MICNP Podcast S2 E3: Boosting Vaccine Confidence: Strategies for Healthcare Providers

In this episode, we explore effective vaccine education strategies, the importance of healthcare provider confidence, and advocacy for health policy change, featuring insights from Gianna Eagle. 

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Key  topics:
Vaccine education programs (COVER)
Effective vaccine counseling techniques
The role of confidence in healthcare delivery
Addressing vaccine hesitancy and myths
Advocacy for nurse practitioner recognition and policy change

Takeaways: Healthcare providers' confidence can increase immunization rates.
The COVER program offers free, CDC-based vaccine education modules. Using a four-step process helps dispel vaccine myths effectively. Building trust and addressing concerns is key to vaccine acceptance. Nurse practitioners play a vital role in health policy advocacy.

Chapters
00:00 Introduction to vaccine education and provider confidence
00:36 The COVER program and its impact on provider knowledge
01:31 The importance of healthcare provider confidence in vaccine recommendations
02:36 Techniques for effective vaccine counseling and dispelling myths
04:33 The role of trust and communication in vaccine acceptance
05:14 Advocacy for nurse practitioner recognition and policy change
07:38 Real-world patient interaction and vaccine counseling success stories
10:20 The impact of HPV vaccination on cancer prevention
11:42 The future of nurse practitioner advocacy and policy change
13:04 Closing remarks and upcoming episodes

Resources:
COVER Vaccine Education Program - https://pids.org/education-training/vaccine-education-program/
CDC Pink Book - https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/index.html

Theme music

• Keyboard, Bass: Clementine Kanfom 
• Guitar: Tyler McDonald 
• Drums: Andrew Padfield 
• Mixed, Mastered: Andrew Padfield 

Michigan Council of Nurse Practitioners (MICNP): Website

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Transcript

Rachel Hetzner (01:36)
Welcome to the MICNP Podcast, where we have Gianna Eagle, a registered nurse and Wayne State University DMP FNP student joining us again today. We're excited to have you and hear more about your DMP project, Gianna. Hello, my name is Rachel Hetzner, President-elect for Michigan Council of Nurse Practitioners and co-host of the MyCamp Podcast.

Dr. Justin Hooks (01:56)
Hey everyone again. I'm Dr. Justin Hooks, Chair of the Education Committee for MICNP and the other co-host of the MICNP podcast.

Rachel Hetzner (02:03)
Welcome back to the podcast, Gianna.

Gianna Eagle (02:04)
Thanks again for having me.

Dr. Justin Hooks (02:06)
So last episode we left off on the importance of educating the public on vaccine hesitancy in a way that's patient centered and provides them with the most accurate information. How can we as advanced practice providers do that?

Gianna Eagle (02:21)
Well, I'm glad you asked. So I discovered while performing research for my project that there is a program that was developed by the Pediatric Infectious Disease Society, and it's called the Comprehensive Vaccine Education or COVER Program. It's a free resource, free to download for healthcare providers to complete vaccine education modules at their own pace. And it's based on the CDC's pink book, which has all the information on communicable diseases and their respective immunizations.

Gianna Eagle (02:45)
A randomized controlled trial published in 2020 found that it was effective and made providers more knowledgeable and confident when providing immunization education.

Rachel Hetzner (02:54)
Sounds like a pretty cool resource to have. So so the confidence and knowledge a healthcare provider has could potentially increase immunization rates.

Gianna Eagle (03:03)
It potentially could because when we as providers are more confident and knowledgeable, patients are more likely to trust our recommendations. And so my goal with this podcast series and spreading awareness about the program is that it'll make we as advanced practice nurses more likely to recommend immunizations and it would make the education more effective.

Dr. Justin Hooks (03:21)
So yeah.

Rachel Hetzner (03:21)
That's really important to know because I know that it has become kind of a contentious topic, which is wild, but some providers are avoiding those conversations just because they're trying to avoid conflict. It's not in their personality, they don't want to have these conversations. but

Rachel Hetzner (03:40)
what you're saying is that having that confidence and having those conversations in and of themselves can affect the public health really.

Gianna Eagle (03:50)
Mm.

Rachel Hetzner (03:51)
So

Dr. Justin Hooks (03:51)
Yeah, that's so true. And you know, education and training is my jam. So as advanced practice nurses,

Rachel Hetzner (03:57)
Mm-hmm.

Dr. Justin Hooks (03:58)
we're taught to inform patients in a way that is patient centered and addresses their concerns. What are some techniques to the cover program that recommends that we use when providing vaccine counseling to patients?

Gianna Eagle (04:10)
so one of the modules, actually signed up for the program and completed a lot of them just so I could see what the modules are looking like from, you know, a user perspective. And there was one module, titled vaccines and social media. Lesson four of the module was what can healthcare personnel do? it gives providers advice on how to engage in the conversation with their patients. It recommends it.

Gianna Eagle (04:33)
indicates that a strong provider recommendation produces best results and when working to dispel misinformation, they recommend using a four step process, lead with a fact, warn the patient about the myth before you state it, explain the fallacy and then end the conversation with another fact. And I found that a lot of the times in clinical even like unknowingly, I was applying a lot of the techniques described and I was using a lot of motivational interviewing too, which is also really helpful for people.

Rachel Hetzner (04:58)
Yeah, that's really insightful. Sounds like a great way to acknowledge their concerns and provide them with accurate information in a non-judgmental way.

Gianna Eagle (05:06)
Yeah, and ultimately that's how we're connecting with our patients and providing as much education as possible. For some people, regardless of the reason mistrust in healthcare prevails and it outweighs the acceptance of accurate information and leading conversation with judgment even unintentionally through body language or through the way that you explain things, it kind of shuts that conversation down and it makes them even more unwilling to hear what you have to say.

Rachel Hetzner (05:28)
And that's another reason why healthcare providers need to be a trusted source of health information, seeing as how there's so much min misinformation online now, especially with different government websites like the CDC, there there's some conflicting things out there.

Gianna Eagle (05:45)
Yeah, and that's why we as advanced practice nurses need to be advocates for our patients by properly informing them to keep them safe and healthy. And that's why another role that we have as health policy advocates is so important too, because we can and do influence the information that gets put out there for the public.

Dr. Justin Hooks (06:02)
Yeah. And you're a hundred percent right about that because like I tell everyone, you do not mess with nurses. Nurses, you do not mess with and it's kinda interesting that

Rachel Hetzner (06:09)
Ha ha ha ha

Gianna Eagle (06:09)
stuff.

Dr. Justin Hooks (06:12)
in the time that we're at, so it's July in 2026, and we've been fighting for graduate nursing education to be recognized. And the most recent

Rachel Hetzner (06:22)
Mm.

Dr. Justin Hooks (06:23)
things is Rachel can help me out here, is that

Rachel Hetzner (06:26)
Yeah. Yeah.

Dr. Justin Hooks (06:28)
we're finally there to be recognized as a as an actual degree, right?

Gianna Eagle (06:31)
Yes.

Rachel Hetzner (06:32)
Yeah, yeah. It took a lawsuit from AANP to to make it

Dr. Justin Hooks (06:36)
it works. So that's the long long part of the story that it actually works when we become advocates for our own profession and and lastly for our patients. So i it it really is amazing. And thanks to Rachel and Nyla, our legislative committee,

Rachel Hetzner (06:53)
Yeah.

Dr. Justin Hooks (06:55)
chair, like I have become an advocate myself and become

Dr. Justin Hooks (06:59)
involved in policy that I never have before because it's really important and the work that you're doing kind of shows that too.

Rachel Hetzner (07:05)
Yeah. And that's I that's always the approach that I try and take, that it doesn't have to be contentious. It shouldn't be contentious. It's just conversations amongst people. Some people might have different points of view, but have these conversations and you know, getting back to vaccines, which we're talking about right now.

Rachel Hetzner (07:23)
is, you know, people can make their own decision in terms

Gianna Eagle (07:26)
I'm

Rachel Hetzner (07:27)
of what they choose to do, but you want to present them with the facts and what we actually know from science so that they can make the most informed decision for themselves and their families.

Gianna Eagle (07:41)
So I actually wanted to share a story about a success that I had with a patient. So I saw an older

Dr. Justin Hooks (07:47)
Okay.

Gianna Eagle (07:48)
school-aged child and her mom at clinical one day for a well visit, and we were discussing the Gardasil vaccine. It wasn't an interaction that was 100 % successful, and mom still refused at the appointment.

Gianna Eagle (07:58)
but she went in fully resistant. And after I talked with her, she left feeling slightly more open to it. Her concern was that she didn't think her daughter was old enough yet to receive the vaccine and that they didn't need to worry about it right now. And I acknowledged her concerns and dispelled some myths and she ended the conversation with, well, probably not today, but I'll consider it. So the myth that I dispelled was that the Gardasil vaccine makes kids sexually active.

Gianna Eagle (08:21)
which isn't the case, explained to her that, through motivational interviewing, that the importance of HPP prevention is cervical cancer. And I emphasized that she had a desire to protect the health and safety of her daughter, and she was a lot more open to what I had to say.

Dr. Justin Hooks (08:36)
Yeah, and that's kind of amazing because literally what I learned about the HPV vaccine during my clinical time was different than what we're trained in school. And it was pretty much that. I I had a wonderful pediatrician, Dr. McPherson. She's an osteopathic physician and a trailblazer. And she is an advocate for vaccines just like that. And so when

Dr. Justin Hooks (08:59)
There was hesitancy, she described the other additional things because especially with HPV, it's stigmatizing. As you mentioned, it's gonna promote sex, it's gonna promote this, it's gonna do that, or it's only for genital warts and they're not sexually active right now. And so she made it a point, like where I learned is the head and neck aspect of it for

Gianna Eagle (09:19)
and that's...

Dr. Justin Hooks (09:20)
the cancer prevention. And now taking a step further, we're seeing by numbers.

Dr. Justin Hooks (09:25)
younger individuals or younger adults that are having rectal cancer. And that rectal cancer is starting at a very young age. And a patient that I have right now that I'm treating for HIV also has rectal cancer. They're 35 years old and they've been dealing

Dr. Justin Hooks (09:42)
with this for at least a good three years. And

Gianna Eagle (09:45)
Wow.

Dr. Justin Hooks (09:46)
kind of the interesting thing too is from the HIV standpoint,

Dr. Justin Hooks (09:50)
We actually will do rectal PAPS now with those that

Gianna Eagle (09:52)
Wow.

Dr. Justin Hooks (09:53)
people living with HIV at age 35, where you will do a colonoscopy at 45. We will do a rectal PAP at age 35. And that rectal PAP is very specific for HPV etiologies. So what you're doing is amazing work.

Rachel Hetzner (10:10)
Yeah.

Rachel Hetzner (10:11)
I actually did my DMP project on HPV prevention in college males. And this was back in 2014. so through vaccination and education and all of that. And you know, it not it it's not in males, but there there was a recent study that came out that showed that HPV vaccination.

Rachel Hetzner (10:37)
has essentially caused the rates of cervical cancer deaths to go down to essentially zero.

Gianna Eagle (10:45)
Wow.

Rachel Hetzner (10:45)
and and it's working is the thing. You know, it we have a vaccine that can prevent cancer. I mean, it's incredible. So it's something that needs to be shared and you know, give give these patients all of the information

Rachel Hetzner (11:02)
let them make their decision. But it just, I mean, knowing this from a scientific and public health perspective, it just it's a it's a no brainer, at least for us.

Gianna Eagle (11:12)
Thank

Rachel Hetzner (11:14)
So we need to try and relay that to the population.

Gianna Eagle (11:17)
Absolutely.

Dr. Justin Hooks (11:18)
Yeah. So as we're wrapping up here, Gianna, do you have kind of like a sneak peek for our listeners for our last episode that we can keep them engaged So when we release the third episode of your DNP project.

Gianna Eagle (11:32)
Yeah, so in the last episode, I'm going to touch a lot more on strategies that we as advanced practice providers can use to advocate for health policy change and really make those changes at the national level to improve health care for our patients.

Dr. Justin Hooks (11:46)
That's excellent. I've had a a wonderful time so far. This is only our second episode. I I can only imagine our third episode is gonna be even as enjoyable. So on that note, with all good things, it must come to an end. Tune in as we amplify the voice of nurse practitioners and work together to shape the future of healthcare. Subscribe now and stay tuned for expert conversations, legislative updates and the latest in NP practice in Michigan. You can't wait for our next episode. I know. I, I cannot wait either. Trust me, it's coming soon. See you next time.

Rachel Hetzner (12:22)
Bye everyone.