Ponder and Magnify: A Rosary Podcast

S3, E5 - The Wedding Feast at Cana Bible Study (John 2: 1-11)

• John and Jessica Helling • Season 3 • Episode 5

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The mission of the Ponder and Magnify Podcast is to seek an encounter with Jesus through praying the rosary, relying on the grace of the Holy Spirit and the intercession of Mary. Join us as we dive into the Second Luminous Mystery of the Rosary! In this episode, Jess, John, and Fr. Philipp discuss the Wedding Feast at Cana from John 2: 1-11. Praise be to God!

Jessica:

Hello and welcome to the Ponder and Magnify podcast, where our mission is to seek an encounter with Jesus through praying the rosary, relying on the grace of the Holy Spirit and the intercession of Mary. I am so happy that you are here. Welcome everybody. Week two, here we go. We are focused this week on the second luminous mystery, which is the wedding feast at Cana. I am joined again by Father Philip and John and we are excited to dive in here. Father Philip, would you mind opening us up in prayer?

Fr. Philipp:

Sure, In the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen, Mary, we return to you and as we enter into this mystery, we ask you who know our needs, all of our needs, all the needs of those who are listening as well, all the needs of those who are listening as well. We ask you to win for us the graces that we most need, the supports, the comforts, the consolations, the encouragements, the gifts and the desperate desires of our hearts that you know we need, that we are so often blind to. Be with us as we enter into this episode. Be with us as we continue through our day or night or whenever we're listening to this. Be with us now and stay with us. Be a mother for us, and we ask this in the name of your most beloved and holy son, our Lord Jesus Christ. Amen, In the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, Amen.

Jessica:

Thank you, father. All right, johnny, what's your word?

John:

It's vanilla, but I'm excited. I'm excited because—

Fr. Philipp:

Is your word word vanilla

Fr. Philipp:

or excited

John:

, I don't know

Fr. Philipp:

I thought you were saying vanilla

Jessica:

I was like where is this going?

John:

it. Uh, the word I've chosen is vanilla like, but it is. I'm simply excited. Um, I'm excited because this weekend is, uh, we, my, we are on a quest my family to go see every baseball stadium and we are crossing two more off the list, so we'll only have four more after this. So we're almost done, and it's just cherished time with my dad and my brother, and so it's something that comes around once a year and I'm just very, very excited, looking forward to it. So thank you, jess, for holding down the fort so I can go.

Jessica:

It's been 12. How many years has it been?

John:

We started in 2013 so yeah

Jessica:

12 years in the making still rolling

John:

still rolling.

John:

It's taking a minute. How about you?

Jessica:

my word, um is giddy, I'm. I'm giddy about diving into this mystery because I feel like there's so many or sorry, so few, the opposite, so few moments where, like Mary and Jesus, as adults, are interacting and speaking with one another, and so I am excited to really kind of contemplate and meditate on that more. Father Philipp, what about you?

Fr. Philipp:

My word. How I'm feeling right now is content. Yeah, no, it's a joy to be here with you guys and just be in the midst of this prayer and openness to be with Mary in this moment, so I'm content. I'm grateful. I've got a cup of coffee next to me, so I'm good.

Jessica:

Okay, father Philipp, could you go ahead and proclaim our scripture for the wedding feast at Cana

Fr. Philipp:

yeah, we're going to be reading from surprise surprise, John 2, 1-11, the reading of the wedding feast. So a reading from the Holy Gospel, according to John, on the third day there was a wedding in Cana, in Galilee, and the mother of Jesus was there. Jesus and his disciples were also invited to the wedding. When the wine ran short, the mother of Jesus said to him they have no wine. And Jesus said to her Woman how does your concern affect me? My hour has not yet come. His mother said to the servers Do whatever he tells you. Now there were six stone water jars there for Jewish ceremonial washings, each holding 20 to 30 gallons.

Fr. Philipp:

Jesus told them, fill the jars with water. So they filled them to the brim. Then he told them draw some out now and take it to the head waiter. And they took it. So they took it and when the head waiter tasted the water, that had become wine, without knowing where it came from, although the servers who had drawn the water knew. The head waiter called the bridegroom and said to him Everyone serves good wine first and then, when people have drunk freely, an inferior one. But you have kept the good wine until now. Jesus did this as the beginning of his signs in Cana, in Galilee, and so revealed his glory and his disciples began to believe in him

Jessica:

okay, after taking some time to pause and reflect, father Philipp, what stood out to you here?

Fr. Philipp:

uh, there's, there's a couple of things. Uh, I love the gospel of john, which is uh, uh, yeah, has been, has been, a space of grace for me for a while, um, but John is just so full of kind of half, half given clues, and so, like he can, he, he does things and then, like, if you're not paying attention, you miss, like, the whole connection to the other thing. So, uh, instead of vague, uh, vague generalities, uh, the two things that I was thinking, there's two things that I have. One of them is this these connections in John. So you have this, uh, john we start off with on the third day, and he's actually, he's actually counted seven days up to this point. And so you finally get to this point where you're at this wedding feast and it's this new, uh, this new day, it's like the, it's the Sabbath day, it's the, it's the fullness of time. And then you get to this wedding feast and then, in the middle of the wedding feast, in this beautiful miracle, he, he takes these stone jars and there's six of them, and you're like, well, we're for, for, for Jewish, like the Jewish mind, six is an imperfect number. So you're waiting for the seventh jar to show up and you're like, where is this jar? And you just kind of end the story and you're like, okay, whatever.

Fr. Philipp:

Well, a couple chapters later, you come across a woman who is married to five husbands, has a sixth husband again, and Jesus is sitting at a well and you have this completion of what happens here, which is that the Lord is claiming her and the whole reality and all of us, as there's the seventh jar that she leaves by the well, right, so this is John four, and then he is the seventh bridegroom, and so you really have this like kind of this, this clue that John's leaving here in the midst of this, this mystery, like that Jesus is the bridegroom who has come for our souls, and the this, this narrative. I just can't not think of John 4 when I read it. And so these mysteries and these ways that John plays around with the meanings that he has, and also that this is just the way that the Lord has worked in this mystery, is kind of a beautiful gift. And I can't help but think about this also in light of like.

Fr. Philipp:

We're sitting here in your house and you have these beautiful pictures of your wedding day that are on the wall that I'm facing, and so the the reality of, uh, just the two of you and your this moment in your life, where the lord and his mother are present, providing the things that you need, um and I.

Fr. Philipp:

I was just looking at, looking at these pictures, which no one else can see, but I can see um of jess and john uh dancing with, like the wedding guests behind them, them in the church, uh, them uh looks like immediately after uh they've they've actually uh made their wedding vows, like they're about to leave, leave the church.

Fr. Philipp:

Like all this stuff, the first dance with John and his mom, like these moments in your wedding and your marriage, and the ways that the Lord has, like actually brought you to this, like I've just those are the things that are popping in my mind right now and as we contemplate this mystery, like the way that the Lord has provided an abundance for you, just like he has for these, uh, for these two.

Fr. Philipp:

So I've that's those are the things that are kind of playing in my heart, like the, the, the way that the Lord has, has and desires deeply to come for me, um, as a bridegroom, which is weird, right, uh, and kind of uh, one of the things to to, to, to play with and and kind of turn over and chew on, uh, but also the ways that, uh, he has acted in your guys' life and the, the beauty that he's brought about, and abundance, because he just doesn't do things small, um, and so he I mean like who's going to drink 20 gallons of wine, like that's one jar, and you're like, oh, my goodness, that's a lot of wine, that's a lot, a lot of wine. This must have been a big party or he just gave way more than we could possibly use.

Jessica:

That's beautiful One. I totally missed the connection of yes being right before these. These pictures, that's amazing. I also am completely mind blown by I've never even considered the the fact that Jesus' miracle in this case and possibly other cases are, like the seventh jar being you know, three chapters later, like in a future event. I I like thinking about it's. These are not just isolated events but a continuum, um and that sort of thing. So I really I'm I'm feeling very mind blown by your john for connection too

Fr. Philipp:

jess, how about you?

Jessica:

I was really meditating and contemplating on just the exchange between Mary and Jesus, and first just Jesus's response saying to her, like she points out, they have no wine. And then Jesus's response, woman, how does your concern affect me? My hour has not yet come and that can seem a little startling or harsh or whatever, but to me that word woman really signifies like okay, something big is happening here, because I know that he and Father Philipp, please jump in with your biblical knowledge and wisdom if I go off course or if there's something to add, but I know at the foot of the cross he calls Mary woman, which is like huge moment in salvation and just the salvation of our soul, salvation history, and I know, going back to Genesis, eve being named woman and everything. To me that title of naming her woman shows something big is happening here which ends up being like the manifestation of his power, like, for the first time, this amazing miracle that comes out of it. And I'm reading this. You know, sometimes people say something and you just can't shake it.

Jessica:

Our two-year-old daughter said something to me the other day so it was about a week ago and I have thought about it every single day. I wear a necklace and on one side it was a gift from my mom. On one side is the sacred heart of Jesus which I wear facing outward, and on the other side is the Immaculate Heart of Mary which I put toward my own heart. and our two-year-old was looking at it, flipping it back and forth at one point and she was like Mom, Jesus and Mary's hearts match and every time I've gone to pray I've thought about that. And when I was really thinking about this in the past, when I've read this story, I've liked to imagine like Mary is pointing something out to Jesus that Jesus didn't recognize. But on reflection that's definitely not the truth. I feel like Mary is pointing out a real need that Jesus is already aware of and I love in the gospels. It's still very mysterious. I still have a lot of understanding, or maybe it'll always be a mystery, I don't know.

Jessica:

But this interplay of how faith evokes God's power. I was thinking about that story. I'm not sure where it is, but the woman I think it's the woman who's been hemorrhaging Is that correct? And she reaches out and touches Jesus' cloak or the tassel right as he's walking by and it evokes his power and she is healed. It kind of reminds me of what you said in the last episode too, john, where it's like John the Baptist and Jesus together are going to. I can't remember the exact language of that passage, but they're together going to do what God sent them to do.

Jessica:

And in this case I feel like it's such a testament to the fact that Mary's faith evokes Jesus's power. He's saying my hour has not yet come and she just says okay, do whatever he tells you. She is like the statement of faith he knew when she said that that she was asking him to act on it, like there was an understanding, and she was basically saying in her word I know that you can do something about this. When she says they have no wine, they have that understanding, which is why he gives that response. And yet then it comes about and just this idea of the cooperation between our faith and God's power and just yeah, when.

Jessica:

Jesus heard that that I honestly thought about it. This time it's him being like oh, I'm so happy you asked I was waiting. I was just like waiting to release this. This desire to aid this couple was like already in my heart. I just needed the faith to kind of unleash it and to be able to have that cooperation. So that really stuck out to me and I found that really beautiful and also just a really random tidbit. I know it says specifically in the passage that his mother said to the servers do whatever he tells you. But I imagined like Jesus overhearing Mary saying that and Jesus recalling Mary for the 30 years of their like life that is silent. Mary trying to teach Jesus like just always, do whatever he tells you, do whatever he tells you. And I imagined Jesus like smiling that she was saying the same thing to the servers that she would have said to him as a boy and him being just like pierced to the heart so excited to make this miracle happen at her request.

John:

That's so interesting because that's exactly like the line and parts that stuck out to me, but it had like a different tone to me. First of all, Father Philipp is like is he talking back to mary in this situation?

Fr. Philipp:

What do you mean? What's

Fr. Philipp:

your question?

John:

Just like it's his mom coming up to him and I mean, jess, you kind of touched on it, like that may be saying like woman and then proceeding with whatever you're going to say it like isn't like what it would be like today if someone was doing that? But just like I mean, what was the exact line? How does your concern affect me? Like, is that? Like what is he saying there in that moment?

Fr. Philipp:

I think more like exact translation would be like what is this to you and to me, like what does this mean for you and for me?

Fr. Philipp:

this need right, like I I think there's I mean, there's that. That's really hard. It's a really weird phrase in greek, it's kind of hard to translate and I'm no greek expert by by any stretch of the imagination, but the the, the reality of what he is. I think he is inviting, provoking something, and the hour is a huge theme in John's gospel and so when the hour shows up, we know something's happening, and oftentimes, when the hour is invoked, there's also miracles and they just happen to surround the wine, the like wine or other other aspects of, of, like the Eucharist, like I don't know, there's, there's, there's tons of stuff happening, but I wouldn't say that he's like, uh, talking back to her so much as maybe even like inviting her to to respond.

Fr. Philipp:

But yeah, it's certainly. I mean, sometimes Jesus responds to us that way where you ask something of him and he kind of like hard noses back right, like kind of like I don't know, he pushes back on us in a way to expand our hearts, and I mean our lady's heart is constantly expanding by responding to the work of our Lord. So I I think that there's different ways that you can understand it, but I don't think that it can be something where, like, he's correcting her,

John:

yeah

Fr. Philipp:

, yeah, and the, the woman thing that you're talking about, jess, like for sure that's. That's the, the role that she has in in the new creation Right and the the seventh day it's like she's the new eve that that's being addressed. Um, for the the new Adam.

John:

Well, and I guess like, even though that, like when I first read it, I like almost picture like a tense situation, I'd still like the positives that you were talking about, jess, but it's like, almost like the way that it first spoke to me was like just like a, a look into, like a mother and her son, like relationship of, like he's there with his friends, mom's coming up and talk to him like one, how embarrassing. But then, like you know, we, we joke that there's like tertiary questions or like statements, but it's like no, no, just say what you mean. Like she's like oh, there's, there's no wine, and he's just like, yeah, that's like what of it? And then, like, I picture her like rolling her eyes and like turning other people and be like just do what he says, because she knows he's going to do it.

John:

And maybe it's like kind of like what you were saying in the previous episode or two episodes ago, where it's just like she nudged him to do it. And I think that's maybe how it works sometimes with Mary She'll nudge us to bring something to Jesus, and it's like just go to him and do what he says. But yeah, I don't know, it's just, the language is kind of startling, so I'm glad you can kind of, you know, translate and interpret for me.

Fr. Philipp:

Yeah, no, I think you're right on that. There's and it's actually playing back to what Jess was talking about that, well, actually your child, your daughter, is talking about right, the heart of Jesus and Mary match. And so there's this space where he's like ah, come on. And he's like what does this matter? And she's just like do whatever he tells you, because she knows his heart right.

Fr. Philipp:

She's confident in who he is, what he's going to do. And, uh, there's a Concord there, right, like even even that word right, like with, with one heart, right Like Concordia, like Cordia is the heart in Latin, like there's a, a, a harmony that exists between them, and so she's the mother who's just like. I know exactly what he's going to do and I don't have to kind of worry about figuring out what's happening in him. So that's a beautiful insight, john.

Jessica:

It's kind of making me as we're talking. It just occurred to me. Sometimes when I meditate on this I imagine the bride and groom understand the wine is running short and they're seeing that and are kind of like internally panicking. And then other times when I think about it, maybe it just has to do with what my own circumstances of my own life are at the time when I read it. But other times when I've read it, I'm like, oh, I don't even think they know Mary is noticing and they don't even realize and she's just having their back before they even.

Jessica:

It's kind of beautiful, I think, and fruitful for me to imagine it both ways, depending on what I need to receive in the moment. But it's making me think about, if Mary is looking at me right now, what is the grace that she's asking Jesus for for me? What is she praying for in this exact moment For me that I am not even aware of? This is not my own idea, I can't. I can't remember where I read this, but I there was something I came across one time that was like just kind of leading you to think about, like how many times has has Mary thrown herself down before the Trinity just begging for mercy for you, without you even realizing it, like her intercession has carried us through so many moments and it's just cool to think and while praying this, to think about, like I really wonder what Mary is asking for Jesus, for for me at this moment, because I know she is a perpetual intercessor, so I don't know.

Jessica:

It's just something cool to think about when meditating on this mystery too

Fr. Philipp:

uh, what you're you're saying just uh brought about in me, uh, just a memory of um a moment when I was in need and the weird way that the our lady actually uh brought about an answer to it. So I was trying to make it to uh to lourdes in France and I was staying at a monastery in Toulouse for part of the summer and I was trying to. I had to get up early, had one of the Dominicans that I was staying with say mass for me. He drove me to the train station and I had like 15 minutes to buy a ticket, get to the platform. I'd never been in this train station before. I walk in, the machines aren't working, so I can't do like the no line, no interaction with people. And I walk into the ticket office and it's just huge line and I'm like there's no way I'm going to make it.

Fr. Philipp:

And I like I was just sitting there and immediately there's in the middle of France, there's this irate Italian man screaming things in Italian at the French person who's working the counter. The French person doesn't speak Italian and the Italian person doesn't speak French. And it's this old man who's saying I can't see the screen and the French man saying if you just look at the screen. And so I got to go up and walk up and I was like, okay, he's asking the screen. So I read the screen to the Italian man.

Fr. Philipp:

I told the the french man, uh, what the italian man was saying, and uh, the response of the, and he got his ticket. He went along and the, the guy, was like thank you so much, what do you need? And he just gave me like, basically, he, he didn't give me the ticket. I paid for the ticket but I got to skip the whole line because I was able to translate it for this irate italian man. So I was just thinking like if Mary gives me irate Italian men all the time, it would be great.

John:

It's a golden ticket.

Jessica:

No, I love that too, father Philipp, because I was just thinking too like. This to me is like such a call to simplicity too. A lot of times I expect God to be asking something huge of me and instead it's like just fill the jars with water. And I just love this like irate Italian man. Like filling the jars, that seems too simple, lord. Or like translating for this man, that seems too simple. There has to be something bigger. But it's really like the Lord never wants to overwhelm us. He knows exactly what we're capable of. He doesn't think lesser if all I can do is fill the jar with water, that delights him and is enough.

Jessica:

I love too the truth that this shows of just. We are called truly to the simplest things, and God's power multiplies and turns that into an abundance, kind of how you were talking earlier. Abundance can come out of such meager, such lack of things. But like, that is when the Lord's glory is like most at work. It's not when I do something great, it's when I can't fully do, or like when I do the simplest thing, and then his glory has more, more room to shine. So I like that story. The Italian man is like a little like fill in the jar, being able to translate for him. I love that, oh goodness, anything that either of you want to jump in and add, or anything that the Holy Spirit's putting on your heart to share before we wrap up.

John:

Thank you, Mary, for praying on our behalf.

Jessica:

This passage always makes me think of my first year of teaching. I had a seventh grader who wrote a reflection on this passage and she's like all I want to do in this life is be like one of the servants at the wedding feast of Cana, who can just hear the word of God and follow through on it. And I was like, oh, this seventh grader is way more advanced than I am Now, she's post-college but I'm inspired by her in that moment. I just want to pray that we can all have hearts like those of the servants here, who are seen by Mary and Jesus as instruments for God's glory and who are ready to receive, receive the word of the Lord, God's will, and act on it with complete trust and excitement of what will come in that. So thank you so much. What a gift to pray and reflect on this passage with you. Please count on our continued prayers and we ask you to pray for us. Praise be to God.