#11 Switching Navy SEALs into EOD (BOMB Tech) contract, led to a lifetime of fulfillment!

What happens when an 11-year-old watches 9/11 unfold…and feels powerless to help?
For Jay Ly, that moment became fuel. Jay grew up in a rough neighborhood in Syracuse, NY—raised by a tough single mom who Made Sure FAITH stayed at the center even when life was chaotic. 

Years later, that same Faith + Grit carried him (Not into the Navy SEALs as he planned) into the Navy EOD community (Explosive Ordnance Disposal)—Where he deployed into combat with army Rangers and other elite operators in Special Forces destroying evil men. He did get to work with the SEALs & "Team 6" (aka DevGru) where he worked a totally different mission set keeping peace and build relationships with our 'allies' in Afghanistan. 

After leaving military life, he now focuses on his New Mission: 
Helping high performers build Legacy, Purpose, and Financial Freedom grounded in faith and character!

Transcript

2:57

Well, thanks for having me, Seth. appreciate the invitation and I'm happy to be here and talking to your audience and hopefully we can give them some good, some good wisdom and some lessons learned and maybe some what not to do a whole lot of what not to do. always share some of those. Absolutely. So yeah, if you would just kind of jump in a little bit with your background first, you know, kind of where you came from, a little bit of what, you know, ended up driving you toward the military and the route you went when you went to the military. Sure. was born and raised in Syracuse, New York, not in the city. There's a lot more to New York as a whole state than just the city that a lot of people, you know, just go to, Oh, you're from the city. No, it's upstate, the heart of New York, actually Syracuse. But yeah, it was not a fancy neighborhood. Lived on a dead end street in the ghetto on South Salina Street. And yeah, it was, it was rough. Single mom upbringing. It was me and my sister, my older sister for the most part. And then when I was 14, my little brother came along, you know, just a delayed blessing is what we call him. but now he's awesome and he's, you know, he's grown up now and, doing his thing super proud of him. yeah, it was, it was rough, you know, being a minority amongst minorities in the ghetto of Syracuse, New York, AKA Stabacuse and, made a lot of bad decisions, I don't know, it was God driven divine intervention guiding me to certain people and certain paths. I firmly firmly believe that I would not be here if it weren't for that intervention. yeah, lot of luck also. At what age do you feel like you was there a pivotal moment or you just kind of always felt that there was God, there was a plan for your life or like how did that come to be? I was raised Catholic all my mom, single mom, even when our car was broken or stolen, made a point, she made a point, we did not, she did. She made a point to like, we're going to church every Sunday, we're gonna walk there if we have to, which we did many times. And yeah, so that was instilled in me from a very early age. And I didn't really appreciate it, obviously, when I was a kid, I'm like, what are we doing? our car is stolen, you know, or it's impounded or whatever the case may be repoed. All three have happened multiple times in my life and growing up and she just made it a point like we are going to walk, we're going to do it. And that's that. And, you know, so I had those roots kind of being established from in me at a, at a very young age ever since I can remember. And yeah, I just, look back now at a lot of situations and circumstances that I was in as a child. Like, how did you make it out of there, dude? I like talk to myself all the time. Like I talked to my 10 year old, five year old, seven year old self and like, dude, how did you make it through that? That's nuts. I don't think I could make it through that right now as a man at after everything I've experienced. And it just, I like those conversations with him. My younger self, I, talked to him a lot and I think that helps me through a lot of different things through my own journey still. But yeah, there was I don't think there was a single pivotal moment throughout my childhood that really kind of reinforced that divine intervention. It's really a lot of reflecting back and like, holy smokes, there's no other way that that like you survived that or you made it through that or you're just in these situations and you come out how you did, you know, with, you know, with a career. with a wife, with a family of your own, with a house of your own now, and you just, made it out. You you made it out guy and, get on yet, but it wasn't, it was, it was, it was truly divine intervention. Well, I imagine you came out with some scars, not just knife wounds, but to be able to utilize those, right? And use those as lessons learned to teach yourself and then obviously to pass that information down to your children. And how roughly are your kids like still real young or are they like middle school age? I mean, you look like you're a young guy, but... I'm in it seven, four and two. All boys so it's crazy. It's pure chaos. Yeah. Awesome. So when you were growing up and you mentioned you have a strong mother who is again determined, that's some determination. If your car is stolen, if your car is broken down, you're still walking. I mean, you know, growing up, I remember like my parents, there was no excuse for not going to church and church was an hour drive away. And I remember, you know, sometimes we'd go get in the car and the car didn't work. So we had to jump in another car. And if that one didn't work, like we're calling relatives, family members to come pick us up and we're going to ride in like, you know, back then you didn't worry about seat belts. So we'd be sitting down in the floorboard and, you know, driving an hour to the big city. Was there ever any mentors or, you know, like within the church there or somebody who kind of took you under their wing or was it just, you just had to make your way. There's definitely a lot of mentors. Super fortunate for that. In the church, you know, I was in our youth group and everything like that. My mom made sure we were involved in that. It was actually is a very, we had a great crew, throughout the, was, I saw I went to Catholic high school also, but like a lot of the other kids in my youth group where I went to church, they went to the like, you know, the local public school. kind of in the area, like near where the church is. So I like knew a lot of those people from like, you know, just around my neighborhood. but yeah, it was cool to just get in with a good group of people, even like public school. Like I was at a Catholic high school. I mean that just because it's a Catholic high school doesn't mean there's a lot of there's no shenanigans. There's plenty of shenanigans. the community is I think a little different, but having that firsthand witness of like, I have a core group of friends that Aaron public school, and they're still very faith driven, even as teenagers and stuff like that. And a lot of them, like just my some peers just gave me some really good examples of like, man, like I always wanted a big brother. And I'm like, man, some of these guys are like, they they just really, I locked onto them, right? I recognized that's what I wanted to be like. And thankfully, it was good. because I saw a lot of bad I saw a lot of bad in my neighborhood saw a lot of bad just kind of growing up and it's like I don't want any I don't want I don't want to become that. And so I was able to I think from a very young age kind of lock on to good people and just want to be with them. You know, it's like, I don't know, I just wanted I just want to be next to you, right? I don't even know if I fit in here. I just want to be next to you. And just kind of follow along and do the things like just go where you're going. And just watch, right? I was definitely like, how do you just watching everything? Okay, well, how does he do this? How does he do that? How does he talk to this person? How does he talk to this girl? How does he talk to his mom when his mom's yelling at him? Like, what does he do? That's how I'm supposed to be, right? Because I didn't know. My father was kind of around that my parents had joint custody. They got divorced when I was very young, prior to two years old. I can't remember. So somewhere in that that realm. But I mean, he they would get in arguments, he would disappear for me a month on end. So it's like, whatever. I didn't really have that strong male presence. So I guess that's why I was like all about like, hey, seeking like a big brother type figure. And then also like just some of the other adult males in the church and just at school really locking onto them and being open to what they had to say. yeah, mentors were hugely influential in my life. Did any single one of them have like a driving, this is why I'm going to take the path I'm going to take? Not really. it was just really the common thread between all of the, well, this guy's my age, guys a little bit older, right? On sports teams, stuff like that, that I really respected. And you know, the adult males that were in my life, the strong adult male figures that were in my life were really just good people. I thought, right. like, okay, this is the goal, that's when I realized like, it's not about having the most of this having the best of that. It's being the best person that you could be really in any situation, It's like just treating people how they should be treated, Or, like I say, the platinum rules, like, you know, the golden rules, treat others how you want to be treated. The platinum rule is treat others better than you expect to be treated, whether it's 1 % or 100%. Like, it's still better than you expect to be treated. Hopefully, that will trickle down, you know, and just be a ripple with no logical ending, So that's where I recognize like, okay, these guys, and that are my age, my peers, and these adult males, strong figures that I'm that I'm really respecting, they're just good people. And that's what I wanted to do. That's so that's That's what I'm still trying to do here. I think something that you touched on there, I figured we were going to touch on more so once we got to the military aspect, which is something that I always am going to echo on this channel, especially to the young men, that are struggling or maybe that are not yet, but they're going to get to that age and they will be. And that is getting yourself around good quality people. That doesn't mean the cool kids. because it was the cool kids from my high school. Some of the cool kids, she got her new driver's license. They all jumped in her brand new convertible, whatever was Mustang. And then when she went a hundred miles an hour and slammed into something and they are all coming to class, you know, in, in sea collars around their neck and, know, their life is, is destroyed, you know, at that early age. Being, looking for people that are quality people doesn't mean that they're going to necessarily be the people everybody else knows. And finding those weird kids like me, and I'm not putting myself up as the highest quality on the planet, but I found myself surrounded by guys who, there's more to them. They weren't going to the, "True Love Waits" for marriage and we're going to save our purity. I went to that class and nobody in there actually did that. And I already knew it because I was on the football team with them, I was on the trash team. None of these guys are doing that. They're lying because they're talking about what they're doing with their girlfriends when they're outside of practice. So my whole point was I ended up finding a couple of guys and one specifically that I ended up being lifelong friends with. He's a multimillionaire and lives up in Montana and owns multiple businesses. And I'm just like, it's so strange what different avenues you go, but these people will always still be there. I bet if you reached out to any of those guys that were your mentors or people you looked up to, I guarantee you just based off what you've told us that those people would absolutely drop what they're doing and have a conversation with you and help you if they could. No doubt, no doubt they would. and vice versa, I would, if they called me in the middle of the night, pick up the phone like, Hey, what's going on, man? How are you? And I would leave because my wife would probably be annoyed that I'm talking on the phone at three o'clock in the morning. Uh, probably get hit, but, uh, that I would still answer, you know? Um, so yeah, it's mutual. Absolutely. So let's go ahead and get to the military. How did you end up deciding on Navy and EOD specific? Yeah, honestly, I didn't even know what EOD was when I joined the military. And I was young when I decided right that I was going to join the military. It was, you know, a huge it was actually like a great feeling of inadequacy that really drove me to the military. I was September 11. You know, I can still remember vividly, I was in sixth grade, right? I was 11 years old. So I was not that old by any means, right? I was very young. And I just remember the whole situation, right? I was at school, we got caught. It was like a bomb threat kind of like, like that's what that's what the school was doing to kind of get us consolidated and like out of the classrooms and whatever. And I'm like, okay, I just thought it was another drill. And that's because that's how everyone was playing it, you know, and because they did. I mean, honestly, looking back, right, the teachers had zero clue what was happening, right? Zero clue. They're just doing the best they can with what they have. And I'm just looking back like I'm just this joking. was a jokester just joking around. I'm like, okay, whatever is another bomb threat. We're just good. We get out of class, like our normal like little protocol, we're just turning off lights, whatever we're being consolidated in, like the teachers lounge like my, my class, I would go into a very small school. so was like me and another, like our class, our sixth grade class. And I think we were with maybe the seventh graders in the teacher's lounge, right? And the TV was on. I was like, this is crazy. We get to watch TV during this thing. And then we're like paying attention to what's on the TV and it's tower. The towers are just smoking, right? They're just smoking. And I'm like, what is happening? and I'm like, is this real? Is this a movie? Like what, and then we realized it was the news and the teachers are like crying like some of them. And we're like, this something is really happening here. And I 11 year old me did not understand really what was going on the gravity of the situation at all. And then it's like, it just became every second we're in there just watching and waiting and seeing new information and hearing the stories coming out of like people jumping out of the windows and just like crash like you could hear it on the news. Like this the body's hitting the ground because they're just like, okay, You know, we're stuck up here and that's that. Right. And this is like, this is what's going on. And I'm like, that's crazy that this is actually happening right now. And, you know, then, then the towers collapse and we see that. it's just like, you could hear a pin drop. Everyone's just like, what is, what is going on? Right. And then I'm like, okay, well, I see some other guys, right. That I respect the older guys. and like the older kids and some of them are like, you know, 17, 16, 18 and they're like, we're going, we are going to go to the military and we're just going to do this. I'm like, uh, well, what, what can I do? And I'm just like, nothing. You literally can do nothing. Right. And me talking to myself again, I guess this has always been a thing with me, um, that I'm now realizing, but I'm just like, I want to go to like, the firehouse and help them take out the trash Like what I was just like thinking of any thing that I could possibly do as an 11 year old kid to contribute in some way, or form. And it's like, okay, no one's even at the firehouse because they're all down, right? They're good. They've gone to the city, right? They've, they've all, mean, Syracuse is about a four hour drive up from New York city. And so like they're gone, right? I mean, they have like minimum manning, whatever. And they're just like, that's it. Like we're needed down here. don't catch your house on fire, you know, pretty much. And cause there's need and that was, that wasn't even a question I feel like, which is another great example of like, man, people are just answering the call and they're going to where they need to be. They're not sticking around. They're just like, go. mean, I'm sure that was a rough, like, I don't know what the, obviously the, dynamic was at the, local fire houses for up in Syracuse of like, okay, we're going to send XYZ. And then like ABC will be here and then you guys will come back and then so on and so forth. So many people didn't come back, right? Cause they were just going to volunteer and just like, they're stuck down there. And so, yeah, it was, it was wild to see, but also the inadequacy that I felt it's like, I literally can't do anything. And I was 11, And this was 2001. So I still had seven years before I could go into the military. And was like, well, it's going to be over by then. And, you know, we're going to go get them and the people that did this, which I really didn't understand that either. And that was that. And so as I got older and older, I was like, okay, well then the emphasis to just be a good person. And it's like, okay, well, these people just died for literally no reason. Um, the civilians in the towers, right. Then now we have fire and police officers just going down there. like from all over the area and some not making it, not making it out. And they're just going to help total strangers. I was like, that is amazing that what they are doing is amazing. And that is what I need to do. Like I need to do something like that with my life because what is like, and I took a look around where I was, I was like, this is a dead end. This is toxic. I'm going to end up like my family members that are just like, stuck in their ways and just like doing the same thing over and over again, like down the road. like my classmates that are just, I can tell, I mean, like kind of you alluded to like, it's strange how things pan out, but it's like, you know, the guys and gals that are going to graduate and do the same exact thing that they're doing now, just all rinse, repeat, rinse, repeat for the rest of their lives. And they're going to be stuck in that for the rest of their lives until they have some kind of come to Jesus moment where it's like, I need to wake up and actually do something. So I just didn't want that to happen. And so I just took every stride then to prepare myself to go into the military. And I didn't know what I wanted to do in the military at all. Like, I didn't know any of the jobs. I didn't know what branch I wanted to go in. I thought I was and like 11 year old me I was like, yeah, I'll go into the Air Force and be like, thunder. What is it a Thunderbird pilot? I'm like, that has literally nothing to do with combat whatsoever. And Like it just nuts, right? That's just like the mind of 11 year old me. It's like, that's what I'm going to do to help out. And so as I got older, you know, the invasion of Iraq happened. And then that's still like that. Again, that feeling of an act was like, I'm too young to literally do anything. And this is just happening. And we're just like sending our we're sending our troops over. And I'm stuck in school still and I can't do anything. So I think that was just really reinforced. And then I had a lot of good mentors stood up for me when I didn't, when I didn't deserve it, when I really, really didn't deserve it. but you know, I don't know what it was. They must've seen like, I don't know. Sometimes people recognize the best in you when you're blind to it and I truly appreciate those guys that stepped into my life and did that for me because again, I would, it's a slippery slope where I lived and I made some bad decisions that could have very easily spiraled out of control and just like had way different trajectories for my life. And I use the term trajectory as like just for a lack of a better term, because there would be no trajectory. It would just be a downward spiral into a pit, right? And then rinse, repeat, I'd be nothing. probably be dead in a ditch somewhere. And that just didn't happen, right? Because people intervened when they didn't have to, and went to bat for me. And I'm like, why is this happening? You know, pull your head out of your A$$ and press on. what you were alluding to. the right guys. the strong guys, the real good guys aren't always the coolest guys. I played three sports. I was in around, like I was in the cool crowd. Right. But I also had a lot of friends that were not necessarily in the cool crowd. Like I was friends with everyone. I like to say my wife just says I was a flirt. but whatever, I was just a nice guy. not just the girls, like obviously I was very friendly with the girls, but The guys too, right? I would talk to everyone. I'm still like that. And that's just, I don't know. just like talking to people and gleaning other perspectives and like, yeah, some of the not cool kids kind of like were apprehensive talking to me or like defensive talking to me. And I probably came off as a little aggressive and you know, sometimes we butted heads and I was like, dude, I'm not at you because you're not part of my group. It's just like, you're just treating me like with a lot of disrespect. And that's not cool. and I'm not the one that's going to sit idly by and let that happen. for everyone that I wasn't really friendly with or, you know, had kind of butted heads with it was probably because they did things that were my biggest pet peeves, right? Because, you know, the things we do ourselves, like that's what we dislike in other people is our biggest pet peeves that we do. And you know, that's probably what I just recognize like, man, I don't want to be like that. And, know, even some of the cool kids were just like, like some of my, some of my very close friends were just like total d*cks to other guys and, and girls, like just how they treated them. that's not me. That's not how I want to be. That's not how want to my life. I am not. I'm not that guy, right? I'm sure I of ego at that, at that age. That's like even good guys can get caught up in that when they're that young, you know, but it's, sorting yourself out and that self talk you're talking about. Honestly, I haven't heard anybody really ever say that on my podcast and I haven't really heard anybody talk about that. know I talked to myself. I always thought that's like, that's not normal. So I don't share that information, but yeah, I'm glad you did. you, but you still do that to this day. is the way it sounds like helping yourself understand and kind of sort through things. Is that right? Yeah, there's just so many things that I just didn't understand as a kid. And like, maybe it's because my I mean, single mom, she's working all the time. And she did show me like how like what work ethic actually was. And I just didn't like she did the best she could. There's not a hit on her. She did the best she could what she had, you know, granted, I don't want to justify some of the crazy stuff that she just did, and put the situation she put me and my sister in. But my I just didn't have that strong like, Dad, this is what's going on in my life. And I don't understand it type deal. Or just like anyone's like, you know, that I'm like really frustrated because you know, we got these things deep in ourselves and deep in our souls and our hearts. And it's like, it like Infuriates us to the nth degree. And then that just like puts us in a bad mood. And if we don't talk about it, you don't have anyone talking about it, it's going to come out in the worst possible way. Right. And I mean, I'm sure you know exactly what I'm talking about. I'm sure a lot of you guys know what I'm talking about and I've felt it or feel it right now. You can invite that person into the conversations like, dude, what what are we doing? Like look in the mirror. Like you can bullsh*t anyone all day except for the dude staring back at you in the mirror. He knows you. He knows all of you. He knows what you do when no one's looking. He knows what you do behind closed doors. He knows what you're thinking at all times, right? So you cannot BS that guy that's staring back at you. And that was like early on, like I didn't really, I didn't realize that until much later. But now it's like, that's what I do. It's like, talk to the guy in the mirror. Number one, you should pray. I think that is excellent. I think it's excellent meditation. think it's excellent for sleep. I think, you know, and that might come off as bad, but you know, sometimes when I just have a lot of intrusive thoughts, I just start praying I'm just going to start, I'm just say 10 Hail Marys and see if I can make it that far with a clear head. Or if I like get to one or half, and I'm just like spiraling back to whatever I'm thinking about, or I fall asleep, you know, it's some, some, one of those things is going to happen. And I'm spiraling back to what I'm thinking, just kind of recognize that. And I just take a couple of deep breaths and start over and just, just do it. Right. And that has, that has significantly helped me out but yeah, I always like to invite the, my younger self into the conversation, especially when I'm experiencing something that I thought I would never experience. I just took my family to Disney. We got back a couple of weeks ago before I ran the marathon. And I just have these moments where I'm like, dude, if my 10 year old self could see me right now, like it would just blow his little mind. And in that moment, I'm like, let's bring him up here and look at it. So it's like I... go back to that guy. I'm like, sorry. It just like really touches me. Like it, touched me in a really profound way to just, and I'm so grateful for it, right? Because he made it Despite all the stuff he made it. it's like, we're on the plane. Obviously I have three mama's boys, so they're just wanting to sit with mom. So she's like over there across the aisle. I'm supposed to have one of them with me. She has them all. And I'm just like, have this great opportunity to just like look at my wife. right and just see our kids just like going nuts and her just smiling through it all and it's like you made it you made it dude it's all worth it right so it's like if i could go back and talk to him and this is like this this really helps out now right this helps me deal with my sh-t now because i can go back then to something traumatic or a crazy scenario or whatever the case may be whatever timeline it is, go back to that moment and be like, dude, it's so worth it. It's so worth it. And this is not permanent. It's going to be all right. And then just give them a lesson. like nothing is permanent, right? It's only temporary. You can do anything, right? Just press on, just don't stop moving. Just keep going and it will be so worth it. You'll see. And then be like, look, look at it, right? that is going to that's going to be you. It's just going to take a long time to get here and a lot of pain and suffering, but it is so worth it. So that's the, that just like makes it feel better. Like, I don't know what, what therapy that is called, right? But it works. and so yeah, that's what I, that's what I, you know, I would highly recommend to the guys Enlisting, right? To you guys, just like invite your younger selves in, you know, go back to those moments where you're like, dude, that sucked and whatever. Like even if it's a very traumatic event, like I'm not trying to get you triggered here or anything like that, but seriously go back, be, look at something that you are tremendously grateful for in your life right now and just invite him up. Like, look at, look at what we did. Like you did this, right? And I wouldn't be here if it weren't for you. So like, I don't know, it helps me out. That I don't know if I'm, that makes me crazy or what. that's powerful. it's, it's interesting that you bring this up again. This is why love doing podcasts that aren't script with a bunch of specific questions, because this is something I just worked on with a guy who helps veterans. the podcast that I'm about to put out this week is a first responder who watched the second plane hit. the tower and then he went and dug for bodies for, for weeks on end. He was in the Marine reserve at the time. And then he says on my podcast that he overcame PTSD. So then we have to get the guy on who he claims healed his PTSD. And I mean like not able to sleep, not able to eat pork because of 9/ 11 and being that's what he remembers the smell being like. And that guy. what both guys are talking about. Absolutely. And that guy, I have a conversation with him. so we had a three way podcast. was more of two way. was just those two talking and I sat and recorded it, but he did the exact same thing that you just described with me. One of my earliest childhood traumas. I was violently sick throwing up as horrible with like the flu was all we, everything was the flu. If it was really bad when I was a kid, they never. took took you to a doctor. So was just the flu. It was on Halloween. So somebody had to be stuck at home with Seth while everybody else went to the big city to go trick-or- treating. And my uncle, who my cousin uncle, long story is mom committed suicide and that my grandparents adopted him. So he was raised as my uncle, but actually he turns out to be my cousin. but he was much older than us and he was super evil. It was just, was. So all the Halloween movies are children of the corn played. We watch it. And then afterwards he says, Hey, you know what? Here's a Mason jar. Go out into the corn field. Cause we lived out on a ranch and pick a go catch grasshoppers. Cause I'm going to go fishing tomorrow. Since you made me stay home, you're not allowed back in the house until that Mason jar is full of grasshoppers and I'm violently sick. And there I was, he shoved me into the cornfield and I couldn't come back. Right? So that's exactly what he described. He had me go back to that moment and it took a while for me to really be able to focus. Cause I've got that ADHD brain, even though it's never been diagnosed I finally get it. And I talked to myself as a kid. What, what would you tell you now knowing where you are today? What would you share with him? And then. After I kind of walked myself, you know, talked myself through that, he said, okay, now Jesus is also standing there beside you guys. Now, you know, what, what would he say to this young man who knows that he's going to, you know, try to live as a Christian and, try to shed that light as he gets older and on a podcast with who knows how many someday that might ever see this, including his, his lineage. That's powerful, Again, I'm just learning this and you sharing that kind of blows my mind again. Nothing is an accident both of them are awesome guys. Yeah, Dan Jarvis is the man. um He's the absolute man. And yeah, I've talked with him a lot about this, like, does this make me crazy that I just talk to myself all the time? He's like, No, you know, it's like, it's what we do with, you know, trauma resiliency protocol and all of the things that that he does. I know that process and I just do it. Like, I not have to go back and like search and like, cause it's a whole thing, right? it's fantastic, but you can do it like micro amounts throughout the day or throughout like wins. Like I, I seriously, I do this now with, with wins stuff that I'm like, when I'm experiencing something, I'm like, this is, I'm just so blessed and grateful that this is even happening. I'm like, come on up, come on up little man, come on up 10 year old me and look at look at what you did, you know, and that makes it feel so much better and more important. And I think it just really puts stuff in perspective about like, what's actually important, we hustling grind to make, ends me or we just like try to make as much money as we can sometimes and you know, I'm all about it. I'm not saying don't make money, but we, it's very easy to get lost in why you're doing what you're doing. And that really puts it in perspective. my wife is a pediatrician and she's like working and she's got her, she's part time. She wants to be home with the kids a lot. I respect that and support her in that. But we have a, a nanny to kind of help out and you know, we've been through a couple of different ones and, there are times where, we have we're in between, and we're trying to search for a new one, And there's times where it's like, my wife works on Wednesdays and Fridays, where it's like, Okay, well, cool with my schedule, we don't necessarily need a nanny, because I'll just take, I'll just make sure I have Wednesdays and Fridays off, so I can be here. And I'm like, I think it was an Alex hermosy thing, he's talking like at the end of my life, right? If I have you know, X amount of millions of dollars or a billion dollars, like if I'm 70, and he's like talking about the wisdom of the ages. It's like everyone always asked like they're like, I wish I spent more time with my family is like, well, how do you actually execute that? You know? And he's like, if I had a million dollars, right here and it was like, I'm 70 years old and I pay this money and I go back to when I'm 30. I would pay that, right? And I'm pretty sure anyone would, right? Anyone would do that. Like how much money would you pay to go from where you are now back so you can relive that or, you know, go back so you can have more time. And he's like, just spend the time now. Don't have the money and just spend the time now. And I'm like, that is powerful. You know, that really does put into perspective when you're like, okay, yeah. we're not going to make this, you know, maybe this finance goal, but we can talk about finance later, you know, the freedom, you want the freedom to be able to do that. and so yeah, it's like, you know, I'm very fortunate again. And it's like, yeah, I spent a ton of time with my kids and it's like, I'm so blessed and fortunate for that. And sometimes when it's crazy and it's hectic and I'm kind of over it and it's like, I think back to those times where it's like, man, this is like truly a blessing that we have this time right now. And if I ruin it, by being upset and being in my own way and like not being grateful for the blessings in my life. That's time wasted, right? And that is time we will never get back. And I'll be at the end of my life and I will be that's what I'm going to think about. Those moments are the ones I'm gonna think about like I want to get those back. So now I've kind of shifted. It's like I don't want to think about that at the end of my life. I want to have very little amounts of those so I can just look back and like yes, that was so awesome. Well, yeah, absolutely. And I think that you touched on something there that, that I definitely want to go back in and delve into for a second. You were just because again, I come from family with no high school graduates around. and it sounds good if you're in that place as a kid, that you want to spend your time with your kids and your family and those things. Cause that's what I'm doing too. I could be out doing more hustling to make more money, but I wouldn't be spending the quality time right now with my son in these formative years as he's, know, about 2 and a half years old. And I have literally been there for almost every day of his life. And that there's, there's nothing in any retirement account. There's no car there. There's no house. There's no Lake house that's worth. giving up that time and giving up that influence and the joy that you have. I think that, you know, kids, of course, today, whatever it is now, was like 80 % last time I heard everybody wants to be an influencer because they want them, they understand that they want time to just do whatever they want. And a lot of times that's vacations and da, da, da, da, but they're not focused on the family and on those things that When you looked back, when you look back at those mentors, the good people were the people that focused on other people and investing in other people, including their family and not focused on cars and bigger, bigger houses and nicer cars. And those things would be my guess. Am I right? Or would I be wrong? Exactly. And that's what you're going to find. No matter how old you are, your entire life, you could bang your head on a rock all you want. It's never going to change. It can't change because no car is going to give you no matter how nice a Ferrari you get into sitting down with your son as he falls asleep in your arms when your wife can't get him to go to sleep and he's fussy and he needs a nap, but you know how to get him to go to sleep. There there's no car ride there. I don't care how many people look at you when you drive by that. That means nothing. Your son being able to go to sleep in your arms and knowing that he's safe and that he's protected. And there's a lot of kids out there that have been hurt by other people that didn't have a protector, that didn't have a father home, that didn't have somebody, a mentor there to really show them the way. I know a lot of my family went through that and some of my cousins had all their kids taken by the state. And I'm literally talking on the phone with one of my cousin's children who's in prison and is looking to get out. it's like, her life has been so horrible They got the same opportunity I had. I just chose, you know what I mean? To put forth effort and work hard. Like you end up in the Navy EOD. Like you said, you didn't even know what the EOD was. Same thing, I didn't know. I had no idea what an infantry heavy weapons specialist was in the Marine Corps and I just signed up because it sounded like the hardest thing I could find. And then the same thing, I joined the Rangers. I was wearing a tan bra and still didn't know what I did as a Ranger because I was a Ford Observer. I literally still don't even know what I do and I am that thing. Just to make me feel old, you said that 9-11 happened, you were 11 years old. I had been in the Marines for a year and a half at that point. And yeah, it's always funny when I talk to people like, where were you on this day? Yeah, was, you know, the last episode I put out was the Jessica Lynch mission. That was in 2003. Like that's what I was doing when you were a little kid. It's wild, but getting back to now. detention in seventh grade and you were freaking doing HRs. Landed poop. laying in the poop, absolutely. Falling down in that poop, laying in it. So let's get back to how you ended up with the Navy EOD contract in your hands. And again, how did your hand get guided to sign that piece of paper? And what was that process like for you coming again from your background? It was definitely not straightforward. I will say that. I, again, didn't know what EOD (Explosive Ordinance Disposal) was. And, when I graduated high school, there's like a lot of my friends are like, I was I was I was Enlisting with one of my buddies. I was in the Sea Cadets, aka the Sea Weenies. That's what we called it. But it was like it's like the Navy version of Boy Scouts for like kind of those of you that don't know what that is. and I didn't really know what it was. kind of did it so I could get E3 out of bootcamp, So it was like a means to an end. I mean, I had a good time, you know, and I met I met some pretty cool people when I was there. And yeah, it was and I have I like some crazy stories from Sea Cadets also. But my buddy and I, we were going to enlist at the same time and leave at the same time. But then he's like, I'm gonna go later. I'm like, dude, I can't, I cannot have a summer here in Syracuse. I will like get arrested, lose my contract, do something stupid. Like I need to go. Like I just need to get out of here. This is toxic for me. I've already come to that conclusion. I need to get out of this situation that I'm in. like kind of what you just like we're alluding to. It's like, you know, you have the same opportunities and your family members have the same opportunities. Like everyone has the same opportunities here. And. I'm like, I'm going right because the opportunity means absolutely nothing if you don't do anything about it. Right. I, I depped in when I was 17 delayed entry program because I knew I was going and I got the first, I got the first date that I could after graduation so I graduated. in June something, right? June something I left July 8th, right. of 2008 That's when I shipped out. And I had a Navy SEAL contract, right? Because I like, don't know what, I literally had no idea what EOD is. I was like, okay, if I'm gonna do this, I went to their cruise office, like this is kind of me, I played three sports, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's like, have you thought of special operations? seem pretty athletic. I was like, sure, you know, I read Lone Survivor, great book, you know, all the things, whatever. And I'm like, that sounds pretty awesome. Yeah, how can I do that? And it's like, take the ASVAB (Military SAT's) did that. And they're like, yeah. You know, you can do it. What do you want to do as a backup? I'm like, what do mean? What do I want to do as a backup? Like this is like my mentality at the time. And honestly, it kind of still is right now is like, that's what I just told you what I wanted to do. I don't need a backup, right? I'm telling you what I'm going to do. and my wife can attest to this too. When I, know, when we put our mind to something, I just, it just, I will just not rest until it's done. Unless it's a project around the house, I will start 50 of those, um, simultaneously. Yeah. a totally different brainwave thing function, right? So I go in he's like you should really pick out and this is a recruiter and I think this is this kudos to this one recruiter that I know because he was actually helpful he's like I Really really recommend that you get a second rating right in in the Navy. It's like your MOS is called your rate and I'm like nah, I don't need it. I'm gonna be a Navy SEAL it's gonna be sick. And he's like, Okay, right. I tried sign the papers, boom, you have a Navy SEAL contract was like, awesome, let's go. And so you know, he's doing this all these things like going to dive motivator PT, you know, there's like a whole program that you get in to do these things that took the I didn't even know I didn't even know how to do the side stroke for the record. As I'm saying all this stuff about me, it's like, that's what I want to do. I'm gonna do that. I'm like, I don't even know what's on the that like the the physical assessment exam. And so it's like, yeah, you got to do this. I'm at the thing, right? I'm at the physical fitness test to actually that now I signed the contract to actually get the contract. You got to pass a PST, a physical screening test. I'm like, okay, cool. I can do that, right? I'm pretty athletic, whatever. It's like the swim. And I'm like, I'm really good. was on a swim team, but it's like, you have to do the side stroke. I'm like, what is the side stroke? And they're like, I'll demonstrate it once. Then you're going to go. And I'm like, dam it. you know, dam it. And because I had no idea what that was, it my whole my form was horrible. Like, I knocked the push up sit ups, the run out, whatever, but the swim, I'm like, that almost killed me because it's like, totally different, right? It's not freestyle. It's not any it's, it's, you know, it's, it's a lot of technique. I won't get into it now because there's no swimming podcast. So the moral of story is I, put the cart before the horse, right? As like, yeah, I'm to do this. wait, there's some homework that I should have done to realize even how to even get in. But miraculously, right? I passed by three seconds. I felt awful. I'm not bragging about that by any means. That's horrible. You should never go into a physical screening test and pass by three seconds. You should crush it. And that's what I vowed to after I was like, holy smokes, what am I getting myself into? And I kind of like now, thankfully, had a dose of reality, a taste of what I was kind of getting myself into, of not the physicality of it, but like the fact that you don't know anything aspect of it. I'm like, okay, cool. I will receive this lesson and I'm gonna train this. So I did, that's what I focused on. My other buddy that I listed with, he was like awesome at it. So I trained with him. And we, I really got some, better technique was able to kind of crush the test. the next subsequent test. And so I'm at bootcamp with my Navy SEAL contract in hand, my shiny Navy SEAL contract. got it. Right. I'm to go do the thing. I'm in bootcamp now I'm bad A$$ because I'm in Navy bootcamp with a Navy SEAL contract in a, in a spec ops division. So we get extra PT and everything for all the other big Navy guys. That would have been like a horrible punishment, but like we're like PT and in our barracks before we even like get out of P days, our processing days. the RECs come in, they're yelling at us for like, they're like, stop working out, just stop. Like, you know, we didn't want to run. So we're doing pushups and sit-ups at night, whatever, you know, as you can imagine that probably didn't go over too well, but you know, they're like these, like that's just what it was, right? that was kind of cool for me to experience that. then, but then, right, we got these cool ball caps, right. In bootcamp. And they said like EOD, MOBI, unit three. I'm like, what is that? And our apparently this is a thing I didn't again I didn't realize this was a thing apparently this is a thing some units will sponsor divisions bootcamp divisions in the Navy like so across the Navy you could get like you could sponsor a bootcamp division with your unit for whatever reason like they get it like a t-shirt a hat you go out there you PT with them you talk about your your unit and your command and stuff like that so sometimes that happens not very often so Total luck of the draw here. Okay. Total luck of the draw. My bootcamp division is sponsored by EOD mobile unit three. I'm like, cool. I have no idea what that is. Whatever. They come out. I'm like, so what is EOD? Right? That's the boom, the shot heard around the world, right? That was me right there. And they're like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I was like, whoa, this sounds legit. It's pretty much what I want to do right now with the Navy SEAL contract, but you get to work with everyone else, not just SEALs I'm like, that sounds legit. That was like the biggest thing that piqued my interest. was like, that is so cool. Also, you don't have to go to Buds. I was like, that's kind of cool too. So I was like, okay, two strike or two really good pros. Now the huge con is I pretty much have to tell the dive motivators over here that I don't want to be a Navy SEAL anymore and I want to go EOD. So was like, all right, you know. Let me talk to the guy first. And he's kind of a weirdo. Honestly, I forget his name. But that and that was my that was my perspective of you. He was like, this guy is f*cking weird. Okay. But these guys are legit. And, okay, I'm just gonna go talk to him. So I was like, Hey, and I wish I could remember his name. I really wish because he was a great guy. And he's like, he was all about it. I walk into the office. times. So I think it's better that we don't remember his name. true. That's true. But you know, he would probably own it. And a lot of you guys are weird, including myself. But yeah, so I go into his office, I'm like, you know, so and so student on deck, blah, blah, blah, And he's like, what, what do you want? And like, seem to recruit Lee, what do you want? Like, I was just looking to reclass to EOD. He's like, drinking coffee. Not looking at me, of course. Why would he ever look at me? We're having a conversation. he's like drinking his coffee. He likes does like the doctor evil turn around his chair, you know, what did you just say? And I'm like, I want to see if I can switch my Navy SEAL contract to EOD. If that's even a thing, I don't know. I figured I'd talk to you first. He's like, sets his coffee cup down like hard on this desk. It's like, my God, I'm to get like my A$$ chewed or something. And he's like, that is fantastic. And he's like, yes, we can do that. Stand over there, he goes out of office. I'm like, okay, cool. This is kind of nice. And then he like goes next door to the Navy SEAL guy. And then I was like, oh man, this is going to be rough. So then he'd like the, they come back in with like Navy SEAL guy in tow and he's like, what the F*CK?! See him and recruit Lee. You think you can just do whatever you want? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's like in my face, like, like really upset. He's like, you didn't even come talk to me first, blah, blah. And really just trying to, you know, that intimidation factor. And I'm like, I'm just thinking to myself, like, I haven't done anything yet. So I can switch. And this is like, and this is like kind of the thing that was kind of in my soul is like, you need to switch to EOD. That's what you want to do. This is what you, this is where you're going. Something inside me said that. Whether it was God, 10 year old me, whatever, both, he's like, do this, right? Do this. And I was like, okay, I will listen. And that's what I'm gonna do. So that's what I did. SEAL guy I was not happy about it. But then the EOD guy was like super jazzed about it. And he's like, this literally never happens, right? This literally never happens. It's usually, you like you fail out for whatever reason you quit. And then it's like, reclass the EOD, know, like that's, that's, that's like, you know, they're called buds duds. have a lot in UD, but you know, like, that's what we would always like, you know, lovingly call the buds duds. You know, that's just what they are. so yeah, he was super pumped. He's like, yeah, he just came in was like, yeah, this is just what I want to do. Cause he had a conversation with an EOD guy and like, they knew each other, like the Mobile _ three guys. So he's like, yeah, I talked to them, and they're like, Hey, we heard what you did. And I was like, It was awesome. And I was like, I told, was like, you know, I don't even think this is crazy. Like, I don't even know how often you guys like, this is literally the first time we've ever sponsored a bootcamp division. And so yeah, good thing we did because we got one. um So then yeah, the rest is history. didn't, I never looked back and you know, it was, that was my pathway to EOD. Didn't even know what it was. Had a couple of conversations with some dudes from OB and a three and yeah, one of them is no longer with us. unfortunately. But yeah, the other guy is still alive, I talked to him, I like we're in the same, EOD brothers group, you know, on signal, whatever. And now it's, it's cool how things just work out sometimes. So let me, let me, I had said before that I was going to circle back to this now because of our previous point about you talking to your, to your younger self. So now knowing where you went and knowing what you've been able to do in EOD, going back to yourself at whatever age, what would you tell yourself as far as Would you still take the exact same route you went or would you have tried buds or like, what would that conversation be like if you're a hundred percent honest with yourself? Is there any part of you that kind of regrets? Is it a hundred percent, you know, exactly this is the way that God meant it for you or I'm just curious about that. Yeah, no, the the only other thing that I would have done in the military is probably be an A-10 pilot, knowing what I know now, because that is legit. Those guys are my heroes. But and gals, but no, like, like to this is no, I don't think I and it's hard to say, right? Because like, if I tell him, right, I'm like, just go EOD right out of the gate, dude, trust me, it's awesome. Look this thing up. Like Who knows what timeline that would have been. mean, granted, it should be the same timeline, because it's like bootcamp, same thing. Granted, my orders didn't come through right away after I graduated bootcamp, Granted, it was only like a couple days. But I will say this, especially if there's like active duty guys that are still Enlisting or that are Enlisting that are still in, and it's like, dude, everything in my career, I was not hand selected for Jack. in squat, right? It was luck of the draw. I showed up at the right time at the right place. The stars were aligned and it's like this is what's happening. And you just like the thing that you can do, right? The only thing that helps you stay on that trajectory and doing the things is being prepared, right? Being a consummate professional at whatever your job is, like doing it to the like above and beyond degree. So you are just ready. Like I was a new guy, I checked in we were slotted to deploy to Helman to support the Marines down in Helman, right? Doing RCP route clearance patrols. So it's like the bomb patrol Afghanistan, right? That's what we were going to, that's what we were slotted to go do with my platoon And then halfway through our workup and an RFF comes down from the Ranger regiment. And it's like, specifically written for Navy EOD because Army has EOD, but it was specifically written for Navy EOD just because of these things that we can do. And we picked it up. We picked it up. And it was my platoon. They're like, okay, cool. Who's getting ready to go? Cool. We'll shift this platoon over to support that RFF, request for forces. And I was like, okay, that sounds legit. A lot of my higher ups like the mobile unit leadership. was at mobile unit 12 and the dirty dozen is what we call ourselves. um They're like, you have like four new guys on this platoon. We have to move these bodies around. There's no way those new guys are gonna go. Me being one of them. So I think our company SEA. He was the senior chief. He comes in and I think it was like trying to like a scare attack, like, you know, if anyone wants to be off the platoon because of this reason or whatever, this is very risky. It's not what we're doing before. It's like, really don't have like the time to get a ton of training before we go. like it's, it's just, you've been doing a, combat expeditionary support workup, which is like for bomb bombs. So I'm not like discrating that, but there's a lot more like dismounted training that we would do otherwise as that type of platoon that we just didn't do because we were a mounted platoon, right? We were gonna be in vehicles. We were gonna have bomb suits. We were gonna have robots. We were gonna have all the tools that you can think of that you guys have at our disposal. And now it's like, nope, you're gonna have what you can carry. And it's a specialized skill. You're gonna be potentially going hands on IDs and blah, blah, blah, blah, right? So we're like, okay. I'm like, cool, I trust the training. I'm in it, right? That's what I wanna do. This is, I'm not gonna quit my platoon. haven't quit anything so far. except for my Navy SEAL contract back in the day. And that was the best decision of my life. So I'm not, I'm not quitting this. My best friend at the time, he was also my roommate calls me on the way home and he's like, dude, I took myself off the platoon. I'm like, what, what are you talking about? I'm like, Explain yourself. Are you thinking about this? I'm like, just think about just sleep on it, dude. And because it's a great opportunity. And we have an excellent our platoon headshed was awesome, dude, tons of experience. These are the guys that you wanted as a new guy, right? They're like, yes, they will hold you to the coals if you mess up for sure. But they were in EOD. It's not really about just pounding the new guys. It's like, yeah, you're gonna get pounded as a new guy no matter what. But the emphasis is on training. Like you will get trained, they will teach you everything you need to know. You need to show up though and be able to receive it. And they will pour into you as long as you're showing up and working hard, they will continuously pour into you. The moment you mess up, it's going to be, yep, you're going to, there's going to be some coals involved, but it's all for, mean, yeah, obviously it's a new guy, right? You do the sh-t jobs, whatever you just do it. You got to do those jobs better than anyone else. And you take the trash out like no one has ever seen. the trash being taken out before in their life, right? Right? You just do it. And then that just shows, cause that just shows that you're ready. And two for the next thing and the next thing and the next thing it's like, if they're doing that with the trash, they're going to do really well with this. then boom, that's just how it happens. Then you move up, you do that, you do that job, that next task better than anyone has ever seen it. And boom, this like, okay, cool. That's just how this guy is now, right? That's now that's the reputation. And so I wasn't about to quit my buddy he called he's like already already called you know our SEA already called him and told him that I wanted to be out there I was like dude you're an idiot that that was literally my my first word to him when I when he told me I was like you are an idiot now as you know as being older and a little I was like dude what are you like people would kill to be in your position right now and I just that was like my first thought I was like dude But you know, kudos to him, you know, he was not ready. And you know, his his rationale was like, he didn't want to get anyone else killed. Right. And I was like, you know what, that's that's really good self-awareness. And that is pretty courageous. If you want to say that, you know, it's kind of it's hard for guys like us to say that. And that kind of still, even though I know the truth, like that still like hurts coming out of my mouth. But it's like. If you are and that's like the number one thing, it's like if your heart is not in the job. and you are like elsewhere, this is not the right job for you. uh And he realized that as a new guy. So whether that was cowardice or, you know, or just really good self awareness, you know, probably a little bit of both at the time, but you know, good on he's still alive and well, and he's got a family of his own. And who knows that might not have been the case had he had he not done that. So, you know, a powerful lesson, right? Because so many people, we're both gonna be saying the same things, because we've both done the same things where we didn't know what it was we were really getting ourselves into, but we jumped at the chance to do it, and we prepared ourselves the best that we possibly could to be ready when that time came. You didn't know about side stroke. There's things I didn't know to prepare for, but I prepared the best that I possibly could and over-delivered. what you describe as taking out the trash. I want to point this out. How do you take out trash better than anybody else has ever taken it out before? This is my answer to that. You anticipate. The idea is that whenever somebody needs that trash to be taken out, it is taken out the second that it needs to be, and it takes no longer than humanly possible for that to be replaced so that their literal trash can goes from It needs to be taken out to, it's already been taken out. here's the brand new one. And it's, it's that anticipation. it's it, that one thing carries you everywhere in your career where you're anticipating when I become a recruiter, I'm anticipating what my boss needs from our team next. And so I jump on it and start building it, even though I'm not tasked with this, I start working on it. So I get familiarized with the new system we're going to the new platform, this new AI that's coming in. whatever it is in life, you start anticipating what it is. And that's communication with your boss, communication with your wife. So your marriage works that way too. Anticipation is how you over-deliver. And that's how you set yourself apart from 99.99 % of everybody in this generation. And for the kids growing up today, it's so easy for you to stand out. In my day, everybody was working hard. Now, not everybody jumped at the chances and took the risks. But everybody had a level of just decency as a man to perform. Whereas nowadays so many kids are out of shape and are not even physically able to do Navy EOD if they really wanted to right out of the gate because their body has been sitting on a couch and playing video games their whole life. But I've seen guys I've served with guys who change that trajectory who grew up the whole their whole life out of shape playing video games. And then they decided to be a Marine and It was rough for him going through bootcamp and it was hilarious whenever he couldn't do a single pull-up and the drill instructors are absolutely eating him. Every drill instructor from all the companies attacking him at once. It was hilarious for us because I had put in that work. But again, we didn't look down on him like he's a dirt bag. Some did. I didn't because I already knew. It's going to happen to you eventually at something because you weren't ready for the side stroke. Something's going to come out. that eventually you're going to have to struggle at. And it's that ability to struggle at it and not give up. And what you did was not giving up as a Navy SEAL. You went in knowing this was something hard and it was going to be worth it. But then you were self-aware enough to go, actually, this EOD thing sounds exactly like what my personality would be a great fit for. I'm going to get to work with all kinds of units. If you don't mind, just share what all units You don't have to be super in depth, but what all units you got to serve with as Navy EOD. Yeah. got to serve with the Rangers. Um, you know, we accepted that RFF and deployed with two seven five and then, did 3/75 seven five after that. And then, we support, green berets, and Navy SEALs mean, there's, there's always 2 Navy EOD guys on every Navy SEAL platoon period, like every single and a platoon. that is like a requirement. and we support the Rangers. don't know if we still do that. That's kind of like calm down a lot. especially with the lack of, you know, not, don't want to say the lack of like, as if I'm sad that there's not a war, but you know, the population that we come from, it's like, that is kind of a sad thing. cause we're not doing our jobs, but you know, from a normal person perspective, that is a good thing, that our country is not involved in a war. Yeah. And then Green Berets. Yeah. We have, mean, my last duty station was a parachute proficiency instructor and, cause Navy UD has our own air program and it's designed to get a level one certification, which is a night, unknown, unmarked DZ wall locker from 30,000 feet. Right. So it's HAHO High Altitude HIGH Opening jump you're going in and that is, that is so like Green Berets come to that course. so they can get that search. So when they're on like the, the Cree or whatever they're calling it nowadays, like the crisis response force, the CRIF or whatever, whatever it is called nowadays. but that is like the level one cert is needed. They come to PPT, EOD, PPT to get it. And so EOD guys also like that are supporting them. They'll come through as like that CRIF platoon and get that certification to support the green berets. So it's like, we're very intertwined with every special operations. command or organization pretty much that there is. It's great. I call us the we're like the ultimate enablers. I that's like my thing for you to it's awesome. It was so cool being with the Rangers. I thought that was an incredible experience. Just from the sheer like it was an experience. I'll say that my first Yeah, it was a So I mean, that's why, and it was awesome. Like again, I totally lucked out because that's why that's why Bootcamp J was like, I want to go EOD to work with everyone. And I was able to do that. Like I got super lucky, super fortunate, like right out of the gate. It's like, boom, Army Rangers. Next, boom, Navy SEALs. Next, I'm working with Green Berets giving them the level one cert. It's funny because everyone it's like all the communities are pretty much the same, right? Everyone like the mentality is very similar. The guys very similar. And it's like the things like the tactics are slightly different, right? It's everyone's like, oh, they do. They're so f*cked up because they go low port. We should go high port. It's like, dude, who cares? Right. And like that's it's fun, like sibling rivalry, if you will. I mean, that's like the closest thing to equate it because at the end of the day, we're all in the same team and It's I mean, it's hilarious with the seals like back home, if you will. And they're like, Oh, how is it with the Rangers? You know, sign those like it's actually pretty awesome. I never I never once wondered about anything that would happen on an op where it's like then I'm with the Navy SEAL teams like they were what vehicle my riding in like I have no idea because everyone's like, too cool. It's like, Oh, yeah, yeah, we're going on this mission. a little bit for somebody who's not familiar with it at all. So you're saying with the Ranger specifically during the operation order when everybody gets together and you go over what the mission is, they were a little bit more detailed is what you're saying. say they're very regimented. I think there's a perfect word for that. Yeah, the perfect word. It's like, yeah, except I did have a joke that no one really found funny one night we were is the con op, I was with a third battalion at the time. And so I've been with the Rangers for a while now. I pretty much have more time with the army than the Navy the comps happening, right? Everyone's going through their slides, blah, blah. It's like the EOD slide. And everyone, right? As you know, like you stand up, Rangers lead the way, my call sign, this is what we're going to do, blah, blah, So I stand up and like EOD clears the way, silence, just crickets. I was like, that sucked. I thought that was going to hit. the platoon sergeant, just like spins around, does a doctor evil, the same thing. I get this a lot apparently. He like turns around, just like looks at me and just like. just now. I was like, Jack, got it. Yeah, got it. And so yeah, but it was I mean, the con that was like, dude, in and out, like, I'm going to be in this bird, I'm going to be in this seat. And I'm going to be next to this person on my left, this person on my right, I'm going to be carrying these things like everyone like I knew what you were carrying, I know exactly what you had, you knew exactly what I had, you knew where I was, you know, what bird I was in, you know, a bird I was going to be on leaving. And that's just like, that was the ranger way, which I realized I was like, dude, this seems like a bit much, honestly, like, it's it's like, the beaten a dead horse. And then I got to the SEAL teams. I'm like, what is happening? I don't even know where I'm supposed to be during this operation. Like, well, I know I'm going to be up front somewhere. But who's going to be with me? Right? Who's going to be there? And what do you have? What do you have available? Like, you know, it's crazy. The the difference. And then it's like, you kind of like work with it. And it's like, okay, cool. I speak your language. Now I get it. Right. But that was like the biggest, I would say the biggest difference is just like that regimented Conop versus the like, and this is not all SEAL teams and organizations like that, obviously, but like, you know, different tiers conduct themselves differently, I would say, even even as far as you know, something like a jumpmaster brief, right, is much different on the white side. Then it is like, you know, like on like a regular Navy SEAL team, then it is at, the, dam neck that guys, right. the DevGru guys, which is different than the Delta guys, which I've never done. at PBT, we had a lot of former Delta guys as our contractors to kind of teach us like how they taught this exact thing. And that's where I like our, our jump program It's modeled after, the jump program at dam neck, but that group, but it's run like we had a lot of Delta instructors. So like even our curriculum is so like enriched in different like organizations. It's like we're taking this curriculum, which they do. And we're going to cause I think that they need the level one cert also obviously, cause they're a tier one asset, but then it's being taught to us by army, CAG guys. So it's like, man, this is like, the different perspectives and everything. And it's like, we run stuff and then I like, I now contract sometimes with the white side seals and I am doing these jumpers. I'm like, dude, and I'm talking like the jump masters that are kind of coming through. like, this is not clear, right? You have to talk about these things like, dude, why, man, everyone gets it. And so, but it's just like the totally different like mentality. It's like, look, and what, how it was explained to me by one of our, one of our Delta guys is like, we're always with other people. always. It's not us, right? It's not just you and your bros. Like we have enablers, we have foreign military, we have other people, we have all kinds of people. And we need to know that every single one of them knows every single thing. So I'm not talking to you, like you're a child. I'm talking to everyone. So everyone is on the same page. I'm like, that checks out. And that makes total sense, right? And it's like, that is the caliber. It's not like we're so good. We've made it like this to this tip of the spear, you know, level. And we can just like not talk about stuff anymore. It's like, no, now we're at that level. We need to talk about it more. And the basics become way more important because everyone needs to be completely locked on and on the same page for every single detail. it was a different, I mean, with the Rangers we were at, like, you know, operating in Afghanistan, doing the DA thing and all that. So it was a different, it was a different, it was a different ball game, right? When I was with SEAL team 8 was, village stability operation and that was just like, it was a sh-t show in a different way, right? It was just a totally different job. So yeah, it just like the, it's not apples to apples. It's just like being a chameleon and being able to adapt in the different situation you're in. It's like, we're not doing, we're not going after high value targets anymore. with little birds following us. And you know, it's like, well, that's cool and everything. That is like a totally different realm than going out all day on a village stability operations. Like that is like, that is like the endurance thing. This is like, we're doing, we're doing sprints, like we're taking turns doing sprints here. I mean, I remember like my, my Ranger buddy, the squad leaders, the different ones that I was with, like with who was going to be like on containment or ISO. We'd be in the back of the 47 and we just like give each other the nod like. I'm going to smoke you to target today. You know, and it's like, that was like the thing. So it's like, soon as the ramp hit, and this probably became a little complacent on my part, because I'm just like an all out sprint. Granted, we're, we, I've already done the research as far as like the EOD job is concerned. It's like, cool. We picked the HLZs, the lowest threat areas, like we're doing the job. So it's like, it's relatively safe to just run all out without really having to look at it. And it's at night, so whatever. And so the ramp drops and we're just like running the target. And it's like, yes, I got you, dude. I'm like that, that became the thing of like racing each other to target. And it was awesome. That was like some of the best times I had was, was doing that, it a different ball game with, with the seals. I mean, a of those guys too, I was on a great platoon. It was just different, something you touch on there just like you're still able to have fun and you're still able to have moments of still getting to be a kid. And that's the one thing that I, whenever I grew up reading Navy Navy SEAL books, cause nobody else was writing books. the, thing that I forget the name of that one book, but I've read it multiple times and he kept saying in it and explaining like when you get to be a Navy Navy SEAL, You can kind of be a little reckless and a little crazy. I remember he climbed the towers at airborne school and tied a Navy SEAL flag up and then, you know, climbed down. So when everybody came out to train the next day for airborne school, there was a Navy SEAL flag hanging from the top of the towers. Well, that's like whatever it was, you know, a couple hundred feet up in the air. And he just literally climbed out there with his arms and ties this thing up and could have died doing the stupid stunt. But that's, you know, especially when combat comes around because you have to be careful, but at the same time, there's moments where you can sprint all out to get to the objective first and win a foot race, right? That's what you did when you were five, 10, eight years old, you know, but here you are in combat and you know that you can do that stuff. you, one thing you talked about and touched on that I want to make sure everybody understands Number one, Navy EOD is the number one EOD. So, so just to dispel that I went through airborne school with two guys who are former Marines. That's just a fact. Like everybody knows it. Nobody, nobody who is honest is going to dispute that because you guys go through more training and just the level of the quality of the people who come out kind of like one 160th SOAR There are more than one. 160th unit, but you always want the Kentucky boys to be the ones flying you. And it's the same kind of a thing. Yeah. Army has EOD. other units have EOD, but the Navy guys are the ones you want on your team for that terrible moment, you know, where something really bad has gone sideways and you need the best guy to do it. So that is one thing I just want to dispel. also you spent more time with the army, spent more time with other units. Most people don't understand as I didn't know anything about that until I'm there working with an Air Force TACP _ and I'm like, wait, that's, makes no sense. Why does he live with us completely on base? Like he's living on an army base when he's deployed, he's only living with us. Like he never sees Air Force guys except for the other TACP P's in our units. so there's very few. jobs like that in the military, but when you get in one like you described, it's phenomenal. And if I were telling myself to go back and I were able to pick, I can't say that I would undo my time in the Rangers regiment because I wouldn't. However, if there was a job that I would be more interested in going, if I had a second life, it would probably be either Navy EOD, obviously A-10. I don't know that I'm smart enough for that. not saying maybe EOD is less, but I'm maybe, EOD or TACP or one of the units that's, that's able to work with all kinds of PJs that get to you really get to be utilized by all the branches. You get that exposure, you get that brotherhood with these people. And I know from working with the EOD guys and especially the TacPs, like, I'm not saying you're the coolest kid, but you're just like, You're outside of all these stupid games we have to play. You guys got shielded from a lot of the stupid and got better pay and got better food in some instances than us some. So that's the one thing I would say now, cause we didn't have Google when I was coming up. Do that research ahead of time. If you're looking into the military, so you don't have to get to Navy SEAL program and then go tell a SEAL instructor that you don't want to be a SEAL anymore. any other jobs like TACP P Navy EOD. Is there any other jobs like that where you get to work with all different units from all different branches? I don't like PJs for sure. mean, PJs, tactics are like an EOD. That's like the, they're everywhere, right? We're, we're intertwined at all levels of, you know, the SOF world. And it is just like that. That's yeah, that's a, that's a big one. I mean, for women, the CST program, that was like, that was a huge deal. you can kind of get in with, you know, Rangers, CAG, Dam Neck like whichever. And, You can screen for either of those. And that's like a, that's like a cool thing for the females where it's like the opportunity is there. And if you want to put in the work, you can work at one of those units, which is pretty incredible because you wouldn't be able to otherwise. and so yeah, that was like, and I mean, there's mixed, there's mixed bag on, you know, the CST and all that kind of stuff, but it is a program that exists. And that's like another like, you know, opportunity that is out there that I thought was pretty unique. They handled the parrot patches, what we called it at two seven five and three seven five. I don't know what the beach boys called it. Yeah, I was gonna say you were talking about how regimented 3rd Battalion was whenever they were doing their op orders. I will say of the three Ranger Battalions, 3rd Battalion is at the flagpole. So I guarantee you they are the most regimented. The Beach Boys, we are known for being a little bit more lax. you know, when I was getting out, most of my buddies were going to the CAG tryouts. And I remember specifically, You know what the percentages that make it versus who don't because you know how many guys go away and how many return and our guys when I was getting out no five was a hundred percent every single person we sent got selected and 275 and 375 375 was basically the exact same. was like 50 % roughly in that, you know a little bit above and below but there's something about the leaders that came through our battalion Four star General Clark who just ran SOCOM and now runs General Dynamics was my last direct supervisor. Like I was the battalion commander's assistant slash driver But he was such a phenomenal human being who had spent most of his entire career back and forth in the Rangers. RRD when that, you know, before it switched over Every time he was trying to get back into special operations, every opportunity he got, and then you see what plays out. Colonel Thomas, who was with us, both of them are up there with multiple stars on their, on their uniforms as they're, you know, switching out who's in charge of all of special operations, So I think we were just super blessed and like you talked about before, like God, If you are putting yourself out there, you're going to be put in places that you can look back and go, man, it is insane that I made it through all of that and I got to this place. But you don't get to that place like you and I, where you have stories that people maybe want to listen to, unless you put yourself out there. You go out and run miles when everybody else is sleeping. And for the young guys, especially who are not married, that is a huge benefit. Do not try to go do the routes that we went being married. Like so many guys get so dumb and they find the one and she happens to be the one from high school that you dated last. And then they get married right out of boot camp, right out of your initial training. And then they try to drag them through this lifestyle. And it's just not meant for a married person. It just really isn't. You're being single is a huge advantage that take that time and invest it in, you and your body and being physically fit. And you have no idea if you'll volunteer the opportunities that you'll get to be a part of. Absolutely. Yeah, you got to the work in. Yeah, to your point, there's another meaning to EOD that not a lot of people know. It's everyone's divorced. But that is if they go the route that you just talked about. And I can speak on that. I can't speak on the divorce aspect because I have not divorced She still loves me. But my wife actually was in the Marines when CST was right. There was the lioness program. And then they started like creating CST. My wife was a diesel mechanic in the Marine Corps and she was deployed to Iraq and they reached out to her. Like, if you'd like to be a part of the lioness program and da da da. And I remember my wife calling me and saying, Hey, babe, there's this really cool program. You know, I'm gonna be attached to force recon and yeah, you know I get to go through this training and you know, they're looking for volunteers I was like if you want to stay married the answer is no Well, but I haven't even told you I don't you said force recon and you said extra training for other things That's not how this marriage works. I got out and you joined and I'm cool with the six years. You're putting in But if you want to go hang out with force recon and just be friends, that's not how that works. So yeah. Yeah. They specifically picked me, honey. Yeah. I know exactly why they picked you. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Awesome. By the way. Hey, I don't want to, again, I didn't want to make this podcast just you coming and telling war stories that you've told, you know, many times again, I really wanted to focus on how you got to be. a you know somebody who's coaching other men that are older than them that have more money than them that you're somebody that people are looking to to learn how to build that wealth to have that family and one of the things you said like me and my wife are about to celebrate 18 years together and man I waited until I was 27 I had already I'd already been in the Marines I'd already been in the Rangers I had already spent a couple years in law enforcement, you know, before I ever actually made the decision to marry somebody. And I was going to hold out as long as it took because that decision was the most important decision aside from becoming a Christian. Giving my life to Christ is number one. But number 2 is that marriage and who you're marrying because even in the military, guess what? If you went in as a cook in the Air National Guard, Guess what happens if you show up and crush the PFT. They're going to, somebody's going to come over and go, you don't need to be here. You need to be somewhere else. And that's exactly what happens. You're, you know, CST for females. Guess what? Newsflash people that are at much higher levels than even the units we've mentioned were females and they were in there long before Obama and any, any changes to the military selection process. I know of women who just. crushed it on PT all the time and had that mental discipline and they were literally hand picked out of nowhere and brought up to units that recruit from DevGru, that recruit from Delta, that recruit from the highest units you know of. There's always a way up and if you put forth the effort and you just take out the trash better than anybody's ever taken out the trash, people are going to pay attention to that because you don't do that by accident. That happens 100%. If you're always there on time, in the right uniform, right place, right time, that's gonna happen for you. And it's just the way life works. You just gotta put yourself in those positions. So. Yeah, people recognize the intentionality of it. And that's a very underrated thing. I think that is not talked about a lot, but it's just like the intentionality behind the things that you just said. I mean, that is that's what people like. And that's who you surround yourself with. And that's what I want to end our podcast on. You talked about the mentors when you were young, finding people that aren't cool, not finding people with the nicest car that have the most money. You're finding people with character. You're finding people you can rely on and people that want to invest in you and invest time to help you as a young man and to grow up and be mature and do the right things, not do the flashy things. Nothing is more sickening than seeing a kid get success and all of his money goes to a chain around his neck and a nice new car and, you know, some super superficial girl with all kinds of cosmetic, surgeries at 18 years old. And I'm just like, like that kid isn't so lost. I really hope that he makes it that I'm not looking at that kid with envy because he has more money than me or whatever. It's the exact opposite. I know what that's going to look like in 10 years and it's not going to be pretty. You know, so, so to that, what would you share with anybody? Just kind of at the end here. would just say put it all in perspective, that's what I do, you know, with the like the personal finance out of the house, like you mentioned. Yeah, I've talked to people that are much older than me about their money and talking to people about their money is sacred, pretty much. Especially like I mean, I've trusted people with my life. People have entrusted me with their lives. My their wives have entrusted me with their husband's lives and that is not lost on me, but people trusting you with their money is right up there. If not more so, I would say, then even like, dude, I trust you with my life, let's go. I could ask that same guy, like, dude, what's your debt to income ratio like, why are you being so personal? Like, dude, chill. Like, what are you doing? And I'm like, like, hey, don't you want to ask me who I voted for in the last election? I'd rather tell you that. It's a huge problem. I think that we have in the military still today. We definitely had it when I was in. And it's just like in every circle. I think that this I feel like the younger generations are getting better about talking about money more publicly. But there's still a long way to go. because there's a stigma about it, right? We want to just be good with money. We want to be known as being good with money. like I, I, and it might not even be in this thought, but it's like we're stewards, right? I believe that, right? It's not my money. It's God's money. I am being trusted to steward just like my kids, right? Those are God's children that he entrusted me to be their parent. Right? So that is like a huge steward. ship thing that we have to do. Money is no different. It's like what you are given, you are supposed to be a steward of period. And now, I mean, a lot of people don't think of it that way. But right, I def I didn't write I'm not preaching up here from a high horse or anything. I was terrible with money, right? I was that guy that bought a truck brand new as an E four with my enlistment bonus. And it was gone like that, right? And I didn't even think about taxes. because I was that dumb, right? I was that guy. I was like, cool, this will pay for it. tax tag title, that's a lot more now than I originally thought. Yeah, there you go. So that's called a stupid tax that I paid. But yeah, I was not always good with money. And that's a huge part of my story about like putting things in perspective, never losing sight, never losing sight of why you do something. And that is way harder than it sounds, right? I can say that all day, but it is so incredibly hard to actually execute that, right? I rose my hand for a reason to support and defend the constitution, much like you did, much like a lot of other people did for a very deeply personal reasons that everyone may have had or may not have had, but like mine, I feel like we're very personal, very deep and very like, like I finally was able to do something right. Because When I was 11, I felt so inadequate about not being able to do anything. I'm too young, too little, too whatever to do anything to help. And then somehow my path led me to Navy EOD whose main mission, like if you boil it all down, the mission of Navy EOD and EOD as a whole is the protection of personal and property. That comes out of one of our publications. is like, that is our bread and butter. The protection of personal and property. The very thing that I could not do. when I was 11 years old, September 11th, that was like nowhere in my wheelhouse. That was my primary job now. And that's what I rose my right hand to do, to find something like that. And I found exactly what I was looking for. And yet, the lifestyle, the money, the fun, the excitement, the brotherhood, like even the brotherhood can be, it's great. It can also be a negative thing when you get too wrapped up in it. Mm-hmm. that there's life outside of that, right? And that was me. That's what I cared about. like, these are my brothers. one of the years of a workup, I looked at one of my credit card statements, and this is as a E5. I'm special, so it's a little bit more than normal, but still, it's E5 pay. Right? You're not a millionaire, period. And I spent like $25,000 just in bars alone. Like just in bars alone. That's not that's not including the truck that I bought. That's bars alone. That is alcohol, right? That's insane. And that's that's where I was. And that's was my end to justify it, back to the high school sweetheart thing. Me and my wife. We were, we kind of started dating in high school, right? Senior year, March, like it was like, she was valedictorian, I was class flirt type deal. She was going pre-med, I was enlisting in the Navy. So it's like polar opposites, Polar opposites, which I think is a key to the success, But we didn't get married out of high school, right? We had, we each wanted to do really big things, right? In our own right. And we, the key, the key was we respected what each other was trying to do. And this is like, this blows my mind to this day, So 2 kids are sitting in a car. And I'm like, I really like you. This is like March of oh, wait, ish timeframe. So I'm 18 at this time, she's still 17. And I'm like, but I'm getting ready to leave for the Navy. that's gonna happen. You're going to college, right? we just started dating and like all this. And this is me who I know I'm like the class flirt. Okay. I'm like, I respect you too much to drag you through this whole thing if you don't want to be involved. And I'm like, I totally get it. If you're not. I don't know if that was me like looking for an out like you do it. I'm not gonna be the one to do it. You do it. Right. But she was on board. It's like, No, I, I, you know, I like you a lot. And I respect what you're doing. And you know, that I think that's really neat and cool, whatever. And like I said, the same things to her. It's like, you know, I just want you to be able to focus and do what you got to do and still have a good time and whatever. And We agreed in that that night. It's like if anyone for whatever reason is not feeling it, just like don't waste the other person's time. Right. That's what that's what our deal was. We had it. And this this blows my mind that I had this conversation at 17 because I was not mature. So and this is my one redeeming moment that I had as a teenager is like I respected her. I respected what she was doing. She respected me, respected what I was doing. And we agreed like, we're not going to waste each other's time if that changes. So we did that. We did the long distance thing. You know, it was tough. It was hard. It one of the hardest things I think I've ever done. so that was 18. We got married when I was 26. So that was a long time, right? We did it for a long time because like you said, it's like, I'm not doing this. I'm not going to marry someone before I even deploy and like know what their what their medal is, you know, and vice versa. It's like, I don't know what I'm going to be like. So we did that. Like she went through all those deployments as my girlfriend and was like, yeah, you know, I'm still in it, whatever. And like she was graduating from med school very soon. And I was like, yeah, you know, I think it's about time we got married. Girls go on the medical route and guys going in on a sale contract. Those are the most polar out like not the likelihood that those 2 are going to be faithful and stick to each other and then make it. You know what I mean? Yeah, way less than 1%. Yeah. Wow, brother. That's, that's, you know, that again, that's a testimony. Like everybody wants to hear the war stories. Nobody wants to hear the hardest, one of the hardest things you've ever done. is doing that as having a long distance relationship, but what's the most rewarding, right? And now you have three sons and you get to watch them. You know, as you described, my son is the same way. Right now he's in this weird phase where she can't be out of the room. I'm right there and I'm like, hey, I'm not chopped liver, get over here. I'm the one that plays with you. I'm chasing you around. And he's crying if she's out of the room. He has to be able to see her right now. But I love that because that's going to switch back. to where he wants dad instead of mom. And, you know, again, there's just nothing like putting your priorities in the right, in the right direction, working toward those as you're helping people do every day now. And it's never too late. And that's the, that's the thing I want to end on. It's never too late to start doing the right thing, no matter what you've done in your life or what has happened to you or in your life. It doesn't matter if you come from money or not from money. It doesn't matter if you're talented or not because I am one of the most untalented people you will ever meet in your life. I don't really have a talent. I just keep going and I run face first in the wall after wall and eventually I find a door or a open window and I climb through that and then I end up somewhere else and you can do the exact same thing. And if you just keep trying to do hard things and put yourself into positions to where You're meeting new people. You never know where those people are going to take you. And that's what's happened to me my whole life. And it sounds like the same thing has happened to you. Yeah, yeah, sign up for something, put yourself out there, be uncomfortable. Then know, then you get comfortable, then push yourself even harder. I mean, like that's that's the only thing you can do. Like I would say I'm not super talented really at anything either. But the difference is like probably with both of us and a lot of the guys that we know in our communities, it's just like we will show up every single day and do what is required. Period. Like it's not even a question. It's like it doesn't matter what is going on in the world. It doesn't matter what the weather is. doesn't matter what, you know, what my neighbor is doing or if there's a birthday, it's like, dude, I will do it. Period. Like, and that's it. Like that is the difference of our communities. And I would say Jen Pop is like, I mean, there's a lot of hustlers out there that are of the same mentality and we, we recognize them when we seems like, dude, we're cut from the same cloth. You would have been great in this community. but it's like, You know, like you have that recognition. It's like, okay, cool. Yeah, I see you. I see you over there. It's like, I know what you will. You will do what it takes. and yeah, that's just like, that's the thing to show up, just show up. That's the biggest thing. And if you don't going to do it for anyone else, do it for the guy in the mirror to tie it all back, show up for that guy because that guy he's been through a lot already and he can survive anything. Right. You just have to show up for him and keep going for him. These kids can ask some meat, not just flashy, not something, not just appetizers. You know, everybody's getting these little sound bites and nobody's talking about how important that time is with your kids and your marriage and your finances and all the difficult parts of being a grownup that nobody talks about or really cares to talk about. It's huge. It's huge. The way you manage your calendar and your budget that will tell you everything you need to know about a person. I guarantee it because how you spend your time and how you spend your money is those are the two things that will highlight no matter what anyone says. Look at those. The most the thing you spend the most time on and the thing you spend the most money on is what you truly care about and you feel is the most important. So. And if that's you and you were like, man, well, I spent a lot of time doing this thing. It's been a lot of money on this thing. Look at that. Is that truly important to you? Is it aligned with your definition of freedom? Does it help you get there? If it's a no, change it today. Like now, just change it like no one can do that except for you. No one did it for me. No one did it for Seth. We pretty much did it ourselves with a lot of grace. and a lot of help from God probably that's it. you know, our mentors along the way. change starts with you right now.