Episode 93: Kelsey Davis

Kelsey Davis, Episocpal priest and co-founder of Christian Athlete Circles, joins the show to discuss her work to provide an inclusive and non-proselytizing resource for college athletes. A former collegiate, national team, and professional soccer player, Davis says "being an athlete is a great gift and a great challenge. In a world centered around the commodification of bodies, high-pressure environments, and ruthless schedules, it is extremely difficult to simultaneously train and perform at a high level while trying to live a life that is centered and intentional with meaningful conversations around your experiences." 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:01

All right, welcome back to On the Ball, the uh podcast series from the Vanderbilt Sports and Society Initiative. I'm Andrew Meredith, and I'm really happy to have Kelsey Davis as our guest today. I was telling Kelsey before we hit record that she is definitely dressed for the occasion, and she pointed out I am too. So we can't hide our Vanderbilt allegiances. But um Kelsey's joining us from Asheville, North Carolina, where she lives with her wife and her kids. Uh, she was just here in Nashville uh for some events we had a chance to meet in person for the first time. But uh Kelsey is a former uh college soccer star, uh U-19 and U-20 U.S. national team goaltender, uh coach in college soccer. But she's also a graduate of the Venerable Divinity School where she earned a master's. Um, and she's an episcopal priest, and she's the co-founder of Christian Athlete Circles, which is something I would be curious to learn more about and the work she that she's great work she's doing there with uh athletes all over the country. Uh Kelsey, thanks so much for joining the show today.

SPEAKER_00 1:05

Thanks for having me, Andrew. Um I'm excited to be here.

SPEAKER_01 1:09

Yeah, so let's talk about soccer first and your your soccer background. Uh, where did you grow up and what was the role that that sports played in your life as a kid?

SPEAKER_00 1:20

Yeah, I grew up in Southern California, so in a city called Thousand Oaks, which is just uh a bit north of Los Angeles. Uh started playing soccer when I was five years old and uh through our local rec league and just absolutely fell in love with the game. Um and I don't think uh you could peel me off the soccer field. So it was sort of uh love at first sight, and uh yeah, played played all throughout um my youth and into college and into the professional ranks as well. And um soccer for me really was my first love language. It also was a sanctuary for me. Um it was a a safe haven. You know, I had wonderful parents uh by day and a tough home home life by night. And so uh if if I wasn't home, I was on the soccer field and and typically um was the first kid, or last kid, excuse me, first kid there, last kid, uh, to to leave the field when the lights turned off. So more more nights than one, my dad was picking me up in the dark after the lights had been turned off uh by choice. You know, I wanted to to play and to train, and um I I I played with everyone and anyone that would let me on their pitch.

SPEAKER_01 2:33

As we record this, we're in the midst of the men's uh World Cup. And I'm curious, going out in California, I'm not sure how old you are, but was uh what was the status of the of the women's national team at that time and was um was that an influence in your uh awareness and and love of soccer at that time?

SPEAKER_00 2:54

Yeah, great question, Andrew. So I'm 39 for the record at the time of this recording. I just turned 39, uh so you know, uh on the cusp of my 40s here. Um I had the really fortunate opportunity to watch the uh if you remember the 1999 Women's World Cup team that had, you know, Mia Hamm and Brandy Chastain, Julie Fowdy, um, you know, Carla Overbeck, Brianna Scurry, I mean, the folks who really worked hard to lay the foundation for women's soccer in this country. So I had the fortunate opportunity to watch them play uh as I was growing up in the sport. And I got to be I got to be at physically at the Rose Bowl at that 1999 World Cup game when they when they won the World Cup. And Brandy, if you remember, Andrew, Brandy ripped off her shirt and was in that black sports bra that that really broke open uh women's soccer, but also just women's sports in this country. That she was the first, one of the first, I should say, to really display the strength of the female body. Um in, you know, they were playing in men's oversized jerseys, and it's like that was a moment when I think uh I would have to suspect that the Nike and Adidas and and all the the powers that be were like, oh, hold on a second. Uh maybe we need to pay attention to to the women's side of sports here. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:18

Wow. So you were one of those kids that was influenced by that moment that uh, you know, it was the whole point, right? Uh um, but it I'm not sure how deep you want to get into this, but it sounds like you love the sport, but you're also uh when you mentioned it was a safe haven, um it was a place to escape some problems too. So uh what what was the role of sports and and soccer in particular in helping with your your safety or your mental health, your sense of self at that time?

SPEAKER_00 4:47

Yeah, yeah, I'm happy to share. Um, you know, I I grew up, I was an only child, and again, had two two very loving parents um who supported me in every way that that they were capable of supporting me. And um they wrestled with their own stuff, you know, like many of us do. We're we're all complex um human beings. And um, and so, you know, by day things were were pretty copesthetic and pretty standard for my livelihood. And at night, you know, when they get home from work, um things kind of shifted gears. And so I uh I found a lot of safety in in being on the soccer field. So I'd go, I'd go there right after school and usually do my homework uh on the sidelines uh and or jump in and out of other people's practices as I waited for my practice to begin. Uh so I was training nearly five days a week from the age of 12 years old when I started club soccer. And you know what soccer really provided me were was a few things. One, my coaches were amazing. And so I had sort of these other reliable adults in my life who looked out for me, not only as a young athlete, but as a young individual who checked in on me, made sure that I was cared for, had what I need, had the support that I needed. Um then two, just a another family system. You know, I was an only child, and so uh I, if you asked my my former teammates, I crashed their vacations, you know, their family vacations. And I was kind of the plus one tag-along to a lot of my teammates' families and you know, sleepovers, dinners at other people's houses, um, but they really looked after me in a way that at the time I thought, you know, we're just being teammates, we're just being friends, we're hanging out. But now looking back in hindsight, they really um I think were keeping watch on me in a particular way to make sure that I was I was being cared for. But then also, yeah, just like leadership, uh development, moral, character development, you know, all of sort of the core pieces of who I am came through sport. I came through soccer and the lessons that I learned through soccer, um, through my teammates, through my coaches, that hopefully helps me become, you know, a practicing human being and compassion, uh, in in trying to show up for something bigger than myself and make a contribution to society that that's healing, you know, and and reparative uh to the breaches in our world.

SPEAKER_01 7:27

Interesting how you can trace you know what you're doing now to those those early days. Um and mentioned you're a graduate of the Vanderbilt Divinity School, uh school with a fantastic reputation, and you're an ordained priest in the Episcopal Church. What was the role of religion and and faith in your life uh growing up?

SPEAKER_00 7:48

Yeah, so I did not grow up in the church. Um I grew up unchurched. My my only Christian formation, which I hold really dear now as an Episcopal priest, my grandparents on my mom's side were Episcopalian. And uh every week my grandfather would mail me the Children's Sunday bulletin that he would take from his Episcopal Church with a really sweet note at the top, a handwritten note from him, just reminding me how much that he loved he loved me and that God loved me. But that was the extent of my uh my sort of childhood formation in church. And uh it wasn't until high school um I came out to my parents when I was 16. And when I came out to them um as a as a gay, you know, queer person, they were delighted and supportive and uh sort of cheered me on and championed me without second thought. I mean, it was it was a really beautiful embrace. Um and then my first girlfriend was the one who took me to a non-denominational church, and I got really into the Jesus thing uh pretty quickly, kind of dove in, cannonballed into that pool. And I don't know, Andrew, if it was because of her or it was actually because of Jesus, maybe a little bit of both. But uh yeah, so when I asked, you know, let my parents know that I was I wanted to be baptized at 17, you know, my my dad's response, he was a lawyer, he said, well, uh, you know, this this is gonna be a rough road for you. So, you know, this was early 2000s. Uh Gene Robinson, you know, globally was going through his whole experience in the Episcopal Church with coming out. And uh the the world in in the early 2000s, if you remember, was not uh not a peaceful world to try to be in the rainbow family and and hold Christian identity. Um and so my dad, in his right mind and in his wise, you know, loving way, said, Hey, let me take you to the local bookstore. I'm gonna take you over to the world religion section, pull a couple books off the shelf, and uh I'm gonna read through these these books with you to make sure you have a you have a scope of what you're you're signing up for if you want to be baptized in the Christian Christian tradition. And so um I remember that day as as clear, clear as blue skies, Andrew, um standing in the aisle, and we were standing there flipping through some books on world religions and some books on Christianity, and he said, Hey Kelsey, you know, will you promise me, promise me three things. One, that you'll remember that that I love you and I'll always love you unconditionally. Two, that if God as father, you know, I'm your father, but God is father archetype, um, you know, if if I love you unconditionally, then God loves you unconditionally for exactly who you are. So remember that. And third, promise me that you'll never proselytize, uh, that you will just live out your faith authentically and and show the world your love of God through your actions and respect that there are other meaning-making systems, you know, that other faith traditions, religions, spiritualities, um, other philosophical ways of understanding the world exist, and to to respect that and learn from that. You know, and and I'm at I'm 17, Andrew, so of course I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah, dad, cool, you know. But what he really gifted me in that moment was was a foundation and a cornerstone to stay rooted in in God's love and in the in his love too, and my dad's love, that I had an advocate along the journey. And also, you know, a cornerstone around inner faith and ecumenical and and meaning-making systems that now as an Episcopal priest, um, I'm more curious about than trying to convert anybody, you know, to my way of showing up in the world. And so he birthed, um, he birthed a theologian in that moment, I think, in me. And so, fast forward, um, I ended up, I played one one uh season at UCLA and then ended up transferring because, you know, I grew up in the area, I also needed a smaller school. Um, I was sort of overwhelmed by at the time the 30,000 students that went there. So I ended up transferring to the University of Portland in Portland, Oregon, which is at the time was more like 3,000 undergrad and uh was a Catholic school, uh Holy Cross School. And so it was at the University of Portland where my spiritual life uh started to come into formation. Uh uh so the gift of being around Catholic priests and people who were committed to religious orders, who were teachers and pastors was such a gift for me. Um because, you know, I was sort of swimming in this evangelical non-denominational space. And getting to to encounter for the first time a liturgical and sacramental tradition felt like room to breathe. You know, as an athlete, I understand ritual. Um, you know, I adhere to ritual, I adhere to rhythms and seasons. And so to be immersed in this Catholic tradition that's ancient, that's calling on liturgical seasons of the church, um, ebb and flow of that we're not just supposed to work ourselves and run ourselves ragged, but there's actually God calls us to, you know, rhythms of work and rest. That um the Eucharist, you know, how Eucharist is made. Um, it spoke to me. And so it was really at the University of Portland where um I started to develop my spiritual life and spiritual identity. Um and wondered, you know, what what might be ahead for me. Uh, it also was the place where uh I started to actually get to study theology for the first time.

SPEAKER_01 14:17

Wow, and it's fascinating. And this you know leads down the road to coming to Vanderbilt and starting the organization that you lead now. Um, from a purely sports standpoint, you're dealing with athletes all the time. How would you characterize your experience as a as a college student athlete on the field, ability to have a self off the field, um and how does that experience that you have uh personally inform the work that you do now?

SPEAKER_00 14:50

Yeah, I I was really fortunate to get to be a student athlete at the University of Portland because they historically and still do have such an emphasis on the development of the human beings, you know, the students and that are in their midst and entrusted to their care during young adulthood. That is one of the most formative times um of our lives. You know, there's so much research, Andrew, around um neuroplasticity in the brain and kind of that young adult sort of late adolescence period is the second wave of neuroplasticity for us. And so, you know, the the deconstruction that happens in the collegiate years and then the uh I would guess uh or say the the reassignment of identity and sort of you know, sifting through what we've inherited and then unpacking our backpacks and then deciding what we want to carry forward for the rest of our lives, you know, um, is such a tender, beautiful time. And so being a student athlete at Portland, um, I was completely supported, not only on the field, um, as I was sort of aspiring to play and hoping that a professional league would exist to play in in this country, but also, you know, off the field. Um I had uh leadership opportunities to develop, you know, my my moral, my moral subset, you know, like who, not only like what I want to do in terms of being an athlete, but who am I? You know, questions of identity. Um, and then also questions of vocation. Like, yeah, I wanted to play professional soccer, but who all who did I want to be as a professional athlete and my work to do to not only win games and to strive for excellence, but also off the pitch too. Like what would be my contribution to my community, to my team, but to the community, to the city that I was in as well, um, to make sure that this platform that I was given uh was was also stewarded, you know, in a way that uh participated in the the betterment of the world. And Portland, I feel like, really set uh set a lot of us up to be able to sift through those big questions and and start to live into them while we were student athletes. So, you know, we had ample opportunity to do community service and community engagement. Um, you know, we were encouraged to be present students in the classroom, to get our homework done, you know, to strive for the best grades we could possibly strive for as we also turned around and, you know, crushed it in the weight room and and on the pitch. So um, yeah, they they really set the tone for me in terms of teaching me, you know, how to lead, I think, and how to lead well in in all facets as a whole human being.

SPEAKER_01 17:57

Yeah, that that's what it was painted a picture to me of just being a whole person. Um so when you're competing for uh US national teams and and playing professional soccer, did you notice that you were an outlier in that way? Um and that this was a perspective that you could share with other people, or did you feel like you were among, for the most part, other athletes that were that had that same experience as growing up or in college and were thinking about the whole person and how they serve the community, uh, you know, uh or mankind beyond just at that point in your life you're trying to make it on a national team or pro soccer. You you you couldn't be faulted if you were singularly focused on those goals.

SPEAKER_00 18:43

Yeah, absolutely. Um, I would say, you know, our generation coming up, um, you know, I got to play with some amazing athletes. Um had I had some amazing teammates who have, you know, throughout their careers gone on to make huge waves and impact in the landscape of women's soccer in this country, uh, in this globe, but also women's sports. And so we were of a generation that um I would say, yes, Andrew, like we were in the same boat, you know, caring about the same things in terms of, you know, how do we go win championships and also how do we show up as good humans in the world? And, you know, some of these folks that continue to make uh meaningful impact on and off the pitch. You know, I remember being in sitting in hallways with them when we were teenagers, you know, when we were sort of young bucks in the US soccer system. And, you know, the the coolest thing um is not only to go see them win World Cups and gold medals, but to know that they are good people now and they were good people then too. You know, it's just it's just who they are. So it was it was really a special thing to be surrounded by such amazing people that pursued excellence in in every avenue of their life. I will say, yeah, of course, being singular singularly sort of focused and narrowed in, um, scope is important. You know, you can't you can't do everything all at once and you can't be all things to all people at once. And I will say that, you know, as a as a chaplain to athletes now, as an Episcopal priest too, one of my favorite conversations that I get to accompany with with current current athletes or former athletes is their wrestling with, you know, how do I show up and be excellent at my at my sport? And uh what else has has God called me to do and and who has God called me to be? So I think that those are human questions that that many of us sit with, and that uh even if, yeah, championship is first on your mind, um, I would bet most athletes are also thinking about, you know, how do I be a good teammate, even in the smallest, sort of unsexy, behind the scenes way? Um I think we all care about that.

SPEAKER_01 21:10

So at some point uh your playing career has to come to an end. It's the case for every athlete. I know that can be uh a traumatic experience in some cases, sometimes caused by injury or age or ability. Uh like how did how did your career as a player end and how did that experience uh shape your sense of self and identity and and lead to the type of work that you do?

SPEAKER_00 21:39

Transitioning out of playing soccer was one of the hardest it was one of the hardest seasons of my life. Um I struggled with anxiety and depression, isolation, loneliness, you know, just this a lost sense of purpose. Um it's it's pretty Pretty rattling, Andrew, when you go, you know, I I was five when I started in this in soccer. My whole entire life, uh, I had sort of built-in community and built-in friends. You know, every team that I was on sort of automatically had had buddies, you know, I had a rhythm and a structure to my life that was was kind of prescribed for me. To then all of a sudden be catapulted out of that ecosystem. It was like, okay, well, now how do I structure my days? You know, what am I supposed to literally do all day long? Let alone how do I go make friends now? I mean, it it's it might sound silly, but it's like I I have to now, like I'm not just gonna show up in a meeting and just have, you know, 25, 30 people who are trying to work towards the same thing. Um, I have to figure out what is social relationship, uh, what is friendship um look like, let alone then now what's my work to do? Um, how do I earn a paycheck and do something that feels meaningful? Um and so that transition was really hard. And I was in therapy for a long time for it. And uh I would say only until probably about five or six years ago that I actually feel like I had grieved the the death and loss of my athletic identity as an active athlete. Um, it took it took about 10 years, 10 or 11 years. It's one of the things that I wish we were able to talk more about in the athletic community is is the the grief of that transition and the the the death that really happens for athletes, you know. We live in a capitalist system and the commodification of athletes and athlete bodies is real, you know, and so there can be a real sense of identity loss of like, okay, well, I'm no longer valued because I'm no longer showing up to perform, um, for people to watch and cheer for me and care. And so if I'm no longer valued in the society because I'm not an athlete, you know, what is my inherent value uh as a human being? And so, you know, those are those are also the spaces that I find myself drawn to in this chaplaincy work, you know, through Christian athlete circles as well as wanting to accompany athletes as they transition um out of their careers uh to really get underneath um, you know, some of those those big questions as well. So yeah, so it was it was really hard and and I'm grateful. I had a really good therapist, you know, I had a really great spouse, uh wife, who um also had had left sport as well, so she understood. And then had some really good community and friends around who, at the very least, Andrew, were willing to at least listen and to believe that this was a hard thing um to transition from. So um I didn't I didn't do it, I didn't do it by myself. And now I definitely feel like I'm on the other side of of all of that, which also feels uh good and a hopeful word that uh you can get through it and and find a new orientation, new purpose.

SPEAKER_01 25:29

A lot of what you said there um is so tied to what you're doing now with Christian athlete circles. So I want to get to that quickly. And there's so much of your life in the chronology that we can talk about in a second conversation, but before we get to uh CIC, I wanted to ask about your experience at the Vanderbilt Divinity School. What was it that that drew you to that particular place and what were some of the most important um experiences uh or learnings that that you had there?

SPEAKER_00 26:00

So when I felt pulled towards divinity school, I was coaching full full-time at a Division I school. I was I was at TCU as an assistant coach there, and in between, you know, writing outset plays and uh watching film and preparing for the next match, you know, I was pulling books of theology off my desk. And my now wife said, Kelsey, I think you need to listen, you need to listen to that. Um, you know, sometimes these these in-between moments where we spend our time and energy can can reveal a lot to us about what's what's at our heart, you know, at our heart center. And so um so Heather's wisdom and saying, hey, pay attention, uh, pay attention to that. And also uh I was I was part of a pub church community in Forth Worth Fort Worth, Texas, and so that's a whole story for another time. So I ended up applying to a couple different divinity schools, and I had a buddy who was already at Vanderbilt, and she had been a softball player at Notre Dame. She's now also an Episcopal priest, and uh I called her up and I just said, Hey, like, you know, what's your experience been at Vanderbilt? I'm I'm looking at the Div school there, and she was like, just come and see. Like, come hang out for a weekend, I'll help you set up some meetings, get you connected, and you you just gotta be there to experience it. And so I showed up on campus and met with a couple professors, walked around Vanderbilt, um, you know, and just absolutely fell in love with the place, Andrew. And not only the the campus and the the Nashville as a community and how dynamic it is, but also, you know, the people that I got to encounter and talk to, the faculty and the current students who really were asking the question of so what? So we're gonna study this theology, we're gonna be biblically literate, we're gonna be able to preach and to pastor. Um, we'll be equipped, right, to do ministry. And how does what how does what I believe and what we believe about God and Jesus and the church translate into how we show up in society? So why I chose Vanderbilt, you know, it's it's tagged as the school of the prophets. Um, that these are are folks in those walls who are there on purpose for the transformation and the healing and the repair of the world. Um, that it's not an ivory tower to simply study together, but to actually study so that we can go back outside the walls and be part of the mercy and the justice making of all that is happening in our world. And so when I got to meet these people, you know, they're activists, they're social workers, they're pastors, they're queer people, um, they're folks sort of on the margins of Christianity writ large that um have experienced church harm and yet are still showing up to ask more questions and to find out still what's possible. And I just was so inspired by these human beings that I got to be in class with. Um, and so in terms of my education, yeah, top-notch academic education for sure. It was a grind. It was hard, hard work. And, you know, um just so inspired and have still have friends, you know, um, where we have beautiful friendship across tradition, you know, um which I loved about Vanderbilt too. We had folks from all different kinds of Christian flavor. Um, even, you know, I had we had a, I remember I had a Jewish uh classmate, you know, I got to learn New Testament from Amy Joe Levine before she retired. And, you know, she's a Jewish feminist scholar who was teaching all of us uh how to understand the New Testament, you know, so just a really, really cool and dynamic place.

SPEAKER_01 30:03

Yeah. Um, all right, so let's let's skip to uh ahead to Christian athlete circles. Um how do you describe to people who have never heard of it uh what it's all about and how maybe does it differ from other programs that are available to um to athletes, to college students, you know, in in this uh that we may be familiar with.

SPEAKER_00 30:27

Yeah. So when I was um when I was coming up as a as a young athlete and had found found my Christian identity and and my queer identity as well, there was no space, Andrew, where I could be an athlete, a Christian, and a queer person and be fully loved at one time. There was always something being sacrificed, depending on what space I was in. So I was too queer for the athlete Christian ministries that existed. Um I was not, that was not a permissible identity. Um, or I was too Christian for some queer people, right? And I was too athletic for some some Christians and some queer people. So um through through my time at Vanderbilt Divinity School, um, I kept turning to my wife and saying, hey, there are athlete ministries out there that exist, they're doing awesome work. Um and I wish that there was another option that sort of upheld a, I guess you could call it a more progressive uh flavor of Christian theology, right? Like the Episcopal Church, we we bless and we ordain all people. Um and we honor the full dignity of every human being. And so, why isn't there an athletic ministry that does that? And I said that for about three years to where the point where my wife said, turned to me, she's like, Why don't you do something about it? You know, like put your money where your mouth is. To which I then said, Well, it can't just be me. Like, we do this work collectively. And so I was I was quickly introduced to Georgia McKee, who's our co-founder and co-director at Christian Athlete Circles, who's a Baptist pastor. Uh, every Baptist needs an Episcopalian, and every Episcopalian needs a Baptist, Andrew. So uh with our powers combined, you know, something we I think we find the middle middle way. Um but Georgia and I shared swap stories that we we both were dreaming and longing for a ministry that could fully be embracing of God's beautiful uh handiwork in human diversity and speak, athletics speak, um, and be something that uh could could offer a wider circle. And so um Christian Athlete Circles was born, you know, our patron saint is the Reverend Dr. Polly Murray. And uh Polly Murray was the first African-American priest ordained in the Episcopal Church. She was also a civil rights activist and lawyer before she was an Episcopal priest. Civil rights movement that that we typically popularly think about with you know Dr. King and all those folks, um, really stands on the shoulders of Polly Murray and her contemporaries and their work to push uh push against racism and the sexism of her day and their day that they faced. And so, you know, Polly for us, she was also, I believe, Andrew, and I hope you write a book on this maybe someday. Uh I believe she was a basketball player in her younger years as well. But Polly has this really famous quote from a paper that she wrote, something along the lines here, I'm not going to get it verbatim, but that Paulie said that she intended to destroy segregation by positive and embracing methods. When her brothers uh would draw a circle to exclude her, she would draw a wider circle to include them. And that where they shouted for the rights of a puny group, she wanted to shout for the rights of all of mankind. And so Pauli's way of truth-telling, um, of really facing systemic injustice, you know, toe-to-toe, head-on, while also this approach of positive and embracing and widening method. That at CAC, what we're trying to do is not to exclude or eradicate or say that we're coming in over and above, or that we should replace any athlete ministry that's out there. Instead, all we're trying to do is pull up a chair to the table and say that, you know, the way that we understand being Christian is also faithful, you know, and and to continue to draw a wider circle. So, yes, we are here to to bless and to love LGBTQ people and athletes. And anyone that wants to come around this table and be part of this circle is welcome. So we are here for all.

SPEAKER_01 35:08

And how do um how do athletes typically engage with you? Um, I thought that there was a really great line on your website. It says being an athlete is a great gift and a great challenge in a world centered around the commodification of bodies, high pressure environments, and ruthless schedule that is extremely difficult to simultaneously train and perform at a high level while trying to live a life that is centered and intentional. Uh and I have an alert come up on my screen that blocks the rest with meaningful conversations around your experiences. So are you facilitating those meaningful experiences? What are the ways that um you're engaging with athletes?

SPEAKER_00 35:44

Yeah, thanks. Thanks, Andrew. So the model of CAC is really a chaplaincy model. What that means is that uh we are here to support athletes in the athletic community community on the go. Um so the way that we do that, um, one way is through content and resources. So we have a devotional, a physical book, and you know, that that you can, it's a 40-day devotional that just came out. We have a podcast called Spirit of Sport Podcast that is is an offering as well, which we have two new seasons at this point in time, two new seasons that'll drop later this year that I'm really excited about. Uh, and so check out Spirit of Sport Podcast. Um, and then we have a weekly Huddle that is uh a weekly devotional that's that's right to your inbox, that's super short and concise, uh, that goes through Belong, Grow, Pray, Act, which are the four pillars of formation for CAC. And then uh we have Instagram and uh are constantly posting um resources and content on on Instagram as well. So that's one bucket is is content that can be live in your ears, that can live in your backpack and go with you on the go, uh live on your phone as well. The second way that we do this is through coaching. So we offer kind of three lanes of coaching. One, uh, we have a life coach available for folks, so that's a little bit less in the sort of faith spiritual realm, um a little bit more secular in, you know, if you have goals and ambitions and kind of want to sort through life stuff, we have a life coach on our team that can provide services. We also have spiritual coaching or spiritual direction that's available to accompany those deeper questions. Um, and then we also provide accompaniment to athletic departments and offices of spiritual and religious life that are maybe asking the questions like how do we serve athletes and care for them in mind, body, and soul? And so we don't have a blueprint that comes in to say, hey, let us come set up shop here, um, but let us be in conversation with you and let us accompany you in teasing out and discerning your context and your people, and then designing from there what maybe offerings look like for athletes that care for their souls as well. So we do the coaching, we do the content, the coaching. And then the last piece is that we um offer care for chaplains as well. So whether that's chaplains on campuses or in the professional realms that are already caring for student athletes or caring for the professional athletes, uh, that we want to be a resource for chaplains to come and just exhale, to build fellowship, to pray together, and just be nourished. And so we have a chaplain circle that just is getting going, uh, that meets once a month. And that's a virtual circle space for anyone who's interested to join in.

SPEAKER_01 38:53

Amazing. Um, okay, as we wrap this up, uh you mentioned, you know, working with athletic departments and campus offices. So is Christian athlete circles uh entirely focused on the on college athletes or younger or pro athletes too? And how do people uh find your podcast and find uh more information about all the other programs that you mentioned?

SPEAKER_00 39:15

Yeah. So uh we have a major emphasis on collegiate athletes. Um and you know, we are able to sort of developmentally span up into the professional young adult sort of age bracket as well. We've also seen some retired athletes coming around that are looking for community and looking for meaning making as well. So um starting to hold space for that as well, that uh we want to be just a resource. Yes, the emphasis is on the collegiate age bracket, and uh we have some professional athletes kind of coming around. Uh we also have some retired athletes coming around. So um if folks want to get in touch, uh definitely visit us, follow us on Instagram at Christian AthleteCircles. And then also through our website, if you fill out the connect form on our website, that comes you know directly to us and you'll get an email back from me. And so it's it's really that simple if you want to connect in further. I will also say, Andrea, we also I'm a trained, you know, certified Enneagram uh teacher and coach. And so if you're interested in the Enneagram and want to do some work around that, um I'm your gal. So please, please also reach out.

SPEAKER_01 40:33

Oh, that's funny. I I just uh did the uh paid Enneagram online about two weeks ago and uh came out as a nine. I don't know if that would be surprising or not to you based on what you've learned about me so far.

SPEAKER_00 40:47

I uh I I can I can believe it and see it. I'm married to someone who leads with type 9, and uh I so I love you, I love me some nines, Andrew. That's that's beautiful. So I think better or worse. Well well, my home base is as a as a I leave with type eight, and so um if I don't know if that's surprising to you or not either. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:13

Kelsey, thank you so much. Uh it's really fascinating to learn about your life story and the work you're doing. We could have gone another hour. Um, so we'll have to have you back. And I've I've mentioned to you that there are some programming that we co host with the Divinity School here at Vanderbilt. So I know we're looking forward to inviting you to participate in that. But uh congratulations on your work and thank you so much for coming on the show today.

SPEAKER_00 41:36

Thank you, Andrew. Blessings to you and all that you're up to at Vandy. It's it's fantastic.

SPEAKER_01 41:42

Thank you so much.