2.156 How Purpose and Values Help Small Businesses Grow with Jason Le

In this episode of the Find Grow Keep podcast, Karen sits down with Jason Le from JRNY Digital to talk about why purpose, values, vision and mission are not just nice words for your website. They help shape how small businesses grow, how they market themselves, who they attract, how they make decisions, and how they build teams that truly fit. 

We explore why so many businesses struggle to stand out when they try to appeal to everyone, how authentic values help connect with the right clients and employees, and why your personal story often holds the key to your business purpose. 

Jason also shares how his own family’s experience in small business shaped the work he does today, and why clarity around who you serve can make every part of your business stronger. 

In this episode, we cover: 

• Why purpose is a practical business tool, not a fluffy extra 
• How values influence brand, culture and hiring 
• Why generic messaging makes businesses easy to ignore 
• How to define what your business really stands for 
• How clarity helps small businesses grow with intention 

If you are a small business owner who wants to grow with more clarity, alignment and impact, this conversation is well worth a listen. 

Make sure to subscribe to stay updated with new releases on Mondays!
 
Visit https://www.amplifyhr.com.au/ for more insights and resources.  

Connect with Jason: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jason-le1/  

Transcript

Karen Kirton   

welcome Jason.  

Jason Le   

Thank you for having me.  

Karen Kirton   

It's great to see you here today. And one of the things I want to talk to you about was one of your really excellent shorts that you have on LinkedIn, and it was more up my alley, I guess, which was around purpose and values. So if a business owner says, you know, we just don't have time to work out our purpose and values, what's your response? 

Jason Le   

I think that, you know, figuring your purpose and your values, a lot of business owners will probably think it's not that useful in the beginning, like I certainly didn't in the very beginning of me starting my business, but to someone, what I would say now, who doesn't have enough time, I think that you kind of need to, like, think about why you need to have that in the first place. Like you certainly have enough time to try and grow your business, or want your business to actually succeed, and in order to do that, you kind of need the purpose and the vision and that clarity around that to kind of give context as to like, why I'm so into purpose, vision, mission, core values is actually because, like, my business mentor, actually mapped out that in order for me to grow my business, I really needed to have these core Things like figured out in the first place, because having your purpose, your mission, your vision, it actually is intertwined into every part of your business, like who you hire, how you deliver the work, who you serve, it's all connected. So if you don't have time to figure out your purpose or your vision or your your mission, then you're basically saying that you don't have enough time to grow your business. Or, like, you know, improve your business. And that's in that way, 

Karen Kirton   

yeah, it's very hard to market yourself if you don't have clarity around that. Kind of, like, if you don't know your target market, for example, people that say a lot, everyone's my target market. Yeah. What's your response to that? 

Jason Le   

Yeah, well, like, if you if you talk to everybody, then you're talking to nobody, kind of thing. And I always look at like, you know, some of these big corporations or just businesses that they say that they serve everybody. And I just look at them as like, kind of, almost like, businesses without a personality, like you look at them, you're like, they don't care about anybody. They just, they just want your money. Yeah, and this is very generic, exactly. So you know, the businesses that don't have that clarity around why they exist, who they serve, you know what, what the whole point of their business is? Yeah, it's very hard to kind of stand out in that crowded market. Yeah, you just become the same as every other business. 

Karen Kirton   

So what's the difference between a purpose that's real and purpose that's just marketing copy? 

Jason Le   

Yeah, I think it's really funny. Because, like, I always find it really funny when, you know, when you like, look at a really big corporation, it's something that always happens with really big organisations, like, you know, the fortune 500 and you look at their core values and like they're all the same, which is like, Oh, we're a values based organisation, and we leave lead with integrity. And it's like, you read it and you're like, what does that actually mean? Who do you stand for? I don't get who you are. Kind of thing. I think that the difference between like values or like a purpose and mission that's real versus like just marketing speak is, does it actually resonate with a certain person? Does it like, feel authentic and real? So it should kind of attract a certain type of persona or people and detract other people away as well. So for example, like, probably one of the most, like, one of the biggest companies world, Facebook, they have this core value around, like, move fast and break things. And it was just obviously to try and attract people that were, like, trying to innovate or trying to do some cool things, but in the pursuit of that, you're going to break some stuff. So it's fast paced, so it's supposed to, like, attract a certain type of person, but also scream out and say, if you're not a fast paced person, you're not trying to do amazing things, you don't belong here. And I think that's the difference between, like, an authentic purpose or a vision or core value, versus something that's just like values based organisation. And yeah, lead with integrity. 

Karen Kirton   

And yeah, I think the main ones are integrity, collaboration, trust, yeah. So how would we actually see that translating in marketing results? So what would you expect to see to improve first in an organisation that's really nailed that, yeah. 

Jason Le   

So how does it translate? And I think that this is like, where my my brain, kind of like, went through a paradigm shift after working with a mentor, and he was like, in the beginning, I had a bit of identity crisis, or just doing a bit of everything in marketing, speaking to everybody. Also, like attract like, the marketing also works to attract talent as well. It's not just attracting. Clients. It's also attracting talent. And without some sort of clarity around your your values or your mission, you're basically speaking to everybody. You attract random clients. You also attract random employees. How it should kind of like, improve your marketing, both on a talent acquisition and like client perspective is like having it very clear, so that it influences the words you use, the services you offer, your delivery mechanism, like, how you even do day to day processes. So for example, like, for one of our core values is really around like, like results and making sure that there's an ROI attached to it. Because, you know, when I started the company, it came from, like, helping my dad and him not getting results from other people. So one of the core values that I established was I really wanted to, like, demonstrate ROI really early on for a lot of businesses. So if that's one of my core values and purposes of me generating the company, everything that I speak about, and also every service that I offer must align with that purpose. So if I, for example, I had team members come in and say, Hey, why don't we do like this additional service? I think it was like, like programmatic, like display marketing and things like that, like some some services that were just like, a little bit far away from demonstrating ROI early on. And then for me, it was like, Well, no, I can't do it because it doesn't align with the narrative of the company of me demonstrating ROI early and quick. So how does that influence everything? It's like, it influences the way you speak. It influences why people come to you, like everything should align with the narrative. I think, 

Karen Kirton   

yeah, I think it's a great example. Because, yeah, I often talk to people about, you know, it's the lens through which you make decisions in your business. And so that's a great example of you go, well, rather than chasing all the bright, shiny things, because that's easy to do. Yeah, it's actually coming back and going well, actually. Does it? Does it serve that purpose? Yeah. And we mentioned, you know, the usual values that come up that are cringe worthy, let's say so. Any tips for how do you turn those kind of values into marketing messages that aren't generic, that aren't bland, that aren't cringe, like, how do you bring that brand personality through? 

Jason Le   

Yeah, that's such an interesting one. Because, like, I think, first and foremost, understanding that once you develop your you know your purpose of the company, your mission, your values, why you exist, it is so much easier to then answer all the rest of the questions of Like, who do we target? What do we say? What do we offer? So as long as you make that very clear, then how can that translate into like, the copy and the creative? I would say that. I mean, it's different for each company, but it actually kind of answers it itself. So again, I'll give you a really good example. I actually did, like, a tutorial with, like, the QUT students and in their marketing degree. And then one of their exercises was, like, there's a cohort of, like, literally 100 students, and they were tasked to just come up with a random business idea, a name and a product, and it was just such a vague question, right? And then there was so many random names and ideas and and like the look and feel of the products were just so completely random. And I spoke to this, this one group of individuals in a group, and I asked them what the purpose of the company was, the vision, the mission, etc. And eventually got out of them that they wanted to serve the elderly market because they couldn't chew food and chocolate was their product. So they were like, a lot of elderly people can't enjoy chocolate anymore. I'm like, Okay, so that's your mission, your vision. You want elderly people to experience chocolate again. So how does that relate to everything else? The packaging, the typography, the words you use, so that, because they identified, the purpose of the brand was, we want to help elderly people, or, like, you know, a million seniors enjoy chocolate. Again, that was the core message, or the purpose. Then the messaging was around everything, like you've you, you love the taste of chocolate, but you forgot what it feels like. Oh, you can't chew anymore. Even to the typography of the packaging was like in old lettering, and it was like colours that it would be nostalgic to so I think to answer that question is, once you identify the purpose who you serve, the core values the mission, it actually answers everything else you then know, like how to cut through of what words to use, what pictures would resonate. Because if your mission is so clear, it. Would, it would literally tell you that this makes sense, 

Karen Kirton   

yeah, and to take that to what you're saying before about goes into the employee experience as well. So if I have someone that says, Well, I don't want to work with that kind of product, like, I'm not interested in helping elderly people eat chocolate, then that's clear, right? Like that becomes an immediate, like filter of the type of people are going to want to work on that, versus, hey, we sell chocolate bars. Yeah. So, yeah, that's great. I love that someone came up with that idea. Very creative. So you kind of mentioned a little bit about when you started the business. So you started your business during covid to help your dad. So can you tell us a little bit about that? 

Jason Le   

Yeah, yeah, yeah, so. And it's such a funny story about, like, how it all kind of like is intertwined. But basically, I was working at another marketing agency. This was back, like prior to 2020 but like 2019 and of 2019 going into 2020 I was stood down because covid had hit Australia. Nobody knew what was going on. And a lot of business owners, including my dad, who runs his own like small tiling company, he was struggling, like losing a lot of business, and pretty much lost all his business, and he was like the sole provider for our family. Back in the day, I was still living at home at the time, and I I saw firsthand, like, my dad coming home stress, like, hey, we don't have enough money to, like, you know, pay for these bills. And just like, we need, we need business. And I was like, oh man. Like, this is really, like, this is really bad. And he's obviously marketing at the time wasn't working, so I just had a crack at trying to help him with his marketing. I jumped on into his business boots on my website, ran some ads, did his SEO within like three weeks. I think I made him, like, 20 or $30,000 or something. Was pretty insane. And then my brother's best friend, similar situation, landscaper, lost all his business, helped him. Same thing occurred, got him amazing results. Then it like occurred to me. I was like, wow, like, I have a skill set, and I think I really need to help people like my dad, because I saw, like, firsthand how much of an impact it had, because, like, if he doesn't make money, he can't put food on the table for his family. It's not just business, it's actually inside into, like, personal life as well. And then I kind of like, said this, like statement out loud, as you do, kind of like an epiphany, right? It's like, Man, I wish there was, like, a way that I could partner with businesses on their journey, right? It sounds like a cliche movie, like, situation, like I genuinely being serious. I was like, I had that moment. And I was like, Oh, I love that word, journey, journey. And then I looked it up on like, domain.com, wherever it is, and I GoDaddy tried to find the name, and some New Zealand Company took it. So I was like, Ah, damn it. I just kept removing vowels until I got the word j r n y. So it's actually, like, people think that word comes from like, like, it's just j r n y, but no, it actually stands for journey. So journey digital and, yeah, it's like, how that relates to everything. It's like, well, first and foremost, the purpose and the reason why I wanted to start a business was to help people like my dad get a result from their marketing to actually help them provide and generate money for them to live achieve their goals. So I wanted to partner with businesses and get them results. How do I do that? Okay, journey, digital. What services do we offer? Well, we only offer services that actually get people, more clients, more more more business, and that's why we offer like advertising services and SEO, or just things that actually generate more inquiries for businesses. And that's kind of like that full circle of like, I first actually identified why I wanted to start the business in the first place, that actually informed the name of the company, and then the services we offer, and then who I actually target, which is like businesses, like my dad, everyday local businesses. 

Karen Kirton   

So yeah, that's awesome. I love that, because a lot of people don't have that epiphany or that this is why I'm doing it. And often for people, it's actually really hard process to get into what's the actual purpose, because I know, when I speak to business owners, and we do purpose of values workshops, try and uncover these like, well, we're just here to make money. It's like, no, like that. That's the outcome of what you're doing, but it's not why you're doing it. Everyone has a reason, and I love that. Yours was like, so like, before you even started the business, yeah, you knew that. So that's excellent. And I think, yeah, that goes to the reason why you've won different awards. So what can you tell me about that? Because sometimes with awards, people say, you absolutely, as a small business, you absolutely have to chase awards. Other people go, Yeah, I'm not sure. What are your thoughts as a marketer, like, are awards worthwhile? 

Jason Le   

Oh, it's such an interesting one. I feel like I think you you kind of need to be somewhat in. In it to be considered, like, part of the Big Boy and the big players in town, kind of thing. But I don't think it matters as much. I certainly didn't like Chase it or, like, won Business Awards, like, and this is like, I'll kind of talk about, like, how I got the awards in the first place, and then, like, whether it, like, fully matters, I will. I'm really big on narrative and storytelling and like, why I started the company, and I'm even throughout my content, throughout everything that we do, it's always about the mission. I'm like so, so bullish on that. Because of that, I've always attracted employees from various different backgrounds that really resonated with my story. So early on, I was able to attract a lot of talent, because they were like, wow, I really believe in your your why? Like, it sounds really cool. I want to join you on this business. And that kind of just kept spiralling to the point where word got out and other people like, wow, this, this story of yours sounds really compelling. And then I was some awards you kind of, like, actually nominate for these awards that I actually like won, like, the Lord Mayor, they actually, like, completely, like, nominated me, and they're like, Hey, your story sounds really amazing. I don't know if you know, like, the selection process for an award, it's actually, like, quite rigorous. Like, they they they put you in front of a panel, and they like, grill you, and they just ask you, like, a gazillion questions. You just have to, like, yeah, just like, answer back. But I genuinely believe, like, so I won this award, which was like, Lord Mayor is like, Business Person of the Year, or something, like that Young Business Person of the Year, yeah, yeah. But what I find really intriguing, I just genuinely believe maybe this is a bit of imposter syndrome. I don't think I actually deserve that as much as, like the other people that were on that, like that list of finalists, but I think I want it because of my purpose and my why. So there were businesses that were bigger than me that were more successful, yet I still won it. I genuinely believe the main reason why I won it was because of the story as to why we started in the first place, you know. And that comes down to, if I didn't have that, like, why in the first place, I would never, have never even be considered to win the award, let alone winning it, as well as to like, whether it matters or not, and like, should you do it? I think it's like, the if you don't have it, you really want it, but once you have it, it doesn't matter, kind of thing. 

Karen Kirton   

But that's pretty cool to say. I was a young business person here, and you're also one of the top 50 business leaders. Like, you know, 

Jason Le   

yeah, it sounds so like, it's like, feels like, kind of like an imposter, in the sense where you're like, what does that even mean? You know what I mean? Once you get it, you're like, just sounds like a title. But when you don't have it, yeah, for sure, like you feel like you're not as, like, legit compared to these other businesses at the end of the day, like, I don't think it matters as much the external validation, I think, like as long as you know internally that you're doing things the right way, I think, but again, easy to say once you have it for sure. Yeah, yeah. 

Karen Kirton   

Now we've spoken a lot about purpose and mission, vision, values, if someone listening really just doesn't have that in place, what would be your advice for one thing that they could do this week to start to really uncover and think about this a bit more? 

Jason Le   

Yeah, I think you need to kind of sit down and actually ask yourself, like, what do you want? And really, like, be extremely selfish about it, like ask yourself what you want personally, and then it should uncover some things in terms of how you should structure the business and the purpose of that. So what I mean by that is like what you don't want to do is confuse, like the purpose of your company, and write down, like, a bunch of mission vision values that don't actually mean anything, because it's just a bunch of noise. It's just the marketing jargon. I think it genuinely needs to mean something, and that's how, that's how it becomes really compelling. Like, obviously my story is so personal and intertwined with, like, my dad and my family. That's why it's true, and that's why it carries so much weight. And like, people aren't stupid, like they actually know. You can feel the energy when a founder talks about how much they believe in the company, versus someone that's like, again, values based organisation, like, integrity, collaboration, yeah, nobody, yeah. It's like, these are the bare minimum traits of a company like that. That's the whole point. So you need to first question, like, why? Like, what do you want? And be very truthful about it, I think. And then then analyse the business and be like, Well, who do you want to serve? And, like, why? And being very like, like, pretty brutal on that. Like, you don't want to lie about it. Do you want time and freedom? Like, you know, do you want all the money in the world? Sure, from a selfish perspective, like, personally. But then how does the company then feed into that? Like, is there a compelling reason why this company started in the first place? Is there some sort of like, demographic you want to serve or help? I think that's a good place to start. You just need something you want to meet. It needs to be something that people can tie themselves to, some sort of narrative or a story. So it doesn't necessarily need to be, like the craziest thing in the world, for example, like it can be. It can be as something as simple as that we want to help X, Y and Z person, or 10,000 people like come out of poverty, or something like that. I don't know. It just needs to be something that employees can be attracted to and stand by in terms of a vision or a mission, versus just doing the work itself. 

Karen Kirton   

Yeah, quite often it comes down to, it is in the founders head somewhere, the reason why they started the business. But sometimes it just takes a little bit more uncovering. So like I could say that, you know, I started the business because I wanted to work flexibly, which is true, but there was actually a bigger reason behind that, which came from my background, and wanting to, you know, have workplaces that actually people want to go to every day. So that's why we say our purpose is to create workplaces and engage and inspire. Because if you're not feeling like that at work, then you're not going to feel like that at home. You're not going to be very nice to your spouse, your kids, your parents, your neighbours, like so, you know, there's a choice that we all make as business leaders. Do we want to actually create a great workplace because that will help society? Or do we just want to, you know, pay people the minimum? But, you know, it takes a while to kind of think sometimes for founders to dig that out and then to put the marketing, yeah, around, it can take even longer. 

Jason Le   

I think it's usually like a lot of founders usually would be solving their own problem. That's a lot of the time, like, oh, they were frustrated with something, so then they created this company to then solve that thing. And that's a great like, starting point to, like, determine your purpose, your mission, your vision, all these things. Or if you, if you were just like, you saw a gap in the market, then it's obviously on behalf of somebody else. So like, I wanted to help like, for me, I want to help people like my dad, you know, I want to help X, Y and Z. Like number of people like my dad achieve their goals through digital marketing or something like that. So then it's a little bit more compelling. And my mission, personally, is more tied to people like my dad. It's not actually about me, but I get more satisfaction I'm helping people like my dad. So for my business, that's what people can then be attracted to. So then, like employees, when they're reading their job description, or like, when they like want to work for my company, they're like, Wow, I actually vibe with that. I want to help other people too. I want to do these things. I want to come on board into your company. So, yeah, I think it's really interesting when, like, I find some some businesses out there that are quite successful, and they they're always like, Oh, I struggled to, like, find talent, or I can't find anybody to, like, work with me. I'm like, yeah, why would they work with you? Like, you're just compelling reason. Yeah, there is zero compelling reason, like you don't even offer a competitive salary, let alone like a reason why they should work for your company versus the other company down the road, because there's no story. There's nothing to even tell people. 

Karen Kirton   

Yeah, now we're at time. But my last question that I like to ask people is, if there was one thing that you wish that you wish that you knew earlier about running a business or being a leader, it was a little bit accidental for you as well. Yeah. So is there something you wish you knew earlier and that you could share with everyone today? 

Jason Le   

Yeah, I think the thing that I wish I knew earlier, because I'm a bit of a a over thinker. I like in the beginning of me starting the business, I kid you not, I literally had the idea. I had that epiphany moment. Yet I spent three days building 100 page business plan. I literally wrote down, and I opened up a Google Doc, and I did a SWOT analysis. I read all other things. I talked about the pricing models and external competitors, because I literally spent days building out this document and validating it was just like it was so clear, like, people needed help. I could help them, yet I still spent so many days, but let alone, like, years, like for years I wanted to start a business, and I just never did it. I never pulled the trigger. And then what I realised was like, as I've gone through this business journey, you learn things, you do things, but you realise that every other business owner kind of doesn't know what they're doing until they learn how to like overcome it so they become they. You. They confront problems as they come, and then they might not know. But if you don't know, call you get help, or you just solve it at that point. So I wish someone told me that, like, it doesn't matter how prepared you are or how much time you take, you're never gonna really know how to run a business until you just run the business. So I think it's if I had to kind of be super concise about it. It's just start earlier and just confront the problems as they arise. Because every other business owner is doing the same thing. It doesn't matter how experienced they are, 

Karen Kirton   

yeah, that's so true. And I think that's one thing you discover as a business owner, as you meet other business owners, is, oh, it's not just my problem. Like, everyone has a problem. 

Jason Le   

Yeah, we're all like, how do I solve this? 

Karen Kirton   

Yeah, absolutely. Look. Thank you so much. If people want to get in touch with you, what's the best way? Is it LinkedIn? Is it YouTube? Is it TikTok? What is it the best place 

Jason Le   

to get in touch with is probably LinkedIn. So I post a lot of content on LinkedIn, pretty active on there. So it's just Jason Lee on LinkedIn. It's Jason Le,  or otherwise, go to our website, www.jrnydigital.com.au 

Karen Kirton   

awesome, and we'll put those links into the show notes as well. So thanks for joining me. It's been great to have you. And for those that are listening, if you receive value from this episode, I love it. If you can leave a rating or review over Apple podcasts or Spotify so someone else can find the episodes to help with their business. Episodes released on Mondays, so click subscribe, and you'll be notified of when it's available. Thanks so much for joining. If you have any feedback, questions or ideas for future episodes, head on over to amplify hr.com.au, or connect with me on LinkedIn, and we can start a conversation.