Bonus: INTRAPRENEUR: Taking The Weather Channel and CNN into the Digital Era

Louis Gump was introduced to me by a mutual friend. "This guy wrote a book and is doing really unique stuff with the biggest organizations in the world" is how it was teed up. And wow, it's THAT plus much more! 

Louis Gump, author, tells his fascinating story of taking massive organizations into the digital era using his framework of INTRApreneurship. He explains the fundamental differences between entrepreneurs and intrapreneurs. Before this episode I had no idea such word even existed! 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

I have another example in the book of Quint Studer, and his dad repaired diesel locomotives for a company called Electromotive, and it was a division of General Motors. And the basement, all the awards in the basement. And what Quint said is that his dad had this basement full of certificates, and he had received a lot of recognition because he just knew how to fix things and make them happen. He could have gone out and had his own business. He could have been a consultant to do that sort of thing, but he said, I want to be inside a larger company. So I think this practice of being an entrepreneur and being entrepreneurial is much wider than the job descriptions that explicitly say you have to do this.

SPEAKER_03 0:49

All right, folks, welcome back to another episode. I've got Lewis Gump with me here today. Lewis, thanks for being here. Great to be here. Thanks, Jeff. All right, so you're here because of a mutual friend, Dave Lerner, who's a CPA, and I think he's got over 30 K1s now. He's a fascinating guy in and of himself. But I had breakfast with him a couple weeks ago, and I told him what I'm doing with the show, and he said, you were the first person that came to his mind, which was awesome. Because it was just the way that he said it. He goes, oh man, I've got a perfect guy for you. You just wrote a book. I think it's out now. So we sat there and Googled it. But he said, this guy goes from organization, big ones, organization to organization and innovates inside of them. Which is interesting because in your book, I came across another name of a guy who was also on my show in season one, Keith Wilmot. So this just continues to go full circle. He was an inside innovator for the Coca-Cola company. Now I've got the pleasure of having you here today for an interview. You're going to want to watch this show, folks. You've heard the term intrapreneur. We've all heard entrepreneur. Intrapreneur, we have a different take on this, and I will be the first one to say, I thought it was a little bit different. So I love how you say, Lewis, you didn't come up with the word intrapreneur. but you did come up with a new definition. The show's going to be awesome. We're going to start right in with your experience at the Weather Channel. So you go into the Weather Channel. Technology is just sort of coming on scene. People can't figure it out. You lead a team in the early, early days to take the Weather Channel to an app, not only to an app and to the phones, but to number one in the app store, the Apple app store. Tell me about that.

SPEAKER_01 2:41

It was an incredible journey, Jeff. And for starters, I should say that we had a team of people and we had this environment where we just wanted to make sure we reached the customers where they were. So it was a natural conclusion to say, hey, let's try some things on these wireless devices. And even before I arrived in 2001, the company was already experimenting. In fact, there was a case or two of pagers in a closet somewhere in the building for weather pagers that never really went somewhere. And we tried a number of things that didn't go so far. On the other hand, when we tried a generation of apps in the early 2000s using technologies like Java and Brood, that worked pretty well. And then we made for mobile video and that worked well with forecasts for different areas. And then we built mobile websites and that worked. And we started actually to generate some revenue around the business. And so by the time the app stores came around in 2000, So that's so interesting,

SPEAKER_03 3:52

especially in a time when we didn't know, we maybe thought technology was going to be like really cool on the phones and all, but nobody knew technology. Fast forward to 2024, how explosive it was going to be. So being on that front end, so cool. I'm curious, when you took that job with Weather Channel, what did they hire you as? An innovator or a... What was that?

SPEAKER_01 4:20

They hired me to do business development and specifically to reach agreements with companies like ABC News and Yahoo for the desktop web. The only thing I knew about wireless devices for practical purposes was how to make a phone call into text. That was it. I really, you know, I didn't know much about the business. Sure. And about six months in, we had some changes in the organization and somebody needed to pick up responsibility for business development for mobile. It's one of those things where you don't know how the I bet a lot of listeners can relate to that. And then we put our heads together and we said, how do we make this a successful business? As you alluded to, at the time, the TV network was the vast majority of that business. Weather.com was coming on strong on desktops, but still much, much smaller. And wireless was in its infancy. So when we said mobile is going to be big someday, people, if we were lucky, they would smile and say, we believe you. Let us know when you're ready. And so later on, as we grew and started contributing revenues, we started to make sure we were reaching users where they were. We not only had a successful independent business, but we also were strategically sound. That's when a lot of the magic happened. That's

SPEAKER_03 5:35

incredible. So there's a famous company out there that says, we didn't invent the chicken, but we did invent the chicken sandwich, right? You didn't invent or come up with the word entrepreneur, right? but you did change the definition. Today's episode is brought to you by Killer Shark Marketing. I started the company in 2007, being completely exhausted and tired of the marketing runaround. And folks, if you own a business, you probably know what I'm referring to. Well, welcome home. Marketing is most effective when we can meet face-to-face quarterly. So if that's the kind of relationship you're looking for, like I said, welcome home because we will be the last stop for you. Head over to our website, killersharkmarketing.com, and you'll see exactly why we're different. And as I go through your book, it started to open my own eyes that I'm actually probably 70% entrepreneur but 30% intrapreneur. So I want to unpack this. What– What is an entrepreneur?

SPEAKER_01 6:41

Sure. So an entrepreneur creates value through innovation and growth within a larger organization.

SPEAKER_03 6:48

That being the key word, like within a

SPEAKER_01 6:51

framework? Within a framework. And this definition even of larger is really important. Every word in that definition matters. I went into this project thinking, hey, this is mostly for people who work in for-profit companies.

SPEAKER_02 7:07

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 7:07

and ones that have thousands of employees. What I quickly came to discover is that that was too narrow a definition. It does apply there, but actually people in 30... 60, 100-person companies, many of them are some of the most accomplished entrepreneurs around. And so it's about thinking in innovative new ways. It's about taking on an initiative. It's about continuous improvement. Occasionally I get asked, hey, Lewis, does this apply to people who are just finding relatively small incremental improvements, not some huge product launch? Absolutely. Another thing that became very clear as I was doing some research is that it's not just for for-profit companies. It's also for non-profits Government? Government, for sure. Educational institutions and schools. I was speaking with John Hancock at Junior Achievement of Georgia, and he described the development of Junior Achievement BizTowns and how that grew out of other things that they did in one of their locations in the Midwest. And I was like, holy cow, okay. So this really happens in a lot of different types of organizations. That sparked my curiosity to see how that would go and ultimately led to this Updated definition. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 8:24

What does somebody do who's currently working in an organization who just heard what you said or just read your book and is like, wait, this whole time I have the title of this, but... I'm really an intrapreneur at heart, and I love bringing ideas. Do they raise their hand? Do they go to their boss? Do they buy your book and secretly put it under the boss's door and go, I think you have an inside innovator, intrapreneur?

SPEAKER_01 8:53

What do you do? So what you just described is one of the most common reactions I've gotten from people who have read the book. It's like, oh, this sounds like me. I had somebody say in the last couple of weeks, I feel seen. And that observation and that insight is one of the biggest reasons why I wanted to write this book, because I feel like so many people are doing this type of work, but we don't necessarily have the vocabulary or the understanding to know what to do with it. So coming to your question of what do you do first, I thought about this too, even in the chapter order in writing the book, I decided to put self-understanding first. Because when we understand how we're wired, when we understand what we're interested in and what our goals are, when we understand the landscape around us, it's easier... to take the next steps to realize our potential and to contribute.

SPEAKER_03 9:49

How does somebody do that? Let's just frame that right there. How does somebody do that step, that self-actualization? Walk me through an actual example.

SPEAKER_01 9:56

So the first thing you need to do is to say, hey, what type of environment am I most resonant in? Am I most effective in? Is it something where I have a lot of autonomy and I get to make the decisions and I really want to have control and a Oh, by the way, a telltale sign that somebody is more likely to be an entrepreneur than an intrapreneur if they say, you know, I like innovating, but I don't like having a boss. Or I want to have complete freedom. On the other hand, someone who says, you know what, I actually really like having the organization around me. I like having the resources. I like having less individual risk while still being able to build things. That means you might be more likely to be an entrepreneur. Once you have this kind of insight, then the next thing is, okay, so how do I go do it? One of the most insightful comments that I received in the interview process was from Marie Quintet, who used to be head of strategy at Coca-Cola. Again, not exactly a small company, right? But she said, hey, here's the thing. Anyone who wants to drive innovation within a larger company, it's really important to understand the strategy of the larger company. So in answer to your question, one of the next things to do is to make sure you have a really good understanding of the strategy. A lot of this will be in written documents, but another great way to do that is by talking to your boss. or someone else who's in a position where they not only understand where the company is going, but also how that connects to your role. And then one of the next ones, and there are a lot of things that one can do here, but one of the next things to do is to say, hey, among the opportunities that we have to grow our business, to serve our customers, what are the ones that are most practical to bring to market? And once you have this self-understanding opportunity, You have connection to strategy, and then you have some thoughts on how you can contribute. A lot of the rest follows.

SPEAKER_03 11:55

Okay, so this isn't a role then. You're not hired as an entrepreneur. You have a particular role, but an entrepreneur might be like an adjective of how you behave. Am I saying that correlation right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:08

I think there is that correlation. Some people are hired into roles that are naturally entrepreneurial, and some people grow into them or activate. An example is a general manager of a division. If you're a general manager of a division or you're tapped to lead a major initiative, AI is getting so much airtime right now. If you're tapped to lead an initiative around a certain type of artificial intelligence or a new product launch, that almost inherently means you're an entrepreneur. On the other hand, I have another example in the book of Quint Studer, and his dad repaired diesel locomotives for a company called Electromotive, and it was a division of General Motors. And what Quint said is that his dad had this basement full of certificates, and he had received a lot of recognition because he just knew how to fix things and make them happen. He could have gone out and had his own business. He could have been a consultant to do that sort of thing, but he said, I want to be inside a larger company. So I think this practice of being an entrepreneur and being entrepreneurial is much wider than the job descriptions that explicitly say,

SPEAKER_03 13:21

you have to do this. Here's what I thought it was. That's perfect, exactly how you said that. I thought when I heard entrepreneur, companies look for entrepreneurs out there to bring into their organization to help think differently about things and came in more part-time-ish and then went out. That's honestly what I thought it was. So now I go through your book and I get it. I totally understand it. You can be in an organization of any size, any type, federal government, nonprofit, doesn't matter. You work within a framework that you're comfortable with, right? Yes. And you're an innovator. You're an idea mill. You're an idea generator. Is that right? Is that the safe way to say it? 100%.

SPEAKER_01 14:14

And a lot of the time, some of the biggest entrepreneurial journeys start with the thing that's on the side of your desk. Your job is 90 plus percent something else. Let's say you're in marketing or you're in product management. And this opportunity comes up and you give it some care and feeding and you're like, wait a minute. This is actually bigger than we appreciated. This has a lot of opportunity. And especially when someone has expertise, they're plugged into the organization and they're passionate about this idea. And then they do the research. They get the facts. That's when some great things happen.

SPEAKER_03 14:51

Okay. What does somebody do if all this sounds good? But they're thinking right out of the gate, oh my gosh, if I bring any of this to my boss, my boss pooh-poohs everything. He says he's an innovator. He says he wants new ideas, but then... Everything's stifled. We're too small. We don't have this. It's all the excuses. What would you suggest to that person?

SPEAKER_01 15:13

Okay, so you just described a situation that's all too common. And sometimes people get frustrated because they have good idea after good idea or promising idea after promising idea to get aside from the good-bad judgment world. And yet they feel like there's no place to advance this idea and have the conversation I'm happy to say just to respond to your question and that type of situation that many bosses are receptive. And especially if there's a very What are our goals for this year or the next three years or something like that?

SPEAKER_03 16:21

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 16:22

Because once this idea... or a set of promising ideas, they're connected to the goals, the things that are important to the success of the business, the things that are important to the way the boss sees success, that tends to open doorways. The next thing to do is to find other people who may be interested in this idea as well, not to go around that relationship, but rather to gather information. So for example, if you're in marketing, Oh, yeah. Yeah. Okay. That makes sense. I'm going to

SPEAKER_03 17:34

tell on myself here. I'd be terrible at this. And

SPEAKER_01 17:38

why is that, Jeff? Why would you be terrible?

SPEAKER_03 17:41

I'd be terrible. I would need a lot of training and I would... need to overcome a tremendous obstacle of mine. And that's why I'm more an entrepreneur and enjoy not having a boss. Because I would just want to walk down the hallway, knock on somebody's door and be like, let's get this done. It should easily be done within an hour. That's more my approach, right?

SPEAKER_01 18:07

I love it. I'm so glad you said that. So a lot of people feel that way. And I will confess that some of the bigger mistakes that are related to doing exactly that or some close cousin of it because I am not naturally patient. And I do like working with teams and value the opinions of others. And for anyone out there who loves working with teams but feels impatient, please know you have lots of company. It's about patience. practice, however, for many of us. And it's about saying, hey, we want to accomplish a goal, we want to make a difference here, and we also are going to have to take a little more time to get ducks in a row so that when we raise an idea, we can take it further. Here's where the situation you just described gets a lot more interesting. What if you took the time to coordinate with your boss and you're both really excited about something and then you advocate for something together? And furthermore, you're not necessarily the person who has to carry the torch all the time because you both have facts and conviction. And so when you're not in the room and budget season comes around, your boss is in the room saying, you know what? Jeff has this great idea. I think it can make a big difference for us in X, Y, and Z ways. I I think that we should add this to our plans. When that happens, you can really magnify success because you're magnifying beyond one individual.

SPEAKER_03 19:40

So is that like when you say, let another person share ownership in it, have ownership? So right there, right out of the gate, the way it was initially presented- Right. I could see where this can be like stepping on toes. It's you got to be very careful. It's not like here's my idea and here's why we should do it. And this will be the best thing, which is where I would tell myself again, typically my approach. This is more of an approach of what?

SPEAKER_01 20:08

This is our this is this is we with a capital W. This is about us gathering together and saying, you know what? We understand the strategy of the Weather Channel. We understand the strategy of this division. And to accomplish our goals, there's this emerging technology. There's this great idea. There's this partner that we can work with. There's any number of ways that this can manifest itself. But at the end of it, what we're doing is having a sense that a team is working on something. And that's really helped when you have a common vision, a common mission, Once you have the vision, the mission, and the values, then a lot of the rest of it flows, and you get around this natural aversion to change that a lot of organizations have.

SPEAKER_03 20:58

Yeah. So you've quoted that in here from Chris Walters, and I love this. It says, the question we want the entire organization focused on is very simple. How do we actually get better at literally everything we do? How can we make progress faster, be more efficient and effective with a focus on delighting our clients? I couldn't imagine it being better stated.

SPEAKER_01 21:24

I agree. He said that so well. I had hours and hours and hours of transcripts. And when I came across that quote in review, I was like, that has to go in the book. It's important in and of itself. It's also important because it exemplifies one way of being an entrepreneur, one mindset that we can have, which is looking for ways large and small to be an entrepreneur. In other cases, sometimes we're focused on a single business. big project. And so, whereas what you just described doesn't go away, it fades into the background a little bit while we focus on a major transformative event.

SPEAKER_03 22:05

Yes. Okay. Now, if you're curious about what it takes to seize an opportunity, and I like that phrase. So any opportunity in your organization, right? If you're listening to this, I love these steps. So you talk about these five critical things to do, and I'm going to go through them. So first thing you got to do is quantify the customer problem, right? Okay. No brainer. Got that. Second is frame the market and the size of the opportunity. Okay. Got that. Three is to assess the space. And I know myself, again, personal experience, this is where I would I would gloss over this one, right? So are there other providers in it? Is it white space where you're inventing and defining or redefining the world? Or is it fragmented spaces with people running around? I tend to be that like, create it and go out and create the demand for it. And probably fail most times, but know that my safety net is that you just got to get it right one out of 10 times. But this dispels that. And I'm going to change my own way now because these five are going to hang on my own mirror. These are so critical. So four is, do you have the right to play? Do you have the right to play? So you unpack it by saying, is it in service of what the wider corporation is trying to accomplish? Yeah. Incredible. And the fifth one, is it a sustainable opportunity? So I want to take those five right now, wrap them up with a bow on them and say, is this not what Elon Musk is doing right now? So he's an incredible entrepreneur, business after business, founder, founder, founder, but then says, there's a problem so large that I want to go work as you say it, inside of a framework. That blows me away that a guy who's such a great, great entrepreneur is now going to take that hat off, walk inside of the federal government, which I know from personal experience working in the federal government, they're in for a lot if anybody can do it, it's him. But Is he taking these steps and hanging the hat up the way I'm explaining it and going to work inside of a wireframe? Is he doing that? Or do I have it wrong?

SPEAKER_01 24:42

It's a great question. I think time will tell as we see him enter into his new role. First of all, I want to say, in general, I'm not looking at this through a political lens. So anything we talk about here isn't political, it's diagnostic. It's about how do we think about entrepreneurship versus entrepreneurship? And I think you're onto something here, because the federal government is a very large organization. And Yeah. Yeah. If they do that in a way that also values the contributions of the people around them and harnesses kind of the ideas and the capabilities and the experience, then there's a tremendous opportunity there.

SPEAKER_03 25:47

Okay. In the first probably two dozen pages of the book, you talk a lot about that word contribution. Yeah. What do you see it as, your importance? Why does that matter to this entrepreneurship role inside of a wireframe and a framework?

SPEAKER_01 26:06

It's right at the core. It goes to values. It's like, hey, are we doing something primarily for ourselves? Are we doing something primarily for a larger organization? And what I've found is that when we limit the scope of Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. We're serving our team members. We're trying to create a better environment for them and create value. And from my perspective, the financials are important. We need to have financial sustainability. However, successful financials, from my perspective, are necessary but not sufficient. There's a why there. And the why there is that we are contributing to others and we're making either the world, the company, our community a better place. So I think that's critically important. Now, along the way, it's also valuable to understand, okay, what do I do best? What are my strengths? What are my weaknesses? And I need other people around me to be most effective, that sort of thing. So contribution goes right to the core of it. And last but not least, it's a way to be most effective. If you start with contribution, you end with most impact.

SPEAKER_03 27:49

Interesting. In your opinion, can it entrepreneur also be an intrapreneur inside their own organization that they founded and run two hats at the same time?

SPEAKER_01 28:03

It's very difficult to do. It's not impossible. The definition of an intrapreneur is someone who's working within the organization. So in the cases that I have generally contemplated in the definition, in the book, and the people I've interviewed, these are people who are working in the context of a larger organization. Now, here's where it gets more interesting. The CEO or president and a handful of other most senior leaders, they create the environment in which entrepreneurs succeed or fail. And if entrepreneurs aren't succeeding inside a company, it's generally a And that's systemic. It's actually not because of failings of the entrepreneurs by and large. It's because the most senior executives have failed to create an environment for innovation. I have one more angle on this that's very, very important. People do take on different roles inside different types of organizations. So let's take that same person who's a founder of a company. Let's say also that they're part of a local nonprofit organization. And let's say they're an investor in another group. They might act like an entrepreneur and most senior leader in one organization, but act much more like an entrepreneur inside other organizations. So the same person can act in different ways and in different capacities in different organizations at the same time.

SPEAKER_03 29:39

Wow. So it's not like... you're born an entrepreneur and you're going to act like an entrepreneur in all things you do.

SPEAKER_01 29:47

For most of us, it's more like a dimmer switch than an on-off switch. And some people are at the far extremes. It's like, you know, I just can't do it. I need to be an entrepreneur or I would never, ever be an entrepreneur. I got to work inside a large company or other organization. Most of us, have a range of capabilities. Let's take a couple of examples. Let's say that someone is coming out of undergrad, if they choose to go to college. Let's say they go to college, they graduate and they say, you know what? I want to learn from some of the best in these larger organizations. And I need some air cover. Maybe I have some student loans. I'd rather work in a larger organization, learn, get my financial footing, and then have the opportunity to be an entrepreneur later.

UNKNOWN 30:35

And

SPEAKER_01 30:35

Right. Yeah. Sure. Right. because of their experience as an entrepreneur.

SPEAKER_03 31:07

Should a company hire, should their job description be for intrapreneur? Are we there yet or is this too early?

SPEAKER_01 31:15

For sure it should happen at times, but it's situational. I think the broader guidance that I would give is for companies to understand what's required for success in a role. Okay. For most general manager and division leader roles, You almost certainly need these characteristics of entrepreneurs, including curiosity, action orientation, bridge building. risk tolerance, and grounded optimism. You need all of those. And I would advise companies certainly to hire for those. At the same time, if you are hiring for someone who, let's say it's a role that requires excellent operations, you can work on the continuous improvement, but maybe there's a higher order need there to have efficiency and same service every time as opposed to the innovation. Not every single role and not every single person needs to act entrepreneurially and be

SPEAKER_03 32:18

entrepreneurial to be successful. Is there a percentage in your opinion in an organization how many people are entrepreneurs versus not? And like how many, trying to get to a number of how many people out there function every day like an entrepreneur. They're at their morning coffee. They didn't even go into the office yet. And they're thinking about how they can contribute to their company. So they're acting like all things required to be an entrepreneur But they haven't identified themselves that way. Is it one in 10?

SPEAKER_01 32:50

I've been looking for the research on this for two years, and I haven't found anything yet that satisfies me in terms of being evidence-based that answers the specific question of percentages. On the other hand, at this point, I've spoken with thousands of people who are interested in this topic, and it's a lot bigger than I ever expected. So I'm going to go out on a limb anecdotally and with the research that I've had access so Okay. That's fair. Yeah, that's

SPEAKER_03 33:21

fair. All right. Real life example. If I hear one over and over and over again, it's this salesperson. I cannot understand why I add so much value to an organization selling, selling, selling. I'm excellent in front of people. I get deals done. But yet that same salesperson who has like one incredible contribution to their company isn't able to do that all day every day because they got to come back to the office and get bogged down in paperwork and sales orders and sales revisions and all that other stuff. Why does that happen in companies? I don't get it. Why didn't the company just let that salesperson sell all day, every day, and they can pay a hundred times over for an assistant for that salesperson? I hear that so often.

SPEAKER_01 34:15

I think it, by and large, is going to be short-sightedness. The biggest explanation I hear for that sort of approach is either a company doesn't have the budget or Or it's just kind of like, hey, it's part of the job, so get used to it.

SPEAKER_03 34:34

It's the way we did it

SPEAKER_01 34:35

always. It's the way we've always done it. I do think that there are some interesting technologies that are coming along that can decrease the administrative burden and increase the amount of time and attention and engagement that someone has. I also think it's about leadership. Because if a single leader of a team or a team of leaders looks at the business and understands the jobs to be done,

SPEAKER_02 35:03

then

SPEAKER_01 35:05

it's entirely possible to dial up the amount of time that a talented coder, that a talented salesperson, that a talented product person can spend doing the things they understand the best and to place support around them.

SPEAKER_03 35:22

Yeah, makes perfect sense. What's a time... when this has failed in the past for you? Like when did you try to step out and be an entrepreneur and fell on your face maybe?

SPEAKER_01 35:34

Oh my gosh. Well, any number of times. One of the reasons I wrote the book is because I and our teams had made so many mistakes along the way. I mean, we had disproportionate success. It was an amazing journey, but at the same time, we had some hard lessons to learn. And so I suppose one of the biggest ones is when We end up with a situation where we're so eager to get moving, picking up on our conversation earlier, that in the sense of urgency and in our enthusiasm

SPEAKER_02 36:09

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 36:12

Mm-hmm. Look, Lewis, that's a fine idea, but there are five reasons why this either can't be done right now or it's going to cause security risks or anything else. And so we need to take a step back. Very often, a no now for a good idea isn't a no forever. But if you can calibrate the timing, that makes a lot of difference. But you're going to have to write the strategy first. You're going to have to give us the plan. Because without the plan, not only am I not... comfortable with this. But also we can't sell it into the rest of the organization because we got a lot of priorities. We got a lot of budget decisions and you're not thinking small here. And so for anyone who's listening to this, who thinks they have a great idea and they really want to make a big impact, I would encourage them simultaneously to keep that enthusiasm and sense of urgency and also realize if you do the prep work in these larger organizations, you essentially are open the doors for longer-term success. And there's one additional strategic reason to do this. If you prove success early, you gain trust and legitimacy. And when trust and legitimacy expand, then you gain permission to go into additional ventures over time.

SPEAKER_03 38:20

Oh, and that's enormous. So that's reputation. Character and competence as they talk about in like the speed of trust. Okay. That makes sense. So about somewhere halfway through your book, you talk about, get your idea, tease it out with some other folks that would be involved, whether it's other divisions, departments, et cetera, get it onto a slide.

SPEAKER_01 38:43

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 38:44

And I like that. I love that for a visual because you'll have one chance and one chance only when it goes out. to whoever it is, when your boss says, okay, show me what that looks like. So put it into a slide. You're talking a physical slide in there, opening it up, drawing a visual. What's some examples of that?

SPEAKER_01 39:07

I'll give you an example, and I'll also tie that to what you asked before. This one was really hard for me early on. I'm not... always able to get a lot of ideas into a small space. And I was creating slide decks, and I don't even love PowerPoint, but I was creating these slide decks to try to cover everything that I was thinking so that no stone would be left

SPEAKER_02 39:30

unturned.

SPEAKER_01 39:30

And it wasn't effective. It didn't work. People were tuning out. And so what became pretty clear pretty fast, especially with some coaching from several people, and I'm deeply grateful to them, said, Lewis, you got to make this really simple. You got to make this Mm-hmm. understands this. Someone who's in the marketing organization understands this. And if you're talking with someone in HR, they understand how to help you develop an organization where you can achieve your goals. And so there is one slide that tends to be very effective and it's articulating a vision. Let's say it's a vision when mobile isn't a really small thing at the Weather Channel and you say, you know what, we have a vision of having a world-class business. Maybe you put some specific metrics in there. But basically, you're the recognized leader in the world in this area. And then you have a mission of achieving X amount of revenue and Y number of unique users within three years or whatever the period of time is. And then you have a handful of statements about how you're going to do that. For example, we need to build a portfolio of apps We need to draw on our strength in video, which, by the way, tends to get people fired up because it's something they already understand.

SPEAKER_03 41:00

And

SPEAKER_01 41:01

we need to have a strong browsing solution. This is a product-centric view. It doesn't have to be product-centric, but this is one way to do it. And then we need to have text messaging so we can reach people when they need it. For example, if the tornado is going to arrive at somebody's house in 10 minutes, get it to them right now. That tends to motivate people. That's the single slide. And I would add that if you have that supported by a clear understanding of the landscape as expressed in a SWOT analysis, strength weaknesses, opportunities, and threats, if you combine those things together, they turn into a really powerful way in one or two slides.

SPEAKER_03 41:43

Sure.

SPEAKER_01 41:44

To capture people's imagination, describe where you're going, and to gain buy-in. And oh, by the way, generate conversation from people who don't yet understand. They say, oh, well, what if you did X?

SPEAKER_03 41:55

Okay. I read a book. It was Harvard Business Review many years ago, and I believe it was called Communicating Effectively or Effective Communication. And the takeaway in the book was depending on who you're speaking to, you use different words. So if I'm speaking to a CFO, I don't want to go into a CFO or a person in finance and use the words crush it, kill it, knock it out of the park. Because to them, they're just thinking, like, have you quantified anything? Because they see the world in numbers. But the same thing you don't want to take to the CEO, right? Somebody who thinks bigger, broader strokes. So for the people out there that are like, this is incredible. I'm putting this slide together because I have such a killer idea and I want to do this the right way in my organization because it will help X, Y, Z. Does that slide need to be translated in different languages based on Who's going to see it in the organization?

SPEAKER_01 42:54

My perspective is absolutely not. It does not need to be translated. Rather, it's the starting place, and then you can do the translation after that. There's a danger if you start changing the words and the approach to try to cater to different groups of people, and that is that there will be different interpretations. It's like if you have a value statement for a company, you don't change the values in general for different audiences. You may make it shorter or longer. Now, what I would advise to pick up on the very important insight that you just described is Understand what your voiceover track is for the course slide. So how you describe what's on the slide and what it means can vary. But the core words, very concise, very simple, always the same. And then furthermore, the slides that you have afterward can vary. For example, if you've got an audience in the financial team, then maybe you follow on with an income statement and projections. And if you've got a meeting with the marketing team, then maybe you talk about the types of marketing initiatives that you'd like to consider. And if you're talking with the technology team, then you can describe the technology that's required. But the core vision, mission, and goals, I can't think of an instance off the top of my head where you'd be better off changing it for different audiences because even though you might gain a little, you lose a lot.

SPEAKER_03 44:18

Right. What do you love doing inside of organizations, bigger and better, like more than anything else? What do you absolutely love? Love.

SPEAKER_01 44:31

Working with talented teams to achieve audacious goals. It's really energizing, and especially when the goals are so aligned with where the organization wants to go overall and so aligned with customer benefit that you can see it and you can do it. I distinctly remember going down to the TED to see a Braves game back in the earlier days when we just had these flip phones, and And we had a storm coming through that was causing a rain delay and seeing the clouds coming through. And we could predict it because at the time, it was fairly revolutionary to see images on a phone, even though that's so common today that it's hard to even imagine. This customer benefit and knowing that our team had taken that from concept to development to market deployment to using it for a specific benefit for our family Oh, man, that's

SPEAKER_03 45:33

so cool. So what was it like when you got the, whether it was a text or the communication, your number one on the App Store?

SPEAKER_01 45:44

What's that like? We just set out to build a great app. And I think that is... The

SPEAKER_03 45:49

Weather Channel

SPEAKER_01 45:50

app. The Weather Channel in particular. And we had a lot of help from a lot of team members. And I want to acknowledge all of them because there were specific teams that were segmented in essentially closed off environments, highly confidential, because what we were working on was not disclosed to very many people in the world. And so we knew we were working on this project. We knew we were funding it. The information at that time was segmented. And then we come around to market launch and we had hoped that it would be loved by customers and it turned out that it was. And so it was really uplifting. And then another part of this Yeah. Yeah. Oh my gosh, this benefits all of us. And to recognize how much it means to our brand, that also means a lot. Because it's not just about an individual customer in Topeka. It's not just about the company itself. doing better on its revenue and EBITDA numbers. It's also about a stronger brand that's relevant for its customers. That's that contribution part of it that you talked to. I

SPEAKER_03 47:33

could feel that now, like in the way you explain this and the way you describe it. Like it's a lot more than just reading words. I actually feel it. Okay. So organizations, you got workers and you got a boss, and then you got a boss and bosses above the bosses and the bosses and the bosses. Right. And... Is it not commonplace that if you bring an idea to a boss, you're wide open risking the fact that he may go, oh, yeah, we'll talk about that another day. Meantime, he steps out of his office down to his boss and is like, oh, I thought of this great idea today. And they take your idea. Is that commonplace or do I have it wrong?

SPEAKER_01 48:17

It's not unheard of. And I think one of the things that frustrates many entrepreneurs is what is commonly described as politics. organizations and behaviors where you look at it and you're like, did that really just happen here? And so what you just described does happen. I'm aware of places where it has happened. However, it happens rarely in the best organizations. And so that gets back to culture. There's this old saying that culture eats strategy for lunch, and it's absolutely true. Yeah. Drucker, I think. Yeah. Awesome. And so it's very important for the entrepreneur to have some cultural awareness. I've sometimes been better at that than others, frankly, because a lot of the times I've just been like, you know, I have three core values. One of them is do the right thing. One of them is serve our customers. And one of them is move forward. And I try to act by those always. And I think, you know, at times I may not have lived up 100% to what I aspired to, but I was always making an effort to do that. And what I found is that if each of Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_02 49:48

of

SPEAKER_01 49:49

mutual support and looking at ways to make each other look good. As a report, what I hope I've always done is thought not only about advancing an idea, but how to support the people around me, including the person I report to along the way. And what I would say also is if you end up in a situation where you know that is happening, might be time to look at a different position, honestly. And I say this in the book because I don't want to mince words. There are some organizations Mm-hmm. That works for a lot of us. And if it works for us, let's keep doing that. And if it doesn't work for us, let's either try to change it or find a different environment.

SPEAKER_03 50:57

Yeah, you gave an example in the book when you were asked to pad the expense report. And your response is just, it's awesome. Thank you. I mean, after reading it, I'm like, it could have went one of two ways. I'm like, way to go, man. We need more of that. You push back. You stood up.

SPEAKER_01 51:17

Well, thank you. And it's a values-based decision, and I find that in the best organizations, they will respect that. And you learn something if you get a different answer, too.

SPEAKER_03 51:30

Oh, I can only imagine on that one. All right. When your child does nothing but build and play Legos and design and all that, it's said that they're most likely going to become an architect or an engineer. They're not interested in sports. Mainly, it's like crystal clear. You could see where they're heading from a very early age. I'm curious if there's anything that would denote or give off symptom that your child, maybe even could be even teenager, is an intrapreneur. Or is it just you would start off showing characteristics of entrepreneur, and then you just sort of find out that you like wireframes or architecture better? Sure. What do you think there?

SPEAKER_01 52:18

So I've taken the position that entrepreneurship and entrepreneurship are different disciplines, even though they have many similarities. And I do believe that you see– inclinations towards one or the other or both early on, both in my experience, because I've been CEO of two small companies in addition to leading divisions within larger ones, both of them start with curiosity. And so if someone is highly curious, adventurous, they want to learn, that is a great indication. Next, if someone is willing to take essentially a calculated risk to try things, to be aware that they're going to fail. You might try a sport that isn't one you've ever done,

SPEAKER_02 53:07

but

SPEAKER_01 53:08

you're going to see how that goes. You might just be an entrepreneur. If you join a club... in elementary school or middle school, and you start coming up with new ideas. I talk with people who have had new ideas along the way and just said, wait, wait a minute. When I was in middle school, I did this kind of thing. When I was in high school, I did this kind of thing. After high school and in college, I did this kind of thing. And when I got into the workforce, I was coming up with ideas. Now I understand how I'm wired. And so there definitely are ways to see it. And can a person who starts a lemonade stand also be an entrepreneur? Yes. Can a person who builds a new initiative within a school club become an entrepreneur? Yes. But you start seeing those signs and at a certain point, especially over time, you can draw a line. You can start seeing a theme there. And lastly, in answer to your question, I've found that there is a clear indication that many people are serial entrepreneurs. They will do that early in their career, and it works for them, and they do it again and again. And so after a while, this idea of innovating in larger organizations is just one of the things they excel at the most.

SPEAKER_03 54:36

Gosh, I love it. Okay, you left Weather Channel in 2009?

SPEAKER_01 54:41

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 54:41

Okay, what did things look like there? What was next?

SPEAKER_01 54:45

I feel like one of the most fortunate people in the technology and media industry. I had the opportunity to lead mobile worldwide at CNN through 2013, where we launched CNN's first iPhone and Android apps, a groundbreaking iPad app, rebuilt mobile web, did a lot of cool things with video. For like

SPEAKER_03 55:06

CNN. For CNN worldwide. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 55:09

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 55:09

So

SPEAKER_01 55:10

it was an amazing privilege to do that with a great group of people. And then I had a long time dream of leading a small company. And there was a company called Ellison Mobile that built websites for local TV stations and also apps. And we repositioned that company. And then we got a deal with Raycon Media in the local TV space. I was doing some consulting Yeah. Sure. Yeah. Oh, my goodness. have had some success in and really love doing. And then I just felt the calling to write this book. I looked around, I've been thinking about it for five years, and I was like, Yeah. Wow. Yeah. And now I am just jumping back into a mode where I'll be working full time, maybe in a role like that and maybe in consulting.

SPEAKER_03 57:27

Yeah. Okay. So you have a consulting gig right now, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 57:31

I do have a consulting business and it's largely focused around entrepreneurship and it focuses on assessments.

SPEAKER_03 57:38

For

SPEAKER_01 57:38

people who want to innovate.

SPEAKER_03 57:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:40

And it also focuses on revenue growth plans. And lastly, fractional COO services.

SPEAKER_03 57:45

Oh, that's very cool. So now you have me. My perspective has changed. I'm looking at a company, any company, and going, this organization is thriving and growing because there are entrepreneurs in it. They're the ones, right? It's so

SPEAKER_01 58:06

important. I mean, wow. That's it. You know, vibrant companies generally have a large group of talented, effective, and empowered entrepreneurs.

SPEAKER_03 58:23

Yeah. That's, yeah, makes sense. All right, so what are you doing with your spare time? The very little that you probably have these days.

SPEAKER_01 58:32

Well, a lot of it is focused on the family. And also I'm active in some organizations around Atlanta, including Junior Achievement of Georgia and the Fernbank Museum of Natural History and the Technology Association of Georgia. And there are just so many people who are doing great things in our community. So I find a lot of energy in that. I try to stay active with exercise. And by the time we take care of those, it's about time to get a good night's sleep.

SPEAKER_03 59:02

I'll bet. All right, folks, for those who want to contact Lewis, how do we go about it?

SPEAKER_01 59:10

Well, the best way is to go to my website at lewisgump.com. And there's a lot of information about the book and also contact... In addition to that, they can go to LinkedIn. I'm easy to find there and they're welcome to reach out that way.

SPEAKER_03 59:25

Awesome. Well, I want to say thanks again for taking the time to come to the studio. You have an incredible story and I wish you all the best in your next, your ventures and your books to come. I feel there's going to be a lot more than just this first one.

SPEAKER_01 59:38

Thank you, Jeff. I've just been really inspired by so many people who have contributed to this writing project and it's a real pleasure to meet with you today. All right. Thanks.

SPEAKER_00 59:48

Thanks for watching The Jeff Opec Show. Be sure to subscribe and follow us on all socials.