jodi Rosko 28:58

Um I might be a little guilty of that. Because I keep until I can't stand it, and then I want it gone. And I want everybody on board to get it gone with me. They're like, wait, it was fine. Yes, well we can all, you know, do things in our own way. We have opportunities for growth. Just different. Not wrong. Opportunities for growth.

Heather Fisher 29:26

Yeah. I think that um the maybe box um or the uh having a pause when you get into emotional items that you're ready to just just throw it out already. Yeah, take a pause. It is okay to just say, we're at that decision fatigue for today. We are we're at that limit. Let's set that over. If you still want to regroup and go back to something easy to finish up some more time, do that. But pulling back from those hot button items that you're arguing about, that's okay. Sometimes just a little time and that that maybe and that thinking about it is all someone needs to to make a hard decision on something.

Jodi Rosko 30:14

Yeah, because I've seen where people where even myself, like if I go through something, there's there's a whole bunch of stuff that's just easy and I can just get rid of that. And then there's that medium stuff that I'm not sure. But if you go through it once and you just kind of get rid of the easy stuff, then if you go through it again the second time, you can get rid of more stuff because you can it's it's like a mental thing. You can only get rid of so much at a time, and then you're just like I'm getting rid of too much stuff. Even if it's not stuff that you love, it's just too much stuff. Yeah. It's back to that mind thing where everything we own is more important than it actually is because we own it. Yeah. And so letting it go, whether we even want it or not, letting it go is still a thing in our minds. Like, oh my gosh, I'm not gonna have that thing anymore, even though I don't know.

Heather Fisher 31:02

I I mean it's it's crazy how it all works, but I mean I did downsize a few years ago from uh a larger house um into a a much smaller house, and uh I don't know the percentage of what I gave away, but I felt like I was giving donating, you know, half of my house, and it was a significant amount, and I really can't picture what I gave away. Like I don't remember what it was, but there I mean it's been almost five years since I made that move, and I I don't miss anything to the point of like I wish I hadn't done that, but there are tinges like hmm, I wonder what was in that pile. Like if that still would have been a maybe pile, it probably would have dug stuff out, but I really don't miss it and can't name it or whatever. So you don't really need it. It's just a mental thing, like it's just a mental accepting that you have less. Oh, I owned all that. What was it? And it's so silly because I I don't need any of it. I don't even remember.

Jodi Rosko 32:05

I think it must be like a caveman kind of a thing, like you better have all the things, or we're you know, we might not get things later or you know, whatever.

Heather Fisher 32:13

But yeah, so we get it. It is emotional. But you know, just move progress forward each day. Um no pressure, no judgment. If someone's just struggling in it, just you know, hey, let's just stop and have uh, you know, a cup of coffee and sit on the porch and that's okay. You can regroup again the next day. Yeah. Um what else?

Jodi Rosko 32:39

Well, I think you know, w uh more tips on how to how to if you disagree on how much you need to keep. So you're you're gonna agree on it in advance back in the beginning. Agree in advance, like we're gonna have ex you know, four bins for Christmas or you know, whatever that is, um, we're gonna have one holiday bin. I mean, I don't know, like depends on how big the area is and what you're doing, but you know, do a volume kind of cap. Like we can have three boxes of pictures, or we can have you know whatever that looks like. And so um so agree in the beginning, and so you're gonna have to sort it down until it fits into whatever that volume cap it is. And that might take a few passes. You know, you might have one pass and you're like, oh, okay, we said four bins for holiday, and I have, you know, seven bins for holiday. And after I, you know, did my first, I used to have twelve bins for holiday, right? Yeah. And so now how am I gonna get that seven into four? And what are my favorite things and what things do I really not put out? I'm just pretending like I need them and you know, those kind of things. So it might take a couple passes, but if you have a volume cap on it, you know, just like hangers in your in your closet, right? You only have X amount of hangers in your closet, and that's how many cl hanging clothes you can have. Yeah. And so if if it something has to go if it if you don't have a hanger for it. Yeah. Just kind of a a way that you can keep the volume cap on on some of those things.

Heather Fisher 34:09

I think that um what we've seen I I've seen personally and and what we've seen with couples that we've met in our classes or clients is that um back to that perceived monetary value of things. Um and so I think that that is a great situation when that third party, that neutral third party, is a really great resource instead of an argument between a like one person thinks it's got a bunch of value and the other person doesn't. Yes. And so, well, we can't get rid of that. I think that not having that argument and just okay, let's find out, and then using third-party sources, an estate sale person, an auction person, an appraiser, whatever it might be, looking online at you know, doing that spreadsheet of value and deciding um let information be a deciding factor sometimes versus just an argument of Yeah. No, it doesn't. It's junk.

Jodi Rosko 35:15

Right, right, right. Right. Find find the facts around it. Yeah. Um so um let everybody have a let each person have a no questions asked pile. So um that's back to like why do you need that? Like some of it's just like I need it.

Heather Fisher 35:31

Like or I want it. Yeah.

Jodi Rosko 35:33

Yeah. I just for whatever reason I want that. And that pile may or may not end up being something that you really want. And that can't be the whole pile, like it can't be everything, can't have that reason. But just, you know, if if the if your partner wants something that you don't want, you don't understand, it's okay. You don't have to always understand it. You know, they that's just something that is important to them, and they'll probably tell you the story around it at some point. Um maybe not when you're you know elbows deep in the in the day of going through things. But there must there is a story around it. There is some reason, so um, but maybe we don't have to go through every reason as we're doing it. So use labels like m like uh you know, it's a memory or it's for future use or it's display worthy um or whatever to frame your your uh your discussion about it. Yeah. Right? So why is it that? Why is that important? This is the memory that I have that evok this piece of, you know, this stuff evokes. Yeah. Or um I'm gonna use this in the future. And then you're gonna have to be really honest with yourself. If you haven't used it in the last five years, are you really gonna use it in the future? So be honest with yourself about that, because I do think that's something that people use as a procrastinating uh you know, comment of kicking the decision down the road. Yeah. And display worthy, I think that's that is legitimate. Like, are you going to put that out and have it, you know, have a place in your home that that it is displayed so that you can look at it and have those memories? Or is it, you know, it was mom's, but it's still gonna go back in that box that was in the basement, you know, and st shove it in the storage room of the new place, then you know, you aren't creating memories around that thing when it's in a box in the basement. Like there's no connection to that thing.

Heather Fisher 37:27

And I think that goes back to the very beginning when you have that plan of what the next step looks like, you can make those decisions a little better. I mean, we just met with a client that was like, well, I can't make all these decisions on what I'm you know, donating and giving away uh because she was waiting on her new space, she hadn't seen her new um space yet. So she's like, I'll be able to as soon as I see what that, you know, square footage and room layout looks like. Right. Um so if you don't have any kind of a plan on um what that next step looks like, those bec I think you keep more thinking, yeah, I'll need this in the future. I might need this.

Jodi Rosko 38:11

Yeah. Um create photo albums or digital backups of large collections of if if if you have a collection that you want to let go of and you're gonna just keep your favorite one, two, maybe three things of that collection, um, and you're gonna let go of the rest, you can take pictures of the rest of it so that you can look back and remember on you know what that was and then let that collection go to either, you know, family or maybe it has some value, or maybe it there's a great place that you can donate it to that it's a club or something that really enjoys whatever that is, puzzles or trains or whatever that looks like. And you know, maybe there's some or great that you can give it, but you can have pictures of it in the meantime, so you know what you had and maybe keep your favorite pieces.

Heather Fisher 38:53

Yeah, yeah. So um the next um topic we want to talk about is sometimes um in the the couple situation, they're at this point of downsizing because one person um is in a different declining health or mobility, um, and a lot of times memory, memory care is involved in that. And so you've got a couple that's had a a wonderful life together, but one person is handling the decisions for for both people. Um so that changes a lot of these conversations that you you you're respecting what you hope the other person's um you know hopes and wishes are, but you're not necessarily going to try to get down to answers on all of these questions from someone that's in the middle of other, you know, another crisis and and dealing with so much. So um talking about some tips, if you're the one, I mean, it's a difficult place and we're very understanding because if that's the situation, you're likely carrying a lot of the burden of their day-to-day care or safety care you're in that caregiver role. And then on top of that, to make the caregiver role easier in the future, you may be making a move, but you're adding all of the pieces of that move on top of an already day-to-day stressful situation. So in that case, it is definitely a great choice to pull in resources and just spend the money that those might cost and take that burden off of yourself because I mean, kudos to all the caregivers out there. It is a hard job to be the caregiver of someone else full-time that needs that. And there are so many resources that can handle a lot of this, and they can be there to bounce the conversation off of with you as to what's important to um, you know, your legacy as a couple and what you want to keep, but they can do the sorting and the physical labor and handle that. So that would be my biggest suggestion is don't try to have these conversations if the other person is not in a place that it's an equal conversation anymore and pull in those third party resources.

Jodi Rosko 41:31

Yeah, pr prioritize safety, dignity, you know, ease. Um, you know, uh keep what serves your current and and your future lifestyle and let the rest of it go. And and wherever possible, you know, uh invol uh you can you can involve them, but not in a way that makes that like a lot of times, especially people if they're having memory issues, that it get they get upset about it. And so um unfortunately, again, that is it's just a hard, hard position to be in as the caregiver and the one that has to handle it. But um there's gonna have to be a little bit of doing it around around the other person.

Heather Fisher 42:15

I think that um there was a phrase they used at the um caregiver seminar we were at, and it was I can't think of the word, but it was um about a f a caring fib, it was a different word. Yeah. Um but sometimes you don't have to give the full question or explanation. Um and so maybe you can give decisions in that this or that question, hey, do you love this or that? And the person is choosing, but you don't have to finish with the because whichever one you don't pick or take into the donation pile. You know, it can just be questions to get some of those answers you want without a full story that's going to confuse someone and make it harder.

Jodi Rosko 43:03

If you don't have the budget to hire someone, then um find some good friends, you know, maybe your family can help you and and see if you can get some help in that way so you just get some support for yourself as you're moving through it, because it's it's a definitely a tough place to be. Yeah. And give yourself some grace. You know, this is this version of downsizing is probably the hardest because you're you're uh not doing it alone. There's still going to be a lot of um uh opinions from your partner, but they are also uh not truly there in the helping process. So um you know, the National Alliance of Caregiving says one in four family care caregivers have said they've had to manage the downsizing by themselves. Um you know, but but not really by yourself because that person is still there. You're s you're just yeah, you know, having to gently move around it. So give yourself some grace. Um consider what systems you're gonna need in the future to help yourself.

Heather Fisher 44:05

Um and uh you know, yeah, give yourself give yourself a break and yeah, give yourself a hug for all of the amazing things you're doing to take care of that family member. So yeah, so back to celebrating. Um, you know, if you've gotten through this and you've you've gotten to that next place or you've just gotten ready to to go to that next place, don't forget to stop, give yourself breaks, give yourself a night out to dinner, give toast to yourself toast to yourself or you know, have coffee or do something that makes you your you feel great about it. Yeah, and and be generous with praise of you know the other the other half of your couple that that worked just as hard, even if it was in a different way than yours. Yeah. Um, you know, give give that praise and gratitude and keep coming back to that big why.

Jodi Rosko 45:03

Yeah you know, keep as you go along, keep looking at that and and reminding yourselves as you celebrate each time, hey, we're that much closer to moving to you know to our kids, or hey, we're that much closer to not having to mow that lawn ever again or you know, whatever that is.

Heather Fisher 45:18

Absolutely, absolutely. So um, yeah, I think that that covered most of it for today. We'll be back with more episodes here in the next coming weeks. And if you need any resources, uh www.downsizingroadmap.com and we can get through this together.

Jodi Rosko 45:39

Yep, good luck.

Heather Fisher 45:40

Thanks for joining us on the Downsizing Roadmap Podcast. If you found this episode helpful, be sure to subscribe, leave us a review, and share it with someone who might need a little downsizing inspiration. Have questions or ideas for future episodes? Reach out to us on our website, www.downsizingroadmap.com. Until next time, let's keep simplifying and moving forward.