EPISODE 35: NBA SECOND ROUND TALK & PGA CHAMPIONSHIP PREVIEW

Ryan & Bean are joined with special guest and longtime friend, Patrick Abraham, to discuss the Second Round of the NBA Playoffs & PGA Championship.

NBA PLAYOFFS SECOND ROUND: 2:00-1:36:00

PGA CHAMPIONSHIP: 1:36:00-1:59:15

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:15

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to episode thirty-five of the No Blue Narrative. My name is Ryan Hefferman. To my left. Chris Bean. To my right.

SPEAKER_01 0:23

Patrick Abraham.

SPEAKER_02 0:25

And you guys heard that right. Patrick Abraham is our guest today. Patrick, how are you doing today?

SPEAKER_01 0:29

I'm doing wonderful. Thank you guys so much for having me.

SPEAKER_02 0:32

Absolutely. Christopher Robert is in Cleveland right now on a work trip, so he is not here today. He did not go to the Pistons Cavs games, but probably a good thing. Yeah, probably a good thing. But um, yeah, we're gonna be talking about the NBA playoffs today. Two series are already over, two sweeps, and then we got two 3-2 series right now with the Pistons Cavs and the Spurs Timberwolves. And then we're gonna be talking about the PGA championship as well that just got underway. Scheffler's currently in the lead with Justin Thomas and some random dudes. Without further ado, bean, please take it away.

SPEAKER_00 1:07

You're telling me you don't like Pac Eater?

SPEAKER_02 1:09

I've never heard of that guy in my life. And I'm sure I wouldn't even be shocked if he gets cut.

SPEAKER_00 1:14

No way. You think he's gonna shoot like an 80 tomorrow?

SPEAKER_02 1:18

Well, what's the what do you think the cut line is gonna be like?

SPEAKER_00 1:20

Well, right now it's pretty low because or pretty yeah, pretty low. Plus four or something? No, it's I think it would be one over right now, but that's gonna change tomorrow. Yeah, that's there's gonna be, like you said, there's gonna be people that are dropping more shots tomorrow. I'll probably if my guess is uh probably three, three on or three over, four over.

SPEAKER_02 1:39

Um I mean a plus seven could be in his cards, who knows?

SPEAKER_00 1:43

Yeah, we'll see. I guess we'll just game. Um yeah, well there is uh actually one thing I do want to discuss um later uh regarding the people. Well, obviously multiple things, but there's uh uh one big thing that um later we'll discuss, but uh we'll start with uh the NBA. Um we can start with the Sixers Knicks series that was uh that was in the that had excuse me, uh the Knicks won and four over the weekend uh on Sunday. Not many close games. Uh Embiid was out for game two, that actually ended up being the closest game. Um, but the Sixers ran out of steam. I think they only had 12 points in that fourth quarter. Uh that they ended up losing by six, and then every other game was a blowout. Uh game three, Paul George was started hot. I think he had 15 early points and then didn't score for the rest of the game. And then uh just like what the Knicks did to the Hawks, uh not quite, they didn't get up, they didn't win, uh they didn't have a lead of 60, but they won by 40 in game four over uh the Sixers on Sunday. Uh do you think the Knicks Knicks are the team to beat in the East right now, boys? They won seven in a row.

SPEAKER_01 3:07

Yeah, I mean I I think one of the big things I go back and think about a lot. Um I feel like the Knicks caught a lot of heat throughout the season. They lost a lot of like quote unquote big games. Obviously, it's regular season NBA, not uh I guess not the none of the games are gonna be that big, but um I feel like they got a lot of heat, and obviously with them being such a huge, you know, big market team, there's gonna be a lot of national media attention on them all year. And I feel like I remember seeing like you know, you see those like Stephen A clips where he's like, the New York Knicks are terrible. Like all that type of stuff. Right. I I feel like I I saw a lot of that throughout the season. Um with all that being said, they seem to be clicking at the you know, absolute perfect moment, and when that happens, you uh you tend to become tough to beat in the playoffs. Obviously, they're a team that has some playoff experience, um and you have a Jalen Brunson who's gonna you know help close you games. I don't know. I um I have to say I'm pretty impressed with them. I I did not think I don't remember what my actual prediction was for this series, but I did not have Knicks sweeping, that's for sure. I thought it was gonna be much more competitive than that. I might have even picked Philly to win, to be honest with you. Um so you ask me right now, just based on how I've seen everyone play, I I think out of the East, yeah, I I would say the Knicks are definitely the team to beat.

SPEAKER_02 4:25

Yeah. I don't know. I'm not I did pick Knicks in in seven against the Sixers. But you know, and Bead was also hobbling around every single game and also missed a game as Bean mentioned. OGN and Obi has that hamstring issue. I don't know how he's gonna be doing. You know, though we know those linger. I don't know if he's gonna be a hundred percent or not. Mitchell Robinson's been banged up as well, but I still think I said this before the podcast or uh our first podcast.

SPEAKER_01 5:02

You your exact quote, sorry to cut you off. Nixon 7, but but very tempted to take Philly. That's the exact quote. I got the receipts pulled up.

SPEAKER_02 5:10

I just said Nixon, I just said I had Nixon seven.

SPEAKER_01 5:12

No, I know, but very tempted to take. I'm just confirming your.

SPEAKER_02 5:14

Yeah, I was I was tempted. Uh I thought it was gonna be a a lot harder of a series, like you said as well. It makes me wonder what would have happened if Boston beat Philly in the first round. If we had a Boston Knicks matchup, because the Celtics would have had home court. I I still said before the podcast, whoever wins the Cavs Pistons series, or before the playoffs, whoever wins that series is gonna make the NBA finals, and I'm sticking to that. I think both teams would beat the Knicks.

SPEAKER_00 5:46

Yeah, I think uh Yeah, we'll have to see who wins. I'm obviously we hope for the Pistons, and we know what the Pistons did to the Knicks in the regular season. Uh obviously the Knicks won last year in the playoffs. And if the Cavs end up uh winning over the Pistons, I think they, you know, they had the more talented roster, definitely a deeper roster, and that's why I think I picked I d I I definitely picked the Hawks to beat the Knicks, and I think I picked the Sixers after how they closed out the last round to beat the Knicks. So I always had one team that I'm off about in the playoffs, and it's definitely been the Knicks. Um but I mean I they won seven in a row. I don't I don't know how many times they did that in the regular season, definitely not too many. Uh but they knew, you know, this year, and obviously new coach, uh new coach, new coaching staff. Uh you're obviously gonna have some kinks during the regular season. Bless you, P.

SPEAKER_01 6:47

Thank you. Bless you, Pat.

SPEAKER_00 6:49

But they're thank you. But they're uh they're kind of like the Wolves, and ironically, Kat has played for both teams, even though the Knicks were the three-seeded. Obviously, the East was a little bit weaker this year. And um they're just one of those teams where they turn it up in the playoffs, and obviously they've had a lot of postseason success in the last five to six years. So they know what it takes to uh to make a deep run, and they haven't made it a finals yet, but this is probably this is probably their best chance, honestly, to win the east and probably an NBA title, because obviously the West is uh, you know, always a crab shooter, and they're definitely the stronger conference. And then the East, you know, you got obviously in Indiana uh beat them last year, and they're gonna get healthier. Um we'll see what Boston does. Teams like the the Pistons and the Hawks are pretty uh are pretty young. The Wizards, who knows what then? They just won the lottery, and then they have AD and and Trey Young, the the Magic, who knows if they can figure it out, but they're pretty they have a young roster, so you know you look you go down and uh you look at the teams in the East. This is probably the next best chance to win the East, and if not the finals. So they're probably I would say right now they're the team to beat. Um just because I I trust their their um their depth and their lineup a little bit more than the other two teams. And uh you know, if Pistons won last night, it would be a completely different scenario, but they are you know they're going to Cleveland tomorrow and they haven't Cleveland hasn't lost at home yet, so um but yeah, I think this is their best chance for sure for the Knicks.

SPEAKER_01 8:42

I think whatever happens, like just I feel like that Eastern Conference Finals series, whether it's Cavs or Pistons, to your point, half, I I think it's like it's gonna be a really entertaining series. It's gonna be a lot of fun either way. We can talk about this later, but I it feels like OKC is just inevitable. Um and you know, however you feel about them as you know, a fan or not a fan of uh that kind of brand of basketball, I I think it kind of can make for a potentially you know a little bit less interesting matchup in terms of finals. Um I mean obviously who knows the the Pacers last year took them seven, so you never know what's gonna happen. But I I just feel like uh yeah, that Eastern the East has been like a lot more fun to watch than the West this year. I don't know if you guys feel that way, but I feel like the Eastern Conference matchups have been a ton of fun.

SPEAKER_02 9:31

Outside of the like Timberwolves series, yeah. Like the Nuggets Wolves and the Nuggets or the Wolves Spurs. There hasn't really been any intriguing Western Conference matchups. Like Lakers Rockets sucked, OKC Suns, OKC Lakers, trash, like all trash.

SPEAKER_00 9:49

Well, yeah, OKC is a big part, obviously. I mean, they haven't lost yet in the postseason. Uh yeah, the Timberwolves post series have been great. I'm hoping that uh that game goes to game seven. We'll discuss that series very shortly, but yeah, um, that's what happens when um you know you got a team as good as the Thunder. I guess we can go there. Um that series, OKC Thunder. The only thing I got to say on the Thunder, we can get into the Lakers in a second. But we'll start with the winners. I told you this, I think last week, half before before the pot, or maybe it was after, I can't remember, that just because the Thunder were playing the Lakers, now the media is starting to attack them flopping and and this and that, and being obviously very aggressive on defense and getting away with foul calls. It's like they've been doing this forever for years, and now they want to bring it up just because they're doing it against the Darling Lakers.

SPEAKER_02 10:56

I feel like SGA has been called a flopper for longer than this series.

SPEAKER_00 11:02

I uh probably on Twitter I would I would say he has, but like the national media. I'm just talking about the talking heads. They're just they're calling them out now just because they played the Lakers.

SPEAKER_01 11:14

Yeah, all of a sudden it's this it's this epidemic, it's a huge problem, right? Where like you're right, half it like I feel like people that like again, people that actually watch basketball, like I've like I've kind of avoided watching Thunder games because of it. Like I'm kind of just like ah, like I'm like less interested in seeing that brand of basketball. I mean, we were kind of I was kind of joking about that in our group chat where I was like the Thunder being a dynasty in my mind is like kind of bad for the NBA. Like as a I just like I can't I'm trying to picture like 15 years in the future and like yeah, the Netflix documentaries coming out about the the OKC Thunder, and like that just has like no I don't know, there's like I just have no interest in that whatsoever, as opposed to like, yeah, like the Warriors run or like LeBron going back to Cleveland or the LeBron and the Heat, like the Spurs dynasty, like you can go on and on and on and on and on, and like I feel like I hold all of those teams with like such reverence, and I just like don't hold that same level of reverence for OKC, and like you know, that could be for a myriad of reasons, but I I think the head of the snake, unfortunately, is SGA, and when it comes to SGA, he's an incredible player, probably one of the best, if not the best, in the NBA. But you you can't bring him up without talking about flopping, and that's just really, really, really unfortunate, if you if you ask me.

SPEAKER_02 12:36

Yeah, I mean, the Thunder, this like I'm I'm with you, Pat. Like I like watching the Lakers, and like I truly like couldn't even focus on the Lakers Thunder series. Like, I'm like trying to watch the games, and I'm like, I already know what the outcome is.

SPEAKER_01 12:51

They weren't even worth like staying up to watch. I was like, I'm going to bed, I'll watch the first half and go to bed. And even it was the same, it was the same script like every game, or like the Lakers would keep it close, and then just like they just couldn't keep up with them in the second half or in the fourth quarter, and yeah, just I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 13:07

Yeah, the only game that was close was at in the end was game four. And even then, I didn't even watch it. Yeah, I was like, Well, it was it ended at 130. No one in the East Coast is staying up for that. But um, yeah, the to the flopping point, it's what what gets me is because you know, every team, not every team, but most teams have players that that flop and whatnot. It's they just mug you defensively and they don't get called for anything, they don't get called for fouls.

SPEAKER_02 13:40

So the Dortcher Chamber. Yeah, Dortcher Chamber.

SPEAKER_00 13:44

Exactly, and and Caruso is always you know banging you down low, dare I say.

SPEAKER_02 13:49

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:51

So and and well, it's basically their whole roster. So I I think that's when people get you know fed up too is you know their best player obviously looks for a lot of contact and then they get up, they get away with a lot on defense. Um, I think what's saving that to your point, P, about the uh documentaries down the road is if they have a big rival like the Spurs, and people were already hyping that up this year because the Spurs um had their not their number in the regular season. And so now I I'm sure the NBA their front offices are hoping that they that the Spurs win the series so they can get that to kind of start that rivalry in the playoffs as well. And because the Lakers and Spurs in the early 2000s, when they were winning, they played I think four times in the in the playoffs. So I think that's the one saving grace is if the Thunder have like a big rivalry in the West, and maybe they don't win as much as we think, but we'll but we'll see. There, I mean they're I mean they have uh what a second year guy in AJ Mitchell that you know is filled in for Jalen Williams because Jalen Williams has obviously battled injuries the whole year, and it's it's flawless. Like you don't even see a drop-off offensively.

SPEAKER_01 15:12

He's on the best contract in the NBA.

SPEAKER_02 15:14

Yeah, I think it's like three years, eight million or something like that.

SPEAKER_01 15:16

8.7 or something.

SPEAKER_02 15:18

I mean, he like this team is the best, like it's the deepest team I've ever seen in my life.

SPEAKER_01 15:25

100%.

SPEAKER_02 15:26

They run freaking 13 deep. You know, they got Hardenstein, Chad, SGA, Dort, Mitchell, Jalen, Jalen, Caruso, Joe, Wiggins, Casey, McCain. Like where's the where's the gap? Yeah, where's the gap? It's insane.

SPEAKER_01 15:40

Like, I have never like you could take out those guys, some of those guys being starters on like most NBA rosters. Crusoe's the 10th man.

SPEAKER_00 15:48

I know it's crazy. And McCain, they got him for I don't even know what they got. He if he would have stayed healthy, he probably would have won rookie of the year. And Philly just trades him at the deadline. I I don't I didn't get that. Like, imagine if he was on Philly, like Philly would be set for for a while too. Um, but yeah, that you know, we talk about uh higher Javi Roseman all the time in NFL, ironically being in Philly, and then uh Sam Preste in Oklahoma City and the NBA. It's uh he's I mean second to none when it comes to roster construction and making deals. And then I mean they still have they have a lottery pick this year, and they're and we're talking about a team that's I mean it all stemmed from the SGA trade, obviously, but um they obviously needed to you know build a roster, and they're they're they're a juggernaut for sure. I mean I it's it's kind of hard to like picture them not being in dynasty.

SPEAKER_01 16:50

Yeah, I think the last thing I'll say about that just on the dynasty piece, like yes, all these are correct, like they're one of the like they are one of the best teams ever assembled. Like they're gonna go down like that. And I think being you you brought up a good point about like bringing up the Spurs as a rival. I feel like part of it for me, obviously, like the flopping, like we talked about, but just generally speaking, like there's like this perceived level, like how the players on the Thunder carry themselves and like express themselves. It just to me always has read as like very like immature. Like, yeah, you know, obviously, like you can talk about like the clothes and the outfits and stuff, that's fine, but like you how many times we bitched about like SGA and Jalen Williams like at a press conference, just like sitting on their phones scrolling, and then you add like a Jared McCain who's doing TikTok dances, and like you're just watching this shit, and it's like, come on, you guys are NBA players, like act like adults a little bit. And yeah, you get your you get your star player saying, I'm not thinking about how I could have ate more, I'm thinking about how I can win eight more. It's like fuck you, dude. Like, I just like all of those different things make them. I feel like if you're outside of Oklahoma City, just makes you like they're off-putting, like it's very off-putting when you and then when you contrast that with the Spurs, you know, whatever you feel about Wemby, I know we we know some Wemby haters. Um Maben. Yep, shout out Maven. But I I feel like you compare some of them and in like their young players, you know, Stefan Castle, Devin Vassell, uh Harper, like you just don't I think dog. Yeah, like you just don't get that same I at least I don't, I don't think that same way about them as I do, you know, Dash GAs, the J Dubs, the Chets, J Will. Like, I just don't I don't I don't think about them in the same way in terms of like even just like the some of the off-the-court stuff. And I feel like that to me is like one of the bigger driving factors, which I know is like not basketball related at all, and like is probably at on some level a little unfair, like we should be grading them on like what they do on the court, but like it's basketball, man. It's the uh you know, it's it's reality TV, it's drama, you know. Like unfortunately, off-the-court personalities like play a factor, and I think they always will. So I don't know, we'll see. Hopefully, yeah, hopefully we're talking about something else in a couple years, and we're talking about you know the crazy epic battles that the Spurs and the OKC Thunder had in the West, and we kind of forget about some of this more, you know, minutia personality stuff. But just from where I'm sitting right now, it seems to be like a really big, glaring, like negative or cloud hanging over OKC that like genuinely makes me not want to watch their games, which is yeah, again, it's unfortunate and kind of sad.

SPEAKER_02 19:30

I think there's only one team that could take them home, and that's the Spurs. I think I think they're the only team in these playoffs that could that could at least bring them seven games. Just like not even because the Spurs are like the best team left, it's just because they have the biggest like outlier, like in Wembinam. Like, just because like at least you can you have a freaking eight-footer in the paint who can stop something, you know, like no like no other team has that.

SPEAKER_01 19:59

Like, I just go bear, but obviously different, like still a defensive player of the year. Like, I let's not I don't want to like belittle, but I get what you're saying, 100%. I mean, no one's he's literally an alien.

SPEAKER_02 20:09

Like the Wolves they've played OKC and we've already seen what's ha what happens. For sure. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure like if it if OKC was not in the playoffs, I would want the Wolves to win that series. But I hate OKC so much that I'm willing to cheer for the other team just so they have a better chance to beat OKC.

SPEAKER_01 20:26

Yeah, I think you're right. Like, I I agree with you. Like, I I want the Wolves to beat the Spurs, but I do I agree, like, I feel like the Spurs will play them a little bit more competitively. So for that reason, I'm kind of like, okay, like I'm I'm cool to see the Spurs move on for sure.

SPEAKER_00 20:39

Yeah, and uh the Wolves are banged up. I mean, obviously DiVincenzo is the only one out for the year, but they're playing with like I don't know how and is playing so so effective. And I mean that his like his knee bent sideways. That was what two two and a half weeks ago, and he's still playing at a high level. But I get what you're saying, Hef. I'm rooting for the T-Wolves as well, but I think you're you know you're right. Obviously, the Spurs give them um they have the best shot to beat, to beat the uh OKC for sure. Um all right, the Lakers. Me and uh P were uh watching the Pistons game yesterday, last night at a bar, and uh I was like, I'm I wanted to hear your thoughts about the Lakers, and he's like, save it for the pod. So I guess we'll start with uh the big looming question is LeBron gonna return to LA?

SPEAKER_01 21:36

So yeah, I I'm and forgive me, I should definitely know this. Is is his contract up? Like, is he does he need to sign a new deal? Is that the yeah?

SPEAKER_02 21:45

I think I think he signed like what before last season was it like a one year fifty million dollar deal or something? Just crazy. Okay. So very team friendly contract.

SPEAKER_01 21:57

Yes, yeah, he's trying to free up that cap space. Um no, I shout out Justin Rose, just uh sunk one from the bunker.

SPEAKER_02 22:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:07

No, I I yeah, I mean, I is he is LeBron gonna be back a hundred percent. I I think so. I I mean I he's gonna be a late he's gonna retire a Lakers, but I I think more so kind of what we were talking about, yeah, and I want to get into like I was thinking about this, and I feel like generally speaking, LeBron going to the Lakers was like a net negative on his legacy. I I don't know if he feels that, he probably doesn't, but like he went to a team where don't get me wrong, he has a ring, but the expectation I know I was waiting for it. The expectation is is champion chips with an S. And you talk to like diehard Lakers fans, he's been there a fucking decade. I know. And they they they don't they don't acknowledge him as like a like no as like their guy. Like they're just kind of like whatever, he's on the team, whatever. And you're like, holy shit. And so I think about that, and then I think about post-bubble, the teams that they've put out, and the seasons they've had, and where they've fallen short every single year, and I start to think and I go, fuck, who knows? If he had stayed in the East, not necessarily with the Cavs, I don't know where he would have gone, who knows? Take the other opposite big market team. What if he went to like the Knicks or something crazy like that? Like, I have no idea. But I just think of what he did and the path he took, and I'm kind of like I think that's like a net negative for him. Like, I really do. Like, you go to a team, you're gonna retire on a team, it's gonna be the the team you play for the longest, damn near in your entire Cleveland, but right the second longest a decade at this team, and like you ask the fan base, and they're gonna show you zero love. Like that's crazy to me.

SPEAKER_00 23:57

Yeah, I think they well, obviously, a couple factors. The Kobe, obviously, for sure, you know, a lot of those, especially like our generation, loved Kobe. That's you know who they grew up watching, they fell in love with with that team because of Kobe, Kobe and Shaq. And then um I think they might have felt a little differently too if that when they won the championship, it wasn't in the bubble. Because like obviously fans weren't at the arena, so they weren't able to really celebrate it that championship uh at all, really. Yeah. Um and then I I think A D, you know, being hurt too, and that's eventually why they traded him. Yeah, he he played in mostly every year in the playoffs, but he's he was always hurt. So having a guy, I mean, A D was uh probably the number one in that team, too. And then after they won, he was always second to LeBron because he was never healthy when it when uh when it came time to the playoffs. So I think that's I mean it's it's it's fascinating for sure. And then obviously he did all those movies and TV shows. Um so it wasn't just basketball when he got there too, it was everything else.

SPEAKER_01 25:13

Obviously, he's ingrained in like LA culture, and I think that's like the biggest driving factor for like why he is there and why he's finishing his career there. I just think I'm thinking about it from a basketball standpoint, and like in my mind, I mean maybe he's cool, he's probably cool with the resume with what he has. He probably feels good about, you know, I'm the best or second best player of all time, and like he's cool with that. And like I just feel like I'm looking at it from yeah, like the basketball debate perspective where I'm like, why not try and why not try and maximize the uh the number of rings you can go for? And I feel like he had to know going to the West and going to the Lakers was like not, or at least staying. Like once they blew that bubble team up, like in my mind, I'm like, I mean, who knows? Maybe we maybe we shop around and see what's out there, maybe go back to the east, a little bit easier to get there. You know, we have a chance, we get lucky, etc. But that's obviously not how it shakes out. And I mean, he's not gonna win another ring, like, unless he goes to the Thunder. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:17

I saw like a I saw a report that like LeBron's willing to just take the like veteran minimum to like compete for like a team, but like I just don't see him.

SPEAKER_01 26:26

No, I don't I don't buy it because why didn't he do it? Why didn't he do that when his contract was up last year? Yeah, he could have done that the last four years.

SPEAKER_02 26:33

Oh, good call on the kid. You're right. Why would he leave because his son's still there? Like I I still think if he does that, it would be for the Lakers. But yeah, the net negative thing is interesting because like, yeah, just that one ring, and I just looking back on these teams, I just feel like every single season we would we would go into like a Lakers like season and would be like they have the star power, but they just have no depth and they just suck out outside of like two to three players.

SPEAKER_01 27:01

I think my my my worst year was was 2024. I felt like confident about that team to like make a run.

SPEAKER_00 27:13

They won one playoff game. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:15

That was and I remember just watching that shit and going like I I'm done with the I'm done rooting for this fucking team because like holy shit.

SPEAKER_00 27:22

It was 80's last year. Um was that against the Nuggets? Last full year, yeah. So they lost to them in 23 in the conference finals, and they played him in the first round.

SPEAKER_01 27:33

Honestly, that year too, both years, back to back. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 27:36

And they always played them tough too. Like they I remember like every single game was the same. The Lakers would go up to like a 10-point lead, and then like the second half would start, and then Jokic and Jamal would just go crazy. So yeah, I've they were really close. I didn't even like I kind of forgot how close they really were to making another finals. But yeah, I just think the only chance, like I think there's no chance LeBron leaves. Uh I think he's gonna stay with the Lakers, uh, hopefully on a friendly, team-friendly deal this time. And hopefully they could sign someone. Like, who do you get though? You can't trade for Giannis because one, I don't think you have outside of Luca outside of Luca, I don't think you have the contracts to really maybe like a Reeves like sign and trade involved.

SPEAKER_00 28:19

They don't yeah, I don't like they don't have the picks though.

SPEAKER_02 28:22

They don't have the picks.

SPEAKER_01 28:22

They have nothing, yeah. They have nothing to like play with. I think their first pick is like 2031 or something.

SPEAKER_02 28:28

Yeah, something crazy. Yeah, it's so crazy. With the roster they have, it's disgusting. Yeah. Like Luca, like I honestly feel bad for him. Like, one, he lost out on a hundred million because he couldn't sign the rookie like extension with his own team, with the teammates that drafted him. And also, like, his team just is so much worse. Like, in Dallas, like his team was like like they made the NBA finals, like they were really good. Like, they could have ran it back and had an opportunity. So, like, Luca's in a way worse situation. Lakers don't have a pick till 2031. The only thing that's on their side is they're in LA and they can sign people. So And you have Luca. And you have Luca.

SPEAKER_00 29:07

But they're about to give Reeves Reeves the max, and that's gonna be another expensive contract.

SPEAKER_02 29:12

You think they're gonna is Reeves gonna get the max? Like, is this like like for sure?

SPEAKER_00 29:16

Uh well someone's gonna give it to them if it's not the Lakers.

SPEAKER_02 29:19

How can you just give Reeves a max when knowing that like players like how do you like how do actually maxes?

SPEAKER_00 29:29

Like, how are they it's what they did in 23 and they're still in twenty-four he played well too, even though they lost in the first round. But the last two years he's been hurt and been horrible in the playoffs.

SPEAKER_01 29:40

I feel like they like like teams have like found a way to D him up. Like I feel like he was kind of like catching teams by surprise. Yeah. He's shifty, he gets to the he was getting to the cup, he was cutting, he's just slap he was slashing. Yeah. And I just feel like teams have found a way to to play defense.

SPEAKER_00 29:58

Well, now he would now he's like high on the scouting report, right? Which he probably wasn't, you know, three or four years ago. And then they just attack him on when they play on defense. So he's become a big liability, uh, especially late in the season. Uh so I just I don't I don't see he's like a he's a three on a team contending in you know for conference finals, maybe a finals, and four on a championship team. But they're gonna pay him like a number two.

SPEAKER_02 30:30

Yeah, and being if they do that, like they're never gonna win ever. Like Luca and Reeves are not gonna lead a team to a championship. Because like if you sign Reeves to a max, like Luca already has a max, like you're you're gonna have like neither of them could play defense.

SPEAKER_01 30:49

In my mind, yeah, in my mind, I'm like how why would I sign a second player to a max deal for a team that's like we're not even contending? Like if if they were making the Western Conference finals and losing, okay, maybe you entertain that a little bit, but like they're I would not call them contend- I didn't think they were contenders this year at all.

SPEAKER_00 31:08

No, what's helped them, like they get like get a little bit of hype going in is because the lat the way they've ended the regular season the last two years, and this year they were probably would have been a three-seed if Luca and Reeves didn't get hurt to end the year, and then they were a three-seed last year, but they only won one playoff game last year, uh, and then this year they had the easiest matchup probably in the first round, even though they were playing against the five-seed Rockets. KD only played one game, and you know, we saw how the Rockets were without a point guard the whole year. So um they kind of lucked out there even though Reeves didn't play for majority of that series and Luca didn't play. And then when they played a you know, a really good team, a great team in OKC, they didn't stand a chance. Get your brooms out. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:03

Yeah, it was snoozefest, man.

SPEAKER_00 32:07

Do you think LeBron is gonna play another year?

SPEAKER_01 32:10

Yeah. I think for sure, for sure he's gonna play one more. You think he's gonna do like the farewell tour? Or do you think it's gonna be Oh yeah. So you think he's gonna announce the year before what the when he's when he's retiring? Like this is my last season.

SPEAKER_02 32:23

Well, knowing he did a 30-minute show to say he took his talents to South Beach, I'm sure he would.

SPEAKER_01 32:28

How long have we been recording for? That's crazy. It took you 30 minutes. Wow, okay. It only took you guys bet on this or something? No, no, I just thought it was gonna be way sooner than that.

SPEAKER_02 32:38

No, but I mean, he loves the attention.

SPEAKER_01 32:40

Like he obviously It's for charity, it's for the kids. You don't care about the kids.

SPEAKER_02 32:44

I I love them kids, unlike MJ. Um but uh yeah, he's definitely gonna announce it. I I don't see why he wouldn't. And like uh it would be like even cooler, like like him and his kid like on the same team, his final year, like it was just I think it would definitely be a thing.

SPEAKER_01 33:03

Yeah, I think you're probably right. But the one thing I will say, completely unrelated, changed topics drastically. I'm I'm becoming more and more bullish on Brownie James. I really am. I think he's gotten so much flack because he just has all this attention on him. He's a 55th pick, dude. Like he's progressing, he's getting better.

SPEAKER_00 33:24

And he wouldn't have gone to the NBA right away if he if his dad didn't, you know, his dad wanted to play with him.

SPEAKER_01 33:32

And do you see some of his G-League highlights?

SPEAKER_00 33:34

Yeah, he's he's good. He's good.

SPEAKER_01 33:36

Let him progress and get more confident, and like he could be a role player.

SPEAKER_00 33:40

I think it you know, his his dad pushing him to play, and it's cool that they get to play with each other, but obviously LeBron probably didn't know how much longer he had to play. But if like if if Bronny was at college for two years, and remember he basically didn't have a college season because he had that heart condition. So he played a half a year, and if he would have played one, two more years in college, he would be a lot more more, I think, better def um, he would have developed more. And in G League, he hasn't played that much either. Like and when he's played, he's been good. But uh Yeah, he is he hasn't had that much, and he played a little bit in that ra uh Rocket series, and that was definitely cool. I know you uh you were bashing a little bit half, but I mean I was kind of just messing around, but yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:32

I like seeing I like seeing him play. I like seeing him get minutes. I mean, I again like I'm not saying he's gonna be LeBron James. He's he's very clearly not going to be that. I think no one's arguing that. I just I just feel like there's like actually a good chance that he develops as a role player and like a serviceable NBA player. I I agree. And I feel like he just got such a bad break because his dad's LeBron and like he just had the spotlight on him immediately, and like there was no chance to even like develop. It was like wait, you mean he didn't get in the game his first minutes and drop 40? He sucks.

SPEAKER_00 35:00

Yeah, like exactly.

SPEAKER_02 35:02

The more I think about it, the more I'm thinking about like these older guys in the league and how like like the like the Steph Curries and the LeBron Jameses of the world who like their organizations like kind of know that like if they're paying like those people, like so like them so much money, they're probably not gonna win a championship because like you need younger guys to take that money. But like, like for example, like this like Steph Curry, he's making a lot of money. They're not gonna win anything. Like, I don't think they're gonna win a championship. Like Draymond Green, so they're they're panic trading and trading for Chris Stopps to like even give Steph like a shot a smaller shot. They're just ruining their team even more just for Jimmy Butler, a 38, 37, 38-year-old Steph Curry to have at least a chance when in reality what they like what should happen if his name wasn't Steph Curry is he would just start a rebuild somehow.

SPEAKER_01 36:02

Yeah, so we should talk about that. Do we do we think this year was the last year for the the Warriors as we as we know them? Like obviously Clay was gone, but do we think Draymond Steph and Steve Kerr, like their jobs are are not safe individually? Like, do we feel like one of the one or multiple of them might not be in a proverbial Warriors uniform?

SPEAKER_02 36:22

Well, Steve Kerr signed his contract for two years with the Warriors. Okay, yeah, yeah. So he signed that. I think Draymond is gonna be gone. I I I kind of think that.

SPEAKER_00 36:33

Yeah, he was uh during the deadline, he was his name was in a lot of rumors. Um, so he may be traded. But you know, what's kind of lost too in the in the sports world is we don't see a lot of teams or a lot of players play for one team in their career, so I'm sure he wants to finish his career. Um, but yeah, their roster construction's weird because they just like they got an aging Chrisops who's always hurt. Jimmy Butler, they got him last year, and yeah, he tore his ACL, so he's probably not even gonna be back for majority of next year, and then uh I think Moses Moody got hurt too, and he but he's one of their younger players, but he's hurt. So um they're definitely done contending. Um so it's just yeah, does trade does Draymond get traded as he finish his career as a warrior, and then does uh how long does stuff play till? You know, so I think those are the big questions for sure.

SPEAKER_01 37:41

Yeah, because you you bring up a good point, Alf, where it's like, yeah, if you're the warriors and you want to contend, like trade step.

SPEAKER_02 37:48

Yeah, like that's what it is.

SPEAKER_01 37:50

There's a there's a market for him, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 37:52

Like yeah, but he's done so much for that organization. I know it's like how do you turn your yeah? Yeah, it's like how do you fucked for a few years.

SPEAKER_01 37:59

But I look at it as like, yeah, I look at it as more like thank you for everything you've done for us, but like that you know this is a business. We're trying to win championships, we're trying to bring in more money, bring in more revenue, like, period.

SPEAKER_00 38:11

Yeah. And I maybe they trade Chris Stopps, and then they probably can't trade Jimmy Butler next year unless he comes back early. Maybe they trade him in and not this offseason, but in the season after. What about Keith Santos? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:30

Santos, what a beast.

SPEAKER_00 38:31

Um yeah, I think yeah, they're definitely in not in a good spot, but that's what happens with uh, you know, when your dynasty eventually falls off and then you gotta rebuild. That's just that's just the cycle, and and they're unfortunately going through that right now.

SPEAKER_01 38:48

Have you guys talked about the uh or have we talked about the Pat Spencer thing at all? No, what do you guys know about his like backstory at all?

SPEAKER_00 38:56

He's from Australia, right?

SPEAKER_01 38:59

He has the wildest backstory I've ever heard, like one of the wildest backstories I've ever heard. So he has always been in love with basketball. I think he was a late bloomer, did not grow until he was like a junior or senior in high school. And so he he was always too small to play basketball. I he either yeah, he either didn't play basketball in high school or only played as a senior. I can't remember the specifics. Ended up going to, I believe, Northwestern for col or no no, I'm sorry. He went to, oh, I can't remember where he went for college, but he ended up going to college to play lacrosse, was like actually one of the greatest college lacrosse players of all time, won like the MVP of the season, whatever it's called, like multiple places. I think he transferred to Northwestern. Oh you can check where he went to first. Transferred to Northwestern as a senior or as a grad student, I can't remember. Played basketball for one year, went overseas to play hoops, worked his way back, I think, at like some tryout or some sort of like basketball conference, introduced himself to oh god. I can't remember who it is, but he ended up basically talking his way onto like a G League roster, had a really good game against the Warriors. That's how the Warriors found out about him, the Warriors G League affiliate. They ended up signing him, and then he gets called up and is now an NBA player. So just like the why like can you imagine not playing competitive basketball like at all in college, being the greatest one of the greatest lacrosse players like ever, and just being like, I don't want to do that, like I don't want to play this. Like that's wild to me.

SPEAKER_02 40:37

That is a crazy story. He all also, I think it's Loyola University, Maryland.

SPEAKER_01 40:41

Yes, yes, which I think they have like a really, really good lacrosse program.

SPEAKER_02 40:45

He won the Tawar Tawaritan Award and set the NCA Division I record for career assists.

SPEAKER_01 40:50

Yeah, so he's like one of the like literally, like he's like a historic college lacrosse player.

SPEAKER_00 40:56

And now he's playing in the NBA. That's great. It just goes to show you how to do it.

SPEAKER_01 40:59

And he's talking shit too. He like hits threes, he like talks shit. It's hilarious.

SPEAKER_02 41:03

Yeah, he must have a strong Y.

unknown 41:08

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 41:09

That that has to be it. That must be it. That is insane though. Shout out Patman.

SPEAKER_01 41:15

Anyway, sorry, random tangent. I just wanted to talk about it's pretty wild.

SPEAKER_00 41:18

Yeah, uh that's a crazy story. I didn't I wasn't familiar with that P. Um Yeah, I think they're they're definitely on the like this the sun is setting on them. Um what was I gonna say? Yeah, uh I uh going back to LeBron, uh last thing I'll say is I think he I think he goes to another team next year. I think he's done playing in LA.

SPEAKER_02 41:47

Where does he go, you think?

SPEAKER_00 41:48

I don't know. It's probably like Cleveland or team in the east.

SPEAKER_02 41:54

Cleveland for a third time?

SPEAKER_01 41:56

I feel like that's the that's his only chance if he wants to like win one more.

SPEAKER_00 41:59

Yeah, it's with Cleveland.

SPEAKER_01 42:01

Which is another interesting topic. Like, he wins one more. Like, does that do any does that move the needle for you at all in terms of like his legacy or his standing? Like if he if he's already my goat. Over over Michael Jordan?

SPEAKER_02 42:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:16

He's number one. He's the number one, he's the greatest basketball player of all time. Yeah. Oh, I don't know why this is like news to me.

SPEAKER_00 42:22

No, yeah. My boo. It's just he does the boo-boo bear? It's funny because he always trashes LeBron, but it's his greatest. Yeah. It's like it doesn't coincide.

SPEAKER_02 42:33

Wins the longevity award, you know?

SPEAKER_01 42:35

Which then has to be worth something, does it not? Well, you're I was gonna say everyone else's goat was fucking on the wizards, hobbling through games barely at this point in his career, like not doing shit. And this guy's at least still playing basketball, play playoff caliber basketball, and is dropping 25 plus a night.

SPEAKER_00 42:54

And he's his numbers at least are just as good as it was when he was with the Heat.

SPEAKER_01 43:00

Which he's definitely like, he's obviously not nearly like as athletic or dominant in every facet of the game, but like he's still playing at an incredibly high level for a 41-year-old fucking guy. Like, think of other 41-year-olds, does he play Vince Carter, barely dunk anymore?

SPEAKER_00 43:15

Right. He never played. Yeah, like he's in year 23, and it's just we'll never see an athlete like him.

SPEAKER_02 43:21

I don't think so either. Remember Marcus Camby? That was really random. I just thought of him at Didn't he play until he was like 42 or something? I don't know how old he played. I think he played long. I don't know why that was the first name that came to my mind.

SPEAKER_01 43:33

I think old players who like were shells of themselves. Vince Carter is always the one. Yeah, but Al Horford can still kind of sort of play.

SPEAKER_02 43:40

Oh no, I was just trying to name old people. Oh, okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:43

Well, Steph's up there, KD's up there. They're still playing at a high level, too. Yeah. There's one guy. But like they're like Steph was hurt at the end.

SPEAKER_01 43:53

Full player coach at the end of his career. Didn't play like played like he played like four or five years, it's it felt like where he just like was not. Not playing minutes at all. It was just coaching as a player.

SPEAKER_00 44:02

No, he played, I would say it was like the last decade. Like there was like four or five years, like right when LeBron left, where I'm like, okay, this guy hasn't played. And then there was he put another four or five years, and I thought he was I thought he was tired. And uh yeah, so also another weird tangent on uh Udanus Haslam because he's on the pre and post game for the prime. Have you seen his right pinky? No, is it like it's like yeah, it's sideways. Yeah, it's like I'm sh you can't see it, but right now, but it's gotta be like a basketball injury. It's gotta be. This is how his pinky looks when you watch the game tomorrow. Look at Udanis Haslam, how he holds his left hand. That's weird, but um, yeah, so he's definitely uh the longevity goat, as good Bayless would say. Did you see his top ten list?

SPEAKER_02 44:58

Yeah, he had LeBron ranked ninth.

SPEAKER_00 45:00

Ninth.

SPEAKER_01 45:00

That's crazy. I mean, he's just uh he's a Hall of Fame rage baiter. Yeah. He's all time, he's number one at rage bait. I know he's so good at it. He's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 45:10

He plays a like a character, like he almost like he says like he's a character, but he like fully commit like he's like a method actor almost. And he full like he'll he'll find stats and support it. It's crazy. I like his list almost like how he presents it, it's like who you would have in a one-on-one. Like he's not like a actual like basketball player, like all around basketball player.

SPEAKER_01 45:36

I'd still in a one-on-one would probably pick LeBron. Like he's he's the perfect combination of size, speed, and everything out, like everything you could ask for in a basketball player.

SPEAKER_00 45:46

And he's gonna lock you down, yeah. Yeah, I I don't know. Um it's gonna be interesting, but I mean it's probably anticlimatic is he goes back to LA and plays one or two more years.

SPEAKER_01 45:58

Yeah, and they achieve nothing. And like, yeah, we still talk about them the same way we talk about them now. We're like, oh, is it gonna is it Lucas team, blah blah blah, whatever.

SPEAKER_00 46:06

But here's the one thing too where I think I could see him leaving is they're not gonna pay him on because they're gonna want to pay Reeves over him. So if he doesn't want to take a massive pay cut, which he probably is gonna have to anywhere he goes, at least on the contending team, he's gonna have to p take a pay cut.

SPEAKER_01 46:23

I I'd have to imagine m like money cannot be a motivator for him anymore.

SPEAKER_00 46:28

Like we're gonna be talking about it hasn't stopped him though.

SPEAKER_01 46:32

Is he is he worth a billion yet?

SPEAKER_00 46:34

I think he is a billionaire.

SPEAKER_01 46:36

So it's like, does he really care if he's getting paid 20 million a year or 10 million a year as opposed to 50?

SPEAKER_00 46:44

I would say we would be lying if we said no. I think it is. Just because why hasn't he took taken one in his career?

SPEAKER_02 46:51

I mean, Brady took pay cuts to when Rang's and it worked out.

SPEAKER_00 46:54

We're we would be entering year we would be entering year 24 P, and it would be his first time he's ever taken a pay cut.

SPEAKER_01 47:03

Yeah, that's a little concerning to me. At least a massive one.

SPEAKER_00 47:07

I he might have taken a little one baby ones and when he went to Miami to perform that big four.

SPEAKER_01 47:13

Well, yeah, because that's how they made it with the money work for UD, because UD was gonna walk. Yeah. And Wade, Bosch, and LeBron all took less money in order to keep UD. Yeah, because Wade was a big proponent of Haslam, where he was saying, like, this thing's not gonna work unless we have Haslam on our roster. And he was gonna walk. Because I think uh like he said Dallas or maybe San Antonio had an offer for he had an offer that was pretty good he was gonna take.

SPEAKER_00 47:38

Who LeBron uh LeBron. Oh, Haslam, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:41

And he ended up not doing it because because he was his in his mind, he's like, D-Wade, Chris Bosch, LeBron. There's no bread left for me. You're right. Yeah. Um but it obviously worked out. So I guess that is an example, but I know I hear you being it's like do you really need to make 50 million at your career in this point when you're literally like when you you most of your in I mean shit, most of his income is coming from outside of basketball at this point.

SPEAKER_00 48:07

He doesn't need a basketball income.

SPEAKER_01 48:09

No.

SPEAKER_00 48:10

And especially if he wants to win, too. But I mean, and uh another thing too, uh uh he said after was this is the first time he's ever been a number three for most of most of the season um before Luca and Reeves got hurt, and then he was the number one number one in the playoffs. And they won a playoff series with that, granted it was a uh against not a great team, but he still they still found a way to win, and uh that's another thing. Does he want to be a three or even a four on another team? But I'm I'm with you, F. I uh I can't see him retiring just because he probably wants a tour.

SPEAKER_01 48:53

Yeah, probably.

SPEAKER_00 48:54

So that's why I think he plays at least one more year.

SPEAKER_01 48:56

Yeah. I agree though, I'd like to see him on another team because again, I want to see him win a ring. And like I you ask me right now, I'm like, he's not gonna win anymore. And the only chance he has is if he goes somewhere else.

SPEAKER_02 49:06

Yeah, and it would help the Lakers too. Like if he went somewhere else, because like they're not at least start fresh with Luca.

SPEAKER_01 49:13

I mean, that's you're freeing up 50 mil, dude.

SPEAKER_02 49:15

Yeah, like honestly, if I'm the Lakers, I don't sign Reeves. Sign and trade him, maybe get rid of LeBron, trade him too. If signing who knows.

SPEAKER_01 49:26

I mean, you gotta be rebuild around Luca at this point, like fully. Yeah, like that needs to be your commitment to the future. And I don't even know how you do that without draft picks. Yeah, it's pretty hard. They're in a bad spot.

SPEAKER_02 49:37

They're screwed. They just gotta sign people. Like, I guess you gotta sign Reeves because you don't have picks. I don't even know.

SPEAKER_00 49:44

And well, and they're gonna have to sign guys like Marcus Smart, um like they did last offseason, and and just kind of guys like that who are aging, but that doesn't help you either, so I don't know. It's uh it's gonna be a fascinating off-season for LA for sure. Um but moving on to the other series in the West, the T-Wolves and Spurs, we uh all kind of agreed on the Spurs being the better series, obviously, for OKC, but P, do you have the Spurs closing it out?

SPEAKER_01 50:19

Yeah, I think originally I picked Spurs in seven was the uh initial prediction. So I guess still alive. We'll see. Um, because they're game game six is in Minnesota, right? Correct. Okay. So obviously they're gonna play in Minnesota. I I I like I like the Timberwolves chances to take at seven. I I do think if it goes to a game seven, though I I think the Spurs are gonna handle business. Yeah, man, when they get going, as much as you can talk about, yeah, whatever the again, the some of the uh stuff you don't like, I just feel like when they get going, man, they're they're they're tough to beat. They they seem to hit some real timely shots. You obviously have Wemby on the defensive end, which you can count on every single game. Um I just feel like, yeah, like I I watch whoever it is on any particular night kind of stepping in and filling that role.

SPEAKER_00 51:14

Um well, they have a like a lot of young guys that wingers that can shoot it. Yes, like Castle wasn't a great shooter at all in college, he's become significantly better. Vassel is great. Uh Dylan Harper doesn't even start, and he's obviously Champagny Keldon Johnson, sixth man of the year.

SPEAKER_01 51:35

We watched the Spurs Pistons regular season game this year and Detroit. Remember Vassell torched us, he had 27? Like they can get guys stepping up and doing that, and like and Dylan Harper's probably gonna be the best one.

SPEAKER_00 51:47

He was what the number two, number three pick last year. And that's another thing. The Spurs have had great lottery luck too. Yeah, they've only won it once, but they won the one that mattered. Um exactly, and then they've been able to, you know, the castle was great, but they've been able to develop his game, and Harper's only gonna get better. Vassell um has turned into a very good player, and then you got a guy like De'Aaron Fox running a point. Who it, you know, maybe not the most clutch guy, but doesn't you know just hit timely shots and then facilitate.

SPEAKER_01 52:25

And then I'm pretty sure he won a uh clutch player of the year a couple years ago.

SPEAKER_00 52:30

Yeah, I think that is right.

SPEAKER_02 52:31

Um I think he won the first one. Oh, there you go.

SPEAKER_01 52:36

There you go.

SPEAKER_00 52:36

Um yeah, was that the year they I think they made the playoffs?

SPEAKER_01 52:45

Hit big shots, which were definitely a requirement.

SPEAKER_00 52:47

And they developed Champney, who I liked in college, but then didn't do much with the Sixers, I think he was at, and then I'm not sure where he was. He might have might he might have just been in Philly, but uh he's been great this year, and Killern Johnson won six man of the year, so they got a deep roster.

SPEAKER_01 53:04

Thick Vince Staples.

SPEAKER_00 53:06

Yeah. Is that you or main dad? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:10

Um that's what he looks like, dude. It's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 53:14

I if Vince Staples walked in this room right now, I couldn't even tell you.

SPEAKER_01 53:18

If you Google Vince Staples after this, he liter like literally picture Vince or pit it's he looks like Vince Staples if he was eating a bunch and lifting a bunch of weights. That's what he looks like. It's crazy. They have the same like because they both have gaps in their front teeth. And like that, I feel like that's a big like similar haircuts, they both have short hair. Like, I don't know. It's like that. Show show a picture of him smiling. Show one with the teeth. Sure.

SPEAKER_00 53:46

Okay, I could see it. Is that a black guy?

SPEAKER_01 53:49

Yeah, he has a black eye on that one. I thought he said black eye.

SPEAKER_00 53:56

That's it. Um speaking of black eyes, what'd you make of Wumbie? The elbow. The elbow. Obviously, it wasn't in the it was the jawline, but still.

SPEAKER_01 54:06

I go back and forth on that because like I get that he like wasn't intentionally trying to elbow somebody in the head, at least I didn't or in the face. I didn't think he was trying to do that, at least.

SPEAKER_00 54:18

He was trying to I definitely try to hit him. He obviously he's so much taller than everyone else. He probably thought he was gonna be probably below the face, maybe like in the neck area. But they have been doing a great job of with him, like pushing him around, being physical with him, and you know, it finally got got to him in game four, and he was like, Alright, I'm gonna I see I kind of thought he was trying to just I thought he was trying to play physical too, and like not let someone rip the ball away from him, which is what he thought.

SPEAKER_01 54:51

So that's why you start. I mean, naturally, that's the motion. Now, with all that being said, regardless, I I kind of feel like he should have gotten a game, especially when you look at like some of the other game suspensions that players have had in the playoffs.

SPEAKER_00 55:03

Um they're just not gonna do that with the star. I I agree, it should have been a game.

SPEAKER_01 55:08

It matters who you are, like your consequences directly tie to who you are, and it's his first offense.

SPEAKER_02 55:13

Like if that was Beef's stew, he's getting suspension.

SPEAKER_00 55:15

Or Draymond. Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 55:17

Draymond might miss multiple games, he might be out for the series. Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 55:21

Uh a lot of it is like, do you have a history? Yeah, it's but like you he probably won't even he probably won't do anything like that again. I'd be shocked, especi in in the playoffs, especially. Maybe in the regular season of some teams. That's not his style. Yeah. It's not. But like he's I would be stunned if he ever got to spend in the playoffs just because I don't see him doing that ever again.

SPEAKER_02 55:43

No, he's not gonna do that. I don't even think that's the type of dude he is. It's just like I don't think he'll ever do that again. Like, I could be wrong, who knows? Um what I saw is marginal contact. Marginal. I'm kidding. No, it was it was obviously a dirty play. Anyone else, anyone who's not a star, as you guys said, would get suspended for that. So I think he should have gotten a game. I just think it sets a weird precedent of like, yo, like, throw bows. Like, like late in the game, like you get who knows? You get upset? Like, it's not gonna like if you're not gonna get suspended for a game, like if Wemby's not gonna get suspended a game, you could use that against it, like if you do it in the future.

SPEAKER_01 56:21

Yeah, but I think the argument is that he got ejected. So, like they felt that that sufficed as enough of a punishment because he, I mean, it was in the second quarter, right? So he missed the whole half. He missed the lost.

SPEAKER_00 56:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 56:32

So you think if that happened in like the fourth quarter with eight minutes left, he would have got suspended again?

SPEAKER_01 56:35

Maybe. I mean, that's something to think to think about too.

SPEAKER_00 56:38

Two of their three losses the uh this postseason for the Spurs, in round one, their only loss he got a concussion. Yeah, and he m I think he missed the whole half, the whole second half. And then obviously they lost game one with him, but then uh in the second round, but then he got his uh ejected, obviously, flagrant two uh in game four, and then I knew I had a feeling he would go off in in game five and I think twenty-seven-fifteen or whatever was, but are you guys buying that he didn't know what a flagrant two meant? Because he he had to ask uh uh Harrison Barnes what a flagrant two meant.

SPEAKER_01 57:20

I did. I don't I'm not buying that.

SPEAKER_00 57:23

I'm not you mean to tell me he's never Yeah, a guy that studies all-star rules? I think he was just kind of like in shock, like like yeah, I'm out, I got kicked out.

SPEAKER_01 57:35

Like, I think he yeah, I think it was more that than it was like he knows what a fucking flagrant means.

SPEAKER_02 57:40

Yeah, there's no way he doesn't know what that means.

SPEAKER_00 57:42

I think yeah, he was just stunned that he got called for flagrant two.

SPEAKER_01 57:47

Yeah, because in his mind, he probably was just like, again, like I'm playing physical, I'm trying to not let them rip the ball away from me. Again, it sucks. I I made contact with him. He probably's like, Yeah, it's a foul. Sees the replay, it's a foul, but like, yeah, again, he I I I think a lot of it probably comes down to like your own intent, and I I just don't think he had the intention of elbowing someone in the jaw. It just worked out that way. Um, so yeah, you all that leads to like shock, but he knows what a flagrant is, dude. Come on.

SPEAKER_02 58:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 58:16

Um uh six or seven for the Spurs, huff.

SPEAKER_02 58:19

I said before the series, Spurs and six, so I'm just gonna stick with Spurs and six.

SPEAKER_01 58:23

I think let me pull up the receipt real quick, keep talking, just make sure that's a good one.

SPEAKER_02 58:27

Yeah, I think I put because I think I talked to um I think I said I think this is what happened. I think I texted Spurs in six over text, and then on the podcast two weeks ago I said T-Wolves in seven, I think. So I didn't know what to do. So I'm sticking with Spurs just. You had Spurs in six. Yeah, what were my other predictions?

SPEAKER_01 58:46

OKC in five, Spurs in six, Pistons and seven, still alive. Yeah, Nick's in seven, but very tempted to take Philly.

SPEAKER_02 58:55

Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_01 58:55

So the only one that's too permanent. You know what you do though, that pisses me off? You'll like you'll like change your predictions after a game or two games, yeah. It's like what do you of course, like what do you mean here's the thing that's like live bed? It's fine.

SPEAKER_00 59:10

Predictions are, I think, meant to change. But then but he'll say, oh, I changed it. Well, like, yeah, like we change it too, but we're not gonna brag after I'm not gonna be like looking up that running. Right.

SPEAKER_02 59:23

I try to change it early in the series where it's still up for grad. Like, like if the if the if I pick Lakers and Sticks and I OKC was up 3-0, I'm not gonna be like OKC is winning this series. Right. Like I try to call it earlier.

SPEAKER_01 59:34

No, but I didn't think I've heard you say after like uh like a going up two games, which again is not it's an advantage though.

SPEAKER_00 59:40

No, it's it's fair, like like I said, predictions are about to be changed, but to change it after a game or two and act like you called it from the beginning, that's where I have an issue with the Spurs Wolves series.

SPEAKER_02 59:53

I've been flip-flopping a lot.

SPEAKER_00 59:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 59:55

I don't I like like I said, I think I said wolves in seven on the pod, but then I texted you guys Spurs in six. I I just have no idea.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:03

I it's weird too, because like going into these playoffs, I did not think the wolves were like that good.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:09

I feel like they that's every year though. Yeah, like they're just like the five, six, or eight, seventh seed, and then they just dominate.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:14

Their style play plays really well in the playoffs. And they the way they built their roster, and then obviously they got you know a star in Edwards.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:24

Um I mean they've they've made back-to-back Western conference finals.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:28

Right. They um like I they always they always they always overachieve in the or at least they overachieve in our eyes because they don't try as much in the regular season than they do in the playoffs. They're a postseason team. Um, but then yeah, they owe they run into a team that's better than them in the like like the last two years in the conference finals. I do think they win tomorrow. I don't know, I think I said wolves in six, maybe I can't remember, but I I do think the Spurs will win in seven. I just think they're deeper, and unfortunately, for the injuries for the the T-Wolves, even though they they do have most of their guys playing, and their Spurs are Um less banged up than the Wolves, so I think they they'll close it out Um in seven. Also, we have said it. I didn't even know they'd changed the game until um you texted us this morning half, which is bullshit. They should be playing tonight.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:26

I think Pat was the one who first my bad. I think sorry, Pete.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:30

I could I didn't know that until I didn't think I did. I only said it I said it in person when we got here.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:35

I thought you said something over time.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:36

Well, either way. No, I checked this morning and just happened to see it, but I don't I never said anything about it. Anyways, whatever. Uh either way.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:43

Um I mean, I guess there's two games tomorrow, but I don't think you need to move it.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:50

It's still it seems dumb to me. Like the schedule has been at like alternate days.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:54

Yeah, I think they want two game assignments on Sunday. It's probably why they did that.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:59

Yeah, probably. As the extent who which uh which Yeah, do we have ref assignments yet? Yeah, extender? Do we if we please God give me the extender? Did you like that when the world needed it most? He vanished.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:11

I I'm sure it's up. Let me see.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:13

Uh Pat, you were pissing me off during the game last night. Why? You were like, oh like I was like, we're up like four points, and you're like, oh, this is exactly where we want.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:23

I never like this game's over, but never said that. I never said exactly where we wanted, but I was having like delusional confidence. I was like, oh my god. Like well, because you know me, I always take the opposite. I always like we'll be up 15 and I'll be like, we're gonna lose though. Like we're gonna blow it. That's true. Um, so I'm trying out this new thing where I'm like confident and like feel good about the team. Like, I every game this series, I've been like, we're gonna win tonight. Like, I feel great. Every single game. And like obviously I have a I have a two and three record there, but I um I mean that the last we we can get into it, which I yeah, let's talk Pistons Cap.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:02

I just looked at the referee. The the there's no assignments yet for tomorrow, and the NBA just came out, they said the no call at the end of the game was correct, the under regulation. Officials no call and Cavs Pistons game five was correct, which whatever it fucking means nothing to me anyway.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:20

It's not like it would be.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:21

No, the and the uh yeah, we can we can start there as we were watching it together, Pete. It's the 9-0 run is that can't happen.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:32

Yeah, I mean I we and again we'll it shouldn't have been in that spot in the first place. Yeah, we're gonna cover, I mean, we're gonna cover uh we're gonna talk a lot about the refs, I'm sure. Uh you guys know me, I don't like blaming refs, it's just not my style. Um but yeah, I think back to the fact that the Pistons went on their a 10-0 run themselves, and they went up what, like eight points on Cavs? They're up nine with two minutes left. Yep, and then zero points the final two minutes of the game. Yeah. That's unacceptable as a as a playoff caliber basketball team. Like someone's gotta get a fucking bucket.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:05

And it goes to show, I mean, I kind of said it to you, I think it goes to show in my mind what the the biggest downfall of the Pistons is sure you we have Cade, he's you know one of the best players in the league. When the when the crunch time hits, like they're gonna key in on him extra sp extra special. They're gonna give him a lot of love, a lot of attention, and that's gonna require your your other guys to hit down to hit some open shots. And I feel like I've seen Cleveland and I've seen I've seen other teams, the Spurs, for example, in this playoffs, knock down those open shots with a level of consistency, and I have not seen the Pistons do that. There have been moments where they where they've done that, they go on their little runs, right? Um but so many times throughout this game, or throughout these playoffs, rather, you'll you'll you'll see them and you're like wide open three, brick. Or I saw I mean I've seen throughout this series, I love him to death. He's one of my favorite players on the Pistons. I want him on a roster, don't get me wrong, but like it's so frustrating that I've seen Cade drive in, get collapsed on, kick it out to a wide open Asar on the three-point line, but he can't shoot. So it's like that's that's a that's a wide open look that anyone else in the league, not anyone else, but a shooter would take and make with some level of confidence. It's just frustrating to have that. So again, to tie it back, you get down to the last two minutes, you get zero fucking field goals, and then the first two minutes of OT, zero fucking field goals, and the first person to score is your third string center, gets you some free throws. That's just not playoff winning basketball. That's not a winning recipe, and as a result, we're looking down the uh the barrel of an elimination game and we're down three two. Pat, you couldn't have said it any better.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:55

This uh was my this is my biggest issue. Um Well, I two big issues actually. Jalen Dern should be on the bench and not he should be the third string center right now.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:09

Didn't he barely play in the fourth? Didn't he play like two minutes or something in the fourth?

SPEAKER_02 1:06:12

Yeah, so Paul Reed played the final twelve minutes in the fourth quarter. The final five and all of overtime. He didn't play in the first three quarters.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:21

Well, so the the quarter is twelve minutes. So he played the entire thing.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:24

Oh yeah, he played the entire fourth and then he played all of overtime.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:27

Okay, so Dern didn't play at all in the fourth in OT? Or did he play at the little bit at the beginning?

SPEAKER_02 1:06:32

I don't remember exactly.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:32

I can't remember either.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:34

What I do know is Dern was a minus 17 on the court, and second worst was like a minus seven. So every time Dern was on the court, we were just getting rocked. Um I just think JB Bickerstaff, I don't know what he's thinking. Like maybe he's just like, we want to see more, like if he can like live up to like a big contract. Like, because like they're probably just as confused as we are. Like, what's going on? Um and the second thing is Asar Thompson. Asar Thompson is elite defensively. He is the best defender, maybe what best wing defender maybe I've ever seen. I agree. It is insane what he does on the basketball court. With that being said, when Asar is on the court offensively, when Kate is driving, he's also getting Asar's defender because they're just playing in the paint. You can leave him as wide open as you want. You get the Shaquille O'Neal treatment back there. It is such a disadvantage on the offensive side of the floor. If that player is like, like I said, it's just like pros and cons. He's unreal on the defensive side, but he's a liability on the offensive side. Um and like it's not like he's like Draymond where he's like setting all these screens and like passing the ball behind him and like being a great facilitator. It's just uh it's just like it's pretty much it just feels like we're playing four versus five on offense. And I hate to say it because like I said, I he's our second best player. I still believe that. He just he makes up for it on the defensive side, but like Cade's just getting triple teamed when he's in the paint.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:11

Yeah, what Asar needs to develop is his handles like driving to the basket in a mid-range game, because then you can keep the defense more honest. And if you can handle the ball, then you can get Cade open in the corner or whoever, a shooter in the corner on the dribble. So if he he doesn't even need to shoot, be a good three-point shooter. Um, if he can just develop um his game attacking to the rim, because then it opens a lot more, and then the mid-range too, because then if you get past your guy, then you can spot up from eight feet, whatever. Um the Durin conundrum is I you're not gonna bench your all-star center, you don't want to damage your relationship with him. Um what's makes me so frustrated the last four or three games since they uh after they went up 2-0, because in the first two games he was really good at getting boards. I was talking to you last night, P uh Mobley had one rebound in game two, and I think Allen had I think his stat line in the first game was two points and three rebounds or something like that. So that means Durham was doing a great job on the glass. Like, obviously, like we we know he's had what over a nine-point difference between his averages in the regular season and uh his averages scoring the basketball in the uh postseason. So we know he's only going to be around nine, ten points a night, which is fine, but you should you shouldn't be averaging five rebounds a game. You should be getting ten rebounds a game. So that's that's where and that's where your put the plus minus comes in, half, because then you're not you're getting less boards on defense, maybe you know, eliminating second chance points and not getting offensive rebounds. Um and then the other thing too is I don't understand why Paul Reed, why we have to bring him in when we're losing. Like we're losing in the second half, and then Paul Reed comes in, gives us great minutes. But it's like if imagine if we had that the whole game coming off the bench. And you know, Stu made two three pointers uh yesterday, so just play him at the same time. I I think he tried that in Orlando, it didn't work, but try it try it against Cleveland, and I don't know if he will tomorrow, but um I would and I also I would start start Paul Reid in the second half tomorrow. Uh in the third quarter. Because he when I like it like we've seen, he comes in and gives him great minutes and they go on a little bit of a run, but you know, they bring him in when they're losing. So if they did that with the lead, because they've had a great um usually a great first half, and the third quarters they have not been good. If they have a halftime lead tomorrow, which I hope they do, I would start Paul Reed in the second half, too, to expand their lead, not bring him in while they're losing to cut into the deficit.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:24

Yeah. I th I think that I think that's a good idea. It's it's it's crazy to me how diff like this team is one of the most entertaining teams I've had the pleasure of watching as a Detroit sports fan. It also might be the most frustrating team I've ever watched in my life. Like, as a fan. It is like because you see the potential of this team. You see how good they can be, how great they are defensively. And you know, like when Uncle T's going, Cade's going, Jenkins sending his shots, Duncan setting his shots, like this team looks really good offensively sometimes too. And you know, unfortunately, I feel like most of the time we just hurt ourselves. Like we just have some of the most bone-headed mistakes. We got Durin, the ball going through his hands when Cade's pump faking and shooting a three and passing it to him, right? Wide open dunk goes out of bounds. We got Cade. Like I said, Cade is not um, he's like he's our best player, but he also has some mistakes as well. Through the first, I think, 10 playoff games, he has the most turnovers by 15 by any player. He has 101 turnovers in like his first eight or ten playoff game. So obviously, yeah, and second place is Anthony Edwards at 86. So he has 15 more. It's like three games more.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:46

Yeah, you want to give him some grace because he is just an absurdly high usage rate. Right. Um, and he is our primary ball handler and playmaker. So you you do want to give him some grace, but so it does explain like at least a portion of that. But there are, yeah, it's it's some of them are just seem so bone-headed. Yeah. Like so completely unforced. He's just making a move and he like bounces it off of his leg or something, and then it goes right into whoever's guarding him, and then it's going the other way. And it's like that happens multiple times a game.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:24

I wonder if if part of it is like because it's his like nonchalant playstyle of just playing so slow that like his turnovers look worse because we could see him ahead of time or something.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:33

Like maybe that's a factor. It's also like your guy, so you're like watching him with like a I feel like whenever I watch like players I don't care about turn the ball over, I like don't even give it a second thought. I'm just kind of like whatever. Um, but when it's like your team and your player and it like matters, you're like, fuck, you just gave away a possession. Yeah. Um gosh. Yeah. Some of them are just so bad.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:56

Yesterday he started the game with three turnovers, and then he only had three of the rest of the game. Um, then he had that one critical one that put the Cavs up seven in overtime.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:06

You think that should have been a foul though?

SPEAKER_00 1:14:08

Yeah, I mean, probably, but they uh they're gonna have to learn. I mean, the last three games, they haven't gotten the whistle, so they're gonna have to find a way to to win without expecting calls. They're gonna decide to put be physical and and play through the contact. Uh because if anything, you know, we've learned that the Cavs are gonna get the benefit of the doubt, so they're gonna have to find a way. But yeah, the the 13-0 run, the 9-0 run, and then the 4-0 run to start overtime. It's if they lose a series, I'll be thinking about that the whole the rest of the offseason.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:49

Yeah, our offense is so inconsistent that we are able to give up these runs all the time. Like, you know, like that 23-0 third quarter run, obviously. All those, like all these runs that are going on. It's just like we need another scoop, like, I don't know what it is, because like Uncle T is so good. Like, he's been averaging 20 points per game. Cade's been so good. Like, he didn't have his best games in three and four, but you know, every other game of the series he's been dominant. Like, we need we just need we're just missing something. Like, we're just missing like someone who could just we're missing that knockdown shooter.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:28

Yeah, because I feel like you you you're you can't control in the NBA. Like, teams are good, they're gonna go on runs, but 23-0 in four minutes, yeah. Like, that's not again credit to Cleveland, they were knocking down shots. A lot of NBA teams can knock down shots, though. Yeah, but when you get to 23-0 territory, that's like you are just like completely stagnant as an offense. And I that's what I see a lot of. They go in these spurts, especially at the end of last game. It's like they were settling for threes, they were trying to, they were trying to waste clocks, so they would take a lot of time to get into their action.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:07

And then before you know it, it's like, well, shit, okay, Cleveland comes down, hits a three. Okay, we get the ball back, we waste our 24 seconds, we get we get a bad three that doesn't go in, rebound. Evan Mobley comes down, hits a three. And you're like, you see it, you see it in real time slowly slipping away, and you just know where it's headed because you know that the ball isn't moving around, passes aren't being made, cuts aren't being made, and there's nobody to make a bucket because Cade's getting doubled.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:35

Yeah, and it's like Yeah, Cade couldn't get his shot in the last two minutes. I think he might have had one, but they would what they would do is yeah, they would waste clock and then they would kick it out for three, but maybe it would have been different if we had Duncan Robinson to hit a dagger three yesterday. But uh Danis had a good game, but um kind of went cold during that stretch, and yeah, they had some open looks, but you could tell like Cleveland was gonna make Cade pass the ball and you know live with another guy shooting, and it worked down the stretch. And uh I told you this off AirP before we started, but I still can't believe Evan Mobley made that three. Yeah, I thought that was like, oh, because we contested it too, but I'm like, okay, yeah, I'll let him shoot. But uh that's a shot top of the key.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:26

He likes the top of the key three, yeah, he's pretty good with it. But even I even like little things too, like again, not that uh not that they were gonna win the game or deserve to win the game, but even like I think about like they intentionally foul Harden and he misses a free throw, and nobody boxes him out, and he gets his own fucking rebound. And then you got to foul again, and then he shoots two more and makes them. And it's like again, you get a rebound. I literally it's funny, I was texting one of my friends because we were down, and I'm like, Harden missed free throw, pistons rebound, we come down and hit a three, boom. Yeah, doesn't happen that way. They get the miss, they don't they don't box out, so it's like little things like that. You just you can't keep making those mistakes and keep doing these things and expect to come out on top. Now, again, I'm never gonna say never just based on last series. Um, I mean, I'm always gonna say that the Pistons have a chance. It's just like one of those things to your point where it's really frustrating because it feels like as much as you have confidence, like you never really know what Pistons team we're gonna get on any given night. At least it's felt that way in the playoffs.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:30

Um I think it was game three and then yesterday. What's so frustrating is they they've won three out of the four quarters, but they had that one dog shit quarter in game three it was uh quarter two. Or excuse me, they uh they only won two of the four quarters, but one of the quarters they only lost by two. And yesterday they won three out of the four before overtime, but they lost it by twelve. And uh obviously in game four they had uh they lost that quarter by whatever it was, 14, 15 points. So they have one really bad quarter, but all the other quarters they're they win or they're they lose by a couple. So they need to, I think you said it, Hef. I just want 48 minutes of good basketball.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:21

Yeah, we need we just need someone to weather these storms, like, because like I it's just so frustrating. Like the game is never over with these pits. Like it's also goes for when we're down a lot of points, like the game's never over, but like, you know, you would like to like see like once when you're when you're up like 12 to 13 points, like you kinda kind of pull away. It just always seems like the other team goes on a run and it's they let him back in. They let him back in every single time, and a lot of it's just like dumb mistakes. But um I was just thinking about this. I remember after game two, Donovan af obviously right after we went up 2-0 in the in the series, Donovan Mitchell gets interviewed. And and the interviewer asks Donovan Mitchell, he's like, Do you think there's anything you figured out like during the series to like where you guys could win this series? And he just like looks at the camera and he goes, Yes. He just says it like that, and I'm like, if they win the series, like I bet you that's gonna be like resurfaced ever like everywhere just because like they just figured something out and then we just can beat him. But I mean get credit to Cleveland too. Like the only thing that's uh pisses me off about Cleveland is Harden's flailing legs when he shoots threes. Like uh Patrick Heekla, shout out Patrick Eekla, he said it perfectly. He shoots like a he shoots like a second grader who can't get the ball there. Like it's pretty good. Like he can but he can't reach the he can't shoot a three, like he doesn't have enough power, so he has to use all the legs. Like that's exactly what it feels like. Um outside of that, like you know, I like Donovan Mitchell, I like Evan Mo. I like their team, and like if we lost this series, I would be very upset, and I think we could have beaten them, obviously, and I still think we can. But yeah, I'd probably be cheering for Cleveland, like over everyone else. Like, I just hate everyone else who's left.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:12

Yeah, I mean we can we can talk about it again. I don't want to put any blame whatsoever on the officials. The Pistons have not done a good job thus far in the in the three games that they've lost. Um but with that being said, the the officiating is has been pretty glaring in my opinion. Um I think you could probably nitpick in in pretty much any series and fucking pretty much any sport, but it feels like it's becoming glaring and glaring and glaring. Every single game it's gotten worse. And I I really feel like that was, you know, pretty indicative. I mean, we were talking about this pre-pod too, like the play that JB challenged, like Harden drives down, blatant push-off, which he does every single play. He sticks his elbow out and pushes off every single time he has he drives, and pushes Karis Levert off of him, goes up to shoot, flails his legs, Karis hits him on the arm, and we challenge, and then they don't even address the push-off in the in the feedback. They just say Karis Levert made contact with him, and it's like I'm not doubt I'm not disputing that. I'm not disputing that he hit him on the arm. Yeah, that's not what we're doing. I'm challenging the fact that Harden just elbowed him in the chest. And it's like that type of stuff, it's like, where are these calls?

SPEAKER_03 1:22:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:31

Because again, I don't think there should be this large of a free throw disparity, disparity, especially in you know, in a team like the Pistons, where like they're scoring in the paint, like they're driving the basketball, and that typically means free throws free throws more foul calls. So again, it's not it's I'm not blaming the refs. I I don't want to do that. I want to make that really clear, but I I at some point it's like we got to address this, and like we gotta there's gotta be some sort of adjustment that needs to be made. I don't know what it is, but it's like it's egregious, and you can't I you should not be rewarding offensive players for pushing off and kicking their feet out. Like you just shouldn't. I just I disagree with that as a basketball concept.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:11

Yeah, obviously the you know, pushing off is should be an offensive foul. It hasn't necessarily been called, but they gotta change it to if you stick your legs out and it's not a part of your shooting motion, like it's pretty glaring, like the difference between your regular jump shot and a jump shot you're trying to get contact, it should be called for an offensive foul.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:34

Yeah, like there was the one there was the one Harden shot yesterday where he got a f he got three free throws out of it, yeah, where he jumps up behind the three-point line and then lands in front of the three-point line on I think it was Karis Levert again, on his legs, and he gets caught Karis gets called for the foul. And it's like he jumped up three feet back, and his landing zone is three feet in front of him. Like what yeah, where are you supposed to stand?

SPEAKER_02 1:24:00

A couple of them were on uh Tobias Harris, too. I know. Yeah, might have been. Maybe it wasn't.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:04

It was on Harris, yeah. They call so they called that one a shooting foul, and then Cavs challenged one that was an air ball uh in the overtime that was uh a pell, they did not call a foul. Yes, but the one that was um called a f called a foul in the fourth, it's like if Harris doesn't uh you know make contact with him, Harden is on his ass. Like you take away Harris and Harden what a would have fell on his ass. Like clearly that's not like you're not you don't take a shot and fall to the ground. That just that's a that doesn't happen. So yeah, it was frustrating, but like I said, you gotta find a way around it. So uh we'll see. I mean Cleveland's 6-0 at home, the uh playoffs.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:50

So well the Cavs also never won a home game, and then they did, so or never won an away game.

SPEAKER_01 1:24:55

I mean, you heard what Deuce said too. He's like, you know, if if we can't win an away playoff game, we're not gonna make it very far.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:01

And so yeah, you gotta dig deep and find a way.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:03

Yeah, it's time to do it. Time is now. That's goat mindset. Yeah, it's either win a game or see in Cancun.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:09

Yeah, Cancun on three.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:12

Yeah, so we'll we'll see what happens.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:14

Uh that brings up, I mean, that brings up kind of a good point. Just one more thing on the fouls. Like, I almost I feel relatively strongly like it needs to be addressed like league-wide, like in the offseason. I just think, again, generally speaking, if I'm a defender moving 100% laterally with you while you drive as an offensive player, and you lean and bump into me and then bounce off to get the shot off. Why the fuck is that a foul on me? Like, I just don't like I never understood that. Yep. And like you see, it's not just in this series, like you see every team taking advantage of that where they literally offensive player fully initiates, and then so they can just pop off and fire up a wild shot, minimal chance of going in, and then boom, two free throws or an end one. And it's like, I just don't understand that. I never will.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:05

Yeah, it bothers me because people are just going to the rack to trick the refs and set up like actually make a batch.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:12

You you drive and you get fucking smacked, raked on the arm. That's a foul. I understand that. But you drive, somebody goes straight up, you lean right into them and then bounce off. It's like, why why why is that a foul? Like, I don't like what are you supposed to do? Just let them get two points?

SPEAKER_02 1:26:29

Yeah, I agree.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:30

I just don't get it. Like I don't either. That shouldn't be rewarded, and it is, unfortunately. And it's it sucks because I think it's an offensive league and people like seeing the points, and unfortunately, that's like the way it's going, and I I honestly don't think it's gonna change as long as ratings are up.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:44

So yeah, Kid's the only ethical hooper left.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:47

He's not a short list, if you ask me. Him and I think Spider's an ethical hooper. Yeah, Spider. James Harden is not. No, he no, he's not. He's a rat. No. He's a rat. He's one honestly, he's one of my least favorite players in the NBA.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:01

But uh I I don't hate him actually. I don't know why. I just never really hate him. I hate Max Struz. He pisses me.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:09

Struce is fine. He just you don't like him because he makes wide open jumpers.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:13

Like, why is he making those shots? Like an NBA player. I don't believe it's knocked down three points. That's literally all he does.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:20

Dude, you said before you were like, I just know Struuss is gonna infuriate me this entire series.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:25

And my dad said the same exact thing. I saw him today. He was like, he's like, Max Struz got pissed off. Me too.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:32

It's because he's making shots. Again, sure, he's made some shots, especially in the last couple games. Like he had a rough start to the series, but again, it's like how many how many free throws does he shot this series? And it's like you look at you go back and look at some of these fouls, and they're just so clearly him baiting to get contact.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:49

Uh right. He looks for contact, and you know and it's just annoying.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:53

And uh yeah, you talk about unethicalness, and I I think that's that's one of the things. And I mean it goes back to the SGA conversation where He very well could go down as one of the best NBA players of all time, but unfortunately, the way it's looking is it's always going to be brought up with that unethicalness of, yeah, but he's a foul baiter.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:10

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:11

That's a stain. No matter how you want to look at it, it's a stain.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:14

Uh well, I mean I mean it can do something about it. They did something about the lottery.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:18

So they already kind of tried to address flopping seven or eight years ago, and like it hasn't it hasn't worked. So yeah, you ask me that that and the the lottery, the tanking stuff are uh I think are are two huge things. They need to address it.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:33

I think they should just every time they go back and see like a blatant flop, give them a technical. Like like after the game.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:40

There needs to be like in-game consequences, like there really does. I think they need to like again it's when the incentive structure put in place rewards that like you're going you're just gonna see people taking advantage of that. And I think you gotta like you gotta really hone in on like what's a foul and what is not, and like really have set a hard line. And yeah, just some of these refs just need to have some fucking critical thinking. Like you can see it live when like it's not that hard to tell.

SPEAKER_00 1:29:08

You can see the buildup. Yeah. Like what you said earlier, F with SGA. You can see it coming.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:13

Every time Harden shoots a three, I get nervous for a foul call. Every single time. Every time, because like his legs are just yeah, because he's looking for contact. Yeah, it looks like he's gonna try to like go in a like do a cannonball, like in the air. Like his feet could just go flying up. Like it's crazy.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:29

Yeah, it needs to be addressed. It really is a problem. I mean, I you talk to some casual fans, and a lot of people I feel like don't like like a lot of people don't like that. Just like a free throw fest every fucking game. Yeah. I don't want to see that shit. I want to see people get buckets.

SPEAKER_00 1:29:43

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:43

Like Cade. Cade. So do we all have pistons and seven? Of course.

SPEAKER_00 1:29:48

Of course, you gotta ride until they lose.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:50

Pistons and seven, baby. Pistons and seven.

SPEAKER_00 1:29:53

Yeah, uh, we can go to the lottery really quick because we kind of brought it up. What uh what are your thoughts on uh uh Wizards winning, the top three picks, and uh Pacers falling out.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:08

Cursed. I think it's uh I think it was an ethical lottery. Um that's like the term of this year.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:15

This season. Like in a word, ethical versus unethical is like the just it's so funny.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:21

Well, the Wizards like this game is crazy. Four goals in eight minutes.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:25

Um yeah, I think the lottery was great.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:27

Well, the Wizards they went one and twenty-four in the last twenty-five.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:32

I think it's ironic that both.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:34

And their two stars sat out the whole year, so I don't really think that was like for uh like the Pacers, obviously they're they were bad the whole year because they were after Halliburn was uh obviously his injury last year, they whoever got hurt, like they didn't play for a couple games and they missed the whole year. So people were happy that they didn't get their pick, but I mean it's not like the Wizards were trying to win either.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:04

Yeah, I th I I just thought it was ironic the two teams that traded for star players both got the one and two picks. Um, like Jaron Jackson Jr. to the the Jazz and Trey Young and AD to the Wizards. I think it's great. Like I always wanted like I just always I I feel like the bad teams are always bad and the good teams are always pretty good. I'm so I'm glad like other teams are having like their chance at getting these star players, like like the Wizards, like getting DeBonsa, the Jazzer will probably take Darren T.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:38

What do you mean? What the wizards are bad every single year.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:42

Yeah, yeah, that's what I'm saying. I'm saying I'm glad that they're getting this pick. So now now they have a chance to become good.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:48

Yeah, instead of like someone like Dallas.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:50

Yeah, yeah, like just like very clearly do not need that pick. Exactly. Like I'm glad, I'm glad the Wizards are getting a stud. I'm glad the Jazz are gonna be back ever since Mitchell left them. Um I'm glad, you know, my jaw is gonna have uh Boozer on his team or uh Caleb Wilson, one of the two. Or Deban uh or not Debanza. Um Peterson potentially the Bulls being good is I feel like it's good for the league. I I I think it was a great lottery. I think it was a great lottery. So I'm happy about it.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:24

Yeah, and when I knew when uh Pacers traded for Zubak and they said it was only top four protected, I'm like, they're not gonna get their pick. I just had a feeling. And sure enough, that because it was it was weird how they did it. It was top four protected, and then the Clipper Clippers got their pick if it was five through nine, and sure enough, they got the fifth pick, um, and it went to the Clippers. So Clippers are gonna be set up well too, huh? Because obviously, this is probably the deepest draft in a long time. Summers saying it's gonna rival 0-3. Obviously, time will tell in the next you know, 15 years, but um look they should get a good pick at five, maybe Wolfson Falls or Darius Acuff, and they got obviously Kwai still there, and then they got uh Ben Benedict Mathrin, who I like a lot of.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:20

I think that I think it depends what the Bulls do. I think the top four picks are pretty set. I don't know what order like I'm pretty sure DeBons will be one, I'm pretty sure Peterson will be two. And then three and four, boozer, will uh Caleb Wilson.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:33

I don't I don't think the Bulls should get Wilson. I hope they do, because I don't think I they need a lead guard, even though they have a bunch of guards. I mean Bulls need a lot, but I think they'd be better off with Acuff, but um I think they're gonna be bad for a while, so I th I still think they'll have opportunities to get like a guard.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:55

Like they're not like they're not gonna win next year, anyways. I just thought like Wilson's highlights were like he is the most athletic dude I think I've ever seen. Like he looks insane on the film. It's crazy how good he looks. Um like honestly, like you know, if it was me drafting, I would I would consider him taking him three. But like I think the Grizz will consider that, but um yeah, overall I'm just happy with the lottery and how it goes. I'm in I'm intrigued to see where everyone falls. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:29

Yeah, I'm uh I'm yeah, I'm excited because just cause to see where everyone goes, and like I said, I think it's gonna be generational, so um yeah, for sure. Uh P, any any uh big things that you noticed during the lottery?

SPEAKER_01 1:34:46

No, nothing too crazy. Um I mean, yeah, I I think you guys kinda already covered it. I think the big one was yeah, the pacers and just like karma. Uh yeah. I feel like, you know, what did their GM say? Like we took a gamble and it didn't pay off, and I'm kind of like, yeah, but fuck you. Um another goal. Another goal, that's wild.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:08

Five goals in the first ten minutes.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:10

This is Chris Roberts Christmas right now. Yeah. Um yeah, I I just uh the tanking thing is like really hard to address. Um yeah, we saw like a bunch of like wacky scenarios that came up throughout the year, and I I I feel like yeah, they're trying, which is like good. And I I to your point, half, like I like seeing a team like the Wizards actually get the number one pay because it's like they're so clearly like actually bad. Um I guess we'll see what happens now that they have a little bit of a squad. Um but yeah, who knows? Who knows? It's always it's kind of fun because you know the world's your oyster, the possibilities are endless pre-draft, but we'll see how it shakes out.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:56

Yeah, for sure. Um any last things on the NBA? I'm down to talk PGA. Yeah, um, so we're watching it right now. First round is uh wrapping up. Uh a lot of a lot of people at the top. I think it's a seven-way tie right now at three under. Uh no one has posted a yeah, there's seven people, including Scotty Scheffler, who is uh on the last hole of the day. Um no one's cracked uh 66 today, Hef, which uh a bit shocking, but it was Wendy to uh for the majority of the uh afternoon rounds. Um but let's start with uh your boy, the reigning two-time master champion. Two-time, yes. Stinker. Absolutely stinker. Rory McElroy. Dud. Keep going, P. What else you got?

SPEAKER_01 1:36:54

Yeah, he dropped a fucking egg on day one. I mean, what is he four over, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:36:57

Yeah, four over.

SPEAKER_01 1:36:58

Maybe the maybe the blister on his foot is still uh is still getting to him.

SPEAKER_00 1:37:03

Yeah, let's start there. There's always something with Rory, it seems like every major leading up to it. Obviously, before he won last year, it was can he break the master's curse? Can he end his 11-year uh uh major drought? And he did, and now it's like there's always some storyline leading up to it. This week it was a damn blister. Would you like to address that?

SPEAKER_02 1:37:26

Um, to be honest, I didn't even know about this story.

SPEAKER_00 1:37:29

So, yeah, on Tuesday he was doing his practice round um on before he teed off on hole four. He took off his shoe and was looking at his blister and he stopped, and then he didn't play yesterday either. And uh obviously he played today.

SPEAKER_01 1:37:44

He was a game time decision today. You know what impresses right foot blister.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:48

What impresses me is like his resilience to play through those injuries. And um, you know, obviously um you know, blisters on your feet are not good for your golf swing. Obviously, yeah it hurts with your rotations. So um honestly shooting plus four, I'm pretty impressed with the two-time back-to-back masters champion, six-time major winner.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:08

Are you impressed with Bogeys on five of the last six holes?

SPEAKER_02 1:38:12

I saw that. I saw him miss a short one to get his fourth in a row. Listen, Rory is not out of the tournament until he's cut or until he's done. So 18 more holes. Rory, well, who knows? He could shoot a 63 tomorrow, and I wouldn't even be shocked if he did. You know, that's who Rory McElroy is. That's like he's in Scottie Scheffler's tier for a reason. You know.

SPEAKER_01 1:38:35

Yeah, I as long as I'm a guest on this podcast, this is gonna be an anti-Rory space. Um yeah, I mean, look, he's a legendary golfer. There's no denying that. Like, you can't. You you look at his resume, there's no denying it. I think with B and I kind of talked about before this, but when my biggest gripe with him is just like the psychology of how he plays golf. It's like it's nervous, it's topsy turvy, the boat is rocking the entire fucking time.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:05

Like you're talking, you're saying like he's just nervous, like nervous every shot. Is that what you're saying?

SPEAKER_01 1:39:10

Like you're just saying like he's like getting it. He he doesn't when I think of top-tier golfers, when I think of Tiger Woods in his prime, when I think of Scotty Schaffer in his prime, when I think of Jordan Speeth when he was on that run, when I think of Brooksy when he had that two-year span, I I think of just like dominant golf. You come in on Sunday, you're in the lead, or you're close to the top of the leaderboard, and you just sh absolutely show the fuck out and you run away with the tournament, or you win handily. Rory McElroy does not do that, at least he hasn't done that since the beginning of his career.

SPEAKER_00 1:39:47

Yeah, nothing's like what he's trying to say is nothing's easy with Rory.

SPEAKER_01 1:39:51

He's always and that to me is something. Like that it's not, again, he's a legendary player, Ryan. Not disputing that. His resume speaks for itself. But I think back to that master's win, the first one, and I'm like, holy shit. Someone, someone, please take this tournament from him because he didn't want to win it.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:13

No, he didn't. And I just like that to me Imagine being a fan of him and watching the crazy.

SPEAKER_01 1:40:20

Here we go again is probably what you're thinking. So yeah. So that that's what I'm that's that's my gripe with Rory. Like, that's my gripe in a nutshell.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:27

It's just like he can't finish the job.

SPEAKER_01 1:40:29

Like you just seems like it seems like the tournaments he went, obviously, he has to put himself in the position to win a hundred percent. He has to get to to Sunday. Yeah. But it just seems like he fucking gets there and like hobbles over the finish, and he just happens to be in the tournament on Sunday where Shuffler's like too far back to actually make a run at it, or no one else actually steps up and like has a fucking day and just wins the tournament. Like that's what it's felt like.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:56

Yeah, well, then the Masters this year, the second one he won, he I think he was wired to wire, but he had a six-shot five or six shot lead going in the weekend, and then he won by one, and he uh he had a two-shot lead going to eighteen, and then he bogeied eighteen. So it's like there's always plan for bogey too.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:15

Like people that that's actually what people do.

SPEAKER_00 1:41:17

I know, but yeah, but he shot it in the woods. Like you shoot in the woods, you don't know what's yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:21

You're not trying to do that. Yeah, I that that's why I was shocked he pulled out driver. I'm gonna be honest. I I thought he was just gonna pull out a wood and then just like lay up the next shot and just hit it on a two-pa. I think him hitting driver there was just a stupid decision.

SPEAKER_01 1:41:35

Yeah, and I again I like as much as it doesn't sound like it, I do like Rory. Like, I I like watching he's got the the prettiest golf swing of all time. Oh, for sure. Like he's awesome, but I just have a hard time saying he's better than Scotty Scheffler right now just be just because of the way he he wins golf tournaments. It's like the craziest fucking thing. Where like again, I said this to you during the Masters, probably this year, and I probably said it last year too. You give me Scotty Scheffler and Rory tied headed into Sunday in any golf tournament, not even Augusta alone, any golf tournament. I'm picking Scotty Scheffler every single time, and I will never not pick him. And I just feel like that perfectly encapsulates like Rory's style of play when it comes to golf. Like I said, topsy turvy, it's a it's a rocky boat. I call him Rory the roller coaster. Yeah, where it's like he always has to, it's always there's always like something in his game. It's all and like dude, I yeah, it's like I see shots where like he to me he looks nervous, and it's so weird because he's literally one of the best golfers of all time.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:42

Yeah, I think nerves are I think it's a part of it. Him not winning the um him not winning for 10 years and like every single year coming back, like obviously I no other player really had that. So like obviously it's his fault for not winning for 10 years, but like for how good he was during those ten years and not winning a major. Yeah, right. The the stress of winning just gets amplified every single time you don't win. And yeah, I mean he had multiple times to win majors, like the US Open and when he should have beat Wyndham Clark, and Wyndham Clark won. And there's just I could probably think of Bryson Jambo, yeah. Yeah, that one uh where he bogeied, I think he he missed that like three-footer, two-footer one. Two of them, right? He missed back to back.

SPEAKER_00 1:43:27

Uh man missed two three-footers. Yeah, maybe one was a four four-footer, I think two of the last three holes.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:34

Yeah, like that downhill slider one.

SPEAKER_01 1:43:35

And then Bryson had a clutch up and down out of the sand and sunk his putt to win. So again, that's the type of shit that just like sticks with me. And that's why I have a tough time putting Rory above Scheffler, because I just feel like I've never felt that about Scotty. Call it fair, call it unfair. Scotty just feels like a robot out there.

SPEAKER_00 1:43:55

Same thing with right, it's like that killer mentality, yeah. And Rory had that early in his career, and obviously he broke the streak last year, but it's like he like limped almost the finish line, and and obviously the masters was clearly in his head, like he had to get over, and then obviously once he won it, he won another one. But it's like it's it's there's always like some like caveat. It's like perfect you said it perfectly, Clef. It's Rory the Royal Royal Coaster versus Scheffler, and I I told this to P on air. Tiger Woods, he won his 50 majors. Every major that he won, he was in the final group. So once he got to that final group, he closed you out. And and with Rory, it's like it's like picking teeth. It's like there's always a struggle, it seems like.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:47

Yeah, I mean I agree with you, but he still won those tournaments, too.

SPEAKER_00 1:44:53

No, I but I think that's where P is saying, like, that's why he would pick Scheffler and saying yeah, that's how we if we have to differentiate how do we do that?

SPEAKER_01 1:45:03

That's how that's how I look at it.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:05

Honestly, I've like I I said I would take Rory, but like it obviously I'm a I'm a way bigger fan of Rory than I am Scotty, but like it's just so neck and neck to me.

SPEAKER_00 1:45:16

I hope we do get that eventually.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:19

I'm sure we will final pairing of Scheffler and High going into Sunday, just shootout.

SPEAKER_01 1:45:26

But the thing is, I genuinely feel like it wouldn't be a shootout. I genuinely think Scotty Scheffler runs away with it. Runs, I think he steps on him. I really believe that.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:36

I think it just I think how like I think Rory's biggest issue is like the big number, you know, like he he's like Scotty is just consistently par, par, par, throwing a birdie, par. I feel like Rory is more birdie, birdie, birdie, double, double, birdie, birdie, yeah, birdie.

SPEAKER_00 1:45:55

That's what he did in Money Won the Masters.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:56

Yeah, it's just like he just has a lot more big numbers and mistakes, but he also I think he hits better shots sometimes. I just think Scheffler's more you know, consistent. Like the last 36 holes, he he I think he's the first player since like 1960 to go Saturday and Sunday without one bogey. Yeah, he went bogey free on the weekend.

SPEAKER_00 1:46:20

Was that last PGA? Is that what Last Masters? Oh, Masters, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:46:24

Last Masters. I think he's the first person to do that freaking 50.

SPEAKER_00 1:46:27

And he was dumb by a lot, and then he kind of came back. He was in second, and like we said, Rory had to all he had to do was bogey 18. I will say this, um, talking about this PGA, I think the field's in I'm uh obviously it's every tournament, but right now, uh Scotty Shuffler's tied for the lead, seven-way tie, like uh I mentioned earlier. But I think the field's in deep trouble, P, because you look at his um history playing the PGA, it's the last 36 when he turns it up a notch, and now he's already in the in the tied for the lead uh after round round one's not finished, but it's look it's looking like he's gonna be at least tied for the lead. If not, he'll be at worst one stroke down. But uh I I I just I I'm picking him to win to win the uh this tournament just because like you said, P, he's got that killer instinct. And especially when he turns it up uh in the last two rounds, I think someone's gonna have to shoot really low for to at least be in contention heading into the weekend.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:36

Yeah, I mean I think this is a really good example of like, yeah, we might we might get to see kind of everything we just talked about on full display. Like we're probably gonna get to see him in a position where he's comfortable going into the weekend with a lead or at least well within striking distance. And yeah, I think we're gonna see him have uh a good Saturday and a good Sunday, and obviously who knows, but it's it's it's just hard, it's hard to bet against where like if I was actually putting money up, not on this tournament, but like in general, yeah, and you made me bet on Scotty or Rory, like I would feel much more nervous betting on Rory than I would on Scotty, that's for sure. Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:48:17

I mean, there's a reason too why I I think this this is the 14th major he was a favorite in a row, and that hasn't happened since Tiger, so and excuse me, and then that's even with Rory winning last year's Masters and going into this year, even though Rory won, he's Shuffler still was still the favorite.

SPEAKER_01 1:48:37

So you you bring up a good point, Pete. Let me pose a question to you. Yeah, um obviously, like every every time we bring up golf, uh anyone brings up golf, like the question always gets brought up of like who's the next tiger, who's the next tiger? Not even who's the next tiger, but do you think definitively at this point, like is Scheffler the closest we've seen to being the next tiger? Or do you think like it's Rory? Is it Speath when he had his peak? Like, who do you who do you think is the closest we've seen to to Tiger Woods?

SPEAKER_00 1:49:11

I think in definitely he's held sustained it the longest. Rory, like we said, he's he went um over a decade without winning one. He did win a lot of big, like he won the players, I think, multiple times, and he won the uh Ryder Cups. Fed uh FedEx, yeah. So but so Shuffler has won a FedEx too. So I it's definitely those two. Um but I think consistency wise for I mean Shufflers, but since he won his first tournament, he's won I think fifteen in in a four year span. So um he's he's definitely been the closest, I think, to that. Um So I and I I think he's only gonna get get stronger. Like I don't see a fall off um from him unless maybe he gets injured, but even even then, like he's I think he just turned 30, so that's fifteen more years of a dominant Scotty Shuffler that we're gonna see. So I mean you would hope. So I think I I mean I would kind of be stunned if he doesn't get to close to ten majors.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:30

Shuffler?

SPEAKER_00 1:50:31

Yeah. I mean Royce still has a chance to get to that too, but like we said, uh everything me and Pete have mentioned, it's just he's he's he's so robotic, he's got that killer mentality.

SPEAKER_01 1:50:44

Which uh you bring up a good point when you remind me when you said you know, 15 more years of prime Scotty. How about fucking Justin Rose, dude? Yeah, he's still kicking it. He's turning it, he's turning it up, and he's in his fucking early 40s, right? Late 40s?

SPEAKER_00 1:50:59

I yeah, I think he's 45. I mean, I think he knows that he's probably got a couple more years of competing at a high level in the majors. Because I think Phil is the oldest one to win a major yeah, he won the PJ four or five years ago at at 50. So Rose knows that he's on the back nine of his career, so he's cool.

SPEAKER_01 1:51:23

It's cool because it feels like to me, like I feel like he's playing some of his best golf, like ever. And it's cool that you can do that at 45.

SPEAKER_00 1:51:31

That's why golf is like sport. That's why you know, there's no sport like golf because you can play it forever. Yeah, and you know, we see all the time the guys, you know, that have won the PGA and mastered all these majors that they come in and so you know every once in a while one of them will contend or at least make the cut, and it's pretty cool. Uh and no other sport can use, you know, do you see that? Um but yeah, I've I haven't seen since Tiger, I haven't seen someone be this consistent. Um well maybe Rory from 2011 to 14, but even since then Scotty's been at least for a four year because we always always see Kepka and Spees, but that was a two-year period, maybe a three-year period. Um but in the Scotty sustained, and I don't like I said, I don't see a drop-off coming from him anytime soon. Um who did you pick too?

SPEAKER_02 1:52:34

I didn't really pick anyone to be honest, but I you know, I hope Speeth wins. That'd be cool.

SPEAKER_00 1:52:42

I just at one under.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:44

Yeah, I hope Speeth wins, that'd be cool.

SPEAKER_00 1:52:46

Because it'd be the career grand slam.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:48

I could see like a speeth or like a Xander winning this tournament.

SPEAKER_00 1:52:50

I don't know what Xander's at two under, Justin Thomas is at three under.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:55

JT would be good. I love JT as well. Actually, JT would you know if it's not Rory, I I'm always cheering for JT. I love JT.

SPEAKER_00 1:53:03

Yeah. Um, yeah, this to this uh tournament played in Philadelphia. I can't pronounce the uh uh the name of the course, but it's uh you know no problem. I haven't seen many people miss many fairways and and whatnot. Um but these greens are so big, so um, and the putting's been very difficult, and that's why we've only seen uh three under is the best score. So uh it's it's it's gonna come down like most tournaments, but it's gonna come down to uh to putting half and and where where you place your shot uh on the green too. I agree. Uh I did pick Cam Young. He had a most mostly a good day up until last uh couple holes. I think he's at one over. Um but yeah, seeing what we you know what we know now, I think Shuffle's gonna pull it out. Who did did you have uh particular winner P?

SPEAKER_01 1:53:59

Yeah, my pick was um Matt Fitzpatrick. That's a go. I also did have um Shawley as my alternate, but that's more of the backup pick, which we'll see what happens. But yeah, I'm good. I felt really good about him. Him and his brother won that tournament uh a couple weeks back.

SPEAKER_00 1:54:15

Yeah, it was cool.

SPEAKER_01 1:54:16

Um so yeah, I just feel like he's been playing really good golf and kind of feels like he's due a little bit, so we'll see how it all shakes out.

SPEAKER_00 1:54:22

But oh yeah, yeah. Um Hef, any comment on Bryson on wanting to become a YouTube golfer after Liftfolds?

SPEAKER_02 1:54:32

Hey, live your life, man. I I like I mean, I watch his YouTube videos, so I mean, I think they're really entertaining. Yeah, he already has enough money to do whatever the hell he wants to do, so if you want to be a YouTube golfer, be a YouTube golfer.

SPEAKER_00 1:54:46

Yeah, I talked to P. I'm like, you're not gonna make that much, but he says like, oh yeah, I gotta talk about this too. Did you see this huff? What uh it's uh Garrick uh Rigo, ironically, is his last name. Did you see what happened to him?

SPEAKER_02 1:55:01

Um no. Two stroke penalties. Oh, I did hear about this.

SPEAKER_00 1:55:05

He showed up one minute late. I think he because he had his putter in hand, so I think he came um from the punting green. Yeah, look, he's 718, he's on the punting green. He showed up at 719, got a two-stroke penalty, and do you know what he shot? He shot a 69, which is one over. And so if he didn't get that two stroke. If he didn't have that two-stroke penalty, he would be tied for the lead right now. He's gonna be kicking himself if he loses by two strokes.

SPEAKER_02 1:55:36

That sucks. Yeah. Um wow. Look at his flow. That's pretty nice.

SPEAKER_00 1:55:45

You said it was Rigo. Yeah. That would that would be a nickname he would give him, though.

SPEAKER_01 1:55:49

I think he's from South Africa.

SPEAKER_00 1:55:51

Yeah. I'm gonna calm Rigo though for you. Yeah, hell yeah. Um, but yeah, so he uh he shout.

SPEAKER_01 1:55:58

That's crazy. How the fuck do you show up late to a tea time? Like, how's no one like telling you? And where's your caddy? Yeah. How's your caddy not being like, bro, we gotta go?

SPEAKER_00 1:56:06

Yeah. I apparent I mean he was waiting at him, waiting for him at the tea box, but it's like Yeah, it's wild. We'll see if he's in contention. Uh come on Saturday and Sunday, but that that would that would I mean you would you would never forgive yourself.

SPEAKER_01 1:56:24

Yeah, because it's like everyone's starting even par and you just immediately are starting two over.

SPEAKER_00 1:56:28

Yeah. And like I said, like we said, you would be he would be in first place right now. Yeah, which sucks. Uh but yeah, it'll it will only matter if he's in contention on Sunday. But uh crazy storyline. I forgot what I was gonna say. Oh yeah, De Chambeau. We're P was uh we were talking before he came in, half P said, like, yeah, I mean he's got all this money from Live, so why not do what you want to do? I just Bryson's such an odd cat, like I don't get why he wouldn't want to play golf. Like, you know, he's not gonna make that much money YouTube golfing, like he'll make a lot, but not what he was making at Live, and even if he was winning all these tournaments, like he's not gonna be making millions of dollars.

SPEAKER_01 1:57:17

Are we like confirmed he like does not want to play on the PJ tour? Like, is that for certain?

SPEAKER_00 1:57:22

I think he said this week he wants to go into YouTube golf if the live if Live folds. He also said each team for Live is worth like $250 million.

SPEAKER_02 1:57:32

Okay, yeah. I mean he's still gonna be making a shit ton of money.

SPEAKER_00 1:57:36

But he'd be making more if he was in the PJ tour. I don't know. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 1:57:41

Speak of the devil, there he is. Could he could still play in the majors though, couldn't he?

SPEAKER_00 1:57:45

Yeah, I mean I think he would have to eventually qualify for them because his five-year status is gonna come out pretty soon after winning the US. But I don't know. I think about Bryson, he does what he wants, so that's true. Uh I just I I think it's odd, but is what it is. Um do we all have Scotty closing it out after even though there's three rounds to go?

SPEAKER_02 1:58:13

No, I think I said I have Xander.

SPEAKER_00 1:58:14

Xander.

SPEAKER_01 1:58:15

I mean, I still think it's anyone's tournament. I'm gonna stick with my initial Matthew Fitzpatrick. I think he's at even right now, which is even, so like he's still in striking distance, right? You get it, you get a big Friday or a big Saturday, and who knows?

SPEAKER_02 1:58:27

That was my master's pick, but didn't go too long.

SPEAKER_00 1:58:30

Oh, and JT too, Heffa.

SPEAKER_02 1:58:32

Yeah, JT or Xan.

SPEAKER_00 1:58:33

Yeah, I just like I like we meant what talking about, I just Scotty's got that killer mentality, so I I think he's in a great spot, especially with how he performs in this tournament. The fact that he's winning uh where he is right now. I can't imagine that um I cannot see anyone uh pulling it out unless they shoot really low the next three days. But uh that's the fun part. We'll uh we'll see what happens. Absolutely. Anything else, boys?

SPEAKER_02 1:59:05

I think I'm good.

SPEAKER_00 1:59:07

Pete, thank you for joining us tonight.

SPEAKER_01 1:59:09

Thank you guys so much for having me.

SPEAKER_02 1:59:11

Pat, you truly are the goat.

SPEAKER_01 1:59:13

Seems like a lot, but I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_02 1:59:16

Well, uh, thanks everyone for listening to our episode. Two-hour episode today, hell yeah. Um KD episode. Yeah. Um, but yeah, uh Pat, thanks for hopping on. Chris will be back with us next week. Um, thank you guys so much for watching. My name is Ryan Heffner.

SPEAKER_00 1:59:36

Chris Bean.

SPEAKER_01 1:59:36

Patrick Abraham. You guys gotta you guys gotta come up with like a better closing tagline though, or something like I'm trying to think of and that's the narrative. I like that.

SPEAKER_02 1:59:50

So should I say that after we say our names? Like, I'm Ryan Heffernan, blah, blah. And that's the narrative. That's the narrative, yeah. Okay. All right, let's try it.

unknown 1:59:59

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 2:00:00

My name is Ryan Heffernan.

SPEAKER_01 2:00:02

Chris Bean. Patrick Abraham.

SPEAKER_02 2:00:04

And that's the narrative.

SPEAKER_01 2:00:05

Hell yeah.