From OKC to Chicago: Decoding Josh Giddy's Value in Today's NBA

Summary:

The NBA's late offseason brings fascinating storylines about player valuation, with Josh Giddy's contract situation with the Chicago Bulls taking center stage. At 23, this versatile point forward has transformed from a 26.3% three-point shooter as a rookie to hitting 37.8% last season in Chicago – yet remains unsigned as September approaches. 

Giddy's unique profile makes him both intriguing and difficult to value. Over four seasons, he's played four different positions while posting career highs of 14.1 points, 7.5 rebounds, and 6.1 assists per game. His assist percentage (32.9%) puts him in Tyrese Haliburton territory, while his defensive versatility allows him to guard multiple positions effectively. The Bulls now face a critical decision: pay for this promising trajectory or remain skeptical about the sustainability of his shooting improvement.

The risk grows daily as Giddy could potentially sign his qualifying offer, which would grant him a no-trade clause and unrestricted free agency next summer. Whether his transformation represents a permanent evolution or statistical variance will determine if he commands a four-year deal around $100-105 million or a more conservative structure.

Meanwhile, Zach Harper's center rankings spark conversation about the NBA's big men hierarchy. Nikola Jokić stands alone at the summit, with Victor Wembanyama, Joel Embiid, and Anthony Davis forming an elite second tier despite availability concerns. The third tier features versatile talents like Bam Adebayo and emerging stars like Alperen Şengün, whose offensive impact transformed Houston last season.

The Toronto Raptors find themselves at a crossroads following Masai Ujiri's departure, with Bobby Webster now steering the ship. Despite a disappointing 30-52 record, Toronto made minimal roster changes while carrying significant salary commitments to Scottie Barnes, Brandon Ingram, RJ Barrett, and Immanuel Quickley. Their predicament – too good to tank, not good enough to contend – exemplifies the challenges of NBA team building and identity formation in today's league.

What's your take on these situations? Share your thoughts on where Josh Giddy ranks among NBA guards and what contract he deserves! 

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Transcript

Vince Carter 0:15

yo, it's tuesday, you know what time it is. Front runner podcast collective is back on the air. I am on the air. I am your humble host, vince, and we are sorry for the delay that uh, friday caused, but we had a? Uh, we had somebody who had some personal issues that they needed to deal with and, uh, we send our, uh, our thoughts out to Soraya at this point in time. So we are back, we have a pod to do and we will do that.

Vince Carter 0:50

Uh, we are down a man or down a woman, however you want to put it today, but we persevere on and in today's podcast we will be speaking about Josh Giddey and his contract issues with the Chicago Bulls, where he kind of ranks in a I don't know what you want to call it hoop type, came out with a poll and we want to kind of look at that, and where he kind of slots in and things of that nature. The other thing is is that we're going to be talking about zach harper guards as far as that's concerned, and we will talk about the sinners today as it relates to his little tear system that he has going on. It's a intriguing article. If you are not a subscriber to the athletic. I highly recommend that you get this article and you subscribe to the athletic. Then we will convene by talking about one other thing that is kind of on my mind's pressing situation, and what that actually is is that we're, oh, we're going to be talking about, uh, the heat trading, uh, highsmith to the nets, celery dump. But there was one other thing we're gonna talk about the rafters and what has gone on with messiah jiri leaving the toronto rafters. Who's in charge now, his new title that he just got and where this leaves the actual franchise at this point in time.

Vince Carter 2:39

But before we get to all that, we need to get to two or three things. One, your support. How you can support us. Well, the best way that you can support us is to be a friend and tell a friend about the podcast. If you're out there and you are enjoying the content. If you missed this on Friday, which I hope you all did Tell people about what we do here. Let them know that we most of the time. I would say Friday was a difficult day for all of us, but we're here usually Tuesday and Friday, and we talk about the NBA, we talk about what's coming up as far as the draft. We talk about the front office, we get into some of the cap situations, but we celebrate hoops. That's what we do. We celebrate hoops and we celebrate those who like hoop. So if you enjoy this podcast podcast, let people know about it, be a friend and tell a friend about the podcast.

Josh Giddy's Contract Conundrum

Vince Carter 3:52

Now let's go ahead and get into it. We got a lot to get to. Let's crack it open and we're going to start talking about josh giddy and the Bulls conundrum of paying this man. So, like I said, I read, like our iterated before who's. I came out with a little article, I want to say a couple weeks ago and we can kind of sitting on this where they rank the guards and I found it interesting that on hoops I bored. They put Jamal Murray at 13th, they put LaMelo Ball at 14th and then they slotted Josh Giddey at 15th All-star level type of guards in front of him.

Vince Carter 4:47

Obviously fantastic playoff performance in Jamal Murray. You know what Jamal Murray has done in the playoffs has been remarkable since he's been in the league. Sometimes not so much in the regular season, I don't know, jamal gets bored whatever it is, but in the postseason that dude is nails and we love all the action that he causes in the playoffs. But then you have giddy behind lamello ball and I thought it was apropos to basically talk about this in regards to his contract situation. It's kind of like if you move into a neighborhood, right, and the property value of that neighborhood is at a certain level or whatever the case may be remortgage, and you know they're telling you your house is significantly less than the houses that are like a door down or maybe even like three doors down, and now you are looking at a situation with the chicago bulls and we are talking about we are almost at the end of august. Now my birthday is about to come up, about to be a super, super, duper old man. This man is still not paid.

Vince Carter 6:11

Now I understand that all the restricted free agents are having the same similar issues that are going on, but you would think for what the Chicago Bulls want to do and how I would say impressive his 2024-2025 season for the Chicago Bulls was that it would be a no brainer To retain somebody who is 23 years of age and just scratching the surface. It's like living in a cul-de-sac and you got two Teslas in every garage. But the way Chicago is treating our guy Giddy. They're treating him like basically like you ain't no Tesla, my guy, you know what I'm'm saying. You are not. Ball is making 37.95 million next year. Murray is making 46.39 million next year.

Vince Carter 7:17

Now I know that josh giddy is not getting anywhere near those numbers just because and we'll get into all of it and why and the how and whatever in one second here's where it gets real spicy. He's gone from 26.3 percent from deep as a 19 year old rookie to 37.8 percent from three last year at the age of 23. So that's not a step forward, that's a triple jump and in the league's eyes a triple jump has a price tag. Usually when you see positivity and positive numbers go up like that, you're like talking about growth and where where do we see the growth going from here? But Chicago was not moved by any of these numbers whatsoever. If you're 23 years of age and you're a point forward and you're ranked 15th on ball initiator and you can't get pen to paper with your franchise, it's like having a Bugatti in the garage and no keys. This is crazy. I am sure there are fans in Chicago right now that are saying man, lock him up before somebody gets a hold of him. I'm sure of it.

Vince Carter 8:40

Here's the dossier on our guy, josh Giddey four seasons, 280 career games, 279 starts. He's been a small forward, he's been a power forward, a shooting guard and a point guard. He's played four positions in four years. Incredible adaptability, or you can call it identity crisis, or where can we stick this guy? His assist percentage in that time frame he's a. He was 32.9 last season. That's a career high. That's Tyrese Halliburton territory, just as a FYI, so you want to kind of lock it in to where you think he is as a ball handler he's in the Tyrese Halliburton area, combined with career highs of 14.1 points a game, 7.5 rebounds and 6.1 assists a game.

Vince Carter 9:40

You got a profile that doesn't pop in scoring but quietly tilts the floor in okc. His rebounding was a quirk in chicago, it's a feature. 8.1 boards per game last year is the highest of his career. So you got career numbers at 14.1 that don't jump off the page. 7.5 rebounds, which is incredible for a on ball initiator. And yeah, the assist levels are a little bit lower than what he put out in chicago.

Vince Carter 10:16

But understand this. He was playing with shea gilgis alexander. That makes a difference. One of the best guards in the league, our mvp, right now our reigning mvp, and before giddy stint in chicago he was draymond green with a passport. But here is the stat that's in oklahoma 6.3 percent and 33.7 percent. So that's what he shot the first couple years in OKC.

Vince Carter 10:49

We gets traded to Chicago and suddenly he's hitting 37.8 percent on four attempts a night. That's an increase by 41 percent in accuracy, on more volume and shooting equivalent of a guy that's been basically driving the honda his whole life. And now he shows up at work with a porsche fully paid off. You have to ask is this porsche leased? Are these numbers real? Basically right, because front offices are obsessed with sustainability. This leap could it be explained a little more as a defined role, a cleaner catch and shoot looks that he was getting or just rare shooting high streaks over a single season.

Vince Carter 11:45

Now, depending on where you land, is where you think, josh, giddy, money should end up, and I understand chicago saying, hey, we'd like to see it for another year before we drop 30, some odd million dollars on you, because the one thing that we always talk about in this climate of the NBA is that what you pay your player, that's maybe not your, not, definitely not your lead guy. And what I mean by lead guy is like this is a guy who's going to have the most opportunities to score the basketball on your team, or even the second guy. What do you pay that third guy? What do you pay that guy who maybe is the glue of your team? You can't pay him like 35 million, can't, can't do it. And the reason why is because you see now how hard it is to build teams nowadays. We understand about the restrictions of the aprons and what have you. I'm not going to bore you with those. We talk about them ad nauseum, but if his shooting is a blip, they're tying up calf space. That in a skill that could slide back into the low 30s by next april.

Vince Carter 13:12

Career okay, see was 1.0 makes per game from deep in his first year in Chicago. That went up by. I have a point. So he was 1.5. It seems like a small change, but in the box score it's a massive in perception, you know. So you're looking at somebody who shot it more, shot it more confidently and also had more success when he moved on from chicago.

Vince Carter 13:31

And there can be a myriad of reasons why that happened. It could be pure ownership of the basketball, knowing that you're going to have the ball in your hands. You're not going to have to share it with Shea Gildress Alexander anymore. It could be that Benny Billy Donovan's system works better for our guy, josh Giddey, and even though we love Mark Dagnall, we love the system that he's created down there in Oklahoma City. Maybe it just wasn't the right style for Josh Giddey.

Vince Carter 14:05

But the one thing that you cannot teach is, in today's NBA, a six foot eight guard who can create and rebound for right now we're gonna say that the shooting is not real. Right, he's a niche player a A 6'8 guard who can create, rebound and knock down 38% from three is a cornerstone. So that is the dilemma that the Chicago Bulls are in. Was it a flash in the pan? You know you bring a guy in, you're like, well, we can get the best out of him. So if you're saying you can get the best out of him and then you see the best out of him and then you still kind of refuse to pay him, where are we in this situation?

Vince Carter 14:53

Matchup data points picture he's guarded by point guards 19% of the time. He's guarded by small forwards 26% of the time. He's guarded by power forwards 18 percent of the time. That 90th percentile in small forward matchups means you can throw him at wing in a playoff series and not panic. His career defensive rebounding rate is 20.9 percent percent among guards, with a 30 percent assist rate last season. The only guy who has that in his dossier is our guy luka donchic. We know what kind of animal luka is.

Vince Carter 15:39

If josh giddy is giving you that, that's not just versatility, that's rare air that he's in. Ash Giddey is giving you that. That's not just versatility, that's rare air that he's in Matchup difficulties face 86 percentile. He's not hiding on defense, he's taking hard assignments. That's what the advanced stats say From B-Ball Index.

NBA Center Rankings with Zach Harper

Vince Carter 15:59

As a big wing who can run the point, they don't grow on trees, unless you're Sam Prest prestey and then they're in your backyard. You just get them. I don't know how he does it. That's what one scout said. So did you pay for the versatility and live with the fact that his rim protecting grades are enough? But here's the thing you don't expect rim protection from your point guard anyway, even if he was 6'8 or whatever the case may be, you don't expect him to be that guy Now if you're putting him in situations where he is now the power forward or he's guarding the power forward. I can understand that, but I think what you have to look at Giddy is Is you have to look at him as a swiss army knife. What he can do is use his physicality to be more of a two-way player with a little bite, that's what he could be so he can deter your guards and your wings and things of that nature, while also giving you a lead ability on the offensive end.

Vince Carter 17:05

This is where we turn to the stock ticker. Now his rookie true shooting percentage .478. Last year it was .570. That's a huge leap over a four year period. That's like a startup doubling doubling its revenue in one physical cycle. Bull's ownership has to ask is this sustainable growth or is this a market bubble? It's not just shooting, it's his free throw rate. It jumped up also to .281 last season, which is nearly double his rookie mark. More he had showed, more aggression, more points, more reasons for his agent to be smiling. He thought that the

Vince Carter 17:54

payday was coming. And again we talk about this all the time. We talk about second drafts, we talk about players needing just a change of scenery. And how many times have we heard coaches say, oh, if we had that guy we could just get him into our system. We can make him better and we can. You know we can work with him to really carve out a niche. You did what you were supposed to do. You got him

Vince Carter 18:21

to that level. So now where are we with the payment situation? Every day without a deal is another day where you are looking, maybe, at a trade. The one thing that you don't want is the thing that's going on in golden state is you don't want, and also in berkeley you do not want your guy to sign the qualifying offer because then you're locked in. That means that there's a no trade clause. Yeah, he's getting minimally paid. So you're winning on that end. When the back end, you know what you're losing. You're losing the player. The player is going to walk

Vince Carter 19:00

out the door. If you are willing to roll the dice and saying that his three-point shooting barrage that he had last year was basically just an aberration, you could do that rim finishing from our guy. 57.6 percent at the cup last season, that's in the 23rd percentile. For a player who creates a ton of rim attempts, that's leaving money and wins on the table. So you start to see where some of the cracks in Giddy's foundations are. With some of these stats. Now, patience is cheaper than hope. If you commit big money now, you're

Vince Carter 19:44

capped out before. We don't have to worry about patrick williams ceiling anymore. But we do have monis buzellas. We do have kobe white to worry about and if he's the guy who's making the real leap and you're saying, hey, that's the guy that I would really want to go ahead and invest in, then come out and say that go ahead and make a trade and trade giddy somewhere else. Now the bull case is this is that passing creation volume is the 97th percentile. Creation quality is at 93th percentile it's 20.38. He has finisher in the league. He might not be the best rim protector in the league, but as far as creating opportunities for others, he's one of the best. If you're in luca lebron tier, that's god mode, son. It's a rare commodity and if you

Vince Carter 20:40

can't draft it. In chicago his win shares were per. 48, were 0.121. That's a career high for him. It's his box plus minus went from negative or negative 0.9 as a rookie to plus 3.0 last season. So you can see the growth and also keep in mind he went through some real struggles in Oklahoma City. There were some allegations that actually seemed to have been debunked. Analytics will say pay the connector before you lose the team also, especially after you just traded Lonzo ball to

Vince Carter 21:24

Cleveland for him. If you believe in the three-point shoot, I would say that you will be looking at something like four years, probably about a hundred to a hundred and five million dollars. That's probably what you're looking at. If you don't believe in the three-point shooting, then you're probably looking at something three years plus a team option for the video and about 88 million somewhere in there. Leave yourself with a little cushion. Leave yourself with a little where his trade value is still there, because somebody might believe in the in the three-point shooting. They might really need the on-ball initiation that he

Vince Carter 22:09

can give you. You continue to delay this. You know what's going to happen. It's that qualifying offer that is. The boogeyman in the building, by the way, is a qualifying offer because you know, once you've done that, you crossed over to Rubicon. If he signs a qualifying offer, it's not gonna be a ton of money. You'd have to almost add something to the trade to get a player back that would be worthy of giving up Giddy. Oh, and, by the way, he would have to waive his no trade. So you are in a rock in a hard place. So hit us up on twitter at frontrunnerpc, let us know. Put in like giddy decision and tell me

Vince Carter 23:00

what you think. This guy in dollar a year guy, is he a 25 million Dollar annual guy? Is he a 30 million? Let us know, be great. Also, you can hit us up on our community page on YouTube, so frpc Vince, or just kind of Google our guys at Harvard. He out here being the ops right now making friends in some markets but making enemies and others. He dropped that top 40

Vince Carter 23:33

list of sinners. Somebody's mom is clipping this article right now and mailing it to her son or sending it via email. Why is our guy 17th and why is your guy 9th? You know a lot of people get into this. We did, we were enthralled. We commend zach harper for being bold, for putting this list together, and now he's doing it with the guards. So

Vince Carter 24:02

we love this. The penthouse is none other. He's got the HOA private chef probably doing DHOs on the balcony Just to keep it sharp. You know what I'm saying. Iron sharpens iron type of situation. Jokic cares about his horses. He doesn't care at all about this list. He wouldn't care about this at all unless his name came up. You imagine this dude's confessional in in a big brother's household type scenario. Call it big man house or whatever. I mean it would be pure shrug energy. It's like I'm here because I have to be here now. Please stop talking to me so I can facetime my stable of horses and you believe him career out of making mvp level dominance. Look like a sunday afternoon jog, no flex, great passing vision and he would make your favorite

Vince Carter 25:06

point guard blush. Jokic's on-off splits last year were incredible. He was a positive 12.3 when he was on the court net rating and without him on the court it was a negative 1.6. That is almost a 14 point turnaround. That's not a gap, that's a canyon. Now you know the 26, 12, and 9. On 58% shooting, league leading offensive box plus warp the kicker is Denver's net rating With him on the floor. We just told you that it was super crazy. That's architectural stability. Everyone else in the house is arguing about who's second best, and that's for sure because jokic is the best center in the league and you're wondering if his horses are getting enough rest between races. That's what he's thinking about his next triple double while you're in mid-sentence trying to like what you think you should be at on this level of food chain. Here's a nice little ditty for you on. Oh man, I said ditty, we can't say that anymore. Huh, damn, here's a fun fact

Vince Carter 26:25

for you then. Yokich averaged more assists per 100 possessions than jamal murray. The center was the point guard and the fuse at all. Get out. Who was number two? Who was in the second tier? In his tier two, he had Victor went by Yama Joel and be questionable

Vince Carter 26:50

and Anthony Davis. Three elite talents, one shared kitchen. Imagine the breath extension between these three guys. One guy measuring his wingspan in the corner and one guy telling you I'm actually not supposed to be cooking in here. Two fantastic years. Right, he had the first year where he kind of came on year one 21.4 points a game, he almost averaged. He averaged more. Ten and a half rebounds a game and almost four

Vince Carter 27:24

assists and three. Now his second year, his encore for that 23.11 rebounds a game, 3.7 assists a game, but the blocks were still there 3.8. His three-point percentage jumped up from 32.5% to 35.2% and he shot more of them. He shot 58.6% on tools and he poses when we might in this tier you feel truly optimistic about, about his long term and what he could look like in surpassing yoke at some point in time. He's the only contestant who wins HOH and sits out two comps and still runs the room like Big Brother style. Winwin's block rate across two seasons is 9.5% to 10.8%. He's literally breaking block metrics that were already designed for Mutombo.

Vince Carter 28:37

Rest in peace. Our guy went healthy 30 and 10, an MVP hardware laying around with a free throw rate at 41.8 percent, bullying defenses wherever he goes. His resume comes with a giant asterisk though 19 games played last season, and that's not just missing a couple. You want him on the court. You're like, if we can get, if you can just squeeze 60 games out of this guy Just 60 games, keep us competitive and then nudge him into the playoffs. We have no idea what we could be looking like in late April and May. 66 games he played in 2022 and 2023. The 24th season he only played 39 games, and then we just talked about the 19 he played last season. Scary times. We've talked about it on this podcast at nauseam. Uh, you know the year where he did play the 62 game or the 66 games was the year that he had the knee injury brought him back and it's just been

Vince Carter 29:51

downhill since then. Concern is AD. He doesn't even want to play center Now. Also, at the age of 31, he played 42 games with the Lakers, nine with the Mavericks. Because there was an injury. He has a game 3.5 assists, 1.2 steals and 2.2 blocks. When he Moved over to Dallas now, his defensive expected was in the 97th percentile. He also was a six point one percent block rate. 80 stretch with the Lakers versus the Mavericks is the cleanest split screen stat of the season. Better scoring in LA, better playmaking in Dallas and the same rim protection everywhere he goes. Doctors have 100% cleared him. He's now doing basketball activities. He lived with monks over the summer, but it's all in the attempts to get better. It's to do everything I can To be the greatest superstar, the greatest basketball player ever to have walked this earth. That's what

Vince Carter 31:04

he's chasing Now. The third tier is a who's who of guys that you would love to have on your team and you don't want to pay them a ton. You want to pay a lot of cash, but not like all the cash. Sam Adebayo, you got Carl Anthony Towns, you got Rudy Golgar, you got Alperin Shangoon, you got Jaron Jackson Jr and the walking double-double himself. Demantis Sabonis Top 10 seasons in defensive win shares, career assist to turnover ratio spectacular. He had a bad season last year. His shooting was terrible and that could have been because he's been working on his range for like the last couple seasons and I don't know if it'll ever be where it kind of needs to be and I wonder if he could just maybe just go ahead and let that go now that kal-el where is there in miami, because I think if kal-el where is, who ma'am is which, which is just a dominating first abandon and also give you that defensive versatility and that defensive tenacity that you always bring every single game. So if Bam is doing that, and then Kaleel Ware can handle, if he can hit league average three point shooting on like decent volume, I'm not talking about taking like eight per game, I'm talking

Vince Carter 32:34

about taking four. Now, carl anthony towns we have had a lot to say about him on this podcast. He rehabbed his image, no doubt, until the knicks ran into the pacers and those walls closed in again. There's gonna be some weirdness. There's going to be some fouls that are questionable. There's going to be some times where you go why aren't you rebounding? For me, karl-anthony Towne shows up again Cats playoff usage drop and what he was able to give the Knicks

Vince Carter 33:09

this last year. Tom Thibodeau didn't want to use any bench whatsoever, so I am really intrigued to see what year 2 is going to look like, especially if he is going to be put at the 4. I do. I am defensive player of the year, and even at the age of 32. Still a defensive rebounding rate north of 23%, and he shot 68.7% from the field. Last year he slowed down a little bit in the rebound department, but the rise of Anthony Edwards has turned him into more of a background character, and that's what it should be, because you don't want rudy gobert having like ample opportunities to score the basketball. He is a type of guy where one for some reason, the hands aren't great. He is a rim runner mostly. You don't want to really have to post him up and give him touches and things of that nature. That is not what he's good at now. If this was the 90s, rudy gogara would be like but now we're in 2025, bub, so unfortunately it's about pace and space and that is not your game. If he can continue this and then basically groom, uh, johan baron, baron jay, where jay? So when he is ready to move on from this contract? Like in size, like in wingspan, maybe not as weird when it comes to making, he doesn't make a ton of mistakes, he's just for some reason Rudy is just not liked universally around the league and I don't know if that's with him being French or they don't like him being a Euro and just embarrassing people by blocking shots. I don't know what it is, but he has had a hard time in the league as far as getting love, what he's meant to the Minnesota Timberwolves over the last three years that he

Vince Carter 35:26

has been there. The next guy on this list is Alperin Shankun. Now Alperin Shangoon won the war right, he is a surprise contestant, no doubt, who's walked out as a pawn and somehow became HOH and he controls all the votes right now, 22 years of age. He posted 21.4 points a game, 11 rebounds, 54.5% shooting deep. We didn't know that was in his bag. He showed it last year While keeping his uses at 26.2 on a playoff team. Two years ago everyone thought Jalen Green. Jalen Green was going to be the guy that the Rockets was going to build around. He was the golden boy. Now Shingun is the one hosting strategy meetings in the kids A step season. He's literally cooking Cooking. Shingun's on-off offensive rating swing was 10.7. The Rockets literally played like a top five offense with him on the floor and a bottom 10 when he wasn't

Vince Carter 36:45

on the floor. We're looking at Jokic style numbers. Look our guy. I don't care if Shingun was in on on that nail position and then having cutters come through and finding open shooters. This is guy who they're going to be building around. This is guy that you know katie's going to look for as far as creation on the ball and things

Vince Carter 37:05

of that nature. That brings us to jaron jackson jr. What did he year? Well, he stayed out of foul trouble for the most part he played. You know what I'm saying. A lot of things went on for our guy. Did he shoot 37%? Yes, he did. Did he only average 5.6 rebounds For a 6'11 guy? With all that athleticism, that was also true. One and a half five blocks per game yeah, I mean, he did his damn thing. You know, being a rim deterrent. Now, taylor jenkins did not survive the season really stepped up to the challenge last year even under the most duress on the defensive end. Like I said 1.5 blocks a game. He also had a handful of steals and things of that nature. He was all over the place. He's a guy who you can pull out on the island against a smaller wing and live. To tell the tale, lots of improvement for our guy jared jackson jr. Lots of improvement for our guy

Vince Carter 38:13

Jaren Jackson Jr. Now Sabonis for the Sacramento Kings. You know what I'm saying. He's also like an Alcren Shangoom type dude, loving that nail hitting cutters and all of those type of things. 13.8 rebounds a game, backing up 19 triple doubles Sick numbers. But the problem with sabonis is this is that he does not offer any rim protection whatsoever. So if you have somebody who is 611 like a skyscraper, but if you're going to continue to trot out keegan murray as that guy, sacramento is going to probably end up where they ended up At the end of this year, which

Vince Carter 38:54

is playing Now. Here's the other thing. With that they just got tremendously worse on defense With Zach Levine and DeMar DeRozan. No disrespect to those guys, derozan is in his mid 30's. Where do you keep him in your tier policy if he can't give you anything on defense except he's literally I want to say about six foot eight. You know. If I'm being real, they'll tell you he's 6'10, but he's probably closer to six foot eight. But his heart, his determination to get rebounds, that's part of defense as well. You get the ball for your team. How long can you go with a six foot eight center and you don't have really any rim protection whatsoever? And your point of attack defense has gotten significantly worse, with Zach Levine being a guy who is gonna probably have to contain the point guards, you know, depending on if Keon Ellis is there or whatever the case may be. I

Vince Carter 40:03

loved his passion. Zach Harper did drop some jewels in this one. In this tier you have Evan Mobley, avisa Zubach, quazingus, oh, and Chet Holmgren. Now Mobley made the leap last year Threes at a respectable clip of 33.7%. His box plus minus was absolutely off the chain was absolutely off. The chain he had was 22.3 points again, 11 rebounds, almost four assists. He shot 63.3 percent from the field and, yeah, he was out there doing his thing. With the offense being what it was last year, you can see why they waited patiently for this and hopefully it's only going to get

Vince Carter 40:53

better from here. Avista zugwatch did something really spectacular. He didn't reinvent himself, but what he did is spammed himself. Zugwatch was supposed to be a role guy set screens, rebounds and they thought pg was going to be. So who was going to take some of that scoring punch? Well, we saw Norman Powell do it, but the other person who did it was Avisa Zubach. This dude almost averaged like 12 boards a game. He shot 64 percent from the field and you knew the range was never going to be more than three or four feet away from the basket, but he still dominated, still did his thing. He had a defensive uh rebounding rate over 30. He found me all defensive. Second team, now zuboff's played in 80 games. That'll just let you know. With all the stuff going on, with as big as he is with, with the physicality that he plays with, for him to play 80 games, it's truly remarkable, especially in this day

Vince Carter 41:57

and age of. Guy was a critical piece to the final piece of what okay sees championship puzzle was forming a terrifying twin tower set up with our guy Chet Holmgren. His offensive rebounding percentage was 11.2. His defensive rebounding percentage was 29.6. I mean, he was a machine when it came to the boards. Now, christoph Porzingis, on the other hand, he had kind of a tough year last year. He was in Boston coming off the championship glow, perfect stretch, big for what Boston wanted to be and what have you. But because of some mysterious illness, my man played in 42 games. They quietly salary dumped him to Atlanta. So Atlanta is hoping to get that dude, get that guy back. He also shot it almost 63% overall, so he was a devastating three point shooter. You had to obviously leave him alone to be able to do that, but depending on where you are, especially now he's going to Atlanta, where there will be space for him, there will be the opportunity to pick and pop, but he has to stay healthy, like that's got to be the thing. Like this, whatever it was kind of immune deficiency situation. I don't know what was going on, but he was out of action for the longest period of time with the Celtics last year. What's interesting is that he missed his entire rookie season with an ankle injury and then he played 82 games the season after, which was last year, but came back in time to run shit in the playoffs and get his team to the championship round, where he

Vince Carter 43:52

also was instrumental. Switching on to guards, switching on to small At OKC wanted to do on the front end and also on the back end Of their defense. It was brilliant On his part the other guys in this tier Is that there's so much upside, it's just can you stay on the court? You know, I think, christoph karzingas but what he did a couple years, couple years prior, that's kind of his zenith of where he's going to be. His rim protection and finals you literally just block everything. He's definitely going to be in that top tier

Vince Carter 44:33

at some point. And then you would say, what about daniel gaffer vince? What about him? What about what he's able to bring to the dallas mavericks? Well, it all depends on whether anthony davis is still like resisting playing the five, even though we all know that's his best position. Daniel gaffer's led the league in dunk percentage. Literally he finished with more than half of his shots as dunks. Think about that. Now jacob purtle played on a very, very terrible now. They started off like a house on fire and then kind of fell back to the pack or whatever. He's an invisible glue that only shows up when you watch the tape. You either are not a fan of glass wall or you don't live in toys highlights,

Vince Carter 45:22

all of them. I love this list. We didn't get to every last guy. But the thing about it is why I love this list is just the conviction that zach har had. We went through like 15 of the guys, items that we need to get to

Heat Trade Highsmith to the Nets

Vince Carter 45:35

the Heat traded. Highsmith to the Nets. Haywood. Highsmith is off to Brooklyn. Miami ships him and a 20-32 second round pick for a protected, no rotation help. Just bookkeeping. Nets is taking your Give me your tired, give me your poor. That's what they're doing. They got. They're the only team that has any money left. So yeah, like you know, little mid-level exception contracts or whatever. Go talk to Brooklyn Because they can take that on. Let's keep it plain Miami got cheaper by trading Highsmith. They slide about 4 million million under the first under the apron and they pocket 5.6 in trade exception. Barry

Vince Carter 46:23

jackson nailed it. If this was the first time in a decade where miami's willingness to weaken their roster, it didn't soften the blow at all. You lost two stars last year in all the upheaval of Jimmy Butler. Now his 2023-2024 vs his 2024-2025 splits tell the story. He went from 20.7 minutes to 24.6. He bumped his threes from 3.1 attempts per game. Now for brooklyn's classic cut, 22 million below the floor. They had to do something, so they scooped up highsmith 8, the expiring 5.6, and tacked on another second round pick to their growing war chest. Remember, the Nets are already added to, first this summer and now and this wasn't even about Highsmith, as you're starting for, this is about basically keeping cover for this is while Basically keeping cover For whatever trade is going to come next For them, because if you don't think they're looking at a trade, you don't think Sean Marks is out there Trying to scour the universe To get a star To Brooklyn With Durant, kyrie and James Harden. Hopefully you did. Hopefully you're not trying to do the exact same thing

Raptors' Leadership Change and Future

Vince Carter 47:51

as you did. The last thing that I want to get into is the Raptors situation, and they had a clueless offseason. Raptors fans, let's call it what it was this last season 30-52. Whew, face plant, no playoffs, no playing, just vibes. And now Toronto is running the season with straight out of clueless ingram quickly rj barrett, yaka perto. When you look in actuality together, it's like, uh, as if bobby wester has just become the new president of person of player personnel. Masai Jerry has been fired. Uh, obviously that happened over the summer and it was a couple months ago, but they just gave our guy Bobby Webster the title. It just brought in, like Brandon Ingram, but he didn't

Vince Carter 48:51

really do anything. Toronto's 30 wins to relevance seems like a long shot. This is sheriffs closets moments. Everything looks fabulous when you scroll, but half of these fits don't match when you wear them. So, with majuri being fired, let let's be real. He was the culture shaper. He turned Toronto into a destination, swung the Kauai deal and brought home the only chip in 2019. But now the steps are being taken

Vince Carter 49:27

by Bobby Webster. Bobby Webster, tumor shot share solid, steady, lackable, but no one was given the movie its style Keith Pele, who is the CEO of the Toronto Raptors and basically all the sports situation that goes on in Toronto. And this is in Bobby Webster talking about Bobby Webster, the states couldn't be higher. Fans aren't just grading Webster on contracts, they're grading him on this. Franchise has peaked in 2019. And then they were just going to the depths of the sea. At this point, when you talk about like they're starting five, and you talk about scotty bars making 38.6 million and you got ingram quickly making 32.5 million dollars, rj barrett making 27.7 and yaco perdo making just a hair under 20 dollars, locked up in five guys and you can't even touch the plan with that. And here's the kicker ingram quickly and rj all signed their deals under masai. Now bobby, now he's got pay off all this debt. When masai went on that spending spree, bobby was stuck with the receipt. Continuity isn't

Vince Carter 50:51

free, it's expensive. Let us be clear the Raptors offseason was mostly paperwork. Is Colin Murray boils who was number number nine overall pick. They signed Elijah Martin in round two. They did a bunch of exhibit 10 flyers on David Roddy, olivier Saar, tyson Dickenhart. They lost Chris Goucher to Boston. We will see what they can get out

Vince Carter 51:23

of Brandon Ingram. And he learned anything in his time off. Are you going to shoot more threes? You know it looks like they are trying to run it back. I don't know why. Team was not that good. This wasn't a makeover, this was a touch-up. Drafted defense, extended the center, kept the GM and that's it. No other news to report. So you're going to see a lineup with Scottie Barnes, brandi Ingram Quickly, rj Barrett and Porto. So we're going to zoom out

Vince Carter 52:01

on the Raptors. It's not just a team, it's a Maple Leafs, sports and entertainment. It's the Crown Junior of Canada, it's basketball's megaphone and Webster said the job is a one of one. He's right. Toronto can call can sell itself as more than wins. But here's the thing you don't get ratings. You don't, and that's the thing that people need to understand when we talk about the toronto raptors. You got all this salary tied up and all these guys and they're on deals where it's not close to the end with brandon engelman is

Vince Carter 52:45

just beginning actually. So how do you get out of this? Where does the respite come from? Owners, like stable margins? Are you going with ownership? And who? I mean? That's really where. Remember in the movie clueless, where shares big realization it wasn't christian, it wasn't elton, it was josh. All along, maybe Webster was the answer, sitting right in front

Vince Carter 53:13

of their face. Continuity doesn't trend, but it builds trust and I'm talking about a 30 win team. You know, you can tell. You can tell fans all they want. Like you know, if you don't go out and get that guy who is going to come off your bench and you were so Worried to give up, like first round capital and things of that nature, what do your fans say? You know Messiah went out and got Kawhi Well, okay, kawhi, well okay. Kawhi is different from 7th dude in your rotation. You gotta

Vince Carter 53:55

be very true. At this present time, webster fits the politics better, but the politics don't win games. Players do, so what is it going to be? Is it billed as a fresh start? If it's billed as a fresh start, what are you doing with the players that you have currently? How bad can you let this get? You just wonder what the heck you're going to get out of Manuel quickly that justifies that contract that he's getting. Maybe you can squint and see a 42 to

Vince Carter 54:33

44 win team. Worst case is Ingram gets hurt again, which he does every single year. Barnes is stagnant, quickly still looks overpaid and RJ stays streaky as ever. And now you're back to a 30-win team and some ugly talk radio Just saying and too bad to contend. It's the kid that in February 1 of Ingram, rj or quickly is in trade rumors because this roster is isn't balanced enough to stand pat. Somebody's gonna be making the tough decisions, and we think that guy

Vince Carter 55:16

is Bobby Webster. Now what he makes as far as these decisions are concerned is going to be the next step into whatever the next iteration of the Toronto Raptors. I mean, I don't know who would want to keep any. Get into some sort of like Out of the first 20 games You're still 15-5 or whatever, but I don't know if that's going to happen. I do not know If that's going to happen. So here's the last piece of this thing and then we can get up out of here. The Raptors identity is at a crossroads. They have a lot of contracts that are held. The franchise is Chubb and Grant and the Raptors they play the Knicks and they take on the Heat In December. So I wonder how, how tied they are to their start. Does that make Any of their decisions any difference?

Vince Carter 56:30

You just wonder. Because here's the thing that, like, people don't want to talk about whether messiah jerry was on the hot seat or there was some philosophical differences or whatever the case may be. Just making no mistake about it in 2019 he brought them a title and now you can say he rested on his laurels. You can say, whatever case may be, the one thing that you have to understand is that you gotta be willing to make bold moves when they come along. You gotta be, and hopefully it all works out. Hopefully it

Vince Carter 57:06

all works out. But now, if you are the toronto raptors and you're bobby webster, you're trying to get yourself off some of these contracts, which is going to be super hard to do, because a lot of teams don't. They don't have the cash space to take these guys. And then the other thing is is that the willing tracks that you have, because quickly making 32.5 it's going to be hard pressed to to, you know? Uh, trade him off now. If you were attaching an asset like tracks right there, you gotta hope one of the other guys pops, one of the younger guys pops that are on a rookie deal. So then maybe you can say I'm really interested in like and I can attach a manual quickly to it and they can get off a salary that's 34, 35 million or whatever the case may be. That's the only way

Vince Carter 58:00

to do this. Or hope that brandon ingram such an awesome, awesome comeback year and then you can trade him for pieces and or draft capital. It will be hard, but I wonder what Canadian fans are thinking. Basketball season just waiting for hockey season to start all up and go watch the Eagles Connect to Jurassic Park and start all up and go watch connect to jurassic park. Can we bring back the echoes of what happened in 2019? Only time will tell. But with that being said,

Vince Carter 58:37

that's our part. Uh, special shout out to saraya who's uh in mass. Uh, on some personal business. Uh, our hearts and our love go out to her. Um, we want to thank maya for what she's doing, contributing to the pod, and all our frpc crew. Now also, if you have multiple frpcvince at gmailcom, hit us up there, like if you want to lean in, do so. The other thing is this is that you want to make sure that you're being a friend, telling a friend about the podcast. Grow the podcast with us. You know

Vince Carter 59:24

what I'm saying. Also, make sure to download, make sure to leave us some five star ratings, make sure to leave us a couple comments, either on the apple pod or spotify. We will read those and we always keep it gangster. We always keep it like this for you. If somebody sends us a tweet or a follow-up on something that we talked about today and it's good enough, guess what? Friday's pod, you'll

Closing Thoughts and Support Request

Vince Carter 59:54

get it right. Uh, the best part of you is you make sure that you surround yourself with super positive, super supportive of you and looking after your well-being and have your best interests at heart. If you have people like that in your life, make sure that you appreciate them, make sure you acknowledge those people that exhibit those behaviors and if you're doing so you're making that happen and you would ask me how do I do that? Well, it's real simple Send them a text, call them, facetime them, get together with them, and if you're doing all that, you're a well rounded individual and we would love to have you on our team For Maya who's holding it down. I am Vince, and this has been front runner podcast collective on a tuesday. We will see your ass back here on friday. Deuces.