Rebellious Skater to Youth Pastor: Jon Deaver #TRB Season 2 Episode 47

What if the power you’ve been chasing is actually found in surrender? That’s the electric current running through Jon Deaver’s story—part skate-park bravado, part barroom chaos, and ultimately a fierce return to hope. He grew up hearing Scripture, drifted into cigarettes at ten and parties by day, became a teen dad, married young, and watched it all collapse. The scene that followed is searing: an empty apartment, a drained bank account, a lawn chair, a rifle—and a mother’s phone call at the last possible second.

We trace the slow burn of addiction into pills, cocaine, and violence, then the fragile first steps back toward faith. Jon didn’t warm to church culture overnight. He resisted, analyzed, and kept his guard high until one small, stubborn decision at communion cracked pride open. At a men’s conference, he prayed a blunt prayer—“change me or kill me”—and encountered the presence of Jesus in a way he couldn’t explain away. He received the Holy Ghost, chose sobriety on a day he once worshiped for drinking, and was baptized in Jesus’ name alongside his wife, two days before she delivered twins.

Tune in to listen to the rest of the story!

Transcript

Unshackled Conference Announced

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Many of you know about our unshackled conference that's taking place March 6th, 7th, and 8th. But what you might not know is that we have added an extra service to Saturday at 10 a.m. to feature Ben Bland. If you don't know who Ben Bland is, I highly recommend that you look him up on YouTube or Facebook. You will be blessed. And also coming is going to be Sherry Moran Haney, her and her husband pastor in Stockton, California. But Sherry sings a song that has been my testimony for a long, long time. And she's so gracious to come down and sing that song and some other songs Friday night. And I believe she'll be here Saturday morning as well. Now, Brother Nick Mahaney has an incredible testimony, and he will be ministering in each of our evening services, and then on Sunday morning. Brother Mahaney was raised in the pews of a church, and by the time he was 15 years old, he was a full-blown alcoholic. And by the time he was in his early 20s, he was worshiping Satan and conjuring up demons. Now we don't hear that story very often about kids that grew up in church. And his dad found him on his deathbed and took him to rehab, and God miraculously delivered him. And Brother Mahaney has an amazing ministry of deliverance now because of where he's been in life. And Ben Bland was molested sexually by somebody in the church. And he lived as a girl almost his whole life up until five years ago. And he was a drag queen and he was all the way out into the LGBTQ community. And so that's also a story that we're starting to hear more and more of about how God is just calling his children home. So we hope that you will make plans to be here. And if you haven't already made plans, please mark your calendars for March 6th, 7th, and 8th. We look forward to having you here. Thank you so much.

Sponsor Message & Show Opening

SPEAKER_03 2:17

This episode has been sponsored by my friend and dentist, Dr. Craig Sedillo at Smile Vicelia. If you're looking for a dentist, you won't find a better one in Tularie County. He specializes in all your dentistry needs, plus cosmetic dentistry and ortho. His phone number is 559-734-7035. If you call him, please tell him that Kathy from the Redeemed Backslider Podcast sent you. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00 2:48

Welcome to the Redeemed Backslider. With your host, Kathy Chastain, Christian-based psychotherapist in the Redeemed Backslider. This podcast is dedicated to those who have wandered but are ready to return to the life-changing power of grace and the freedom

Meet John Deaver

SPEAKER_00 3:08

found in Jesus.

SPEAKER_03 3:10

Hi, welcome to the Redeemed Backslider. I'm your host, Kathy Chastain. I'm a Christian-based psychotherapist and a redeemed backslider. Today with me in the studio is John Deaver. He lives right here in Tuleri County and attends the Harvest Center Church in Strathmore. John is not a backslider, but he does have a wonderful, miraculous testimony of how God redeemed him and brought him out of a crazy life into knowing the full love of the Lord. So I'm excited to have him here today and really looking forward to having him share his story. But for the people out there to know that no matter where you've been, that God sees you and he knows where you're at, and all you have to do is open your mouth and talk to him and he'll meet you there. So, John, welcome to the studio today.

SPEAKER_01 4:07

Thanks for having me. It's an honor. And like I said, any opportunity I get to boast about Jesus, I would like to do it, you know. So I'm excited.

SPEAKER_03 4:15

Yeah. So how old are you?

Early Faith Stirrings And missed Moments

SPEAKER_03 4:17

I'm 33. Okay. And how old were you when when you met the Lord?

SPEAKER_01 4:23

Um, so I had a real I had an encounter with the Lord when I was a child. I grew up, my mom speaking in tongues and is that right?

SPEAKER_03 4:31

Was she Pentecostal?

SPEAKER_01 4:33

No, she was not. Not Pentecostal. So I didn't I didn't learn about this great truth until excuse me, until 2018. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 4:40

So So how was your mom like where where I was raised homeschooled. I'm the youngest of five boys. Oh baby. Yeah. You were homeschooled.

SPEAKER_01 4:50

I was homeschooled, yeah. So I was homeschooled. What a blessing that is. It really was. Yeah. It really was. And um that's what's kind of crazy about my story is is I wasn't raised Pentecostal, but almost in a way, um I did I did backslide from the Lord. I um I had a call in on my life, and um I kind of ran from it. I got invited, so I started skateboarding, started getting wind up in smoking and doing drugs and everything at a younger age, and uh uh my buddies that I was skating around with and hanging out, they said, Hey, you need to you need to join public school. You need to come, there's a bunch of chicks here, come hang out, it'll be awesome. So that's like kind of where it started.

SPEAKER_03 5:33

So let's go back. I'm so intrigued. How old were you when you felt like you had a call on your life? How did you know that you had a call on your life, and how did you know you were running from that?

SPEAKER_01 5:47

So when I was younger, um, we went to a church. Our family was in a church, and um, of course, there's always some kind of issue, something happens. Well, um so I grew up knowing scripture. Okay. And my mom would that was a big thing about the homeschool. That's why she homeschooled us, it's because she didn't want us to be a part of the public school even then. Um But so I would grow up hearing scripture, her telling us about the Bible, so I knew the the stories and I knew some scripture and um but as I grew up um my brother, he was really involved in the youth group, really involved in the youth group in the in the church. He was kinda like it kind of helped them and stuff. And um there was actually a time that they had some kind of like evangelists at a youth group event. And um if they would have I'm not trying to say they didn't know any better, but at that moment, and especially me knowing now, I would have received the gift of the Holy Ghost if someone would have taught me more. Right. If someone would have told me, that's it, linger. Like that's you're feeling God. Because I remember it was just they were talking, they were people who were in and in and out of prison, and they're trying to help, there are drugs and alcohol and trying to help the young, the young people. And and I remember just feeling God pull on my heart, and I started to cry. I was nowhere near one, I was in the very back, and a kind of sad story. I kind of leaned over my brother, and my brother's kind of holding me like, What are you doing? kind of pushed me away, like, Well, what's going on? And I was just weeping. And I was trying to hide myself, I was embarrassed, like, why am I crying? You know, and there was this actually this man named uh Randy Agelston. Uh he was a cliff diver. We would go to the rivers with him and stuff, and he'd call me Flip Buddy. I was I was maybe ten. And he said, That's uh God's pull on your heart. Don't ever forget about that. I haven't for I've never forgot about it. Wow. But you know, kind of grew up, and then they went we went to this um Christian convention. It was actually at the San Francisco Giant Stadium and it was called Battle Cry. And I remember there was that opportunity um to become a missionary. And there was we

Skate Culture, Rebellion, And Identity

SPEAKER_01 7:55

went just to go get a free shirt, me and my buddies at the time, and we went over there and uh it was just really pulling on my heart from that moment at that when I felt God and I was crying to that Christian um it was like a youth event. Yeah. But it was a couple days long, I was at the San Francisco Giant Stadium, and God was just really pulling on my heart. So it wasn't that I didn't know who God was, and of course I didn't have a full understanding of Jesus. Um You just knew he was real. I knew he was real. I've always known God was real, and that's one thing is and I can get into a little more in the podcast, but um I would always set the Bible out. Even when I was in drugs and alcohol, I would tell my buddies like we're not right. I knew if God came back that I would go to hell, I wouldn't make it because it wasn't that I didn't know, it was that I was just choosing not to follow God. And that's something uh kind of blows my mind at this moment, you know. I look back and think, I would have chosen to be lost over being saved.

SPEAKER_03 9:00

Right. Yeah, it it is it's hard to fathom that that is an actual conscious choice, right? Because I think we just have real no awareness of what being lost means, yeah, you know, in death and and hell. We just we I have heard people say, uh, I don't care if I go to hell. Yeah. I I don't mind because they really have no understanding, none of us really do what it's gonna be like. But if you've ever been separated from God, why is that it's the worst feeling, and so to think for eternity you never have an opportunity to feel his presence. Yeah, I think that's the worst part.

SPEAKER_01 9:48

Yeah, absolutely. You know, my pastor has said it m many times and it's always stuck with me. He says, you know, men can live three days without water and you live maybe a couple weeks without food, but hope you can't live one day without hope. Yeah, right. Not having the hope in Jesus Christ, I mean that separation, I think that's gonna be the worst part of hell is the separation from I mean, even even those who aren't believers, they feel something. God's in the atmosphere, you know, he's omnipresent, he's everywhere. So they're feeling something.

SPEAKER_05 10:19

Right.

SPEAKER_01 10:20

But to have that nothingness, that would be I don't want to experience it, you know, I really don't. Um but that's what was kind of kind of blows my mind now is is um of course, you know, sin's profitable for a season, it's pleasurable for a season. That's what the Bible says. And and it was, it was but I was choosing. And it went once once I got into high school, um, so my brother, um, he was a skater, um you know, with that kind of lifestyle. He was a punk, you know, bleach blonde hair. I had bleach blonde hair, liberty spikes, you know, the whole the whole thing. I'd dye my hair black, I'd have earrings, you know, it was it was just kind of the thing I did. And um it just that kind of lifestyle, you know, the people we hung around with, it was it was just uh it was funny because it was like no one had family. Everyone came from a broken home, but they were all family, all the skaters. Um that's something I didn't experience. I my parents are they're still together. Um I actually I couldn't have had a better childhood. And that's why I think what's kind of crazy with that I didn't have hurt growing up.

SPEAKER_03 11:31

Not normal wounds like some of us have abuse.

SPEAKER_01 11:35

Um we weren't rich, we weren't poor. Everything that I needed was was supplied. I mean, it's not like we went without my mom, she prayed over us every single night. I mean, and then if my mom wasn't there, my dad would pray for us, you know. Um, so it wasn't like I grew up in a bad home. But it was like once I tried the world, I just loved it. I just don't know.

SPEAKER_03 12:02

It was for you, it was more temptation because uh you're the youngest of five, all brothers. Yeah. And so you had community there.

SPEAKER_01 12:12

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 12:13

It wasn't like you were lonely or looking for a place to fit in. Did you feel like you with your brothers?

SPEAKER_01 12:20

Yeah, me and we were unbelievably close. I mean, growing up, my best friend, of course I had best friends, but we were close as brothers. Yeah, you know, even as we grew up, as we were we were very, very close. Um so it wasn't like we had a I it's not like I was looking somewhere to fit in.

SPEAKER_03 12:38

Right. There was no pain driving you, no, which is the case in so many, and so it's uh

Teen Pregnancy, Marriage, And Collapse

SPEAKER_03 12:45

what what a lovely heritage you have to have that, you know. So for you it was just being exposed to something different than you had ever known before.

SPEAKER_01 12:57

Yeah, well, I mean my dad, he's only my whole life he's only smoked, he's only smoked cigarettes. Um but it's crazy because I didn't I wasn't raised with alcohol in the home until I got a little older. And then I was maybe 13, 14 years old, I think the first time I saw my dad have alcohol in the home. Um my mom didn't drink. Um so it's not like that I was exposed. I mean, I was exposed to some things, but it wasn't encouraged.

SPEAKER_03 13:24

I met with your friends. Oh, with my friends, your friends, not your family per se, but yeah. Um so when did you so your brother, how much older was he? He got into it.

SPEAKER_01 13:35

Two and a half years. Oh no, so I have one brother who's two and a half years older than me, and then the next brother's two and a half years older than him, and the next brother's two and a half years older than him, and then the next one is around five years from my father's first marriage.

SPEAKER_03 13:48

So he kind of started out in a skater lifestyle.

SPEAKER_01 13:52

My he would be the third oldest. He was a skater. And you kind of followed I loved it. I love skateboarding. It was my mom always says it was she had two two of the sons that never got in trouble and never got hurt, and then she had two that were always getting hurt, always getting in trouble. And I was the one of the ones always getting hurt. I remember just it was this it was the lifestyle, you know. I mean, I was jumping off roofs when I was younger. I mean, I did parkour in high school, you know, skateboarding and cliff diving, and I mean my brother, my brother Jake was about the same. Yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_03 14:26

John, what do you think I and I'm just asking this from a psychology standpoint at this for this question? Um, what do you think it is about yourself that drove you to be the guy that jumped off the roof and the cliff diver and you know, kind of that thirst for adventure? I'm always curious about that because I I've kind of I look at boys a lot. It seems like eight years old is a significant age between eight and twelve. They're really trying to find themselves and figure out what's going on. And and I've I've thought about like um, you know, are they bored? Is it boredom that drives them to that? Is it just thrill seeking that drives them to that? Is it looking at what people around them are doing that they say, hey, I that looks fun, I want to do that? Like I'm always looking for the motivation in in boys that takes them from being that little innocent kid to crossing that line to where now there's a lot more potential for harm.

SPEAKER_01 15:36

I I just liked it. Um it was the adrenaline, it was the I you know And you weren't afraid? I wasn't afraid. Okay I wasn't afraid of anything. It's crazy because now I'm older and I have kids, I'm getting more afraid. Like, oh no, you know. Uh but still to this day, I mean I can still do flips. That's one thing. It's it's on a skateboard? Not I can do it on flat ground. I can do backflips, I can do front flips. Yes, yes. Like it's it's harder for me to land it now since I'm getting a little older, but uh that's one thing I try to do every year is at least do one more backflip every year. And then uh this past year we came back from the lake or had a family day, and I was doing front flips and I couldn't land it, and I was so upset. I was like, I can flip, but I wasn't landing flat on the ground. I could backflip, but I had to put my hands on the ground. But it was something that just in my life, it was it was like, especially at that moment in who I was with, no one was doing it. And I actually remember it was just my buddy told these people, hey, get off the bench, my buddy's gonna do a backflip,

Spiral, Suicide Moment, And Survival

SPEAKER_01 16:40

and I was in front of a bunch of people, so I had to do it, and I just did it and I landed it, and we just it was just a rush. I didn't start from me when I was younger, we would go to the river as a family, and there was one guy who would always dive off everything. It's like, okay, well, that's really cool. So I just start doing it. So I'm I was ten years old jumping off 30 foot rocks and doing front flips off 30 foot rocks, doing one and a half off 30 foot rocks, and it was fun.

SPEAKER_03 17:08

I climbed, I went to Hawaii um a few years ago with my kids, and I climbed all the way up on top of this rock. I was gonna be brave and jump off molder, right? I know what I'm doing, I know I'm gonna be safe. I got all the way up to the top of this rock to jump. Do you know that I could not do it? I climbed myself back down, and I was so embarrassed for my little granddaughter, she jumped off, no problem. But I thought, oh, what a poor example I'm setting. I couldn't, I couldn't do it. Well, some people just can't. Yeah, I I couldn't do it.

SPEAKER_01 17:43

I actually got my mom, um, so I grew up in Exeter, and they we live a block half a block away from the high school. Well, there was the high school swimming pool, and sometimes they have the public pool. Well, they used to have the high dive then. I was gonna say, and uh she would take me, and she I convinced her to do a front flip off the dive, the high dive. And so my mom did it, I think about a couple times front flip off the high dive. Then one time she overrotated and got hurt, and she's like, All right, no more. But you know, it was she was a boy mom, she kind of had to run around with us.

SPEAKER_03 18:14

So yeah, uh that's a hard job being a boy mom. Oh, yeah, yeah. When you got kids like you, my my my son and two of them. Yes, yeah. That that's that's hard. That's hard. Okay, so at what point did it start going sideways for you? So you started following after your brother in the skater world, and yeah, I'm sure that was just fun and yeah, it was just fun.

SPEAKER_01 18:38

It was I like skateboard, like I said. Um and it wasn't like I ever felt um like I didn't fit in. It was kind of strange. It was I could talk to anybody and hang out with anybody, any culture, it didn't matter, it didn't matter what background they had, I could just talk to them. Um so it wasn't like I was trying to fit in anywhere, you know? Um but when I I just liked skateboarding, and then with that kind of lifestyle, there was drinking, everyone was drinking during the day, everyone was smoking pot, I mean, everyone was doing something during the day. I mean, it would you'd wake up and it was just you're partying.

SPEAKER_03 19:16

It was like an all-day what is the lifestyle of the skateboarder? It is its own little culture. It is. What what is that culture?

SPEAKER_01 19:25

I I don't want people to think that if you're if people are skateboarding, they're bad people. No, no. Because I still skateboard, I still have skateboard, and and I I can't skate as much as I'm gonna be able to do my pastor's skateboard still, I think. I'm gonna say, because he's he told me about they built a half pipe. I didn't ever get a skate that half pipe, but I wanted to skate that half pipe. But uh yeah, and and it it is, it's a different culture. Um but I think a lot of it is the skateboard culture for a lot of the people, um, they were rejected in certain aspects of their life. Okay. And they found skateboarding as their outlet.

SPEAKER_03 20:01

Kind of like a gang, right? Uh but in a different way. They found a place they they belong. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 20:07

And that's kind of how I was growing up was um the skaters stuck with the skaters. Right. I mean, and it was a complete different kind of lifestyle from people who are in sports. I mean, you might have a couple people who um knew how to ride a skateboard, but when it came to actual skating, it was a whole different life. It's like they lived and breathed skateboarding. I mean, there would be people they bounce from house to house, and you're thinking, Where are your parents? But their parents just kind of didn't care. And so what they they would just skate. But it is, it's a whole different kind of culture. And it it I'm not saying that everyone's good, you know, there's always a there's always someone who kind of messes something up. Um, but skateboarding had a bad rep. Um but there's a lot of people who do bad things.

SPEAKER_03 20:56

Right, yeah. Yeah. I think there's a lot of people do bad things in every kind of sect or group, you know. Um, there's always

Drugs, Violence, And Coping With Shame

SPEAKER_03 21:05

that potential.

SPEAKER_01 21:06

Yeah. But that's probably when it started um before I even got into the skateboarding world. I was probably nine, ten years old, is probably when I first had my first cigarette. Okay. That's when I first tried it. Um me and my buddy growing up, he was my best friend growing up. But that just kind of continued. It wasn't like uh we tried it and we didn't like it, we loved it.

SPEAKER_03 21:27

And do you think it was the image that it had being a smoker or absolutely it was? Because you know you joke when you first smoke. You can't it's not like you like that.

SPEAKER_01 21:40

It was just Well, and it was like we liked what he looked cool smoking. Yeah. I looked cool smoking. The whole holding the cigarette, the way, you know, it was the movies you watch back in the day. You know, I used to love the outsiders and uh they all smoked.

SPEAKER_07 21:55

They did, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:55

You know, our Breakfast Club, John Bender, he smoked, and it was like the cool. Cool guy. Right. You know, and I think that's what started it. We wanted to try it. And uh it just continued. And then you were the kid sitting against the wall smoking cigarette. Look at that guy. You know, and it's it was just the whole persona that it went off. Yeah, um people just trying to be cool. Yeah. But that's b that's where it started, and um just started drinking and partying and um smoking weed, and the weed goes into other drugs and pills, and it just went downhill. You know, um 15 years old, I found out I was having a daughter.

SPEAKER_03 22:37

I uh Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_01 22:39

Yeah, my girlfriend at the time in high school, she became pregnant and um dropped out of high school at 16. Started working for her father. He uh he uh owned um irises. I worked in the fields. So I worked in the fields. She um I didn't I didn't even actually graduate high school. She uh it was some kind of it's a diploma, but it's I paid a tuition. She wrote a paragraph. I got my diploma. I didn't even do anything about it. Um not I was not good at education whatsoever. It was just something I could not do. So I was only ditching. I was, you know. But yeah, 16 years old, I found I was having a kid, I had my daughter at um 17. She actually just turned um 16 years old on the 19th. She lives in Idaho with her mother. Um, so it's crazy. It's a crazy thing to have a 16-year-old daughter. Yeah, it was. Yeah. And that was one thing that kind of um, you know, since I was young having a child, I thought I was a man. So me thinking I was a man, I thought I can do men stuff. So I was buying booze all the time. I I could buy cigarettes when I was 14 years old at the gas stations and started buying booze at 18 years old. So I'd I've I've always had the I guess the opportunity to get what I wanted, you know? Um But yeah, it was hard. It was hard because I guess when I was trying I should have been a kid, I was acting as an adult. And so with that kind of that freedom of an adult, not someone telling you what to do. I mean, I had my first apartment at 18, I married, we got married very early, had a child very young. So we got married. I was I think I was 20 days, 18 when I got married.

SPEAKER_06 24:26

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 24:26

Uh I didn't I don't think it lasted a whole year. Um I don't think we made it a year. And uh she left, she took my daughter, and whenever she did that, I just went into a spiral, started drinking more.

SPEAKER_03 24:44

Um Did you think you guys were gonna make it? Like, was your mindset? Hey, I'm the man now, I have a family now, I'm I'm gonna make this work, or was it just not one day at a time?

SPEAKER_01 24:58

To be honest, I mean I can't people want to point fingers and say he said, she said it just it wasn't gonna work out. We weren't allowed to date in high school. Our parents wanted nothing to do with me. Okay. So it was sneaking around the whole entire time. Um the only time I was actually able to sit in a room with her and her parents was when we talked about that she was pregnant.

SPEAKER_06 25:19

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_01 25:19

So I mean they they wanted nothing to do with me. It's my culture. It was my skateboarding. I was the kid I had long hair down to here, you know, Rastafarian Beanie. I was yeah, I was I was the skater, you know? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:30

And um You're the outcast.

SPEAKER_01 25:32

Yeah, exactly. And she came from a more of a uh conservative family, you know, with uh um she was a cross-country runner, kind of known in at at the school at the time, um getting scholarships, stuff like that, and I was the crazy skater, you know.

SPEAKER_03 25:50

So uh was your mom still trying to get you to go to church at that time where you guys Well, they had uh church hurt.

SPEAKER_01 25:58

Something happened in the previous church, and um they stopped going. Stopped going. And there was I will say the church had a huge impact on that. It wasn't like, you know, some people they they hear something from a preacher and they get offended. It wasn't like that. It was it was a big deal. And uh it was things that I looked back like people of God shouldn't act like that. Right. You know. Um but regardless, we're not supposed to take what men's done and hold it against God. Right. You know, right if there's a problem, we need to pray through it and we need to talk to God, we need to find a good man of God, we need to find a good church and and to continue our walk with God. Um but there is one thing I've had conversations with my mother and uh we have a really good relationship. We always talk scripture, always talking about the Bible. It's one thing I always wanted to do. I wanted to pray with her in the spirit. I wanted to have that opportunity, me and her could pray. And I did. I asked God let us have that opportunity, and it was a beautiful moment, and she told me the one thing she regretted was that she stopped praying in the spirit in front of us. You know, um so yeah, my mom wanted us to have a relationship with God, of course. You know, she she raised us on the Bible. But um we chose our own path, you know, like everybody. I just you know, I'm I'm the youth pastor of the church and I explain to the the young people all the time that mom and dad can bring you to church, but they don't get a plus one to heaven.

SPEAKER_06 27:40

Right.

SPEAKER_01 27:41

You have to choose God, you have to choose that this is the truth.

Bar Culture Marriage And Domestic Turmoil

SPEAKER_06 27:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:46

And mom and dad can go in the rapture and you can watch them go. Yeah. It's not a well, Jesus, I'm with mom and dad. That's not how it works. So we want the best for our children, but they have to want it.

SPEAKER_04 28:00

Right.

SPEAKER_01 28:01

They have to, and that was something that we all had to go through as as um, you know, me and my brothers, we had to choose are we gonna live for God or we not gonna live for God? And we all for a long time no one lived for God. It seems like the you know, life gets busy and you choose your flesh over the things of God, and uh yeah. So I jumped into alcohol. That was my thing. I loved to drink, and um I sold drugs in in high school. It wasn't like I was selling methamphetamine or anything, but I would so I sold weed and um pills, um getting in fights with people. Um just kind of I lived that lifestyle.

SPEAKER_03 28:45

What were you getting in fights about, do you know?

SPEAKER_01 28:48

Dumb stuff.

SPEAKER_03 28:49

So were you just being a tough guy? Were you just people's rescue? You know, there's a I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 28:56

That's how I first started. I will say that. When I when when I first um I wasn't just some guy being a punk running around. The first altercations I'd get into is I was defending people. I was just I didn't like I didn't like bullies. So I tell my kids, I used to bully the bully. So I really don't like when people bully people. Yeah. I really don't like it. And and um that was what it started first, you know, of course, and then you get a big head until someone finally beats you up, and then like, all right, maybe maybe I can't beat everybody up, you know, and then uh I'll never forget the first time I got beat up. So um that's when my mouse didn't run as much, you know, once someone shut it up, then I was able to not be so crazy, I guess. Yeah. Um, but just it was just the lifestyle. You're at a party, someone's looking at you wrong, you fight 'em, or you get jumped by him, or you know, it's just it was just a thing that that that happened. Um that's just kind of it came with the lifestyle. But it wasn't like it wasn't like it wasn't a force lifestyle. It wasn't like I was trying to survive.

SPEAKER_04 30:08

Right.

SPEAKER_01 30:08

It was something I chose. Right. I was choosing this. Like I said, is you liked it.

SPEAKER_03 30:13

It was it was who you were, just some, you know, for what you knew at that time.

SPEAKER_01 30:17

Exactly. Exactly. And it was, it was something that I was the guy that growing up and trying to get my life. I was trying to get my life together. Let's not say that. I was working. I was the guy. I wanted to have the garage with the best bar, with the best liquors, with a pool table. I told myself I'm never gonna quit smoking, I'm never gonna quit drinking. It was that was my thing. I loved it. I mean, I was a whiskey drinker, that was my thing. I would drink wild turkey, and it wasn't I would yeah, I would drink beer, but I liked the liquor. It was the fastest, quickest thing. And uh that's who I was. I was look, I would look forward, say at my age now, when I was younger, I was hoping that I would have a bar. You know, I wanted the bar with the pool table. I wanted to be the guy that everyone went to their house on the weekend and we had the best liquor. You know, and then of course at the end of the night, then we're doing the drugs, you know. I wanted to be that guy. Um, so like you say, I I liked it. It was something that I looked forward to. I think when I was younger, that's what I looked forward to the most. Oh, when I turn 21.

SPEAKER_05 31:22

Right.

SPEAKER_01 31:23

I won't get in trouble for buying booze because I was already buying booze. Um, you know, some kids, oh, when I turn 18, I can't wait to do this. I was already doing it when I was 16.

SPEAKER_03 31:33

Yeah, me too. I was going to bars when I was probably 17. Wow. By the time I got to be 21, it was like no big deal. I was moved on to something different. But yeah, I look back and think, so young to be doing all those crazy things.

SPEAKER_01 31:50

Very young. That's why I tell the young people, it's like um, I said, you guys are blessed because you have something I didn't now. I didn't have a bad childhood. Right. But I didn't have guidance. I didn't have a youth pastor. I didn't have someone to tell me, hey, when you want this, you shouldn't do it. You need to pray. I didn't have someone I can go to. That is one thing I can say. I didn't, I never felt comfortable to talk to anybody about what I was dealing with.

SPEAKER_03 32:16

Were you did you keep it all inside?

SPEAKER_01 32:18

Yeah. I would keep it inside.

SPEAKER_03 32:20

Do you remember when you were a teenager? Do you remember feeling sad?

First Church Encounters And Resistance

SPEAKER_03 32:24

Do you remember I had a lot of anger? Where do you think that came from?

SPEAKER_01 32:32

Um I had a hard time, like I said, in school. Uh academically or with your peers. Not with my peers. I had no problem with that. Um academically. I always felt stupid. Okay. I always felt stupid. And that was a trigger word. If someone called me dumb, that was it.

SPEAKER_03 32:52

So that was your kind of sense of shame. That was my shame. Absolutely. That was my shame. Um and you're an entrepreneur, so you know today that you were never stupid.

SPEAKER_01 33:03

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:04

Um you just learn probably differently.

SPEAKER_01 33:07

Yeah, I learned differently. I remember being tested in high school. Like they they sat, they brought in a specialist and tested me, and she said when it came to my hands-on that I could have been graduating from a college. But when it came to reading in math, they said he should be in like the third grade. It was that bad. I could barely actually read when I first came to church.

SPEAKER_03 33:30

Well, you never applied yourself probably since school.

SPEAKER_01 33:33

Well, it was really hard. That's one thing is, you know, because like I said, I so I didn't join public school till I was a freshman. And I got in trouble from teachers, but I was trying. Yeah. When I first got there, I'm like, I don't even know what they're talking about. You know, it was like a complete different language.

SPEAKER_04 33:51

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 33:52

The way that they would do the math. And I'm like, and so at that point, you're like, what do you do?

SPEAKER_04 33:57

Right.

SPEAKER_01 33:58

Well, I'm gonna be the tough guy because I have no idea what's going on, and I don't want people to think I'm stupid.

SPEAKER_03 34:02

Right.

SPEAKER_01 34:03

So that kind of started it. I think that was the biggest thing was I was Yeah, I could see that I was ashamed of not being able to um it's not that I wouldn't apply myself, it didn't work. My mind worked differently, my brain just was completely different.

SPEAKER_03 34:21

And being homeschooled, you would have learned probably a complete different way. And with math, it's so many layers that if you lose, you know, layer 10, you're never gonna be able to understand layer 25.

SPEAKER_01 34:35

Yeah. So I think that that was it. I was it was anger for me. You know, um, I know there's anxiety and there's the fear. Well, I always thought that was a cop out before I came to church. When people tell me I suffered anxiety, I'd be like, There's no such thing as anxiety. That's just people make up in their mind. But I had anger when people would be um anxious, I would be furious. And that was one thing. It was it was my anger.

SPEAKER_03 35:04

I see that a lot with boys because for whatever reason that seems acceptable. Tears are not acceptable, sadness is not acceptable, being afraid is not acceptable, but anger and anger gives them a sense of control. I can hit something that feels better, I can, you know, do whatever, and it's it's a total false sense of the same thing.

SPEAKER_01 35:28

You can control the situation, right? Right. And then you feel in power.

SPEAKER_03 35:32

Exactly. Right.

SPEAKER_01 35:34

And with you know, if you're in control, then you feel confidence. Right. Which is completely of the world. It's not that's that's not true.

SPEAKER_03 35:44

Well, it's such a false sense of confidence, but who knows that in the moment, right?

SPEAKER_01 35:48

We don't that's something I had to learn as as a believer is in my weakness, yet am I strong? Because I reach for God.

SPEAKER_05 35:55

Right.

SPEAKER_01 35:56

Right in my weakness, I used to punch people, right? You know? Um or you would scream at people, you would g push people away because you don't want people to truly see who you are.

SPEAKER_05 36:06

Right.

SPEAKER_01 36:07

So I think that's what it was, is is I had anger. And that's something even God's still working with me today. I'm nowhere near who I used to be. But there is of course there's still anger.

SPEAKER_03 36:20

You know, the Bible says, it's your uh natural reflex, right? To be angry first.

SPEAKER_01 36:26

Yeah, well it says you can be angry, just sin not in your anger. Right. Uh we just gotta redirect our anger. Right. And um, but that's what God's working, and he's still, I mean, he's still working on me. But when I was younger, that was it. And then of course alcohol and drugs, and it helped the anger. Yeah. You know.

SPEAKER_03 36:44

Uh Were you ever tested for dyslexia?

SPEAKER_01 36:48

I I couldn't tell you if that was if they ever came up with a solution, I guess, if that

The Communion Decision And Turning Point

SPEAKER_01 36:56

was the fact. Um, but I could barely read. Um, my mother said that I did have some kind of learning disability. She did tell me that um later on because I was kind of just talked to her about it, you know, later and she's like, Jonathan, you had a learning disability. Like, I didn't know that, you know? Yeah. I just thought I was like, well, everyone else is wrong, you know. Uh but yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:20

Well, I think it it's I hate the word disability because I think that's usually not the case. Sometimes I or it's learning differently. Yeah, you you learn differently, right? And I I think uh dyslexia is something that was not very common. They didn't test for that a lot. They didn't even now, it's not very mainstream, but there's a lot of people that struggle with dyslexia, and so they're they see it backwards, they see it different in their brain, so it does not compute. Yeah. Um, so now I'm more aware of that. I I check for that with with well.

SPEAKER_01 37:58

My brother, he's an educator, and um he's told me before that there's maybe problem problem students, and some teachers say, Oh, you gotta be careful. And he's learned that it's not that the kid has a problem, it's not a problem. It's just he learns differently. Yeah. That's what I love about my brother. He shows grace.

SPEAKER_05 38:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:14

Kids chewing on something, yeah. Give them a granola bar.

SPEAKER_05 38:18

Right.

SPEAKER_01 38:19

Give them a fidget spinner, give them something.

SPEAKER_05 38:21

Right.

SPEAKER_01 38:22

And then they can focus.

SPEAKER_05 38:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:24

And uh that's that's something that he's he's told me. He's like, Yeah, he's like, people just think it's there's a problem. When well, if there's a problem, there's always a solution to a problem, you know, which we just have to be willing to try to find the solution. Right.

SPEAKER_03 38:40

Yes, if we're willing to look at kids and look for what what's really going on here, because kids in and of themselves are not problems, and whatever behavior is happening, there is a reason, usually outside of that kiddo's control. And so I'm glad that there's teachers out there that that take the time to see the child because they suffer so much in silence, and all they have are their behaviors to try to get help, and you know, they don't know how to, they don't even know how to articulate what they're feeling or what's going on.

SPEAKER_07 39:15

It's true.

SPEAKER_03 39:17

So where so your wife leaves, your daughter's born, your wife leaves, then where does that take you in life?

SPEAKER_01 39:26

So it was actually my buddy's birthday. Um, I was working, I was like, I'll I won't forget it, because I was on the tractor, and it was, I think it was his 18th birthday. It was his 18th birthday. No, it was his 19th birthday. I was already 18, so it was his 19th birthday, and his mother invited me and my daughter and her mother out to dinner, to Chili's. And I called her up and said, Hey, they're inviting us to Nick's birthday. And she said, No, don't worry about it. Um, I'm working later. My mom's already got Cassidy. Don't worry about it. I said, Okay. She said, You go have fun. I said, Okay, and we had a plan to go back to the house and hang out because I was the only one with an apartment. And when we showed up, me and my buddy, everything was gone. All the all the furniture was gone, everything was gone. So at that moment, a broken heart, I couldn't show to him.

SPEAKER_05 40:19

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 40:20

I couldn't show my buddies that I was sad.

SPEAKER_05 40:22

And you were shocked because of one of them.

SPEAKER_01 40:25

Oh, yeah, I was shocked. I was working for her father.

SPEAKER_06 40:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:29

And come home and her father moved all the stuff out. You know, so it was a complete betrayal of what happened. Oh, yeah, absolutely. And uh I remember calling her up and I told her, I said, You took the beer pong table and I hung up on her. I looked at my buddy and I said, We're going to the bank. I drained my account.

Men’s Conference And Receiving The Holy Ghost

SPEAKER_01 40:45

We bought all the booze. I told him to invite everybody, and that's where it started. I just with my hurt, I was trying to drown it in alcohol and drugs. And it just spiraled. I got evicted from the apartment. Um, I mean, it was it was wild, it was crazy.

SPEAKER_03 41:03

Um I imagine you lost your job with that.

SPEAKER_01 41:06

Oh, yeah. Yeah, I lost it.

SPEAKER_03 41:07

Um right away after she left, or um, I was never told I was fired, but I kind of just took it as that. You just never went.

SPEAKER_01 41:18

The employer took all my stuff, and so the thing was was she was willing to live with their parents. And I was like, no way, you know, I'm not doing that. That's crazy. Already had it at our apartment, had two vehicles. I mean, it w yeah, I'm not gonna do that. Um I mean, it got so wild, I remember my buddy's little brother because I used to throw knives, and I'm into firearms and you know, crossbows. And oh, John, can you teach me how to throw a knives? I was starting teaching him how to throw knives in the walls. I mean, I just completely didn't care about nothing. Nothing at all. There actually came a time uh in that moment, you know, just like the Bible says that sin's profitable, it's pleasureful for a season. Well, everybody had their season at John's house. Right. Well, when reality came, everybody left. And I remember just drinking and I was sitting in a lawn chair. I still had a TV and I was sitting in a lawn chair, and I just remember it was just me and myself, and just looking at the TV, the the reflection, and just seeing myself saying, dude, this is horrible. Forget it. And I had a rifle, and I remember going in there and racking up around, um, it's a World War War II rifle, and I was gonna shoot myself. And it it wasn't like I was depressed and just whining and crying, but I was just fed up. Everything, you know, everything starts going back in your head, and I was like, whatever. My daughter was gone. I had no job, I definitely didn't want to go live back with mom and dad. I'm only 18. I mean it wouldn't have been a huge deal. There's some people they don't move out till they're 25 years old, you know. Um and I I I and I was, I was gonna shoot myself, and my mom called. She told me she was, I don't know why, son, but I had to call you. I started to cry. I said, Mom, you need to come get me now. So I'm going to shoot myself. And that was just God. Yeah. It was definitely God.

SPEAKER_03 43:20

Because at that point you weren't like a deep philosophical thinker. You were just two fingers in the air, I'm done. Make up your mind that quick. Just done.

SPEAKER_01 43:30

Yeah. Well, it was like I couldn't be alone. Yeah. That is one thing. I was kind of joking around yesterday. So the same guy who was with me at the apartment, Nick, when she took everything, um, he actually got the Holy Ghost yesterday.

SPEAKER_03 43:46

Praise God.

SPEAKER_01 43:47

He received the gift of the Holy Ghost. And it's it's just crazy because I met my wife now at his house at a party. Wow. And so I've known him nineteen years. Wow. And it I might cry for that. Uh But that was something that was just a full circle moment, right? Yeah. Well when I I'll try to hit back, but I have to share this is um when I got into church, it was like, wow, when I got the Holy Ghost, that's it. There ain't no drug like this, there's no booze like this, there's nothing like this. So I'm like screaming on the mountain, everybody needs Jesus. Like this is crazy good.

SPEAKER_06 44:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:21

And I remember going to his house and just telling him, I mean, I'm like, gun boom, you know, I'm like, dude, you need Jesus. And he he might he might not even remember this conversation uh this eight years ago. And he says, Oh, that's that's good, bro, but that's not for me. What do you mean it's not for you? This is the best thing. And you turn you he said, You changed too quick, way too fast. What do you mean? It's like you were snorting blow one day, and then now you're telling us scriptures the next. Like you you went too quickly too fast.

SPEAKER_03 44:54

So did that mean he didn't trust it that it was real or something. I think he was scared. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 44:58

I think he was scared, and um I think he was kind of intimidated, like, whoa, like this guy, it was my pastor when he came into church said it was like a Paul effect because there were so many of us came in at once so quickly. It was the transition into a relationship with God, because we were all drug addicts, alcoholics, wrecked marriages, but once we once we surrendered to God, it was like we surrendered everything. Because it was of course we had struggles, and there's some things we held in, you know, in our own in our own minds,

Baptism, Sobriety, And New Beginnings

SPEAKER_01 45:32

but it was just such a quick thing, it was a quick work, and I think it kind of intimidated him. And I'm like, hey, come to church. And he's like, nah, that was too fast. Well, he started coming to Bible studies and everything. Well, he got the Holy Ghost yesterday, and uh next step is baptism, yeah. You know, so it's gonna be an awesome awesome time for that. But um I can't remember what I was talking about.

SPEAKER_03 45:55

So you your mom came and picked you up at that time. Oh, my mom picked me up, okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 45:59

Because you said she called and you and you you would think it would have got better when I got to that low point, it didn't it?

SPEAKER_03 46:05

So when your mom picked you up, did she take you back to her house?

SPEAKER_01 46:08

Yeah, I lived at her house. Um I lived at her house for a couple months, and then my mother my grandmother had a bigger house in Exeter, and I ended up moving in over there. Um I had she had a guest room for me and my buddies, but I chose the garage. I'd sleep in the garage. Um and that so once my daughter's mother left, it was just a spiral. I mean, it came to the point that I probably went a whole entire year without being sober. I mean, it was just I was drinking, I was smoking, I was popping pills. It was anything. Um, I mean, making up lies just to get something. I mean, doing anything in my power to be intoxicated. Like I had to get that high. Um, drinking fifth of whiskies to myself. And at this time, I mean, I never ate. I mean, I might have been a 120 pounds, you know, and uh it was just every day, just it was party, party, party, party, party.

SPEAKER_03 47:09

Um So that day that you were gonna shoot yourself was and and you went to stay with your mom, didn't did things slow down for you at that point? It it continued.

SPEAKER_01 47:21

It continued.

SPEAKER_03 47:22

Did the thought of suicide ever come back?

SPEAKER_01 47:25

It would always pop in the mind. It was kind of strange, it's like it wasn't like I was oh life is you know, like I was down on myself. Wasn't I wasn't I wasn't a depressed person. Right.

SPEAKER_03 47:37

But it was just kind of like But it was an option that you entertained at one point. So once that option presents itself, it's easy for it to continue to present itself.

SPEAKER_01 47:46

Absolutely, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 47:48

So as long as everything was going okay, you didn't really think about it.

SPEAKER_01 47:52

Yeah. Well, I never found myself alone.

SPEAKER_03 47:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 47:55

I never found myself So that was the case being by myself. I think that's what it was was being alone. Okay. And then reality hitting. Yeah. Because when you have friends around, you're drinking, you're doing drugs, you're always doing something. Right. But it was the you know, being by myself, realizing my reality, my life. I wasn't who I wanted to be. Um I needed something greater, you know, and and I was just kind of like, well, I can't I've tried everything, you know. That's I was at that point like kind of like I I I tried everything. So why? Why try? It didn't help. Um like I said, at this point, my my dad drinks would there's alcohol in the home. Um, so I was drinking, and they didn't want me drinking his beer. He'd tell me, Don't drink my beer, that's his beer. But I drink his beer, you know. Um and I met my wife. She had three jobs. I had no job. She had all the money. Uh her dad had a uh had a houseboat, and we would go on the lake every day for like a sum for the whole summer. And it's always just I was drunk all the time. You know, it was in and when I was at my grandmother's, I got I f I finally

Forgiveness, Letting Go, And Healing

SPEAKER_01 49:10

once I got kicked out, I pretty much got kicked out. But uh it's party, party, party, party, party, party, party. I mean, that's all it was. It was everybody knew, hey, let's we'll go to John's, we'll go to Dever's, um, and we'll just get wasted. You know, um I actually have a couple buddies who've passed away from that lifestyle that they would knew to go to my house because it was the place and did whatever you wanted. It was the garage. We did anything we wanted there. Um but it didn't stop. You know, I got with um I started dating my wife. Um we had a child very quickly in our relationship. Um, you would think that I would kind of slow down on my life would get better. I was actually I was very sad when I found out she was having a child. She's gonna have my child. Not the fact of that I didn't want to be with her was a piece of me said, I felt bad for the child because I would never love anyone as much as I love my daughter.

SPEAKER_06 50:17

Yeah, the one that the first one. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:21

Um I told that to myself the time, like, this poor kid's not gonna I can't love 'em. I don't know why. Maybe it's I never felt loved. I felt loved by my family, my parents and stuff, but maybe I just I felt that betrayal from um my daughter's mother. Uh I just thought to myself, I didn't have enough love. I didn't have enough love for anyone else. Yeah, I was in a relationship with my wife at the time, but I didn't love her. Well, I'm just gonna be real, you know. I did I did not love her. It was um we were dating and she got pregnant, of course, and we lived um together and we ended up getting married. But even after our marriage, it was like I didn't love her.

SPEAKER_03 51:06

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 51:07

I was it was it was just what you did.

SPEAKER_03 51:09

It was yeah, yeah, convenience, I wanna say, um because you're in a relationship.

SPEAKER_01 51:17

And I wasn't a good guy. I would not at all. I will say that is is I don't, you know, I don't I don't want to give the devil any credit for anything because he doesn't have the power to do that to me. Um now I know there's some things he can whisper and continue, and I and I understand that, but it all came down to me. I'm not gonna blame the devil for what I chose. Right. And um actually brother Mike from our church, he preached one time a couple years ago and he said that he goes, I I'm not gonna give the devil any credit, and that stuck with me. Um I think a lot of times we throw everything on the devil. Right. And he's not even nowhere near us. You know, he's not even messing around with us. It's our own flesh that we keep messing up. Uh but yeah, so we got married and it didn't nothing nothing helped. Right. Nothing helped at all.

SPEAKER_03 52:08

And is there a conscious awareness that there's something missing? Like you're going through the emotions with

Quitting Cigarettes And Fighting Temptation

SPEAKER_03 52:15

your wife and you're having a baby. Was do you feel like there was a conscious awareness within yourself that there's just something missing?

SPEAKER_01 52:23

Yeah, absolutely. There was I knew there was something missing.

SPEAKER_03 52:27

That's why uh did you think that it was the hurt from your wife leaving and the and and losing your daughter? Did you think it was that? I was hurt that she left. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:38

But not as hurt as not having my daughter. Yeah. I don't want to sound like a a heartless person, but um I cared that she left because she took my daughter. Right. It yeah, she was, you know, my first love. Right, right. She was um I had my first child with. But her as a person, I don't want to sound mean.

SPEAKER_03 53:03

You were just attached to her.

SPEAKER_01 53:04

I was attached to my daughter most of anything, and that's what it was. That's and that's why it was kind of when she left, it was kind of like that's kind of what I was hoping for, but I didn't want you to take my daughter, right? Right. Um, because I didn't care. I didn't care about people.

SPEAKER_05 53:20

Right.

SPEAKER_01 53:20

I I I didn't care. It just it's not like that I was like, oh, I hate everybody, but I could care less. Like I said, someone would be suffering with anxiety, or I'd laugh at them. And that's something even my wife, my wife now, whenever we got in our marriage at the beginning before we got into church, and I would laugh at her. Say, You're ridiculous, you're ridiculous. Like that's fake. I didn't care. I was a rude, mean guy. Um, so I didn't care that she left. It was more the hurt that I love my daughter so much. I was my daughter.

SPEAKER_05 53:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:53

I always wanted to be a father. Always. Um, my brother had my older brother Jake, who was the skater, had a kid at 16. He had his first son at 16.

SPEAKER_03 54:04

And uh but you really followed in his footsteps. Yeah, yeah. Wow.

SPEAKER_01 54:09

Uh I'm not blaming him, you know. We all choose our own actions. Right.

SPEAKER_03 54:13

But we influence. Yeah. I mean, absolutely all of us influence somebody in our trajectory. So he he was your big brother. You looked up to him, I'm sure.

SPEAKER_01 54:24

I really did. Um and so I I I did, I always wanted to be a father. I think it's maybe because I was the youngest of five boys. I just liked the family. Um, so that's what hurt me the most was I felt like I wasn't a father no more. You know, and of course I could have done more to keep her, um, but I went into a spiral. You know, and uh even with my marriage, my son was born. It's just it's beautiful what God does. It really is. So my first child was is a daughter, and um it was a natural birth. My second child's a boy. There's a C-section. People may not look at the details. I'm a detail guy. And it's beautiful what God did is I wasn't living for God then, but He gave me a son because at that moment I couldn't love another girl because I had my one daughter. Right. And even the birth experience was different. Right, right. It wasn't like it was a rerun. Right. You know, so it wasn't like new experience that you didn't have to compare. Exactly. And that's what choose. Yeah, I didn't have to choose. I didn't just have to say which one was better because you couldn't compare the two. And it was just beautiful what God does. Yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_03 55:42

He knew what you needed.

SPEAKER_01 55:43

Yeah,

Ministry, Calling, And Learning To Trust

SPEAKER_01 55:44

he did.

SPEAKER_03 55:45

Um those details, like, you know, I think when you live for God and and you see his goodness to us and his kindness, because those little details are just for you. Yeah. Because he knows you, he knew exactly what you would need to be able to love your baby. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 56:09

Well, it just it just proves what a caring God he is.

SPEAKER_03 56:12

Right, right. You know, and all the things we would take for granted and not really notice.

SPEAKER_01 56:17

It's the little things, yeah. That's what I love about my God is the little things that everyone else overlooks. He's like, I haven't overlooked you, I haven't overlooked this moment. And that was really beautiful for me to to see that. And of course, I I I don't want to say I knew it because I wasn't spiritual at all. Um I didn't, I wasn't following God at all, but in my heart, it was like, well, I can love this kid. And he's Jonathan Alexander Deaver Jr. He's my junior, he's my only son. Um, and I do. I I love him, you know, and and uh, but we're completely different. We're completely different. I'm the wild, you know, so I like to jump off things, and he's not so wild jumping off things, but um it's just beautiful what God does. Yeah. And uh so I was able I I love my son, but I wasn't a good father. I'd still get so at this point after my son was born, I started working in the pool industries, um, and I started getting into heavier drugs, cocaine. And I loved cocaine. I loved pills, that was my my biggest, that was my favorite drug, was pills. And then when I had I liked the taste. I really liked it. It's kind of weird. I like the flavor of a pill. Um if I chop I would chop it up and snort it, or I would break it up and chew it up. I I liked that taste. And then um the first time I did cocaine was it was the flavor of the drip was the pill. It reminded me of that. And some pills made me feel like I was invincible, and then cocaine was that times 10. So I really felt invincible. Um, it was another thing of I I had no control over my life, but when I was on drugs, it felt like I was in control. I think it was because I was self-conscious. Um I didn't want people to know they were on me. Uh so I would use drugs and alcohol. And um just trying to kind of cover that up, you know. Um actually, brother Mike, he's our prayer coordinator at our church, him and his wife, they're actually they want us to the Lord. But we sat Fairchild. Fairchild, yes.

SPEAKER_03 58:39

Okay, we just saw his testimony on uh okay.

SPEAKER_01 58:42

That's not even that's not even a quarter of his testimony, you know.

SPEAKER_03 58:44

So he won you to the Lord.

SPEAKER_01 58:46

Yeah, yeah. So we were friends in the world. Um his wife, Katie, and my wife, best friends, um even in the world. We would go to the bars with each other, we'd party with each other. Um, me and him would run around getting bags of coke. So we used to come up, I tell people it's kind of funny, as is we used to text each other, hey, how like how are we gonna lie to our wives to get drugs this weekend? I used to text about that, and then we started texting scriptures to each other. We started becoming, instead of running around with buddies doing drugs, and we were going to prayer meetings with each other. So they they they invited us to church. Um But what I'm was trying to get to is I started working in the pool industry, I got deeper into drugs. It was the cocaine, and it wasn't like I was just doing it at night. I would get my work orders, get in my truck, go down the road a little bit, rack up a line, snort it, go to work. Um got to the point that all I would get was a 44 ounce of Mountain Dew, and that was it. I'm working 12 hour days, and it's summertime. What do you you're not hungry? No, I can't eat, you know, because I was on drugs. Um that that's that's kind of it went deeper than that. So I was drinking. I was married to my wife. Um we were two broken people trying to fix each other, and none of us, neither one of us could help each other. I mean,

Loving His Wife After Meeting Love

SPEAKER_01 1:00:20

it was just chaos. Um wife told me I can share what we need, I need to share today. And um we were physical with each other.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:30

Um there was times that just so I'm gonna just spell that out for the audience. I'm sure they know, but you guys had domestic violence going on.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:40

Yes, yeah, yes.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:41

Um I think that's so common, especially for people that aren't saved. It's it's so easy, I think. Yeah. Not that it's ever okay, obviously, but um it can happen very easily and quickly.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:57

Yeah, absolutely. Um well she had anger. Um same as me. We were both broken from our past. We met at a party. What do you you know, what do you expect? Right. We met at a place that we shouldn't have either one of us been.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:15

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:15

And it was a setting. I mean, we weren't we weren't boyfriend and girlfriend long. We talked to each other and we weren't even we dated, I think, not long, maybe a month before we found out she was pregnant. Um and it didn't even stop, you know. I mean, there would be times so our week looked towards the weekend.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:37

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:37

It was just for means to an end finding babysitters Wednesday, trying to find a babysitter on Wednesday so we're ready for Friday and Saturday to go to the bars. Just we're waiting, you know. Um I mean, I it was drugs during the day, I was drinking on jobs, I mean it it was just nonstop, you know. Uh but that's what we looked forward to was to get drunk because we were both trying to escape. I don't want to say we hated each other, but we probably liked the idea of each other. And there were some times, yeah, we might be, oh I love you, you know, emotional. But when it came the deep down inside is I don't think we did. We were on the we were on the rocks to to divorce. Um I think it was probably more of a pride thing we didn't want to get divorced, you know. Um but it was just a hard, it was a hard time. We are two broken people trying to fix each other, and that doesn't work. You know, we were hurt people hurting each other.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:46

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:46

And there was times all the time, especially we'd be drinking and um physical altercations. Um it was either her or either me. You know, it wasn't like uh it wasn't a good time. I could just say that as it was a rocky marriage. Yeah. Um but I think it was because when we were entertaining, yeah. We were always looking for the next high. She was someone who she only drank when we went to bars. She wasn't uh an everyday drinker, she was a um casual drinker, but she loved to drink, she loved to go to the bar, she loved go dancing. I mean, um I'd seen karaoke in Thursday nights, you know. I was go to the pool. I did. I did. That's what Pastoral laugh was uh I used to sing karaoke on Sunday nights, and now I sing on the praise team. So I mean it's it's good with just what God does, you know. Um that's what's funny because it was pool on Thursdays, free pool, five dollar pitchers, and the same thing on Sundays. Well, we have youth on Thursdays, so we do youth on Thursdays now instead of going to the bar, and uh, we have church Sunday night instead of going to the bar. But um we were broken.

SPEAKER_06 1:04:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:03

You know, and and there was nothing she could do to fix me. Absolutely nothing she could do. There's actually a time when she she wanted to go to uh a church here in town, and so we went because um when I was younger, I went through this, it was called Life Hurts God Heals, and it's like a celebrate recovery. And I was 15 and I got my one-year chip. Um didn't do any drugs,

Youth Ministry, Bible Studies, And Local Outreach

SPEAKER_01 1:04:30

but once I got my one-year chip, my buddy came pigment. I threw the chip, literally threw it that night, and I got loaded that night. I don't know why. Actually, I do know why. I went through it because at the time my daughter's mother family hated me. So I was trying to prove to people that I could be a sober person. Because there's a piece of me, you know, I wanted to be with her.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:52

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:52

Um, but it didn't matter if I was sober or not, it wasn't allowed. Right. So it's kind of like, you know, whatever. Yeah. Um but fast forward, so one of the women who was over that life hurts God Hills celebrate recovery when I was younger, she went to this church. And so, oh, I know this person. Okay, we'll go. And um I can't remember the name of the church. Um and we went and she felt God. I did not. She was looking, I was not looking. I was still angry. I was probably angry at God. Uh but there was a time she keeps crying, bawling, and once again, I'm not I'm not trying to say anything bad about people, but if they were uh Yeah, no empathy for him. Yeah. Yeah. Well, if if they knew if they searched the scriptures more perfectly, they would have seen she would have received the Holy Ghost. Mm-hmm. Someone would have just talked to her. Someone would have told her about repentance. She could have easily received the Holy Ghost.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:57

She was ready.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:58

She was ready. She was ready. Um, I don't think she repented. She didn't know, no one told her anything. They just, that's it, you know. Right. Kind of rubbed her back, but that was it. And I walked outside. I said, forget this.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:08

This is That's such a good point. Um sidebar, really quick, because I think that I've never thought what you just said. I've never thought that when you see somebody in church to walk them through the steps. Yeah, absolutely. You can see that God's dealing with them, you can see them crying. Um, it and it's kind of embarrassing to say, but it's never occurred to me to think, oh, they don't know what to do. They they need to know that this is the Lord they're filling, and then you just repent and turn all your sins over. And you know, I watched our youth pastor, brother um Alonzo.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:55

Yeah, that's my boy.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:56

He's really good. I saw him yesterday in church go up to somebody. I'm not kidding, 15 minutes later they're filling up the baptismal tank. Hallelujah. I think Brother Andres gets that, you know. But until you just said that, I've watched so I've watched him do that. Um, but until you just said that, I have never really thought that people don't know. Yeah.

Honoring Pastors And Healthy Church Culture

SPEAKER_03 1:07:20

You know, I think we I think there's just an assumption that if they're at church, they know.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:25

But they probably really don't know.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:27

They don't know. Like my wife, she knew nothing. Yeah. She didn't grow up at all knowing anything about church. Nothing about the Bible. But yes, she was raised.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:35

But she's responding to the presence of God.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:37

Because she was she was hungry. Yeah. That's what it says that they that hunger and thirst after righteousness, they shall be filled. Right. And if we seek God out, it doesn't matter what setting it is. It doesn't matter if it's the whole truth or not. If you're seeking God, God's gonna find He's omnipresent, He's everywhere. Now, of course, there's um you know, uh reading the book of Acts that uh Apollos, he was preaching God, only knew the of the baptism of John. Yeah. And they had to come and teach him more perfectly. Right. It's the same thing.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:10

Well more perfectly meaning more. There was more to the gospel. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:16

There was more to it than just what he knew. Right. And it wasn't, it was is uh ignorance not in a bad way. Right. Not knowing.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:22

Right, of course, right.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:23

And that's what my wife she didn't even know who Noah was. You may have heard of a boat, you know, about the animals, but she didn't know, she didn't know Adam and Eve was, she didn't know anything.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:31

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:31

She was raised, you just believe Jesus and be a good person. Yeah. That was it. And it was just it wasn't out of, you know, her family being bad people. That's just the way they were raised, just generation to generation. Uh but that's a huge thing. I've seen that a lot, is is when people they just don't know. Yeah. Especially as a as um working with the youth, the young people. We have a church in Plainview. It was uh we have a campus in Plainview and in Strathmore, and that's where our youth chapel is. Well, there's a lot of kids just running around Plainview. I don't know if you know if you've ever heard of Plainview.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:05

Yeah, I've been there.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:06

It's kind of like a deserted town. Yep. There's no law, there's nothing out there. They do whatever they want. Yeah. And uh some of these kids they've never even said the name Jesus unless they were using it in a curse. Right. Yeah, they're cursing. They've never prayed before. And you're telling them, and they're feeling they're pricked in their hearts by the message or by the worship, and they're like, I don't know what to do. Right. So yeah, you gotta go alongside of and just talk to them.

SPEAKER_06 1:09:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:34

That's like Buddy Nick. Yeah, just yesterday was praying with him, talking to him, like you just gotta give it to God. Of course, repent of your sins and then just worship him. We make it so hard to receive the Holy Ghost, to receive the Spirit of God when Peter tells us so simply repent, be baptized, you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. And that's something I was talking to him yesterday, and he did, and it was very faint. He was speaking in tongues. And then um actually there's another man in a in in the church that they both come to our Bible study. Um, because I have a Bible study on Tuesday at my house, and Marshall and Nick, I knew them when I was younger. I used to play baseball with Marshall. Uh we're praying at the altar, and I got Marshall right here, and Nick right here, and I'm praying over him, and Pastor comes up and he lays his hands on them, and they both just explode in speaking in tongues. And it wasn't

Closing Reflections And Invitation

SPEAKER_01 1:10:30

like, and this is something that Marshall he received the Holy Ghost years ago and baptized him. But he I don't think he heard it for himself, and he didn't believe it. Like he believed it.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:42

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:42

He didn't have confidence. He didn't have confidence, like his wife's part of our purpose team, and and she's gone with us overseas to El Salvador and Mongolia, and and she's a big part in our church. Um but for himself, right? And Pastor laid hands on, and I'm it's kind of like a diamond shape how we were sitting, standing, and he blew up. I look over at Nick to see if it was Nick speaking in tongues. It wasn't him. I look over and it's Marshall, and then I hear another one and it's Nick, and it was like Wow. But they didn't know what to do.

SPEAKER_06 1:11:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:15

So when I received the gift of the Holy Ghost, no one prayed over me. That's some in some points that's that's that way. I don't know if you know um Pastor Delgado in Stockton.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:25

Oh, I know of him.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:27

Michael Delgado. Well, he received the Holy Ghost in his apartment. He gave everything to God and he started speaking in tongues in his apartment. He gave everything to God, he repented of sin. So I was at Men's Conference Um 2020. We just got into church. We got in church in January 2020, so we just went over our eight years being in church.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:47

So did that experience of visiting that one church and Tommy was feeling the presence of the Lord, did that start you guys going to church?

SPEAKER_01 1:11:56

It didn't, it pushed me further away.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:58

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:58

The church that they were at, they kind of act like the pastor is holy of all holies, and and it was instantly I was like, but I already had a chip on my shoulder walking in. Right. I'm already looking. You know, if you're looking, you're gonna find issues. Right, right. And uh she was she was hungry, she was really hungry. Yeah, I was not, I was angry. Uh so I will talk about how we first came to church. We first came to the Harvest Center in 2018, January. It was Michael Fairchild and his wife Katie Fairchild. They are getting baptized. So Michael and Katie. So Dennis, brother Fulton, is Katie's uncle.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:38

And Dennis is already in at this time.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:41

Dennis is already in this time. And he's on fire. Yeah, he's on fire. This is this is what revival.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:46

Dennis uh was on a previous episode, and um, that's who he's talking about. You should watch his testimony because he when he got in, he changed the world around him because it was so pretty miraculous.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:00

And so because they saw what God did in Dennis.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:03

And so Katie is related to Dennis, that's her niece, and so Michael's her husband. Yes, and so they're getting baptized.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:10

Yeah, so they're and I saw a change in Michael first because I had a diaper party. I don't know if you know what a diaper party is, you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:17

Yeah, the boys.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:18

The boys baby shower, right? Yeah, and so we're getting drunk, we're getting crazy drunk. And um, one thing that stuck out to me was Michael was already coming to church. We were really good friends, but he wasn't drinking.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:29

At your diaper party?

SPEAKER_01 1:13:30

Didn't drink at my diaper party. And that was one thing that stuck out to me, and people were trying to get him to drink because he he was one of our drinking buddies.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:38

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:38

And he wasn't drinking. Of course, he was doing everything else, you know, still hanging out and still smoking and stuff, but he wasn't drinking. It was one of the steps he was deciding not to do. And I remember yelling at everybody, hey, leave him alone, he's living for God now. Well, that stuck out to me. Uh so Katie and Michael's gonna get baptized. And I tell them, do not get baptized in a Pentecostal church. They're nuts, they're crazy, leave them alone, don't go to them.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:03

And Katie So did you have experience with Pentecost?

SPEAKER_01 1:14:07

No, it just you know what you hear. Okay, you know? So speaking in tongues, I know that's biblical. Yeah. I grew up hearing tongues. Right.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:14

It was just But that wasn't a Pentecostal church, so it wasn't Pentecostal church, no.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:19

Um so I told her, like, just they're crazy. I and I told her for the people at home. Right. Absolutely. Absolutely. Uh well people can people can be crazy about their football. Why can't we be crazy about a God who actually knows our name? Right, right. Who actually loves us? Uh but so she's getting baptized, and she goes, Well, will you just come and support us? Of course we will, you know. And so we show up. Little did I know. I always tell us this. She was it was kind of like a lie to get me in church. I I I know she's repented over it, but uh, she told us to come to service. It was Sunday morning service and Lindsay. Well, she didn't tell me that I had to go to Sunday morning service and then Sunday night service and wait till after the service of watching me baptized. Um, but it was the best thing that could have ever happened to me and my family. We went Sunday morning, um, and it's just beautiful what God does. There was communion that day. So first time I heard, first time I ever walked in the apostolic church. And I'll never forget it. I walked in, and the same man that Dennis mentioned, brother Monks, who helped him taught him Bible studies and pick him up, was the same man who first caught my eye. I walked into church and he's just smiling at me. I thought, what's this guy smiling at? What's he want? You know, and he came up and gave me, you know, a man hug and shake and hug. Good to see you, bro. I'll never forget that because why is he being so kind? Mm-hmm. What is it why why is this guy so nice? You know, um from the world.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:55

No one's nice. Did you instantly trust it? His his demeanor. Well, I could I could feel it was real. Yeah. Instantly.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:02

Because you know, you you learn how to read people.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:04

Right, right, right.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:05

Yeah, you and that's one thing I'm I I I over observe everything. I'm always looking around. You know, I'm always I over-obserb people. Um, but I could feel I could feel safe. I will I will say that. I could feel safe when I entered into the harvest center. And uh remember there was a young man, I mean, he probably only nine years old going crazy on the drums. I was kind of like, whoa, you know, that's that's awesome. Well, then the man preached. And the preached word of God went forth, and it was literally like the word became flesh and walked to me. And I watched my pastor, he wasn't my pastor at the time, but I watched him preach, and it was if he would gamble his soul on what he was preaching. Other churches weren't that way, it was like they read it out of a handbook. Right.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:55

You felt that conviction behind it. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:58

It was it was real. Yeah. Um he wasn't doing it for money. Ain't no one in that church had money.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:04

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:04

Ain't nobody had money, especially you know, at that time, and and he was doing it because he loved souls. Yeah, he wanted to make heaven crowded.

SPEAKER_05 1:17:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:14

And I won't forget it, there was communion, and everybody went up, and it's just me in the back with all the kids, and I'm fighting, I'm cussing in my mind, yeah, yelling at everything in my mind, and I'm mugging people and I'm angry.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:28

Are you at the same time aware that I knew what was going on feeling the Lord?

SPEAKER_01 1:17:33

Yeah, I knew what was going on, and I was fighting it. And uh, you know, the cartoons had the devil and the angel. Yeah. And I felt I felt that. And uh I rem I'm right before he's already gone through the steps, he's already prayed, and he's gonna bow to take the cup of communion. And I'm the last one, and I walk up and I grab the cup. My wife's looking at me like, and so is Katie looking, like, what are you doing? Like, that's not that's not wine, John. What are you doing? That's not alcohol. And so I walk back. I don't even stay with everybody, I walk back and I took communion that day. And I meant it. It wasn't that uh see that's one thing I could say is I'm not a I'm not someone that could be convinced by somebody. I've I'm very strong-willed.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:21

God made you that way.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:22

Yeah. If I don't want to do it, you can beat me till I can't breathe. I'm not gonna do it. If I wanna do it, you can't stop me, I'm gonna do it, you know? Yeah. And no one could make me take communion. And it was something that I had to do. And I and I won't ever forget that.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:41

John, I I want to pause here and ask you something because that wrestle that you just described, feeling the Lord and fighting with yourself, that that place of pride, I I call it pride. Yeah. I I um I know that in the moment we're not trying to be prideful. I've sat in that very position so many times trying to find my way back, you know, and and I know backsliders out there, and anyone that comes to church who has an inkling about God, they feel that, and there is such a wrestle between giving in to what you feel, because you know the dam is gonna break, um, and or just staying in your anger and and resisting the move of God that's there. How what was it in you that made you reach for the cup that allowed you to get past that area of pride within yourself to be able to go reach for the cup and and then actually mean it? I did everything, nothing worked. So you were really something had shifted for you to where you would say, I'm gonna give this a shot.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:09

Yeah. I was tired. Everything that I did, nothing worked. Um it was kind of like a make it or break it deal.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:17

Like So you made a decision.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:19

Yeah. I had to. Like I said, is is Did you know in that moment you made the decision? Well, so I told my wife. I said, This is our church now. She just kind of looked at me and said, I took communion. I know what communion was in the Bible. Like I said, I it wasn't like I just I just I didn't just know about Jonah and Noah. Right. It was my mom read me scripture. Yeah. And my mom would say that, you know, sometimes I was the the little guy under the table would answer some questions when she would ask. I was the guy listening. I'm a very good listener, especially when it I'm our that's why I like podcasts. I listen. I'm more of a listening guy. Um so I took communion. I told my wife, I said, This is our church, because I took communion. I didn't do that just because everyone was doing it. I I don't fall under peer pressure. I care less. Especially then. I was like, I don't care. I'm if I don't want to do it, I'm not doing it. And I took that, and I remember the first step with the the heaviness. It was the enemy. It was the enemy just holding you down, holding you back. Like sit down, just sit down, sit down.

SPEAKER_05 1:21:24

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:25

And I remember the first step, and you feel it fall.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:29

An act of your will.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:30

Yeah. Well, that's the biggest thing is yeah, we want to only say, Oh, I must decrease so you can increase. But that is real.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:38

Oh, yes, it is.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:40

Our pride must decrease.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:42

Yeah. And it's slippery. Pride is uh it shows up in places that we don't even recognize as being pride, and it is, and it's self-preservation a lot of times, you know, the fear of the vulnerability, I think.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:02

Oh, yeah, and it's not being in control.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:04

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:05

It's losing that control. It's like, you know, some people they always drive, they never they're never passenger. Right. It's because they want control. Um and that's the same thing with pride. We have control. Yeah, there's a God, you know, we understand that he's all powerful, but he gave us free will. He could by the vapor of his breath, everything came into existence, every um life form, everything. But free will can stop him. Yeah. He chose that for us. He gave us free will.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:37

That's the only way love can exist.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:38

Yeah, that's the only way. And so by us having free will, that's pride. Yeah. I mean, that's it's um we all have it. Um, but I remember that deciding, and I remember kind of just taking off a little quick and pastor coming out, hey nice to meet you, bro. And I told him, it was good preaching, good job, you know. Uh and then we went back that night. So it was at the Lindsay campus Sunday morning, and Sunday night was at the Straffmore campus. And that's when I watched Michael and Katie be baptized. And uh to see that man I'll probably cry now. To see my brother Mike, I knew who he was in his life. The hurt, the hurt that he's experienced, I'll never experience. I've never no one, you know, I tell young people, no one knows how you are, because there's only one you. Right. It doesn't matter. Someone say, well, I understand no one understands what we go through. And to see that man to see him live for God. That was a big I tell the young people all the time that if it wasn't for Katie and Michael, yeah, but my pastor, my patrick teaches me, and he began to show me who Jesus is, but it wasn't for excuse me, if it wasn't for Michael and Katie Fairchild, I want to be married. I'd probably be strung out, maybe dead. But it was them deciding, you know, um someone's always watching us. Yeah. They're trying to see if it's real. Right. And I was watching them. And so we started coming to church. And then um men's conference was coming up in March. It was 2018, and I was just got a job. I actually didn't have a job. I was doing like side masonry work. I got a job working for another pool company, and um, and that's just something that God does. You give your life to God and He starts to put everything out, you know. He sure does. Um I didn't have a job when I was living for myself and I started living for God. He gave me a job. And then uh oh, I forgot to mention my wife's expecting twin girls at this time. So I have twin girls that they'll be uh they'll be eight next month. Oh my goodness. And then my son will be twelve the following month. So I got February, March, and April all all birthdays. Uh but so I'm trying every I'm trying to come up with every excuse not to go to men's conference. My wife, God bless her soul.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:15

So wait, so when was this that you guys came to church and then when how far it was in January? And then when was men's conference? In March. Okay. So between your first coming that Sunday night, you started going regularly. Yeah, we'd like and you were just still very cautious.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:31

Yeah, we'd go Sunday mornings. Um we weren't really attending Sunday nights. I had in my mind, I've already gone to church, you know.

SPEAKER_08 1:25:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:40

I actually tried convincing Katie one time to stay and hang out with us because I was barbecuing and I had a bunch of beer, and I it was on Super Bowl. I'm not a football guy, I've never been in sports. But Super Bowl, you're barbecuing. Yeah, and I tried telling her, You don't we already went to church today. You don't need to go back to church. She actually ended up going to church. Um good for her. You know, I I stayed. But uh so I tried every excuse. So we're in two months, maybe not even the full two months, and uh yeah, we'd show up on Wednesdays and midweeks and kind of building a relationship with with the pastor and the church. Um and then men's conference pops up. So there's I think there was ten of us that went. And uh of course, the last night it was Friday night. So we I showed up Thursday morning. No, I showed up Friday morning because I had to wait to get the days off. I show up Friday morning with another gentleman in the church, and uh Friday night, it's crazy, so everyone's speaking in tongues, you know, apostolic atmosphere. And I talked to Dennis, I'm sharing a room with Dennis, his brother-in-law Matt, who's Mike's father-in-law, and I'm sharing a room with Mike, so it's us four in this Mike, really ghetto little hotel that Matt booked, whatever. He I didn't pay for it, he paid for it, it was, you know, we're just trying to get to church. And uh it was in Merced. And uh I literally just got taught talking to him, like, yeah, that's awesome. People speaking in tongues. They said, but you gotta be some kind of like deacon, you gotta be some kind of pastor's kid, you gotta be something, you can't not me. That ain't for me. I couldn't, I could never receive that. And so we get to the church, and right before church service starts, Dennis and I jump my little Kia, a little hatchback, and we go down the road to have a couple cigarettes before service. So we're blowing smoke, trying to get our couple of cigarettes in before service, and I walk in and they sit, they there's only one seat open, and it's right next to my pastor. Are you kidding me? Like, I'm the newest guy, I don't know who this guy is. I smell like an ashtray. Uh I didn't have cologne, so I'm putting Febreze on me, and I smell like an ashtray and Febreze. And so I'm sitting next to him, and but I just I remember feeling loved. I remember feeling the kindness and Church is going on and comes to the altar call and they ask all the pastors that go on the platform. They want to pray for all the pastors. And they ask everyone to go down there. Well, me and um one other gentleman from the church were the ones who went down there, and I just told God, I said, God, they don't need you. They're men of God. So they're they're living for you. They I'm not gonna pray for them. Maybe a little selfish. I'm like, I'm not praying for them today. I said, But a God, I need you. I said, I'm tired of my life. I'm tired of the father I was uh tired of the husband. I was tired of the John I was. I was sick and tired of me. So I I prayed and I said, God, if you can't change me, I want you to kill me right now. I said, now change me or kill me. Because I was done.

SPEAKER_06 1:28:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:57

And the only thing I can explain it was I know for a fact. My body might have stayed here, but I know for a fact that he picked me up. The only way I've been able to explain it is like, you know, I'm an uncle, so you kind of grab little kids like this, they grab onto your wrist and you kind of pick him up, whatever. And that's the only way I could explain it. It was, it was I was moving, but I was moveless. Yeah. It was like if I was staying still and I was lifted, and I felt that he was kissing my forehead, like welcome home.

SPEAKER_06 1:29:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:34

Because he called me, he was pulling on my heart when I was young, but I chose not to. And at that moment, I was worshiping God, thanking him, because I felt him so strongly. I know that was that moment that 100% without a doubt, there's a God and his name's Jesus. Yeah. And I was speaking in tongues. There was no one near me, no one praying over me. And one of the gentlemen, pastors on the platform, one of the gentlemen said, Get over here. John's speaking in tongues. Like, pastor didn't know who I was. I was this random guy, you know. I mean, I started coming to church a little bit, but there was a shooting range. I brought a bunch of guns. He's like, Well, who is this random guy with these guns? Like, oh no, you know, and uh That was it. That was it, and and I dove in. I was like, Oh my goodness, there's nothing like this. So my pastor asked, Have you ever been baptized in Jesus' name? I said, No. So I was baptized in the the Trinity when I was younger. Um, but it wasn't even a it wasn't even it was just everyone's getting baptized, get in line. It was literally what it was. It was like a conveyor belt of non-emotion baptism, just next, next, you know. Um so that that was March 16th, 2018. I'll never forget that. And it's my pastor's son's birthday, so I'll never forget that either. So my Holy Ghost birthday is his actual natural birthday. And March 17th is St. Patrick's Day. Well, I come from an Irish family, Irish culture. And St. Patrick's Day is like Thanksgiving. Right. My mom cooks all day. And I was the first St. Patrick's Day, probably once since I was twelve. I was sober.

SPEAKER_06 1:31:14

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:15

And that was the biggest decision. Probably one of the biggest decisions I made was I knew I already knew when no one had to tell me. I already knew that for me to keep this experience with God, I couldn't trade it for alcohol again. So I didn't, I didn't drink. We went. One of the hardest things I ever did, seeing everyone drink, and I didn't drink. But that Sunday night, I was baptized in Jesus' name. Um Tim, who's Katie's brother, Michael's brother-in-law, he was baptized that night. His wife, Melissa, was baptized that night, and my wife was baptized that night. My pastor will joke and say that he baptized three at once because my wife, so she gets baptized Sunday. We had she has the twins Tuesday. She's huge, you know. Wow. She got two two two babies in there, and uh pastor he told me because I'll only baptize her if you help her in the baptistry. You know, you gotta kinda walk in. But that was the beginning. Wow. That was the beginning of a of a start. I mean, I'll never forget it. Yeah. And I try to explain to people you could n you should never forget who you were.

SPEAKER_05 1:32:24

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:32:25

Testimonies, right? I mean, it's it's it's our eyewitness account of how Jesus moves. And I try my best every day to remember who I was and just give God glory for it. Because yeah, there's different testimonies. There's people who have had broken homes and they've been in prison. And we've all been in prison in one way or another. Right, right. If it's we put ourselves in a prison. Right. So we need to remember that there is a chain breaker. Right. There is a he he he set he sets the captives free. Right. Truly. Yeah. I mean So I just talked about how my friend Nick got the Holy Ghost yesterday.

SPEAKER_06 1:33:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:11

So I asked him, I said, is there any booze like this? He said, no. Is there any drug like this? He said no. Is it any relationship? He says, No. He goes, there's an he can't he couldn't explain it with his mouth what he felt. Right. And that's that's the Holy Ghost. It's the Lord, yeah. It's it's we can't come up with the words to describe how an unperfect human can receive a perfect God.

SPEAKER_05 1:33:39

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:40

You know, it would that was that moment the veil was torn. And that's what I love. I love to read that passage is when the veil was torn because only, you know, you can only go into the holies of holies once a year and you had to be the priest, you had to go through all these steps. Well, when he said it was finished, that veil was torn from the top to the bottom. And now us who are we have access. We have access to that. The perfect God that was hidden behind a veil is now a veiled to us and can live inside this temple that was tainted. But once we repented of our sins, he was able to come in. And that's what's so beautiful. It's it's it blows my mind that we don't deserve this.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:25

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:26

I don't deserve it.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:28

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:28

Yet he paid it all.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:30

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:31

And I know if it was just me on this earth, he would have gone to the cross again and again and again and again. And I just love Jesus. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:34:40

And I don't think we don't, I've said this many times, I never understood the cross. I think because I never really understood love. You know, I loved my child, but my child was never in a place of jeopardy where I mean I knew he was always safe and everything, you know. But when you when you really lose something and you know you would stand in front of a train or take a bullet because of love, only then I think you could really understand what Jesus did on the cross, you know, for us to be okay. Um what do you know about yourself now? What have you learned about yourself that you didn't know about yourself growing up? Because I hear a lot of things in your personality that you probably weren't acquainted with within yourself as a kid. So, what have you discovered about the gifts and talents and the way God formed you and your personality and in the way you think and in the things you observe? What do you know now?

SPEAKER_01 1:35:53

Well, I know we can do nothing without him, and I am a walking testimony of that. So I told you when we came into church, I could barely read. I could literally barely read. And I wanted to know God. I got the Holy Ghost, I didn't know God. I wanted to know God. And so I bought a Bible and I set an alarm from nine to ten every night, every single night, I would read for an hour. Sometimes I'd read past it, sometimes I'd fall asleep with it, but there were words that I couldn't read, I didn't understand. So I prayed and said, God, I gotta know you. I I wanna know how to read better. And he taught me how to read. Yeah, clearly taught me how to read. And and words that I you know, you make up, you kind of just go past you know, you couldn't read it. And I learned that I can do nothing without him, that I am nothing without him.

SPEAKER_05 1:36:48

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:36:48

Um I just got my license, my contractor's license last year. I've never passed a test in my life. Just a driver's test. I've never passed a test, and that's one thing that I was really self-conscious about was testing. Yeah. It was a bad experience growing up. I never, I was always bad at it. You know, that's I would just, I would just ditch. I would escape the test. And I prayed and I said, God, if this is your will, you gotta let it. It's gotta be you. Well, I passed my test the first try for the trade, and then it came to the law, and they were speaking pig Latin. I had no idea what they were saying. I was and I prayed. I prayed in the room. I said, God, if it's your will, I'll get it. And I got it. I've only met one other person besides myself that's passed it first try both, and that's Mike. And the same thing. He got a C10 license, and it's just beautiful what God does, you know? Right.

SPEAKER_03 1:37:39

And I've learned that He's a difference maker for everything that we don't have, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:37:45

Well, everything I couldn't do before him, right? I've been able to do with him. So that's what I've learned. I've learned if I can tell anybody anything, build a relationship with Jesus. Give it to Jesus because he will give you more. Yeah. I mean, he will.

SPEAKER_03 1:38:03

It's just That's what love does.

SPEAKER_01 1:38:05

Yeah. It gives. Yeah. I mean, why not? I mean, you want to give more to your children.

SPEAKER_04 1:38:10

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:38:10

Even there's times that maybe they be disobedient. A piece of you still want to take them to the park and have them you want them to have fun. Peace them. We just went to Rollertown this past weekend, and you even if your children be disobedient one thing, or maybe they're not being the best, you know, at that moment, you still want them to have fun. You still want them to have what they need.

SPEAKER_06 1:38:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:38:29

And but what I learned with Jesus is I just had to trust him. I think that's the biggest thing is because you couldn't trust nobody. Right. Um but I I trust Jesus. And what I've learned from a child to now is I can do nothing without him. Because I tried it. I tried to fix things. I couldn't fix nothing. And I made everything worse, you know? And uh until that moment that I let Jesus take the wheel, I let Jesus fly the fly the airplane, and I'm just sitting co-pilot. I think that's the biggest problem is we it comes down to the pride thing. We don't want to lose control. Because if we lose control, um there's fear there. There's fear.

SPEAKER_03 1:39:26

Yeah. But that's really the only place trust is established. Yeah. Is you have to get to that cliff to be willing, you know, to let God catch you. And then once you do that the first time, it's so much easier to trust him after that because he proves that he's trustworthy. He's going to catch you, he's gonna step in. Yeah. So at what point did you do you feel like the night you got the Holy Ghost and got baptized, do you feel like your heart then began to heal, or do you feel like there was a process of understanding and realization of the pain that you had endured that you began to let go of? Or do you feel like it was just instant the past was gone, you never looked back, the pain you had with your daughter?

SPEAKER_01 1:40:19

There was something I'm still um with my daughter, I'm still going through it. Yeah. There's uh so what happened was there came a time I'm living for God, I'm doing my best, and it felt like I was at a certain plateau with God. Like there was something, there's a wall, there was something stopping me. And we were at a prayer meeting at the Lindsay campus at this time, and God laid it on my heart, I need to forgive my daughter's mother. I need to pray for her. I need to pray for her husband. Her husband was at our wedding, shook my hand and said, Congratulations. So I needed to let that all go. So I did. And I'll never forget that. It was again less of me. Because I don't want to do that. I you know, when we get angry, we sometimes we we feel like we deserve to be angry, we deserve to hate somebody because what they've done. Um but the Bible's clear if we don't forgive, we we won't be forgiven. Right. And I won't forget once I did I prayed for her, called her her name and her husband's name, and prayed for their children. They have children, and I I asked the Lord to bless them, keep them, let their marriage be successful, let their their children know that they're loved. I mean, I prayed for them, God touched them, and that was something that that moved. It broke that wall. Yeah, it literally broke that wall, and because it was like God was trying to let me know is the more you hang on to things, I can't work on it. Right, right. You got to let go because he's a gentleman, Jesus is a gentleman, right? He's not just gonna kick in the door of your heart, but he says, I'm at the door knocking. He that lets me in, I will sup with you, I will have relationship with you, but you have to allow me to come in. And you know, we say that he's Lord, but Lord is referring that he's Lord of all, right, and not just Lord of Sundays and midweeks, but he's Lord of what we don't want him to have.

SPEAKER_05 1:42:32

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:42:32

What we have to give him. And that was something um I still suffered. Not suffered. I so I still smoke cigarettes after baptism. And it was funny, we were at uh our pastor's house, and my wife's bragging on me. Oh, he quit smoking. I did not quit smoking. And my pastor's wife, my my wife speaking, and I'm not even looking, I'm next to Pastor, I'm like looking down, like, oh, I don't even want to look at this guy. Like, he knows something. He's a man of God, he knows. And I never asked God to remove it from me. Because I knew that he would. I knew he would. Yeah, especially after being filled with the Holy Ghost. I'm like, if I ask him, he's gonna do it.

SPEAKER_05 1:43:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:43:13

And I won't forget, we were at another prayer meeting. I said, okay, God, I'm I'm done. I'm ready. And I asked, I said, God, uh, I want it to make me sick. If I smoke, I want it to make me sick. And um I worked for a different company at the time, and in my work van there was a pack of cigarettes that I was driving to a job site, and I was like, I'm gonna try it. And I never inhaled the first drag. I lit up the cigarette and blew it out. And the very first drag that I inhaled, I gagged.

SPEAKER_06 1:43:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:43:40

And so I threw the cigarette out, I threw the pack out, and I haven't smoked since.

SPEAKER_06 1:43:43

Yeah, well, praise God.

SPEAKER_01 1:43:45

Yeah, praise God. It's it was once I gave it to him.

SPEAKER_03 1:43:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:43:49

Now I know some people they struggle with it. They struggle with the addiction.

SPEAKER_03 1:43:53

That goes back though to what you said, the willingness, you know, because God isn't gonna force us. He's gonna ask us, he'll give us choices, but he he wants us to release it, you know, for him. Yeah. But he gives so much back in return.

SPEAKER_01 1:44:10

And of course it was hard. Like at that moment, I was like, wow, but I bought a bag of sunflower seeds every day for a long time to try to help with the other. And it wasn't necessarily the urges of the nicotine. It's the busyness. It's the busyness. Yeah. The the they say that, you know, of flicking the cigarette is a huge part of the addiction. And I've I used to find myself with pens doing this, you know, flicking like it was a cigarette. Yeah. Um, but God, it's like this when it comes to addiction, God will take it from you. But you have to fight to keep it away. Right. You have to fight to keep it away. Any kind of temptation is if you're delivered from anything, um, I mean, even anxiety. God showed me this. There was a young man that um that I was speaking to and suffered from anxiety. And that's all he always told me. He always told me he was anxiety, he has anxiety, and God told me he doesn't have anxiety, he has anxious thoughts. And when the thought comes and he continues to think on it, yeah. That's why he says we're supposed to take every thought into captivity. And so I told him, I said, you don't have anxiety, you have anxious thoughts, but you dwell on it. And since you dwell on it, you take on what you think. Right. Who you know what what you think you are, you're gonna you're gonna be that and so instead of pushing it away, yeah, it's gonna come. Anger comes. Now there's sometimes I can smell a cigarette and it grosses me out. There's sometimes I smell a cigarette, I'm like, smells pretty good. Right. A piece of your flesh, right? He delivered me from it. But now it's my turn to do the work.

SPEAKER_05 1:45:55

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:45:56

You know, it's my turn to stay, okay, God, you delivered this from you delivered me from this, or you healed me from this. And now it's my turn to do which you've given me the power. You know, Acts 1 and 8, you shall receive power. Right? After that, the Holy Ghost comes upon you. Well, with power comes responsibility. Right. You have to be responsible. And we as believers, we have to fight that good fight.

SPEAKER_06 1:46:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:46:21

The fight, the good fight of faith. And um, of course, there's gonna come times that hurt comes. Like with my daughter. It's something I'm I've been struggling with since she's been took in. Yeah. Um went to court, or we went to mediation, I didn't get nothing, hardly what I what what I was hoping for. Um and she doesn't really want nothing to do with me. And it's it's hard.

SPEAKER_06 1:46:50

She will one day, John.

SPEAKER_01 1:46:52

Well, I was praying, we were at a prayer, we're at church one night, and um God told us ask me like it's gonna be done. And I was in the corner sitting between these chairs, and I was on the ground, I was weeping and praying. I said, But how, God, it's not happening. This is the same thing I've been asking you for a while, it's not happening. And he told me, He said, Do my work and I'll see to it be done. I'll take care of it. Do what I've asked you to do, and I'll take care of it. Yeah, and I've prayed that, and I've prayed that, I've prayed that, I've prayed that, and so that's all I'm doing is I'm gonna be busy about the master's business and let him deal, let him take care of it.

SPEAKER_05 1:47:37

He will. Yeah. He will.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:39

He's the only one who can. Right. He's the only one who can.

SPEAKER_05 1:47:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:42

Um, you know, we can't save nobody, we can't change nobody. God told me one time I was really concerned about an individual in my life, and some circumstances came up and I was confused. And God told me, He said, You're no one's savior, and you're no one's judge. He said, Love my people, do my work, and I'll take care of it. Yeah. And that was a relief.

SPEAKER_03 1:48:06

It is a relief, yeah. Yeah. It's a revelation. And it helps you helps anyone stay in their lane and keep their boundaries when you know you're not the savior. Yeah. But God's just done a lot for me.

SPEAKER_01 1:48:20

Yeah. And you know, if um when it comes to passing things or things that I couldn't do, you know, I I I believe it's three years ago now, I became a licensed minister three years ago. And that was something that blew my mind. Like I went through the tests, went through the curriculums, passed it, went to the bo in front of the board, and they allowed John Deaver to become a minister. That blew my mind. I couldn't stop crying all day. It was we went to Elk Grove and my wife I knew she was like, oh, you know, but she was probably thinking, All right, dude, you can stop, you know. I'd never accomplished anything in my life. I was never good enough to accomplish anything. But once I gave it to God, something that I saw literally as impossible, God had made possible. Right. And that's what really got to me is I never did anything. I never had a piece of paper or certificate. I didn't even have a diploma that I did. Right. I had nothing to sit there and say, okay, I I did it. And the United Pentecostal Church International gives me a certificate saying I'm a licensed minister to spread the gospel of Jesus Christ. That's insane to me. But that's God.

SPEAKER_05 1:49:40

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:49:41

That is God. And that's what I want people to understand is you know, this is the redeemed backslider. Well, if you feel like you're so far away from God, what I love about Jesus is we could be millions of miles away, but it's one step back to him and he's there.

SPEAKER_05 1:49:57

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 1:49:58

I love about the the process. Son, the father was waiting. Right. He had the fatted calf ready to go. I mean, he already had the robe clean, he had the shoes, he had the rings, he was ready to go to give it to his son. But the son had to make the decision to come back.

SPEAKER_06 1:50:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:50:13

And that's what I love about our God is all we have to do is say, okay, Jesus.

SPEAKER_06 1:50:18

One step.

SPEAKER_01 1:50:19

One step. Yeah. One step at a time. That's what I love about, you know, you read about how Peter walked on the water and he fell. Mm-hmm. Right? Well, the scripture says they walk back together. So once again he walked on the water.

SPEAKER_05 1:50:34

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:50:36

He just walked with Jesus.

SPEAKER_05 1:50:37

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:50:38

So all we have to do is continually walking with Jesus, and we're not going to sink. Is there storms? Absolutely. There's storms in our lives.

SPEAKER_05 1:50:46

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:50:47

But he's the one that tells the wind and the rain, peace be still.

SPEAKER_05 1:50:50

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:50:51

Not only to the wind and the rain, but to us. I love that. When I first read that passage, was he said, Peace be still. The rain stopped. But the storms in their own minds was calmed.

SPEAKER_05 1:51:06

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:51:07

Because they watch, I mean, they said, What what kind of man is this that tells the wind and the rain? And they obey. They obey his commandments. He's God.

SPEAKER_05 1:51:17

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:51:17

And what that did to the inside, what that did to the storm on, you know, on the inside of their own mind. And that's what God's revealed to me is Yeah, there's times I've had to cry out to him and I don't hear them. I don't feel them sometimes. There's been times in my life that I'm going through it, and you know, um the teacher's always quiet during the test. Can't give you, can't give you the answers, or it's cheating. We gotta be able to get through the test on our own. Right. And um there's been times I've cried out to him, but it was a test time. Yeah. And I just need to remember that he is our strength, he is our fortress, he is a strong tower. The name of the Lord is a strong tower. Yeah. And we run to it.

SPEAKER_03 1:52:00

I want to interject really quick for anyone watching. Um, God does not bring temptation. And when John said test, what he's talking about um is a test of faith. Yes. You know, and and he's and God isn't up there just saying, Oh, I'm just gonna see if you're gonna pass. That is not who he is. What he's doing is he's strengthening us in those moments when we do walk through a test of faith. It isn't because he doesn't know we're gonna get to the other side, it's for us to know that we're gonna get to the other side. And because when we do come through it, um, our faith is increased, but our ability to trust him grows. And so we can walk through so much more because we were willing to risk that. Yeah, and God has to let us stand on our own two feet and walk through those places so that we can know without a shadow of a doubt that He's got everything under control. And the reason I wanted to explain that is because I have heard countless times from people, if I come back to church, the minute I start coming back to church, all hell breaks loose in my life. The minute that I go down to the altar and pray, everything starts blowing up. And so they're afraid that if they take a step towards God and if they try to live for God, that their life is gonna fall apart as they know it. Well, that's not God. No, it's not, he's not totally disrupting your life. When those things happen, it's because he wants you to turn to him in it. Yeah. He wants you to ask him for help. He wants you to know that no matter what comes, he's gonna be there with you. And for some people, a ton comes at once, and for other people, it's just a really smooth step. And I think a lot of that depends on the relationship you've had or have or are going to have with the Lord. So God doesn't test us um in the way that a lot of people think.

SPEAKER_01 1:54:24

So God doesn't tempt no one and he's not to be tempted. Right. And James tells us that he doesn't tempt us.

SPEAKER_03 1:54:29

Right. The enemy's the tempter. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:54:31

Yeah. Um it's just some different experiences with you know, with people, but what I've seen when people come to church, their life gets a whole lot better. A whole lot better. Everything gets better, everything starts falling into place. The things that I mean, that's what happened to me. Right. Um, we're in revival. We got people coming in and out of the church. We had the crusade in in in in Portoville at Menachie High School, and people are coming from all over. Right. And these are people that are they're broken. Right. They they're backsliders, right? They're people that were hurt. They're people that um they went through things in their lives, right? But now God's fixing it. Yeah. You know, and rapidly they're redeemed. Yes, you know, yes. Um, but yeah, I don't want anyone to think that God's not gonna, oh, you come in, now I'm gonna test your faith.

SPEAKER_05 1:55:24

That's not who is He's grace. Yeah, he is He's grace.

SPEAKER_01 1:55:27

He's he's not He's not gonna allow us to be tempted more than we can see ourselves through. That's not gonna happen that way. Um, because He's love, yeah, He is grace. Um, and that's what's beautiful about Jesus is the world will test us. Yeah. Uh the enemy will test us, the enemy tests our faith every day. You know, it says the accuser of the brethren goes day day and night and tries to accuse us of our sins unto God. And God's not that way.

SPEAKER_06 1:56:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:56:00

Repent of your sins and love them.

SPEAKER_06 1:56:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:56:03

You know, and and follow the word of God and live for him as the best as you can.

SPEAKER_06 1:56:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:56:09

No one's perfect. Right. We do our best and God does the rest. Right. Right. We we make it too hard on ourselves.

SPEAKER_05 1:56:16

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:56:16

Just do what you can do every day. You know, my pastor said is we're not in competition with nobody besides yourself. Right. We gotta look at who we were yesterday and be better today.

SPEAKER_05 1:56:29

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:56:30

There have been days I've been better yesterday than I was today. Right. You know, there's been days the next day I'm like, wow, I really messed up this day. But we just move on.

SPEAKER_03 1:56:38

We endeavor.

SPEAKER_01 1:56:39

You know, it says a just man shall fall seven times, but he shall arise again.

SPEAKER_03 1:56:43

Right. John, one uh one last question, maybe one last question. When did you realize that you were falling in love with your wife? Really loving her.

SPEAKER_01 1:56:58

That was after I learned after I met love with Jesus. I met Jesus and I met love. And I'm I'm deadly in love with her now. Yeah. Uh she's my best friend. Um, you know, there was this ladies' conference this weekend, and I hated it because she was gone, you know. But um she is, she's she's my best friend, and it wasn't until I learned I met love. Love of love isn't just L-O-V-E, it's J-E-S-U-S. I met love. Yeah. I was able to see love. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:57:33

And and to uh feel it and to be able to give it.

SPEAKER_01 1:57:37

And um but that's something that I want to encourage couples is nothing works as husband and wife until you put Jesus in the mix. Young people trying to find their future husband or wife, find Jesus and let him find your wife.

SPEAKER_03 1:57:57

Because you can have a husband, you can have children, you can have a home. Doesn't mean you have love. Yeah, it's not at all the same as being in love with your person and knowing them.

SPEAKER_01 1:58:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:58:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:58:10

And that's one thing I I she's my saving grace. Yeah. She's the one who's helped me. She's the one that grounds me. You know, uh she's the one who corrects me when I need correction. I need I need my wife.

SPEAKER_03 1:58:25

But you trust her enough to allow for that.

SPEAKER_01 1:58:27

I trust her. Yeah. Um I trust her more than I trust anyone else on this planet. By far. In any circumstance. She can tell me I've been feeling this in prayer. I believe it. I never have ever I don't have to question is that God when she says I feel this. I know it's God. And uh we're a partner, we're a partnership. Yeah. And um without her, I'm nothing. Yeah. You know, I always mess around and and I always comment how beautiful she is. She is beautiful, she is gorgeous.

SPEAKER_03 1:59:07

Yeah, she is she's she's a fire, she's a fire for the Lord.

SPEAKER_01 1:59:12

And she's not only beautiful because I love her looks, but I've seen God move in her life. I've seen God do it. I had a buddy who passed away and he told me the only reason why I believe in Jesus is because I saw him change you. Well, if I ever feel like I'm lacking in faith, I can look to my wife and see that God's changed her. And that's evidence. I know God's changed me. But when you see God change someone, you know who they were, you know how broken they were. And that's I think that's I probably love her the most the reason why I love her the most is she loves Jesus more than she loves me.

SPEAKER_05 2:00:01

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:00:02

And that's that's that's what I love is she's a Christian. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:00:10

There's safety in that. You know.

SPEAKER_01 2:00:13

Yeah. I don't have to worry. I don't have to worry about nothing. I trust her. You know, in the world and they've gone for an hour, what are you doing? Hey, what's going on? We had a horror relationship, so you know, we we always thought that something was going on.

SPEAKER_05 2:00:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:00:27

And that seeing God move in her and what God's done with her and her own ministry. Of course, we have a ministry together as husband and wife, but she has her own calling. Like God's calling her to things, and just to see what God does in her life. And um she can pray anyone through the Holy Ghost. I mean, I've seen her, people, I mean, I've been praying for people, and I'm like, Where's my wife? I've I've done that. I've been praying with people and I've and I've looked around. I said, Where's Tommy? Where's my wife? Yeah. Why, why? I they need the Holy Ghost.

SPEAKER_03 2:01:02

Yeah, and I feel like that's such a gift. You know, being at um um ladies' retreat with with you with the girls from um the church, I was blown away at man, the confidence, the faith, the boldness, um every single one of them. Every single one of them, everyone actually I've ever met from your guys' church, they're the real deal. They're just the real deal. And I I'm not wired that way. I we were I went to the um what's it called that you guys did in Porterville? The Crusade. The Crusade. Yeah. And um I was praying with somebody and I saw Ashley, and I did the same thing. Come here, come here, Ashley. Uh, because I'm I'm just I do it different. Yeah, you know, and that's not my talent. I pray with people. I will always pray with people most of the time. It's from a distance. Sometimes I'll pray with them in person. But man, Ashley just looked at me and said, You have the same Jesus I have. Yeah, you can do it just like me. But I do think that Tommy and Ashley and others are differently gifted to encourage and to speak faith and to help people along in that altar working environment. And um, I love it. Uh and we need people like that, you know.

SPEAKER_01 2:02:44

Well, and that confidence comes not from them at all. Right. You knew my wife, she was not confident in anything she did. She's blasted in tattoos, and because she was trying to put on the persona of I'm a tough person, she's not tough, she's a loving, kind woman. Right. But God gave her the confidence. Yeah. God gave her what was needed, the boldness. And it's true. I mean, um, the first time someone received the Holy Ghost during um a youth, I gave the word, the word went forth. I'm holding one of the twins, and it I literally just watched my wife pray for these young people, and it was like it jumped. I mean, I think there was 12 that one or 14 that one night that received the gift of the Holy Ghost. Wow. And it was just like we've never seen anyone do it in youth service.

SPEAKER_03 2:03:32

Yeah. I do think there is a a special anointing for those things too.

SPEAKER_01 2:03:37

Well, there's special gift. We understand there's gifts of the spirit. Right. But not every gift is for every moment. Right, right, right. And and I know I've watched her pray for people, and it has nothing to do with her. No, it's what God it's it's how God uses her.

SPEAKER_03 2:03:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:03:53

Yes. It's how God uses her. And I don't want anyone to think, oh, they know that she has some kind of power. No, it well, she has the Holy Ghost. She has the Holy Ghost. But it's But He does anoint for things, yes. Absolutely. Yeah. A vessel. Yeah. You know what? Exactly. She's been a conduit, she's a vessel for God to to flow through. And I've seen it. I mean, if someone's at our church who doesn't have the Holy Ghost, they go to the altar, they get the Holy Ghost. You know, it's it's of course them surrendering, right? But it's someone having to walk them through.

SPEAKER_05 2:04:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:04:26

It's someone having to just to tell them a little more. Because I think I one reason, I mean, I I can't tell you for a hundred percent fact, but I feel like there's a reason why God uses my wife so much is she knew nothing.

SPEAKER_05 2:04:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:04:39

It's all God.

SPEAKER_05 2:04:40

Right.

SPEAKER_01 2:04:41

And she's someone that I'm not trying to boast about my wife, but I am boasting about my wife a little bit. You know, boast about your wife. Uh it's someone that God knows she's not going to take the credit for because she was in the shadows. She didn't want no one to see her. Right. So this day, if I mention her, like she's probably blushing when she watches it, she'll probably be blushing. Like, oh my gosh, stop talking about me. But God uses her to help others who are in that same situation. And it's beautiful, and and and I love to watch God.

SPEAKER_02 2:05:13

Yeah. It's just so pure. It is.

SPEAKER_01 2:05:15

She has a pure heart.

SPEAKER_02 2:05:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:05:16

You know, even uh, of course, she's a mother and she's a wife, and there's times of frustration and stuff. Like we all, but she has beautiful heart.

SPEAKER_03 2:05:25

Yeah. I think it's that um it's just the pureness towards God, you know. It's it's it's just love. Yeah. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 2:05:39

I think that's the best way to explain it, is she knew not love until she met Jesus. Same thing with me. And now since she knows love, she wants everyone to feel loved.

SPEAKER_05 2:05:49

Yeah, you do, you she loves everybody.

SPEAKER_01 2:05:51

Yeah, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. We can hear a story about like someone could have been the worst person in the world. She meets some, she loves on them. She wants to pray for 'em. Come do our Bible study, come do this, come do that. She she loves. Yeah. She is a loving, kind person. Yeah. I think that's why I love her too, is the most. Yeah, I've I there's all kinds of things why I love her, but she's beautiful on the inside. Yeah. That's what I love about, you know, God works on the inside out. Yeah. And He's worked on her inside. And I've seen it. And um yeah, I'm deadly in love with her. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:06:32

You know, and she's it's the thing that everybody seeks, you know, but really I I agree with you can only come through the Lord. Yeah. Okay, so um wrapping up, you guys have youth service on Thursday nights. Is that in Lindsay or that's um Plainview. Plainview.

SPEAKER_01 2:06:55

So um we've have switched back and forth from Plainview campus to Shrathmore, but it's mostly in the Plainview campus.

SPEAKER_03 2:07:01

Okay. Yeah. And if anyone has kiddos in the Porterville, Exeter, uh Lindsay, Strathmore, um, is there is the Harvest Center, that's the name of the church, the Harvest Center, um, is there a phone number that someone answers regularly?

SPEAKER_01 2:07:17

Um or I I'm not too sure. I think on our Facebook page or there is a number on there. Um but probably Facebook or um probably f probably Facebook's probably the best way to reach out to us.

SPEAKER_03 2:07:28

Uh I'm sure if you you know we don't dial 411 anymore. But yeah, they are the Harvest Center is on social media, Facebook, Instagram.

SPEAKER_01 2:07:39

Um and the awakened youth, that's what our youth group is called. The awakened youth. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 2:07:46

Okay. And John Deaver. So Thursday night is their youth and um Thursday night, six p.m. And man, there's six thirty. No better thing you could do than to take your kids to church, even if they resist. Because man, when you encounter the presence of the Lord, there's nothing like it.

SPEAKER_01 2:08:04

Yeah, it's true. Yeah. And you know, I I will ask your viewers if they could be praying for it because I'm actually um this Thursday I'm going to go to the high school in Strathmore. Oh, wonderful. Meet with their athletic group and minister to them. And it's on Thursday, so I'm gonna try to get them to come to come to youth that same night because it's Strathmore and Plainview is just down the road. Oh, okay. It's their right they're right next to their neighboring cities. So uh be praying for that. That someone touches a young man's heart and and a young woman's heart and they'll show up to youth.

SPEAKER_03 2:08:36

I I am, you know, of course, I go to um a different church that I love, but oh my gosh, if I didn't have our church, I would be at your church.

SPEAKER_01 2:08:47

Yeah, you know, your pastor is the second Pentecostal preacher to pray for me. Yeah. And he's the real deal. Oh, yeah, I love him.

SPEAKER_03 2:08:57

Brother and Sister Treadway, they're the real deal. And I say that because, you know, you just know it when you meet people. And um, someone said the other day, actually today, I got a Facebook message. They said, not everyone that's a pastor is called to be a pastor. But when you meet a pastor that is called to be a pastor, their mark is love.

SPEAKER_07 2:09:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:09:24

And you, you know, I think I've only ever shook Brother Treadway's hand once or twice, twice, maybe at landmark and at your guys' uh crusade. Yeah. But you know, I've seen him, I've been around him, and and Sister Treadway, and and the fruit. It's true. The fruit that they're bearing in their church with all of you wonderful people I've met, it's undeniable. And, you know, again, it's not about people, but it's about find a church that you feel loved in because that is what the world needs the most. That is when you absolutely know, I'm so grateful for my pastor because I needed the gentleness, because it was hard to come back. It was hard to be vulnerable, it was hard to swallow my pride, and I needed the gentleness and the grace that allowed me to find my way. Because God was doing the work, God will do the work in people. But having a pastor that loves you enough and loves the Lord enough to let God do the work is huge.

SPEAKER_01 2:10:45

Well, he even tells us he'll give us pastors after his own heart. Yeah. And I know for a fact that pastor um First Lady King, absolutely. That's they were the people when we first came in, let's say if Pastor was out of town or something, he would come preach for us. And if I remember the first time I was like, Who's this guy? This ain't my pastor, what's going on? I heard him preach, I was like, This guy loves us well, just like our pastor. He does. Uh but you know, speaking of the pastors, is I won't forget, we were actually going through a funk. We're in maybe a year, and I wanted to leave the church because everybody had friends. Everyone, not friends, everyone had a family. I had the only one who didn't have family. It had nothing to do with the church. You were just kind of embarrassed by it. Yeah. And um I was going through a funk, and our pastor and his family was off at Disneyland, and God woke up my pastor's wife, Candace, in the morning, four o'clock, five o'clock, and said, Pray for John and Tommy. She didn't have she's on vacation. Yeah. With her family. No one's waking up at five o'clock to be at Disneyland, right? And she woke up and travailed for us. I won't forget that because that just went and showed us. They're after excuse me. They're loving the way God loves. Yeah. And that's who a pastor and a pastor by supposed to be is and and they're the perfect example of that. I uh highly respect my pastor and his wife and their their whole family.

SPEAKER_03 2:12:18

Um it's easy to follow someone that you know loves you. Absolutely. You know, you try you trust that you don't have to worry about submission issues because you trust their love for you.

SPEAKER_01 2:12:30

And they've it's been proven time and time again that you can. Yeah. That God's opened the doors, and I don't know how many times if it's anything, how many times I've been they've helped me in anything. Um actually he was the one who invested in for me to get my contractor's license. Without him, I wouldn't be a contractor because I couldn't come up with the money to go through the tests and all this. And he helped me, and that's it. He's invested into my life, my wife's life, my children's lives. And we play pickleball on Mondays. I have a wonderful relationship with my pastor and his family, and but that is one thing I can say is a pastor is as strong as his spouse. And my pastor and pastor's wife, they're they're good. I love them.

SPEAKER_03 2:13:16

And yeah, and um you guys are gonna I mean you're exploding now, but I tell you, Porterville needs Jesus, and um you guys are just ripe for the harvest.

SPEAKER_01 2:13:29

Yeah, we're doing Bible studies and at my house on Tuesdays, which we had five new people.

SPEAKER_02 2:13:35

That's wonderful.

SPEAKER_01 2:13:36

Seven new people. It was a it was a family, and so uh it's in Porterville, and just let God do it. Yeah, you know, the harvest is ready. Yeah, we're the laborers, right? We just have to go out and do what he wants us to do and uh yeah, and just let God do it.

SPEAKER_03 2:13:52

Yeah. So anybody that watches this, if you need to be in a Bible study, uh if you need to find a youth group, um, and you're again in the Porterville, Lindsay, Strathmore area, anywhere close, reach out to the Awakening Youth on social media or the Harvest Center. Wonderful group of people, and uh you will be blessed. So, John, thank you. It was a pleasure to meet you. It's good.

SPEAKER_01 2:14:21

I got some things off my chest I don't think I've ever talked about. So thank you. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_03 2:14:25

Yeah, I I'm excited. I I love just sitting back and watching what God is doing in the lives of people and what he's gonna continue to do. I am excited for you and your family. I'm just God is good. God's good. Yeah, he really is. Yeah, so thank you for being here. I really appreciate it. And um thank you for watching. Uh, if you guys are in the area March 6th, 7th, and 8th, please come out to the Unshackled conference at the Pentecostal Lighthouse. It's gonna be wonderful. Yeah, and all the great people from Strathmore Church will be there too.

SPEAKER_01 2:15:01

We'll all be there.

SPEAKER_03 2:15:02

Um, but anyways, it's it should be good. And uh if you're been contemplating um giving God another chance, um I pray that you will because you won't regret it. He is gonna be way different, probably, than what you think he is, and um he won't let you down. So we'll see you again next week. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 2:15:25

We are so glad you joined us. If you have a story of redemption or have worn the label of a backslider, we would love to hear from you. If you'd like to support our ministry, your donation will be tax deductible. Visit our website at Kathychastain.com. We hope you will tune in for our next episode.