The Mystery in the Fields: Exploring Crop Circle Phenomena

The mysterious phenomenon of crop circles has captivated our collective imagination for centuries. As we explore in this episode, these enigmatic formations aren't just modern curiosities—they have roots stretching back to ninth-century France and beyond, raising profound questions about their true origins.

From the earliest documented cases like the 1678 "Mowing Devil" pamphlet describing perfectly cut crops that "no mortal man was able to do the like," to the explosion of increasingly complex geometric patterns in modern times, crop circles have evolved from simple rings to elaborate fractals and mathematical sequences that challenge conventional explanation.

The most compelling aspect of our investigation might be the apparent "response" to humanity's first interstellar communication. When scientists led by Carl Sagan beamed the Arecibo Message toward distant star cluster M13 in 1974, they couldn't have anticipated that 27 years later, a crop formation would appear in England mimicking their binary code—but with crucial differences suggesting silicon-based life forms rather than our carbon-based biology.

While the confession of Doug Bower and Dave Chorley in 1991 that they created hundreds of formations using simple tools like planks and rope seems to solve the mystery, scientific analysis reveals characteristics difficult to attribute to human pranksters: plants gently bent rather than broken; exposure to microwave radiation causing node elongation; magnetic anomalies within the formations; and "ghost patterns" persisting for years after the original circle disappears.

Perhaps most curious is the statistical correlation—98% of unexplained formations in southern England appear over chalk aquifers, excellent conductors of electromagnetic energy. Yet alongside these serious scientific puzzles exists the delightful discovery that in Tasmania, wallabies high on opium poppies created their own crop circles while hopping in dazed patterns.

Whether you're a skeptic or a believer, the crop circle phenomenon invites us to question our assumptions about communication, consciousness, and our place in the cosmos. What messages might be hidden in these fields, and who—or what—might be trying to reach us?

Transcript

Josh 0:04

aliens yes but maybe no. Welcome to the show. Welcome back. We were doing a count. How many episodes is this? If I counted?

Travis 0:25

correctly which I'm not guaranteeing this would be episode 17. Holy crap, yeah, we're starting to know things.

Josh 0:33

Well, speaking on my behalf, I haven't learned shit. Let's start over. Welcome to the show. Aliens, yes, but no with Josh and Travis. I'm Travis. Why are you talking so fast? Because I fucked up the intro.

Travis 0:50

Oh, who are you? I'm Josh.

Josh 0:52

This is another worldly podcast, as ambiguous as our title.

Travis 0:56

That's a wrap.

Josh 0:57

Okay, good, we got it All right. A wrap on the intro. Jeez, what a rough start.

Travis 1:01

What did we do last week? I?

Josh 1:03

never know. I always ask this question because I never know.

Travis 1:05

I know we did a quiz for this Uh-huh man. What did we do? It changed my life. I know that Sky battles oh, how could we forget sky battles? That one was so epic.

Josh 1:16

It was so cool we absolutely forgot it once we hit turn off podcast.

Travis 1:22

Well, in our times of doubt, all we had to do was say Sky Battles, and then we'd believe again. Yeah, yeah, it was fantastic.

Josh 1:27

Yep, when I'm looking at my life and I'm just thinking, I don't know if I can do it again, I remember that Sky Battles is a thing that theoretically existed, and then I'm like, oh, thank God.

Travis 1:39

Yeah, I do the same thing, and then I make up my own sky battles too.

Josh 1:42

Yeah, sky battles are like my lasagna. Use a Garfield reference.

Travis 1:46

I'd rather you not.

Josh 1:47

Yeah, I kind of hated myself for using that as a reference. So yeah, we were talking about sky battles. I don't remember necessarily where we landed on it, just the concept of it Fucking rules.

Travis 1:56

I think we landed on there was a lot of old documentation and we can't prove it Right, but we can't discount it. I mean, for me I couldn't discount it, especially with the LA one I think you landed on it was nerves.

Josh 2:11

Yes, because everything was so heightened. This was right around World War II.

Travis 2:15

Yeah, it was three months after.

Josh 2:17

Pearl Harbor, and so everybody was on the look.

Travis 2:20

They're ready.

Josh 2:21

On the watch? Yep, yeah, so because this is the 17th episode Special. I thought it would be nice to get a little bit of feedback. And so, before the show, josh said oh well, guess what? Through my editing, I found that we can get feedback. It's going to be an AI doing it.

Travis 2:37

Yeah, it's harsh, okay, but great, we're going to take these criticisms like champions.

Josh 2:44

I'm really scared.

Travis 2:45

No, it's, it's good. It is good. I do not have a history of dealing with criticism very well. Well, luckily this is not a real person criticizing you, just uh, zeros and ones. I first asked for some gentle criticism cause I wasn't ready and it was okay. And I said, could you be a little less gentle? And the AI said, all right, you asked for it. I don't know if I'm ready for this. A rambling mess. Your conversational style is just an excuse for aimless rambling. You jump from topic to topic like a caffeinated squirrel and it's impossible to follow. Get a script, or at least a damn outline, and stick to it.

Josh 3:21

We have an outline.

Travis 3:22

We do have an outline. We don't always stick to it. We have an outline we do have an outline?

Josh 3:24

we don't. This is really it is.

Travis 3:27

I asked for it. And then skepticism is shield. Your constant dismissal of anything out there makes you sound like a closed-minded know-it-all. You're so busy trying to sound smart that you're missing out on the actual fun of exploring these topics. If you're going to be skeptical, you should change the name of the show to things that don't exist, according to us.

Josh 3:48

I feel like that is a personal attack on me and I'm being read for filth here. That is very upsetting.

Travis 3:54

That one does seem aimed towards you. Yes, it does. I'm wondering if I should ask it for criticisms for each of us individually.

Josh 4:02

Oh, so that's, you just put my name in there.

Travis 4:04

No, no, I said it's like I really need.

Josh 4:07

I really need something to talk to Travis about, to fill those awkward silences that we have before the show. Please give me something mean to say to him. He's always so nice to me.

Travis 4:14

How can I get Travis to believe I have AI on my side? We're going to get you, OK. Well, so then it says structure. What structure? This podcast has less structure than a bowl of jelly. It's just two people talking about whatever pops in their head. It's chaotic and frustrating to listen to Get some organization or you'll lose any listener. That doesn't have the attention span of a goldfish.

Josh 4:35

Okay, that's good. That's good, Good criticism. So we're not podcasting anymore. I don't know how to change this.

Travis 4:43

No, I think it's fun not podcasting anymore.

Josh 4:46

I don't know how to change this. No, I think it's fun. Maybe this is something that we revisit every 17 episodes. So on the 34th episode, we're going to go back and see if it's changed its criticism. Yeah, so good, new segment maybe. Maybe, hit us up in the comments. Yeah, let's open it up to listener feedback, which was, I think, another criticism. We don't have enough listener feedback.

Travis 5:03

Honestly, we don't have listener feedback yet. We haven't received a lot of emails because, as of now, there's only four episodes released and we're on 17. I don't know if they need to know that, but today we're talking about one of the big topics, the topics that I had some kind of information about even before I delve into this whole world.

Josh 5:27

Yeah, this is something that we saw happening in real time in our life. Right, we saw these things play out.

Travis 5:33

Yeah, I remember some of them. So today we're discussing one of the strangest mysteries of modern times. Are crop circles the work of mischievous artists, a natural phenomenon misunderstood, or could they be evidence of something far more extraordinary? So for centuries these strange formations have baffled farmers, scientists and skeptics alike. Some believe they're nothing more than the elaborate hoaxes, clever tricks played under the cover of darkness. Others are convinced they're something else Messages from another world, glimpses of a hidden technology, or even result of a phenomenon beyond human understanding.

Josh 6:08

Yeah, like intergalactic gas stations. Yeah, and these are just the road signs that direct you there.

Travis 6:13

It could be. Now that you said it, I 100% believe it. Okay, I believe everything I hear and see. So, crop circles they might seem like a modern phenomenon, but they haven't just been recently. They go back for centuries, maybe longer, before anyone had drones, gps or even electricity. Strange formations were appearing in the fields around us. From what our researcher found, one of the earliest was the ninth century in France, but it was kind of I don't know. They talked about pagan practices and them going and picking up seeds from a circle formation to use in a fertility ceremony.

Josh 6:49

But I mean Right, but that is actually a way of collecting seeds is just by mashing plants down. That was a primitive way of collecting seeds.

Travis 6:57

Oh, I thought you were saying walking in circles, yeah.

Josh 6:59

I mean, and walking in circles? You could walk in a square to collect seeds, it's any geometric pattern, not the pagans, they did circles.

Travis 7:06

They love their circles. Yeah, 1678, there was the news pamphlet titled the Mowing Devil and that was kind of discredited a little bit. This one was different than all the other crop circles because the crops were actually cut, not bent. So it's considered an early example of folklore related to the mysterious patterns.

Josh 7:27

Mm-hmm, how were they cut? Would you say laser precision.

Travis 7:30

They were saying that it was cut. It wasn't laser precision, but it was so perfect.

Josh 7:36

Did they have lasers back then in 1678?

Travis 7:38

Aliens probably did. They said it was cut so perfect that a human wouldn't be able to do it. Because I mean back then what they were using? Sickles, mm-hmm yeah. So they said it was just too perfect Scissors, shears Possibly.

Josh 7:50

It could be shears, yeah.

Travis 7:52

1686, robert Plott, a professor at Oxford, writes about and draws pictures of a circular formation appearing in fields near his home, attributing them to flashes of light. He his home attributing them to flashes of light. He also notes animals avoiding these areas, which is interesting, yeah. And then 1880, john Rand Caprone, an amateur scientist, writes a letter to nature.

Josh 8:13

which is funny. He wrote a piece of paper down and then just threw it in the woods.

Travis 8:16

Yeah, he's throwing his letter into the ocean. Yeah, he describes circular areas of flattened crops formed under suspicious circumstances after a storm in surrey, suggesting cyclonic wind action as a possible cause okay.

Josh 8:30

So what do you think about those josh after reading that?

Travis 8:33

uh the devil. I truly believe that satan showed up.

Josh 8:38

No, I well. The story is that a guy wanted to have his. He had like three acres of land and he wanted to cut. He asked another farmer to cut it and there was like a bit of a disagreement and he said he'd rather have the devil do it. And that's how this started. And then there was a fire that happened and then the next morning it looked like it was cut.

Travis 9:00

Interesting. It's weird that people freaked out about it, so someone was lying somewhere.

Josh 9:05

I mean yeah, I mean it made it into the calling the news. Sometimes calling something like the mowing devil is a little Rumpelstiltskin-esque, where it's just like kind of a fable that ended up getting printed instead of told orally.

Travis 9:17

Yeah, that could be Like their story, or it was a slow news day? Yeah, it was a slow news day. They're just like looking around whatever and they day they're just like looking around, whatever, and they're like we just we really got to print something yeah, a new giraffe was born at the zoo.

Josh 9:29

We've got the newspaper boy standing out front just eager to deliver a paper. We got to put something out no, I don't know.

Travis 9:34

I mean this kind of goes back. I mean these are so old. It kind of reminds me of the sky battles a little bit, where it's just I don't know how they wrote and talked. I'm not a professor of ancient scripts, yeah, and some of these are so old that it's kind of hard without context of the time. But it does show that people are fascinated, even in the older times, enough to keep record of it.

Josh 9:58

Well, do you think this was an isolated experience? Or they wrote about this one specific experience because they'd been noticing these trends happening?

Travis 10:05

I think it was an isolated event. I mean it was a pamphlet just for that one farmer's field about his oats being cut in circular patterns overnight. But I mean people were spooked back then too. They didn't really have science, so anything science or anything out of the ordinary day would spook people.

Josh 10:25

So there's a transcript of this Hartfordshire woodcut right 1678, the one we're talking about. The mowing devil yeah, the mowing devil, or strange news out of Hartfordshire being a true relation of a farmer who, bargaining with a poor mower about the cutting down three half acres of oats upon the mowers asking too much. The wording on this is a little weird. It's antiquated. The farmer swore that the devil should mow it rather than he, and lo, it fell out. And that very night the crop of oats shewed as if it had been all of a flame but next morning appeared so neatly mowed by the devil or some infernal spirit that no mortal man was able to do the like. Also how the said oats lie now in the field and the owner has not power to fetch them away.

Travis 11:08

So he's saying that he potentially cursed the field? Yeah, like he summoned the devil.

Josh 11:13

I don't think I should do it. The fucking devil should do it Interesting. And then he came, and then the devil was like you know what I never do anything half-assed. I'm going to make sure this looks good.

Travis 11:21

I've been a bad boy long enough. I'm going to do something nice.

Josh 11:24

Fire's kind of my thing.

Travis 11:25

Yeah.

Josh 11:26

So we're going to show fire, so people know it's a devil, and then it'll be precisely cut. Hey, I'm all for it. Slow day in hell, too, the devil's just like. You know what. I think I really missed an opportunity Ruling over the underworld.

Travis 11:50

Great, very fulfilling. Maybe not for me. I think that I should have gotten into landscaping. It's possible that humans today are so disconnected from the land and spirituality that olden times they were connected and could tap into what a lot of people doubt exists nowadays.

Josh 11:57

Are you saying that the land, then, is like the phones now?

Travis 12:00

I'm just saying magic could have existed at one point. We're so connected to our phones yeah, we are. I'm looking at one right now. So'm just saying magic could have existed at one point. We're so connected to our phones. Yeah, we are.

Josh 12:06

I'm looking at one right now.

Travis 12:08

So those are old ones, these are just examples in the olden days that have come up of circles in crops, but what really has the world enthralled is the modern day ones, because that's where we live in the modern day. Yeah, sometimes, sometimes I'm in the future. Do you think of?

Josh 12:25

the past.

Crop Circles: Ancient History to Modern Day

Travis 12:26

I don't think about the past too much, but I think about the future a lot, and then I just get sad. I think about the past all the time. So in the 20th century, as sightings of UFOs become more common, reports of crop circles exploded and what were once simple rings in the grass became sprawling, complex formations of geometric shapes, spirals and fractals. Some witnesses have even reported seeing orbs floating above fields before the appearance of crop circles.

Josh 12:51

So you're a math guy. Can you explain to us what a fractal is?

Travis 12:55

Yeah, no pressure. Is the fractal, the image that, no matter when you zoom in and out, it is still the same image. What's a fractal?

Josh 13:05

It's a shape that just repeats. So a fractal is a mathematical shape that exhibits a repeating pattern that appears infinitely complex. Fractals are self-similar across different scales, meaning that any small part of the fractal resembles the whole. Each one relates to the bigger.

Travis 13:22

So a small piece looks like the bigger piece, but a bunch of small pieces make the bigger piece, I think. So that's kind of what I was saying, like whether you zoom in or out, it still looks the same. I kind of feel like I was on it a little bit.

Josh 13:35

Exactly Nailed it.

Travis 13:36

Yeah.

Josh 13:36

And they're created through a continuous feedback loop that involves repeating a simple process over and over. Fractals are often found in nature, such as in trees, clouds, mountains, rivers, coastlines and seashells. So think of like a conch those horn shells that you see. A lot of people you know.

Travis 13:50

Is it a conch or a?

Josh 13:52

conch. I don't know a conch, that's how I've heard it.

Travis 13:55

We could both be wrong. It could be Sanche. Yeah, maybe it's sandwich Sanche. So there's a lot of things in modern times, a lot of science. I mean thousands and thousands. So we're going to kind of just touch on a few.

Josh 14:08

I'd say probably like hundreds, not thousands and thousands.

Travis 14:11

I mean it's worldwide right and it's been going on, for we're talking about modern day. Yeah so. 1932, archaeologist EC Kirwan observes dark rings in a barley field and stoutened down, noting the barley was lodged or beaten down. 1937, a British science journal reports circles found in a barley field. Includes one of the first photographs of a crop circle. In 1940, David Wood reports making crop circles near Gloucestershire using ropes. What does that mean? Using ropes, making crop circles?

Josh 14:40

near Gloucestershire Sure, using ropes. What does that mean? Using ropes, crop circles near Gloucestershire.

Travis 14:46

I would imagine he was wrapping ropes around it and then pulling them down. Or maybe he was using the ropes to hold the things down in a circular way, like stakes and ropes.

Josh 14:56

Okay, so that would explain some of the controversy around crop circles that we'll talk about the two British engineers that use sticks right or two plank. They used a plank of wood and rope and were stepping on it and they said it was breaking the plants. You could see where they were bent or had snapped. Yeah, it was breaking and bruising, so like using a rope would probably rectify that and be a little more gentle, which we are seeing in some of these other documentations of crop circles right Maybe.

Travis 15:25

Maybe, possibly. I'm not a crop circle scientist, that's a seriologist. Yeah, we found that out. I was hoping you'd remember, because I did not remember A seriologist One who studies crop circles.

Josh 15:37

Well, yeah, it comes from it's Greek, greek, for I believe one of the greek gods, cirrus, maybe cereal cereal, the gods, the god of cereal, cereal aria, but yeah, that's essentially where we get the word cereal, from which is grain. Yeah, the god of harvest.

Travis 15:55

Yeah so 1945, a balloonist just a funny profession working for the raf parachute training school, takes a photograph of a crop circle. 1952, the us air force investigates circles found in kansas. And then, 1963, sir patrick moore, an astronomer, investigates flattened circular and elliptical areas in wheat fields in Sharon, noting spiral flattening. Hugh Ernest Butler suggests lightning strikes as a possible cause for similar craters.

Josh 16:27

Sorry, I got lost. I was looking up balloonist jokes. Oh, I saw a lion get into a hot air balloon basket. It caused quite an uproar.

Travis 16:39

Oh, come on now you. So another current modern sighting 1966.

Josh 16:44

Really nailing the landing on these balloon jokes. Oh my gosh.

Travis 16:49

Get it, I do. 1966, a farmer named George Pedley you might say we're full of hot air.

Travis 16:55

Oh, my gosh, get it, I do, I will get all of them. A farmer named george pedley was driving his tractor through a remote field in toly, queensland. Oh, now we're in australia. Yeah, this one will really get you. Suddenly he saw a metallic, disc-shaped object rising from the swamp, leaving behind a perfect circular impression in the reeds. This became became known as the Tully UFO nest. Scientists tried to explain it away Some suggest whirlwinds, other plasma vortexes, and then some said maybe it was fish swimming in circles so aggressively that they flattened the reeds. But in 2012, farmers in Tasmania also discovered mysterious crop circles in their opium fields. Turns out, circles in their opium fields Turns out, redneck wallabies were sneaking into the field.

Josh 17:42

Not to be confused with redneck Americans.

Travis 17:45

Or blue-collared wallabies or blue-collared wallabies or white-collared wallabies. Yeah, they were sneaking into the fields, munching on the poppies, getting stoned out of their minds and then hopping around in day's circles until they collapsed.

Josh 18:00

Yeah, they just had like a cool ass dance party. They got hopped up in goofballs and just like had the time of their life. I love this so much.

Travis 18:10

I think this explains all crop circles.

Josh 18:12

I'm going to start thinking about this when I'm feeling low.

Travis 18:15

Yeah, this and sky battles.

Josh 18:17

Yeah, just wallabies getting high on opium and just just living their, their best life. It's amazing oh man Wallabies.

Travis 18:25

So here's a really great one, next to the wallabies, which is always going to be number one. Nineteen seventy four, a team of scientists led by Dr Frank Drake and assisted by Carl Sagan Heard of him, heard of him, much Beamed a powerful radio message into space, known as the Arecibo message, sent from the Arecibo Observatory in Puerto Rico. It was humanity's first attempt at interstellar communication, a binary code transmission aimed at the globular star cluster M13, some 25,000 light years away.

Josh 18:56

You want to say globular again.

Travis 18:59

Globular. This message was packed with information Our DNA structure, the makeup of human life, a simple diagram of our solar system and even a pixelated figure of what we look like.

Josh 19:10

So if you look this up, you can look up the Arecibo message online or as you're listening. In fact, I encourage you to do it.

The Arecibo Message and Alien Response

Josh 19:15

Yeah, it's fascinating, we're going to talk a little bit about it. It was kind of like setting up the message so you knew how to read it right, which is important. So the top it shows our number system one through 10, not in binary, and I don't know what style of code this is, but if you look at it there's like one and it's just basically filling in squares. So you can understand this is a one, this is a two, on up to 10, right and, and then underneath that was using that same communication style or that same code. They communicated that we were carbon-based, and then I can't remember what the next couple lines are. Then there's an image of the satellite and then there's a very pixelated. It looks kind of like an Atari graphic pixelated version of a human being.

Travis 19:58

And then it shows the DNA structure, kind of like the helix, double helix, yeah Pixelated version of a human being. And then it shows the DNA structure kind of like the helix. Double helix? Yeah, I don't remember what that green stuff was.

Josh 20:06

Mutagen. That's what transformed the Ninja Turtles. Could be Green goo, globular goo Any chance now to just work that into conversation Globular? So it's a pretty clever way to communicate pretty complex information, I think.

Travis 20:20

Yeah, I would not have thought of this.

Josh 20:23

You, Josh Snodgrass, wouldn't have thought of this.

Travis 20:25

Yeah, I mean, I pride myself of thinking.

Josh 20:28

Good thing we had world-renowned science fiction writer and philosopher, carl Sagan, on the case to take care of it for us.

Travis 20:35

Was he a science fiction writer? Oh yeah, I thought he was a science nonfiction writer.

Josh 20:40

He did both. Oh, and his son also is a science fiction writer. That's cool.

Travis 20:45

So this was in 1974. They beamed all this information up into the space, into the unknown, expecting in 50,000 years that they would get a response, maybe, hopefully. Carl Sagan wrote Contact Whoa, I love that.

Josh 21:02

But in August of 2001, nearly three decades later, something did respond, but not in the way anyone expected and definitely not as fast as they expected, so 2001, we got a return answer to something that we sent out in 1974.

Travis 21:21

got a return. We got a return to something that we sent out in 1974. Yeah, because the star was 25 000 light years away. They're expecting it to take 50 000 or more years to even make it over there. So in the field next to the chilbolton radio telescope in england, a massive crop formation appeared overnight. Unlike typical crop circles, this one was different because it was an almost perfect replica of the ericebo message, but with some odd changes.

Josh 21:43

Instead of a carbon as the building block of life, the message indicated silicone which is a building block that's used in a lot of like uh, science fiction novels. It's something that's like a theoretical building block of life, because okay, I can't remember you need like four components to come together, and carbon is the most common and easy way here, but silicone also requires like four components or something like that, and so it's theorized that, you know, silicone could also be a building block. Also boron, a version of boron.

Travis 22:17

Huh, that's fascinating. It goes on describing that, instead of a human figure, the reply depicted a shorter being with large head and wide staring eyes, which, basically it just looks like an alien, your typical alien.

Josh 22:31

I like this response so much because this is you know, we talked about this on earlier shows like the universe is huge and we don't know what makes life. We know what makes life here, but because the universe is so big and the equation that could cause life in another galaxy far, far away could be something completely different and be so foreign to what we know here and are familiar with.

Travis 22:55

Yeah, we've talked about it. It doesn't make sense. Just because on Earth, A plus B equals C, you know, carbon plus all this equals life. That's not what is happening in other places. Yeah, I mean, who knows?

Josh 23:06

Fascinating Right.

Travis 23:07

In the reply, where we had listed Earth's population around 4 billion, the new message showed a staggering 21 billion, which made me think, oh, is this aliens, or are these humans from the future?

Josh 23:19

Yeah, or maybe it's like some kind of Valerian type situation. You know, the city of a thousand planets. Oh, I hope like that is that's to me. That's so wild. Like, do they have a mayor of the city that has a thousand, josh, a thousand planets? Think about a thousand earths. Imagine those town halls.

Travis 23:36

It's probably going to be like in Star Wars. It's that big room, that big tunnel.

Josh 23:40

Yeah, it's like a big stadium. Yeah, and it's just, they're all on little platforms and you get a xenomorph and an ET.

Travis 23:49

Yeah they were there I love that.

Josh 23:51

Yeah, it's funny.

Travis 23:52

But they did send in their reply their solar system and it looked as though, because the message that that we sent it shows all of the planets and then earth, the third one from the sun, the little block is up, signifying that this is where we are. When they replied, they sent their solar system and there was three planets that were raised and then another one that was something else. It was like four, basically four squares, with a empty square in the middle, signifying maybe a artificial structure, or I, no one really knows what that is.

Josh 24:27

So in the, in their response, there was like their alignment within their own galaxy.

Travis 24:32

Yeah, in their solar system, in the, in the planets, in the solar system that they live in. So the Arecibo reply, as it's been called, has never been explained and no one has ever stepped forward to claim responsibility for making it, if it was fake, if it was a hoax. That one was probably my favorite one out of all of them. I mean, there's other really great ones, but this one is super neat.

Josh 24:54

Yeah, I like it. I mean it could be faked as well. I mean it took 13 years before these two jokers admitted to making those crop circles. You never know. I mean it could be otherworldly. Yeah, because there was. What a 26-year gap. Yeah, it was a decent gap, 27-year gap between Carl Sagan's message and the return, the response yeah, that information was out there, like it wasn't put in a time capsule and buried in the dirt yeah it was known that we were trying to make contact.

Josh 25:23

I mean, this was through the 80s and 90s, you know, growing up yeah, I learned about it as a big part of sci-fi and that we had tried to reach out.

Travis 25:30

Yeah, yeah, so that was the recibo in chilbolton reply.

Josh 25:34

Yeah, so I I find this all not I wouldn't say sus, and I know that there's reports of crop circles popping up all over the place and a lot more, especially after these hoaxes in England were brought to light, right, right. Why, though, are they mostly in the UK? So the pranksters are from the UK. The two old timey, 1686 or whatever the year was Old timey 1686 or whatever the year was and then the ninth century. Those were in Europe, or, almost specifically, in the UK, part of Europe. Yeah, a lot of these that we're talking about now, like Chilbolton, the response to Carl Sagan, that was in Europe.

Travis 26:15

Why this part of the world? So there's chalk quarries under the ground in UK that are really good conductors of electromagnetic frequencies. Okay, I mean, if it's a hotspot for something like that, if they can use Earth to or harness Earth to help them create some of these messages, I mean that's definitely a possibility. But it's not just in UK, it's all around the world. It's just the ones that are above. The quarries have different attributes and they last longer.

Josh 26:42

Well, we're seeing that with the ghost formations right, when the ones the last a little longer. I was just curious why, and all of these sightings that we had talked about here, those were all in the UK.

Travis 26:54

I think we mentioned one in Kansas, but I think the big ones are in the UK, some of the more prominent ones in the realm of crop circles. Also, I think the UK media was fascinated by this and with the media, scientists in that area, they were fascinated. I don't think the rest of the world had the resources or the intrigue to delve into it. And the military as well. The Royal Military RAF yeah, they were investigating. Yeah, okay, yeah, I wouldn't say it's just UK, I think.

Josh 27:27

UK is a hot spot. No, I didn't say it was just UK. I'm just asking why a lot of these? We're talking about the ones that are in the UK, and that seems primarily where everybody is focused right. Whatever you know about crop circles come from these recorded instances of crop circles that are all in the UK.

Travis 27:44

And maybe it's because of past relationships.

Josh 27:47

Maybe the pagans I mean, we talk about Stonehenge a lot but there's a lot of hinges that are out there. Those were used and they're not really sure. But a hinge is just like a little hill that has a ditch on the inside of it and then these stones are centered around the top part of the hill and then it drops down and then there's a raised part on the inside with other stones. There are other hinges which we can talk about a little further in the reading, but they are all throughout the uk as well yeah, and maybe the pagans were in contact and were able to communicate back and forth through these signs and maybe these extraterrestrials aliens like that.

Travis 28:23

You're just like yeah, the pagans well, I mean, the pagans were the ones that created stonehenge and all these other formations. Yes, but maybe some of these older civilizations and older groups were able to contact them and that's how they're still contacting us today.

Josh 28:39

Pagans like. Their big characteristic is how tied to the earth they are. Right, a lot of their rituals and things are very I wouldn't say agrarian, because that's like more farmer, but, um, like dirt and wood and rain and forests.

Travis 28:56

They're like very earthy yeah, they were definitely, uh, mother earth influenced sure.

Josh 29:02

so, yeah, maybe, maybe they just were more attuned to the earth because that was part of their culture. There's another, I think it's just like off the coast of Australia. When you talk to them, they give you directions, like you say, how are you doing? And they're like oh, I'm doing north by northwest, but they'll give you exact coordinates of how they're facing and that's how they communicate. So they're very aware of where they are situated in the world. And so maybe pagans were like that, where they are situated in the world. And so maybe pagans were like that, where they had just developed a culture so earth-based, possibly.

Josh 29:34

You know, maybe they were more. I guess sensitive is the word I'm looking for. They're more sensitive to things that are happening here on the earth, so they could. Maybe they're more attuned to feeling those electromagnetic lines or impulses. The earth is putting off where we might feel them if pressed. But the earth is putting off where we might feel them if pressed. But it's not something that we deal with on a day to day basis.

Travis 29:51

Yeah, we're distracted. Tenfold.

Josh 29:53

I got a pocket full of electromagnetism.

Travis 29:55

Yeah, it's possible that these pagan groups were closer to what the aliens perceived as ready to be contacted than we are today, or even back then the people outside the pagan communities were very violent and evil and so that's why they were contacted or were able to be talked to and they were talking back, same with Native Americans. They had a lot of really intense encounters. They had areas marked that were potential portals to other galaxies for alien races. I mean, there was a lot of down-to-earth earthy civilizations that seemed to be a little more advanced in the contact of alien life than the normal Joe Schmo. So maybe there's something to it, possibly.

Josh 30:44

I hope we just need to get there, okay you first, you first Get rid of your phone, no so you did mention you first Get rid of your phone.

Travis 30:49

No, so we you did mention Stonehenge. Huh, 2011. On July 13th, two crop circle formations appeared in the fields of Wiltshire, england. One was near Stonehenge and the other on Windmill Hill. The Windmill Hill formation spanned over 400 feet and was arranged in a double spiral pattern.

Josh 31:10

That double spiral looks like you you know, in a cartoon, when a character gets bonked on the head and then its eyes go into like spirals.

Debunking Crop Circles: Doug and Dave

Travis 31:15

Yeah, that's what this looks like I was thinking the, uh, the hypnotizing glasses. Yeah, yep, yeah. So some researchers propose that these double spirals symbolize colliding neutron stars, a cosmic event that can lead to the formation of a magnetar which sounds like a Pokemon, an ultra-magnetized neutron star. Shortly after these formations appeared, astronomers observed the outburst of a new magnetar designated Swift J1822.3-1606 on July 14th 2011. So July 13th is when this happened. July 14th is when they observed this magnetar. It was bonkers.

Josh 31:58

I was just looking up a magnetar because I had no idea what it is. It's uh, yep, it's a Pokemon. It's got like a little U shape on its head.

Travis 32:08

Is it actually a Pokemon?

Josh 32:12

No, nope, but it could be. You believe me I did when I said it's got a little like u-shape on its head. Yeah, you can picture it. Yeah, looks like a magnet. Uh, magnetar is a type of neutron star with an extremely powerful magnetic field, about a thousand times stronger than normal neutron star and a trillion times stronger than earth's yeah you want to talk about our our guys doug and dave chorley yeah, okay uh, so in 1991 these two jokesters, doug bauer, dave chorley, doug and dave, I believe they were engineers.

Josh 32:39

they said they've been creating crop circles for the last 13 years, plus now the. The origin of that date is in flux, but it was sometime in the mid to late 70s is when they started, and they believe that it started as like a joke in a pub. Okay Right, just some goofballs goofing around.

Josh 32:58

Just a couple of goofballs, you know, they're well old and the way they did it was pretty clever. They took and we talked about this at the top of the show just a piece of board, then got a rope. They made two holes in the board, one on either end, put a piece of rope through that and then they put their foot on that board and then use the rope. You know, holding onto the rope. They would use that to smash the wheat or the grass or whatever, whatever medium they were working in at the time and you're like well, travis, that's all great and all, but how did you get these great circles? And how did they get so symmetric, symmetric, in air quotes?

Josh 33:32

They had fixed to their hat this little wire with a circle and then they would use that. They would focus on something off in the distance and just keep that. And it's not perfect, it's just like a really easy lo-fi workaround, but they would keep that in that little circle and that's how they would make straight enough lines. Now, because that was the way they were doing it, their lines weren't exactly straight and that's why when we're looking at other crop circles, they look more clean. These early versions didn't look like they weren't laser cut or like they were done by the mowing devil so sharp and clean lines. But I just thought that was a really clever way to have figured this out. I mean, you can get in and out of a field with basically things that you'd find around your house to make these crop circles.

Travis 34:16

Yeah.

Josh 34:17

And if somebody sees you walking around, you just throw a board and a rope on the ground and nobody's going to think twice about it, right?

Travis 34:23

Yeah, I think the farmers thought a lot about it, because they're ruining their crops.

Josh 34:26

I'm just saying, like these guys, if you saw somebody walking around with a board, and rope, nobody's going to think twice about what they were up to or what they were doing.

Travis 34:33

Yeah, I would think that they were working on the farm.

Josh 34:36

Yeah, or you know, you didn't want to be caught carrying this thing around. You just throw a board and rope on the ground and it just looks like a board and rope on the ground. That's true. Who knows what that could be used for. Yeah, a swing, absolutely A swing, so it could have been anything. So I just think it was like a really clever way to do that and I think, because these guys were obviously fond of alcohol, they thought of this idea and they're engineers, so they had good minds.

Josh 35:01

But I also think that they talked about it Like they were in pubs and they were talking about this prank, and I think that they found some like-minded people that maybe judged it up a little bit and they were able to get more precise circles In some cases I'm not throwing out that it's like an indicator or a road sign directing aliens to fuel or food or whatever it is that they're here looking for a point of interest. It's like, you know, when you're driving on the highway and you see those signs, it's like a historical site up ahead. Maybe that's what this is, where the aliens are coming in to observe a certain part of early human civilization. You know, maybe that's why it's near the hinges.

Travis 35:36

Yeah.

Josh 35:36

Could be right. Or maybe they love chalk. They eat chalk, who knows. Whatever it is that they're here for, like in Carol Clowns from Outer Space, they're just stopping by for a snack, yeah, it could be. Anyway, I think that that is a possible scenario that they had, you know, gotten drunk and, as you do, you tend to be a little braggadocious and you talk about some of the things that you've been up to and you know, word spread and maybe somebody else heard the story, maybe a little more inclined, or was able to improve upon this very simple idea.

Travis 36:06

Yeah, there's definitely, I believe copycats all around the world that were copying their techniques.

Josh 36:12

once these guys came forward, but they found a different way, like this was a very rudimentary way to do this, and somebody was, like you know, told their mom and dad, I want to grow up to be a seriologist and make crop circles, and then they got laughed out of their house. And then suddenly their parents are watching nightly news and they're seeing these crop circles and they're like, oh my God, he finally did it. He actually pulled it off A dad's nod of approval.

Josh 36:36

Yeah, all right, all right, all right, atta boy, you did it. We said you couldn't do it, but you did it. It's kind of like our parents with us starting a podcast.

Travis 36:44

Yeah, you're right. They're like what, I'm so disappointed. Yeah, I remember seeing this in the news. It was in the 90s.

Josh 36:53

Yeah, 91.

Travis 36:54

Yeah.

Josh 36:54

But I mean like the crop circles they were part of like international news in the 80s.

Travis 36:59

Oh, yeah, it was huge.

Josh 37:00

People couldn't wrap their head around it, and so these two guys claimed to have made over 200 of these things.

Travis 37:13

Yeah, which is a shit ton, and they had you know little diagrams that they'd use.

Josh 37:15

So they draw it out, these little patterns, and there's still today groups and organizations that make these. They use it for like advertising, like Mountain Dew has a crop, had a crop circle.

Travis 37:19

And well, those are tractors.

Josh 37:21

just like how they make the mazes, I know, but I mean like just saying that this spurred that, like they think that the reason that they came forward is because there were other copycats and other copycats were getting approached by advertisers or whatever, and then they were getting paid to go out and do these crop circles. And so these guys were like wait, we invented this kind of, in a way, not invented it, but made it more popular. Yeah, we're not getting paid, so there's also some controversy there that that's why they may have come out when they did A little bit of professional jealousy.

Travis 37:52

There is some problems with their claims, though. I mean, obviously they took credit for a whole bunch of these. A whole bunch of them were fake, but there's a big difference between the fake ones and the real ones. What do you mean fake?

Josh 38:03

They're all crop circles.

Travis 38:04

Well, there's fake ones that these guys made. Those are real crop circles. But the real crop circles that are unexplained have some.

Josh 38:12

I don't Okay, I don't like that term where real and fake, because they're all crop circles. I think you can say human and then maybe otherworldly, but they're all crop circles, they're not real or fake ones.

Travis 38:23

Well, they were imitating.

Josh 38:24

These guys weren't imitating. These guys were just doing this whole cloth I. These guys weren't imitating. These guys were just doing this whole cloth. I don't think crop circles were a known phenomena, like they are now.

Travis 38:31

I mean, there was prior reports.

Josh 38:33

Right, but I don't think these guys had access to these prior reports. This was like well before internet. I mean, you'd have to be like a historian, and these guys weren't historians, they were engineers.

Travis 38:42

So the extraterrestrial or otherworldly crop circles. They had very strange things that were not just bent plants from a plank, they did not snap, they actually were just gently slanted over all the way down and they would still grow and then they would also have kind of small mutations, the plants where scientists found out that only way that could happen was because of radiation like microwave radiation, where some of the little nodes on the stems of the plant would expand, very similar to how popcorn expands in the microwave, how it just kind of eventually pops, but these would just kind of elongate and expand. Also, the patterns got really complicated and it wasn't just a simple piece of wood or stepping on these plants. They said it kind of it moves, kind of like water, where it just kind of flows and sometimes they cross over or hatch.

Josh 39:36

Sure like a lattice.

Travis 39:37

Yeah.

Josh 39:38

Or it'll look woven instead of smashed.

Travis 39:40

So they definitely did contribute to the crop circle phenomenon. But attributing all the formations to their activities is it just isn't possible, because ridiculous amount of these crop circles have attributes that can't be done by a human, especially with primitive tools that they were using. Also, some more scientific stuff they had magnetic glaze. So when you look at it through a microscope you can see spheres of magnetized meteorite and iron in some of the formations, suggesting that the fields were exposed to high temperature events, fire, devil, maybe A lot of electromagnetic effects that we talked about before, with the chalk quarries underneath. Those are good conductors to help with that. People who have medical devices inside of them or who are pregnant, they have to kind of avoid those areas because the electromagnetic effects can alter them. Even one example where a woman's thyroid that was too big, she went and sat in a field in a crop circle for a couple hours or a few hours.

Josh 40:39

I know that sounds so woo to me, though I don't know that I believe that at all.

Travis 40:45

We don't have to believe it, but it's documented and they had doctors there observing her and watching it. Another one that you mentioned earlier the ghost formations the persistence of the crop circle patterns in the soil. Even after plowing it it's still there, sometimes for multiple seasons, so you can still just you can constantly keep seeing the crop circles up to a couple of years. And then the location correlation a study showed 98% of non-man-made formations in South England were over the chalk aquifers. There's also mathematical messages. What they're saying is that all of these non-man-made crop circles, they're usually encoded with messages.

Travis 41:25

So the Arecibo reply, like we talked about, was in binary code, communicating to us. And then the Julia set resembles precise and complex mathematical fractal patterns. And then there was one in 2008 with a pi formation and it kind of showed in a circular kind of record style way the first 10 digits of pi, which is pretty cool. So in conclusion, we've explored the history of strange formations stretching back centuries. Are crop circles an evolving form of man-made art, a message from an unknown intelligence or simply a naturally occurring formation? And it sounds like it could be all of it.

Josh 42:03

It's definitely yes, I believe it could be all. Yeah, it's definitely not none Right.

Travis 42:10

I'm with you on that. Where you know, there is a little bit of everything for sure. So when it comes to aliens, yes, no, or maybe I'm a yes-man on the alien aspect, some were man-made, we know that, but some have phenomenal proof that it was not man-made and it's not natural, especially with communicating some of these images and messages. I mean, nature can't communicate and respond back yeah, you know. So I would say aliens, absolutely. For me, I think the proof is there. What about you? What do you think?

Josh 42:45

I think it's a maybe. I don't think that there's enough proof that it's aliens. I would like to believe, because this is like a kind of clever way to communicate. I just think that it's of all the mediums you could choose to communicate to us information. Like they said, one of these crop circles was made and it looked like a non-symmetric shape and they couldn't figure it out until they put it in like a 3d generator.

Josh 43:10

Yeah, and they were able to look at it and I think that that is clever and I think they were able to make like after they put it in this generator. They were able to make something that didn't work, but that doesn't necessarily mean that that information wasn't communicated correctly.

Josh 43:24

That could have just been human error yeah, if that's if that's the case or we don't have the right things. But I I don't think there's enough definitive proof for myself to say that this is 100 yes, aliens did this. Because then, like, there is a human element to this right, there are people that were making crop circles and there is a way to do this and there has been ways to do this by man. So to say that it's aliens, yes or no, I don't think is. I don't think that does this topic justice, right? But in the context of the show, we have our arbitrary ruling at the end yes, no, or maybe I'm gonna say maybe okay, I think it backs up a galactic federation, because why would you communicate in that style?

Travis 44:07

you know? Why wouldn't you just come down and communicate with us? Yeah?

Josh 44:10

Maybe they have Like that's oh yeah, we talked about this before Like alien language. Could be something as subtle as leaves blowing across the ground. It could be something as complicated as the way you know a quarry is formed or whatever. It could be any number of things.

Travis 44:28

Or the governments are hiding that they have made contact.

Josh 44:31

Well, I'm not that's not what I'm interested in. I don't well, I am. I know we're talking about communication, the way they are trying to communicate to us.

Josh 44:40

If that is indeed what this is. Um, it's novel, it's just weird. Why is it centered around agrarian places? Like this is not done just like out in the wilds of africa. This is done on farms, so agrarian. This is where a civilization and maybe that's because this is the highest likelihood that we'll see, we'll see it they put it next to roads. More often than not, that also leads itself to being a hoax, like. If you are a human being, where are you gonna want to go? You're gonna want to go somewhere where you're not going to have to travel a thousand miles and you're going to want to be able to have people see it.

Travis 45:15

Well, what if in this galactic federation they're not?

Josh 45:18

what's this galactic federation you're talking about? I thought it was a joke. Is this serious?

Travis 45:21

No, no. What if they're not allowed to contact earth? And these are some of the rebel species.

Josh 45:30

Maybe that's okay. This is the first time I've heard this Galactic Federation talk.

Travis 45:35

Yeah, no, it's just an idea people have had that. You know there's different possibilities of aliens out there. You know there's a theory that there is a federation out there of tons of different alien species and we're not ready to join it and they're not allowed to contact us because we're primitive and potentially dangerous Cruel. Yeah, so if there's some species out there that are doing tests like abductions, that's like honey badger territory.

Josh 46:03

It's earth they're like. Well, we don't go to that side of the mountain. That's where the honey badger is.

Travis 46:07

Yeah, I think there's a handful of species out there of alien that are pushing past the lines of intergalactic law. Oh, my God pushing past the lines of intergalactic law.

Josh 46:15

Oh my God. Okay, we're getting a little out in the weeds here.

Travis 46:17

We are. But you know, that's where we get the messages right. Yeah, in the weeds, In the weeds.

Josh 46:22

Yeah, way to tie it back.

Travis 46:23

Yeah, thanks. Thank you for listening. This is very fun for us and we definitely want to keep doing this for you, but we need your support, or else.

Josh 46:36

Yeah, need your support. Or else, yeah, listen to this podcast, or else we kill this dog. Oh my gosh, that was a mad magazine cover. Oh really, yeah. I was like yeah, buy this magazine or this dog dies leave it to mad.

Travis 46:43

No, we do appreciate you listening and taking time out of your days to sure, really.

Josh 46:47

What is it to you, though? Like you're gonna be listening to a podcast anyway no, not necessarily I mean people that don't listen to podcasts are not gonna. Let's just listen to a podcast. You podcast listeners, though, you know they know.

Travis 47:00

But yeah, subscribe to us, follow us. That way you can get updates when we have episodes coming out every other week. Leave comments and reviews. Uh, get a hold of us if you think we're full of shit or you enjoy us. We'd like to hear both.

Josh 47:15

Yeah, either way, so we can talk about it on our 34th episode, where we rehash some of the negative criticisms from real life people. Maybe this time, instead of mean AI, yeah.

Travis 47:27

We don't want to have to get all our criticism from AI. We want the real deal.

Josh 47:31

Yeah, yeah, we do. We want the real deal.

Travis 47:33

That leads us to our teaser for the next episode. So it is the baseline quiz time. Oh, my goodness, what the fuck is this Project Stargate? I have no idea. Next episode we are going to talk about Project Stargate and I know nothing. Maybe the TV show this has?

Josh 47:54

MacGyver in it. Was he in Stargate episode? We are going to talk about project stargate and I know nothing.

Travis 47:55

Maybe this has a tv show. This has macgyver in it. Was he in stargate? So we're going to be talking about macgyver and stargate and the portal to go to other earths. Yeah, maybe no project, so it's probably a government project and they always name them really cool, like the immaculate Conflation.

Josh 48:11

I think this was named after the movie.

Travis 48:14

Maybe. Well, let's find out. So first question what was Project Stargate? A A classified mission to traverse a wormhole in Utah. B A failed NASA experiment to teach chimpanzees to pilot spacecraft. C A top-secret program to research psychic viewing. Or D, A secret project to build a portal based on Egyptian hieroglyphs.

Josh 48:37

That's the movie or the show. Whatever I'm going to say, I think it's wormhole related.

Travis 48:46

OK, I mean, that is from my viewing of the show and movie. It would probably be wormhole.

Josh 48:54

So that's what I'm going to say. I'm going to say classified mission to traverse a wormhole in Utah. Okay, I don't know. I don't know shit about the actual project Stargate, though these are 100% guesses and I 100% did not cheat.

Travis 49:07

I or did. I Just recently saw something about psychic viewing, but I don't know if this was part of that project. But I'm gonna say see psychic top secret program to research psychic viewing.

Josh 49:21

Just based on hope, because I, I like I, because you don't want to answer the same as me, because I historically get these wrong and you're like perfect. You just narrowed my choices down from four, from four to three. That's a little easier choice.

Travis 49:36

I didn't read much about the psychic viewing, but from what I saw it was just like what. So I'm I'm hoping that this is what it is Okay. So next question why did the government invest millions in this project? A, the Soviets were trying the same thing, so they wanted to beat them to it.

Josh 49:55

Okay, so that phrasing right there. Okay, well, let's get through it and then I'll work my way through the answers. Go ahead.

Travis 50:01

B a congressman had a dream about it and convinced his colleagues to move forward. C an independent test subject in Cuba successfully predicted the future. Or D the project was inspired by a president's secret meeting with aliens.

Josh 50:16

Oh my gosh, okay, so that first one. Uh, the soviets. That definitely puts it in the 80s, the soviet union is not around anymore. And that first question doesn't say when. No, it was a what when project stargate started, so I guess I can't rule that out. Congress wanted to dream about it and convince his colleagues to move forward. I hate that answer.

Travis 50:38

I really hate that answer. Yeah, that made me mad.

Josh 50:40

Yeah.

Travis 50:41

Because if it was true, which I mean, things like that have probably happened. That's bleh.

Josh 50:46

I hate it.

Travis 50:47

I'm going to go. Which lines up with the psychic viewing was the future one. An independent test subject in Cuba successfully predicted the future.

Josh 50:58

Okay, future one an independent test subject in cuba successfully predicted the future. Um, okay, I'm struggling with this one because I don't like how reactionary stargate sounds if you know the soviets were doing it and we're just like, well, but I guess that's kind of how our entire space program started, so maybe I? I also don't really like president having a secret meeting with aliens. I just think that's wild. I'm gonna do the soviets. They were trying the same thing. Okay, same thing being, who knows, a wormhole maybe maybe next question.

Travis 51:27

One declassified idea for using remote viewing in combat was does that mean I was on the right? Train predicting enemy movements by reading chicken bones. B using mind bullets to incapacitate enemies. C teleporting military units via telekinesis or. D staring at goats until they die. That's really funny. There is a movie men who stare at goats until they die.

Josh 51:52

That's really funny. There is a movie Men who Stare at Goats. That's really funny. It's about psyops, which is that that was a real thing. I'm going to do that.

Travis 52:01

The goats.

Josh 52:02

Yeah, okay, I like mind bullets too though.

Travis 52:05

Mind bullets. Yeah, the chicken bone one seems a little. I'm going to go with goats too. I mean they're all weird. I mean they're all weird.

Josh 52:12

They're weird, they're all weird. I mean we're getting into some weird ass shit here.

Travis 52:15

Yeah.

Josh 52:16

This is fun. This is going to be a fun one.

Travis 52:17

Yeah, okay. Next question when did famous remote viewer Joe McMoneagle physically travel to? A the Palace of Versailles in 1793. B the Lost City of Atlantis. C ancient, once inhabited Mars, or D the center of the earth? I know this answer.

Josh 52:35

Do you? Yeah, do you want me to answer first? Then yeah, lost city of Atlantis.

Travis 52:39

Okay, I am going to say ancient, once inhabited Mars.

Josh 52:45

Okay, that was the like the two paragraph thing I read about this Looks here Uh, as though I said ancient, once inhabited Mars too.

Travis 52:53

Oh how convenient, All right. Next question, though I said ancient, once inhabited mars too. Oh how convenient, all right. Next question which of the following remote viewing operations actually worked a locating a downed soviet bomber in africa. B predicting the fall of the berlin wall. C finding saddam hussein's hiding place or d identifying the location of missing cia agents? I, I'm blown away that one of these worked, or any of these. So I'm going to say, identifying the location of missing CIA agents. I'm going to say that.

Josh 53:25

Okay, I'm going to say finding Saddam Hussein's hiding place.

Travis 53:29

Seriously, I mean yeah, I mean it could, if it's real.

Josh 53:33

He was just in a hole. I'm serious, he was in in a hole, I'm serious. He was in a hole in the middle of the desert, so people knew he was there and I feel like I read that somewhere. At least they got him. They got them close, yeah.

Travis 53:48

Interesting. I do not know All right. Last question how many different names and iterations did the US government's remote viewing program go through? A one Project Stargate was the only official program. B three it changed a few times but was mostly consistent. C five different agencies kept renaming and restructuring it. Or D more than 10, it went through so many names it was hard to keep track.

Josh 54:14

I think I'm going to go with one, because Project Stargate sounds fucking rad. It does, and I think they're like one and done.

Travis 54:21

Can't change it. My nephew came up with this name, yeah.

Josh 54:25

Roland Ebrick movie.

Travis 54:26

I'm going to say more than 10. Okay, because that way it would be messy and hard to track. Okay, all right, it would be messy and hard to track. Okay, all right, let's view our accuracy.

Josh 54:37

Damn Yep. Obviously I was wrong, because all other questions were about remote viewing.

Travis 54:43

What was Project Stargate? It was a top secret program to research psychic viewing.

Josh 54:49

I wanted it to be about wormholes. God damn it. Yeah, maybe a future episode.

Travis 54:55

Why did the government invest millions in this project? You were right the soviets were trying the same thing, so they wanted to beat them to it.

Josh 55:04

Of course. Never, josh, never outrule spite that's true.

Travis 55:09

Yeah, I said it was. The test subject in cuba successfully predicted the future. I was. We just wanted to beat the Soviets.

Josh 55:17

Next one. I knew it, I knew it, I knew it, I was right, I knew it. It's the funniest one, and it was right.

Travis 55:24

One declassified idea for using remote viewing. Combat was staring at goats until they died.

Josh 55:29

That is insane. That was an actual program and they made a movie out of it called the Manuscript Ghosts. It starred George Clooney. Wow.

Travis 55:37

That's okay, I don't understand it, but I'll take it.

Josh 55:42

Don't make any sense. It was a wild ass movie. I remember it was a lot of fun to watch.

Travis 55:46

You'll have to watch it. Next question when did famous remote viewer Joe McMonagle physically travel to?

Josh 55:53

Ancient, once inhabited Mars.

Travis 55:57

That's what I got, and it's right. Oh man, you are on it unprompted. Wow, yep, this guy, remote, viewed into the past at a once inhabited mars. Prove it.

Josh 56:07

I just did no, with my words. That guy needs to prove it, prove that he did it well, we'll do the research.

Travis 56:13

We'll figure it out which of the following remote viewing operations actually worked. I said identifying a missing c agent. You said saddam hussein. The answer was locating a downed soviet bomber in africa. Last question how many different names and iterations did the us government remote viewing program go through? The answer was more than 10 probably for that reason I was saying they just want to make it messy and confusing. Which checks out? That's what they do to the finances as well. Let's make it real messy okay.

Josh 56:45

Well, this is going to be a blast I'm going to start doing that to our pets. Just rename them every day, just to make it confusing for everybody they just stop responding to you just gaslight everybody in my house, yeah, uh, and the dogs well, I'm stoked.

Travis 57:01

This was my hope at the very beginning of the quiz that we would talk about this. I don't know really anything. I literally read two paragraphs and I was like what the fuck is this? So I'm really excited. I want to know everything there is to this. I'm gonna do a lot of research and you're going to be a believer.

Josh 57:17

I will push back on that a little bit. I don't want this anybody out there, or you even, josh, I don't want this to seem like a combative podcast. I don't want you to feel like you have to convince me and I have to be skeptical of everything you say, because that's not how I'm approaching this. Podcast, yeah, podcast, yeah. I am trying to be open-minded.

Travis 57:36

There is just a lot of things that I'm going to push back on and I appreciate it.

Josh 57:38

I do believe in aliens. We've talked about this a lot. Yeah, there's just a lot of things out there that I have a hard time wrapping my head around and I'm not a 100% believer like you are.

Travis 57:47

No, I appreciate it, because it actually opens my mind up to.

Josh 57:51

That's what I want from you, Josh. I just want you to think about things a little more critically yeah, and, and I have been, and I appreciate it.

Travis 57:59

It's expanding my mind we're both growing.

Josh 58:02

Yeah, well, thank you for listening and have a great oh, do you want to thank jordan, our uh researcher, for?

Travis 58:10

music and oh yeah, and we want to thank jordan, our researcher for music, and oh yeah, and we want to thank jordan, our researcher for music. And you rule, and yeah, you do rule everything you do well.

Josh 58:26

I was saying to you, josh, but yes, jordan, you rule too oh, thank you.

Travis 58:30

Yeah, yeah, we wouldn't be where we are without you. So, thank you very much, and, travis, you rule, thank you. I was trying to figure out what was going on. Oh man, man, this guy's coughing in the mic a lot.

Josh 58:46

Yeah, I was clearing my throat.

Travis 58:48

Yeah, editing really hard To get attention. Yeah, you're just trying to get me here. I am derailing the podcast yet again, right at the end, as we're trying to say goodbye, okay, bye.