No Life 'Til Lager Episode 19 - Nick Meyer, Adam Wolfe, Justin Sirois x Eckhart Beer

No Life 'Til Lager Episode Nineteen with owner & founder Nick Meyer, head brewer Adam Wolfe and operations & sales manager Justin Sirois at Eckhart Beer Co.

Hosted by failed Master Cicerone® Adam Zuniga. Produced by Jeremy Batchelor.

No Life 'Til Lager theme song by The Bad Actors. Episode art by Dana Sirois.

Follow @nolifetillager, https://nolifetillager.buzzsprout.com

Meet the Meisters - https://eckhartbeer.com

Copyright 2025 No Life 'Til Lager

Transcript

Welcome Eckhart!

SPEAKER_01 0:14

Welcome to No Life to Lager, a show about lager beer, the brewers who make it, and we that drink it. This is a conversation between four people over one or two pints. My name is Adam Zuniga. I'm a failed master cicerone. I'm part of the creative team behind the Six Most Metal Breweries and Beer Like and Dust Movie. And my guests today are Nick Meyer, owner and founder, Adam Wolf, head brewer, Justin Surrois, operations and sales manager. That is at Eckhart Beer Company in Brooklyn, New York. I am so happy to be back in New York City. Cheers and welcome, gentlemen.

SPEAKER_03 0:53

Thank you. Nice to be here.

SPEAKER_01 0:56

Oh, thank you for joining No Life to Lager. There are many firsts on this episode. First time we've met, first time I've had your beer. First time we've ever had three guests at once. But I'm guessing we have a lot in common, a lot of friends in common, a lot of shared experiences. I mean, uh I heart New York City. I love New York. I think uh next to beer itself, New York is the great love of my life. And I think it's the best city in the world to drink beer. So it is a match made in heaven. And you are doing both. Um, I lived there for over a decade. I managed sales for six-point for a large part of that. Um, I don't think I fully realized it at the time, but it gave me the keys to the city. It gave me the keys to Brooklyn. It made New York like the biggest little town in the world. And what seemed overwhelming at first uh felt very personal. I could no longer walk down the street anymore without seeing a familiar face. Uh, that's what New York means to me. That's what beer means to me. And you're giving me every reason to come back and visit. So thank you very much.

SPEAKER_03 2:07

Yeah, man. Yeah, please, please come back. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:13

You don't even have to ask, but by the end of this episode, I guarantee it. Um, so before we talk about you, before we talk about the brewery, before we talk more about New York, uh, can you tell

The beers at hand

SPEAKER_01 2:25

me about the beers in each of our hands? So I am drinking your Czech style dark lager. Uh, clocks in at 4.7% alcohol. Uh, dark lagers are also a great love of my life. So thank you for a very handsome box of beer. I guarantee you I'm gonna drink every single can. Tell me about this beer and tell me about what you're drinking, please, before we go.

SPEAKER_03 2:46

Uh yeah, Adam, and yeah, why don't you take it away on the on sort of talking through these beers?

SPEAKER_02 2:51

Uh yeah, yeah, sure. So, yeah, you're drinking the Czech Dark Lager here now. Um, that is kind of inspired by Prague and Ufleku, uh, the brewery out there. Um uh we all love this style very much, so we definitely want to make it a kind of a core range beer for us. Um, but yeah, it's got Agnes hops in it, which is uh we all did a kind of a sniff and rub uh about a year ago and came across this hop and fell in love with it. It has this beautiful kind of menthol minty uh resin vibe to it. Um still is super noble and has that awesome Czech expression. So we wanted to express that all the way throughout this beer. Um it's definitely one of my favorite styles, though I love brewing this beer. I don't know if you guys want to speak anything else on it, but yeah, definitely one of my favorites.

SPEAKER_01 3:41

So fitting for the time of year, but fitting all year. I can drink dark lager endlessly, whether it's Czech style, whether it's German style. And I just, it's still kind of a magic trick to me. It's always fun explaining dark, you know, beer doesn't necessarily mean heavy or hefty, uh, but that you're able to make it uh so that it's not overly roasty, that it's not overly astringent, that it finishes dry, that it finishes clean. It always seems like a magic trick to me, and that's exactly what you do here. Like I said, I can drink this beer infinitely and endlessly, and your expression of it in the check style here is absolutely flawless, my friend. And if I didn't say it already, it's always good to know another Adam. So thank you for sharing this with me. Um tell me a little bit about the beers you all are drinking.

SPEAKER_03 4:27

Uh yeah, so I'll start with me. Um, I'm drinking the Meritzen, um, which is one of the two um Oktoberfest beers we did. We did uh a uh you know traditional Meritzen and then we did uh some more contemporary uh blonde fest beer. Nice. Um you know I can let Adam talk a little bit about the the process um going in you know going behind it. I just really like this one. Um I mean this is something we'll probably talk about a lot. Like we just have a similar palette. I think what Adam sort of formulates as far as recipes, like the dark, the same. I'm not a huge dark beer fan, but like I just really I do really like our dark lager. Um there's there's sort of a roundness to it, like you said, with like the thing, the things that I tend to not like, the astringency, the harsh roast, like the techniques that he's using to get those, um to make sure that those that doesn't happen um are like really important. And um yeah, and then the meriton is another one that like you know I've had some that I like, but it's it's usually I tend to go for the the lighter, the blonder stuff. So um, but this one is another really nice one. It's got something that sort of reminds me of like it's the beer version of like a nice bourbon.

SPEAKER_01 5:45

Um I love it. Um both your meritin and fest beer are waiting for me. And um, yeah, I will say the same. A lot of time meriton historically it can be kind of cloying, um, which I think allows why a lot of modern breweries and craft breweries are turning toward fest beer. Um, but that you can make a merit and that doesn't, it's not like overly sticky, so to speak. Um, I cannot wait. Uh what else? Adam, Justin, what else do you have in hand?

SPEAKER_02 6:12

Yeah, I am drinking our alt beer. Uh this is actually gonna be a new release, so we just filtered it yesterday. So always fun to pour a beer off the tank and enjoy it uh at day after filtration. So uh yeah, this is a classic Dusseldorf style alt beer. Um my friends always make fun of me because I say my desert island beer is Schumacher Alt. Um, and I stand by it. It's one of my favorite styles. It's funny, it's not a remarkable beer, but I I just love it. It's made for drinking. Um, so uh I'm excited to be drinking this today.

SPEAKER_01 6:46

Made for drinking, other Adam. I think you and Julie from Notch um on our last episode, uh, likewise share a love for Altbeer. I love that what is old is new again, and it's coming back. Um during my tenure at Six Point, the headbrewer at the time, Danny Altbeer was also his favorite style. And it wasn't, I don't think the market was quite ready for it when Sixpoint tried to put a larger push behind Altbeer in New York City. Uh, but great brewers and great minds think alike. So here's to you, Danny, and here's to you, Adam. Uh Justin, what do you have in your hand?

SPEAKER_04 7:21

Uh I'm drinking our Czech pail lager.

SPEAKER_01 7:24

Nice.

SPEAKER_04 7:25

Yeah. This is one of my favorites. Um, you know, it's it's 4.2%, but still really medium, full-bodied. Um packs a lot of flavor. Um you know, we have a kind of combined big love for Boudvar. So that was uh, you know, a beer we were kind of emulating a bit uh in thinking about the recipe design. And and similar to the dark, you know, we did a pretty deep dive into um hop selection and lot selection of trying to find some more unique um local expressive hops from Germany and Czech. Um and how dark uses uh predominantly Agnes is kind of an expression of that. Uh the Czech Pale is more of an expression of Slodek, which is a really really cool hop. Um has a little bit of kind of like melon citrus and dankness to it as well. Um and it's one of those hops too where there's you know a few breweries in in Czech that are brewing with it, larger ones, which is the main reason like why it exists. And if they stopped brewing with it, the farmers would probably stop growing it. So uh I hope they jumped.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

Oh, likewise, likewise.

SPEAKER_04 8:39

Um and similar um to the Czech Dark, and in a lot of our beers, we used a lot of holy pots as well, um, hot side in louder. Uh, and I think you know there's a lot of really kind of awesome, nuanced uh green herbal expression that comes through with those additions.

SPEAKER_01 8:58

Well, that's really interesting. Um, here's to the light side, here's to the dark side. I've definitely seen you all sitting around a table doing sensory analysis together as a brewery, so I can tell how seriously you take it, and we're gonna talk more about that. Um, there's so much that is so exciting about Eckhart that makes you special, that makes you unique, that makes you distinct. Um let's get into it. You know, before we get to present day, we always like to talk about our brewers and our brewery team. We like to know the people and personalities behind it. We like to know whose house we're in. So, can you tell me just a little bit about yourselves, uh life before beer, if there was such a thing, uh, some other jobs you've had that ultimately led you to turn this passion to a profession, whether it was owning and founding a brewery, whether it was brewing as head brewer, whether it was sales and operations uh within the beer sector, uh all of which are absolutely vital to success for a modern, fully functioning brewery. So tell us who you are and how you got here.

Meet Nick

SPEAKER_03 10:05

Uh okay, yeah, I'll get started. Um I uh my background is in cooking. I was a chef and cook for a long time. Um, and I worked primarily in fine dining for 20 years, um, sort of bounced around various sectors of the cooking world. I taught cooking for a while. Um, I worked in a bunch of different concepts, but I was always um into cooking, flavor, creating flavors, um, and then the other side of that, of course, is like hospitality. Um and it's you know, share sharing with people and and sort of sharing in their enjoyment of of the of the product and of the experience. And I got into brewing, I got into beer first through food, and then I because I like making things, was interested in learning how to make things. Um, and I sort of journeyed through the home brewer process and the beer enthusiast uh sort of process. Uh I first started getting into craft beer when in the sort of initial wave when it was British styles and then Belgian styles were sort of all the rage because, you know, especially because of the high ABVs and stuff like that, but also because there was interesting flavors that people were not used to experiencing in beer um in the US anyway. Um and because they were food, you know, because they were sort of could be treated as food beverages. And I I like wine, but I was never as like into wine as a lot of people were.

SPEAKER_01 11:46

Uh and then it's good to hear that from a from a chef and someone with a history in both uh culinary arts and hospitality. So yes to wine, but more to beer. That's fantastic. I love it. Keep going, please.

SPEAKER_03 11:57

Yeah, I mean, you know, the way people some people say beer wine people tend to say beer is one-dimensional and and vice versa. Um I I feel like beer has a versatility, not to not to open a can of worms, but that that wine doesn't. But uh anyway, yeah, I was just always just more interested in it. Um and uh owned a craft, small craft beer shop for a little while in the city, but I was always more interested in the making side of it. Um and I mean it's a it's a long story, but essentially I I started to think about doing a brewery concept, and there was just never never felt like a really a concept that needed to exist given like how uh saturated the brewery market was, you know, over the last 10-15 years. Um and then uh I just as my journey continued, I just became more and more interested in these types of beers. These they're they're very flavorable, but they're drinkable um and um and tricky to make, which is always uh like you know intriguing to me. Like I would as a homebrewer, I would just I dumped 90% of the lagers I made because I just where they were just never turned out the way I wanted them to be. And I was wasn't gonna drink them if they weren't right.

SPEAKER_01 13:21

Um well, A plus and extra points for trying.

SPEAKER_03 13:25

Um so yeah, so I uh this through a various I was trying to revive a brewery that had gone out of business, uh Folk's beer. I don't know if you know about them. Um there was a great small uh brewery in in Brooklyn that was doing a lot of lager uh production, and then they went out of business, and I was hoping to revive that and that didn't work, but um then I'd sort of come come into this business plan that I thought looked, you know, by that point had a had a place to be. Like I was looking at other breweries like Notch um or like um you know KC Beer or um Beer Stot or you know, what's the um Chilling, yeah. And I was seeing like look, people are making a go of it with loggers and it's working. Um and New York and New York is a huge market. It seemed like an ideal place to do it. Yeah. So that's sort of how we how I got to where I am. Um and you know, I'll let that Justin was the next sort of player into the picture. Um and um we met through some some weird circumstances, but it was the timing was perfect, and sort of he came on right early in the early stages to help sort of create the the lay the groundwork.

SPEAKER_01 14:50

So I want to hear the weird circumstances since you mentioned it. Um but I first just a lot of love for what you're saying, the love for lager, uh, appreciation for beer as food. That has been a recurring theme on this show. And just real quick, what was the the little craft beer store that you owned?

SPEAKER_03 15:08

Uh it was called Some Good Beer, and now we were partnered. I was partnered with a wine shop that was next door. Oh and we were trying to we were sort of there, we were trying to create some sort of synergy there. Um where like you know, he had people buying wine, and then we wanted to any people who wanted beer, we were right next door. Um and that sort of was starting to get gain some traction right and right when COVID hit, and so I yeah, the bottom sort of fell out of it.

SPEAKER_01 15:38

But uh some good beer was on East 8th Street, right? Yeah, it's just as you cross Fifth Avenue. Um, God, I feel like I remember you had a beer tender there that was heavy into technical death metal. Um, and you were down the street from Arson Craft's beer parlor, and if you kept walking east, you'd hit Good Beer, which I know is now also defunct or out of business, but all great institutions in their own, right? Um, I love to hear it. Here's to some good beer, and here's to more good beer. The small world.

Meet Justin

SPEAKER_01 16:05

Yeah, hell yeah. Um well, Justin, uh, tell us what led you uh to operations and sales manager, how life and beer began, and what were the circumstances around you and Nick connecting?

SPEAKER_04 16:18

Yeah. Um yeah, I've I've had a pretty diverse past. I've kind of bounced around a few different industries. Uh, was sort of born into the hospitality industry, used to have a family-owned um hotel down on the Jersey shore. So grew up around hospitality and got into restaurants at a very young age. Um and studied photography, art history, stuff like that, and got into the film and TV production world.

SPEAKER_05 16:51

Oh nice.

SPEAKER_04 16:51

Uh the whole time maintaining like one foot in FMB and working in some really fantastic uh restaurants with really amazing wine programs and cocktail programs uh in New York City and Santa Barbara. Um eventually I had my own production company, a little multimedia kind of commercial company, um, and sold that and moved out west uh with my wife when uh shortly after my daughter was born. Um we bought a 40-acre farm in Northern California um to do various things. Um and but I I've always had a big love, similar to Nick, um in making things. Um I'm an artist at my core too. Uh love, love all things beverage, um, was really into wine and being in Northern California and just the whole West Coast there, the you know, the minification scene out there. It's amazing. Got to got to meet and work with some really great winemakers, which actually led me to beer. Um, because at that time, uh, I was also kind of feeling like, oh, I feel like there's even more um creativity and expression possible in the beer scene. This is 10-ish years ago. Um so similarly got to kind of shadow and hang out with some awesome brewers and breweries in northern and southern California, lived down there for a bit too. Uh, and then when we moved back here, I was like, all right, like I really want to get into beer production. Um so started doing that, um, did the Siebel route, all that stuff. Um, and then I was I was at Five Burrows Brewing Company, um kind of wearing a few different hats there. Uh and then I unfortunately had an accident at that brewery, um, which through various ways ended up uh I was introduced to Nick, met Nick, and at that time, I mean I was um also had in my mind, oh, I'd love to open a brewery someday.

SPEAKER_05 18:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 19:00

Um, and met Nick, who had a concept that I you know very strongly believed in and still do. Uh that was almost two and a half, three years ago or something like that at this point.

SPEAKER_03 19:12

It might be, it might be a half.

SPEAKER_04 19:14

Three, I think it's three and a half actually. Yeah. So yeah, you know, Nick and I just continued meeting, hanging out, having beers, talking about the concept. Um, and then eventually it came time to look for a space, and one thing kind of uh led to another, and here we are. So yeah, I mean, you know, I'm I'm not uh I'm not a master brewer by any means or a technical brewer. That's why we've got Adam. But uh just the kind of various things I've done with logistics and operations in different fields um and sales, just kind of all acquiesce and lend themselves well to managing the brewery and making sure we're ready to rock each day.

SPEAKER_01 19:54

I love it. Um yeah, I'll say again, you and I definitely have a lot in common just in terms of background, whether it's production or acting or entertainment. Um,

The Bad Actors

SPEAKER_01 20:05

too.

SPEAKER_04 20:05

Is did you do did you do the jingle in the beginning, the opening jingle?

SPEAKER_01 20:09

Uh fun fact. So the voice is actually George Sulaitis, uh, the owner of St. Vitus Bar. Uh guitar is me, bass is our um editor and producer, Jeremy Bachelor. We call it, we call our band the bad actors. Um, but yeah, that's uh that's the three of us putting together the no life tillager jingle. I think I'm gonna release a seven-inch someday. Um so yeah, music, uh, acting, entertainment, art, production, and ultimately beer. And you give me faith that this this sojourn, the sabbaticult in northern California, can also bear fruit and ultimately lead back to New York City. So maybe we were neighbors before, or maybe we will be at some point. Um that's wonderful.

unknown 20:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 20:51

Well, I was down in Gohide too, and you're in Sasolito?

SPEAKER_01 20:55

So right now, Sasolito outside San Francisco in the Bay Area. I've lived down in Hermosa Beach in Los Angeles. You know, all these places uh make us who we are, um, but for always uh just forever nostalgic for New York because it just was over a decade there and kind of the most defining moments of my life to date. So um, Adam,

Meet Adam

SPEAKER_01 21:16

for you now, um this is all becoming abundantly clear, like how Eckhart is a reflection of all of you. And we'll talk more about this, but the hand like the tap room is so handsome. The menu is so thoughtfully curated, the wine list and other options are so thoughtfully curated curated. And first and foremost, the beer is very thoughtfully curated. So tell us more about your children here. Um, tell us about life before beer. Again, if there was other jobs you might have had, how you turned this passion to a profession and found yourself ultimately as head brewer at Eckhart.

SPEAKER_02 21:51

Yeah, for sure. Um, so I'm from the East Coast originally from Connecticut. Um, so I went to Yukon uh and in my junior year. I was fortunate enough to study abroad in Ireland. And that's actually where I met my now wife. But I'd say that's kind of where my love of beer started was just traveling around Europe, tasting different beers that I'd never really tried before at that age. So that's what really piqued my interest into beer. So coming back from Ireland, graduated college and uh stayed with uh my partner, and she was uh going to school in Boston, so we moved up to Boston together. Uh, and I started working for Harpoon uh brewery in their chap room. Uh so I was doing tours and bartending, they called it beer, being a beer captain back in the day.

SPEAKER_05 22:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:38

Uh I did that for a bit, and that really kind of just elevated that uh bug for me to just want to really focus on beer full time. Nice. Um, and then yeah, my wife was fortunate enough to get a job opportunity in Sydney, Australia, uh, while we were in Boston, and we packed up and cruised on over. Um, and so my mission was to get a brewing job once we got over there and uh luckily achieved that. I got to kind of get in on the ground up. I was the first production uh employee hired at this brewery called the Grifter. Um, shout out to them, Glenn Faith, Matt, and Trent, Legends. Um yeah, I got to, that's really where I got to cut my teeth. I started as a main kind of seller person and made my way all up to lead brewer and seller manager once I was done there. So really had an awesome opportunity and learned so much while I was there. Um, and then kind of common theme, my my wife's a bit of a weapon. She was she got another job uh in Amsterdam. So after four years in Australia, we moved over to Europe and uh uh settled down in Amsterdam and I started brewing there as well. Um I was lucky enough uh before I started my brewing job there, I had about two months of downtime. Uh and I was kind of with her blessing, I was like, listen, I've always wanted to kind of do this almost like stodge idea of learning and going to learn from different breweries in Europe. So I headed up to Munich and learned a lot more about lager brewing. Um, and then I was lucky enough to head to Belgium as well and learn more about Lambic brewing too. So I spent kind of two months doing both of those things, which I felt incredibly lucky and gracious to do. So that was a really fun opportunity. Um, and then yeah, spent another uh four years in Amsterdam brewing for a couple different uh breweries there. Um, and then found this opportunity. And we still have a bunch of family on the East Coast. It felt like the right timing. This concept sounded amazing, as Justin said. Super talented group of people. I was super stoked to work with and just felt like the right time to head back over here.

SPEAKER_01 24:48

So no accidents. Um, all meant to be. Once again, a lot in common. I'm noticing a similar theme. My wife's job has also led us crisscrossing across the country. So it seems to be the way. Um, Justin, you mentioned you have a daughter. I just celebrated my daughter's first birthday. Um, and Adam, I think it's even more interesting that a lot of your roots are in um just brewing roots, professional brewing in Australia, because that means between Australia and New Zealand, you must know your new world hops very well. So the fact that you're really exploring and investing in what would be considered, I guess, old world hops, continental hops, you know, is just fascinating. That's just absolutely fascinating. Um okay.

Meister Eckhart

SPEAKER_01 25:30

It is good to know all of you, and I feel like I know you already. I feel like we've somehow met before, but now that we're friends and now that we're up to present day, um, I want to talk about the brewery itself. Your personalities, your past experiences clearly influence everything. Eckhart, um, we know you specialize in European-style lagers. I think you were named for Meister Eckhart. Uh that's correct. German uh priest, theologian, philosopher, mystic. Uh, I want to know what's in a name. I want to know a little bit more about that. And then your beer has been available basically since the end of last year, starting to circulate around New York City bars, around New York State festivals. But you've been open to the public as of this year since basically September 2025. So again, nothing happens overnight, uh, even though it might look like it, nothing is effortless, even though you're making it look easy right now. You're doing everything everyone is not supposed to do, which is open up a new brewery in 2025. So more power to you. Um, but tell me a little bit. So, first and foremost, what's in a name? Who's Meister Eckhart and how did he expire how did he uh inspire Eckhart Beer Company?

SPEAKER_03 26:41

Uh yeah, yeah. I mean, you did a good job explaining, you know, his who he was um and his philosophy. Um, I mean, uh my uh like many things in this business, you know, we I spent a lot of time grinding with a branding agency, trying to think about names, doing, you know, all these sort of word association exercise type things. Um, I had been reading a lot of philosophy, sort of started over COVID, also, you know, just my point in life, thinking about what life means. Um, and Meister Eckhart had been mentioned a lot by a lot of the people I was reading. Uh and yeah, it's it's just at some point, like a lot of these things do, like just came out of nowhere. Um, no, that's Eckhart is the name of of this business. Um and what is sort of behind it is his philosophy, along with a lot of the other sort of philosophy that I was reading, um, is about it's about being in the present. It's uh it's all about just like being as still, quieting your mind, being fully present in the moment um as much as possible, and and just allowing that to be enough. Um and that's something that does not most people it's almost impossible for people to do that these days. Um and what I wanted to do was try and create a place where people could be more present. Um, that has a lot to do with how we've designed the tap room and how we want people to experience the tap room is sort of feel like they can slow down a little bit. Um, it definitely informs how we um make our beer, which is that it is a very slow, deliberate process. We make a very narrow, compared to a lot of craft breweries, a narrow range of beers. And the idea is we make them over and over and over again, and we're just trying to perfect and repeat um and refine. And this beer takes a lot of it's it's not flashy, it's very humble in certain ways, but it takes a lot of attention to really make correctly. Um, and what I wanted to do is sort of in a selfish way with this business, is just use that as an use it, have it be an exercise for me in just focusing on the little details every step of the way. So that's the idea of naming Eckhart, naming the business Eckhart reminds me of that every single day. That that's my job. Um, and if I'm gonna do my job like to my utmost potential, that's what I have to do first. Um so yeah, that's that's sort of the philosophy behind it.

SPEAKER_01 29:37

Very well said that there is that there is even a philosophy uh behind it. Uh you're giving me chills, my friend. I um a lot of the time, just with the number of breweries that have opened over the last decade, plus people will say, you know what, we just had we just had to find an aim that was still available and seemingly original. Um, that there is an intention intention and focus behind yours, um, I guess I would agree, you know, like that there we constantly kind of maybe regret the past and want and long for the future and forget or get lost in the present moment. And sitting and having a beer kind of stills and stabilizes uh just mind, body, spirit, whatever you want to call it for me all at once. And if that's the goal of throwing open the doors to your brewery and your tap room, um, again, as a gathering place, uh as a community, or for just for someone who wants to take a moment and sit in the present and savor, um, that is a very worthy cause. So very, very inspiring. Um so if that's behind the name, uh, the vision, the mission, um I do want to talk about not just what makes Eckhart different, but I mean, a huge part of the answer to that question is that you are opening a brewery in 2025, um, a new brewery, a loger-centric, almost across the board all lager brewery. Like I said, you're

Playbook 2025

SPEAKER_01 31:00

doing everything that everyone is being told not to do now. And I think it would really help our listeners to just kind of know what is the playbook? Like, how are you doing this? Um, you know, I'm guessing you can't necessarily just walk into a bank now with a business plan saying, I want to open a brewery because it sounds fun, it sounds cool, you know, because the numbers aren't really there nationally to back it up at the moment. Give us just some insight. How do you do this? How do you open a new brewery in this year in New York City? Uh what got you here? What is that story behind Eckhart?

SPEAKER_03 31:35

Uh, I mean, that story isn't particularly if you're talking about sort of financing and stuff like that, that's not a particularly interesting story. I have, I mean, I have my own resources. This is funded by myself. Uh and, you know, my intent here is that um, you know, I sure a lot of people going purely by the numbers probably wouldn't do it the way I have done it. I think there's a lot of decisions I've made that hopefully will have returns in a tangible way, you know, creating a tap room that is a little more welcoming than some sort of very bare bones breweries. I think the hope is that that will um make us more of a destination. And once people are here, encourage them to stay a little bit longer. Um, doing sort of having a full menu and a full kitchen, um, same thing. Yeah. Um, set us apart. I mean, the idea is, you know, I think the idea, well, some one of the things we're sort of fighting against a little bit is the is people's vision of what brewery means. Um, they have a very specific vision of the craft type of craft brewery that proliferated over the last 10 years. Yeah. That was fairly cookie-cutter kind of operation, and that was enough for a long time. You could all you had to do was do that, and people were excited about it, you know, especially especially you know, in your local area, and you could do pretty well, and you would have you would you could grow and and and get pretty big. It's not like that now. I mean, I think the fact that the market is contracting a little bit, I am hoping, is a is sort of an advantage for us that we can stick it out, that we are different, that we we are, you know, we do table service uh in the entire tap room. So you don't have to go get up and stand up and wait four deep at the bar for a beer, someone will bring one to you, you know. Streamlining that process um and having a full menu um so that you don't feel like you need to get up and go somewhere to get something to eat after you know two and a half beers. You'll stay for another one because we have food.

SPEAKER_05 33:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:56

Um, so yeah, I mean, the the question is one of the one of the examples I use is there's a um uh very successful Michelin start chef in New York and globally, who his flagship restaurant, um, he always sort of, and I I'm not trying to do this exactly, but his his feeling was like the flagship restaurant just needed to sort of operate at break even or a little bit better because he just needed to like demonstrate what he was capable of and then he could do other um, you know, he could he could turn that into other opportunities. I think this tap room can actually do very well financially. Um but it there is a certain degree of let's devote more resources, maybe than you absolutely would have to, to make it more of a standout um and to sort of demonstrate what we can do and and create like uh an impression for people of what this brand is.

SPEAKER_01 35:00

So again, well said. I agree, you know, the craft brewer industry, uh maybe it's in a contraction, maybe it's in ultimately a correction for the better, but uh giving thought to your brand, uh giving thought to your tap room and the experience there, giving thought to the menu. Um, I mean, these are all like these are all profoundly different than kind of as you say, is maybe what was expected of our craft brewery over the last decade. Um, I saw you have horizontal serving tanks over the bar, I believe, and you're pulling directly from there for customers. Everything is in a Willie Becker, a two-benger mug or a stanch glass. Served by 0.3 or 0.5 of a liter. I think that's roughly 10 to 17 ounces, maybe, give or take. Um it's labeled as filter or unfiltered on your menu. Um, you do all the traditional check pours, including the Maliko pour. I think when you do those, you have to send a royalty check to Jake at Human Robot, but he seems pretty forgiving about it. Um and everything from a lucre faucet. So um that this is becoming not only just kind of the norm and the standard and the expectation, but that it's still like new and exciting and different within the craft beer space for now is uh it is a welcome, a welcome, call it what you will, a correction, a contraction. Um hearing as well, just from

Vision and Mission

SPEAKER_01 36:20

you, Justin, from you, Adam, uh, just tell us a little bit about kind of how you approach Eckhart, the vision and mission behind it, and what, in addition to all that's been said, might kind of make it unique and distinct and stand out in the current market and your home in New York City for that matter.

SPEAKER_04 36:39

Yeah, absolutely. Uh if I jump in. Yeah, I mean, for me, and to kind of piggyback on what you just asked Nick and he spoke to, um, a big thing about what we do is the intentionality of it. Um, and you know, right now it's every day I get emails from this or that association that's talking about recommendations for like what do you need to do to grow your taproot business? And I see a lot of talk around doing things strictly from a financial gains perspective, that like we went into this being like, we want to do it this way because this is what we care about. We care about hospitality, we care about the sourcing of our ingredients and the quality of the work that we do from top to bottom. Um and you know, I think there's I think there's a big difference in the kind of genuinity of that. Um the genuineness, if that's the word.

SPEAKER_00 37:39

Yeah, I'll take it.

SPEAKER_04 37:40

Um I don't know if I got away from your original question, but um.

SPEAKER_01 37:48

No, I think again, the the focus, the intention behind what you're doing um is clear. And then how you're doing it, I think is really inspirational. And again, you know, like you said, Nick, whether that's from like private funds or I um or dealing with an investor or many like micropersonal investors, like whatever got to you to this moment now, I think anyone in the position to open their doors and open up open a new brewery and release new beer onto the market has to be very focused, uh thoughtful, and considerate about how they do it, because there's no margin for error anymore. Um for you, Adam, also just kind of doing the doing the brewing, you know, brewing the beer for a new brewery open this year, um, a little bit more about just the vision, the invention, uh, the intention behind it, as we've been saying. Just what do you think really it's actually kind of remarkable to me that New York City um didn't really have a devoted lager brewery up until now. So I don't know if that was also just part of the focus from the start or if it evolved over time. Tell us.

SPEAKER_02 38:51

Yeah, I mean, mainly just on ethos again and kind of the name of this brewery, like we're super fortunate to have the time and give these beers the time that we think they need, which is super important and a lot of times not possible in the craft beer industry. So I think that's the biggest thing. Like, I like to drive home working here. What I feel so lucky to be doing here is just, you know, we have really long fermentation and conditioning times, you know. Like conditioning is really important for me in this process. Like lagering is a huge part of lager beer, but I think conditioning actually plays a huge role here. And we're we're conditioning our beers for three to four weeks before we even start stepping down because I think the yeast is still in operation and still wants to change the profile of the beer. Um, and I that's probably what I like to drive home most with our beers, to Justin's point as well, being able to use whole leaf hop and getting to source Weyerman molt and ingredients in general. Um, like we're just really hyper-focused on that. Um, but I would really truly say time, you know, time is everything on these beers. And uh we're fortunate to have that time. And it's really fun to just see, you know, a 14-day fermented beer that then gets conditioned for three weeks totally just flip on itself. Like you just see these expressions change day to day, and it's just really fun to watch that happen.

SPEAKER_04 40:15

Yeah. We've also we've uh I we didn't come up with it, but in the wine world, low intervention, you know, gets talked about a lot. Um, and we like to kind of think that what we do here is like low intervention brewing. Um which to Adam's point, it's you know, having worked in regional production breweries, etc., where it's like you have to turn that IPA around as fast as humanly possible and use every trick in the book um to do it. And it's just we're we're not doing that. We're brewing with real ingredients, we're not using additives, clarifying agents, we're really kind of being as traditional as we possibly can. And yeah, I think you can you can taste it in the beer, um, and it's a pleasure to work this way. We're also also super fortunate with the entire design process we went through and the amount of custom design that went into our brew house and facility um that allowed us to build a kit in a place that was meant to brew lager um and do it efficiently um and consistently.

SPEAKER_01 41:16

Yeah. Time is the most valuable resource, you know, kind of since we've been talking about living in the moment versus looking to the past or looking toward the future.

Lagering vs Conditioning

SPEAKER_01 41:25

Um, Adam, for anyone who's listening that might not know the difference, can you just speak to the distinction between lagering and conditioning and maybe also tell us a little bit about the size and scale you're working on, uh the equipment you're brewing with uh since Justin just mentioned it?

SPEAKER_02 41:40

Yeah, for sure. Um so yeah, once we kind of finish that first primary fermentation, we'll uh spun, which is yeah, kind of capping the tank and let it start to naturally carbonate itself while it's still fermenting in secondary. Um, and then we'll start heading into that conditioning phase. So we'll slowly start stepping that beer down to about 41 degrees where it'll just kind of rest at that temperature for a, yeah, usually about three or four weeks there. Um it's low enough that you start flocculating your yeast out, but also some yeast still stays in suspension and and still changes that beer. Um, and that's the kind of phase that I really enjoy the most. And then lagering is really when you truly crash that beer down, you want to get all of that yeast out of suspension, and that's that true, you know, moment of clarification and getting that beer super bright. Um, I see fully carbonated as well.

unknown 42:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:35

Yeah, yeah. Excellent. I think it's easy to kind of get the two flipped. Uh I'm gonna remember that forever that lagering is the true point of clarity.

SPEAKER_02 42:43

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 42:44

Yeah. And a little bit about the size and scale you're brewing on.

SPEAKER_02 42:47

Yeah, so we have a uh three vessel 10-barrel brew house uh from Crew um out of Canada, which was built and fit out um, yeah, really truly for lager brewing. Um, so the ease of decoction um and the use of whole leaf hops and things of that nature, like it makes it so easy and user-friendly. A lot of it is automated as well. Um, we work off of a super sac, uh, which makes it super helpful for milling in and grain handling as well. Super good on the back and uh just your overall body in general. Um, but also also allows us to focus on all right, we want to use this one type of main pilsner base malt. We're gonna stick with that. Um and then we're kind of operating, we have four 30 barrel uh uni tanks, uh six 20 barrel unitanks, and two 10 barrel uh unitanks, and three 30 barrel rape tanks.

SPEAKER_01 43:45

Oh nice.

SPEAKER_02 43:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:47

10 barrel kit.

SPEAKER_02 43:48

10 barrel kit, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:49

Exactly.

SPEAKER_04 43:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:51

Yeah. Um, you know, I'll say, like thinking back on six point and the original facility and Red Hook, you know, those brewers did not have rakes in their mash. Ton, um, what was still being produced there was all done by hand. And we already gave a shout out to Danny, but God, Heather, and just everyone else who was there. That was uh hard labor and hard work.

SPEAKER_04 44:15

So, you know, Andrew there when you were at six point?

SPEAKER_01 44:19

Andrew, I think that was a little before my time.

SPEAKER_04 44:21

Beforehand, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:22

Yeah. Um, but all like truly done by hand. And that's not to say, you know, what you're doing as well is clearly like small batch crafted logger production. Um, but you know, efficiency, I mean, using like whole leaf, whole cone hops, not efficient. I mean loggers in general, like is it not efficient, you know, um, compared to like the former model of like turning on an IPA as quickly as quickly as possible. But when you take the time to invest in this, I want to believe, and I think you're right, that the difference, uh, the difference is noticeable and it and it's valuable.

SPEAKER_03 44:55

Um can you take it too? We'll we'll find out whether whether it's true or not.

SPEAKER_01 45:02

Yeah, well, it's your money on the line, Nick. Uh so we'll see. But uh know that I'm here to support you and know that everyone listening to this episode is here to support you.

SPEAKER_04 45:11

Um there's no one thing that it's this attention to all the little facts. Yeah, yeah, it's amazing to use holy hops, it's amazing to be able to work a kid that decocks so efficiently and accurately. Yeah. But it's like there's there's a a hundred little things um that when you pay attention to all of them, it makes a difference.

SPEAKER_01 45:34

Yeah, yeah. Um so I guess uh speaking of speaking

To distro or not to distro

SPEAKER_01 45:40

of money and dividends and whatnot, just uh you're do you have any intention of like signing with a wholesaler or uh distributing, or is it all DTC at this point uh through halftime? It's halftime beer and beverage, right? So they operate a couple storefronts throughout New York, but they do ship directly to consumer. And they were early to the game to do that. But outside of halftime, does anyone who wants your beer have to come to you to experience it?

SPEAKER_03 46:06

Well, we distribute in we we self-distribute right now. So basically anywhere we can get our van to, um, we will distribute to, and we're uh we definitely I will we were just talking about this. Like I was I was overly cautious about distribution early in the early days, and in retrospect, I think I would have been more just tried to get package beer more places to get people more aware of us before we opened. Interesting. Um so right now we distribute sort of the farthest we distribute is Westchester. Um Halftime uh buys from us when they want to buy from us, so that's you know, that's sort of we're at their mercy in terms of getting it out to the rest anywhere that they ship. Um so anyone who's out there who wants our beer that's not in New York State, go call halftime and complain. Um to say good things. Yeah, yeah. They're they're great, like they do uh they do an awesome job. Um, it's you know, they're they've got their own considerations that they have to deal with.

SPEAKER_01 47:12

So after we wrap this episode, I'll just give them a call and say, hey, do you have Eckhart beer on hand? Well, you gotta order one of the 24 beers of cheer.

SPEAKER_04 47:21

No, that's right. We just we just did an half time in the New York State Um Brewers Association put together kind of like a beer advent a bad advent box of view.

SPEAKER_01 47:29

So yeah, it's so much fun. Um so you're self-distributed around the city.

SPEAKER_03 47:35

We are the intention is to be as much taproom as possible. Um I think that's another thing people have been saying for the last couple of years is you know, distro is a real grind. And um, if you think you're gonna make a big pile by doing it that way, you know, you're in for a rude rude awakening. Um, that's again why I sort of invested the resources I did in the tap room is look, we want to sell as much beer out the door or you know, on on our own premises as possible. Um I of course want to get it to other places um and spread it, you know, more far and wide. Uh and we are just right now focusing on tap room primarily and local distro.

SPEAKER_01 48:20

Yeah. Um and Justin, is that you pulling up in the van when uh when you are distributing locally?

SPEAKER_04 48:26

Um it used to be. Uh we have another brewer that's actually out in the van today, uh doing deliveries. Um Kevin, great guy.

SPEAKER_00 48:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 48:36

But yeah, since the beginning, it's been me hitting the road to land accounts and uh did all the deliveries uh up until recently. Um and yeah, now we're we're we're refocused and kind of uh growing the distribution. Uh again, we kind of took a bit of a pause on on account landing during uh kind of end of Q2, Q3 as we geared up for opening the tap room. But um yeah, Adam and I are out there doing sales. Adam's joining me now. He's quite the salesman.

SPEAKER_01 49:12

Oh I bet. Adam, you've got the hair for it. Um you've got the name for it. Uh, we're all in sales in some form at the end of the day. But what a full service operation to know that uh and you know what? That might also be when you think about your beer out in the world, um, you know, obviously lager, I think uh it's not uh it's not as prone to oxidizing as IPA, right? You know, it has more shelf stability, uh, more of a shelf life, you know. But it is scary to think about this thing that you've put so much time, time, and labor into. You're not really control in control of that experience if you're with a distributor once it leaves the tap room, you know. Something that has been really refreshing on No Life to Lagras for any doom and gloom around the beer industry, everyone who is doubling down and investing and reinvesting in their tap room experience and their tap room as a destination seems to be doing just fine. Um, so I think there is a bright future ahead from Eckhart.

Back in Bushwick

SPEAKER_01 50:10

Uh tell me a little bit about your neighborhood. Uh, tell me if Bushwick, take me back to Bushwick, and is it still Bushwick? Um, I know you're at 545 Johnson Avenue, you're near the Jefferson L stop. I think you're a block away from elsewhere, great venue where I saw a lot of shows. Uh, your neighbors with, of course, our friends at Kings County Brewers Collective. And you're close to Roberta's, where I got married. So a lot of love for Bushwick. Uh, tell us a little bit about how the local community um has embraced you. And do you find that people are taking the? So when I first moved to New York, Bushwick, it just seemed like the Far East and kind of forbidding, you know, and I started riding the L train a little bit further and a little bit further and a little bit further. And that's how I ended up getting married at Roberta's. It became one of my favorite neighborhoods and one of the most vibrant neighborhoods in New York City. So is Bushwick still Bushwick? Tell us if the local community has embraced you and tell us if people are getting on the L train to come visit since you opened.

SPEAKER_03 51:11

Yeah, we're working on that. Um, I think that a tricky balance is the that we're trying to navigate is being a destination, you know. One of the things I that's really great about our location is how close it is to that L stop. And the L is like used to be a joke train, but like now is it's super easy to get here from Manhattan. It's a 20-minute, you know, from Union Square, it's 20 minutes on the L. Yeah. So there's a there's a certain degree of trying to get convinced, you know, the Manhattanites to come out here and check it out. Um, but like we're not gonna, you know, we're not gonna sustain unless we really engage with the local community. And this is, like you said, a really interesting, creative, like vibrant neighborhood. Uh, it's changing really fast the way like lots of neighborhoods are changing. Um, you know, there's there's certainly a gentrific, big gentrification push, and that can be good in some ways and can be bad in other ways. Sure. Um, we would love, yeah, we're really trying to um our big challenge right now, and what we're working hard to do is just like show people we're here and have them come give us a try. Um you know, we've been open for a little over eight weeks and we're still um, you know, people walk by and look in the window and they're like, what is that? I don't, you know, so we're just trying to um basically communicate with the neighborhood, be welcoming. Um whoever takes a chance on us, just give them a good experience. Um so yeah, I mean, I'm hopeful we're making connections with, you know, we we've been talking with the local other local businesses that have been have been here for a long time. Um we're in touch with Roberta's. We'd love to do some kind of you know collaboration with them or elsewhere or just just be engaged with uh those places that have already have roots in the community.

SPEAKER_01 53:13

Yeah. Uh Roberta's was probably my single biggest win and single biggest account at six point um while I was there. So yeah, if you're listening, Roberta's, uh I think that'd be a very fitting collaboration beer. Robert's likes Pilsner. They definitely, I mean, it's great pizza beer, but they definitely like the lighter side of beers. So I can see that. Um I think you are giving people a reason to come out. It's uh I more than hope, I have true belief. So um

5 core lagers : 1 rotating IPA

SPEAKER_01 53:40

I think you have core beers at any given moment on the board, basically spanning German and Czech style lagers, right? You'll have a Hellas, a German-style pills, Czech style pale lager, Czech Amber, Czech Dark. All these beers are five, what, five and a half, five point four percent and under, right? So the point is that people can come out on the L train or however they get to you and definitely have more than one. Um, you do have an IPA on the board. Uh, one IPA, I love it. Similar thing at notch, you know, one or two for whoever wants it, and the expression of the best if we're gonna make this right. So my understanding is it's kind of it's like a rotating IPA, can be West Coast style, can be hazy, the hops will change. It also clocks in around five and a half plus percent, give or take. So still drinkable. And then I don't know if these are rotational, but you mentioned the fest beer, you mentioned the Merzen, uh, I saw there's a Kolsch, and of course Adam is drinking the alt beer. Um, still, you know, these all hover just over or under six percent. So I'm guessing again, like the point is like you want people to come and drink and stay, and that's part of why you're delivering like this style beer at this level ABV. But tell us just a little bit about what they're gonna see on the board as far as beers go whenever they arrive. Core versus rotational. Um, and then after that, I want to talk, of course, more about the tap room experience, just because your tap room is so handsome. All my first impressions are a lot of thought has gone into the space. And then we've got to talk about your menu uh given your culinary background, Nick. Um, but yeah, tell us what's waiting for people when they walk through the door on the beer board.

SPEAKER_03 55:22

Uh sure thing. Yeah, I'll tell I'll just give a the sort of general rundown, you guys can go into like more detail. Um, yeah, we I always the plan was again keep it narrow. Uh I think people are they think they want a choice of 50 different beers, and then when they're actually put in that position, a lot of people just shut down. They don't know what to do with that. I think giving people fewer choices as long as they're more well thought out is the way to go. So yeah, five core beers. Um Hells had to start with Hellas. It's it's a like just a fundamental beer style that you know lager, you couldn't not do a Hellas if you're you know being a lager brewery. Uh German style pills, um you know, for me, pills is about bitterness, it's about that really snappy, um, like good mullet character, but still like almost painful bitterness. And like I'm a German-style pills guy, and I'm just like, I just love that bitterness.

SPEAKER_01 56:29

And that is that is the primary distinction, would you say, just between Hellas and Pills nerve for anyone listening? It's in that firm, bitter expression.

SPEAKER_03 56:38

Yeah, and a leaner hop character, like the the the the Hellas has a little bit fuller, rounder, and like maybe a little more touch of sweetness, and the and the it's dialed back, the malt is dialed back in a in a pills, and then you're still getting hop aroma in the pills, but like yeah, that bitterness is just is that just there. Um and then three Czech styles. Um, you know, I I took a little research trip to Munich and Prague, and my main takeaway from that is like these the Czech style beers are just more like vibrant and like they don't they don't adhere sort of as narrowly to like specific style guidelines, they're very expressive of whatever they want to be expressive of, you know, ingredient-wise. Um and so we you know, we have three shades of Czech beer that we all want to really express, primarily malt, but like then they also have are you know very uh hot forward um to varying degrees, and then like more fermentation character, like a little bit, you know, we we treat the fermentation a little bit differently, and you get some yeast character out of them to just like liven up a little bit. Yeah, and then as far as like our our uh seasonal beers, we some of it is just what do we feel like doing, some you know, um what is the style we love, what seems appropriate to the season. It has to fit into our our sort of model. Um but you know, like the grapefruit rattler was a good example of we just it was sort of midsummer and a few of us had run into people who were like talking about grapefruit lot rather, and we're like, let's give it a try. You know, how would we do it? And so um we you know, Adam came up with a recipe, you know, sort of all collaborated on how we wanted it to drink, and we have a sort of a profile that we tend to like, which is lower look, you know, lower sweetness, more crisp, more drinkable. Um and uh yeah, so and then our IPA, you know, was again another thing. I I really like Alchemist, so I was there's sort of a a little bit of trying to go for that flavor, like that original Vermont IPA character that you get, like nice sort of dank hop character, as well as some fruitiness, but like good bitterness. Um and yeah, so those, I mean, those are and then yeah, you know, fest beer and Martin because it's seasonally appropriate. Um we have a Baltic porter coming up, which will be our strongest beer um that we've made so far.

SPEAKER_01 59:27

Amazing. Uh uh Baltic porter with uh brewed with lager yeast. Yeah, nice.

SPEAKER_03 59:33

It's full fully it's a full lager, it's just a strong, strong, dark, portery lager. Yeah. Um that's incredible. Yeah, that's the general guidelines, and then yeah, it's it's about it.

SPEAKER_04 59:47

We also have uh, I mean, just doesn't air for a few days, so why not? We can just say it now.

SPEAKER_00 59:53

Yeah, oh you've got time, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 59:54

We'll have a fun beer up on the menu at the end of December that was a collaboration we brewed uh with Other Half and the Chico's and Sons, which is a family-owned and operated, really uh lovely kind of high-end grocery in Westchester. Um that has it's amazing. They have they have full-on bars at all the groceries and have really fantastic beer programs. Um, and it's just a lovely place to hang out. Um, so there will be an Italian red logger coming out in December that we brewed the three companies together. Um, so that's something fun to look forward to.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:32

Yeah. Um you know, it's so funny. It's just thinking about beers um or breweries like other half, uh like The Alchemist. Like, you know, I you used to have to like wait in line for other half, or you'd have to drive, of course, to Vermont to The Alchemist. And now I can find those beers, those breweries, some of their band, uh some of their brands within walking distance of where I happen to live in Sausolito at the moment. So my have the times changed. But an Italian red lager sounds like a really fun collaboration. Um, all these beers, maybe with the exception of the Baltic Porter, of course, small beers, big character. Small beers, but full flavor, flavor forward. Um they have a character, they have quality, they have spirit.

All My Children

SPEAKER_01 1:01:15

Um tell us a little bit more about, well, first and foremost, I guess just Adam, again, since they're all your children, just kind of how you want people to be greeted and welcome at the tap room. I am kind of curious, is IPA still king? Do you sell as much IPA as anything else at any given moment? Or are you all really leading with Lager? And that's what people who have visited so far are coming to drink. Um, just what's waiting for them on the board? What's their first experience and first impression when they walk into Eckhard?

SPEAKER_03 1:01:44

Last I checked, just on the sales front, check pale is the is the leader. Check pale by pills.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:52

Yeah, pills, pills and check pale kind of fight neck and neck. For a lager brewery, the P-Mix is yeah, we sell a decent amount of the IPA, which is great.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:03

Yeah, for sure. Um, yeah, and turn in terms of just kind of being greeted, I mean, appearance and foam is big for us, you know. Like yeah, we want people to walk through the door and get presented with a really stunning, whether it be brilliantly clear or not, beer with a really nice level you had a foam. Um, but I mean, to Nick's point and Justin's point as well, just service and just the actual atmosphere of the tap room is so important. Like even just being in Europe and going to brown bars in Amsterdam or bars in Italy or Spain, like there's we just want people to feel relaxed. They want we want them to feel at home. And uh obviously as soon as they walk through the door and go to that bar, we want to make sure that beer's got a nice solid three fingers ahead on it and is full of flavor, and there just puts a smile on their face, to be honest. So that's that's kind of the main goal.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:54

Yeah, well, you've put a smile on my face with your dark lager. Um let's talk

Taproom tour

SPEAKER_01 1:03:00

more about when they walk into the tap room, just because it is so thoughtfully designed. It is so handsome. What is the model for that? What's the inspiration behind the space itself? And uh as well as some I've started I see you've started to do some events. You have like uh you have DJs coming in, you're about to do, or maybe by the time the Sayers have done like a live reading series for surviving New York, which I love every decade or so. The question is, is New York alive or dead? And let's talk about it, you know? So tell us more about the tap room design, uh, what inspired it, and tell us more about the experience there and the events you've had so far to date.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:38

Yeah, the I mean, the intent was um to, I mean, I was I've been trying to, from the beginning, I've been trying to figure out what from the sort of European model um will translate and what might not. Um the example I always use is getting a if you get an espresso in an airport in Europe, it always comes in an actual ceramic mug. You're not gonna they would never dream of giving you an espresso in a in a paper cup, right? There's just that level of, yeah, it's just a little bit, just slow down, take like just do it right, you know? Um, and I I understand why, like I just understand the appeal of coffee to go, right? And convenience and speed. But again, like I was saying before, if the idea is we want I want people to come in and feel like they can just slow down for a second. Um so proper glassware, uh table service. Um, you know, we're we're really trying to like um like impress on our service staff, like, look, slow down, pay attention. Like you're not don't be thinking about the next table when you're talking to this table. You're talking to this table now. When you're done with talking to them, you can move on to the next thing, right? Pouring beers, a lot of training in pouring beers. Why are they why is it this one have so much foam? Is it what you know? Let's just come up with a system. Um, and our and we've been really lucky we have a service staff that's really engaged and wants to do better. Um, but it's not the typical that's been a challenge. It's you know, someone looking for a brewery, you know, tapster job is not necessarily thinking that's what's going to be asked of them. So um that's that's a lot of work, and it's especially in the early days, just constantly correcting and making and checking things. Um so yeah, and then the the design-wise, you know, I sort of wanted to do a little bit of a reference to like a Bavarian beer hall or a you know Central European kind of beer hall thing, but I don't didn't ever want to be a themey place. Um, we're not a German themed bar, we're very much American, but taking inspiration from these things. I also liked sort of Japanese style aesthetic, and that's pretty obvious in the sort of design. Design of things. So which is backfired a little bit. Sometimes people walk by and think we're like a sushi place. We're putting it in the windows. But that was the intent. And our designers did an awesome job. And then yeah, the other part was just dividing the space up into sort of smaller zones. I thought was a really cool idea. So we have a beer garden area in the front that's got big facade windows, it's double-height ceilings. Then we have a tavern area that's has lower ceilings, it's more cozy with booths and that type of seating. And then we have the main bar area with the serving tanks and uh windows into the brewery, and that's like, oh yeah, if you if you're thinking about like going into that brewery warehouse and you want to see a lot of stainless, like that's that's your place, you know. You can get that. Um and then um yeah, uh and then we have a mezzanine area too, um, which will you know we're we're definitely pushing as a separate event space. Um we're doing ratcheting up the tap room programming. You still gotta, it's New York, you gotta fight for people's attention. Sure. Um, you gotta be giving them a reason to come in every night. Um, and you know, luckily there's a lot of really ambitious people out there who want to do events, and you know, like this reading group that's coming in has a huge following, and they just looking for a space, and we want to be that space. So good stuff.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:26

Yeah, I was I was trying to put my finger on some of the un other influences. It's interesting you mentioned Japanese culture. Um, but it is a really handsome space. Uh, very warm, very inviting, very welcoming, very modern. You know, these it's not that you are in kind of like an abandoned industrial space hoping people will find uh their way there. You are clearly thinking about creating a destination and you want them to walk through the door and know where they're going upon

A Cook's Tour

SPEAKER_01 1:07:55

arrival. So um the menu also speaks to like many different influences, many different cultures, firmly rooted uh in German and Czech food, but I see international recipes on there. Um, I see you're doing a full Sunday brunch. I haven't had a kalachi since I was growing up in Texas. That's really interesting. Your malt and marmite tart has already gotten several shout-outs on the interwebs. It's just a really interesting menu. And you also have a very curated wine list. And Justin, maybe that kind of speaks to your experience here in Northern California as well as all of your previous experiences. But um, you know, that looks like as if I was walking into like a natural wine shop or a store, you know, anywhere in Brooklyn, like it could hold its own. Um, you offer NYC shrubs, which is basically like a vinegar and fruit soda. I mean, that is distinctly New York, and you have cider options as well. So again, a full menu. Can you tell us a little bit about the chefs and the kitchen behind it?

SPEAKER_03 1:08:56

Yeah, so I, well, my background was in cooking, um, and I felt from the beginning that foods had to be an important part of it. Um, and you know, I think a lot of breweries would like to do food in a more serious way, but if they don't, it can be very intimidating if you've that that's not something you've ever sort of managed. Um, because being a chef, that wasn't intimidating to me. Like, you know, setting up a kitchen and running food, uh a food program didn't wasn't something like I felt like I had a good hand can keep a good handle on that. We have uh two great chefs, um, both very talented um and uh you know, good palates, um and good creative energy and our you know, they want to try sort of push the envelope of what brewery food is. I always wanted to do food that was again, I didn't want it to be German themed, but there are certain things you can't I mean, I can't deny the appeal of like a brat and a sauerkraut. Yeah. Um and we make make them in-house and they're fantastic, you know.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:08

Incredible.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:09

Um and I sort of wanted to give people things that were similar to what they wanted, like were used to with beer food, but just a little bit different. Um try to and and then also the the idea behind it is give them, you know, give them a reason to have another beer. We're here to sell beer. The food can be great and and on its own, but it also needs to support the beer. Um I've had a lot of food at breweries that as soon as I eat you know the food there, I'm done and I want to leave because I need to go take a nap. You know, so it's just what you know, how do you um and beer can be tricky to to serve food with because it's heavier than wine and you know carbonated and stuff like that. But um yeah, so we're constantly sort of coming up with new things we could do. I want the menu we have right now, I'm super happy with, and I want to sort of let more people experience it um and see what works and doesn't work. But um, you know, I mean I'm very happy with what we're putting out.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:19

Yeah, so there's also a lot of really cool, like Chef Fred, um great guy, like Will Chat, and he incorporates a lot of brewing ingredients in the menu, which I think is a unique thing to see. It's like there's all kinds of different food programs and breweries, um, from you know, food truck all the way up to trying to be kind of like the Michelin approach. Um, but it's really cool to be using yeast um as part of sauces, to be using beer for marinades, to be using malt to make crackers, you know, like we're playing with the dessert right now, um, to include more malt in and also cacao and coffee from local uh suppliers just right here on the block.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:02

So very, very creative. So the menu, this is kind of uh your idea, your recipes, your inspiration, Nick. And then you found a kitchen team that can really bring it to life. And again, I mean, it looks delicious. The presentation, very handsome, very compelling. I've never seen food quite like this at another brewery, but I have noticed some of the best breweries I've spoken to, and whether they were brewers or owners, they likewise um they're thinking like a chef. Um, they have a background in hospitality, they they're thinking about the experience, the culinary experience that people are going to have both eating and drinking when they come into their tap room. And uh it's that kind of mentality that seems to make modern-day tap rooms thrive. So to the to the design, to the menu, to of course the beer on the board, I mean all very compelling. Uh every reason to visit Eckhart.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:57

Um Credit where credit is due. They're not my they're not my recipes. They're uh I like we I sort of have a I want to let them do what they're what they're good at, um, which is you know execute and come up with the ideas. Uh I had a sort of guidelines of what I wanted to do, but this is very much Fred and Jared, um, they're you know, have creative free reign to do what they what they need to do.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:24

So uh well shout out I can't take credit for that. Yeah, shout out to Fred, shout out to Jared, and uh I cannot wait to taste the fruits of their labor someday.

The Robichaux Report

SPEAKER_01 1:13:35

Um I have one more question before we move on to the final kind of lightning round that I like to ask everyone. And um I I wasn't planning this, but I think it's particularly relevant just since you are a new brewery, since you are opening in 2025. And we've talked about before kind of the expectation now is clearly different um from what was expected from breweries over the last decade plus, right? Um did you read that article, the opinion piece in the New York Times recently? The wacky labels and silly names are killing craft beer. It's by Mark Raba, Rabba Chow, Rabba Shoa.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:13

I hear it on the same day saying, come out and check us out.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:20

It was funny to see what like a tizzy that caused. Um I saw a lot of responses online, just it's lazy and it's uninformed, it's dated, it's ill-timed. But I look at the, I mean, I look at the title alone and I'm like, well, you're not wrong. And I think my favorite line from it was that the beer aisle now looks like a merch stand at Comic-Con. You know, he's he's not wrong. Um I am wondering if we might need like a new word for craft beer, like to encompass like what you are doing now, what breweries who have opened, whether it was just pre-pandemic, during the pandemic, or are now practicing modern day, like, does craft still really capture what is happening now among small breweries? Um again, I just do you first and foremost, do you think of yourselves as a craft brewery? You're opening up the in the name of craft, you're opening up to move craft forward, or is it something else at this point? Because that article was basically saying craft is synonymous with uh with IPA, uh, with hazy, with pastry, and with boozy and with alcohol. And that's kind of the opposite of what almost what all every single brewery on this show to date is practicing current day. So, you know, is that part of craft? Is it just the current reality of beer? Or do we need some new word, some new expression for it? And do you have any idea what that would be?

SPEAKER_03 1:15:47

Well, I'll just start out topic, man. I'll start off by saying I don't ever want to put down what anyone else is doing. Um that like my feeling is very much like that's those things are not what I want to do. Um, and the reason I and and the reason I'm doing them A is because I what we're doing is because I like it and I'm committed to it, and it's my true expression of what I want to put out there. Um and so I don't on some level it doesn't matter to me what someone else is doing, like or whether they're successful or not. Um and we're you know very close to breweries that are are very much what that what he was describing that are doing very well. So I don't think of course that's what he's saying is not completely a hundred percent true in all respects. Um but I just felt and and all of us feel like there is a it's there's what we're doing is underserved and should be doing should be done more. So we're gonna be the people who do that. Um and you know, I I don't profess to be very knowledgeable in terms of marketing, so or the industry sort of beyond that, but they both have worked in it a long time, so maybe they can talk to that.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:11

Yeah, I mean it's part of what paved the way and I think allowed you to do once again what what no one else is supposed to do or is really doing this year, which is open up a brand new brewery and it's devoted to the loggers. Uh, Adam and Justin, I just I want to hear the the same from you. Do you think craft still kind of captures what you're doing? Do you think of yourselves first and foremost as a craft brewery? Is it all beer at this point? Or do we need some new words, some new idea, some new concept for this? I don't want to overcomplicate it or push it too far, but just your thoughts.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:46

Uh I mean, man, it's uh I don't want to be too divisive because I I can be with ease. Um but no, I do love that actually. Um and I'm gonna think very much about this conversation now of a new word, another word for some section of craft beer, uh, where it's like, yeah, at the end of the day, like I identify as a craft brewery or working in a craft brewery, I yes, wouldn't call Eckhart a craft brewery. Um, but you know, as the person who does sales and who has been in this a while and drinks a lot of beer, um you know, it's tough. Like, I even in this last week going out um to certain sales calls uh and speaking with managers that are like at places where I knew they used to have tons of craft beer and they've all gone back to macro. And they're like, listen, man, it's just between batch inconsistency, quality, and cost, this just has not made sense for us to put on our lines anymore. Yeah. And I, you know, I think we're we're kind of getting over the the wide-eyed honeymoon period of the extremeness that craft could be and the newness of all these things. When something's new, you're not overly critical, you're just excited that it's new and you want to see this new thing. I mean, I have traveled far and wide and shipped beer across the country to try new things.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:09

Um but you know, it's like what's kind of going back to what we do, it's like, what's the intentionality of like, why are you doing this? You know, it's like if you wanted to open a bakery, would you just open a bakery and call it a bakery and then buy all your bread from Whole Foods and put it in your shelves? And like, yeah, what are you doing at that point? Um, and I think that there's a wide range of approach of skill, access to resources, funding, all the various things that can make brewing beer really difficult, even when you have the best of intentions that you know a lot of people are are are facing, especially during this contraction period and getting forced to make tough decisions. So, long story short, yes, we're a craft brewery. Yes, we need another word for craft.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:03

Very, you know, very well said. I mean, careful as I speak about this and trying to think about my words, but it's it's a worthy question because, and Adam, I want you to have the last word on this. Um, before you do, though, it's also just worth mentioning like the beers people have been sending me, um, like you, um, you know, they're just they're they're world class and they are in a whole other class and category than macro logger. So the point of this show and no life to No Life to Logger is not to say A, B, and Bev was right all along. You know, for all the arguments we've made for adjunct loggers, for example, you know, the point is not just go back to your macro XYZ or A B, whatever the case may be. I still think a lot of that beer is both the biggest and the worst. Uh, everything I'm drinking now, thanks to you and everyone who's participated in the show, is in its own class. It's in its own category. It is the best of the best, and it deserves a word. I'm just not sure if craft captures that anymore. And it's really interesting to kind of hear the sales standpoint from Justin, what's happening in the market and in the field and the pushback for it, because it's almost starting to carry a negative connotation. So, you know, it might not be craft, but it is definitely not, you know, kind of it's definitely not the big macro producers. Like it needs its own kind of category. Adam, what do you think about this? As the one brewing the beer, tell us.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:30

I'm just happy to be brewing beer, man. Um, I yeah, I think it's definitely a fair question to ask. Um, I mean, I think I would lean on more of the side of, I agree, I think naming it just just to craft is maybe a bit tough. I mean, as we talked about, you know, like low intervention, like wine is, you know, people know orange wine as being low intervention wine versus, you know, bigger vineyards and things of that nature. Is that the right category as well? I don't necessarily think that's the right way to go either. I will say, in terms of craft captures a very large spectrum, and that's why I think it's done so well, that word. I mean, it's the craft of making something. So whether you're crafting a pastry stout with a bunch of lactose or you're crafting a lambic or you want to brew beer with the Burton chain cask focus, you know, it's just like if you're really truly focusing on that craft and you're doing it at an exceptionally high level, I think that is defined as craft, as craftsmanship, which I think is super cool. And that's what draws me to this profession in general. I love the idea of that. Yes. Um, so I do think craft does encompass that. However, I do agree, I think it's just the over, I think it's the idea of that a bunch of people decided that they wanted to brew beer and opened a lot of breweries, which is amazing. But I think at a certain point you just have so many people doing this all over the shop, and and it can only be so consistent across that many breweries, you know? Um but I yeah, I I don't think I have the right word for it. I think you're totally right. It could be in different segments where it's just like, hey, we brew lagers and this, and that's kind of focused there. Um but from craftsmanship, I think if you're focused, you're doing it at a high level, that's still a good way to, I guess, call it that.

unknown 1:23:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:28

To take a like uh analogy from the food industry from from the restaurant business, like remember when farm to table meant something, right? And and it was again, it's it was the early people that were doing it, most of them there was there was you could relate that to what they were doing, and then people started using farm to table to mean I mean just they would just call themselves that um and not be doing the things, right? So I guess the the challenge is right, like how do you differentiate what what you're doing? I mean, I think for me, um again, to go back to the presence be in the present moment thing, let's do what we're doing first and we'll figure out what to call it later, you know. Um like you know, we talked about this with naming beers. I didn't want to have names for beers. It often feels kind of forced. Um, if one of our beers sort of organically has a name because we start calling it a thing, then we can call it that, you know. Like I sort of feel like Edelstoff was is one of those things where like it was just their special beer, and then for whatever reason it got that name. But I don't want to try and force a name on something from the top down.

SPEAKER_01 1:24:54

Nice. Um, Nick, I think very well said, and I like the continued culinary analogy. Adam, very diplomatic. And you're right, you know, the idea of craft is meaningful, it's not the word itself. Um, but Justin, I think you did get to something with this idea of like low intervention wine. I mean, I don't see like low intervention beer ever necessarily like taking off or lighting a fire, you know, but it communicates something closer to what we're all trying to capture here and what we're talking about in this moment. So interesting conversation. We'll see if anyone else has any opinions about it.

Safety Glasses

SPEAKER_01 1:25:30

Um, I want to move on to a few last questions. These are for all of you, these are for any of you. It's something I like to ask everyone before we wrap up. Uh, first of all, non-alcoholic beer, just the rise in dialogue and volume around sobriety, around temperance. I know you serve industrial art, safety glasses, pills, and IPA as your non-alcoholic option. That name, I mean, here's to the chief. Um, that name carries a lot of weight, and I'd be really curious to try how they handle non-alcoholic beer. Just tell us some of your thoughts on this. Uh, was it an essential offering for the tap room? How do you feel in the rise of the non-alcoholic category, especially in light of opening a new brewery?

SPEAKER_03 1:26:12

Yeah, I mean, one of the best things about beer is the alcohol. Um, you know, of course we have to we have to offer it. Um, if there's someone who doesn't drink who wants to um, you know, join their friends, I want to make sure they have an option. Um, you know, personally, just from a like flavor standpoint, um I haven't had any that really do the job flavor-wise, even you know, taking the alcohol out of um out of like the the equation, like I haven't had any. But there's they don't do exactly what beer does flavor-wise, right? Um so it was tough for me to find one that I thought, you know, just because I'm not in that position, but absolutely think, you know, you need to have that option available. Um, so yeah, and industrial arts does a great job. There's a bunch of others that that were in contention too. They, you know, but they're local and we everything they do is really solid. Um, so you know, that was how we ended up going with them.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:22

Yeah, yeah. Um, you know, I agree that alcohol adds body and flavor and character, and it's not it's not an additive, you know, it's an essential and integral part of beer. Um, but I appreciate the option. I appreciate the alternative. Um, this kind of leads me to my next

Relapse lager

SPEAKER_01 1:27:40

question. Yeah, it's all actually in a related because I just heard that John Mullaney has its own, his own non-alcoholic. Uh, he partnered with Years Beer, and they released a pilsner in the pale ale in a Belgian, I think. Um, but celebrity loggers, we see a few out in the market right now. Uh, we can now count John Mulaney among them, and Charlie Sheen came up in the last episode. We talked about the Kelsey brothers. We talked about Hulk Hogan. Just tell us your thoughts on this culture. And if you were going to brew a celebrity lager, what does that mean to you? Who with and why?

SPEAKER_04 1:28:12

Oh boy. Well, you got first. Oh man. Chapel Rowan? I have a 10-year-old daughter, so um, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:29

Brewing a celebrity lager with your daughter in mine. I love the gesture. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:33

Uh that's a tough one. That is a tough one.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:36

Yeah. Um I love to crack a beer with Clint Eastwood. Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:45

Clint Eastwood, yeah. Anything else or anyone else?

SPEAKER_02 1:28:49

I feel like Vince Vaughn would sell the hell out of a beer.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:53

Oh. Well, Vince Vaughn, if you're listening, Eckhart is winning. And I you're right. I bet he would. I bet he would.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:59

I don't know. I'm just a fan, really. I'm a fan of Vince Vaughn. But uh it's a great question.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:09

Great question.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:10

Oh yeah. No, good stuff. There's no shortage of celebrities in New York, so something tells me you will have options down the road.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:16

Yeah. I'm gonna be true. I'm gonna be true to myself and say that I I really uh don't like the celebrity whatever culture. Um I you know it because what is I mean, I don't know, I would pick George Clooney, but what does George Clooney have to what does George Clooney say about how good our beer is, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:29:37

Well, he doesn't say much about how good tequila is, so yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:41

I didn't say that. I didn't say that. Um but that's yeah, for me, I like I guess it would it would have to be, and I can't think of the person right now, but it would have to be someone who communicates, you know, that that that level of quality, attention and quality, not just a big following.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:59

Agreed. I know we will see some button. Yeah, we will say uh Meister Eckhart is the um the star of this show and the celebrity behind all your loggers. Um

Decoction Team Yes

SPEAKER_01 1:30:10

decoction mashing, maybe first and foremost for Adam. Um I already know the answer is yes, but uh another kind of hot button topic in the beer industry in recent years. So I always like to put everyone on the spot and say yes or no in a single word, but maybe you can also tell me why in a single sentence. Um yes or no to decoction mashing, and if I know the answer is yes, uh, why is that from a historical standpoint, from a sensory standpoint? Uh why did you build a new brew house meant for decoction mashing?

SPEAKER_02 1:30:38

Yeah, nice. Um yeah, definitely on team, yes. Um, but uh also, I mean, I I understand that every brewery has their own setups and uh challenges and also uh benefits, but uh I think great beers and great lagers are being made on either end. I personally do just love decoction brewing. It's a super fun part of the brewing process, one, but I also think it adds an incredibly uh cool element to the beer as well. So I would definitely say I support it. Um I would say, yeah, I mean, especially when we're dealing with lower ABB beers, what we talked about earlier is low ABV but still full-bodied and very robust beers. And I think decoction plays a really huge role in creating those uh elements. Um whether that's Jack Pale at 4.2%, you know, that's a very light beer and it expresses incredibly full and very malt forward, and I think decoction plays a huge role in that. Um we don't mess around too much with multiple decoctions. We actually like playing around with the length of said decoction. Um, and that's actually been a really fun thing to see a five-minute decoction versus a 40-minute decoction and what that really does to that beer. Um, I would say, just honestly, just like whole leaf hops and what we said before, multiple things coming together all to make this beer, decoction just adds this other extra background profile that I truly just don't get in an undecocted beer like German, like our German Pilsner. Um I usually get it in the foam. There's just this really unique malt expression that also plays well with hops that comes off as malty, but it's rustic and and husk-like in a very positive way. I mean, we're exploding grain and we're boiling it. So, you know, a lot of other things are happening there. And I think that flavor really comes through the husk and um that profile of that molt really happens when you boil it. Um, so that's why I I really am pro-decoction.

SPEAKER_01 1:32:48

I'm so rustic, husk-like, but not tannic, and there aren't many other ways to achieve that. So it has been a resounding yes when I think back upon uh I guess 19 episodes to date. But there's the occasional no and the occasional maybe, and often depends. Um, anything else about decoction mashing from from you, Nick, or from you, Justin, before we wrap up?

SPEAKER_03 1:33:11

You know, I was ready to, if it didn't make a difference, to say we don't need to do it. Um, but you know, it makes tell us and we can see tell the difference. Yeah. Um, and yeah, the check pail is a is a perfect example of that. Like it's a nice long decoction. It's got very few other things to interfere with that, you know, in terms of specialty malt. It's a pretty just pure expression of malt. And it is I've I've always wanted a beer to taste as much like the brew house smells when you're brewing that beer. When you drink that beer, that's what it's you're getting, you're getting like hints of that, that super fresh grain quality that's in that finished beer. And it's that's amazing.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:00

Sold and truly one of my favorite smells on earth. So thank

Foam first, last beers

SPEAKER_01 1:34:05

you for sharing. And is there anything else you want to say to beer drinkers out there? Um, anything else you want to say to someone who's pondering their first beer at 21, considering their last beer at 101, deciding whether or not to get on the L train tonight. What do you want to leave our listeners with and say about Eckhart for the year ahead and hopefully many years ahead?

SPEAKER_03 1:34:30

Uh yeah. Come and leave some time to sit and enjoy it and just be here. Um, bring some friends. Uh it's I mean, you know, it's the the highlight of the experience for me of you know going to European beer halls is that it's a social activity and you're in it to be with the people you're with. And the beer what I love is they they don't get precious, they take their beer very seriously, but they don't get precious about it. These beers are not supposed to blow your mind unless that's what you want to get out of them, in which case, you know, I think we're doing a really good job um, you know, in in putting some unique beer out, but it's supposed to be a play a supporting role there. And you know, that goes to ABV too, like sit and for three hours and have however many beers that is, and you you can still walk home in a straight line, you know. Um feel okay the next morning, you know. So that's yeah, that's sort of my last word, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:40

Oh, absolutely. And same for you, Justin. Same for you, Adam. You know, whether uh new beer drinkers, current beer drinkers, seasoned beer drinkers, what do you want to say to our audience and leave them with?

SPEAKER_04 1:35:51

Well, I'll go so Adam can have the last word.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:57

Please drink beer. Again, straight to the point. I love it. Just do it.

SPEAKER_04 1:36:04

Um, I love wellness. I love health. Having a couple OEB loggers ain't gonna kill you, so come on over to Eckhart and do it. Uh if you're 101 and it's your last beer, get some utopia, man. Uh, you know, drink the biggest beer you possibly can. But uh otherwise, yeah. Young people, we're not your enemies.

SPEAKER_01 1:36:26

Yeah, not your enemy. Uh, what about you, Adam? What do you say?

SPEAKER_02 1:36:30

Um, yeah, I would just say, I mean, I love the ritual of drinking a beer, and I love the ritual of people coming together to enjoy that at the same time. So I would say I I I don't see that ever going away, and I I I hope it stays strong. Um love foam. When you get your beer, look at it for a second, take it in, think about how much work went into it, whoever brewed it, and uh just really appreciate it. Sniff it, get a little bit of foam first, and then take that first sip. That's that's my best advice.

SPEAKER_01 1:37:03

Love it. Sniff it,

Goodnight and Good Lager

SPEAKER_01 1:37:05

get a little bit of foam first. I love it. Um, it's so good to get to know the newest brewery in New York City. And thank you all, Nick, Adam, Justin, for taking a bet on Lager beer. And I hope and truly believe it's gonna pay dividends. So if you like what you're hearing, by all means, like, subscribe, follow No Life to Lager, help us hit the road and make a better kind of beer show. Help me get back home to New York City. And until we get to where we're going, I will say good night and good lager. Eckhart beer, thank you so very much. I'm all done, so I'm gonna have to get another and make a day of it. Cheers.

SPEAKER_03 1:37:46

Thank you. Cheers so much, man. No life too lager.