My Golf Source
Attention Golf Enthusiasts! Level up your golf game with hosts Darren Penquite and Noah Horstman, PGA as they keep you up to date on the latest trends, equipment, training aids and more. Learn tips and tricks from PGA Professionals to lower your score and grow your love for the game of golf.
My Golf Source
Your Story Shapes Your Swing: How Identity Impacts Performance
Mastering the mental game is often more crucial than physical skill in golf, as demonstrated by emotional intelligence coach Daniel Schuler who breaks down how our personal narratives impact performance. The internal stories we tell ourselves, rooted in our identity, determine our decisions on the course and can either empower or limit our potential.
• Emotional intelligence defined as awareness of your feelings, their origins, their impact on others, and recognition of others' emotions
• How water hazards create mental blocks because trying not to think about something requires thinking about it
• Understanding that we don't see shots as they are but through the filter of our personal narratives
• Why negative outcomes dominate our memory even when most shots are good
• How rapid improvement happens by identifying and changing false beliefs about ourselves
• The difference between a golfer's physical capabilities and their mental readiness to perform
• Examples of dramatic performance changes after just one conversation with Daniel
• Success story of a student-athlete improving after only 20 minutes of emotional intelligence coaching
• Insight into how professional golfers could benefit from identity work
If you'd like to contact Daniel Schuler for emotional intelligence coaching, reach out through contact@golfgarageoregon.com.
Welcome to the my golf source podcast. Welcome to my golf source.
Speaker 2:I'm Darren and I'm Noah. Hey, did we just get done with league again tonight?
Speaker 1:We did, and I was playing a fantastic round. I think I was going to finish four or five over par. How'd you do? Shot a nine on 18.
Speaker 2:Okay, so I saw your tee shot. You ripped that drive and then I had to go back to my bay.
Speaker 1:I did what happened from there to drive and then I was 160 out and I faded an eight iron right into the water. So I took a drop and then I faded an eight iron right into the water. You know where.
Speaker 2:You know there's a button that we can aim right, you know the story, you know how this goes. We were playing TPC Louisiana, I think.
Speaker 3:Pretty awesome yeah awesome course.
Speaker 2:Where the tour players are playing, and each week we're playing there and having a good time trying to see how we compete against them, and that was probably the most challenging course we played all year. I mean, in my opinion, there's just a lot of force carries us to last week and I'm not sure you can get more challenging. Maybe, if, maybe, if we had to putt true, yeah, so no, it was pretty awesome and it's just fun to be able to compete on the same level of courses that the tour players are playing.
Speaker 1:Obviously, we're not playing the same tees, but it's a blast man I mean for me to be five over par on nine holes on the back nine.
Speaker 2:I'm thrilled with that and we're in the playoffs.
Speaker 1:I blew it up on hole 18.
Speaker 2:Yeah well playoffs and we're playing each other again. So I'm not sure, because handicaps seemed a little bit off tonight. We're going to find out exactly where those were. I think scoring is going to happen tomorrow, so we'll see exactly what happens when Coach Kukula gets back. And you played one under right, I did. I played one under, missed three birdies by about half a roll. So I played good tonight for as much as I get to play.
Speaker 1:So I played running wide for the first time on Saturday.
Speaker 2:Oh, so we talked about that last week. We did, and one of our you know, my all-time favorite course in Southern Oregon. What did you think?
Speaker 1:It was spectacular.
Speaker 2:Did you have good weather?
Speaker 1:We got drizzled on with rain for hole three and four.
Speaker 2:Out in the elements there.
Speaker 1:yeah, Aside from that, it was perfect. It is. It was perfect. Hole nine that dude I. I've never seen a par four that is more than 20 yards downhill 302 yards. I was pin high way off to the left out towards the road in the driving range because I hit a power fade and so I aim left and I ripped the drive and, as I do when I hit a pure drive, it goes dead straight.
Speaker 2:So well, and and like going back to that hole. It is probably 200 feet downhill, so it's awesome. They used to carve the American flag into that fairway and it was immaculate. It was like a postage stamp or a postcard. It was awesome.
Speaker 1:I took a picture of it once. I took a picture from the top from the tee box, and I took a picture from the green looking back at the tee box with the uphill fairway. It was super cool, and then I birdied 10 oh, that's a good birdie.
Speaker 2:Par five, yeah, with the pond on the left. So cool thing about that is it's one of our reciprocals. Did you take advantage of that? I sure did.
Speaker 1:It was uh 75 bucks for 18 holes with a cart with a cart. Oh, that's awesome arnold Palmer signature to Palmer signature course. That was money.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so do you. Where's it right in Southern Oregon for you?
Speaker 1:man. Well, you know that's a tough one. Um, I gotta say it's it. I gotta play it one more time to say it takes the cake, but it's, it's there.
Speaker 2:So Ryan and I played, um, played it, and then we had to play bar run and then we were like going back and forth and we're like I don't know which one's better bar runner or running wide.
Speaker 3:And then we played bar Well it's awesome, not on the top.
Speaker 2:Oh man, it's so good for me, just because of the way that a few of the holes are designed. Dan does such a good job, um um. But then we played running y again, and running y just smoked it for me I think so, bar bar running brand new course.
Speaker 1:Um, right now I don't think they're open.
Speaker 2:They have at least two holes that were completely submerged yeah, they got flooded um when we had all that rain and just redo a couple of holes, yeah, yeah, I mean from t-box to green and everywhere in between yeah, so they should be open again. I know they have their lazy river open now, driving range is about to be open and a few other things, so really excited for it.
Speaker 1:I got a week stay in their rv resort on in june do you really?
Speaker 2:yeah, I do.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's awesome.
Speaker 2:You want to come up play with us, uh, yeah it's a monday through friday, june 17th ish I'm in, then I gotta go to tennessee right after that. I think it's gonna be kind of warm, so I want to go hang out and uh bar run and pretend that I'm. That's my vacation yeah, we'll.
Speaker 1:We'll play a couple of times, enjoy the lazy river and love it. Do a couple of rounds.
Speaker 2:I have a question for you how was your mental game tonight? It was good until 18 18. So we have somebody coming on the show here in a few minutes. That um is, in my opinion, the best mental performance coach in the country. He focuses on emotional intelligence. He's a scratch golfer, played in state, played in high school, had lots of different jobs up into this point for a young um young man and um, I respect him wholeheartedly. We've got daniel schuler coming up right now.
Speaker 3:Welcome, daniel what's going on hey? Daniel that scratch golfer is, uh, very generous okay, well, you know what?
Speaker 2:It's better than saying, nice, drive, easy five, because that was my buddy's new game and we know you know how to make birdie.
Speaker 3:I think if we scratched out a couple holes I could be a scratch golfer, but I do appreciate it.
Speaker 1:I've got to say on hole 18 where you know, whenever I have water right and I'm a right-handed golfer who tends to hit a strong fade I I crushed my drive, I did exactly what I wanted to do. Everything about it was mentally, physically, in reality, good, and then just a simple eight iron shot, which is one of my favorite clubs in my bag. It's like that water's a darn magnet and I can't get my mind past it. So, is this a?
Speaker 2:question for Daniel already, what are we?
Speaker 1:defending to Daniel Cause. This just happened five minutes ago.
Speaker 2:Daniel, did you know you're a psychiatrist or you're an emotional intelligence coach?
Speaker 1:I'm still kind of fired up about it, so give me a break here. No, it's pretty awesome.
Speaker 2:Hey, so I do want to kind of open up a little bit with Daniel, because you know, this is so crazy how I met Daniel. His dad was recommended by a really good friend of mine to do some work on our house. He's a general contractor and and I've heard that his dad, fritz, is like the best tile person in the Valley. So we have him doing our, our bathroom, um reno. When we got at our house and lo and behold, uh, his son's in there working and didn't think anything of it. And next thing, you know, like Daniel and Fritz are just chatting it up and you know my kids are in there and they're just like hanging out, and you know. And then I find out Daniel played golf in high school and I remember the name, but I was. I was away for about 12 years and so I knew the name but I didn't know. And then all of a sudden, it just hit me.
Speaker 2:I'm like oh, you were like a really good golfer, weren't you? And then you know next thing, you know his dad's telling me a couple of days later about how he's going through emotional intelligence training and how he's worked with some of these Fortune 200 companies. And then he's like helped all these people out and kids out. And I'm like, oh man, well, we're looking for a mental performance coach. Right now. I don't know what emotional intelligence is. So, daniel, why don't you tell us a little bit about what emotional intelligence is and just like, ultimately, how you're? You just rock it, man, like you have helped so many people. I have so many good stories about you, but I think I just like people to know what EI really is.
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely, and thanks so much again for having me on here. Yeah, that feels like forever ago. That was during COVID. I think it was literally in 2020 and I had just gotten back to Oregon from LA, because I was living in LA for quite a long time and didn't want to be there during covid what were you doing in la?
Speaker 3:uh, so I was in the entertainment industry. Um, I started at age 15, or I just turned 16. I was doing modeling and acting, and then I quit when I was 20 because I didn't like who I was and the industry was really tough, and that's for another podcast. But then two years later, I got into the music industry. So that's what I was doing down there. And then, over COVID, because I was home, I was like, well, I might as well help my dad out with work and keep myself busy, which is how I was fortunate enough to get connected with you, which is awesome.
Speaker 3:But, yeah, so I did my certifications in 2018 through the Global Society of NLP, and if you don't know what NLP is, it just stands for Neuro Linguistic Programming, and so the easiest way to explain, I guess emotional intelligence.
Speaker 3:And for those listening, I specifically focus on identity, because I look at people as a quilt, and a quilt is made with a thread.
Speaker 3:So if you want to understand how the quilt got there, or if you don't like the picture that the quilt has, you've got to figure out the thread that made that quilt, and identity is the thread that runs through everything, and so your identity is who you think you are, who you think other people think that you are, and then you create a story around that and then that story determines the decisions that you make, and then that story determines the decisions that you make. And emotional intelligence is just the ability to be aware of how you're feeling at any given time and also just how other people are feeling and how you're coming off. I think there could be, you know, essentially there could be a couple different definitions for for emotional intelligence, but it's essentially just the ability to know how you're feeling, the reason that you're feeling the way you are, how it's coming off and how someone else is feeling. Yeah, and obviously that that plays a big role in in golf, for sure.
Speaker 2:Well, I would agree. Um, so you have helped the St Mary's girls golf team when their fifth state championship in a row. Um, they at the time were not the horse you'd bet on if you will and they came out on top. You have worked wonders with a lot of our junior golfers. You have worked, um, well, it's odd actually.
Speaker 2:So one of my SAU players actually, um, approached me Southern Oregon university and told me that you worked with them one-on-one and it was the funniest thing because I noticed such a change in him in one of the events we were playing in and I just I went up to him and I said, man, you were so coachable, it was a pleasure watching you play. And like we were just talking a little bit and he's like, oh, I actually worked with coach Daniel and I was like did you really? When did you do that? Oh, last week I called him, I talked to him and I was like, well, good for you, because he literally 360'd from the standpoint of coach to player. He in this last tournament too, and he just finished all conference and you know it's a shout out.
Speaker 2:I mean he always had the game and there's so much to be said for self-belief always had the game, and there's so much to be said for self-belief. But, as a golf coach, saying something about self-belief is totally different than for the person to understand how to believe in themselves. And I mean you ultimately gave him the ability to believe in himself through the conversation you guys had. And so I mean, first of all, all thank you, because it was awesome to see this young man succeed. And and secondly, I mean we've talked a lot too, because you work with our company. But like how is it that you go through this process? I'm just curious because, like Darren, we do want to get back to Darren's question about hitting into the water, but there's probably more to it but like, how, how does this process work for you? Because you help people in like two sessions, dude, like you're it's so much different than because you're finding this root cause.
Speaker 2:I guess I don't know. So tell us a little bit about how that works. And I'm just curious too, cause it's nice to hear it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And yeah, I was super, super proud of him and the crazy thing is we literally talked for 20 minutes, like that was it, and he had a tournament. He had a three-day tournament the next day and it was our first time actually working one-on-one and it was nice. He gave me an update each day and at the end of the tournament he's like, hey, I just had my best tournament finish ever and I was thinking about all the stuff you were talking about and so that was just. It's always a blessing, you know, to be able to see that it's working. And the cool part is is it's him, it's not me, like all I'm doing is reframing the story that someone believes about themselves based off of these lies that they're living in. And so the process typically and I and it's it's funny, I don't have a system like this is going to sound really crazy. I don't go through a list of questions that I always ask. I don't have like these bullet point things that I bring into every session. I literally use whatever I'm given from that person, um, and I just help them figure out the way that they think. Where that? Because they created their own system, and so we go through. Okay, what do you either? What are you most afraid about in this situation? Or what area do you want to experience the most transformation in, or what's a behavior that you're not a super big fan of, that you'd like to change Basically, where that you'd like to change basically, where do you want to experience change?
Speaker 3:And I was like, well, you know, in his case he said every time I get into a tournament, I just I don't know what happens, like I know I have the game, I just shut down and you know. So we kind of just work, work through that. And you know when was the first time that you started feeling that way? And it it seems really basic, but it's. It's helping people figure out the way that they see the world and where it came from, because you don't see what happens. You see what happens through your filter, and so you have to change the filter. And, yeah, it's basically like I said, it's just finding the area that they want to change and working on the story, helping them figure out what the story is, what's the truth, what's the lie, where did it come from, who's involved, how is it manifesting in your day-to-day life? And golf is just one area where it could be expressed.
Speaker 1:So, whether we want to, admit it or not, we all have a system right.
Speaker 2:We all have a way. We all have a way, a system.
Speaker 1:We have, a process of doing things in our life and, even though we may not even recognize it or be in touch with that system, it's there and you're able. You're able to identify that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's literally why people have opinions. It's because they have a different way of processing information, and there's no quote unquote right or wrong way. But if the way that you process information is leading you to a less than favorable result, we should look at the way that you're processing information. Love it, you know so. For example, if you have someone who is afraid to say I love you to someone that they really actually love, you know, the question isn't well, why can't I say I love you? It's no, no, no. What is what would it mean about you if you said I love you? It's like? Well, it opens me up to pain. So pain equals love.
Speaker 3:It would make you vulnerable and it's like, yeah, and it's like when was the first time that you learned that saying I love you equaled pain? And most of the time there's like a childhood situation or a significant event where that was where that was learned. And I say learned on purpose, because we're only born with two fears the, the fear of bright lights and the fear of loud noises, because we go from being in our mother's stomach, where it's super dark and super quiet, and then we enter the world that's super bright and it's super loud, and that's why babies come out crying most of the time. Everything else is learned you learn shame, you learn anxiety, you learn guilt, you learn fear. You learn all of these things.
Speaker 1:I've never heard that.
Speaker 3:And it's fascinating. Yeah, and so if you, yeah, and so if you can learn these things, that means that you can know where you learn them from, and it also means that you can unlearn them. You know there's there's a because you, you created a system that that doesn't work, which means you can create a system. We just have to figure out which system works for you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, and ultimately segwaying a little bit into the group environment. You've done a lot of things for our team, sou Golf, but you've also done some stuff for um, for our instructors. You've also worked with larger groups. How does, again, one-on-one's gotta be the best? But we've taken so much from you, um, in learning, both with SOU golf, which is a group of almost 20. And then, um, you know our, our smaller staff of about five to six, depending on who's on like, how do you go about that process versus a one-on-one?
Speaker 3:Well, a one-on-one, I could just get more specific, like I just do more of what I would do in a group with the single person, so in the group I can give the general info and then people are doing it on their own and then on one-on-one I'm just going a lot deeper, specific, because they're giving me specifics, and then what will happen typically in a group is it'll be hey, is there anybody that's willing to give an example? Or or is anybody in here willing to share? And then I'll do like a one-on-one, in person in the group, and then people see how it works and so maybe it helps them structure the thing they're writing down, or whatever the case may be. A lot of.
Speaker 3:I make it very clear that I'm not this coach standing up here with this. You know this information that I'm the only person that has access to it and you guys have to come to me. It's like no, all I've done is spent, you know, almost seven years now learning what works best. I've coached close to a thousand people. Uh, youngest clients, 11, oldest one, 62. I've coached athletes at every level multiple sports, door-to-door sales companies, worked with some people in foreign governments.
Speaker 2:Let me stop you, because will you tell the door-to-door salesman story about the guy that like wasn't selling? Do you remember that? Yeah, please tell that real quick.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there was a. There was a guy who was sitting in on a group session and he came up to me after the group and he was like, hey, I'd love to do a session with you. And I was like, yeah, for sure. And so we did a 30-minute call the next day and I was just like, okay, what's going on? Where do you want to experience your information?
Speaker 3:He's like man, I just haven't been able to, um, you know, sell anything in like three weeks, and so all, literally all he did was redefine his definition of patience. Like, I kid you not, that was pretty much it. It was just okay, tell me about your experience. When you get to the doors, what happens? How do you feel? What do you believe about yourself when XYZ happens? What does that mean about the other person? Okay, when was the first time you felt blah, blah, blah?
Speaker 3:And I know I'm talking really fast through this because we finish it we come to the conclusion and he's like, oh so, basically I just need to be more patient, basically I just need to be more patient, which is not really profound. You would think, well, yeah, of course you need to be more patient, but it was what patience meant in his head and then he sold for the next five days. Oh man, that's a big difference and yeah, and so that was pretty cool to to see that happen. And I mean there's there's multiple stories of I had another kid he's 11, or he's 12 now and he's a he's on a soccer academy in Dallas and his parents came to me because he couldn't slide tackle anybody mentally. He hadn't slide tackled anybody in like five years.
Speaker 1:Let's not be specific or anything.
Speaker 3:I mean, yeah and uh, you know, they were just. I mean you have to slide tackle and you just can't, he can't do it. So again I just, you know, go back and essentially what had happened is his coach, when he was seven, his coach had kind of tripped in his ear about his aggression, so then he kind of went into a tackle not fully got injured, so his seven-year-old brain went slide tackle aggression, injury, bad. That's the story. And so I did a little exercise with him, redefined what a tackle was, a couple other things, and he slide tackled someone the next day, after five years of not slide tackling someone and again, it's not the that it seems so crazy but isn't is because it takes literally a couple of milliseconds to learn something, which means if you can learn it that fast, you can also unlearn it that quickly. It's just a matter of practicing it. But it's, the neuropathway gets stuck into this pattern and so you're primed where your body remembers, uh, based off of the story that you tell yourself about yourself.
Speaker 3:That's a hard truth, it is, and that's why, it is, and that's why the whole year my truth thing is so interesting, because most of the time, quote unquote, your truth is built off of a lie, but it's scary to ask. Ok, that's your truth, but what is the truth? You're compromising a truth for the.
Speaker 1:You're compromising the truth for a truth which could cost you years of moving forward in an area where you feel like you're being held back so I've overcome my um lack of patience and and because I I forced myself to be patient you you almost answered my question that I was gonna ask before. Um, but this comes into play with with tournaments and I and I'm thinking very deeply about my own son in preparation for a tournament, for a tournament, in days leading up to the tournament, there's such a hype that is building up in in his mind about this tournament and his vision for it and what he wants to see happen in that tournament, when he hasn't even played the course. You can't even envision the course and it always comes out negative. What advice do you have for people who tend to lean on the anxious side and stew on things for multiple days leading up to a big event, whether it be a golf tournament, whether it be a job interview, whether it be something you know, any big decision making thing in your life?
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's a really good question, and I think the first thing I would say is that, well, notice that you have the ability to create something that isn't there and feel a certain way about it. We're all capable of creating these visions and dreams and scenarios that just tend to be negative, which means that we can create them. So, if we can create the negative one, know that you can create the positive one, because you've already created a negative one, which means you can create one. So that would be the first thing is that if you have the ability to create the negative one, that's one option. And then you go, ok, well, what would it look like for it to turn out? Well, you might as well do both.
Speaker 3:You know, we all, we all like justice, we all like things to be even, we all like things to be even, we all like things to be fair. So if you're going to think about the worst possible outcome, you might as well think about the best possible outcome. That's just like a general statement, and the thing I hear a lot of the time is oh gosh, there's no way out. And then I'll say, well, if there was a way out, what would it look like? And then they tell me the way out and I'm like, well, there is a way out, or I I can't. I just can't explain. I don't know how to explain this. So what about people, if you were?
Speaker 1:what? What about people who have a very positive outlook on something? They go and do it with the absolute best scenario in their head and their level of play or whatever you know. Whatever transpires in that chain of events doesn't meet their expectation that they went into it with.
Speaker 3:Well, the first thing I would say is unfortunately, that's life. You know, I and I don't say that facetiously, but like it's true I have hit putts. I have hit putts that came off my face, terrible, and go in, and then I hit really good putts that don't go in and I hit a terrible swing and it ends up in the fairway and I hit a and I and I have a really good swing and it ends up out of bounds. So at which point in time am I the better golfer? It just depends on the definition. If I, if I define being a good putter as making a putt, then I will only ever be a good putter when it goes in.
Speaker 1:Now this is a deep this is a deep conversation. This is something that all of us struggle with. A you know where I made the best contact with my driver that I've made in a long time, but it went out of bounds because I was aiming left, expecting a fade, and I hit it dead straight.
Speaker 3:So it's a terrible shot when it comes to the game. And then what do we say? Exactly, yep. And then what do we say? Gosh, I hit such a bad shot, but you did it. But that's the story. And then, when you go back to think about your round, you're not seeing reality, you're seeing how you felt about it, and then you create a false narrative, and that's how it starts.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So ultimately these false narratives build up and what's really cool about what you've done is you can teach people how to be aware of the false narrative and then train them very quickly to understand and ask the right questions, I guess, if you will, to themselves, to be able to create their new narrative. And it's funny because personality traits are so different. I mean, my philosophy in teaching golf is every player is different and it's just because those personality traits and the expectations expectations and again the story they've written their whole lives about what, what they think they should be able to do, based on other sport or based on success in business or whatever that would be. And then they get to the golf course and they're like I just suck, I want to quit, I want to, I don't, I don't care anymore. And you're just like. You're fine, you got to slow down and we got to figure this out. But like the funniest thing about all this, daniel, you're fine, you got to slow down and we got to figure this out. But like the funniest thing about all this, daniel, you've spoken at the Oregon PGA teaching and coaching summit with me and we all agree that our students like don't realize that what you do is more important than what I do at some level, because I can't teach them if they're not ready to be taught.
Speaker 2:Yeah, right. And and it's so frustrating because it's so hard as a coach to say you need to go see our and I love the name emotional intelligence, because it's not mental performance, it's not psychiatrist. So it helps a lot to be able to say man, like you got to go talk to somebody, I can't help you, I'm not your shrink, like I am, but I'm not. And I would love nothing more than for you to meet Daniel Shuler and he's going to fix you in a day. Will you talk to him? And and again, like they don't. It's, it's hard, dude, because they don't want it and I don't, I, the hardest thing is to sell it. But then when I say, hey, um, I want you to talk to my buddy about some things and don't say who you are, what you do, okay, sure, yeah, whatever. Like they will you know. So it's so weird, yeah.
Speaker 3:Well, it's based. It's based off of the story that they believe. Again, like, this story is the story is so powerful and there's there's an overarching story and then there's like a mini story. So if you're, if you're really watching your weight and you walk into a store and you walk by a bag of chips, what do you do? You, you find a story to justify whether or not you're going to get them. So you look at the chips and you're okay, did I work out today? Yes, I did Okay, so maybe I can get away with these chips. Or I didn't work out today. So you literally figure you make your decisions in the grocery store because of the story you believe about that ingredient. Yeah, that's, those are, those are micro stories.
Speaker 3:And then you have the overall story where, like, if someone's deepest belief is that they're unworthy, they're not looking how to do something, they're looking how to do something as someone who is unworthy, which means their filter is automatically going to be disqualifying themselves. And so I want to make sure that I answered both of Darren's questions, which was the original one was you know, what do people do if they have this anxiety about these future events? Well, number one is, again, it's understanding. This is what we call a hypothetical, where you think about something that hasn't happened in the future and, because your brain can't determine that it's not happening, it thinks it's happening now, and so you have an emotion come into your body immediately about something that hasn't even happened yet.
Speaker 3:And I love this quote where it says a lot of the worst experiences, some of the worst experiences in our lives are the ones that we haven't had happen yet, and a lot of the time we actually have ourselves experience things twice because first we have it happen in our mind and it doesn't even need to happen in order for us to have that sort of quote unquote traumatic experience. But if it does, let's say we step into that like public speaking. A lot of people are afraid of public speaking and so they picture themselves like throwing up on stage or stammering or sounding like an idiot or whatever the case may be. They don't have to, even they could be in their house, but they are holding the embarrassment and the shame and the guilt in their body in their house alone, without being on stage, as if they were, and then what happens is they remember that emotion and then they bring that into places that it's not relevant.
Speaker 1:And then someone just picture. They remember that emotion and then they bring that into places that it's not relevant. And then someone just sent a picture of everybody naked, right.
Speaker 3:Yeah, which I mean personally. That wouldn't really help me, but it's to you know, it's to quote unquote, distract yourself, but it's OK when you think about yourself, public speaking, for example, and let's say you do mess up, what does that mean about you? What would that mean if you messed up public speaking, you know, and they say, well, it means I'm a failure. And then my question would be according to who? According to me, okay, and when was the first time that you learned that not doing well public speaking made you a failure? Well, I don't know, I guess I've never had that happen.
Speaker 3:Okay, so now we have this false definition that's created about something that hasn't happened, which number one just shows the power of our mind. Which, again I said, the fact that you can create something that hasn't existed yet and experience such a powerful emotion in your body means that our words and our thoughts have power. And so one of the other things I say is the person you talk to the most. I mean, I don't just say this, a lot of people do, but the person that you talk to the most is yourself.
Speaker 2:So you have to be really mindful about the way that you talk to yourself.
Speaker 3:What do you think Go ahead? No, I was just saying that the biggest thing is to be just ask more questions. I know it sounds really basic, Like I. Like I try to keep it as simple as possible. This isn't this. Oh, you're super, you know I'm I'm working on hopefully, hopefully, giving a Ted talk here within the next year, and it's just you're, you're one question away from total identity transformation.
Speaker 3:And I don't mean they're like, okay, well, what's the question? But it just means that the more questions you ask, the closer that you get. So what does this, what do I believe this means about me? Okay, and where did that come from? And so, since that hasn't happened and since that's not true, what does that mean that I can believe about myself? Well, that my worth isn't tied to a result, and what does that mean? That I can give 100% of my effort without needing the result to determine how valuable of a person I am?
Speaker 3:And even the CEOs of companies I've worked with I'm like you cannot have your identity be in this company, because it means that your identity is contingent on the success or the failure of the company, which again, is not true. And then they'll make these decisions based off of the status of the company rather than who they are and their true identity and how they can function, and they go into these false narratives to make decisions, and that's when companies start to fall apart and company is just a word for a group of individuals. So you have to know that each person is different and each person has an identity they're working with and each person has a story.
Speaker 2:So I have a question for you. This is kind of a different side of this. I've heard things like for every negative, you say to yourself you need seven positives. What do you think about that?
Speaker 3:I mean I wouldn't disagree. I've never heard those exact numbers and I think that positive reinforcement is really good. I think what's really interesting is if I got the seven positive things first and then got one negative one, that negative one's still going to stick with me.
Speaker 2:A hundred percent.
Speaker 3:So you know so it's like okay, well, if we're just trying to combat the negative with a quantity of positive, you know what? What is that means that the, the emotional issue here is a quantitative problem. What it's not it's, it's, uh, the belief about the negative. Like I could, I could be told wow, you're, you're such an amazing golfer and you're this, and you're that, and you're, you did so well today. Blah, blah, blah. And then your coach comes and he's like what the heck was that? Immediately, you're like yeah, I know, right, all these other people were lying. So why do we do that? And it's because it's the thing that is easiest for us to believe the fastest. We believe lies about ourselves so much quicker than we believe the truth, because it's typically where we tend to spend most of our time in our head you're on the course and you hit a bad shot on the range.
Speaker 3:What's the first thing? You think, gosh, that was so bad. Uh, I know you're so. You're just so bad at golf, I know exactly. But but I'm saying that our, our, our mind is so primed to be down on ourself that when we hear something negative, it feels more familiar than the truth. Yeah, and that's why. That's why, when you hear one negative thing, even if there's 10 positive, we hold onto the negative because it feels most real.
Speaker 2:I think you hit a really good point. Um, ultimately, I asked that question not expecting that answer and and I think you reworked it to the point of that is like it's like a book, it's like a published thing, so I don't want to go into it too much because maybe they and it's on the edge of the cup and this is back on hole 13. And you're like I can't believe that didn't go in and you just put all this truth to that. And then you get done with 18 and that's all you talk about and you shoot 72,. It's like you lose sight of I just shot even par and instead you're so fired up about the putt that you missed the one shot, the one shot that ruined your whole game. And what does that do to you in the future? Like that's the frustration of if we go back to golf, but in life at the same time, that's your negative self-talk as opposed to positive self-talk, and if we all just talk a little bit more positive about ourselves, we'd probably feel more successful.
Speaker 3:Yeah, well, and yeah, and it's funny because most of us spend our day-to-day in self-preservation and what that is responding to shots like that. It's a defense mechanism, because what do we want people to think, no matter what we shoot? That I'm better than that.
Speaker 2:What does?
Speaker 3:that mean about me. If I come in shooting 72 and I know I missed a long putt, I have two options. I can either say you know what? I played a really great round. I could have dropped a couple more putts, but I shot even par. Cool, that's true. Or I could come in and I could say gosh, I cannot believe I am the shot 72. It should have been 68.
Speaker 3:I missed this, but, but this, but I suck at golf. And but what am I doing? I'm protecting myself from criticism by doing that, because I'm already I'm I am. I am protecting myself because I'm acknowledging the fact that I could have done better. And then people will say, oh, he could have done better. I don't need to tell him, I don't need to ask him why he only shot 72. That's the story in my head. It's not true, but it's like if people know that I could have done better, they won't ask me how I messed up. Or if they do, they'll be like, oh, he's actually a lot better than 72. Wow, that's really cool. He could have shot 68, and it'll make me feel better.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 3:So, daniel, and again, I know you're friends with one of them, so like who would you work with and why?
Speaker 3:oh wow, can I give two, and for two different reasons absolutely 100% so after I saw the episode of full swing with Brooks Koepka, I was like dang, that guy needs some identity coaching because he just it was tough to watch. Um, so I'd love to work with him, just because I I think he's such a powerful individual that has no idea and I think the way in which he thinks he has power is not even close to what he could actually do, not even. I'm not even just talking about golf, like I can kind of see his narrative and what he believes about himself and how that manifests into his marriage, into his, into his golf game, like all of that stuff. Uh, so I would say brooks is like the asterix to a player um, and man, that's you gotta use use Dylan, dude, come on, just do it.
Speaker 2:You guys are doing each other.
Speaker 3:Yeah, throw it out there of course, like I'd, I'd love to work with Dylan. I think it'd be. I think it'd be awesome.
Speaker 3:Dylan Wu such an incredible player and, uh, he's just right there so much of the time and I think I think there's you know, anybody that's extremely good, right on the peak of breaking through, there's just this gosh. Do you think I'm really going to? Am I really good enough to do it? So I'd love to work with him just to find out what he believes about himself. Um, when he, when he gets into these tournaments where he starts playing really well, you know, and I mean he, he shoots really well in some of these tournaments, he's right up there and then, and then maybe Saturday rolls around and he'll shoot, you know, three or four over, whatever the case may be, and, um, but yeah, I would say him, and then it's either between, uh, between Bryson, and Bryson and Rory funny, funny thing about Dylan.
Speaker 1:Last year he played in tournament where he knocked in an albatross on a par five and it was the only shot of the entire tournament that was not caught on camera? How?
Speaker 3:crazy is that that never happens.
Speaker 1:That never happens. They have so many cameras out on these holes now on the pga tour that it was a it was a big dog leg and he just crushed his second shot and he said in the interview afterwards he knew that he hit a good shot, he knew that it was headed in the right direction, but he had no idea how good of a shot it was. And then all of a sudden he just heard the crowd from you know hundreds of yards away just erupt and he knew that he had made that albatross.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that would have been cool for him to be able to watch that. Well, you know, that happened at the Masters, where they had trouble filming Bryson, and so he ended up bringing his own YouTube crew to film it. But but yeah, I think working, working with uh with Bryson or Rory would just be incredible. Um, I just I respect what Bryson's done for the game and just he's, so I'm with you.
Speaker 3:Like you can. You can tell he's so confident in himself, because, I mean, everything he does is just a little off in the best way. Like the way he puts all of his. All of his irons are strong. He's got big grips on all of them. They're all the same length. He's swings out of his butt every single time. Like he can hit the driver 450 yards. Like he's just crazy. And so I'd love to just work with him to be like man.
Speaker 3:What story led you to believing that you were able to do that? Who else grew up exactly like that? But because of one comment, a coach or parent or critic said they gave up. They said you know what? Yeah, you're right, it's still just that lying voice of like, yeah, you're not really going to make what. Yeah, you're right, it's that that's still just that lying voice of like, yeah, you're not really gonna make it, or you're not that good, or you're you're unworthy, or or whatever it is. And that that filter. We don't see the world as it is. We see. We see the world as we are, you know, and and so in order for us to to change the way that we see things, we have to know how we see them in the first place? Based off of what?
Speaker 2:Daniel, you are the man Appreciate you being on tonight. Darren usually talks a little bit about what questions we got for him here at the end. Daniel, what's your favorite course you've ever played? Always with me, buddy.
Speaker 1:StoneRidge. No, no, no, no, no, no, all right all right, let me restate this what's your favorite course you played with noel? What's your favorite course that you've really ever played?
Speaker 3:uh, I love capalua. That course was just stunning. Um, I you know as as hard as it is. I actually really enjoyed industry hills. Um, in california I played a. I played a. It's in, it's actually in industry hills. I can't remember if it's a country club or a golf club, but it's called industry hills golf club. Um, and then there is another course down in rancho called dove canyon nice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's good I actually hit.
Speaker 3:I was getting coached down there and there's one of these par threes that goes over a canyon onto this two-tiered green and the pin was on the bottom tier, the, and the tier was maybe 10 yards long and maybe four yards wide. Like it was disgustingly hard and I jammed a six iron. I was like one 90 out or something and I jammed a six iron right on top of the, I stuck it on top of the ledge and then it just trickled down to about five inches and he said that's one of the best shots I've ever seen anybody hit on this hole.
Speaker 1:So what was your mentality? Stepping up to the ball on that hole, hitting over the canyon? What were you telling yourself?
Speaker 3:I probably was saying don't hit it in the canyon.
Speaker 2:Yes, you were. There's a negative side.
Speaker 3:There's the human. Yeah, I was gosh. I think I was about 16, 17. But I wish I could have really used a mental coach when I was playing, so it wasn't.
Speaker 1:the positive attitude of this hole is within reach. Let's knock it in the hole it was. Let's not hit it in the canyon.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it was. I mean, it was basically just let's hit as best of a shot as we can and it turned out okay. But I I think you know, and maybe for fun, we can end on your your opening question slash statement about the water. You know, it's funny in order for us to not think about something, we have to think about it to see if we're not thinking about it.
Speaker 1:That's very complicated, it's very deep, but it's very true and we can all relate. Yes, awareness is okay.
Speaker 3:Like, how do I figure out if I'm not thinking about the water? Well, I have to think about the water to gauge if I was thinking about it or not. But by the time I'm there, I'm already thinking about the water. So, acknowledging the water is there. We're not ignorant here. There's water on the course. But what you do is you're like okay, there's water in play. There's also a fairway. The fairway is just as in play as the water is. So the trees are just as in play as the trees are. So what? Trees are just as in play as the trees are. So what do we do? Nothing different. You pick your target, you know your ball flight and you just hit the ball.
Speaker 3:And that's why golf is hard, exactly, and that's what Kira did last year at the tournament.
Speaker 2:In Arizona.
Speaker 3:No, this was at a conference.
Speaker 3:Oh, a conference last year up in gold canyon and then I'll, yeah, and then I'll end with this, just because this is how this is how it happens. She's on number 18, crushes her drive. I was following her on the last hole. It's a fantastic drive right down the middle and she's in a divot and she can't move it. Obviously she goes gosh, I can't believe I'm gonna divot, blah, blah. I said, all right, what do, what can we do here? She's like well, I can, and there was. I mean, it was a really hard shot. There was a tree on the right, there was water on the right side of the green, like it was. It was pretty tough.
Speaker 3:She's like I can't believe I'm gonna divot. And what if I was? Like, okay, what are we gonna? What can we do from this position? She's like like, well, I can take this club, I'm going to aim to the left side of the green and I'm just going to see what happens. I was like, great, sounds good. She hit it to 10 feet so it could have gone either way. It's like we focus on what we can do or we keep thinking about the, because she didn't hit a bad drive. She hit a great drive with a bad result. That doesn't make it a bad drive, and then she could have said, well, what if the divot pulls it to the water? And then this is just grounding yourself in reality. That's what emotional intelligence is. So being confident is is knowing what you can do now, immediately, what's happening now, versus how you're feeling about everything that's going on around you.
Speaker 1:You can assess your feelings later well, this spring, all of us going back out onto the course, um, the weather getting nicer across the country and us all heading back out to the course, this is amazing encouragement glad to hear that, yeah you know, uh, daniel, going back to kira too, you'd be proud of her.
Speaker 2:Um, from loomis trails where you're talking about their hole 18 to her shooting two under par her best tournament finish final round. She jumped from 65th to 54th in the country this week and has a huge opportunity to get an at-large bid to nationals, depending on what happens with everyone else. So we're hoping that everything goes in her favor and she gets to go to michigan here in the middle of the month. And, um, the girl gosh, it's so crazy to say this. She's the closest thing to anything I've ever coached, that is, lpga potential. Now we have we and we have another guy on our team. Same thing with PGA potential. It's so hard to be out there, but it's different. And if we can get their mental games caught up to their physical games, then it's going to be scary. And when you say Brooks Koepka, you're going to be saying no, I want to just interview Kira Chang, right, I mean.
Speaker 3:I hate to say it like that.
Speaker 2:But, man, you get that girl on page with where her physical is. She's hitting it 300 dude and firm fairways. That's awesome. Anyway, daniel, you're the man, dude. Thanks for coming all the way from Texas to be with us. I know it's like 11 o'clock your time and we want you on again, but uh, dude, thanks for being with us tonight absolutely.
Speaker 3:Thanks so much for having me.
Speaker 1:I appreciate it thanks, daniel, take care all right, have a good one all right. What do we have to look forward to over the next couple of weeks?
Speaker 2:no, oh, darren, I'm super pumped. I mean, first of all, going back to Daniel, that's just inspiring stuff. I mean, I have learned so much from him and he's like 10 years younger than me. The guy is amazing. You can actually reach out to him through contact at golf garage Oregoncom. So I wanted to give that shout out and we'll get you in touch with Daniel, so you don't have to be a golfer to need emotional intelligence. I mean, it's just life balance, man. We say that word so lightly, I don't even know what it means, but I'm just going to use it right there. Ultimately, looking forward. Moving forward on the podcast super exciting stuff. Ever heard of a Titleist golf ball?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Number one golf ball on tour. I mean maybe for a while. So yeah, I mean we're, we're getting there there's some companies coming out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, here we go. No, but, um, I have a good friend, um, that was the executive director of the Northern Ohio section, pga, and I was. I sat on their board for a while and I'll never forget when he knew I was going out to LA and he's like, hey, my son's out there. I'm like, oh cool, what's he do? He's like, oh, he works for Titleist. I'm like, oh nice. He's like, well, you should go see him. Like, well, okay, what's he, what's he do? It? Well, he's. I'm.
Speaker 2:I was going out to LA for, um, I think it was Carlsbad actually, and we're going down to Callaway. At the time and I was on staff with them and I let the executive director know I was in the area and he called his son and right away it's like next day, yeah, come on in eight o'clock in the morning. I'm like great. So I show up there and you know I'll save a little bit of this story for next week. But I've got a Callaway hat on in Titleist. That was the only hat I had on. Next thing, you know these, you know these guys are there. I'm trying to hide it under my armpit. I had it off.
Speaker 2:I'm indoors, I'm like, yeah, I'm like crap, I screwed that one up, but it's, you know, it's Carl's bad, it's sunny outside under my armpit. And next thing you know we're introductions and somebody's like hey, what's that Like, what's what? Oh, what's that under your armpit?
Speaker 1:Something I found in the parking lot. Yeah, I found it.
Speaker 2:I mean they literally gave me so much crap that within two minutes they literally gave me so much crap that within two minutes they had a Titleist ad on me. It was pretty funny. But Dino Antonucci was a fitter at Titleist and now he's in their tour department on the road with the big dogs. So Dino's going to be on with us next week, super excited. So I am looking forward to all those people calling in, you know asking some questions for Dino. You know Titleist kind of brought golf to another level. I mean I think Tiger Woods had a Titleist 3-wood in his bag for a long time, even while he's playing Nike.
Speaker 1:They did. I mean for the longest time they were. They were it. Everybody was playing with the Pro V1s anyway.
Speaker 2:Right, it went like Spalding. Then it went Titleist Pro V1 out of like nowhere right.
Speaker 1:Out of nowhere. And then it was that way for a long time.
Speaker 2:And you know, titleist is one of those companies that just always has taken it to another level between you know golf ball, their golf ball company, absolutely. But Bob Vokey, vokey Wedges, I mean shoot, everybody knows that name, it's just a household name. And you know, there for a while they didn't. I felt like their driver was struggling, but they had great players still playing it. And now all of a sudden they're up there. I mean their driver's phenomenal, which phenomenal. You know Adam Scott is one of the only golfers that has like the perfect swing. If you look at it right, I mean I don't know what you even say. You know quote unquote. But no, they do it right. So we're looking forward to having Dino Antonucci on the show next week.
Speaker 1:Excellent Dude. That was awesome information tonight. That was inspiring for me. That was inspiring for I hope everybody out there um getting ready to hit the course with a little bit more um beautiful weather and an active golf season ahead.
Speaker 2:I would just say let's start thinking positive. Out there on the golf course, it's your choice, Darren. Pleasure buddy Likewise.
Speaker 1:Take care, we'll see you next week.
