The Sunset Connection - Perspectives from SF's Sunset Neighborhood

The Brisket Bao That Changed Everything

• Jessica J. Ho • Season 1 • Episode 8

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The aroma hits you first: smoky, rich, unmistakably Texan. But this isn’t Houston. You’re in San Francisco’s Sunset District, where Daniel Ramirez and his wife, Lareina, have built something special at Smoking D’s BBQ.

Daniel, a Houston native, missed the Texas barbecue of his hometown, so he made it himself and his own. What began as casual taste tests for homesick friends turned into a farmers market hustle, and eventually, a brick-and-mortar hit on Irving Street that now sells out almost every weekend. But it wasn’t just the brisket that turned heads — it was the bao.

Inspired by a trip to a night market in China, Daniel had the idea to merge his 18-hour smoked brisket with the pillowy softness of a Chinese pork bun. After several experiments (and a few delicious mistakes), the brisket bao was born — a cross-cultural creation that honors his Mexican roots and Lareina’s Chinese heritage. It’s now their breakout hit.

🎙️ In this episode, we talk about:

  • What makes Texas brisket so legendary — and so hard to master
  • How Daniel and Lareina blend Mexican, Chinese, and Texan traditions in every bite
  • Why doing barbecue in San Francisco comes with unique challenges
  • What it takes to grow from backyard cookouts to a full-time restaurant
  • And how a bao changed everything

📍 Smoking D’s BBQ is located at 2181 Irving Street in San Francisco. They’re open Wednesday–Sunday, 11am–6pm — but go early. When it’s gone, it’s gone.

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💬 Got a guest idea or feedback? Reach out on social media or email me at jessica.jasmine.ho@gmail.com. I’d love to hear from you.

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The Sunset Connection — exploring the stories and histories that connect us.

Jessica Ho:

All right, welcome to another episode of the Sunset Connection. Today's episode is for anyone who's ever waited in line for something hot, smoky and worth the wait. I'm talking to Daniel Ramirez, co-owner of Smoking Deeds Barbecue. What started as a brisket experiment in his outer sunset home turned into a full-on farmer's market hustle and now a brick-and-mortar sensation that sells out almost every weekend. Daniel and his wife, lore Lorena, have created something rare Texas-style barbecue that's rooted in community and seasoned with cross-cultural love. Daniel and Lorena aren't just serving food. They're sharing a story of migration, marriage, adaptation, all through something hot and smoky that makes you feel, just for a moment, like you're right where you belong.

Jessica Ho:

In this episode, we talk about meat. Of course, mistakes hello brisket that wouldn't cook on time, and merging Mexican, chinese and Texan flavors into a bao that hits you right in the soul. Stay with us. This is the kind of story that'll leave you hungry, curious and maybe even a little inspired to build something of your own. Dano is originally from Houston Texas. While Lorena grew up right here in the sunset , a deeply local family. Daniel started smoking D's back in 2021, smoking meat in his garage in the outer sunset, where he and Lorena still live today. So, Daniel, welcome to the show.

Daniel Ramirez:

Thanks for having me.

Jessica Ho:

Where did you get the idea for Smoking D's?

Daniel Ramirez:

Well, smoking D's is just kind of one of those things that was an accident waiting to happen. I've always been into barbecue, growing up in Houston. Smoking barbecue is ingrained in our DNA, something we do together with friends, family, hanging out during the weekends, before football games and whatnot.

Jessica Ho:

So tell me about your background. You said you're from Houston.

Daniel Ramirez:

So how was it growing up in Houston? So growing up in Houston for those of you that don't know, it's a gigantic melting pot. Houston is very diverse. I mean there you'll find different cuisines, like Viet Cajun, which is one of my favorites right now, besides barbecue. You know, we're in a central part of the country down there, so you have a lot of transplants coming from different continents like Africa, central America. Mexico is close by. Obviously there's a huge Vietnamese culture down there.

Jessica Ho:

When you moved to the Bay Area. What did you miss most about Houston food?

Daniel Ramirez:

Moving out to the Bay Area, I couldn't find anything that reminded me of home. So I kind of had this wild idea and created a pre-order. That kind of took off and which brought us to where we're at today.

Jessica Ho:

Was there a moment you realized that this could be more than a hobby, maybe even a business?

Daniel Ramirez:

So, before I started this, I have a whole bunch of friends that I met here when I first moved out here that were from Houston as well. So there's a big group of us, and one thing we would always complain about was like, oh you know, there's no barbecue. So I started having taste tests. I didn't know what I was going for, what I was doing Right. So I'm like hey, try this, tell me what you think about this. All their feedback was fantastic, so that kind of gave me the confidence to put myself out there.

Jessica Ho:

What do you think makes a great brisket now, after all those early experiments?

Daniel Ramirez:

You know I've messed up a whole lot of briskets throughout my life. My dad gave me an old Charbroil offset smoker when I bought my first house and the first thing I did was attempt to smoke a brisket. The brisket was supposed to take anywhere between 15 to 16 hours. I invited friends to come over. Family came over, but unfortunately the brisket was not done on time. Brisket is one of those things that just takes a characteristic on its own. It requires a lot of patience. If you're looking, you ain't cooking, so you have to make sure and let the thing. It's slow and slow, Just let the brisket do its thing.

Jessica Ho:

How long does it usually take to make?

Daniel Ramirez:

brisket. It kind of varies because you know now we're talking about. I started smoking one brisket. Now I'm smoking anywhere between 16 to 20 a day, so there's some that finish faster than others, on average maybe 15 to 18 hours and is there, like a certain way that Texas does barbecue that you bring here?

Daniel Ramirez:

The way Texas does. Barbecue is more focused on a dry rub, so it's salt pepper. We're not really known for much of our sauces. We put the showcase in the meat. So if you're looking for a different barbecue sauce, that's smoking D's. I'm sorry to disappoint you right now, but it's all in the rub, it's all in the cooking techniques.

Jessica Ho:

Very interesting, and so it also reflects your food, also reflects your Mexican heritage. So tell me a little bit about how you bring that culture in and also the culture of your wife, who is Chinese.

Daniel Ramirez:

Absolutely. I mean, it's the best of both worlds, right, there's good Chinese food, there's good, you know, mexican food and there's good Texas food. So it's kind of I like to say that there's a lot of similarities between Chinese food and Mexican food. You know, for me it's like the lotus sticky rice. The first time I had it I'm like, oh, it's almost like a Mexican tamale. It really is, you know, except it has lotus rice and it has like sweet pork in it. Right, and I think it's just, it goes to the testament of, like ancient cultures, where you have very simple ingredients. Right, you have flour, water and wheat or maize or maize. Yeah, it's very similar. So it makes it for me easier to understand.

Jessica Ho:

Right, how do you and Lorena collaborate on flavor ideas?

Daniel Ramirez:

A lot of stuff is things we both grew up eating as kids. You know, you know part of my French. I like to refer to myself as a fat ass. So I just love eating food.

Jessica Ho:

But you're picky.

Daniel Ramirez:

I'm picky, but I love eating food, so there's a fine line to it, right? She's introduced me to a lot of different food that I wouldn't have ate if I hadn't met her. You know, Chinese dim sum being one of them, and that's pretty much where the idea for the brisket bao came. My first time to China was probably 2017. And we went to a couple of night markets you know that they have out there and they were making this pork bun and I thought it was the best thing I ever ate. You know, it was super cheap. I think it was like one or two bucks.

Jessica Ho:

Right.

Daniel Ramirez:

I was like, wow, you know, the bread was so soft, it was delicious. And this was way before I even had an inkling to do barbecue, where I asked her I'm like, hey, has anybody ever put grispen in this? And she was like, no, I don't think. So. I'm like, so there's not a beef version of this? And she's like, not really, because I learned that beef is kind of a specialty, you know, in Asia, where the wealthy people eat, or so I was told. I was like, oh, ok, that's interesting.

Daniel Ramirez:

So fast forward to maybe 2021 or 2022, when we first started doing smoking D's, I started noticing the demographic of our customers, you know, of course, you know the sunset is predominantly Chinese, you know. And I went back to that pork bun experience and I asked him hey, remember that pork bun we ate? Why don't we try to experiment like putting our brisket inside of this? And you know, we made a few pre-orders. We've had like four or five iterations of the buns until we felt they're where they're at now and it's been a breakout hit. You know, that's one thing that really, I think, set us apart from any other barbecue spot, not just here in San Francisco, but even in Texas. It's just the blending of cultures.

Jessica Ho:

Yes, I have a funny story actually about the barbecue pork bun, because when I first met my husband, I also introduced him to Chinese culture and food, and so I tried to explain to him what a Chinese barbecue pork bun was and I didn't have the words because I've never met someone who's not had it. And I recognize now, of course, there's a lot of people who've never had a barbecue pork bun and what is that Right. But it's so. I'm like it's not had it and I recognize now, of course, there's a lot of people who've never had a barbecue pork bun and what is that right? So I'm like it's like a sandwich, but it has sweet meat in it and it's very good.

Daniel Ramirez:

Yeah, it's good. And he was like that sounds terrible.

Jessica Ho:

And so I was like okay. And then he had one and he's like this is the best thing I've ever had. He's like if you ever explain to someone who doesn't understand Chinese food, tell them it's like a brisket sandwich, but sweet.

Daniel Ramirez:

Interesting.

Jessica Ho:

And I was like, oh Okay, I never thought about like explaining what a barbecue pork bun. A Chinese barbecue bun tastes a lot like a brisket a really good brisket sandwich, but Chinese.

Daniel Ramirez:

Correct.

Jessica Ho:

Yes, and so it's. When I saw your buns, I was just like the first thing I do is like call my husband, like guess what they actually did it.

Daniel Ramirez:

That's great. You know that we love to hear that and that's what keeps us going.

Jessica Ho:

Can you tell me a little bit about the barbecue scene in San Francisco? Like you mentioned that you started smoking these because you couldn't find what you wanted here. How is the Bay Area known in the world in terms of barbecue?

Daniel Ramirez:

Well, I just think it's different because there's a lot of good different types of barbecue here. Let's start with Chinese barbecue or Asian barbecue. There's Korean barbecue. There's Chinese barbecue. There's Vietnamese barbecue. Barbecue there's Korean barbecue. There's Chinese barbecues, there's Vietnamese barbecue. And I think it's just the misconception of what barbecue is and what it isn't For barbecue from a Texan perspective. For us, it's more about the smoking techniques Slow and slow cooking it at 225 using a certain type of wood. When you go to an Asian barbecue, it's over like a hot fire, it's like a skewer or whatever. Okay, now I see the difference.

Jessica Ho:

What did you learn doing farmer's markets that helped when you opened the restaurant.

Daniel Ramirez:

Well, farmer's market. It's a challenge because it's very hard to bring a barbecue joint to a farmer's market. So here's the thing that people might understand how farmer's markets work. The farmer's market might operate. Let's use the outer sunset, for example. That's where we started from. Farmer's market starts from 9 am to 2 pm. Think back then we started till three o'clock. We have to set up anywhere between seven to eight third. So we have to have all the food ready prior to then and then we have to set up by 8 30.

Daniel Ramirez:

So having a barbecue outside, with the windy conditions you know, in the sunset, as we all know, sometimes it's cloudy, sometimes it's drizzling it's very hard to maintain the quality of our food. We used to have a generator, six tables, four or five people helping us. I think you remember that. And if you know anything about Texas and their barbecue, we are very judgmental about our barbecue. If you know anything about Texas and their barbecue, we are very judgmental about our barbecue. So it's my responsibility to honor that and make sure that the quality lives up to my standard no-transcript.

Jessica Ho:

Oh interesting, because you can control the quality better, you can control the quality better.

Daniel Ramirez:

So now with our brick and mortar, you know we have warmers, we have everything that we need, that we don't have to lug around all the time. So we trim our meat, we smoke our meat, keep it in warmers, cut it, prep it, sell it Super easier there than the farmer's market, but prep it, sell it Super easier there than the farmer's market.

Jessica Ho:

But we learned a lot doing those farmer's markets. How did you get around all the permitting process.

Daniel Ramirez:

We've been very lucky. You know, before I opened my restaurant, I did a ton of research, and I think I told you this. When I met you at the farmer's market, people would ask me oh, are you planning to open your restaurant? My first words were no, never. Now look at us, though. So during that time I did a lot of research. I reached out to the city, you know. I reached out to Katie Tang and her team at the Office of Workforce Development, who's been super helpful with us, so we kind of figured out a way of how to smoke, you know, our meats outside in a very smaller capacity than what I would really like to. So I think that's where people don't understand, or they get mad. When we sell out, I'm like, hey, there's only so much space in my smokers Interesting, yeah, and there's only so much meat I could cook.

Jessica Ho:

Right.

Daniel Ramirez:

So it is what it is Doing. Barbecue is hard, you know especially I'm going to call it American-style barbecue because you really don't have the space in San Francisco to be able to bring in these big Texas sized smokers and I think there's a lot of red tape when it comes from the city and the Bay Area Air Quality Management Department. That makes it hard for barbecue restaurants to open. I know there are some places that have been around for a long time that are grandfathered with their permits, so it's just a permitting issue. And then I know there's complaints from neighbors. You know it's very hard. You know the way San Francisco is set up. It's commercial, residential, and we want to be respectful to our neighbors as well. Even though it smells good, they don't want to smell the smoke 24-7. Right, so it's just super difficult. You know we're always trying to find new ways to become more efficient and try to increase our capacity.

Jessica Ho:

Yeah, I mean that is a unique challenge for barbecue, american barbecue that I don't think a lot of people think about Absolutely, because the space that's needed, space is an issue.

Daniel Ramirez:

Right, and when we get these briskets in they come in between 18 and 20 pounds, so we have to trim two or three pounds from it.

Jessica Ho:

When we smoke it, we lose about 50% of the meat, you know that's kind of how we come up with our costumey, so has anyone from Texas come and try your barbecue and then, like man, this takes me back Absolutely, and that's probably one of the best compliments I hear Texans find me every day.

Daniel Ramirez:

I'll never forget this story. We used to pop up at Standard Deviant and it was a older woman who came and she told me she was very proud. She's like I'm from Denton, texas. You know. You could hear the twang in her voice. She's like I'm going to judge your brisket very harshly and I was like, okay, I'm like well, I hope you enjoy. You know, thanks for you know coming out here for supporting us. You know she was out having fun with her friends. I kind of forgot about it. She came back and she said wow, that really reminded me of home. You know, thank you for bringing this to San Francisco. So when I hear things like that, that I don't want to. I'm not sure if humble is the right word, but I think it validates more of what we're doing and it gives us that extra pressure and motivation to be better every day.

Jessica Ho:

That must be so validating. How do you share that pride with your team?

Daniel Ramirez:

We have a lot of employees now who've never been to Texas, so it's also a challenge showing non-Texas what Texas barbecue is all about. One thing I tell my staff all the time is complacency is the quickest path to decline. So we can't let all the positive reviews we get, or even the negatives. We cannot react to every single one of them. We're not competing with any other barbecue restaurant in the Bay Area. We're competing with our last cook. And as long as we keep the focus on us and what we do control, what we can control, I think we'll be okay.

Jessica Ho:

Yeah, I mean your place always sells out and I always see lines. All my coworkers go like it's great, like I think for me at least from the outside, the reception has been really great. What's the best way people can support you right now, if they have, if they love what you're doing?

Daniel Ramirez:

So far the reception has been great. It's also fun and rewarding. But it's super crazy. Sometimes it can be overwhelming. Sometimes the people come to the store and I'm not all there. It's just, it's just super hard. So I'm taking my time because right now we open Wednesday through Sunday from 11 to 6. I will love to open seven days a week from 8 to 9 pm, but we have to continue training you know, we have to focus on maintaining the quality of our food.

Jessica Ho:

Right, because that's what you're putting out into the world, that's the product that you're selling, that's the thing that you want people to remember you by.

Daniel Ramirez:

Correct.

Jessica Ho:

Is the level of quality of food that they got from Smoking Bees.

Daniel Ramirez:

Absolutely.

Jessica Ho:

I think that's every restaurant should strive to be like that, and so it's amazing to really hear your story about how you put that into your work and how we've seen the transformation of Smoking Dees from a farmer's market kind of staple to now a brick and mortar and now growing your brand even further. Really appreciate your time. I'm so excited for you and your restaurant and your business and I really hope the best of success for you. And it just really adds to the tapestry of amazing cultures and flavors that we have here in the Sunset District. Smoking D's BBQ is at 2181 Irby Street.

Jessica Ho:

So go grab a sandwich. Tell Daniel, we sent you. So now we're going to move into the trivia portion. This trivia is going to be barbecue related, obviously, and I wanted to incorporate not only Texas barbecue but also Chinese barbecue into these questions. Only Texas barbecue, but also Chinese barbecue into these questions. So do you know which region of China is most famously associated with char siu barbecue pork buns? A Sichuan, b Guangdong or Canton, c Hunan or D Beijing?

Daniel Ramirez:

I'm going to go with B Guangdong.

Jessica Ho:

Yes, that is correct.

Daniel Ramirez:

Is that because you went there? I have a Guangdong barbecue place right next to me.

Jessica Ho:

Okay.

Daniel Ramirez:

So that kind of makes sense right.

Jessica Ho:

When was Peking duck first developed in China?

Daniel Ramirez:

Ooh, I don't know A long time ago. Sorry, go ahead, that's okay.

Jessica Ho:

Yeah, the answer is all in the past. Yes, A Tang Dynasty 618 to 907 AD, yuan Dynasty 1271.

Daniel Ramirez:

We know it's not the last one, so I'm going to go with the first option.

Jessica Ho:

It's the Yuan Dynasty. B yes, it originated there and then rose to prominence in the Ming Dynasty, which immigrant group is credited with heavily influencing the development of Texas barbecue in the 19th century. A Italian, b Chinese, c German and Czech or D Irish German, that is correct.

Jessica Ho:

German and Czech immigrants brought Irish German. That is correct. German and Czech immigrants brought their meat smoking traditions to Texas in the 19th century. What is the traditional method of seasoning meat in Central Texas? Barbecue? A Sweet molasses based sauce. B Spicy dry rub with chili powder. C Vinegar based marinade or D Salt and black pepper only.

Daniel Ramirez:

Salt and black pepper only.

Jessica Ho:

Yep, that's what I was like. Oh, you already said that. All right, so I think you got three out of four 75%.

Daniel Ramirez:

Yes, I'll take it.

Jessica Ho:

Yes, so very good. Thank you, yeah, thank you so much. Big thanks to Daniel for sharing his journey, starting from his home in the sunset to feeding lines of hungry neighbors smoking d's. If you're in the sunset, head over to 2181 irving street and grab a brisket bow. Trust me, you'll understand the hype. If this episode made you smile, think or crave barbecue, do me a favor. Share it with a hit follow or leave a quick review. Every bit of support helps this show grow and, as always, if there's someone you think I should talk to next, let me know. Please, let me know if you have any feedback. I'd love to hear how I can improve. I want to make this podcast as interesting and useful as I can for all my listeners, so all this feedback really helped. All right, thanks for listening and tuning in. Hope to see you in the neighborhood. That's all folks.

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