From Dark Night of the Soul to Reclaiming Sovereignty: Cherie Burton's Rose Path Journey.

Katische Haberfield welcomes Cherie Burton to delve into her profound journey guided by the divine feminine and the mystical path of Mary Magdalene. Cherie shares her experiences with sacred pilgrimages, including her life-changing visit to France, where she felt a deep connection to Mary Magdalene. Explore how Cherie embraced the Rose Path, underwent spiritual awakenings, and discovered her true self through sacred feminine wisdom and healing journeys. Perfect for anyone interested in spirituality, the divine feminine, and personal transformation.

Chapters:00:00 Introduction to Cherie Burton02:27 Cherie's Personal Journey and Spiritual Awakening06:22 The Dark Night of the Soul08:45 Pilgrimage to France and Mystical Experiences14:33 Questioning Faith and Embracing the Sacred Feminine25:02 The Role of Trauma and Emotional Healing28:31 The Power of Sacred Locations and Energies29:39 Ayahuasca Experience in Costa Rica30:39 Embracing Plant Medicines and Initiation33:05 The Rose Path and Divine Feminine36:27 Ancestral Healing and Lineage41:25 Personal Sovereignty and Self-Discovery43:01 Authenticity and Life's Journey52:28 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

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Transcript

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Welcome to the infinite life with Katische Haberfield. I'm a Katische and I'd like to take you on a transformative journey, exploring the mysteries of the soul, past lives, and infinite existence. Through over 60 regression case studies, mediumship interviews, and fascinating discussions with interesting human beings, uncover what it means to be a human facing duality on earth, whilst embracing the true nature of reality. Non duality and unconditional equality. We're all here learning and growing together as one and the biggest lie we were ever sold or told was that we were not worthy of that. Cherie Burton is a master aroma therapist and emotional breakthrough coach and trainer who specializes in the science and spirituality of multisensory, healing, and feminine empowerment. She's been trained in multiple healing, art forms and modalities having journey through several sacred, feminine wisdom, tradition, apprenticeships, and mystery schools. Cherie a mother of six and has been a life coach for over 20 years. Holds a psychology degree and has worked in clinical settings as a mental health counselor. Her soul rose show podcast online programs and retreats guide women to connect with their authentic essence and experienced deep transformation and inner awakening. I am here with the beautiful Cherie Burton today. Sheree is coming all the way from the USA. So Cherie welcome to the podcast. Thanks Katische glad to be here. I was on episode one, one, one of your podcast. I love the fact that it was episode one, one, one. That's a long time ago. But that was back at the very beginning of my journey with sound healing. So if you haven't caught up with that part of my life, you can go to Cherie's podcast, which is now called the Soul Rose podcast. I have Soul Rose show. Today I wanted to talk to Cherie. We're in the midst of a whole bunch of interviews with fascinating people to me about their life and how they are dealing with the forties, fifties, and sixties. How they're learning to nurture themselves how they're finding unique aspects of themselves to learn more about themselves and to take up space within themselves for themselves. And one of the distinct things that I know about Cherie is that she has amazing, a sense of knowing when it's time to rest, to go on sacred journeys, to take retreat, to go do everything from shamanic style, psychedelic journeys through to mystical sacred feminine journeys. And as a mother of six, I honor that because as a mother of two, I don't do that. So it's like when I see other people honoring that need to explore, to question, to have their own quest within their own. I guess hero's journey and to, ask who they are and what they're doing and take a breath and say, hang on, . For me it's very inspiring to see that especially within the context of your life and the professional life you've led, but also the personal spiritual life that you've led and the, your own backstory of discovering your position in life. In relation to God and religion and who you are. So I wanted to just quickly say, if you would like to hear Cherie's story, I have a very beautiful friend Jennifer Elizabeth Moore, who has the empathic mastery show, and on the 29th of March, she released a podcast episode called from exile to grace. And I really highly recommend that you go and listen to that because, It is a deeply, sacred honoring of the things that we go through in life with the family that we choose to be born into, with the situations that we take to grow as a soul and the people who join us on that journey, be they children, partners and all the people around us. So I'd like to highly recommend you do that homework. Or. Post homework after you listen to the podcast, I'd like to really dive deep kind of where that podcast left off, which is the next step, which was the journey into the mystery schools, the sacred feminine journey, and how you've used that space and travel and. Sacred time to nurture yourself and discover yourself. Yeah. Oh yeah. So I loved that interview with Jennifer. She very compassionately guided me to some places that I don't always feel very comfortable really exploring and talking about cause it is so sacred and private. I've, felt the grace, I felt the exile. And you and I met in, I think 2012 or something when I was in Australia. And we just, yeah, we just stay connected that way. And you were just talking about how, like when you meet people or you get a spark of somebody or this or that, and as I've been working on my memoir and it's a hybrid with some of my research on the divine feminine, but Writing a timeline of my life and just seeing synchronicities. I, I encourage everyone to do that, to just write an arc of their heroes, journey, heroine's journey, and just look at little the highlights, but then also looking at what were the little things along that path. And so for me, where we left off in the interview with Jennifer was, okay. So I went through this really harrowing. Dark night of the soul, deconstruction, faith crisis type of, right around the age of 49 coming into turning 50, I'm 55 now. So it's been about five years and I've been through a lot of trauma in my life, a lot of loss, losing a sister to suicide losing my firstborn daughter just, a lot of loss. And. And. I take all of the losses that I've experienced over my life, including like finding my grandfather dead and all these things that I just put that theme of loss. And I always tell people it does not come close. All of those losses of all the really and the people that I love so dearly and losing them, it doesn't even hold a candle. It's not minutely in the same category as when I lost my quote unquote faith, which is to say, the exile piece of it was me taking a sabbatical from my community, my religion of origin, which is Mormonism, seventh generation Mormon. I live here in Utah, which is like the central place of, Mormonism globally. And my ancestors came here. They settled this land. They had a lot of hardships. And so reconciling. Where I was being led, versus what I had inherited at birth created a real psychological split in me for a lot of years, even before I was consciously aware of it. So around mid 2018. I was, I was still active, actively participating in my religion. And I for me, it always came down to devotion to the divine, I was like, okay this is a beautiful community. There's a lot of really positive things. I knew there were shadows. I didn't really dive into them. I just went on with my life because my kids did my business. And what started to happen is I started to hear some teachings and all of a sudden cause I got more in tune with my body. And I start to hear the teaching, and then I would just experience an instant feedback Pension. And so I would write things in my journal and just move on. Mid 2018, I, felt this call to go to France cause I read some stuff about Mary Magdalene. I was starting to get into the Gnostic gospels and I was like, nobody ever taught me at church. I've been in a religious devotee. Like why are we not hearing about Mary Magdalene? Number one because she's very pivotal to the, especially the resurrection story and Easter and everything. And number two, I found out that there were these texts that were discovered in like right around the time of World War II and in Egypt, and they contain a lot of texts that could have really benefited Christianity, but all the churches were just, not even exploring it, not even going there, but I did, and I started to meet other people that did, and then I find out she's in France that Mary Magdalene went there after the crucifixion and had a whole life there. And that really intrigued me. And so I decided to just Google Mary Magdalene pilgrimage France or Mary Magdalene retreat France. I like, I knew I needed to go to France and it's, and to the region where she was and where all these legends abound and, where all these texts indicate that she lived. So I did I, just chose Didn't know anyone in this group, but I found out that the woman that I her name is Chloe Mercer. I had met her before, let me back up. So I went to Glastonbury, and I felt called to go there as well. And for those of you guys unfamiliar with, I know you're familiar with Katische, but maybe some of your listeners, like that's another sort of like divine feminine hotspot on the earth, the chalice well, the gardens, the tour, the Avalon. So I had done. And Avalon pilgrimage. And then I was like the next place is France. So I, and I met Chloe in, in, Glastonbury and she has, I have been part of her mystery school now for all of this time. And we'll get to her in a minute, but I went with a separate group to France. And I just, again, I just Googled and then found it online and I just went and met everybody there. And they were all from America and we all didn't know each other, but it was like I came home. I have no other way to describe what it was like to be there other than the lands felt, familiar. They felt. It didn't feel like it was in a foreign country aside from the language. It just felt, I felt so nestled in to the lay of the land. And, I don't know how much you want me to describe, but that, experience being a week or 10 days in France and going to all of the places and having a guide and they were, everyone was mystical and everyone was searching and everyone was, I would say of one purpose and unity in terms of it. How come I feel the call of the Magdalene? How come, what is this about for me? So the turning point was I was, I'd had, we'd had a little kind of a group dispute about an issue and I felt like I was staying in integrity and and then I just felt this is icky. Why am I here? All of a sudden it just felt weird. So I was in my room alone and. I was praying and I was contemplating, I fell asleep and it was what do you want from me? Mary Magdalene? What, how did I end up here? Why am I in France? I've got kids. I was there during my marriage anniversary. It was just like, what am I doing here? And I had a middle of the night mystical experience that I'm still integrating, but it was physically undeniable. And I won't go into too much detail other than to say a very strong feminine presence was asking me what I wanted. And I was like, nobody has ever in my entire religious life asked me what I want. And that all of a sudden I just went into my heart and all these longings were coming out. So I was expressing non verbally, I couldn't move. I couldn't speak. I couldn't open my eyes. I wasn't afraid, but I was stupefied, awestruck. And so I began to share from my heart, I want just rattling what I valued, my core values. One of them was health. One of them was about my family and being mother, and truth. Those are the three that stood out to me the most. I just, I want truth of my life. I value truth, actual reality. I journaled about it quite a bit and I ended up having a beautiful experience for the rest of that pilgrimage, but when I came home, Over the next of the course of the next six months, this is, I'm 49. My Chiron return was on its way, which you know, nobody knows anything about that. But there is this definite thing, like around 50 for women, where it starts to just really you're moving into the second half of your life. And for a lot of women it's happening sooner. It certainly was trying to happen for me, but I was so staunch in my belief system that I, couldn't even go there. I had too much dissonance to even question my, right. Beliefs. So over the next six months, after I got back from that pilgrimage, things just started to fall apart. I was hosting a retreat for women in October. So it was about three months after that. And I was talking about sovereignty and I was talking about all these beautiful spiritual concepts and the feminine mystics back the Christian mystics like Hildegard and Jillian of Norwich and, and all of a sudden I'm on stage and I'm talking about sovereignty, and I'm talking about getting being at one with the divine and getting your own answers and being a mystic and agnostic and all of these things. And I'm literally on stage and spirit says to me, you're about to really learn this in big ways. What do you mean? What don't I know what's going on here? And it was very egotistical of me to be like, I think I know, thank you. But what are you talking about? Fast forward after that retreat, I started to experience a very strong pull to study and research. I have this very like researchy lift the lid, I'm, like, I love investigative. So I almost was an investigative journalist. Like I just love exploring and researching. I was basically like told or shown or felt a draw to research the things that I, that were considered taboo in my religion. Satan wouldn't want you to explore that, so you should probably like not and I, because I've been studying sovereignty and because I felt a strong pull to really get to the bottom of truth, I started studying and as I, it didn't take me too long from public Documents, source documents, historical narratives, public records, to get to the heart of why I was feeling dissonance in my religion and a historical narratives specifically and, truth claims. And also I realized that I was unhealthy. That I had been bypassing my feelings for a very long time, and it was affecting me like an autoimmune level. And so I can put this together for you. Now, at the time, I didn't know it was very destabilizing, but everything that I shared from my heart. That mystical night in France to that divine feminine presence of what I wanted, I realized with great distress that I could not have those things, health, authentic relation to all the things had I, not lifted the lid and had I stayed on the track that I was on, which I thought was the right track. In my religion and it ripped me apart. I was probably in fetal position, crying on and off for months and months. It was a slow process for me to come to terms with that because it was my entire worldview, but I could not deny where I was being led and I couldn't deny what I felt. And experienced in these lands, like Glastonbury and France. And yeah, it, it finally got to the point where I had to set a boundary for my own spirituality. And that just meant I need space. I need everyone to get away from me. I need to stop reading. I need to stop studying. I just need to, feel into what's really going on here. And this is where I call it like the dark feminine comes in and that archetype, not in an evil way, but just a space holding of the unknown, the dark, the cosmic womb, the let me incubate you and hold you in this fertile soil while you start to sprout something new that's more in alignment with who you are. And It was so incredibly powerful and also paradoxically, I thought I was going insane. We can understand. And there were some people who probably thought I was too, because I lost my whole sense of identity and I was no longer the me that many people saw it as far as my image, my public persona. And I had developed a strong identity of being a woman, a pillar really of faith in that community. So to experience the shunning, to experience the loss of dignity in many respects, to experience the, people stopped respecting me on a different level. And then there was a whole new tribe that saw me. Not what I was believing or doing or not doing or adhering to or not adhering to. It's just I see you, I love you for you. So it called into question a lot of my relationships that were built on beliefs or identities versus authentic, true connection and communication. And I might add that my husband and I almost divorced that same year that everything was because everything in my life blew up. Everything. And I was starting to question the authentic everything that I besides my kids, like everything blew up. I continued to just rest into the unknown and I would be sent, I would be sent on the only way that I can describe it is I went back to Glastonbury. To pick up activations in the land, which I know now that's what was happening. I didn't know that's what I was doing on a conscious level. The mystery school and understanding the rose path and why the symbol of the rose was coming through so strong to me just at that time leading up to my sabbatical for religion. And then also like stronger and stronger. Cause I asked, God, okay, just give me, I'm not a sign seeker. Cause I know that means you don't have faith, but Just give me a symbol that I'll know is from you went to this really powerful retreat, in the summer of 2019 when I was 50. And it was like, it undeniably came through the rose. It was like, you're on the right path. And then I came to understand what the rose symbolized. So there were just so many synchronicities and so much archetypal, you sort of resonance with these symbols. The Magdalene as just an archetype who she is and what she represents archetypally. The Rose, Sophia even Universal Christ and how that's so different than what I was given in the religious space. Yeah, the high priestess archetype from the Avalon, and I didn't even understand what a priestess was. That name was dropped in the temple, in the Mormon temple, but it was more along the lines of, There's no expressed power with it. It was all related to your husband and like being a priestess to your husband in the afterlife. So all this secondary feminine stuff I was programmed with and conditioned to like males are second, they have auxiliary roles. They're not the real they're not really the ones in power. They don't have the true authority. I don't have the keys. They don't. And I was like, I was fighting that my whole life to understand what this God thinks that. Girls are not as important as boys. Like I literally had that program running. So my feminist awakening was very sacred because I'd already grappled with this in the space of religion. So when the call of the Magdalene came in and all of it just affirmed everything I'd been praying about for literally 50 years. It just, you didn't feel good about it because this was being stripped from you and, you're feeling the call of the Magdalene because she, comes through to those who are trying to really, embody sovereignty and understand it in the sacred, sovereignty way and divine partnership, internal masculine, feminine balance, like the sacred marriage within high risk gamas, all of these things were just seemed like a book. Somebody didn't mention a book or a podcast or go to this plan and follow this teacher. So really I got to just be with this group of women in the sacred rose mystery school. I was pretty much the only American, there was one other kind of popped in and out, but I was pretty much the only one that wasn't from Europe. And these women have really midwived me as I have them through their own dark nights and through their own awakenings. The sacred feminine awakening is a lot of women are going through it that don't know they're going through it. And so I've made it, that's my theme on my podcast is to explore what's compromising your health. What are you paying? What systems are you feeding? What foundations that have been laid for you versus what are you wanting to create? What resonates for you? And that's heretical. It can be deemed heretical and it, still continues to I'm literally seen as a heretic and an apostate. Because I'm taking another path, but I don't ever think I've ever felt more aligned with my true self. I know I haven't, and that's direct connection to source, direct revelation. It's messy sometimes. I think that's the way it's supposed to be, don't you? Absolutely. That's how you learn. And it's interesting because just to put a little insert here for the listener the way that I met Sheree was that she was teaching classes about emotions. And then using the power of sensory. Awareness and all of the connections within your body to heal emotions and heal trauma and to understand your body. So I can imagine that it was a huge shock to you that you're like, I'm an expert in in my eyes, you were in emotions. And yet I have all these feelings and emotions that I actually haven't even got to the bottom of yet. Yeah. I felt a bit hypocritical because. I knew that I was emotionally like coming apart in terms of, it's been described to you, you brought up trauma Dr. Gabor Mate, Peter Levine, all of these really, the leading industry experts in trauma, release, addiction, talk about how the worst kind of trauma. The most complex and actually the most damaging is not like a severe accident or a disaster or a crime, and it can be, but the worst kind, the most complex is chronically deferring. Your own voice and authenticity over time and not being your authentic self. That's the worst kind of, and most complex kind of trauma. And I can definitely look at my religious path and say there was spiritual abuse here and that was out of line and this and that, but when it came to the big, thing, it was, I feel like I just went into homogenization and I was expected to conform to a certain role. And there were expectations that were put on me that were quite heavy. One of them was having a lot of children, which I did. And I don't regret that at the same time. It's undeniable that there's. There's not, women do not have authority in, this religion and I couldn't sit in that anymore. I just couldn't. And I love what it created in me that I continue to. Retain in terms of devotion service, a lot of, gifts came from there in terms of learning to speak and all I went on, I actually served a full time mission in my early twenties. And so, there were a lot of beautiful relationships that were built and a lot of, and also a lot of like pain and dogma and shame and retribution and punitive. There were just a lot of really polar. So now I'm just like, my goal in life is to merge the duality, not to create more of it, not to create more light and more dark. It's just, how do we merge these so that I can rest into a middle path that allows me to see all sides. And respect all sides, because I can't judge somebody for something that I created in my own life at one time and vice versa. And for me, it comes back to just really deeply listening to myself and other people. And it's interesting because, no, I keep going back to the oils, but the oils, change you to one path of being aware. But that's also linked spiritually, but these journeys also connected you into the energy of the land as well and put you into a new space. And they say that when you are healing your emotions and your thoughts, sometimes you need to move out of your environment to clear the energy, to then move into a new environment, to actually see through that and to get different perspectives. So how did you find that? Various locations that you have journeyed to. Can you speak on the energy and the energetic side of things influenced you? What role did that location have as opposed to going down the road to a seminar, for example? Yeah first I just need to say that. You don't have to go to these places. I don't want people to listen and go I haven't been to Glastonbury and I haven't been here or there. For me though, I was blessed with the resources and the setup at home to be able to do that. And so different lands have different lay lines, different portals really into other dimensions and also into like activations. So you can. I don't think now I think we're living in a time where you don't have to, like I said, you don't have to go to those places. You can call that energy in, or you can sit in your own kind of ritual or ceremony to receive that. But for me, it was just, I'm such a tactile somatic person. So, going there became pivotal. You mentioned oils also plants and plant medicine, essential oils, everything that we have for our need for healing is already here on the earth. It's just a matter of trying to find what. Resonates for you and what calls to you. And I never thought that this would be the case, but the ayahuasca grandmother, ayahuasca medicine called to me for two years before I finally said yes. So I did that at age 51 in Costa Rica for with high level shamans in a really secure medical facility. It was actually a really beautiful experience, but I would never do it again. But I, yeah, I did a whole episode on it and, really, And there are many layers that I'm still integrating about, but the gist of it was like. Like I almost had to, and I did actually leave my body the last night so that the medicine and the unplugging from the matrix could actually happen because I was in so much resistance because I had so much trauma and so much love and devotion for, that system and that institution. And I just wanted the truth. I just wanted to know. So working with gifts of the earth, working with plants and plant medicines and plant allies, again, it was so out of the box and so out of my comfort zone to go do that. I went alone to go study. I did, meet people there, but it was absolutely transcendental what I experienced. Very akin to what I experienced in France, but. It added upon that to let me know that I was in the middle of initiation, I was being initiated and it wasn't that I was because my programming was well, if you have this crestfallen countenance, and if you're struggling, and if things aren't lining up, then you're doing something wrong or. Evil has infiltrated. So I was grappling with that what am I doing wrong? And what I was being shown through the support of these natural environments and these plants was that wasn't doing anything wrong. I was waking up and I was being initiated into a new way of being and to create not another identity. That was all ego when I had built up. All of those were ego structures, as much as I loved them, they were ego structures. It's if you really want the truth, if you really want resonant health, if you really want authentic relationships, if you want to feel good in your skin, then are you open to receiving something that may be a little bit out of the box? And I was like, I already thought I was doing that, but okay. What's the next level? I'm slightly afraid, but also slightly excited. Yeah. And just for me, it's just the hardest. I love predictability. I'm a Capricorn. I love structures. I love, and there was a time I love people just telling me what to do. It was safe. It was comfortable. It took I didn't have to think too much about it until that just became absolutely unbearable. And then I'm like, I know I'm getting comfortable being in the unknown. I'm still what I would call like very much on the path of the divine feminine. I'm not excluding the divine masculine because there's just very much there, right? There's a lot there with that, but for me personally, I spent most of my life connecting to the divine masculine and, like dismissing that there is this other resonant force that's so much a part of me. And I think the planet is waking up to that as well, but the Rose path, I'm still on what I call the Rose path. Because of what it's about, what the Rose path is. Yeah. I guess I was just, I love this quote by Anne Bering. She's like one of my mentors, heroines. I've had her on my podcast. She's 92 years old. She has a book coming out this year. She's very much like she's written. Incredible books on soul evolution. I think it's called, but I always forget the name of it. Divine cosmos or something. But anyway, cosmic mother, she's just written so much on the divine feminine, but she's from England and she's very proper and she's very brilliant and she's as sharp as attack 92 years old. So I'm going to just read to you what she says. She said the way of the rose wasn't, is the way of the heart. The way of the visionaries who preserve this ancient tradition, that who from time immemorial connected us to a deeper levels of reality and opened our soul to the experience of our own divinity and immortality, as well as to the cosmic consciousness and the unity of life. Like a thousand petal lotus of the Eastern traditions, the rose came to symbolize the union of the awakened soul with the divine ground. It was Mary Magdalene who brought this tradition of divine wisdom to France. We do not know who guarded and transmitted it for over a thousand years until it came alive in the 12th century and is now being restored once again in our own time from the work of many individuals who are Being brought together to accomplish it. And that's the soul evolution take on it. I will tell you from a mist, a purely mystical place, you can't describe the Rose path, but it is a path of initiation and it is very, divine feminine. Yeah, it's, it, there's a lot there around mystery and, And mother, both of which I really signed up for hard in this life. Yeah. Incarnation. I'm like, really? Cause yeah. Yeah. And just to bring on the comment about where you said you're not ignoring the divine masculine. I think that there are people incarnated right now who are on. Either the divine feminine or the divine masculine path, whether they are gender identified as female or male, like mine is definitely the divine masculine healing because everything that I've done so far through the work that I do has all been masculine, very traumatic, religious, masculine lifetimes. So interesting. You're on the feminine side of that, dealing with exactly the same, but in a feminine incarnation. I'm like, I haven't had religious trauma in this incarnation, but I've had so many in other incarnations in masculine roles that haven't been healed that. I needed to get rid of that first and heal that before I can do the feminine thing. That's the kind of feeling that I had. So there are times where we do feminine healing lifetimes. We do masculine, maybe lifetimes where we do both, but yeah, so it's not ignoring it. It's just saying right now I've got to this is where it's, yeah, this is what's coming up. And I, think that is really pivotal. We each have our own very much like our own individuated path and what is calling to us and where we're called to work. I just happened to descend as a seventh generation Mormon and Mormonism is, I will say it's also Christian nationalism because in my direct matrilineal line, seven is my grandmother and her mother. Seven generations of American Mormon mothers, like faithful. My seventh great grandma was a daughter of the signer of the U S constitution. She was the first one to join the church back when it literally started in New York state in the 1800s. So I've got this really interesting matrilineal lines. It's very mother oriented. It's all in my. Cosmology. It's all in my astrology chart, this loaded fourth house, and there's all this pain and trauma in it. Like it's all Chiron's there and all the things. And so I know, and I have that knowing also there's this sense of, I, even though we do a lot, we talk a lot about ancestral healing and it was really like up in the consciousness right now. I also honor that while I might be helping to liberate aspects of what they experienced, for instance, like my, some of my great grandmothers had to do practice polygamy. They had to literally share their husband with a myriad of other women. And I have felt that pain in my body. No, I've never been practicing. I know the pain I have ancestrally felt that, but I also honor that there are other aspects to their incarnation when they were here on earth that I can draw from as. They, had more, maybe they just held more wisdom than I did. The tenacity, the pioneering spirit all of those things I don't want to diminish by saying that there's this other aspect that's so huge, created this huge energy, entity really for all of us to divest and outsource to and defer to that got so big that we lost ourselves in it. And that, that calls to me to claim for back for myself, whether my ancestors have done that already or in the process of it, or they've moved on, or I don't know that it feels like just working through it in my own being for myself. And just offering that as he, if there was something that you couldn't take care of while you were here, I'll be the vessel, I'll be the conduit and let's clear this lineage. Yes. Feminine dependency on patriarchal rule, or, not being able to be fully here and embodied and, have a voice like that's massive. Yeah, and your ancestors they chose their incarnation and their struggles for a reason. And as you wisely say, but they had their own strength that you can pull from as well. We always need to look at. The strength of people will not just look at them as, victims, as you say you need to see that and the world needs to see that when you're examining a religion and a background, you can't just say, oh, that poor person or the whatever. It's that's the role that they came to grow in and yes, I'm going to help them with my side of it. And I will heal what I can for the, whole lineage so that we all evolve. But I guess from my perspective, it's also, we take away from the genealogical side of things. So you have seven generations of grandmothers. So that's just one of your ancestral lines for this incarnation, right? Unless your soul has chosen to incarnate in your own lineage many times, which nobody can tell unless you go and investigate that this is one set of families that you've had in a billion lifetimes. My words of advice from my perspective is simply. Don't overburden yourself. Do the bit that you can for that lineage that resonates. But don't burden yourself with, I must sacrifice myself. Yeah. Because yeah, no, I'm really bounding around that. And actually I've, actually wrestled with that, quite a bit over the years. And what I came to is I will not sacrifice my health for the collective as much as I love humanity, as much as I love my children, as much as I love my lineage. And my heritage, because part of that programming that I got younger was that like, you have to suffer and endure through this life. And that you are like a savior on Mount Zion is what they call it, meaning that you're here to liberate people, but the way that, that they presented it was not about individual liberation. It wasn't the true path of liberation. It was bringing everybody into the system, bring everybody into this set of police structures. So for me, I'm like. That's why that word sovereign just kept coming to me over and I didn't understand why it was and I'd hear it and I'd be like, what does that even mean? Does that mean God's not sovereign? I don't get it. And I had to really go through lots of initiations to get past that it was wrong. Who am I to claim that? And I think some of it was the survivor guilt of my ancestors because they didn't have that option. It wasn't even a thing. It wasn't, or maybe it was, but they didn't know how to access it. Are they women, we didn't have rights. We were property. We were and you didn't even have claim on your children. If something happened in the marriage or there's just so many dynamics and complexities to being a woman. Literally until this generation. Until late. And I know, irrespective, of any religious background, women in their 50s, late 40s, 60s, even 70s, whenever they realize it, do tend to sacrifice their health for the greater collective. It's just like on that track. Let me tell you, I was like, yeah, you see it all over. Yeah. People go into acts of service, like joining charity clubs or whatever to fill time in retirement. And yet they almost run themselves into the ground doing service for others because they can't stop to take the time to do service for themselves. Yeah. I think where it really culminated for me and, just really okay, just shedding and shedding all these old beliefs and about my roles and my identity and just all. And then it just came down to what do you, again, that thing that happened in 20, what do you want? Is it okay to want what I want? And it's if you are in alignment with your core values and your integrity, you can't get it wrong. And even if you did quote unquote, get it wrong, it's just learning. And so I had to give myself that permission. No one else gave it to me. I felt God giving it to me in the way that I understand God. I'm also open to Changing courses, if I feel called to do that, or I'm not so rigid now, I guess is the best way to put it, but it really culminated for me. I think this last trip that I did, following the path of the Celtic rose to Scotland, that was last January and, that just sealed the deal. I'm like, I don't need to travel anywhere anymore. And it was the last kind of like gathering of our sacred rose mystery school sisters. We had some beautiful, awarenesses and both as a group and as individuals on, what this has been like about for the last five years. And for me, I walked away going, I don't need a guru. I don't need a teacher. I don't need to join another mystery school. At least I, it's just like tree, the programming was that you didn't know enough that you had to find something to complete you or go somewhere to get what you needed. And now I can just I just came home to me. I wish I could say it's all perfect and tied up. There's still so many questions, but like that really just, it took that amount of time. Those five years for me to just really be like, okay. Like it's all inside. I'm going to get it wrong. I'm going to get it messy or I'm but that's how creation works. And so for me now, it's all just about empowering myself and then. Allowing and receiving myself more of myself as I continue to unfold as that rose, the rose puddle or the Eastern Lotus. It's just we're all coming online. We're all of the dormant codes in our DNA. I study a lot about the gene keys now. Human design, I'm nerding out on the gene keys and learning we're all going to we're all on the same basic path. And so why can't we just allow everyone the freedom to experience that path in the way that they're wanting to. And eventually we're all like heading home, but what we're really doing is not going to a place. We're coming here and then feeling that unity consciousness, for all. And I had just been so conditioned to stratify and separate and marginalize and judge and fear. And it's no, we're all the same. Our spiritual leaders and prophets in the day that we're all the same, we're all equal. We're all, we all have different interests and desire levels and we're all learning different things. But ultimately we're one. And that's really not the message we're getting. In most, organizations, I'd say, especially religion. Yes, it's definitely a journey to understand your place within yourself and your place within the world and then your place with, within the divine, and then to learn that they are all one. And to be certain about yourself so that, you don't put yourself in a structure. You allow that free flowing. Fluidity to change, adapt and redefine yourself in every moment. So thank you for sharing that. If you could and importantly, the really important point to share there was that you went to Scotland and that you're like, this part of my life is now. I've, I'm done, I did what I needed to do. I don't feel any more desire, but that was a really important part to get to where I am now. I think currently live on the podcast at the, moment we have a discussion with Ailish Keating and she talks about her journeys in Ireland and Granada and Egypt. That's why the journey was interesting to me because some people do need to do those journeys in whatever way it is, whether it's a journey down the road or a journey into a different nation or different religion or a different sense of spirituality to find, as you're talking about it, your story today, it's like, The sensation that I have of my own journey is like this ripping apart of a second set of skin, so to speak, to reveal I came in with this, and now he's the next layer and this is who I am now. And I want to let that take shape so I can express that. Yeah, and I think just, yeah, you hit it just doing that consistently for yourself is all of your gifts come online, you attract more into your space. That's authentic. Like the, tribe that I was talking about, I still am friends with a lot of the people in my community of origin, but now they, but they, didn't hold. Most of them, 95 percent of them didn't hold this authenticity or this, like, I was saying, like really seeing each other, not what we believe, not what we looked like, but it's Oh, I see you. I trust you. I love you. And, that was just a gift. But had I continued to. Go through the motions and, through all the religious rites and devotion and all that and not actually sat and rested into asking, what I needed or wanted because I thought it was selfish had I not done that work. Which was really hard. I'm, here to tell you it was hell, even though you think, Oh, you're exploring what you want. When you've been conditioned to want things and then you don't know if you actually want them, or if you want something that was considered bad, like tea I wasn't allowed to drink tea. And so there's just these little things that I'm like, all right, yeah what do I want? And I think you and I were talking about this before we started recording. Like when you move into the second half of your life, it's all about reclaiming that. It's fierce, it's wild feminine, it's unknown, but it's very much around an embodied knowing of your, a clear want, clear wants, clear plural. Yeah. Yeah, and then not denying those wants that are authentic. Yeah. Yeah, that are aligned with your core values that aren't hurting other people. I think that anybody who's like at the end of their life or even in the realm beyond this world would say to you that is the secret of being human is making sure that when you take your last breath, you haven't had unresolved regrets of being inauthentic and not doing what you wanted to, desired to, or Yeah. You don't have that guilt or sadness or grief about not being you, right? And then the nurturing of your relationships and how much deeper they are when you are authentic. And that's the other deathbed regret is that people didn't authentically connect in their relationships. They were in the office too much or they whatever. And so I think it's all one thing is that when you rest into your authenticity and you get clear in your desires and that sparks your creativity and then. All of your relationships go deeper and everything just naturally organically aligns. It moves your life into alignment when you go in and you ask and explore, and that's how you create your destiny. That's just it. You're, destined to discover that you are what you're seeking. You're destined to discover who you actually are, which is the divine. That's our destiny. How do you, co create or create anything without knowing that you have the power to do it? Without being clipped at the knees, and yeah, for me, that's just the bottom line is we're all God. We're all here learning and growing together as one and the biggest lie we were ever sold or told was that we were not worthy of that. That sounds like a perfect way to end that story because. I can't even think of asking you anything else because that just encapsulates the whole episode. So I will link in the show notes everywhere that people can find you, Sheree, if they wish to work to you, work with you, follow you on social media, listen to your podcasts. or explore more about your journey with the feminine traditions the rose, path and your journey today, and to learn about all of the different tools that you have in your toolkit now. So thank you so much for spending an hour with us today. And I look forward to seeing the next part of your journey unfold. And I yours. Thank you, Katische. This was great. I loved, the safety you created for me too. Go down these roads. Thank you. Mhm. Mhm. Mm. Mhm. Mm.