Dr. Samantha Kesteloot Shares Her Hearing Loss Journey

Join me for an inspirational interview with Dr. Samantha Kesteloot as she shares her experience growing up as a twin in the public school system in Michigan with bilateral hearing loss.  Samantha’s hearing journey led her down the path of educational audiology.  Dr. Samantha Kesteloot is now an educational audiologist with Trenton's Oral Program for the Deaf/ Hard of Hearing in Trenton, Michigan. She graduated from Wayne State University's Audiology program in 2020 after completing her externship at the Central Institute for the Deaf in St. Louis, Missouri. Her hearing loss was identified at the age of 4 after which she was fit with bilateral hearing aids. In 2017 Sam decided to be implanted with a hybrid cochlear implant at Vanderbilt University. She enjoys spending time with her friends, traveling and staying involved with professional volunteer activities as well as those for kids/ families with hearing loss. 

For more information about Dr. Carrie Spangler- check out her LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/carrie-spangler/

For transcripts of this episode- visit the podcast website at: https://empowearaudiology.buzzsprout.com

Transcript

[00:00:00] Announcer: Welcome to Episode 28 of empowEAR Audiology with Dr. Carrie Spangler.
[00:00:17] Carrie: Welcome to the empowEAR Audiology Podcast, which is part of the 3C Digital Media Network. My name is Dr. Carrie Spangler, and I am your host. I am a passionate audiologist with a lifelong journey of living with hearing challenges in this vibrant hearing world. This podcast is for professionals, parents, individuals with hearing challenges and those who want to be inspired.
[00:00:46] Thank you for listening, and I hope you will subscribe, invite others to listen and leave me a positive review. I also wanted to invite all of you to visit and engage in the conversation on the empowEAR Audiology Facebook group. Transcripts for each episode can be found at www dot 3, the number three, C digital media network dot com under the empowEAR podcast tab.
[00:01:19] Now let's get started with today's episode. Ah, well, good morning everyone. My name is Dr. Carrie Spangler and welcome to the empowerEAR audiology podcast. I am really excited to have this guest today, Dr. Samantha Kesteloot with me and she is currently a full time educational audiologist that Trenton.
[00:01:42] Um, oral program for deaf and hard of hearing in Detroit, Michigan. She graduated from Wayne state university with her AUD, and then prior to completing her AUD, she worked as an audiology assistant for four years. Gaining multiple experiences, working with children who are deaf and hard of hearing.
[00:02:01] Samantha also dedicates her time and talents through volunteer. She has been active. She was active in a doctoral program with a student academy of audiology. She's active with a teen program in Michigan. She's active with Michigan's EHDI family matters conference. She's been active with summer camps for children who are deaf and hard of hearing.
[00:02:25] And she also volunteers with the educational audiology association, Samantha is both a personal and professional journey to share with all of us today. So thank you for joining. 
[00:02:37] Samantha: Thank you for having me. I'm really excited to be on this podcast and, um, just talk about everything and share my journey and, um, yeah.
[00:02:49] Carrie: I always like to ask my guests how we met and that we kind of have a longer history. 
[00:02:56] Samantha: Yeah, well, I think so. I know when I was in Lapeer and I had audiology assistant with Kate Salathiel, we drove down to. Um, oh, gosh, I want to say, is it stuck or where were you at 
[00:03:11] Carrie: Stark county educational service center?
[00:03:13] Samantha: Yes. And then we, we went, we met, we went and got lunch with like some, uh, like Asian place, hibachi place. And then, um, cause we were trying to figure out different ways to accommodate, um, my, having my hearing loss and providing the services for kids and Kate had known of you, I think just from working in the field.
[00:03:32] And so we set up. And we got some good ideas. Um, and that's, that's how I remember meeting you. That's 
[00:03:39] Carrie: how I remember meeting you too. It was, and that was a long time ago because county, but a long time, 
[00:03:48] Samantha: that's probably eight years ago, at least because I mean, in between that time, I had my first year as an audiology assistant and that was out for.
[00:03:56] And then I got my doctorate and that was another four years. I mean, there's a little bit of overlap, so maybe six years, but yeah. Then 
[00:04:04] Carrie: in high school, 
[00:04:07] Samantha: no, I don't think so. No, I was, um, uh, I was definitely grad because I had just graduated from UGA in 2012 ish. So, um, I think, I don't remember being in high school and meeting you.
[00:04:22] Okay. 
[00:04:22] Okay. 
[00:04:23] Carrie: But I know it was at least six. It was probably at least 10 years ago. I mean time flies. So it was a long time ago and you guys had a great little road trip from Michigan and I got to meet you for the first time. So it was great to meet you. And I was so excited. To see someone else with a journey like mine going into the field of audiology.
[00:04:50] So it was a great connection from 
[00:04:52] Samantha: the beginning. I experienced this definitely like kinda, I don't wanna say mimic each other, but they're very, very similar. So that is at its cool to be able to be here on the podcast. But I feel just to work with you and have you as a colleague. 
[00:05:05] Carrie: Yeah. So Samantha, can you just, well, back up a little bit, and could you share a little about your own childhood journey and growing up and your diagnosis and amplification journey and school, things like that.
[00:05:21] Samantha: Absolutely. Um, so I'm actually an identical twin and my sister and I were born, um, pretty poor. We were very premature with three months early. Um, and so, uh, we were given, uh, this ototoxic drug called gentamicin to, um, keep us from going septic basically. Uh, and so that was sort of the cause that they definitely believe that the cause of my hearing loss, but, um, so then I was late identified.
[00:05:49] But when we go, when you're going to preschool, you get the hearing screenings done. And so, um, that's when I, they caught my hearing loss then, so I dropped three and a half to four years old when I was diagnosed and fit with, um, hearing loss. I'm sorry, hearing aids. Um, so I had bilateral, um, like normal.
[00:06:07] Precipitously sloping to profound, um, sensorineural hearing loss. So I had the good, low pitching and then almost like nothing in the highs. Um, and so, yeah, I wear hearing aids my entire life growing up until about, uh, well, 2017. So about five years ago, I got my, um, I got a cochlear implant in my left ear. So, um, it's kind of a, I have a hybrid, so it's a shorter electrode, array that will, um, like replaces the highs.
[00:06:35] And then I have a hearing aid portion for, um, my lower frequencies. Um, so that's kind of my, you know, my device usage and my diagnosis there. Um, in school, I received services from educational audiologist and teacher consultants, uh, for the deaf and hard of hearing. Um, I think I saw education, the educational audiologist about once a year, just for updated testing and then the TC, like once to twice a month.
[00:07:02] Um, and then that tapered off as I got older, um, when there wasn't as much of a need for, um, TC services. Uh, um, but I definitely, um, Hm. I don't know where to stay. I usually FM system that you've preferential seating, um, captured if they were available note-takers in college. Um, and those types of things, um, let's see.
[00:07:30] So those are the kind of the technical things. Um, what it's like emotionally in school too. Um, I definitely think that, um, there were lower expectations of students who had hearing loss. Um, but I, my, I had an identical twin. My parents always made, like, expecting me to do this. Like. on Target with her. And, um, so I think that that was a huge reason why I, a quote, unquote, successful person with hearing loss.
[00:07:58] I think that everybody can, but, um, you know, just in terms of kind of shadowing those lower expectations for kids, with Hearing loss, at least in my district and in my experience from what that seemed like, um, my mom was also really involved. Um, once she was. You know that I needed services and those kinds of things, she really fought for me to get the most.
[00:08:20] And so I, um, uh, I was actually, uh, put into a special education classroom, like preschool And then, um, then it was mainstream from kindergarten onward. Um, in high school, I, uh, you know, I was, I wasn't, I was a cheerleader. I just didn't count. So I was in class council, so I took on a lot of leadership roles and, um, those kinds of things.
[00:08:44] So I was also. You know, very involved. And that is, I think, a stereotype that a lot of people with hearing loss get, I thought you can't be a leader. You can't be involved in sports and, um, those kinds of things, but you just have to find a way around that. Um, and, and, you know, kind of accommodate for what you need.
[00:09:07] Carrie: What about friends? How was that? Did you tell you them about your hearing loss 
[00:09:14] Samantha: that. I've always been like a social butterfly. Um, but I feel like a lot of that, a lot of hours. Um, yeah, because, uh, growing up with hearing loss, I get pretty isolated. So I think that like you would just kind of, I would just kind of get to know anybody that I could get to know.
[00:09:32] And I mean, maybe it wasn't like the deepest relationship or whatever, but, um, I knew a lot of people, um, cause I really wanted to like try to fit in and all of those things. Um, but. I think socially, I had a lot of reliance on my twin sister, uh, to like interpret situations and those kinds of things. And then, um, sometimes I could just come to the point where you just can't keep up.
[00:09:55] And so you just sort of like retract back. Um, but I definitely think that that is something that. Always kind of been a problem. I just have a feeling of isolation and a left outness. Um, I don't know. I don't know if it's a problem, but I mean, it was always like a struggle or something that, um, just stopped.
[00:10:16] I, somebody who like I'm, my nature is very social. Like to feel like I couldn't be. Um, so I want it to be with always like, 
[00:10:25] Carrie: Yeah. Yeah, no, I could relate a hundred percent to that as well, because I feel like I was always the 
[00:10:33] Samantha: social butterfly. Definitely. Um, yeah, it's just something that always just will always carry through, but I definitely feel like I'm getting my implant has helped me like realize that and like be able to be that person we want it to be.
[00:10:48] So that's kind of like cool that the technology is able to do that. Um, and then I had the option, an opportunity to do that. 
[00:10:57] Carrie: Right. So your next, I guess, um, a step after high school was applying to college. And so how did that go? And, and how did you pick a major. 
[00:11:11] Samantha: Oh, gosh. Um, okay. So in high school, I always like, I, um, I first wanted to go into fashion, but then I quickly realized that that wasn't for me and my teacher consultant.
[00:11:23] So I actually, my teachers consultant from elementary school who her name is Shannon Williams and she, I mean, Uh, like give her so much credit for, um, the self-advocacy skills that I have and just like everything. Um, she just did so much for me when I was young and struggling and everything like that.
[00:11:42] Um, but I came full circle because when I was a senior in high school, she came into my district. And so she was like, why don't you do. Uh, junior, I should say, uh, why don't you work with kids who have hearing loss? And then that just was like, duh. And so ever since high school, I've always knew that I wanted to work with kids who had hearing loss.
[00:12:00] And, um, initially I was like, oh, I'll be like a psychologist or a therapist who works with, um, kids with hearing loss. I drive away and I. I actually started a CMSD at the University of Georgia, sorry. That's communication, sciences and disorders. Um, but I really, really struggled with anatomy and I had to take it like two incompletes and, uh, in that class and my brain just wasn't or just wasn't working for me.
[00:12:27] So then I looked, I just went for my psych. My bachelor's in psych, uh, thinking that I would, you know, go through that whole path and become a therapist for kids, with hearing loss, um, that get it like entirely pan out. I ended up moving back to Michigan and then that's when I became the, um, my, I got my educational, um, audiologist assistant role, but in terms of applying for college and all of that, um, I mean, there was a lot of guidance from the school, you know, there are all those like matching programs and, uh, That's how it was so long ago.
[00:13:03] I'm, I'm going to really think about that. Um, I will say like applying for disability services, um, my  my mom took a lot of like, kind of control over that. I feel like, um, the transition part between high school and beyond. So kids with kids  hearing loss is really just, um, I don't want to say a place where we're failing, but I kind of think it's the place where we're failing.
[00:13:25] Those are like, um, So many things that children just are not getting about, like the transition to adulthood or applying for college and like, um, I don't, I don't think it's anybody's fault necessarily, but those, um, there's just so much it happens. But in that transition, I don't think our kids are prepared for, um, I feel for me, I would say like, I didn't, I wasn't even, I mean, I work in the.
[00:13:53] And the industry now, I wasn't prepared to buy my first pair of hearing aids that I wasn't prepared to. Um, you know, disclose my hearing loss when I was, but I mean, just closing your disability to, uh, future employers, you know, all those kinds of things. Um, I think just kind of, I don't, they just don't really click and I don't know if it's because we are talking to teenagers or, um, just, you know, how we're trying to reach them.
[00:14:21] Um, but that transition to adulthood, I think because I had a very strong support system. Wasn't as hard as that is first from others, especially from other people. And then I got, I mean, I had all kinds of accommodations at UGA, but they gave me an FM system that was pretty old, like 1980s style. Um, so that was terrible, but I ended up kind of being pretty vocal about that.
[00:14:47] And, um, we were able to get like brand new FM systems for the university, by the time I graduated. So that was. Really proud of and pretty exciting. It was shocking to go to like a, you know, a school as big as the university of Georgia and not have top of the line equipment and stuff like that.
[00:15:10] Carrie: Right. They don't the disability services, especially if there's not like a strong program, that's connected with them on campus. That's, you know, has those types of services available for audiology and speech? They may not know that they like a comtex FM system is probably not appropriate for students right now.
[00:15:34] Samantha: I mean, like I still come back to like the whole thing of like, people know. You know, students not being ready to, to addition is they don't know that they can ask for better equipment. Right. Or, you know, oh, this is what we're getting, but like, you always have to. Like be willing to ask, you know, and like advocate for the things that work for you.
[00:15:54] And if something's not working, you also have to make them aware of that too, because legally the school's obligation to help you in the best 
[00:16:01] Carrie: way. Right. So you advocated for the FM. Did you get any other services in college? 
[00:16:09] Samantha: Um, I didn't know. I had a couple of note takers, um, like, I mean, preferential seating.
[00:16:15] I mean, that was sort of self-driven because you see yourself wherever in college, pretty much. Um,
[00:16:24] I think I might've had extended test time, but I've, I've never really utilized that as a, um, um, as an accommodation, 
[00:16:38] Samantha: I also, at one point did have like written notes, like copies of if the teacher would just lecture, I'd have copy of copies of the notes, um, or the, you know, oh my gosh. Um, overhead projectors, they do have at all.
[00:16:51] Yeah. They do the little like sheets of paper and you could, I would just fill those in, um, I would also like I would meet with my professors too. I think that that was something, uh, I mean, UGA is a huge school. There's 30,000 kids. Um, and so you'd have the accommodation letter and I would set up meetings with all my professors, um, before, or even during.
[00:17:16] You've been doing like those semester. I think that was a huge help because it just, it, you know, differentiate yourself and put you, you know, from all those, whatever, you're more than just a number, you know, face. And they know like they all, they would check in on me, um, those kinds of things and make sure that I understood the assignment or.
[00:17:37] So that was something I think also that, um, was very helpful in 
[00:17:41] Carrie: college. Yeah. A great tip by a teenagers and our parents who are trying to help navigate students or their own kids who are deaf and hard of hearing to be like, you need to meet with your professors. 
[00:17:55] Samantha: I mean, they don't, they're not like they do seem scary and intimidating, but they're there to teach you and help you learn.
[00:18:02] And if you can do anything. Um, apart and I mean, take, you're taking control and you're at, you have your own voice. Um, they know you respect that and they look out for that. So, um, I, I definitely, um, advocate for meeting with your professors, for sure. 
[00:18:18] Carrie: Definitely. So one of the other things kind of just segwayed a little bit, you ended up getting the audiology assistant position and then that did that drive you then to apply for the AUD program.
[00:18:34] Samantha: I’m sorry, you said, uh, my audiology assistant position, you 
[00:18:38] Carrie: had your audiology assistant position for about four years. Is that what drove you to then eventually apply and do the AUD program? 
[00:18:49] Samantha: Well, shout to Kate Salatheil again, because she was, um, she, I mean, she was just like, she taught me so much and she just saw how much I cared and how much I wanted to be involved.
[00:19:01] And she just really just was like, I would just respond like soaking up everything from her. And she, um, at that point I kind of like, what am I going to do? I know this isn't like, um, you know, like I knew that I had the personal experience and I mean, in Lopera they were so. Just supportive of that and like really, uh, respectful of it.
[00:19:22] And they would always do. Yeah, they would always want my input. And that was amazing. Um, when I felt like I had that personal experience, but I really wanted like the credentials to back it up and I really wanted the education because I, I don't want to say I felt like a fraud, but I was kind of like, I don't know if I have like all the right, um, qualifications to be providing this input.
[00:19:44] Right. So then, um, she was like, and then Kate was like, you have to go, like, you have to go. You'd be like an amazing addition to the field. And it would be started exciting. So then like, yeah, now it's pretty cool to have like the personal experience to bring to it. And then I also have the professional, you know, um, expertise and experience.
[00:20:03] Uh, so I feel like. Just kind of, I feel much better about saying things and doing things. 
[00:20:12] Carrie: No, that does make sense to be able to, you have such a gift to provide to the students that you work with and the families, because you can say this is my journey, but then you have the professional knowledge to, to direct them in different ways 
[00:20:31] Samantha: and being involved in different.
[00:20:35] You know, different programs, different, um, uh, uh, groups and stuff like that. I think it is a really, really unique and kind of a necessary perspective because when you're talking to parent and you're talking to these people who are, you know, sharing their anecdotal experience, um, the there's a lot of misinformation out there and it kind of can get spread pretty quickly.
[00:20:56] So I feel like, um, I feel like when I'm going into certain situations, I'm pretty unbiased, but I know that there's like a very scientifically backed like clinical reason for XYZ. And I've been in panel than on an indifferent cause, uh, on different cars and say, um, where I feel like that perspective needed to be shared because what, whichever, whatever was interpreted was.
[00:21:25] Does it make sense clinically? Do you know what I'm saying? Like as an audiologist, you're like, oh no. So let me, like, let me clarify this kind of, um, so I think, but I think it a less intimidating way of doing it than when you're in the clinic or at a doctor's appointment or whatever. So it's, it's cool to be able to kind of, um, provide both of those, uh, perspective.
[00:21:49] Carrie: Yes, definitely. So going, you know, you graduate with your AUD, which is awesome. And then you end up getting your job. Were there any roadblocks that you feel like you encountered as just an individual who's deaf and hard of hearing and getting a job? Or did you feel like it was. Kind of a good segue because you already in that kind of deal.
[00:22:17] Samantha: Oh, interesting. I mean, I don't really feel like I've felt any like huge systemic roadblocks or anything like that. I feel like there were some, uh, like comments that were made and stuff that could have been pretty. You know, if I wasn't me, I think it would have been like really upsetting, but I I'm, I've had people say like, there's no way that you can be an audiologist.
[00:22:40] If you have hearing loss, how can you do that? You can't hear, um, And that kind of thing. And it works out is that most of those comments came from other people with hearing loss and a lot of them were older or whatever. And I, I know it's because you know, the, their technology, isn't the technology that I have and that my technology isn't the technology that the younger kids younger than me have.
[00:23:03] So, um, that was kind of the, that was really shocking, I would say, but I wouldn't necessarily call it, um, a roadblock. Um, I feel very lucky. I've always been very supported by the audiology community here in Michigan. Um, and so I haven't really experienced many roadblocks, um, getting my implant, which talk, I mean, adjusting to, um, I mean, I got my implant and I was activated and then the next week I think I was back in clinic.
[00:23:35] Um, so that was really, um, That was really tough. Like that change just in back to being in the clinic and every little sound was so loud. And I couldn't like my, like my professor to my supervisors would like, like rush all their papers and I would be like, oh my God, what is that noise? That is so loud.
[00:23:57] That a 
[00:24:00] Carrie: little bit for that. Cause I wanted it. That was one of my question for you is. When did you decide that you needed to explore the cochlear implant process and kind of go backwards a little bit? That. 
[00:24:18] Samantha: So it actually started when I was still an audiologist assistant. Um, the woman who previously worked in that district was also a cochlear implant and she was a cochlear implant rep.
[00:24:30] And then, um, just like through going to the different conferences, we. Kate. And I were kind of like, oh, there's this hybrid implant. Like, why don't you do it? And I'm like, ah, I don't know. I'm kind of nervous. So, I mean, it probably took me a good two, two years, three years, um, of like being aware of the new, uh, implant and that I would, I was a candidate and that kind of thing, um, for me to actually pursue it.
[00:24:57] But, uh, a huge reasoning why I did that was because I felt, um, as a.
[00:25:05] And I wasn't, uh, performing my best. I wasn't doing the most for me to be able to best understand the kids I wanted to work with and that type of thing. I mean, children are pretty soft spoken and a lot of them have like speech errors. And then if you put like a child with hearing loss on top of it, you know, I need to make sure that I have all the tools.
[00:25:26] To make sure that I am doing my best job and show. That was something that, that was a huge motivating factor. Um, for me to get my implant, I was definitely just be my future goals and working with kids, um, as an audiologist. 
[00:25:42] Carrie: So you didn't have any like sudden change in your hearing or anything like that.
[00:25:46] You just knew that this technology was out there that now make you a candidate. 
[00:25:53] Samantha: Yeah, I guess I would say I had a lifestyle change. Right. But my hearing, um, was stable, has been stable my entire life. I've never had any sudden changes. Um, getting the implant in my left ear did change. Um, my hearing it did decrease in the low pitches.
[00:26:09] So, uh, that's something that. Which it's pretty hard. It's pretty hard still because when I don't have my implant on, people have to switch sides. Cause like my, like I consider, so when I have my implant on my left, did my good side of it. Then when I have it off my right, it's my good side, because I'm used to hearing with that residual hearing, like I've used it my entire life.
[00:26:30] So, um, it's something that I always kinda joke about. But, um, but yeah, so that would be the only time that my hearing ever changed. 
[00:26:39] Carrie: Okay. right  So. Can you go back and just kind of explain how you came to, um, I guess like make an appointment and kind of determine whether or not you really, I mean, I know you knew you were based on your audiogram, but like actually
[00:26:58] Yeah, the process of the cochlear implant. Um, um, 
[00:27:02] Samantha: yeah, I mean, it's pretty tricky to navigate and it's really intimidating. Um, I think for, you know, for parents or for, um, individuals to make, to take that first step, um, kind of a different. Journey, I guess, because, uh, like I said, a woman that I knew was a cochlear implant rep.
[00:27:20] And so she was aware of some, um, like research trials and stuff that were going on. So she had informed me of that and then put me in contact with the audiologist. Um, I think via email. And so I just emailed the audiologists and said, I'm interested in being in this research. I want to see if I'm a candidate, et cetera.
[00:27:39] So then I actually, so the closest research center or. Where they were doing this trial was at Vanderbilt in Nashville. So I actually, um, my mom and I went down there and I did my entire, the whole test battery there. And I didn't qualify for the initial research study, but I qualified for the other one.
[00:28:03] Um, and then. I came back home and my husband at the time, it said, why don't you keep it in Michigan? I go to Michigan. So then I ended up making an appointment at the U of M CI center. And then, um, I went there and it was kind of, um, I mean, there was conflicting results. So it was just, you know, um, just in terms of EAS.
[00:28:25] So like, uh, Vandy fell my left ear as a candidate. You haven't found my right as a candidate. And I always thought my right ear is stronger, just an understanding and stuff. So that was kind of like, ah, I don't want to wait. Like I want to get this done. Um, and then. So I just went back to Vanderbilt and, um, they w they were, I mean, I will highly, always recommend Vandy that the continuity of care has been something I've never experienced.
[00:28:52] I mean, I would email, I would email the surgeon and he would email me back the same day, same thing with the audiologist. So, um, that was just something I was like, I feel comfortable here, you know, and I think that that's something a lot of people need to do to just like, just make sure that you're comfortable with the people that are helping you.
[00:29:11] Um, yeah, I mean, if you just, I know here in Michigan, like if you just call. MCI center, which childrens hospitals, audiology clinic, those, you can just schedule an appointment for CI eval. Um, I always try to tell my parents too, because people are really scared about CI’S and, um, you know, I always try to, I try to tell them, like, if you just go in for the appointment and get an evaluation to see if it even a candidate, um, cause I know.
[00:29:42] Like when I was younger and my mom, like my mom and dad were told, I wasn't, I would never be a CI candidate, but the thing is that technology changes and you know what, 27, whatever, 24 years later, I'm a candidate. So I think it's, you know, it's important that audiologists continue to encourage their patients to like seek out the best and just seek out information, like having information isn't doesn't necessarily warrant, uh, needing to make an immediate decision.
[00:30:12] Yeah, 
[00:30:12] Carrie: I agree. I think. We cochlear implants have changed so much as far as candidacy goes, and we need to recognize that it's not a last resort anymore. It's part of that continuity of care and you know, you and I have. Similar. I think they like probably identical, um, ski slope audiogram. 
[00:30:40] Samantha: Yeah. I remember seeing the audio going that one of your presentations know, I was like, oh, that's really creepy mine.
[00:30:47] Carrie: It was like a mirror image of each other's audio grams. All of these great sound low-frequency sounds, but all of the high frequency sounds have been, never been audible. 
[00:31:01] Samantha: I know that's something that I think is just, I don't know if, I mean, that was one of the most amazing things was like, wow, I literally have profound hearing loss and these ranges, and now I'm detecting these steps.
[00:31:16] Carrie:  25 dB and a hearing aid would never touch frequency. So 
[00:31:26] Samantha: I don't know. I mean, for you, I, this was one of the things I was just kind of a side effect and I never really like realized it until my surgeon asked me, but like my fatigue level. Uh, so much less. I said, getting the implant. Is that something that you've experienced?
[00:31:43] I'm just curious. It is. 
[00:31:45] Carrie: I feel like. I definitely for me started having discrimination difficulties, uh, prior to the implant. And that's what prompted me to think about an evaluation. So I was definitely having a lot of fatigue prior to the implant, just because I had to concentrate so much harder with my hearing aids and.
[00:32:10] so that Prompted me to go for an evaluation. And then of course, like what you said initially after you first are activated and your brain starting to get used to a whole new language. I was exhausted just trying to figure that out, but as time has gone on and I feel like that focus, so the speech is more like speech rather than.
[00:32:34] chirps and beeps, it's a lot different now. So I, and I'm the same way when I had my implant on I'm like, you need to be on my left side because that's my good side. And then the vice versa, if I don't have my implant on, for whatever reason, like you need to be on my right side because that's my right side or my good side.
[00:32:56] But I do like having. The residual for me, just because I have so much residual low frequency hearing, having that was the residual low-frequency hearing just brings back, I guess, the natural acoustics that I'm used to of escaping. It's 
[00:33:15] Samantha: almost like a, it's an a to like a comfort thing. I, you know, in a way too, cause I can only, I have always heard this right now.
[00:33:21] I'm just hearing better this way. Um, when they do my testing at Vandy, like there's a huge difference in noise. Like if I had just had my implant on versus if I had my hearing aid and my implant on so, you know, somehow my point is using both that like both of those, um, To make a lot more sense of it and noise too, which is like the most challenging environment.
[00:33:44] So, um, yeah, the combination of the two is like the best 
[00:33:49] Carrie: that is in that. Most frequently asked question by people who don't have, you know, experience, uh, where they aren't pushing off his name. So it's like, how is your brain going to get used to this signal? That's total electronic and natural acoustic signal.
[00:34:09] How is it going to bring it together? And it does. 
[00:34:14] Samantha: We don't know, but it works
[00:34:18] Carrie: so was there anything after your implant that you felt like you did to kind of speed things up? I know you kind of got thrown back into work obviously, very quickly, and that can be a challenge, but did you do anything on your own or did you have therapy that you felt like kind of fast tracked to progress?
[00:34:38] So I 
[00:34:39] Samantha: didn't do any therapy per se. I would listen to podcasts. Like I would I'm stirring the pot that I would be. So when you're in clinic, there was a lot of driving. Um, so I would turn on a podcast in my car and just. Leave my implant on and try to listen, um, through that, or, I mean, when those are too hard to podcasts, a difficult for me already, uh, are still, I would say, but, um, like even just listening to music, like songs I knew and, um, you know, I knew what the lyrics would be.
[00:35:12] So I could, you know, with like figure out what the lyrics were just using my implant. So, I mean, that would probably be the only thing I did do audio books for a little while. But everything was just kind of on my own, like using my commute, that sort of thing. Yeah. 
[00:35:28] Carrie:  Maximize that dive time, right? 
[00:35:30] Samantha: Yeah.
[00:35:30] Might as well. Well, 
[00:35:36] Carrie: we definitely have a similar journey with a cochlear implant. I just want to say to thank you because I got my implant a couple of years after you did and  great sounding board for me when i was making that decision
[00:35:53] Samantha: That's terrifying. You don't know if you just don't know what to expect, you know? And like now I'm like, dang it. Why did I wait so long? But I mean, you really just don't know. And it's like, the fear of the unknown is, is pretty intense. So, um, I mean, I'm glad that I was able to, uh, you know, be a good, safe, like sounding board too, because I mean, I think that's what we do.
[00:36:16] Right. I see. As audio audiologists who have hearing loss, I think that. You know, you just kind of want to tell parents to go for it and you just want to like, know, let them know it's going to be okay. So I think that's a huge way that we give back and it's cool to be able to give back to colleagues 
[00:36:31] Carrie: as well.
[00:36:32] Yeah, it is. And I think what you said about it took you about three years to kind of come to that point where you're like, I'm going to make an appointment like you. And it is, I think it's a whole different Ball game when you're a patient. Oh, 
[00:36:48] Samantha: absolutely. 
[00:36:50] Carrie: So to be able to have that perspective for parents and, but, you know, teens and adults, um, to say, Hey, like you're still a human being and you still have to go through that emotional process of, um, getting to the point where you feel comfortable.
[00:37:08] Samantha: Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, sometimes I feel like I, maybe I'm a little bit, I don't wanna say aggressive, but I'm like, just do it, just do it. Like, you know, I think, you know, most of the time it's cleaner, it's gonna work out better than you could ever imagine, but it's got to be more judgment. So it's really, you know, it's kind of tricky sometimes I want to be respectful, but it's like, oh, if you could just do this, you know, like, um, shout it out.
[00:37:33] We see that obvious cochlear implant. You candidates, it's just heartbreaking. Cause I, you know, we've experienced the power and the change and you know, how much easier it makes life. So that's hard. I think that's one of the hardest things. And, and doing what we can do it anyway. I do, or whatever. It's just like, man, oh, I just want you to do it.
[00:37:57] Don't hold back. But no, well 
[00:37:59] Carrie: right. But everyone has their own process too. So I have to be, I guess, a support along the way in wherever, like part of their journey that they're on is, is important to. So kind of switching gears just a little bit before we wrap up today, I just wanted to ask you, um, you have been an integral part of a campUS experience, which is a overnight experience, at least pre COVID that we, um, my colleague, Dr.
[00:38:31] Gail Whitelaw and I do at the Ohio State university. And that you were gracious enough to be a counselor for. So, can you just share a little bit about what your experience was being a counselor and how that, you know, kind of paying it forward is helpful? 
[00:38:51] Samantha: Absolutely. Well, it was so much fun and like, just so rewarding and to me, Like, you know, campUS and all of that, like, that is just why I do this.
[00:39:01] Right? Like, um, like I said, I feel like that spot where teens are transitioning into adulthood, it is one of the, one of the most under-serviced. And I just feel like making it fun and doing this camp and bringing peers with hearing loss together. That is such a, um, Critical point in life to do that. You know, these kids are like facing the unknown and they don't really know what to do, but then here's adults with hearing loss who are kind of cool.
[00:39:27] Just, just getting Jasmine, like we're fun. But anyway, so it's like, you know, we have those conversations. Um, can't have with anybody else, you know? And so when they're talking to their students or talking to their peers with hearing loss, like the laughing about awkward situations that they've been in because of their hearing loss and, you know, I think there's so much stress and anxiety that comes with, you know, going to college or going to the workforce or doing whatever you're going to do after high school.
[00:39:57] And so knowing that you aren't the only person out there with this and developing. Those friendships and those bonds and seeing these mentors in the okay. It's going to be all right. Um, I think that's just, that's a powerful thing to be a part of. And I was honored to be asked to be a part of it and work with you and Dr.
[00:40:16] Whitelaw. Oh my goodness. She was amazing. Um, I think, you know, when like people like me and Jasmine and like, because the other people who were there, I feel so bad, but I mean, we, Jasmine is like one of my close friends. So I just keep saying that I think that, um, we can talk about our experiences transitioning to adulthood and they're all different.
[00:40:40] Right. So. It also just normalizes the differences of experiences that we all have, and then we have fun and that and then it's just a good time. And, um, I loved it. It's fantastic. 
[00:40:55] Carrie: So did you feel like meeting some of the other counselors? How was that experience? I don't know if you've ever really had like a peer mentor kind of before meeting 
[00:41:08] Samantha: other.
[00:41:09] What I owe and never forget. So this is a different camp. It's called Bear lake camp in Michigan. And so it's a, a camp it's like a week long camp for a kid who, uh, is an oral program for kids with hearing loss. And it’s a camp and. I will never forget the first day. I like we were checking everybody in and you see these kids come in and there's literally a weight lifted off their shoulders.
[00:41:34] You're going to see them relax. And still like how it feels. Um, when you meet, when you're in a group of people with hearing loss, you know, um, I think about at the AAA conference, we always have the meeting of audiologist with hearing loss and it. This amazing people, amazing place with all these people, and we're all bouncing ideas off each other and trying to figure out how can we all help ourselves and sharing experiences and just to kind of a different sort of a safe place, um, where it's like, okay, yeah.
[00:42:06] You know what I'm talking about? And, uh, so I think that that is obviously something that I experienced with the counselors and, um, my. Yeah. It's sometimes too. It's like a little bit like, oh, I will say sometimes I get a little bit of anxiety. Sometimes meeting somebody else with hearing loss because you just don't know like, Where they are.
[00:42:27] And some diff that makes sense. Like, cause I have a pretty like open book about anything. Like people can ask me anything I'm, I'm not going to hold back. People can like say jokes, you know, say something offensive and I won't be offended, but other people might not be there. So sometimes I'm always trying to gauge that.
[00:42:44] Um, but when I meet people with hearing loss, Right that weight off your shoulders. 
[00:42:51] Carrie: It is, it is. And I just, that was one of the reasons I really wanted to start something like that. Then be able to have the, in the shoes experience with someone else and recognize like, all right, I might be the only person at my workplace or my school or wherever you might be, but there are other people out there that.
[00:43:16] Samantha: Absolutely, And like the internet, like Facebook, like Instagram just took all of these like ways that we can communicate. Um, I think makes it so much easier for everybody to like, stay in touch, you know, like if something happens, something funny happens or something awkward happens, or you're like, oh my God, Jasmine and I we'll text each other, you know, and it's just like really cool to, you know, those friendships and those relationships don't they only come from things like this.
[00:43:40] You know, the majority of people with hearing loss are in the hearing majority. So we're not finding each other. And I don't think that we innately seek each other out. You know, I think that we have to be brought together because we don't identify as, you know, only somebody with hearing loss and it's not.
[00:43:57] Like, there's not like a deaf community around it with like the hearing community around it. So it's just a place that we have to carve out and relationships that we have to develop. And campUS is such a, an amazing way for us to do that. 
[00:44:12] Carrie: Yes. I think it's just important for professionals who are listening or parents or individuals that do, uh, who are deaf and hard of hearing to hear that because.
[00:44:24] We can, we, we can make these connections for people, but if sometimes needs to be, I don't want to say forced, but brought together so that people understand the value of it. 
[00:44:37] Samantha: I feel like I just like, because there's this middle that we're in, right. You know, like not big D deaf. We are hearing, we, we identify as hearing.
[00:44:47] We're all we can hear. So we're always, you know, Well, making it work in that world, but then there's this part of us. That's not necessarily like, I don't know what the word for those as part of us is, is a little bit of a void or whatever. I don't even know if it's a full void, but like, it was just like, oh, there's something missing.
[00:45:06] Oh, I'm just always trying harder in this world. And then the other, well, let me go. This is what, this is the coolest space. Like this is like not taking away from who I am here, but it's just adding like a deeper connection and understanding. 
[00:45:21] Carrie: Yeah, because there are a lot of challenges in the hearing world.
[00:45:24] So to be able to talk to someone who is experiencing the same challenges and how they navigate is important. So I think that's, yeah, that's 
[00:45:34] Samantha: helpful. I hope I hope. I hope I can others too
[00:45:38] Carrie: And I hope we get to be back in person sometime too, because the virtual connection is, is hard, but it's better than nothing. So I have to say that much.
[00:45:48] Absolutely. As we wrap up today, is there anything else that you want to share with any of our podcast listeners that I didn't ask you? 
[00:45:57] Samantha: No, I don't think so. I feel like we've covered the gamut of everything. 
[00:46:02] Carrie: Yay. And if people want to get connected with you, if they have questions, is there a way that they can connect with you?
[00:46:10] Samantha: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, um, probably just my email would be the best way to be honest. I don't have like any other, um, like I don't have any of the websites or anything like that. 
[00:46:22] Carrie: Um, active and like LinkedIn. 
[00:46:25] Samantha: Oh yeah. I am active LinkedIn. 
[00:46:29] Carrie: And I can put your LinkedIn, um, 
[00:46:32] Samantha: yeah, if you want to just put my LinkedIn and my email, or maybe LinkedIn would be the better one.
[00:46:36] If you want to just put my LinkedIn on a, in the blurb or whatever, that would be fine. 
[00:46:41] Carrie: I put it in the show notes display us. So, but I just wanted to say thank you so much for being part of this podcast and sharing your Professional and personal journey. I hope our listeners will gain a lot, which I'm sure they will.
[00:46:55] And I just appreciate all that you do as, um, and your own field in Michigan, because I know you, um, certainly do help, uh, have a ripple effect on the kids that you serve as well as the professionals that you get to interact with. So thank you again for being part of this. 
[00:47:14] Samantha: Thank you so much. Carrie. I am honored to be a part of it.
[00:47:18] Carrie: All right. Thank you for joining us on the empowEAR Audiology Podcast. And please feel free to share this podcast with any other listeners that you think will benefit. Have a great day. 
[00:47:32] Announcer: This has been a production of the 3C Digital Media Network. .