EP 9 Marie-Jeanne Lamartinière – The Fierce Fighter I Women And Resistance 🌍

In this conversation, Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. and Adesoji Iginla discuss the life and legacy of Marie-Jeanne Lamartinière, a key figure in the Haitian Revolution. 
The dialogue explores themes of identity, the role of women in the fight for freedom, and the importance of unity among marginalized groups. 
Aya emphasizes the need for education, storytelling, and self-awareness in understanding one's heritage and the ongoing struggle for liberation. 
The conversation serves as a powerful reminder of the resilience and strength of women throughout history and the lessons that can be drawn from their experiences.

Takeaways

*Freedom will never be given, it must be taken.
*We must not allow ourselves to be divided.
*The biggest battle is really the battle of the mind.
*Women played a crucial role in the Haitian Revolution.
*Unity among marginalized groups is essential for liberation.
*Education is key to understanding our history and identity.
*Storytelling shapes our perceptions and actions.
*We must learn from the past to inform our future actions.
*Don't underestimate your power to make a difference.
*The fight for freedom is ongoing and requires collective effort.

Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Marie-Jeanne Lamartiere
01:43 The Legacy of Mixed Heritage and Identity
03:47 The Fight for Freedom and Unity
06:02 The Role of Women in the Haitian Revolution
08:30 Tactics and Strategies in Battle
10:53 The Aftermath of Victory and Continued Struggles
13:20 Reflections on Leadership and Legacy
15:15 Empowerment and the Role of Women Today
26:18 The Ulterior Motives Behind Assistance to Africa
28:28 Historical Lessons from King Jaja of Opobo
32:25 The Importance of Understanding Our Enemies
35:12 Reclaiming Our History and Education
40:31 The Collective Fight for Liberation
44:17 The Power of Storytelling in Our Struggle

Welcome  to Women and Resistance, a powerful podcast where we honour the courage, resilience, and revolutionary spirit of women across the globe. Hosted by Aya Fubara Eneli Esq and Adesoji Iginla...

You're listening to Women and Resistance with Aya Fubara Eneli Esq and Adesoji Iginla—where we honour the voices of women who have shaped history through courage and defiance...Now, back to the conversation.

That’s it for this episode of Women and Resistance. Thank you for joining us in amplifying the voices of women who challenge injustice and change the course of history. Be sure to subscribe, share, and continue the conversation. Together We Honour the past, act in the present, and shape the future. Until next time, stay inspired and stay in resistance!

Transcript

Adesoji Iginla (00:12.94)
Yes, welcome, welcome. Welcome to another episode of Women and Resistance. And this week, we're looking at the

How can I even describe her? The powerful person of Marie-Jeanne Lamartiere. A Haiti hero. no, the best way to give out voice is to ask my co-hosts sister.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (00:48.312)
Marijin Lamatiya.

Adesoji Iginla (00:54.456)
Sister Aya Fubera Eneli Esquire. And what do you make of this? Another of this of our heroes.

Adesoji Iginla (01:15.915)
good.

Adesoji Iginla (01:31.886)
You

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:39.642)
Don't disparage me because I happen to have been born into this body. There is nothing that I would not do to fight for my own liberation.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:55.45)
There are many stories about who I am and how I was born, not many historical documents. But we can assume, and we know to some degree, that my father was a French white man.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (02:17.721)
And my mother was an African woman. One of the many hundreds of thousands of Black people who were taken from our lands in Africa.

and brought.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (02:39.131)
to raise sugar cane and to produce wealth.

for the white man.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (02:51.139)
I have been told that I came from a long line of female warriors. In fact,

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (03:03.493)
part of my story says.

that I inherited an army consisting of women from my mother and my auntie who both died in battle. They were from the all-female army known as the Minos of the Dahomey Kingdom.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (03:27.053)
Many of us came from different parts of Africa to the shores of these Americas in the area known as Haiti.

It is said that General Le Boetture was actually from Congo. But it doesn't matter where we came from.

in terms of this story.

We knew we were enslaved in one form or fashion. Now, to tell the whole story, I would have to talk about the mulattoes.

Adesoji Iginla (04:09.608)
Key parts.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (04:09.939)
I refused to be called mulatto, preferring the term mixed blood. But there were many like me.

who thought themselves superior to the black Africans because we had white blood flowing in our veins. And they did a lot of work trying to convince us we were not as good as white people, but we were better than the pure Africans. And there were lots of conflicts between the so-called mulattoes and the black.

Adesoji Iginla (04:40.11)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (04:51.179)
Africans. In fact, one such conflict which was called the War of Knives had us slaughtering each other. And for what? Because some of us had been indoctrinated into the Catholic faith.

Adesoji Iginla (05:06.968)
vaccinated.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (05:11.501)
not understanding that the way white people who were in numerical minority kept control over us all was to divide and conquer. And so they recruited the mulattoes into their own armies.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (05:33.635)
warriors like Lalarque who was a mulatto and even my husband for whom I bear the last name Lamontiere. He once fought on the part of the white Frenchman.

Adesoji Iginla (05:48.374)
front.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (05:53.848)
I may have white blood flowing in me, but I was always clear that I was an African woman. Yes, of mixed blood, but I fought for my people and I fought to convince those who consider themselves mulattoes. I fought to convince them that our struggle was one and we had to come together as one.

Adesoji Iginla (06:27.139)
So.

You acted as a rallying spirit even till today. The history books, those that bear to mention you, register notes that you were a sea of change in Haiti, considered then one of the poorest nations now, but one rich in history. And you are part of that history. Could you tell us

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (06:35.035)
you

Adesoji Iginla (06:58.956)
What was the motivating factor for deciding to fight for your freedom?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (07:09.135)
simple. I wanted to be free. I saw the atrocities on these slave plantations.

I saw.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (07:28.015)
how we were dehumanized, I saw.

how short our lifespans were because the work that we did was dangerous and the hours were long and the cruelty was intense. I knew.

Intimately, from the privileges I had as a molato, as they would call me, although as I said, I prefer to be known as mixed blood, I knew from the company that molatos were allowed to keep, I knew from some of the privileges some of us had, including owning African slaves ourselves, that this was a system

Adesoji Iginla (08:16.845)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (08:21.753)
that would never give us freedom. We had to take it for ourselves. And I knew that if we were divided, we could never take it. And though the mulatto magp felt that they were in somewhat of a better position than the black African.

There was a hierarchy and we mulattoes could never truly be free. We were always also going to be beholden to the white French men and women.

and

the memories from my mother, from my aunties, from the women who spoke of their time as free people on the continent of what is now called Africa.

were still embedded in my soul. And so I did everything. I used every gift and talent God gave me. I used the fact that I was mixed blood. I used the fact that they loved my height, because I was taller than most women. I used my bosom.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (09:39.425)
I used all my feminine wiles, I used my beauty and I used my intelligence, but I also used my ability to fight. I was quite the sniper.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (09:55.368)
And I did not come, nor did most of the Black women, mulatto or otherwise, we did not come from a tradition we were never given that opportunity to be damsels in distress and to wait for men to save us. And so unlike many other revolutions, including the American Revolution that only talks about the role of white men or men, but never the roles of women, for us, we fought.

Adesoji Iginla (10:22.243)
Women.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (10:25.975)
side by side.

I had my sash and my belt. I had my dagger and I had my musket and I was not afraid to use them.

Adesoji Iginla (10:29.568)
sometimes.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (10:41.515)
on our sworn enemies, but also on those of us who looked like me who would betray us. And so there is a story told during the battle at Crete.

Crete at Perot and we were hemmed in 12,000 French well armed soldiers who thought they could take that fort in one day because we started off with about 1,500 fighters.

But we just needed to buy time. We needed to buy time for General DeSalin to rally up some other troops from the other side. We needed to buy time to get more ammunition because you know something about the white man, which we did use to our benefits then, but I think we've forgotten some of these lessons. The British wanted in.

Adesoji Iginla (11:46.104)
Pre-Tail

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (11:48.826)
And so the British were actually providing us with ammunition because they wanted the French out. We first had to get the French out and then we were going to figure out the rest of it, but we needed ammunition. We also were smart enough to know the environment in which we lived. And we knew that if we could hold off those French soldiers long enough that the wet season will come.

Adesoji Iginla (11:57.902)
You

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (12:18.071)
and yellow fever and other diseases would be able to take them out. We just had to hold on. But you know what? That fort was no, provided little resistance to the cannons and the hail of bullets that rained over us day and night. And we went down from 1500 warriors fighting men and women down to 700.

Adesoji Iginla (12:21.614)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (12:49.304)
and

We were demoralized. Well, some were demoralized. And as I talked with my husband, as he was trying to hold down the fort, waiting for support and backup, I told him we were not going to lay down and die. And I rallied the troops. I was on the walls of that fort and I was sniping.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (13:24.185)
and the man saw me and they too were stirred up in their spirits not to give up not to lay down and die.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (13:35.246)
In addition to all the skill sets that I've also shared, I also had learned to be a healer. And so I provided I and other women, I am known. Belair is known. You can look her up as well, but there were so many countless unknown women who were part of this struggle as well. And we provided healing to some of our wounded warriors.

Adesoji Iginla (13:54.36)
women.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (14:05.253)
But I'll tell you what I did as well. We had to ration food and water. We were hemmed in with no access to additional resources. And at one point there was a man crazed with thirst. And as I was trying to ration the water, he would try to attack me. He was not going to live. We knew he was so hurt, he was going to die from his wounds.

And in that moment, I made a split decision and I offered him a mercy killing.

pulled out my dagger. Before he could realize what was happening, I slashed his throat. I let him bleed out. The same way I would have slashed the throat of a hog or cut off the head of a chicken.

At that point, he was a problem for the rest of us.

and I sacrificed his life so that more could live.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (15:10.535)
We fought day and night. I'm going up and down the walls, making sure that the men had whatever little ammunition that we had left, cheering them on, inspiring them, fighting, healing, doing whatever it took.

I was not afraid of being a spy. Sometimes I dressed like a man and I would get into the quarters of the enemies to get intelligence. Other times, like I said, I knew what they wanted. I knew they were attracted to my physical beauty and I used that as well as a distraction for the enemy. And I use that to inspire the men who were fighting on our side as well.

Adesoji Iginla (15:47.694)
You

Adesoji Iginla (15:59.5)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (16:00.569)
I used everything that I was given. Eventually, we knew that their ranks were being decimated.

from our fighting and also from disease. And my husband and I, we plotted an exit. We could not stay hemmed in there, even though we knew that we were weakening our enemies. And we charted a path and we were able to make our way through.

that thong of soldiers. Armed to their teeth, Napoleon was so sure that he could wipe us out, but never underestimate the power.

Adesoji Iginla (16:43.822)
seats.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (16:54.467)
in the heart of a people unified in their quest for their liberation. We were willing to lay it all down, but we were not going to lay down without a fight. And we were able to break through their ranks.

and about history says 350 to 500 of our people survived and we got through. And with our troops coming in on one end and the British troops coming in on the other end and a weary beat down decimated French army in the middle, they knew they had to surrender.

And if they came our way, we were going to massacre every single one of them. We were not taking any prisoners. They had to die. And so they chose to surrender to the British. And we claimed our independence.

Adesoji Iginla (17:49.806)
Mmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (18:04.397)
Unfortunately, our struggle wasn't quite done.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (18:11.471)
this notion of divide and conquer.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (18:16.643)
This idea of keeping us fighting amongst ourselves ultimately led to my husband being ambushed and killed by some of our

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (18:32.267)
I fought on in other ways. Some say at one point I was a paramour for dis-selling it, dis-selling, dis-selling.

Adesoji Iginla (18:42.274)
John Jacques de Salis.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (18:45.891)
I did later marry again. My husband did have property, LaMonteir, and I eventually retired back to where he had property as a young widow. And some say that is where I lived out the rest of my life. But I'll tell you what, what never died.

Even if most historians failed to acknowledge the role of women, even as they wrote about the heroics of the men, what never died in the hearts of our people were the stories of the women, women such as me, and there were others as well. And so today, in some parts of Haiti,

Adesoji Iginla (19:11.427)
the question.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (19:39.535)
When a woman is fearless and afraid of nothing, you will hear this, tanku yon marijan. She is like a marijan. Or if she's a woman of courage, the expression may go, yon fan vayan.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (20:00.631)
And so like the woman who came before me, I carried on.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (20:08.526)
our tradition.

of knowing that we are not the lesser sex?

We are not an inferior gender.

We are not incapable of fighting for our own freedom.

that we have the ability to put our minds to whatever we so choose.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (20:37.165)
and to build the communities and the societies in which we want to live.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (20:49.979)
and though history would try to ride us out like another one of our daughters on the other shore in the Americas, the United States of America, Maya Angelou would say, and still I rise. And so in 1954, I was recognized during the 150th anniversary of this battle at Crete.

at Perot and there was actually a stamp that was created that featured me and my husband. He in military regalia and I, I guess more as a vixen and not as a warrior in that sense and that is okay because again,

Adesoji Iginla (21:20.91)
Piero.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (21:45.358)
My story is that we will fight in every fashion and form. And yes, sometimes I fought wearing so-called military regalia, and other times I fought in a mamook, and other times I fought in whatever ways that I could. In 2004, another one of my sisters was recognized, and she was named a national heroine. And maybe one day we will talk about her too.

Belair, I was not given that recognition, but that is unimportant because it's not about titles.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (22:30.009)
It's not about whether white men or even black men choose to acknowledge who we are as African women. It is about us knowing ourselves and choosing to live up to our full potential in every sense of the word. And so to my...

Daughters and my granddaughters and my great granddaughters and my great great granddaughters all know the ones who are not born yet

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (23:05.499)
one of the messages that I would leave.

with you is.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (23:15.075)
like all your foremothers have done before you.

You use everything at your disposal. You use your intelligence. You make your body strong. I was strong. I was fit. I was a warrior.

I can cook. I can feed my people.

I was a manager. I could manage our resources.

could have the babies and nurture the babies and I could comfort and heal and I could fight and I could be a wife and I could be a lover and I could be a spy.

Adesoji Iginla (23:52.974)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (24:05.285)
could be everything at the same time as the circumstances required.

And that is who you must be in this day and age with whatever challenges that you have, but understanding that we must be unified and that we must not allow ourselves to be divided because to be divided is to be common.

Adesoji Iginla (24:34.222)
Speaking of unity, yeah, she had a unifying presence, not least the fact that she led the army at the Créte-à-Pioreau, the battle. The question is, what was it like being a inverted commas mulatto who was supposed to blend an army of black and

mixed blood soldiers. How was she able to manage it?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (25:12.069)
think being of mixed blood actually gave me an advantage in the sense that...

for both the mulattoes who would have thought I would just use my privilege as a mulatto and for my African brothers and sisters who had not yet had their blood, may I say polluted, to see me in that role made them have to stop and think.

She must really believe in this unity because I could have served the French soldiers. They certainly desired me.

I gave up that quote unquote privilege, that opportunity, and that spoke to my commitment. And so I was leading by example for the mulattoes to understand that they needed to move differently. But then for my quote unquote, and I hate to use these terms because even these terms are us buying into this notion of difference, but for my

brothers and sisters who were quote unquote pure blood Africans, they too had to look at me and say, if she's fighting with us, then we can trust her. And so in that role, I was really able to bring both sides together in a way that perhaps a true blood African woman would not have been able to do so.

Adesoji Iginla (26:54.892)
Hmm. Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (26:55.843)
I think that for the Frenchmen who attempted to conquer us during that battle. Who could clearly see me? You see my red head scarf and I made myself conspicuous. I think that initially they were dazed, they were surprised and that's all we needed was that moment of them going, what is going on? Because I was a sight to behold. I had long flowing black hair.

Adesoji Iginla (27:22.414)
Mmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (27:26.509)
in this very feminine and attractive body.

And momentarily, they were confused. And that gave us the advantage.

Adesoji Iginla (27:40.91)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (27:41.488)
But it was really knowing my history, knowing that there was no real freedom in embracing my white father who really did not see me as equal and that my true freedom was with my people, regardless of how I look.

Adesoji Iginla (28:02.978)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (28:07.291)
And those are lessons from my mother and my aunties and the mixed blood people who still had a connection to who we are and who understood again that our freedom will never come from the white man.

Adesoji Iginla (28:23.928)
So Napoleon came back March 1802 in a bid to re-seize Saint Dominic then, which ultimately became Haiti.

What would you say was the driving motivation? Was he economic? Was he militarily? Or was it his ego which was at play? I mean it could be a mix of all three.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (28:52.431)
You know, the white man has a God complex. So depraved in mind and body and spirit, yes, that's what I believe. That they cannot conceive of a world where they do their own work and they just live and let others live. And so Napoleon had an idea of having this huge empire, yes, that allowed him to show his military might.

Adesoji Iginla (28:57.286)
You

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (29:20.847)
but also provided never-ending source of wealth to him and really a small group of people because most French people were not living well either. So whether you talk about St. Domingo, which is now known as Haiti, all the way to Louisiana in America, United States of America, remember it was after the Haitian Revolution.

Adesoji Iginla (29:49.473)
Evolution.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (29:50.651)
after we showed the world.

that a determined band of Africans could take out the most well-equipped army in the world. Although some would say that Nani had also kind of paved the way for this because her fights in the Maroons preceded ours and there were some communication.

I think that he had this idea of this whole empire and it was going to be fed by the bodies and the blood and sweat of black people. And he could not conceive of giving up this territory. He could not conceive of the ridicule from other powers by being defeated by this ragtag group of

Adesoji Iginla (30:50.594)
You

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (30:54.623)
savage Africans. And so, yes, he did everything he could. Of course, we know that they tricked Toussaint Louverture and ended up imprisoning him in France. And they also carried out many ambushes to kill off other generals in Haiti.

Adesoji Iginla (31:11.672)
fronts.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (31:21.883)
The idea being if you cut off the head, then the people scatter and then they're easier to control. And they've continued by the way to carry out those same kind of ideas all across the world. On the continent of Africa, every time you have a leader rise up, what do they do? They cut off that leader's head so that the people are scattered.

Adesoji Iginla (31:25.75)
The body can.

Adesoji Iginla (31:38.326)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (31:49.946)
They did it in the United States of America with the civil rights movement as well. We must know and learn from history. We cannot have one head. But at any rate, that I believe was partly what motivated him. What do your studies tell you about his motivation?

Adesoji Iginla (32:11.822)
So at that time Haiti or Saint-Dominic was the most profitable slave colony in the Western Hemisphere. It made riches that made the eyes water. And you made mention of the fact that the British provided weapons in order for you to defeat the French. That was also their motivation. They wanted that

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (32:40.889)
Yes.

Adesoji Iginla (32:41.506)
They wanted a piece of real estate in the Western Hemisphere. shall I say that that plot continues to play out even up to today. Haiti provides some sort of motivation for greed in the Western Hemisphere. Not least because it's the only black nation that claimed its own independence.

without it being offered. It took it. So that in itself is one of the reasons why Haiti is the way it is today. It's destabilization effort from the outside. So that's what my notes say. Speaking of, you made mention earlier that... Gone.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (33:33.732)
Can I add something to that? Because the reason that I will come to share my story and to speak is not because I necessarily need adulation, but again, it's the lessons that must be learned. And so there is another son of Africa who lived long after I was gone, who has been known to say,

that Africa has no friends. I think you all know him as a man called John Henry Clark. Every time they offer us some kind of assistance, there's always an ulterior motive. We must be clear about this. We must know that we have to do for ourselves. They come in always with an ulterior motive.

Adesoji Iginla (34:09.144)
John Henry Clark, yes?

Adesoji Iginla (34:22.862)
Mmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (34:32.567)
So the guns, the muskets that we had, we got from them as well. So that we could get rid of one group, but then be beholden to another group. And so when you look at the continent of Africa today, and you see how black people, we're not now talking about mixed blood versus pure blood. We're talking about

Adesoji Iginla (34:45.624)
to another group, yeah?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (35:00.869)
brothers and sisters who are indistinguishable if you see them side by side, fighting and decimating each other just like the Molatos and the Africans decimated themselves in the War of Knives. When you see us fighting and killing ourselves on the continent, this one side armed by Russia, this side armed by France, this side armed by

Adesoji Iginla (35:06.83)
Yeah.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (35:29.455)
the Americans, this site, you have to understand that the goal is still to dominate us. And after you killed your brother and your sister and your mother, even if you stand, you are in a weakened position because now they come after you and you no longer have your brother and your sister and your mother and your father to fight side by side with you.

So we must be very smart, even if you use their weapons.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (36:07.077)
to defeat one group. We must be looking for how we create our own weapons and we stay together so we can defeat all the groups. But never to acquiesce to think that any of them mean us good. That has to be a lesson that we learn.

Adesoji Iginla (36:28.728)
It reminds me of story of Jiajia Vukubo.

You

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (36:35.819)
See, I'm so glad you brought that up because again as we study this to know ourselves is to also know our enemies and how their playbook has actually been the same. So here you just brought up King Jaja Wopobo. What did he do? And by the way, let me just show you this if you can see this book and I'll reference all the books later.

Adesoji Iginla (36:51.138)
the same.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (37:06.637)
she's wearing the regalia really of the British sorry the French

Adesoji Iginla (37:12.972)
friendship.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (37:14.767)
King Jaja of Opobo also has pictures where he was wearing the regalia of the British and he had a sword that had been given to him by the Queen of England that he was so proud of. And he got that sword because when the British went to war with their shanty and could not defeat their shanty in Ghana, the area now called Ghana, they recruited

Adesoji Iginla (37:28.312)
when we

Adesoji Iginla (37:36.384)
in Ghana.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (37:45.404)
African leaders to provide African troops to join the British army to fight the Ashanti. Now once they defeated the Ashanti, they gave out little trinkets to these African leaders and told them, we are together, we will protect you. Protect you from whom? From themselves?

And so they come back when King Jaja decided to assert his sovereignty. And they said, no, no, no, no, no. We control you and everything. And when he refused to bow down, they pointed cannons and massive guns from their boats at the island of Opobo. And they said,

You better come onto this boat and meet with us or we will blast your entire people to smithereens. And it wasn't an idle threat because they had done it before. And so he gets on a boat with them and they deport him from his own land. Even as the orangutan, felon in chief in the United States of America is deporting Mexicans.

Adesoji Iginla (38:57.059)
Yes.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (39:14.207)
from land that was their land. They deport him and they take him where? They take him to Ghana, the land of the Ashanti, to have a court where he really has no voice. And since they had conquered the Ashanti with his help, who was there then to stand up for him? Nobody.

Adesoji Iginla (39:39.91)
Hmm

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (39:42.638)
And they tried and convicted him and banished him not just from Opobo, but from the entire continent of Africa and furthermore determined that neither he nor any of his bloodline could again rule the kingdom of Opobo. And they were successful for a time anyway, because we Africans

had banded with them to weaken one another, and now we could not fight them. When will we learn this history? When will we learn the playbook and adjust accordingly? So in the United States of America, I hear you all are catching the proverbial hell as black people. Because some of you

Adesoji Iginla (40:28.334)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (40:40.933)
could not get over the so-called mulatto called Kamala Harris. You questioned, you questioned.

Adesoji Iginla (40:49.1)
Mm, parallels of history.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (40:55.663)
her authenticity as a black person. You disparaged her for being born in the body she was born in with a vagina as opposed to a penis.

Adesoji Iginla (41:11.34)
where she was born.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (41:13.913)
And you decided.

to throw in your lot.

with whom you should have known was a sworn enemy. Some of you decided to sit it out altogether. And now everybody is catching the hell. When will we learn? Now what was your question?

Adesoji Iginla (41:40.75)
Parallels of history. We have to understand, I mean, I'm going to ask my question.

Adesoji Iginla (41:51.534)
Mary Jean was not a ghost nor a myth.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (41:56.408)
No, I was a full-blood living human being, yes.

Adesoji Iginla (42:00.654)
Okay, so that is rest assured. Now in terms of our historical figures, why is it that history has found a way either due to our own complicity or the fact that we're completely ignorant of the fact

Adesoji Iginla (42:23.68)
of putting their stories before us so that we can learn. I mean, if we had a story like this pointing out the obvious playbook to people that look like you and I, maybe the United States, the people of United States will not be in the F around and find out phase of their existence. I mean, it's no

nothing to be joyful about. It's sad that all of a sudden people that should be fighting for their own interest are actually voting against those interests that matters to them. So the question then is what can we do to move from that point of

so-called self-imposed ignorance.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (43:32.677)
think it's important not to underestimate the enemy, underestimate the depths of their greed, the depravity of their hearts, and the extent to which they would go to gain and maintain power.

Adesoji Iginla (43:41.25)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (43:50.766)
our ignorance, though we can to some degree argue is willful, has also been very carefully orchestrated.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (44:06.843)
Remember the African proverb that until the lion starts to write, the history of the hunt will always be told from the perspective of the hunter.

Adesoji Iginla (44:16.524)
Lurify the hunter. Yep.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (44:21.217)
Even the books that are now being written about me and about so many other women of African descent are not even being written by us. But we have definitely been languishing in obscurity for so long.

If you can keep people ignorant of who they are, as another one of my sons, Carter G. Woodson said, once you can control their mind, then you control everything else about them. And the biggest battle is really the battle of the mind. What do we do? What must we do? We must go back to where we educated ourselves.

Adesoji Iginla (44:57.262)
Mmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (45:05.753)
I believe it was another one of my sons, Malcolm X, who admonished us for being the only people who take our children and deliver them to our enemies to educate them. What do you think will happen? And so in this Americas, we were taught to disparage our history and to disparage our heritage and to disparage our spiritual ways of knowing.

Adesoji Iginla (45:11.47)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (45:33.517)
and to embrace Catholicism, embrace being protestants, to embrace everything else but who we were. Because then your allegiance is to everything else but who you are. And then you're easier to control.

So all over Africa today in Christian homes, you will see the image of you want to call me a myth? What is the proof that Jesus walked this earth in the way that he's written about? But a picture that someone drew of him, whom I understand was they used their cousin or someone from a jail and came up with this image. And now black people put that image across their homes.

Adesoji Iginla (45:55.649)
V-

Adesoji Iginla (46:03.852)
Mmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (46:20.419)
and cannot rise up against the white man because they really see the white man as God.

So when you talk about the ignorance that has us fighting against our own interests, it is that same ignorance that had quote unquote mulattos fighting against Africans. It is that same ignorance that upholds the patriarchy within black

African, whatever name you want to call us within our own homes. And so if we are under siege, if your home is under siege and half the occupants of that home decide to tie up half the occupants in that home.

Adesoji Iginla (47:18.158)
I see where you're going.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (47:23.747)
Are you not setting yourself up to be more easily conquered?

We must re-educate ourselves. It starts with what you're doing.

We must, like my mother whispered in my ear and sang songs to me late at night as I nursed at her breast, we must do the same for our children. We must unearth the stories of all of our warriors, male and female. We must come against the narrative that Black women, African women have the luxury

to be as ineffective as some white women have been historically.

Adesoji Iginla (48:15.308)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (48:17.101)
So when my son CLR James writes so eloquently in the Black Jacobins but chooses to leave me out, I thank him for telling the story that he did tell, but I encourage us to continue to do the work.

Adesoji Iginla (48:22.318)
chips.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (48:46.883)
to fill in the gaps. Those gaps are our shortfall. Those gaps keep us weak. Those gaps keep us from being able to truly gain our liberation across the globe.

Adesoji Iginla (49:08.952)
So as we begin to wrap up.

There is one storyline that runs through the story of Marie-Jeanne Lamartier. And that is one of asserting one's independence, asserting your voice, asserting your presence. But most importantly,

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (49:19.067)
Thank

Adesoji Iginla (49:44.97)
making sure that you don't act small when history calls you to because if we're to take strength from what she did in the the fort

It's important that us as a body, men, women, children, today looking back at history, not just at her, but a series of women around the world, some of which we will be talking about later.

What would you say they should take as an abiding lesson from your life?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (50:49.43)
say.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (50:56.965)
Freedom will never be given, it must be taken.

Adesoji Iginla (51:02.318)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (51:04.055)
What you cannot defend, you do not really own. And that includes your own body. That includes your children, your land.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (51:20.739)
What I would say is...

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (51:25.785)
We do not have the lux ring.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (51:30.427)
to be individualistic. Listen, I was in my 20s.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (51:44.217)
when history recorded some of my most valiant acts. I was a young woman. And I was a young woman who...

had options. I could have lived fairly well as a mistress of the many French men who desired me. As a matter of fact, some mulattoes were taken to France and were kept women.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (52:25.143)
I could have continued to fight with my husband for the French.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (52:33.717)
with the idea of riches that would come when we had quelled the cry for freedom in the hearts of my darker-skinned brothers and sisters.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (52:51.183)
But again.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (52:54.999)
I understood like another one of my sons who lived in the United States of America whose head got cut off.

Martin Luther King Jr. would say injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere.

Adesoji Iginla (53:08.233)
and justice everywhere.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (53:11.939)
And so we do not have the luxury of thinking of ourselves as individuals, of just charting a course that allows us to, as individuals, be relatively comfortable compared to the masses of black and, and I'm going to use this interchangeably, African people. And only for those who still have a hard time calling themselves African.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (53:41.998)
We must all be in this fight together because there is no liberation for one of us if we're not all liberated. And so what I would say to my people is whatever opportunity you have to learn a skill

Take it, learn it, get excellent at it, and put everything in you to work for your liberation. And I would also say this.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (54:25.999)
Don't ever underestimate yourself. Don't ever underestimate your power to bring about a difference. Because I know that I was a change maker, if you will, on the walls of that fort, encouraging our men and our women not to despair. Yes, 12,000 of the best army in the world at the time coming out.

after a handful of us, so many lying dead and dying.

We don't ever give up. And if we don't ever give up, we win.

Adesoji Iginla (55:10.478)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (55:13.167)
Don't ever give up. Learn everything you can, put everything you can towards your liberation and don't ever give up. IT might be where it is today, but that heartbeat for freedom, it's not dead. And whether it takes 10 years, a hundred years, a thousand years, we will be free.

Adesoji Iginla (55:14.99)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (55:44.436)
And let me tell you who is convinced of this, even when we're not. Our enemies are. That is why they are unrelenting in their assaults on us. If they thought we were truly vanquished people.

They would just go about their lives. But they better than us understand our strength. They know our history, some of them, the ones at the top, they know our history. They know the character of who we are better than we do. And they have to keep us ignorant of ourselves.

But the fact that they keep coming at us is because they know.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (56:35.437)
They are in trouble should we ever come together.

Adesoji Iginla (56:40.974)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (56:43.673)
So I do want to, for those who want to learn a little bit more about me, there some books coming out, but there's so much more that needs to be written and shared. This is one called The Shiro's of the Haitian Revolution.

Adesoji Iginla (56:56.95)
evolution.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (56:59.225)
I would like to say that this one was put together by some of my children.

There's one of them here.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (57:15.429)
here a couple more. I need to see more of us researching and writing. And here's another one, The Valiant Women, The Haitian Revolution. So any men who are editing and republishing some of the older books about Haitian Revolution need to go back and rewrite and add in chapters on what we women did. And here's one by Philip Thomas Tucker. This is actually volume two.

Adesoji Iginla (57:17.102)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (57:44.89)
because the first one focuses on my sister Belair, the Haitian Revolutionary Women's Series, and this one is on me, my regime, inspirational freedom fighter and heroine of the Haitian Revolution. Now he does take a lot of liberties in here and he stretches out stories because he couldn't find as much, I guess, but you don't have to make up anything about me, my life and...

Adesoji Iginla (58:08.226)
Yes.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (58:14.127)
what I accomplished speak for itself. I do want to point out something that he did share in this book though. And this is about

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (58:28.151)
understanding your lineage. And so in this area now called Aiti, there were an indigenous people who lived there before the Africans were brought there. They were known as the Taíno. And there was a woman who was called Anakaona. And she was a healer. She was a priestess.

Adesoji Iginla (58:40.472)
TINOS

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (58:57.951)
and she was a queen and she protected her people to the best of her ability and she passed on some of their spiritual ways and their ways of healing with the plants in their environment and that was passed on to some of the African women who came and that was passed on to me.

from my mother and my aunties. And we used all of that knowledge and we drew inspiration from her as well. We women as we fought. So both men and women study everybody, but also study the women because we have a lot to share.

Adesoji Iginla (59:51.566)
And also it's important to also put this into context. When the French Revolution happened, it was the common man on the streets deciding the royal classes, the high echelon, the elite of society had to be gotten rid of. When the American Revolution happened, it was them kicking out the British. When the Haitian Revolution happened,

They did two things. One was equality and also the abolishment of slavery. So in itself, that is a very unique aspect of the Haitian Revolution that needs to be studied. Because you had various people fighting together for the commonality of humanity.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:00:22.233)
Yes.

slavery. Yes.

Adesoji Iginla (01:00:46.978)
Just think about that. We're talking exactly. So this is why this sister story is very, very important. That not only were they fighting for freedom, but you had women championing that cause for freedom. And I repeat, women championing that cause for freedom.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:00:48.389)
which is why they're still so threatened.

By us, yes.

Adesoji Iginla (01:01:17.422)
Like you said earlier, most of the women in the other revolutions were seen as...

spectators they actually and I'm talking about the Haitians here they actually inserted themselves into the fight that this is not just about you it's about us so if us is everyone it's time that we all put hands together bring up the stories stories are actually very liberating which brings me to the

the quote from another African brother, Ngugiwa Fiongo, who says the story that you tell yourselves are what makes you. So if you tell yourself denigrating stories, guess what's gonna happen?

Adesoji Iginla (01:02:13.708)
So.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:02:13.819)
What we take in into our ears and our eyes absolutely impacts the actions that we take. And so, yes, the music you listen to, yes, the shows that you watch, yes, the books that you read. You know, I have to say this because I understand that maybe last week you talked about one of my daughters, Septima Clark, and you know her mother.

was raised in Haiti.

Adesoji Iginla (01:02:45.389)
Hmm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:02:47.277)
We are so connected in so many ways. As a matter of fact, many of the slave revolts that occurred in the United States of America were inspired by the Haitian revolution. And when we talk about even the independence movements on the continent of Africa, again, independent nation that fought for their independence. We're not talking about Ethiopia that never lost its independence.

Adesoji Iginla (01:02:59.47)
revolution.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:03:16.803)
It was Haiti. We were the inspiration. We must continue to tell those stories so that we don't forget. And that in those times when we are weary in spirit, where it looks like all hope is gone, we can remember what we've done before and we can know that we can do it again and we can do it even better because we are learning from the past because our enemies study.

and they do make changes, make adjustments based on what they've already learned from us. My understanding is that some of the people in the Orangutan's administration actually wrote dissertations and studied us.

Adesoji Iginla (01:03:50.593)
Hmm

Adesoji Iginla (01:04:07.318)
Hmm. Yep.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:04:08.557)
We must study ourselves. We must see how they've moved against us before. We must learn from what we accomplished and then we must make adjustments.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:04:23.333)
for our liberation.

Adesoji Iginla (01:04:25.516)
Yes. Speaking of adjustments, would you like to tell us who we'll be looking at next week?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:04:34.253)
No, I'll leave that honor to you. But, you want to hear from this woman because I guarantee you actually, I would like to see in your chat how many people have heard of this woman before that were, what, first of all, how many of you had heard of me? Let us know in the chat. And if you hadn't heard of me, then I know you're going to share this session with.

Adesoji Iginla (01:04:37.036)
So next week we'll be looking at, yes.

Adesoji Iginla (01:04:52.238)
Mm.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:05:02.043)
everybody that you know, because they should know about me, shouldn't they? And then I also want to know for the person you're going to announce, how many of you have heard of her? So who are we going to talk about next week?

Adesoji Iginla (01:05:06.305)
They should.

Adesoji Iginla (01:05:14.412)
So next week we're going into the great island, the great country of the Samba. The sister's name is Aquitaine Egodindo Mohamedou da Silva da Santos.

I repeat, aqua teen, ego dindu, marmoid, da silver, da santas. I will leave you till next week for you to find out what makes her who she is and why she is on next week's rotation. Until next week.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:05:57.999)
And you might have to learn Portuguese to learn more about her.

Adesoji Iginla (01:06:01.428)
Yes. Yes. Because I've seen some of the books and I'm like, okay, my Portuguese will have to have to sharpen my Portuguese. And as I say, until next week, sister.

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:06:05.083)
you

Adesoji Iginla (01:06:19.425)
Marie Jean?

Aya Fubara Eneli, Esq. (01:06:22.927)
Yes, indeed, because I am her daughter. Yes. Thank you for the opportunity.

Adesoji Iginla (01:06:29.44)
And from me, it is good night and see you all next week. And good night.