blew €1.5M then built a $1.2B fund ~ Oliver Holle

Hey Crew! 

Oliver Holle founded his first company as a PhD student at Columbia in the late 1990s. Raised money. Opened four offices. Hired 20 people. And nearly went personally bankrupt for two and a half years with three small kids, no salary, and personal debt of €1.5 million.

He eventually sold to VeriSign, moved to Silicon Valley, came back to Vienna, and built SpeedInvest. Europe's largest seed stage fund. Now managing over $1.2 billion in assets.

This one is full of hard earned wisdom from someone who has been on both sides of the table and paid dearly for every lesson he learned.

We get into 👇:
★ Dropping out of a Columbia PhD to build a startup nobody understood
★ Raising money, blowing it, and nearly going personally bankrupt for two and a half years
★ How threatening to walk away flipped the power dynamic and got him back 100% of his company
★ Why he passed on Bitpanda and ElevenLabs and what that cost him
★ What actually separates founders who make it from those who don't
★ Why the AI revolution feels bigger than the internet and mobile combined

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Transcript

the teaser

SPEAKER_03 0:00

We had to actually take a personal deb a personal loan of pretty significant size, up to a million, would it actually be in personal and private insolvency as well. Zero percent advice to do it. Every single person told me not to do it.

SPEAKER_00 0:12

What's the single most common lie you think that founders often tell investors?

SPEAKER_03 0:16

Passion. We had at 1.5 million euros on the bank as a small Austrian startup that was a wonderful starting position and then we blew it.

SPEAKER_00 0:25

Oliver, welcome. Let's talk about the cloud and not just the peak. You nearly went bankrupt at one point, and you've now backed hundreds of founders who've hit the same walls

💡 dropping a columbia phd for a startup nobody understood

SPEAKER_00 0:35

and challenges that you experienced. What do most of them still get wrong that you wish that they didn't have to figure it out the hard way like you did?

SPEAKER_03 0:43

Oh well, that's a it's a great question. Uh ultimately, I think founders need to have a certain level of ignorance and a certain level of optimism that is irrational, obviously. Uh, and I think striking the balance between keeping that and and staying on your course and true to yourself and really pushing no matter how many signals you get that it will you will fail is a prerequisite for success. At the same time, you have to be, so to say, open enough as a person to receive signals and and get signals on a personal level, how you treat act as a leader on a product level, how the market actually is reacting. And I think this balance is extremely difficult. It's a very major personal journey, I would say. And then I definitely was not ready for that when I started.

SPEAKER_00 1:37

Speaking of when you started, you founded your first company in the late 1990s as a PhD student in the US. Um, and also before the word startup was really a buzzword, and especially in Europe. At that time, what were you looking to build and how did it evolve and pivot over time?

SPEAKER_03 1:53

Yeah, it was almost like there was no other choice, frankly. I think many entrepreneurs have that that it's it's it ultimately it's not a choice, it's a it's a must. And and so I was on my way to finish my PhD in in the US and and I saw the journey of an academic. And then meanwhile, I already had as a side geek my first company up and running, with where we've had projects up and up and coming, and and I knew that this is actually where my heart is, and the other part was was also exciting, and of course, a lot of status involved, uh, getting a PhD from Colombia. So that was actually the most difficult part to let go of expectations also around me, uh, and just focus on this weird, tiny little nothing startup. What was it? So we start we we built uh simulations, particular social economic simulations, um, initially really as a scientific approach, and then increasingly as games.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 2:57

So we tried to create this kind of smart games, a little maybe like SimCity, we don't remember SimCity, but with real data. It was pretty cool. But of course, there was no market for okay.

SPEAKER_00 3:10

So it was a hobby at the time.

SPEAKER_03 3:12

It wasn't a hobby. We got we got a little bit of money from the from the German Green Party or from the city of Vienna. We were at the back, you have to think about it, in 93. We modeled how Europe would react to a carbon a carbon tax. So it was really pretty much ahead of the time. Uh, and and obviously the game told you that if you introduce a carbon tax, you will get kicked out of government. So that was the result of the game, which is also true. So these kind of things was really extremely intellectually exciting, yeah. But not uh no market, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:49

But also very useful to society. So I guess you had kind of two elements, and the most important to make money was missing.

SPEAKER_03 3:55

Yeah, yeah, and uh and uh the the use for society is also limited if you only sell a couple hundred of copies, you don't have too much impact. Yeah, no, but it was great. It was we were we were given that this very specific approach, we were very early on creating interactive games and simulations, and then the web came along, uh the internet, and and we moved very quickly to the internet, and suddenly we were one of the first in Europe, I would argue, that actually did online games. And that actually and then suddenly we became a hot asset in Europe because everybody was creating websites while we already were doing quite complex online games. So that's when Venture came in and we got we raised quite a lot of money, and and that was the start of the actual startup journey. Before that, it was more of a small little company doing small little things.

SPEAKER_00 4:43

So were you still based in the US or did you move to Europe at that time?

SPEAKER_03 4:48

Before we raised the money, I moved to Europe. Yeah. I moved back in in 1999, beginning of 1999.

SPEAKER_00 4:54

Okay. And so when you first raised funds, what did it feel like? Did you feel like there was pressure now to really perform? And how did it change how you operated?

SPEAKER_03 5:03

And yeah, of course. I mean, it was a I think the big difference also to today is that you don't have any context. There's nobody else doing it. Or maybe there are one or two

💸 raising money and blowing it on four offices

SPEAKER_03 5:14

other people doing it. So you have very little chance to calibrate, and and that was actually the problem because we we didn't we we raised as much as we could because that was great. Um, but we had no no chance to to really calibrate our response to all that money. So so one of the big mistakes I did, and I'm actually trying to advise also our founders to not go down that route. Of course, when you go out fundraising, you you have big promises in your deck, and you have all kinds of growth expectations. And if you're really honest to yourself, you know you know you don't you're not gonna make those cross projections, most likely. Uh so what would have been smart, raising that money and then taking a pause, really looking at your product, focus on the product, build that, and only then spend in growth. And we were so excited, and and so we opened up four offices across Europe and in New York, and we we hired very expensive salespeople, but ultimately our product was not at all ready to scale. So it was uh we we and our investors created a little beautiful bubble around ourselves where we believed what we told ourselves, um, and that didn't go anywhere, then of course.

SPEAKER_00 6:33

Unfortunately. And you've publicly talked about the new insolvency that you experienced. What happened?

SPEAKER_03 6:39

Well, it wasn't wasn't, I mean, it's

😰 two and a half years near bankrupt with three kids

SPEAKER_03 6:42

it that wasn't a point, it was uh years. So I think that's that's the first thing. I think people think about this near-death moment. Yeah, that's typically not the case. The the much, much worse situation is when you're in this situation not for one month, two months, but actually for two and a half years. So it's it's a long time. Um, and back then also, the the way equity rounds were structured in Europe, at least in our case, I don't think it was again no context, there was no comparable, but in our context, uh we had to actually take a personal debt, a personal loan of pretty significant size, up to a million. So it was not only that if the company was bankrupt, we would have to start over, but we would actually be in personal in private insolvency as well.

SPEAKER_00 7:29

But it was a uh how did you sleep? That's very stressful.

SPEAKER_03 7:33

Not well. Not well. No, it was very stressful because then of course you don't pay yourselves then almost anything. We didn't have any money. Uh so there was also this personal situation where basically have no money. And I was um I I got um got together with with my current wife, uh, with my with my wife, and we had three small kids. Uh so it was a pretty tough situation. Um but yeah, there was also I think today uh what founders learned is to give up much faster. And back then, even that option, also in combination with this private bankruptcy thing, was so out of the question that there was no other choice than to keep going. Yeah, so we kept going and kept going. And I think one very interesting learning, and I think that's also something I keep telling to founders, is at one point if your back is against a wall, the situation switches. The power the power dynamics switches significantly. Up to that point, all the

🔄 threatening to quit and getting the company back

SPEAKER_03 8:39

power is with the people who have the money because they basically tell you, I give you another 100k or 200k or whatever, and you do what I tell you. The moment you actually liberate yourself from that and you say, Okay, I'm I'm done, I'll I'll quit and I go into bankruptcy, no problem, I start something new. Then suddenly the investors uh uh realize that they need you. Because typically, if I would have left, uh I mean the company would of course been dead. Yeah. So then the situation changed, and we actually struck a quite interesting deal where we got back our shares.

SPEAKER_01 9:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 9:13

We had a little clause where they would get extra money in case of an exit. But uh at that point in time we actually got back 100% of the company again. And then we were able to maneuver again, and then mobile came along. And we we switched uh very quickly to to sell to telcos because they were the only ones that would would give us any money, and that was then the beginning of the turnaround and uh and the happy end that uh eventually came through.

📱 mobile arrives and the turnaround begins

SPEAKER_00 9:40

So when did the acquisition take place? Because mobile was introduced in like what 2003 or something?

SPEAKER_03 9:46

Yeah, something like this. Uh so so we we were very much involved with Ericsson back then. So we so the story was we had the simulations, then with out of the simulations we built an AI recommender engine.

SPEAKER_00 9:59

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 9:59

So this was a yeah, early. Way too early for me to do. Very early, yeah, yeah, totally. So out of this recommender engine, online recommender engine games that we developed, we then created the music recommender engine that we then sold to Ericsson. That was the basis of the success, frankly. And then in 2004, once I got rid of all my former investors, I then merged my company with two other companies. Uh, because we knew, so we were back then 25 people, profitable, but marginally not at a critical size where we knew that US buyers would buy us, too small. So what I did is that then I found two other mobile startups um that were actually in Austria.

SPEAKER_01 10:47

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 10:47

All of them complementary in product, but all in mobile. And out of this, we created this company called Three United. So three companies united. Very practical, very practical brand. Yeah, and this was then suddenly we created a company that was then in total roughly 10 million in revenues, highly profitable, truly uh innovation leader in mobile back then, because it's it's also weird to believe it, but back then Europe was years ahead of the US in terms of tech, in terms of mobile, yeah, because there was no iPhone. Uh, Nokia, Ericsson, Philips, uh, Siemens were the leading companies in that space. So actually, uh, US customers were using us in Austria to run their mobile campaigns. So very, very, very different world. Uh, but that was the basis of then the eventual exit, which we then concluded in 2006. So two years after the merger, we finally, finally, yeah, finally uh sold the company to Verisign, and that was of course then the happy ending of that.

SPEAKER_00 11:53

Very happy Andy. How many years in total was that journey? Did that take place?

SPEAKER_03 11:57

So we we officially uh launched the company in in 1997, so nine years.

SPEAKER_00 12:05

Wow. When you look back at those nine years, it seems like there were definitely a lot of highs and lows, but would you re I guess would you go through it again? Do you think in the end it was actually worth it?

SPEAKER_03 12:17

Of course, of course, of course. I think the I think I would have loved to not make as many mistakes as I did.

SPEAKER_00 12:25

What do you think was the biggest mistake you made?

SPEAKER_03 12:27

Yeah, there was this really this personal ignorance. So the personal ignorance of of of not understanding product development and and and building something that is really that can actually work at scale while following the fast promises I gave to myself and to others. So this kind of put ourselves in a hole that was unnecessary because we were we had at 1.5 million euros on the bank uh as a small Austrian startup that was a wonderful starting position, and then we blew it basically. So that's but again, on the other end, I was um I never worked in a company before. I come from a family of doctors, so I have no so it was just um trial and error, and uh I guess we all did uh a lot of errors.

SPEAKER_00 13:19

I also come from a family of doctors, so I I understand what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_03 13:23

Yeah, you learn.

SPEAKER_00 13:24

You do. If you've made it this far, we are basically friends. Watching on YouTube, hit the like and

🎯 why he came back to build a vc fund

SPEAKER_00 13:30

subscribe button. Listening on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, wherever you stream your podcast, hit the follow and like, and so that you can tune in for more next week. You touched on hiring and how you spent a lot of money and time hiring salespeople. I find that a lot of startups struggle with who that first hire should be, whether it's marketing or sales or it's development. What's your advice? And if you look back at your decisions, what do you think you could have done differently or better?

SPEAKER_03 13:56

Yeah. So I mean, what I did back then was of course ridiculous. We I hired all my best friends from universities. But I didn't hire one, I hired like 20, right? So because we got all this money and then we needed to ramp up sales, and and so that so again that's a long time ago. So um but I guess the the actual first hiring aspect in our case was really the founding team. So because we were actually seven people that started to come.

SPEAKER_00 14:29

Seven co-founders.

SPEAKER_03 14:31

Because we came out of uh almost like an NGO. So this was like a small scientific institute that we could that we founded back back in the university where like all kinds of people were involved. And then naturally, out of this, once you see okay, let's move from the institute to a to a company, um, people come come along, so to say. So so obviously this was um very different from how you would do it today. I personally think um yeah, finding your co-founder or finding that initial setup is extremely important, but at the same time, there is no guarantees. There are no there is no safety net. You have to try, you have to start working together. And I think the very, very m important point is that after a couple of weeks or months, you typically know if it works or not. Walking away then is even harder, especially if you're already out fundraising. And that's what we see, and that's why I'm quite skeptical about these EF programs and so on. These matching programs, so to say I think they are great in a way, but they're also really tr difficult because you you very quickly within a couple of months get locked in with a co-founder.

SPEAKER_00 15:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 15:45

And I I really think that the ability to adjust and walk away at that point is so important that can determine your next 10 years, frankly.

SPEAKER_00 15:54

If you're I often say the co-founder relationship is like a marriage, it's very intense, and often people don't really do enough due diligence to make sure that they can last the highs and lows.

SPEAKER_03 16:05

Exactly. And unfortunately, the due diligence, the abstract due diligence only goes so far. I really have to start working together, and that's why I'm um I really want to see people staying together at least for a year or something like this until they raise money, yeah. Which is not the case. We have a lot of founders that we've back that are together much shorter, but that's also due to the competitive pressures that are in the market these days.

SPEAKER_00 16:30

For sure. Well, you had your big exit. Um, Three United was acquired by Verizon for about sixty-seven million dollars. And then you moved to the Silicon Valley, and you were then managing hundreds of people inside a major tech company, which is a very interesting move from Europe back to um yeah, why and what were you hoping to achieve from that change in scenery and I guess focus?

SPEAKER_03 16:54

So, so first of all, uh we moved to Santa Cruz, which is a beautiful place. I learned surfing. Uh, we had a daughter born there. Amazing. So this was also a moment of relaxation, a moment of uh joy and uh relief. Um but it was also a new beginning because a part of the deal that we did with Verisign was that we stay for a while, you know, and hand over. And for me, um I was always eager to to learn and to see that part of the world, and not only as a student, because I studied already in the US for quite some years, but actually from a business perspective. So it was I was eager to learn. And as mentioned before, I never worked in my life in a comp in another company than my own. So it was also interesting to okay, how is this actually to have a boss? Okay, it's weird. Uh so that was also for me an interesting learning journey, and and for a while I actually liked it a lot. I'm still close friends with my former boss, that is the only boss in my life that I ever had. And and um, and it was for at least one and a half years, it was great. And then Verizon went through these typical corporate bullshit uh cycles where they suddenly completely revamp the strategy and then they kick out everybody and they divest everything, and and then it was over, basically, and it was just a matter of getting out and moving on.

SPEAKER_00 18:22

Moving on. And so you decided to choose something very simple and build a VC fund eventually. Why? Like that's a very ambitious thing to tackle. What drew you to that sector?

SPEAKER_03 18:34

As usually in my life, uh, it was more of a it was almost it felt there's no other way. Uh just as I wasn't able to think of anything else but starting my own company when I did my PhD. Um so I moved back to Vienna uh with the family,

🚀 building speedinvest when everyone said don't

SPEAKER_03 18:53

and I I desperately wanted to stay in the startup environment, but I desperately didn't want to start a new operational company again because life becomes extremely narrow. Uh when you when you do five, seven, ten years the same in the same business, in the same industry. Like I did, I mean I I moved from I moved, the company pivoted, but ultimately you do the same thing. And I was very eager to expand my horizon reading, um talking to people. So this is this this kind of life that you have as a venture investor is much more entertaining, maybe. Uh and and uh I mean as a founder you still have a lot of pressure, but it's different. And and so I was looking for that. But if you want to be in the startup world, and either you're an operator or an investor, there's not much in between. It's very difficult to to um sustain yourself with consulting geeks or with advisory, and that was also not me. So I did that for for one year. We played around with different concepts, nothing worked, and it's okay, okay. Either we go in and actually raise a fund or or we or I do something completely different, and then completely try. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:09

What was that process like? And what advice did you get from people around you? Did they think it was a good idea? Do they think it was maybe not right or too ambitious for Europe at the time?

SPEAKER_03 20:18

So I had a lot of conversations because of course I was worried about BC back in back in 2010 when we started this idea.

SPEAKER_00 20:25

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:26

Uh there was CFC. And in Europe and specifically in Austria, there was not a single example of a successful venture fund, nobody. And I remember I had a lot of conversations because I tried to talk to everybody who ever tried in Austria to run a and I was in Germany to run a venture fund. And it was a a 0% uh success, right? 0% advice to do it. So every single person told me not to do it. It was quite funny actually. Um, and our my conclusion was then okay, if I do it, I do it really, really differently. Uh so I was pretty sure that the traditional venture model wouldn't work in Austria. So we tried this model where we had a much more heavy operational involvement. We had a six full-time partners, two of them in the US, for 10 million funds. So that's that's in a very expensive. It's very expensive, basically. It's expensive if you pay yourself, you don't pay yourself, it's not expensive. We didn't pay ourselves. So it was a but on the other hand, we got direct equity in the companies that we invested in. So there was a we had the entrepreneurial upside, but it was much, much more entrepreneurial and startup-like than a typical fund. And that was ultimately also the reason why this fund did very well. Because if you would just have given money um without being involved, I think that the ecosystem was not ready for that.

SPEAKER_00 21:47

For sure.

SPEAKER_03 21:47

So that that's how I that's then that was my and our way then to address these concerns and come up with something different that also resonated at least with a couple LPs in Australia. That allowed us to raise the first funds.

SPEAKER_00 22:02

Wow. And who were your co-founders at the time? How did you find them and decide that they were the right ones to undertake this with?

SPEAKER_03 22:09

So this was most of the people I've worked already in my previous company. So that was actually two of my co-founders who are still with Speed Invest today are they were both already in Three United and in the company before. I had one new co-founder that was uh that I worked already in in this consulting advisory phase. And then I had one co-founder in the US who I worked at Verisign together and became friends and enjoyed working together.

SPEAKER_01 22:39

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 22:40

So bit bit so we I learned at least in terms of selection process.

SPEAKER_00 22:46

For sure. What's really interesting about Speed Invest is you are still today quite non-traditional in your approach and also how you structurally set yourself up. Why do you think that is? And I I guess especially now with AI, um changing sectors where it's not so niche anymore. Like you might have a fintech startup, but with AI that looks very, very different. Why do you still choose to structure speed invest in that specific way? And do you think it's going to evolve over time?

SPEAKER_03 23:14

So it's for sure gonna evolve. Um I'm gonna I'm very curious w how. But ultimately, I think companies are always a reflection of the people that build it. Um and Speed Invest is definitely a reflection of my and our ambition to build something that is not just traditional al allocator of capital. So we I come from a startup background. I feel I want to build something, and so for me the the the perspective to just collect capital, uh allocate it, uh invest it, and then raise the next fund was never interesting. I wanted to build something a bit more meaningful and and also pan-European. So that was very important for me. Actually, I I got I learned over time how how that opportunity is actually in front of us. And um and so that was then if you have that perspective in mind, you need to build a a company and not a venture firm. And the company means you have a you have multiple offices, you have um a bigger team, you have structure, you have processes, you have a just like any other company in a way. Uh and that and that then also allows you to do bigger things, but it also uh forces you to think harder about yeah, about this kind of part of the business while not while only in versus only investing. So my job is nowadays 80% or 70% company building, fundraising versus maybe 30% personal investing. So that's a different, different role, but one that suits me well.

SPEAKER_00 24:54

For sure. And I think now it's very impressive that Spinvest has about $1.2 billion in assets that's being managed and also across the world. And I think you mentioned about being very pan-European, but now you're doing things in Africa, potentially Asia as well. Why that the decision to move and to spread so so far geographically? Because most um VCs tend to stay within a specific country or region, but you're really taking a very ambitious approach.

SPEAKER_03 25:23

Yeah. Now I can give you all kinds of strategic reasons. The reality is I just enjoy it.

unknown 25:30

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 25:32

And we enjoy it, and and I I truly, truly um love the image of Swedenvest being a platform of empowering people to fulfill their dreams, so to say, their entrepreneurial um ambitions and and visions. And so we had this situation a couple of years ago where we had a very strong fintech team, and um and they they started to do small investments outside of Europe, actually in Middle East and Africa. And it turned out to be pretty successful. And and then the question was, okay, do we give these people, this team, a chance within Speed Invest to launch their own fund, their own initiative? Um, or do we shut it down and focus on Europe? And and and my natural inclination is okay, of course we try it. Which then comes at a cost again because the reality is that yeah, this takes time. We've been on this now for almost two years. Uh, but now finally have made first close for the Middle East and Africa Fund. It was a long journey, an expensive journey, but um I sincerely think and hope it's worthwhile. Yeah. So now we we have this strategic opportunity in front of us because in these markets the experience that we gained over 15 years in Europe is extremely valuable. Um, the brand is well known and respected. And I have this team which is really strong. So if I wouldn't have had this team, I would never have done it, frankly. It's always a good for me, it's always a combination of matching people and unique entrepreneurial energy with a strategic opportunity. And if this comes along, it's very hard to resist. For sure.

SPEAKER_00 27:15

And it's obviously working out, which is which is good.

SPEAKER_03 27:17

Let's ask, let's look again in a couple of years because you've we're the the it's the very beginning of the journey in reality.

SPEAKER_00 27:24

Okay. So now as someone who has invested in a lot of startups

🔑 what separates founders who make it

SPEAKER_00 27:27

and really mentored and you've had a really macro view of many founders, what separates the founders who make it and succeed um to the ones that don't?

SPEAKER_03 27:37

I think about this a lot. And first of all, I I think people underestimate how many different qualities you need to be successful. It's not just one thing. You need to. I think there are some some obvious ones. Um like if you if you want to make it to the top, so to say, you really need to work hard. I think the the idea that you can navigate your way through without putting everything in your heavy is you sometimes it works, but it's then you need to be super lucky. Most people are extremely hard and sacrifice a lot, personally, also from their yeah, from their life, really. I think that's unfortunately unfortunately really um a very clear pattern that this is needed. They need to be self-conscious.

SPEAKER_00 28:32

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 28:34

And that's now it becomes rare, right? You have somebody that fully dedicates her or his life to one thing which is already a bit not not very smart in reality, not very balanced. But you need to be a very self-conscious person to be able to adjust, to learn, to actually take people with you, to also create a certain environment that that has a good culture, super important. That also means you have to be a bit of a more nuanced person. So and uh and then um there needs to be a spike somewhere. Okay. A spike being in something, yeah. That can be that can be many things, can be an amazing salesperson, amazing empathetic leader, it can be a true scientist. It doesn't matter so much. There needs to be one spike. If you don't have one spike, it typically is also very delayed.

SPEAKER_01 29:24

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 29:24

But it's just a couple of elements, but I think it's just uh the longer I do this, the more I I understand how multidimensionally tough it is to really succeed. And then the question, what does success mean? I mean, some people um would argue that having your own company that that runs well, that is profitable, and you're happy is also wonderful, right? But as a venture fund like us, we need these crazy outcomes, right? We need the billion-dollar outcomes. So that's a different journey.

SPEAKER_00 29:58

It is. It is. What's

😬 passing on bitpanda and elevenlabs

SPEAKER_00 30:00

an investment that you passed on that you maybe regret? Many is there any in particular that come to mind? You don't have to name names.

SPEAKER_03 30:07

No, no, I'm happy to name names. It's I think it's it's a fun exercise invention. Yeah, we so we passed on BitPanda in the very first round that they did. That was already at that was at the four million valuation.

SPEAKER_00 30:22

So much cheaper.

SPEAKER_03 30:23

So much cheaper, and and and they were already great, great back then, but we didn't understand crypto. And why would an Austrian company succeed in in crypto? Uh we invested then two years later, and and that was still a great investment, but much, much more expensive. So that was one, and then and more recently we we also passed on 11 Labs, which is also painful. Because we have this, you know, as a venture fund, you have to have a strategy, and you have to, for example, ownership targets is extremely important for our fund model. And we could have invested in 11 labs, but we uh didn't get anywhere close to our ownership target. And back then that was not an obvious, it was not like they had already um scaled up revenues or anything like that. So we we walked away. And and that's painful because if you know the impact this investment would have had on our performance, I mean, life would have been much easier.

SPEAKER_00 31:16

But it's working out anyway.

SPEAKER_02 31:18

It's working out, but you you uh you feel it, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:22

Yeah. And currently, do you find yourself leaning into certain sectors uh over others, or yeah, what's your preference your personal preference now?

SPEAKER_03 31:31

I think it's the most exciting time, and that sounds like a stupid advertising, but it's actually true. I think it's it really is extremely exciting to be in venture these days. Because I mean I've seen, I've been part of the really when the internet was invented, I was there and then mobile, and now this one, but this one feels so much bigger. The AI revolution, it really does feel bigger and and uh and so fast and and still so open. I think people now think okay, entropic and open AI will dominate the world. I don't think so. I think this is just the beginning. We've seen now within half a year that uh even these kind of races are shifting completely. Uh and there's so many, many, many uh fields that are really impactful to society, to really to our lives uh that that are now touched, from robotics to health to biotech, to still climate is a huge topic, energy is a huge topic. Um so so yeah, it's really exciting. Right after this year, uh we have our IC and actually our ICs I love them. It it's like in two weeks ago we we we decided on a on a Mars mission, uh space tech company, which is I would have never thought we would invest in. Uh, and then we do a biotech company that really has a a shot at solving some of the biggest health problems in the world. So I think it's it's it's it's really beautiful. Uh the topic of impact investing for me is almost gone because there's so much impact that is available in front of us now. So, yeah, it's I wouldn't be able to choose one, but of course, the AI everything is now driven by this platform shift. Absolutely. Every sector is touched.

SPEAKER_00 33:15

It's a very exciting time. I think people who are looking at it with dread and and doom are missing out on a really great opportunity.

SPEAKER_03 33:22

Yeah, as always, as always, it's always easy to talk of a bubble, it's always easy to dismiss all this as talk. Um but I think people, if you work with Claude or ChatGPT, you can feel that this is actually very impactful.

SPEAKER_00 33:38

It's changed my life, that's what it is.

SPEAKER_03 33:41

And that's the thing, if it really touches your personal life, yeah, it's very rare. Most of the tech out there doesn't touch your life that immediately.

SPEAKER_00 33:49

You've also mentioned that VC should be thought of as a cultural endeavor. What do you mean by that?

SPEAKER_03 33:54

When I started this venture, I asked myself, okay, is this actually a meaningful job? Is this do am I doing something that is contributing to society? And I think ultimately what we're doing is we're building a human infrastructure for entrepreneurship. And especially when you're based in Austria, when you come from this uh this this culture, that alone is useful. Yeah. And that's uh and and I think if you if you limit venture to allocation of capital, it's it's then of course it's not very interesting. But if you think about it as a as creating a professional environment for young entrepreneurs to thrive, it's very it has this cultural dimension. And learning around about this and actually speaking about it and maybe even doing research about it, I think there's a lot um a lot of value you can do on a certain meta-level that is uh relevant.

SPEAKER_00 34:50

For sure. I think what's very clear about you is you're approaching VC with a very founder mindset, which is probably what's led to the success of Speed Invest, to be honest. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:58

Yeah, maybe, yeah. And uh and also the people um in Speed Invest. So we're by now a very diverse group of some some people have been in the adventure all their lives. Most of them come from operational backgrounds, but the core DNA is, I would hope, the founder mindset. That's still very much founder focus.

SPEAKER_00 35:16

Before we wrap up, I've got some rapid fire questions to get your thoughts on yeah, a few things. So the first one, European VC versus the US VC, what's one genuine advantage that you think Europe has over those other ecosystems?

SPEAKER_03 35:30

Being trained by capital

⚡ rapid fire

SPEAKER_03 35:32

efficiency. I think we all learned to do more with less. Um at some point we have to untrain this now to be able to spend massive capital and not feel bad about it.

SPEAKER_00 35:45

Okay. You've seen thousands of pitch decks. What's the single most common lie you think that founders often tell investors?

SPEAKER_03 35:52

Passion. If there isn't people always tell us how passionate they are about their problem and and many are not. And then and you can smell it.

SPEAKER_00 36:02

Makes sense. What's the best investment you've ever made?

SPEAKER_03 36:05

Speed Invest.

unknown 36:07

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 36:08

To be honest, I put everything I have in Speed Invest.

SPEAKER_00 36:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 36:11

And and I think it's working out, and it's uh it was the best decision in my life to put all my eggs in this basket.

SPEAKER_00 36:18

For sure, for sure. And last one, do you think Europe needs more growth-focused funds?

SPEAKER_03 36:23

Yes, sure, sure, sure, but it needs more funds across the board. I think that this this um theme that we have enough early stage capital is not true. If you look in Austria, uh we could use a lot more professional, internationally minded uh early stage uh growth uh capital as well. So yeah, we need 10 extra money anyway, on all fronts.

SPEAKER_00 36:48

Lots of opportunity, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_03 36:49

For sure.

SPEAKER_00 36:50

Oliver, thank you. It's been really great having you. I've learned a lot.

SPEAKER_03 36:53

Thank you very much. It was fun.