Two Taps and Friends

Dye & Golburgh | Why the Tate Brothers Are in Deep Legal Trouble #82

• Daniel Rosenberg • Episode 82

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Defense attorneys Michael Dye and Lloyd Golburgh join Daniel Rosenberg to break down the U.S. Marshals arrest of Andrew and Tristan Tate in Miami, the sealed UK indictment, dual Romania proceedings, extradition standards, and the legal realities of multi-victim sexual assault and trafficking cases. This episode examines the charges, patterns alleged by prosecutors, credibility challenges common in these matters, flight-risk considerations, and why the brothers’ public statements complicate their defense—delivered with the measured analysis only experienced litigators can provide.

⏰ Timestamps ⏰
00:00:00 👋 Intro
1:36 🎙️ What brings two defense attorneys back to discuss the Tate brothers right now?
2:00 👤 Who is Andrew Tate and how did the “Top G” persona develop?
3:07 🇷🇴 What happened in the Romania case and why are those charges still pending?
3:55 🎬 Why does the Hitler Club video keep resurfacing in every discussion of the brothers?
5:31 🚔 How did U.S. Marshals execute the Miami arrest at a bare-knuckle event?
7:01 📜 Exactly what UK charges does Andrew face, and how do Tristan’s differ?
9:45 💻 How did the webcam business and “PhD” program start the legal exposure?
10:51 🗣️ Why did public boasts about buying Romanian judges create new problems?
11:49 📁 How detailed are the alleged victim statements and digital evidence?
12:47 🏛️ Is there any credible evidence of political intervention in the brothers’ travel status?
13:41 💬 What do Andrew Tate’s own statements about women and relationships reveal?
15:11 🛡️ What classic defense tactics work—and fail—when there are multiple alleged victims?
18:14 ⚖️ How does the pattern of similar allegations change the credibility battle?
24:36 🌍 What is extradition actually about, and what does the court examine?
27:52 🔒 Why fighting extradition rarely helps and why bond is unlikely?
29:51 🧠 What do experienced defense lawyers actually think of Andrew Tate as a client and public figure?
30:31 🔄 How does cultural over-correction create space for extreme voices like his?
40:21 ✈️ What can we learn from the Clavicular Israel visit and public backtracking?
43:39 🏁 Where do the attorneys land on the likely outcome of these cases?

Does a defendant’s public persona and prior statements about women make a fair trial more difficult, or should those statements be treated as pure entertainment?

#TateBrothers #andrewtate #tristantate #lawyer #criminallaw #topg #Law #CurrentEvents #justicesystem #Lawsuit #justice #LegalNews #CourtCase #lawandorder #DeepDive #truecrimecommunity #CourtroomDrama #CrimeDocumentary #LegalSystem #criminaljustice #trials #LawAndOrder #realtalk #debate #TrueCrimePodcast #truecrimestories #attorney #investigations #LegalTips #TwoTapsAndFriends

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SPEAKER_01

Todd G. I mean, if you ask me he's a douchebag, I don't like him. I'm not a fan of him. I think he's an idiot. I think that he's a grifter. I think that he just will say whatever gets him likes and views. And it looks like there are seven alleged victims. These guys are in deep shit.

SPEAKER_00

They fled to Romania to avoid England and now then they move to the United States with charges still pending in Romania. If I'm a judge, I'm like, nope, flight risk.

SPEAKER_01

They flaunt their money. And then not only that, they have a huge fan base. They could probably raise any amount of money they needed.

SPEAKER_00

You release him, the first thing he's going to do is head to Morocco or something like that, a country with no extradition treaty, and then fight it from there. You're not going to get a sympathetic jury for Andrew Tate.

SPEAKER_02

It's not easy to avoid conviction in the gr in in the UK, by the way. Oh yeah. Sentencing is another story.

SPEAKER_01

We literally started a country to get away from that judicial system. You know, like that's uh we we started a war. You know, when you're so fucking adamant, yeah, and you create a platform and you're using this for views, at least go fucking do your due diligence. You know, do your due diligence, do minimal due diligence.

SPEAKER_02

Well, I you know, they don't give clavicular that. Here's a guy who finally comes back and says, you know what? I was wrong. He did what we want everyone to do is go for yourself and experience it, and then come back and argue with it. Right.

SPEAKER_01

Want to welcome back attorney Michael Dye. Hey Danny. Welcome back, and I have attorney Lloyd Goldberg.

unknown

Danny.

SPEAKER_00

Welcome to Two Taps and Friends. Grab your favorite drink, get comfy, and let's dive into another episode of Two Taps and Friends.

SPEAKER_01

Welcome back to Two Taps and Friends. I'm Danny Roseberg, host of the show. Today I have my panel on when we talk about all things news and current. I want to welcome back attorney Michael Dye. Hey Danny. Welcome back, and I have attorney Lloyd Goldberg. Danny. Welcome back to my favorite panel. Um, I wanted to bring you guys back on. Anytime there's some high celebrity things, not celebrity, but issues that are going on, especially litigation-wise, criminal-wise, you guys are the go-to's. So let's talk about the Tate brothers. That's the thing that's going on now. It just happened um not long ago. These guys, apparently, the Andrew Tate and Trist, this is Andrew Tate. This is Tristan Tate. For listening viewers that don't know, Andrew Tate is, I am not a fan of his, but he is uh blown up on social media, he has a huge following. I think the guy was a former kickboxer, and then he became he got big with this whole male machismo that alpha male energy is being drowned out, and we should promote it and and and and trying to masculine.

SPEAKER_00

I masculate boys, toxic masculinity, and he's like the opposite of like calling it toxic. He says it's healthy.

SPEAKER_01

The healthy, like I'm alpha. Um what does he call himself? G1. Top G. Top G. I mean, if you ask me, he's a douchebag, I don't like him. I'm not a fan of him. I think he's an idiot. I think that he's a grifter. I think that he just will say whatever gets him likes and views, and and he's a scumbag. I mean, he's got a lot of shit going on against him. So just for background, he had a huge case in Romania for sex trafficking, prostitution, assault, very similar type charges, rape, all kinds of stuff. They they went and he lived in Romania. He's from where? England, though, right? Isn't he from Romania?

SPEAKER_00

He's dual citizen with England and the U.S. Right.

SPEAKER_01

So he they moved to Romania to, I guess, avoid uh stuff. I don't know what it's about, but he was living there and he got arrested and hit with multiple counts of uh all kinds of stuff. I think he did he go to trial on that? Not yet. No. No, so he's not, but he's out. They had him in no bond or at a very high bond, and the judge released him on bond, so he's out. Now, are we sure that that's pending?

SPEAKER_02

Yes.

SPEAKER_01

Okay. Now he's back out. He started to do the media again. You start seeing him on Pierce Morgan, you start seeing him talking his trash with um one of the main things he was on is uh he was in that Heil Hitler club incident, too. I mean, he's anything that's controversial, the guy draws himself to, right? And he's very outspoken, blasting Israel and you know, talking some anti-Semitic stuff, right? Yep. Um he was at the uh he was part of that Heil Hitler video for listeners and viewers. We have that video. Dan, you want to play that video where a couple's big influencers were in the club and they played the the Kanye West. Some people remember this, the Kanye West Heil Hitler song, a very controversial song. They played that and Andrew Tate and those guys were in the VIP lounge and they were celebrating. You want to play that so they can see him? With Nick Fuentes and Clavicular and all those people. That's his brother Tristan. I don't know if he's another schmuck.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, he's another one.

SPEAKER_00

Clavicular kid.

SPEAKER_02

Clavicular or clavicular kids. Is that it?

SPEAKER_00

Clavicle? I don't know.

SPEAKER_02

Clavicular, yeah. The one that just went to Israel and came back, like, oh my god, Israel's so great. I can't believe I thought they were a terrible.

SPEAKER_01

That was the chan. That's Nick Fuentes. Another schmuck who's also backtracking, by the way. And this is Andrew Tate smiling and they're screaming Heil Hitler. So that was part of a, you know, he's part of a controversy. He's usually in the middle of controversies, but he was in town for, I think, a boxing match. He was here for other reasons, but he was here at what time.

SPEAKER_02

He's promoting some uh uh bare knuckle fight.

SPEAKER_01

Oh it was so it wasn't boxing, it was bare knuckle. He goes to the event and the U.S. Marshals are waiting for it.

SPEAKER_02

That was a beautiful video.

SPEAKER_01

And if you can play the video of uh they got detained, we'll explain in a minute the arrest video. This is it, this is Andrew Tate. Go ahead. They were waiting for him.

SPEAKER_02

Ah, you missed the beginning.

SPEAKER_01

And this is his typical outfit, the high pants. Yeah, it was a very alpha male outfit. Yeah, very alpha male outfit.

SPEAKER_02

It's a dead giveaway. Same as when you had, you know, eight guys in a limousine together.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

And his brother is wearing some top hat.

SPEAKER_01

I don't know if you saw him at the beginning of the video.

SPEAKER_02

He was wearing his, yeah, like uh three-piece tails and a top hat. You missed the best part. The beginning of this video, he gets out of the car, and one of the FBI agents or or one of the marshals actually says he's dressed in a in like uh entertainment kind of outfit, and he's like, Mr. Tate, will you sign like for an autograph? Ah right when he gets out of the car, and then they approach him and you see him shocked, like as these marshals step in and put their hands on him.

SPEAKER_01

They got him good.

SPEAKER_02

They got him good. So what happened that guy, you see the guy with the gold jacket?

SPEAKER_01

Oh he's the one that well, he's undercover, he's a marshal. That's great. So, yeah, these are U.S. Marshals, and what that is, that's the federal government's uh one arm of the federal government's law enforcement to listeners and viewers. And what happened is you the UK had a sealed indictment on him. And what a sealed indictment is is you know, when they have an indictment, they don't put it out in the public, especially when the person's at large, they seal it. Um the investigators, law enforcement know they can see what it is. And it's uh I have the counts here. He's got multiple counts of rape, uh sex trafficking. This is for Andrew Tate, assault-related offenses. Do you have the specific ones? No, assault-related, this is what I have assault-related offenses, four additional um uh charges involving indecent images of children and extreme pornography under UK law. So you got a slew of serious charges, very similar to the Romania count.

SPEAKER_02

More serious. Right, more serious, right? And the reason why the distinction is in Romania, it seems like it's a one of those webcam operations. So there's a lot of circumstantial evidence. Um I know that rape is involved in those charges, but it seems like the focus there is on them manipulating women to participate in the webcam operation. Right, right. So to me, I think that's gonna be a much more difficult case to prove. Right. Whereas, and the yes, the specifics in in the UK, I think they're gonna have a hard time uh, you know, skating by those. Right.

SPEAKER_01

We'll break that down more. Tristan Tate's charged with rape, sexual assault, and sex trafficking. Um and we like we said, Romania case is separate. It involves and was there human trafficking on that too, or was it just website? Trafficking on that one too.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, I beg your pardon. Andrew Tate in the UK, seven additional counts of rape, three counts of arranging or facilitating traffic for sexual exploitation, which could be webcam, three accounts of assault occasioning actual bodily harm, 19 additional counts involving alleged indecent images of child and extreme pornography, and then, like you said, Tristan Tate, two counts of rape, one count of sexual assault, and three counts of trafficking and exploitation. And it looks like there are seven alleged victims. These guys are in deep shit.

SPEAKER_01

So these charges, first of all, when you get charged with this, normally it's the end of your life because once these kind of charges come out, it it's very it just stays with you, stains your reputation until the end of time. I mean, look at Michael Jackson and all these guys, it's always going to be there. So when I say these guys are scumbags, there seems to be a lot of evidence to support what I'm saying. Yeah, right. So looking at the evidence, we kind of try to break down the evidence here. We have multiple seven alleged victims, right? Yep. Um, similar pattern. They're saying that there's an MO too, so they're they can bring out a lot more, and more people will probably come forward, right?

SPEAKER_00

Well, what happened was um the the Tate brothers started, and you know, obviously Andrew Tate was a kickboxer. It wasn't Muay Thai. I don't know exactly what the rules were. I've seen him. He was decent, but I mean he was he a pro?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Okay.

SPEAKER_00

But I mean, he he wasn't um like he wasn't like an elite muay thai kickboxer or anything like that. He he'd get mangled by a lot of people, right? Um, so but they uh started the Tate brothers started this webcam business, and I think the the initial charge in England comes from they brought a girl from I think it was Slovakia over to England to be a webcam model. Unfortunately for them, she was underage, they didn't care, um, and they uh got her doing webcam things. Um they started building up their webcam business, and then they they're kind of idiots because they they kind of just yeah, I mean, they they can't just keep their mouth shut and make money. It's like they they're uh they're drawn to being famous. So they started a uh internet like program of like how you can make money in the webcam business, and they offered the the the Tate Brothers PhD, which stood for Pimp and Ho's degree. And then they called it that PhD, Pimp and Ho's degree. And so then they ended up they were they I guess they realized they were gonna get charged with some things in England, and then so they moved to Romania. But again, instead of just keeping his mouth shut, he gets online and talks about how he moved to Romania because he has so much money that he can buy off any judge, he can buy off the police officers, and talking about how you know basically money talks in Romania and he can buy his way out of anything. And I mean, talk about you know pissing off an entire judiciary in one swoop one swoop.

SPEAKER_01

Right.

SPEAKER_00

Um so made himself not very popular in Romania. Um, you know, so one of the one of the things I told my son is it it doesn't take any talent or ability to get yourself on the front page of the newspaper. All you have to do something is something astoundingly stupid, and that's exactly what you're dealing with here.

SPEAKER_01

And then they did it over and over. But I mean, so apparently these witness statements are very detailed, right? I mean, rape, choking, physical assaults, coercive conduct, all from the usually spanning from 200 uh seven to 2012. They have specific dates, location, descriptions. I mean, this is uh gonna be difficult. Very difficult, very challenging case for them to defend.

SPEAKER_02

They also say that they have digital evidence too, not text messages, social media messages, photos, their own public statements.

SPEAKER_01

Right. Whoops, I mean, they're just digging their own holes, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Um What's it when you find yourself in a hole? The first thing you need to do is stop digging. Stop digging, right?

SPEAKER_01

So, I mean, these guys they and they went, and not only they do, they so when they got released from Romania, I mean he sat in there. Do you know how long they sat in the jail there? A while.

SPEAKER_02

They were there a while, and then wasn't there wasn't there a rumor, rumor that Trump had something to do with getting him his visa back so he could get back to the job.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, yeah, that's what I've heard is that uh Don Jr., I don't know, it's just speculation and rumor. You know, it's a lot of people want to blame everything on Trump, no matter what it is. So it was like he's friends with Don Jr., and Don Jr. uh managed to get in touch with uh Marco Rubio, who told he's the Secretary of State. And so uh Marco Rubio told the Romanian authorities that they have to you know give him his passport back so he can travel. I'm not sure how much I believe that. That's bullshit.

SPEAKER_01

There's no way they're gonna interject on the Tate brothers. Like what what purpose does it serve for them? You know? And then he goes and he shits all over Trump all the time, always. He's talking shits. Anything that because he's he's a Muslim, right? So who Tate is? Tate is I didn't know that. Yeah, he he converted recently. So anything that has to do with any like Iran's a bad idea, Gaza's a genocide, you know, he's gone that angle.

SPEAKER_02

Ah, so why wouldn't you not say that all Muslims say that, but you know why wouldn't he convert to Islam? Why wouldn't any degenerate convert to Islam? Look at Andrew Tate. This is Andrew Tate. Some of his better known statements include calling himself an absolute misogynist, um, that misogyny is realistic, quote unquote, saying that in a relationship a woman belongs to her man, arguing that a man has authority over a female partner because he provides and protects, saying that men should be over. Right. That'll go over real well. Right. Saying men should be permitted to have multiple sexual partners while women should not. Uh there listen, he has millions. There are millions of people that believe the same way that he does. So you're not alone there, Mr. Dye. Um suggesting that women bear some responsibility for putting themselves in situations where sexual assault occurs. You know, with a short skirt, it's their fault. He was asking for that line. Yes. And that if a woman earns money through online sex work while in a relationship with him, he should get that money because she is his.

SPEAKER_01

This guy's a fucking pimp. He's basically a pimp, is what he is. And he dresses like a pimp. The other guy was the Tristan guy's wearing a pimp hat. You see that? It literally looked like he came out of like a movie. What was that movie?

SPEAKER_00

I'm gonna get you something.

SPEAKER_01

I'm gonna get you second. Pimp of the year.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, but you better have my money. Oh, my cash.

SPEAKER_01

We're joking, but this is not funny, but that's funny because they're such idiots, you know. But look, as defense attorneys, we gotta look and see can you take this case apart? They are celebrities, yes, they have a lot of money, you know. You know, so obviously they have witness, you know, they're gonna be credibility issues. That's where we're gonna attack as defense attorneys are gonna attack the credibility of these girls. Yeah, the problem in these kind of cases that I found from experience is that there's no there's no like equation for who can get like abused or molested, right? But a lot of some a lot of times the there's there's girls or guys that are emotionally have issues going on collateral that these predators attract to, right? So you have a guy like Tate who's a predator. If you ask me, the guy's a predator. He talks like a predator, walks like a predator, acts like a predator, right? He's a predator. He's going to go and find some some girl that is, you know, maybe has some emotional issues, some substance abuse issues, whatever it is. They're called daddy issues. Whatever, right? Well, pray you have that combination when a defense attorney can attack the girl, right? Yep, look at her, she's a drug addict, she's slept with so many guys, or he's done this and he's done that, and and you have that line of attack. Yeah. For example, I'll just real quick, quick insight. I had a case, this is very strange. Well, uh, it was a sexual battery case, and it involved a at the time 14-year-old girl and a 50-something-year-old man, okay? And he was a pretty well-known man. And it was the man was a fucking pain in the ass narcissist, predator, if you ask me. But she had crazy emotional issues too. And at that time she was 16, 17, by the time the case was going on. And it turns out that that girl is one of the alleged victims in the Tate case. Is that right? Is that crazy? Yeah, right. So I see the name, I'm going, oh my God. So there's a history of this girl making these allegations. Okay. So that would lead, and I think their their attorneys contacted uh us at some point, yeah. You know, his attorneys, and I don't I didn't speak to him. I think you know what happened with that case is I ended up getting off that case, and a new lawyer took over, and that guy did not do well with the new lawyer, it did not end well for him. But uh, I think that lawyer and that and and Andrew Tay's lawyer has got in contact. Interesting. You have credibility issues with probably all of them. Yeah, right now, it doesn't mean because she's you know, accused she's probably that sometimes these people, these girls will get right back into the same situation with somebody else, right? So she they go from one predator to one predator. Yeah, and allegedly in the Romania case, she moved in with both the brothers and was doing the webcam work. And I know that girl from just crossing, I'm not crossing from depositions and just you know, learning about her. It doesn't surprise me at all. But it also doesn't surprise me that she's back with a guy like that or that he's a predator. That wouldn't shock me at all. So I think that that's an interesting angle that always is up for. But now the problem is there's seven of them, yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02

Well, I mean, it's it's but it's all the same. In other words, you're still gonna be able to cross-examine, you're still gonna be able to mount a defense because, like you said, you know, they're they're gonna, you know, their claims, their lawyers' claims are that these women were either employees or they were even partners in some of the endeavors, and that now, of course, it's all about money.

SPEAKER_01

Right. Well, do we know are there civil cases against them? No, I don't know that.

SPEAKER_02

No, I don't know that.

SPEAKER_01

That's a good question. Yeah, are they going for money, right? Yeah. Um, but that could happen at any time. They have uh the statute of limitations on that.

SPEAKER_00

Well, the I mean, one of the things that, you know, as a defense attorney, we'd always start looking at right away is that how often do we see rich, famous guys accused of sexual assault? Like, who is that uh that baseball player? He was a pitcher, where the woman accused him of sexual assault, but then she had a a video of her, and then she's like, look, I just scored the bag. Oh, I remember that. I remember that.

SPEAKER_01

I don't remember the name of the I don't remember that, but I remember that. Yeah, yeah. Like him in bed, right? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

She was like giggling next to him in bed, and then and then she comes out and says that he raped her, um, which was before that video. So I mean, there a lot of people like to say the you know, the you know, believe all women, the women don't make up sexual assault claims. They do. Some do. Right. All right, right. And so when you have people who are rich and vulnerable for these allegations, because once the allegations start piling up, you know, people uh, you know, there are people out there that are opportunistic that are just going to pile on to get money. Yep. Um especially if they they've had some sort of a relationship with them, it didn't end well. Uh they can get money and get a little bit of revenge at the same time. So there are definitely I I won't say the you know anyone specifically of these women are uh lying. I don't know. But at the same time, it I'm sure the floodgates are going to start to open and there are going to be opportunistic people that are going to jump in there trying to get money.

SPEAKER_01

Right. But the problem is there's seven of them, and there's gonna be more. So if you have an effective cross of one girl, you discredit one girl, there's two girls, your percentages are going up that you're not gonna discredit every one of them. It's like a parallel. Uh either one. I think they do have jury trial. Do they have jury trial in Great Britain? I think they do. But if they didn't, it's worse, right? Like you have to now discredit. And the problem is apparently the pattern is very similar. So I they're not, unless they're communicating, like they're gonna talk about specifics that are very hard. Like in that case, there were specifics that were like, ooh. You know, the more detailed it gets, the harder it is to fabricate.

SPEAKER_00

Haven't all these specifics been leaked publicly since the Romania case, the the choking, the you know, threatening a girl with a machete. And I mean, we we already know a lot about what the allegations are. So it wouldn't be difficult for somebody to pile on.

SPEAKER_01

Right. Well, that's the back and forth. Clearly, that's gonna be the back and forth. And then they I don't know if they have DNA, and if they do have DNA, then it matters.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, well, that's where the consensual comes in.

SPEAKER_01

They're already laying the groundwork for that. Consent is gonna be the big thing there. So what are your thoughts on it, Lloyd?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, no, I agree. I think that's exactly what the problem is gonna be. I think that if it's about the webcam business and they're trying to extrapolate, you know, a coercion into the webcam business, I think they're gonna have the same kind of problems that the Romanian officials are gonna have. But if there's, you know, evidence of actual physical assault and rape, And strangulation, then I think it's gonna be a lot more difficult for them to escape by that, especially if you have, you know, multiple witnesses. Right.

SPEAKER_01

I think there was a video of him beating up a girl. I don't have it, but I think there was a video of it already.

SPEAKER_00

I mean, unlike Matt a while ago. But that girl came out and said that it was consensual that she enjoyed that type of sex.

SPEAKER_02

Well, and it's not gonna be like Michael Jackson, where you have, you know, multiple witnesses, all of whom were discredited, right? Um, but a jury wanted to believe Michael Jackson. Right. So these guys aren't gonna have that same benefit.

SPEAKER_01

Because women are not like this guy. Correct. All you gotta get is some mothers on there. Right. Or some fathers on there. Yeah. I mean, this guy's core base, I would think, are just, you know, teenage boys or 20-year-old men that aren't, you know, that that that are attracted. That's so as a if if we're picking a panel, it's pretty easy for me to get a panel. Yeah, right. You get any older that man or woman, right? No men, no men with daughters. Any woman, right, right? Any woman. I guess some girls might think he's like good looking or something, but even that, like, no, he's talking like an asshole, you know.

SPEAKER_00

So I don't think it would be hard.

SPEAKER_02

But I want liberal white women on that because they're well, and another one of their defenses is that that their public persona is not really who they are privately, that they understand that they're in entertainment, that it makes money, and that's their business. So they use that whole idea of this, you know, degenerate kind of misogyny to attract followers. That's a lot to overcome as a defense of the lot.

SPEAKER_01

You gotta paint that picture, like what, show him he makes apple pies on Saturday? Like how do you how do you show that? Like now you're presenting evidence. And they have to testify that he's a good guy. Right. They would have to testify. This guy makes the most outlandish statements. I I can't stand him. Every time I hear him, and I think he's stupid. I don't think he's a smart guy. Of course. I think he's a very stupid guy. I mean, literally I can guess his position on everything. You know, like I know where he's gonna go, I know how aggressive he's gonna be.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, well, they all get the talking points.

SPEAKER_01

I have a friend who uh other friends that have another podcast, and they had booked him and they were super excited to have him. Like, oh, we got Andrew Tate. I'm like, oh fuck that guy. I was like, dude, they're laughing, you know. They're like, yeah, but we'll get a lot of views. I'm like, yeah, you will get that. So yeah, kudos for that, right? That's what it's about for you guys. So um, and then when the shit happened, I text them, uh oh. Like, dude, and apparently they already paid him a big. So, like, I was like, good luck in a refund from that fucking guy. Yep, right. So the issue, like, so what people don't understand now is what extradition is. So let's break that down for people a little bit. Because this what this is about now is like they're fighting extradition. So I'll let Lloyd or Mike, Mike, whoever wants to go ahead and explain extradition. So before you go, they're not having to prove the case against the Tate brothers at all, right? This is not about did they do it, what evidence do you have? It's you know, it the is a legal standard met for extradition to be proper. Did the government on both sides do everything correctly? So explain that.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, basically, extradition is when in one jurisdiction a person has a criminal charge. In this case, that would be England, and the person is caught in the United States. England has the right to, and usually it's via a treaty uh that we have with uh the country. Uh we do have an extradition treaty with England.

SPEAKER_01

England has the right to have everything with England, but it's a big bro.

SPEAKER_00

Right. So what happens is England requests extradition from the United States. The United States, once they receive the request, the treaty will dictate exactly what the procedure is going to be. Usually it's uh, you know, the the criminal charges have been filed, certain due process procedures have been met, and once that happens, and there also usually has to be what's called mutual criminality, meaning that the the crime that the person committed in England must also be a crime in the United States. So what in the that's in international extraditions and state extraditions, mutual criminality uh isn't usually an issue. So sex trafficking is a crime in uh England, rape is a crime in England, and uh child uh child sexual exploitation is a crime in England, and all three of those are also a crime in the United States. So then England requests the United States take the people into custody and take them over to England to stand trial. And so when the United States reviews it, it's just kind of a it's not a a big review.

SPEAKER_01

Uh there's just a timeline they have to do it by.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it's like in I have different for every jurisdiction. Yeah, I don't know what it is for international extraditions. Uh in state-to-state uh extraditions, it's uh 30 days to present a governor's warrant. Um I don't know what type of warrant they have to present, and I don't know what time frame they have uh for the international cases. But once they present that, then they they're taken into custody and they're held here. And the person can either say the person can waive uh extradition, which means uh I'll voluntarily go back, or they can fight it. And uh at that point they have to come up with a uh relevant defense, like uh, you know, it's a political persecution, or they didn't follow uh due process.

SPEAKER_01

Their life would be in danger going back as one of them as well, right?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. And none of which seem to apply here, but the Tate brothers are fighting extradition, and uh it should be a relatively quick process. Uh it's not uh fighting extradition isn't uh very long process because it's just a checklist.

SPEAKER_01

By the time I've seen it not go, or then the only time I've seen a person not get extradited is if that place decides the other jurisdiction decides they don't want to come get them. Yeah. And I assure you they're coming to get these guys. What's your thoughts on it, Lloyd?

SPEAKER_02

No, I agree. I I I I don't understand the fighting of the extradition. I never did. It's just a matter of course. I mean, you just I mean, even in state cases when, you know, when when you know this the state would, you know, want to extradite, uh my client, you know, they're just gonna sit in jail longer. Yeah, you just waive it. You waive it. Well, they are entitled to bond on extraditions.

SPEAKER_00

Uh they're not gonna get a bond.

unknown

No.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, they're not getting bonded.

SPEAKER_00

Uh well, I don't know if federally you're entitled to a bond, but is it the state, the interstate compact on extraditions?

SPEAKER_01

Well, I think that there was some talk of that they're trying to get a bond. There's probably some sort of a bond. And like if I guess but think about the level of flight risk these guys are.

SPEAKER_02

No, they're they're not getting a bond. So that's the point. I don't that's why I don't I don't get it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, they I mean they fled to Romania to avoid England and now then they move to the United States with charges still pending in Romania. If I'm a judge, I'm like, nope, flight risk.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, they flaunt their money, and then not only that, they have a huge fan base that could probably raise any amount of money they needed, right? If they need a hundred, you could put a hundred million dollar bond on them. Yeah. These guys have you know 50 million uh followers if you know it's not.

SPEAKER_02

And they just go to a country that doesn't extradite.

SPEAKER_00

And see, that's the that's the problem with him running his mouth is he bragged about going to Romania for the purpose of I can buy the judges, I can buy the police. So you know right away that if you release him, the first thing he's gonna do is head to Morocco or something like that, a country with no extradition treaty, and then fight it from there.

SPEAKER_01

And you know, this guy has this stupid position where he I fought the matrix and they came after me, right? Yeah, that's what he says. What are your thoughts on that? Talk about it. What are your opinion of Andrew Tate? Give me your opinion.

SPEAKER_02

I I I I he's a worthless human being to me.

SPEAKER_01

Right?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, he's a piece of shit. I I I mean, I don't have any sympathy for these people.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, do you do you doubt these charges?

SPEAKER_02

Well, I mean, it's hard to like say that, but yeah, I don't doubt these charges. Anybody that has a kind of attitude is gonna cross the line.

SPEAKER_01

Right.

SPEAKER_02

You know, if if that's your attitude and that's the way you feel about everybody else besides yourself, there's no doubt in my mind that these guys had, you know, they got their toe in it. You know, what specific allegations are true. I uh obviously I don't know that, but you know, the old proverbial where there's smoke, there's fire, I think that it applies in this case.

SPEAKER_01

Right. What's your thought? First of all, what do you think of him? You like him?

SPEAKER_00

Uh no. I I think you know, he he takes issues that are going on in society and just goes all the way too far. Right. I mean, I I will agree that, you know, to a certain extent, society has been completely pussified. Right.

SPEAKER_01

When it's I mean he when he that I agree too.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. I mean you you take guys from that was his opening. Yeah, 1940s, you know, you had 16 and 17 year olds dying on the beach in Normandy, and now you've got 20-year-old college students that don't know what gender they are and crying over a fucking safe space. All right, society's definitely been pustified. But at the same time, he takes it way too far.

SPEAKER_01

Well, it's like I was talking to somebody, it's the overcorrection that's always a problem. Yeah, right. So you were bashing, you know, the society would was hard on homosexuals and transvestites. I understand that. But the overcorrection is now it got shoved in everyone's face. You're like, all right, enough already. I'm not gonna teach my kid about transvestite. I it's not, I don't want to do that, right? It doesn't mean I care that you do it, yeah, right. You could do whatever the hell you want to do. Yeah, but you don't have to put it in every cartoon and every show, and we don't have to have this and a character and list, and that's fine, but when it gets to a point where it's too much, it's an overcorrection. But the problem now is the response to the overcorrection can be an overcorrection. It's an overcorrection. Yeah, that's always that's where you get a guy like Andrew Tate, a fucking predator, scumbag con artist. You could tell I don't like him. Yeah, I like I can't even stand to hear the guy's voice, you know what I mean? Because I just know this type guy, especially doing what we do. Yeah. How many guys like this do you know? Oh, they're the worst. You're gonna tell me the law, probably. He's gonna tell me this, right?

SPEAKER_00

You know, what's when I first heard him, I thought he was funny because I thought it was a joke. And you know, I was like, this guy's kind of funny, you know, the way he puts things. Uh then I then I was like telling him, I remember telling my son, I'm like, he's not serious, you know, he's just he's just pushing the limits to get an audience, but you know, and I still think that you know, most of it's probably an act. Um, but at the same time, you know, he apparently has been involved in some pretty crazy stuff. But you know, as for him, you know, uh what my kid told me the expression, I didn't come up with it myself, and I know my kid didn't come up with it either. Is that real G's move in silence like lasagna? You know, the G is silent in lasagna. And you know, if you're gonna do something, shut your fucking mouth. Yeah, all right. That that's his biggest problem, is he's he's seeking fame. And he has it now. Yeah, he loves it. A person told me a long time ago, he said if you're gonna commit a crime, do it by yourself and keep your mouth shut because two people can keep a secret when one's dead. All right. So just you know, and the thing here is he he he had his little his little webcam business. And then instead of just going ahead and making money with his webcam business, he has to come out with the Tate Brothers PhD and make himself an internet celebrity.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, he's literally advertising pimping hoes. Yeah. And I'll give you a degree in pimping hoes, yet I'm innocent of all these charges of prostitution, trafficking. I did not pimp this hoe. Yeah, that's not these eight. These seven or eight hoes. Sorry, nine, ten, eleven hoes, because it's gonna keep coming. What do you got in your mind? Uh my entertainment.

SPEAKER_00

You know, if you're gonna commit a crime, keep your mouth shut. Remember uh Sammy Gravano was talking about John Gotti, and he said that there were some people down at the end of the bar that were pointing at John Gotti, and Sammy Gravano says, The dapper dot. Yeah, he says, John, you want me to go take care of these people? And he's like, No, that's just my public. And then he walks down there and gives them autographs. And Sammy Gravano was like, What the fuck? This is supposed to be a secret society. And here's this guy trying to get on the cover of every magazine, you know.

SPEAKER_01

And so the thing coming from the guy who ratted the whole thing out, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And so you look at it and you look at what they're doing, and you see that it wasn't just the money that they were after, it wasn't just the girls, they wanted to be famous, and they put their business out there for everybody to see for purposes of being famous, and they got famous, and this is the consequence.

SPEAKER_01

What's the story with the brother? Does anybody know much? I don't know much about that guy.

SPEAKER_00

I think he's the follower.

SPEAKER_01

He he does look like the follower.

SPEAKER_00

He's Robin. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Batman Robin.

SPEAKER_01

But so but and he's always getting arrested for all these things. He's his business partner, I assume.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, but he's married with kids and stuff.

SPEAKER_01

Well, that's really yeah. He's pimping hoes.

SPEAKER_00

Well, I guess he can have multiple sexual partners and his wife can't, but oh my god. Who knows?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I'm reading through the notes on see the case in Romania, there's more information. All right, what is it? Because this the indictment in the UK is sealed, so we don't know what the specific allegations are. What do we got in Romania going? It's so it seems so weak. So, for example, in in Romania, it's more about coercion than anything else. So, for example, that's tough. Targeting women through romantic relationships, making promises, you know, promise, promising love, exclusivity, marriage. Sounds like every relationship. Right. The lover boy method prosecutors describe this as a recognized grooming technique, sometimes seen in trafficking cases where you'll uh make promises, build trust, you know, gain their trust. And then, you know, hey, well, you let's do this webcam thing where you're naked on camera. It'll be great. Okay, baby. You know, that kind of thing. Um recruitment into webcam work, told they'd be they'd make significant money on the platform, persuaded women to move across state lines. There's no allegations, at least in the summary that I'm reading, of any underage. Yeah, that girl that I mentioned, she would be overage at that point. Um coercion, emotional manipulation, isolation from family and friends, monitoring of communications, financial control, pressure. I mean Those are charges. This is the state's case.

SPEAKER_01

What's the actual counts? What are they charging for?

SPEAKER_02

Uh I don't have the actual counts. Trafficking, right? Or yeah, it's uh human trafficking and uh financial exploitation. That's tough. I mean that's that's a tough one. That's a tough to prosecute me. Yeah. That's e easy to lead defended. Because basically you're removing all the agency from the women. So they got fooled. That's your case.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, you gotta get your you gotta get the jury into the mind of the women. Yeah. Right?

SPEAKER_02

That's always difficult to do. That's why I feel like the rape allegations are obviously more significant. Right.

SPEAKER_01

You have physical evidence or you have physical evidence, even without your the testimony of women that are gonna come in there and describe a very similar uh mode of operation, too, you know.

SPEAKER_00

The problem with the some of the rape allegations, like the the the girl who they had getting beat on video, haven't watched it. Uh, but she came out later and said it was consensual, that's just the type of sex that she was into.

SPEAKER_01

But she was just videotaping it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. And so and whether people like to believe it or not, there are women that are into that crap. And uh, you know, if he, you know, I don't even know. I mean, it it's not hard, and things aren't hard to find. Whatever your kink is, you can find it. So, you know, I mean the the women are gonna have to, you know, the the defense from the Tate brothers is obviously gonna be that they were willing participants, this is the way we like to have sex, and this is the, you know, they were into it.

SPEAKER_01

They moved in on their own right. They were living in a house, all of them, right?

SPEAKER_02

And you're prosecuting us because we're we're douchebags.

SPEAKER_01

Right. And then the fact that they got out on a bond must have been a showing of something, like, you know, on the because when they do bond hearings, they do talk about some of the weight of the evidence, right? And uh and their flight risk is so high, which means that the evidence must have been pretty weak, right? Because it's all, you know, they're balancing.

SPEAKER_02

So on the other hand, there's you know, there's always the argument that they're so recognizable that they're not gonna be able to hide anywhere. So there is that argument. What do you mean you see the hat, Tristan was wearing? That was a pretty sort of thing. There I would have known who he was. Yeah, the top hat. That was funny.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, dude. These guys, yeah. So I I think that they're fucked. I think they're fucked. I do. That's my that's my diagnosis. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

It's not easy, it's not easy to avoid conviction in the gr in in the UK, by the way. Oh, yeah. Sentencing is another story.

SPEAKER_01

We literally started a country to get away from that judicial system. You know, like that's uh we we started a war, you know.

SPEAKER_02

It's super easy to get convicted there. It's just they're very liberal on sentencing. You know, if they would have sent them, unless you use hurdy words. I don't know how you I I know they do prosecute significantly for tweets.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, that is true.

SPEAKER_02

But they do have some fucked up tweets.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

If they would have stayed low-key um their chance, you know, and not sought fame. First off, I don't know whether all this would have ever come down on them if they would have just been low-key about what they were doing. Yeah, maybe not. But at the same time, it would also be very a lot more easy to defend because you have a client when you have him as a client that everybody hates.

unknown

Right.

SPEAKER_00

So again, like Michael Jackson, everybody liked Michael Jackson, everybody sits there dancing along with his stuff. You're not gonna get a sympathetic jury for Andrew Tate. It's impossible. I I just I don't know how you get that.

SPEAKER_01

You would literally need to pull those kids that were in the club singing Heil Hitler. That's what you'd need on your jury pen. Yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_00

The best you could hope for is a juror like me, who just thinks he's kind of like a loudmouth idiot. And uh, you know, right. That would be the best you could ever do.

SPEAKER_01

Because you would actually look at the evidence, right?

SPEAKER_00

Right, that's it.

SPEAKER_01

Right. And just for the last few minutes, talk about this clav guy. You know about him?

SPEAKER_00

You don't know uh clavicular, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So this guy's about his whole thing is like looks maxing. He came up with looks maxing. Where is that? They like they do all kinds of procedures and ways to make yourself look good. It's some really like uh I don't know, that's alpha. Okay, that doesn't really they got the looks maxer and you got the G dog together in the club with so but he went to Israel and had a blast, yeah, and saw what we see when we were over there. Yeah, and you know, he went on Pierce Morgan. Obviously, you saw that I didn't see the Pierce Morgan one. I don't know. Why didn't you go to Gaza? Right. Why didn't you go to Gaza? You know, unfair. And he goes, Well, it seems safer in Tel Aviv. Did he say that yet? It's such like answers that were whoever is, but um, they kept bringing up this that Heil Hitler situation.

SPEAKER_02

I saw an interview uh with him. Uh it was an is it was the interviewer was Israeli and he was a very left-wing. Oh, and he went at him and he walked off.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, they were talking about that. Yeah, it was he didn't want to talk about that anymore. Right. He almost walked off Pierce Morgan when he kept bringing it up. Yeah. He's like, Do you just went over there because you wanted to show Jews that you don't need Jews?

SPEAKER_02

He's like, and I was listening to I think you know who Emily Austin is? Oh, yeah, you know, great beautiful Jewish uh influencer. And uh she was talking about it and she was lambasting that reporter. Really? Why do that? She her point was amazing. She's like, this guy, you know, he talked all the talking points. It was, you know, maligning Israel every chance he got. And then he was he had an he was brave enough not to, you know, play a game like Ro Cannon did. For you know, he actually went to Israel and he and he experienced life on the ground, and it changed his perspective completely, of course. Right. And he came back and he was like, Oh my god, I I you know I expected, you know, this horror show, and it was amazing. Apartheid. Uh I couldn't believe I saw Arabs on the beach until I was blown away. And the reporter was like, you know, trying to bring up the Heil Hitler shit. Yeah. And Emily Austin was like, Why would you do that? Here's a guy who finally comes back and says, you know what? I was wrong. He did what we want everyone to do is go for yourself and experience it, then come back and argue with it. Right. And still that wasn't enough.

SPEAKER_01

She was to rip 100%. You took the moment to rip him up. Yeah. That was bad. Yeah. You have nothing to say because you won't go over there. So I don't want to take it.

SPEAKER_00

I won't go to Canada. That's his excuse every time.

SPEAKER_01

Actually, Whistler's beautiful. But um, no, that that's interesting. But yeah, so he was bunched up with um, he was bunched up. I don't think Andrew Tate's ever been to Israel. I don't know. No. Scumbag. I don't think he's been to half the places he talks shit about. He's that's what it is. That's what today's social media and all these talking, most of these people not have never not well traveled. Well, he's probably well traveled, but never, never been to these places they're fucking talking about. Of course. Most people have. And look, we we opine all the time here about places we've never been and things we don't know that much about, but that's fine. But when you're so fucking adamant, yeah, and you create a platform, yeah, and you're using this for views, at least go fucking do your due diligence. You know, do your due diligence, do minimal due diligence. Well, I you know, they don't give clavicular that.

SPEAKER_02

And he because he went with an open mind.

SPEAKER_01

Right. Yeah, you need to go to Gaza. Nobody can go to fucking Gaza right now, all right? It's not a fucking place you go, right?

SPEAKER_00

But not safe.

SPEAKER_01

No, right, right. So I don't know. Any final thoughts on Andrew Tate, the Tate brothers? Uh Riva Narchi. Uh-huh. That's not easy. I can't say I'm angry. You know, I can't say I'm upset.

SPEAKER_00

Top G is going down.

SPEAKER_01

Top G is going down. He better get into some like male-to-male energy. Because he's gonna be someone's girlfriend very soon.

SPEAKER_02

I think you know, here's the thing. I that was my only that was my only reason. That was my only hope for for him not being guilty, was then I can't continue to say that I think he's gay. You know, because he if he comes up and says, I'm I'm I didn't rape these girls, I'm gay, I would be like, Okay, I I was right, because that's what I think of these people. Yeah, here's the thing not that there's anything wrong with it.

SPEAKER_01

No, no, not at all. But when you're so when we were saying when you're so out there about alpha male, what are you doing? Yeah, you're trying to cover what you know? Yeah, that's right. I just call it little dick energy.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, that's what I told you. You know, eight guys in a limo and eight guys in a limo together, you know, not a girl in sight. Come on.

SPEAKER_01

Dick Fuentes, you know, like you got it. He's celibate, isn't he? What does he call them? What the name of those? I don't I don't remember. Incels. Incels. Yeah. This guy's a well-dressed, I don't even say well-dressed, but a very dressed-up incel. Yeah, you know, exactly. But we'll see where this goes. We'll come back, we'll talk about it some more. I think it's going nowhere good for them. Yeah, but it'll definitely be entertaining for us. Yeah. As soon as the indictment comes out, we'll come back. I'm sure that'll be out very soon. It'll be an interesting one to read. It'll be a hot, it'll be a hot topic and we'll be talking about it. But thank you guys for coming on. I'll have you guys on again soon. Always a pleasure. Thank you. Thank you to all my uh listeners and viewers. Thank you for watching. Two taps and friends. Please like, subscribe to the channel. You can find us everywhere. Like I always say, our marketing team's amazing. We're on YouTube, we're on IR, we're on Instagram, Facebook, we're on uh LinkedIn, we're on TikTok, we're everywhere. Um uh love you all. We'll be bringing it back to you. We'll be keeping you up current on this. We love you all. Thank you for watching. Thank you for listening. See you guys soon. Goodbye. Cut