The Civil Union
Political discourse with a midwest twist
The Civil Union
Not So Civil Pope Trump Intimidations | 05.09.25
In this episode of 'The Civil Union', hosts Alex and Ryan discuss their anecdotes from their week, including dining at local sushi restaurants and dessert spots. They delve into current political controversies such as Trump’s AI-generated Pope image, the scandal involving Ron DeSantis’s Hope Florida foundation, and the arrest of Wisconsin Judge Hannah Dugan. Additionally, they cover updates on the significant reliance of the horse racing industry on foreign workers with H-2B visas and play a fun game comparing quotes from Trump and Darth Vader. The episode wraps up with remarks on Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer's tactical collaboration with Trump
00:00 Introduction to The Civil Union Podcast
01:11 Weekly Recap and Sushi Adventures
04:03 Dog Talk and BarkBox Fun
05:38 Movie Reviews and AI Dubbing
07:38 Trump's AI Pope Controversy
11:56 New American Pope Announcement
15:23 DeSantis Family Controversy
17:19 Trump vs. Darth Vader: Who Said It?
21:44 Kentucky Derby and Immigrant Workers
25:12 Judge Arrested for Protecting Migrant
28:39 Michigan Governor's Dilemma with Trump
32:18 Conclusion
Music: What's The Angle? by Shane Ivers -
https://www.silvermansound.com
Welcome to the Civil Union, the podcast where politics meets partnership. We're Alex and Ryan, a married couple, navigating life and debates in a conservative state. We bring you sharp insights, bold opinions, and. Honest conversations about the political issues shaping our lives, especially those living on the society's margins. Tune in for real talk. A touch of humor and plenty of passion because when it comes to politics, every voice matters and we are here to make sure they, they're heard. God, we gotta change that intro. One day you will get it right. I think I really believe in you. We need to rewrite it. Well welcome everybody. Um, just a reminder, we are on TikTok and Instagram. Uh, just follow us at our very new and very fresh handle. The Civil Union Pod. Yes, that's the Civil Union Pod, both on Instagram and TikTok. We are trying to push out more content, more things for you to enjoy. So just follow us there to see what we have to offer. Absolutely. So it's, it's been a successful week so far. How about you, Alex? Yeah, it's been a good week so far. It's not been bad at all. That's good. Yeah, so we even managed to squeeze in a dinner date at one of our favorite sushi restaurants, sushi, sushi Hana in Afton, Missouri. You know, I'm not sure if the two people up front are married or the owners, but they're so passionate and knowledgeable about the roles they serve. The vibe of the restaurant is. Totally like transports you to Japan. And I just love hitting those small family run restaurants. They feel so authentic, you know? Yeah. And every time we go, we always compliment their dishes and their cups. They just like, they do everything right and cozy. You know, we have three different sushi restaurants right now in rotation, and they all are completely different vibes. One is more modern with. Anime everywhere. One is more has like, like fancy rolls that, that you're just piled on with different things. And then Sushi Hana is more like your classic sushi place where it's not rou, rou or frills, but it's just solid good sushi. So it's, it's kind, you know, it is funny'cause when we lived in Oklahoma City or when we lived in. going to Texas, there aren't as many sushi places. So St. Louis, weirdly enough, has a lot of sushi places, like a lot of different options. We haven't even gone to some that we've heard of. Um, and I'm curious to try some of the other ones. But yeah, we have some good offerings here. Yeah, I just feel like I'm cheating on my other sushi restaurants when I go to a new one, so I try to keep it like. The same one, you know? Yeah. And that's the thing with sushi is like, all of them are like small businesses. You know, when you go to like Red Lobster or something, you're not really, it's just a, it's just a big corporation. But like those businesses, they're all family run. But anyway, yeah. So we also swung by a dessert spot up in Ladu called Jars by Fabio vii. They're known for these little like mini pudding jars, apparently a big trend. I went with the Bananas and Cream. It was. Delicious. Uh, what did you get, Alex? Which one did you get? So I had gotten the red velvet cake and the double chocolate, I believe. And I will tell you that I wasn't impressed with the red velvet cake'cause it was just cake with like icing in it and it was just really, really sweet and kind of dry. But the double chocolate one I actually ate last night and it was. Way better. I mean the, they had like fudge in there. They had some pudding in there. I mean, it was good. It was way better than the red velvet. Yeah, they were pretty good. Yeah. So clearly I did fall off the health train last week. I just, I feel so disgusting right now. Like each week I like meal prep, about four meals. You know, the, the chicken, broccoli, rice, super simple. And I think I only ate one because I had been rushing around so much. There was just like. We were dealing with just like unnecessary drama going on. But I am back on the train again and plus our vet told us that the border Collie needs to lose weight. He's gained 10 pounds since last year, but so I, I've been walking the dogs almost. Each each day. So it's not our fault. He's a good boy and deserves all those treats and he loves those cookie ones that have like the icing in the middle. Those are his favorite. They're like little Oreos, but for dogs, he like licks all the icing away. Plus we just got resubscribed to the BarkBox again, which we absolutely love. I always forget how much that box is so much fun until we do it again and then we're like, this is so fun.'cause every. Box has a different theme, but you know, he's happy. And so if he's a little chunky, it's fine. I kind of wish Shelby would get chunky. I think chunky golden retrievers are the cutest things. You always see them on Instagram and they're just so fluffy and cute, and she just won't get chunky because she's so active. We monitor our dog steps with their collars. They use like PHI collars, it's fi and. Shelby always goes like above her daily goals goal. Yeah. All the time. So she's, I, I've lost, I've lost faith that she will get fat. You know, speaking of, of the dogs, I think I'm slowly drifting into the middle aged category because now I surf the web, like for themed bandanas for the dogs. Like we had the Easter ones and now they're wearing the. Spring ones, and now I'm contemplating purchasing a July 4th themed one. So who am I becoming here? It's, it's, uh, it's a new me, I guess. I like the bandanas and I think the dogs like the bandanas. It makes'em feel special. Yeah. Yeah. They, they like them. They do. So what else is going on, Alex? Anything new? Um, no, I, I went and saw, um, thunderbolts last Friday, which was the new Marvel movie, and that had, you know, it was a good movie. There's some people were saying it's like one of the best Marvel movies, at least in this, in this next section of the MCU, which I. Can't really argue about, it's not the best Marvel movie, but it's good. And it deals a lot with mental health. It's probably one of the strongest superhero movies that deals with mental health and depression. And it was really well done. I mean, I do give it that. Um, and I love Florence Puke, Florence Puke, Florence Puck, whatever, how you ever say her last name. I love, love, love her. And she is ma, the main character in this movie, basically. And she was really good. So I would suggest it. I'm gonna go see a movie called Something Space or something. UFO or whatever. It's a Swedish movie. I'm gonna see it tomorrow. I'm really interested in it. It's the first movie that they've AI generated dubbing. So they took AI generation and used dubbing of other acting voices, and then the AI morphed the actors' faces and lips into looking like they're speaking English. And it morphed like the. Swedish papers that were written in Swedish now the papers automatically are translated into English. The whole movie has been flipped for a US audience, and it's been purely done by ai. It's gonna be, I'm really actually excited about it. So it's a foreign movie, but it's, it's the first one to use artificial intelligence. To dub, I mean,'cause before you would go see dubbing and the voices didn't match the lips and it would still be in that. So what is the movie about? Um, it supposedly is like a Swedish version of like Stranger Things and Interstellar. It's like about alien, like a UFO and it's set like in the eighties or something. It's supposedly pretty cool vibes, but it's all in Swedish. So it's gonna be interesting to see where this movie, how this movie performs and what people think about it.'cause it could be the future of other. Foreign movies. Wow. That's gonna be interesting. It's gonna be interesting. Tell us about it on our next episode. Yeah. Um, so my husband was raised Catholic and so when I tell you when the Catholics are pissed off, you know, you know it's real. Here's a sound bit of Trump and his controversial Pope pic,
Speaker:Some Catholics were not so happy about the image of you looking like the Pope.
Speaker 2:Oh, I see. You mean they, they can't take a joke. You don't mean the Catholics, you mean the fake news media? Not the Catholics loved it. Carmo Dolan, I had nothing to do with it. Somebody made up a picture of me dressed like the Pope and they put it out on the internet. Uh, that's not me that did it. I have no idea where it came from. Maybe it was ai, but uh, I know nothing about it. I just saw it, uh, last evening. Actually, my wife thought it was cute. She said, isn't that nice? My
Speaker:question about it, actually,
Speaker 2:I would not be able to be married though. That would be a lot. I'd have to, to the best of my knowledge. Popes aren't big on getting married, are they? Not that we know of, no. No. I think it's a fake news media that, you know, they, they're fakers. My
Speaker:question though, sir, was about the fact that it was put out on the White House account, even though it was AI generated. It was a joke. It was a meme. Does it at all diminish the substance of the official White House account to have it go out on that particular chance? I'll give you a
Speaker 2:break. It was just, uh, somebody did it in fun. It's fine. Have to have a little fun, don't you?
so Trump went ahead and. F posted an AI generated photo of himself dressed as the Pope on his truth social last week and just a few hours after that the White House reposted the photo on their official ex account. Did you saw the photo right Alex? I did. It was absolutely ridiculous, but, but here's where things got intense Catholic leaders and at least one major US Catholic group are not happy about it. this like. Catholic group in New York dropped a serious message saying there's nothing clever or funny about the image. Basically they're calling out the mockery saying, don't mess with us or our faith right now. So, yeah, I mean, here's the thing. I was raised Catholic. I think a lot of people actually in this country were, especially in St. Louis. My relationship with the church, let's just say it changed a lot after college. That's a whole other story I'm not even gonna get into. But here's what I will say about this situation. Yes, the Catholic Church, depending on a congregation, doesn't always support L-G-B-T-Q. People like us, it's no surprise. Some places are downright hostile. Others try to be more open. I have met many liberal Catholics, including nuns. Some do believe that love is love. I mean, Pope Francis made some moves in that direction as well, but religion is still minefield. Every faith has people still clinging ancient views, and that makes it complicated. It makes it hard for some people to feel civility towards this religion. I get it still. Respect has to go both ways. We want people to respect. Pride. Same goes for religious traditions like the papal conclave. You don't have to believe in it, but you can respect that. It means something to millions of people. Republicans love to scream blasphemy and oh my goodness. When someone uses Christian imagery and art or pop culture, remember the outrage overly Olympic opening ceremony in Paris and the whole last Supper reference, they re quote recreated it and there was a. Bunch of drag queens and artistic performers on the deadly bridge over the SANE river. The Olympic officials, I think, came out and said it was actually a reference to the gods of Olympus. But anyway, fast forward now and the same crowd is totally fine with this Republican president being edited as the Pope. No one's saying shit. Posted it was posted by the official White House account. So no matter how Trump can spin this and say, oh, I didn't know about it, he still like promoted it. That is hypocrisy at its finest and its selective outrage to those Republicans. If you're a Catholic Republican especially, and you're fine with what Trump did or was just able to sweep it under the rug. Let's move on to a different story. Maybe ask yourself, is it about the religion or. Just what fits your narrative when it comes to these things? I mean, who thought it was okay to share it? That's the bottom line. Even if they didn't create it when they saw it, who was like, oh, this is great. Let's post it on the White House account. It's so stupid. Uh, it is crazy. So, I know you, you work overnight, so you sleep during the day. Did you see that they found a new pope today? I, so it just popped on my account, like I saw something about it. I haven't dug, but I did see that. His name is Pope Leo. He's the first American Pope and he is from Chicago. He actually spent a year here in St. Louis in the 1970s, um, a few miles from where we are recording this today. So I found that interesting. Interesting. I'll have to look him up. Is he, does he We do. We know if he's tales liberal or conservative? Liberal, like the posts that I have seen, like on social media. Of course, I'm not doing research on the new Pope right now, but, very liberal leaning, like anti the deportation thing. He's, uh, I. I, I don't want to say anything else that I, that's not factual right now, but that's a good thing. And I don't think people realize how important it was that we pick a liberal pope or they, they picked a liberal pope because the Pope, even if you don't, aren't Catholic, they are a worldwide leader, just like president and just like anyone else, and they are brought to the table. Their views are respected. And so if we would've had a conservative Pope Trump, I mean, think of the ramifications of that and what that would've done with the Catholic. Church in the us all the, all the shit they would've defended with Trump. I mean, it could have been really bad. So if he is liberal leaning, that is a very good thing. So, um, because they do, they do bring their thoughts to the table. A lot of leaders respect them. A lot of leaders meet with them. So we need a liberal pope. So I'll be good if he is. Yeah. So switching gears here. Uh, political scandal in Florida, shocking, and this has nothing to do with Trump that we know of yet, but this scandal involves Governor Ronald DeSantis and his wife Casey. So in 2021, Casey DeSantis founded Hope Florida, a charity to connect underprivileged Floridians with government resources and a whole network of different charities throughout. And over the three years, the charity managed to raise around$2 million, which is a lot of money, clearly. Then just last fall.$10 million arrived to the Hope Florida Foundation from an unlikely source. A Medicaid contractor embroiled in a case of Overbilling, but within weeks, the money was gone not to the churches or other groups helping the needy. Instead, the 10 million was funneled to two dark money nonprofit political groups. Those groups which aren't required to disclose their donors then sent$8.5 million to pacs or political action committees, which helped Ronald and his allies defeat a November ballot measure that would have legalized marijuana in the state of Florida. In his two terms as governor DeSantis has enjoyed strong support from the Republican controlled legislator, but now the state Republican House members allege that a criminal investigation is warranted for this dark money. Essentially, this comes after Mr. And Ms. DeSantis are mulling whether she should run for governor or not. As DeSantis the the man is turning out. All this money comes from a corporation, which I think is headquartered here in St. Louis Centene, who was over billing taxpayers of medications, specifically in the state of Florida. Centene paid out about$67 million. 10 million of that 67 million went to Casey DeSantis Hope Florida Foundation. Such a windfall. Is unheard of for this foundation of the 2 million the foundation has raised before the last fall windfall. Essentially they had given around about$500,000 in grants. Those grants mostly ranged from 10 to like$20,000 in payments. That was clearly not the case with the$10 million payment that the foundation received, Even if no criminal charges are filed, one person is marked by this investigation is the potential governor candidate Ronald's wife, Casey DeSantis. And in case you care, Trump has already endorsed a candidate in the race Republican Congressman Byron Donalds. Yeah, this whole story is a minefield for the DeSantis family. I would be curious if Casey does continue to try to run for governor, some say. She doesn't have the stomach for it. Um, especially for the fight, if it gets really dirty, if she did run, this would be a huge hurdle to get over for them. Even if they're not convicted, even if they're not found guilty, it's still gonna follow them. It makes you wonder if this story was planted and the other Republicans are in on the hit job. I mean, they're all kind of ganging up on it. It just seems very conveniently timed. Like, they definitely hired an Olivia Pope Republican version of an Olivia Pope, it sounds like, to find this story out. Yeah. Um, so, okay. Game time babe. And you know what? I got the game this week. All right. So you get to answer. Oh man. It's a, it's a who set it game and, uh, since we celebrated May the fourth, it's gonna be who said it between Trump and Darth Vader because, you know, they're very much alike. So, here we go. Ready? Alright. Yeah. Quote one, here we go. We got hit by something that should have never happened because they could have stopped it. Trump or Darth Vader Trump. Yes. Good job. So Trump said this in regard to COVID-19. There we go. Interesting. Uh, Here we go. I am altering a deal. Pray I don't alter it further. Oh, Vader. Yes. Oh yes. Ding, ding, ding. Perfect. Alright, next one. Here we go. Uh, in life you have to rely on the past. That's called History Trump or Darth Vader. Oh, that, oh, man. Um, Trump. Yes. Nice. Three for three. All right, here we go. Space is going to be so important. Trump or Darth Vader Trump. Yes. SpaceX, right? I have no idea. I just know. I'm sure it was, that's what he said. So next. This technological error is nothing compared to the power. do.dot Trump or Darth Vader Vader. Yes. Yes. Nice. The power of the force. That was the dot, dot dot. There you go. Oh, okay. This is too easy. I like this. Alright, number six. Here we go. You could see there was blood in her eyes. Trump or Darth Vader. Vader Trump. Oh man. He was saying this in reference to Megan Kelly whenever she hosted like one of those, you know, debates. See the blood in her eyes. I remember that debate. Yeah, when she went hard. It was pretty good actually. Yeah. So here we go. Be careful not to choke on your convictions. Trump or Darth Vader Trump. Darth Vader. Fuck. I'm messing up now. Asteroids do not concern me. Trump or Darth Vader. Okay, that sounds too easy to be Vader. So I'm gonna say Trump. Darth Vader. Dang it. This is a fun one. Um, okay, here we go. Ready? If you're not with me, then you're my enemy. Trump or Darth Vader. That's Trump. Darth Vader. Dang it. Okay. I'm totally, I'm throwing in the towel, right? We got one more. One more. Here we go. This is a long one, so listen. Okay. All right. You're asking me to be rational. That is something I cannot do. Believe me, I wish I could just wish away my feelings, but I can't Trump or Darth Vader. Trump would never admit that. I feel like that has to be Vader, but Vader would never admit that. Maybe Vader would, I don't know. I'm gonna say Vader. Yes. Good job. There we go. Now, I do have a question. Was that coming from just the old Star Wars movies where Vader was the villain? Or was that also including quotes from the newer Star Wars movies where you learn about the origin story of Vader? Hayden Christensen, I believe is actor because he had a lot, I don't remember Vader talking that much in the original Star Wars movies, so it had to have came from like. Phantom si and the, the episode one and two and three movies, you probably have no clue, right? I really don't care. I, I think, I think it was because I think some of those quotes were questionable because they came from the early movies, which Vader wasn't actually that evil in the early movies. So are you questioning me creating this game or what's going on here? I'm questioning whether you had enough knowledge about Star Wars to build a quiz with Vader and Trump. I think. Alright, next story. Let's go. Alright, so you know what else happened this week? The Kentucky Derby, an American Thoroughbred named Sovereignty won the race. But you know what's interesting? The success of many racetracks rely on hundreds of immigrant workers on temporary H two B Visas. Horse racing generated some$36 billion in 2023 according to the American Horse Council. That's a lot of money. I was actually surprised by those numbers. Horse racing. Horse racing,$36 billion. And that's just, I guess, in America, which is crazier.'cause I believe horse racing is bigger in other parts of the world. It's like soccer, but. So it makes you wonder how much actually this, this industry makes. The industry heavily relies on workers with H two B visas to get a horse on the track because owners and trainers say they're unable to find enough US-born workers. Still a large portion of the workforce is estimated to be without legal status. Yeah, so there are two widely sought worker Visa programs, and they've already reached their annual caps this year, visas are no longer available for 2025. That includes the. H one B Visa, which goes to those with college degrees and the H two B visa for non-agricultural seasonal labor, such as like hospitality, landscaping, or working with animals like horses. Yeah. Labor experts say that the demand for Visa shows a pressing need for immigrant workers, but the Trump administration promises a general crackdown on both legal and illegal migration. The majority of H one B Visa holders come from India, followed by China, and Mexico was the top country for H two B Visas in 2024, followed by Jamaica, Guatemala, El Salvador, and the Honduras. I. The annual cap for H two B visas was 66,000 This year, business owners are worried that Trump will lower those caps next year or just. Freeze the programs entirely as he did for the H one B Visa program during his first administration. It's also worth mentioning in 2023, the most requested occupations for H two B visas were landscaping and groundskeeping workers, which were made up 39%. Maids and housekeeping cleaners, forests and conservation workers, foreign seasonal workers are also in high demand into tourism, construction, and seafood processing industries. As the US baby boom generation retires out of the workforce and young US born workers like millennials and Gen Zers continue to show little interest in physically intensive seasonal jobs. These statistics matter because who's gonna fill those jobs and because of Trump does cut, does cut or freeze these programs. It is important to know these impacts. Yeah, we'll see. I don't, I don't foresee a millennial doing any of those jobs. Origins years especially, well, I don't think it's not, I don't think it's necessarily that. I think it's just the pay is very, very low. Yeah. And uh, it's probably below minimum wage too, if you think about it. So, yeah, that's true. That is true. The pay would make a big difference as well, so. The day of the Chris Murphy Town Hall. Remember that, that was, what was that like a couple weeks ago, like two Fridays ago or something? I learned that a judge was arrested. It totally caught us both off guard. Uh, turns out Wisconsin. Judge Hannah Dugan is accused of telling a migrant to leave her courtroom out of a side door as ice agents were waiting to take him away. That is a big deal because it raises questions about justice and fairness. The government specifically, the Attorney General Pam Bondy, said that the arrest sends a clear message. If judges try to protect people or block immigration authorities, those judges will face the same treatment. I. And get this. After she was taken into custody, FBI Director Cash Patel posted a photo of her in handcuffs. Seriously, it's like something out of a movie. The whole thing started on April 18th at the Milwaukee County Courthouse. Eduardo Flores Ruez was. There for hearing and his lawyer told Judge Dugan that his ice was outside, which she found absurd and she left her seat to talk to the agents. The judge told them they needed a warrant and dis discussed the matter with the chief judge. The Chief judge Carl Ashley said there was a new policy about where ice agents could make arrests in the courthouse, but he made it clear. No taking people in courtrooms or private spots. Still, the situation was tense and controversial with many seeing it as a clash between justice, immigration, and law enforcement. Judge Dugan has retained the top conservative lawyer, Paul Seaman, and so it's becoming a legal showdown and just shows how complicated and heated these issues are right now. It definitely makes you think about how the Trump administration views real justice in today's world. Here will be the interesting part as well. The law recognizes that a person may use illegal means to prevent imminent, unlawful harm to another. Deportation is not inherently unlawful, but wrongful deportation into a known torture center without due process, which the Trump administration has been under fire for doing recently. If. Dugan can prove she believed that helping with the escape was necessary to prevent imminent unlawful harm, then there may be a legitimate defense. She was resisting a system that had already proven itself willing to bypass the due process and placing deportees in brutal conditions. So a trial could expose these wrongful deportations and open up this can of worms of abuses that this administration has been under fire for. Would they, this administration, I. Want to open up that can of worms in court to be able to challenge her. We'll see the case is pending, but if she is convicted, she could face six years in prison, which is crazy. But not only that, the thing that pisses me off about this is the fact that they're arresting judges now after they've been defying court orders. It's like scaring our judicial system into the corners and like cornering them literally. It's just a scary, it's wrong, completely wrong. It's, it's a threat. It's threatening because, yeah, I mean, it's just like what they're doing with doctors, with the abortion stuff. Like there there's no, there's no, oh, if you're this status, you're safe or you have more. Yeah. You know, and I wonder what party that's coming from. Hmm. Interesting. Yeah. So here's another one. Michigan Governor, Gretchen Whitmer, uh, a leading Democrat has found herself in a tricky spot with her recent dealings with Donald Trump. She's faced criticism for her meetings with him, but she insists she's doing what's best for her state. Here is her speaking on the current situation in Michigan in regard to the tariffs.
Speaker 3:I'm not gonna sugarcoat it. These last few days have been really tough for Michigan. 20% of our economy is tied to the auto industry, which depends on a steady flow of goods from our largest and closest trading partners. We're home to the busiest international border crossing in North America. More than 10,000 vehicles carrying parts and materials crossed the bridge between Detroit and Windsor. Every weekday, we're already seeing the impacts of tariffs. So as I've said before, I'm not against tariffs outright, but it is a blunt tool. You can't just pull out the tariff hammer to swing at every problem without a clear defined end goal. We cannot underestimate or under appreciate the time and capital. It's gonna take to actually bring jobs and supply chains back home, so there's not a shortcut here. Strategic reindustrialization must be a bipartisan project that spans multiple presidential administrations.
Last month, Whitmer appeared alongside Trump at a Michigan Air base where they announced a new fighter Jet mission, a major win for her state. She credits her Oval Office meeting with helping secure the deal, saying her priority is Michigan. First, even if some people don't understand her choices, Whitmer also made headlines when she shared a brief moment with him as he arrived in Michigan, greeting Trump with a handshake and a hug. I don't think I could ever hug that man if I was in her position. Maybe just the handshake, but I would prefer a covid hello where we just don't touch. Um, but this came after some tense history as Whitmer is known for opposing Trump's policies and being cautious around him. But she explains that the handshake and hug were just a normal part of her, of the diplomacy of it all. While she's spoken out against Trump's actions, she stresses she's in a tough position as a democratic leader trying to navigate this polarized political landscape as a potential presidential contender for 2028. Whitmer is walking a fine line trying to support her state. It's just a, a clear example how democratic leaders are. Balancing opposition in a divided America today. Yeah. I'll be curious if she does win, and I do understand if she does win, she has to tiptoe around this whole situation, so I get it. It's just, I don't know if I would have the stomach to hug him. Yeah, she's, she's really, really good at getting that. Like she became governor and she had a Republican controlled legislature, especially during the. 2020 era. Era or whatever, when it, like Covid was rampant and stuff, and she was able to make nonpartisan deals with them in regard to the coronavirus and a lot of other things. So she's really, really good at reaching her hand across the aisle. Um, I do like her. Uh, so do you think she'll run? Do you think there's a possibility? I think she'll be a good top candidate. I, I think she's more a VP type deal situation, but I don't know. We'll see. Yeah. So well with that, that's it for the civil union. Hey Alex, what is our handle? The Civil Union pod. On Instagram and TikTok and then on Instagram and TikTok, uh, you guys can email us at the Civil Union twenty5@gmail.com. Thanks for listening, guys. Thanks guys.