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All-In Wedding Photography
The business podcast for wedding photographers who want to build a booking system that works.
If you're tired of feeling stuck and alone in your business, this podcast is for you.
Join wedding photographer Alex Stead with co-host Ren as they break down funnels, marketing, pricing, and business strategies together in a way that actually makes sense.
New episodes every Thursday - hit subscribe so you never miss one!
All-In Wedding Photography
Clients Need You To Have Boundaries
Have you ever felt that gut-wrenching sensation of letting someone down by not being immediately available? You're not alone.
Perhaps most surprisingly, we discover that clients typically don't want or expect 24/7 access to you. They understand work-life balance, often better than we give them credit for.
today's episode was actually a call-in question. Who said she listens to this podcast and said I need to know how to put up boundaries without hating myself. So the question was how do I put up boundaries of my clients without hating myself? Very important distinction there. Because you can. I can give you all the tips to put up boundaries, but if the problem is that your nervous system can't handle boundaries, it doesn't matter. The two gotta go hand in hand. And that's the not fun part of running a business is that it's not really all business. A lot of it is just emotional and regulating yourself and going to therapy and learning how to like just be a grounded, regulated person. Therapy is now a business expense, absolutely. Can we claim? No, you can't claim it.
Speaker 2:Well, you can. Well, some people have insurance Right, right, true.
Speaker 1:So there's just like some. I just have some notes, yeah, the first being if you can't put up boundaries for yourself, can you instead trick yourself into doing it for your clients?
Speaker 2:Hmm, but my clients love that I don't have boundaries they actually don't.
Speaker 1:Your clients are probably stressed out because you're not putting any like, you're not telling them what to do and when to do it, and so they have to guess, and that's not kind. Making people guess how to get in touch with you or how to best contact you or book you, is not a kindness. That's creating indecision, kind of like a difficulty. So instead being like you know, upon the very first message, telling them how to talk to you and how to communicate with you best, it's the same as, like you're getting into a relationship, right, and if you're dating somebody and they don't tell you that they hate texting but you try to text them and they never text you back, you're like, oh my God, like this person hates me versus this person's up front and is like I'm not really a texter, I'm more of a caller.
Speaker 2:Okay perfect.
Speaker 1:You can work with that. You know that information. I think it's the same for business owners. I don't ever text my clients. That's not something that I do. My preferences are number one email, number two Instagram message. So I let my clients know upfront hey, the best way to get in touch with me is through email. If you're an Instagrammer and you want to shoot me off a quick message there you can, making it really clear that that's how I like to be communicated. Therefore, my clients typically communicate with me over email or Instagram. Right, they know where to find me. They're learning how to do business with me and that's good for them. It's good for me.
Speaker 2:What else do you got in your?
Speaker 1:notes. The most important thing is to learn to sit in the discomfort of feeling like you're disappointing people by putting up boundaries, so maybe that boundary is. A client texts you at, like, 10 pm on a Friday, not responding to that client until Monday morning, or responding with a hey, I'll get back to you Monday morning, in the moment can feel like a piece of garbage. It's really important, though, and you have to learn how to deal with that feeling like a piece of garbage. It's not that you can't say the thing, it's that you don't want to disappoint somebody. How do you deal with that? How do I deal with that like having that awkward conversation around putting up boundaries around, like your time or the way you're communicating?
Speaker 2:A lot of the time I'm just like hey'll, I'm gonna answer when I'm back to my computer yeah, I don't feel like you have quite the same emotional response yeah, I've like what do you, uh, I?
Speaker 1:like what do you mean? Like for some of us, it feels like the client is murdering us.
Speaker 1:Like for some of us it feels like the client is murdering us, like I feel like I'm like it's like I'm killing a puppy when I tell them I'm going to message them back on Monday morning. It's this deep feeling of like I'm letting them down and it would be easier to just answer this email or this message or whatever it is that they're emailing me about, on Friday night than it would be to like say, I'll message you Monday morning.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't think that I have the killing a puppy feeling. I just imagine how I would receive it. Like if somebody, if I message somebody and they were like hey, like I'm not at my computer, I'm outside of work hours, I got this, I'll answer Monday, I'd be like, cool, yeah, same, oh yeah. So I just assume that's how people are going to be. Yeah, I think if they are like really persistent, I get a little defiant about that remember that thing that a therapist told me once people won't ask more than three times yeah, people won't ask more than three times.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they won't ask more than three times but there are exceptions. 99.9% of people won't ask more than three times If you say no and if you are clear, yes, the being clear is important, so I think you can feel like sorry, you can feel like you've said no and that person, the person who's asking, has no idea that you said no yeah, I think a really common one in my industry in wedding photography, um, a place where the photographers really struggle with in general communication is clients asking when their photos will be ready.
Speaker 1:And, to be fully honest, I put the blame entirely on the photographer in that, because if you are not clear up front about when they can expect their photos, of course they're excited, of course they want to see them. The back and forth is only because you are not being clear enough. So, like when I finish a wedding and I send the teaser, the preview gallery I put in, you can expect to see all your photos on or before and I give them a date. Right, that's eight weeks. So in eight weeks, with the date in brackets, if a client were to message me which rarely, if ever happens asking when they can see their photos, I just say the exact same thing you expect them on or before this date. If they were to keep asking me, they're going to get the same answer, so not going to get a dopamine rush from asking me more right right, there's no, there's no point in continuing to ask.
Speaker 1:Another point that I was going to make is boundaries are kind to your clients also and kind to you.
Speaker 1:If you can uphold them, you're actually a lot less overwhelmed, less busy if you have time set aside each week even if it's like not every day of the week, but maybe like two days a week to go through and clear out your inbox, right like get to inbox zero a couple times a week, rather than always trying to be on top of it and then like missing things or forgetting to respond or not giving a great response, being like no, on monday mornings from like 10 to 12, I'm going to respond to everybody and give everybody a really solid response.
Speaker 1:That's a kindness to your clients and to you. This is where, like this really goes twofold, where, like, your clients are going to get a better, more regulated, less overwhelmed, like clearer response from you. And, like I find, when I'm not upholding my own boundaries and I'm just responding to messages willy-nilly, I don't really have that time set aside. I will often miss messages because I'll check my email, I'll read a message, I'll draft something and I'll be like oh, I need to sit my computer for that actually, and then I'll leave and it will sit and it'll be marked as read.
Speaker 1:And then if they message me back, I'm like my god, I'm so sorry, I was just gonna say like a big reason that I don't play, like I don't do any like back and forth messaging if somebody's messaging me on facebook that's why, like facebook and texting are really hard for me, because I get notifications on my phone all hours of the day, and so I will often like I'll read it and I'll like be like, okay, I'll think about the response, and then I won't send it. I'll be like, okay, I'll respond to this in an hour or two hours, and then it's just like it's gone. I don't have the ability to like market.
Speaker 2:I say in those messages, if they come through, I'm like give me your email or email me here, same. That's that's just where I have to do business, that's just where I have to talk about this. Um, I don't tell clients the reason and they might think that it's like you know, keeping it organized and all that. Absolutely my like, my, my, personal, most honest reason is if I don't have my spreadsheet pulled up and my booking calendar next to the email, I'm going to mess up your inquiry. A computer screen with my calendars. I need the spreadsheet. I need, like, all the information that I need, because it might feel like somebody's asking are you available and how much is? It is a very common right and you want to be like, oh, I am available and it's this much.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but I'm not logging it and it seems so simple, but when I'm doing that on my computer with my undivided attention, your inquiry is going into a system for me. I'm making sure through. Like that, not only am I available for your wedding date because I don't have other wedding books, weddings booked, I'm also available for your date because I don't have any person Like. There's your personal calendar, there's your partner's personal calendar, which is always super awkward when you're like I'm so sorry.
Speaker 2:I know I had said I was probably available and yeah, actually it's like my mom's having a 50th birthday party or something right and I gotta know, like, where's the location, what's the time of ceremony. I gotta know a lot from you to be able to cross-reference everything.
Speaker 1:Yeah and I want to like, just add, like I'm not perfect at this and I don't think perfection is possible with, with a.
Speaker 2:With all of that said, like with all those you know, all the windows open with all the information I need, I still have an, a margin of error.
Speaker 1:I think, to recap and tie this up in a nice bow yeah, having boundaries is good for your clients because when they are getting a regulated, grounded not overwhelmed, not stressed version of you, they are having a much better experience with your business. It's totally okay to respond on a friday night with being like I will get back to you on monday and making a note or just leaving that until monday. There's nothing wrong with keeping things to business hours. The next point is setting time in your calendar to respond to messages once, twice a week to really like catch up and again, this is kind of like just being realistic. If you can commit to like two, two hour blocks a week, I think that's like probably better than most people are doing.
Speaker 1:Honestly, like yes, it would be ideal to get back to every inquiry within an hour. You can like auto responses are totally fine. Like you know, I'll go back to you within 48 hours or whatever, and having clear communication and just being very up front with what your communication style is and how they can expect to communicate with you just sets the stage for easy breezy being. Like you know, I'm an emailer. I email typically between these hours. You can expect a response within 48 hours, and what it comes down to is like commit to what you can actually commit to and be realistic with your time and your ability for access 24 7. Oh, that's fine. You don't need to be able to yeah, yeah, okay. One really good example of this is I'm going on a trip.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:By the time this podcast airs, I will be on my trip Hiking, hiking Big, big dream of mine. I'm going for two weeks. I would love to take this time to kind of test being a little less accessible. Again, I was on a call with a client last night and I'm doing my thing where I'm like, and if you need me like, you can message me on Instagram, you can do that and she stopped me and she was like if I haven't needed it in the last year, it can wait two more weeks, yeah, and I was like I love you so much, but also like she's right, like she shouldn't have to be the one to tell me that no Right, have to be the one to tell me that no right. That should be me being like you can hear from me when I get back, you know and her being like have a lot of fun if you need me no, you don't.
Speaker 1:Well, she was like if I need you, no, I don't. Like that's what that was her. She was like I don't need you. Like go enjoy your fucking vacation.
Speaker 2:Like, stop working I feel that way.
Speaker 1:When service providers like our clients want us, I I don't know, like whenever I have anyone I've ever worked with as a service provider, like when I'm the client, I look at them. I'm like I hope you're enjoying your life. Yes, like I hope you're doing well, I want you to be having fun and I love when I see them going on vacation or doing things or like spending time with their family. I'm like, yes, girl, I get it, that's good.
Speaker 2:Like I don't know it should be this, it's the same. If I need you no, I don't know it should be this, it's the same. If I need you no, I don't. So that's great, okay. So, alex, yes, rani, this was about boundaries with clients and why it's actually for your clients.
Speaker 1:Yeah, why does boundaries have such a weird connotation? Because all it is is just setting expectations. Yeah, that's's all a boundary is? It's not like this big crazy thing. It's just like here's how you can expect to talk to me and expect to communicate with me, and it's it's really just kind of putting a a really kind this is how you're going to be taken care of. So it all comes down to regulate your nervous system. Learn to sit in the discomfort. Therapy is a business expense. Yeah, and something I'm working on too. This is not something that you're doing alone. If you're feeling this, you're not the only one. I think I've had this conversation with probably every business owner I've ever met. So it's really not not even business owners.
Speaker 2:people who have have jobs, their bosses are emailing messaging, texting, kind of love, feeling busy and important enough that you have to be answering a client, even if you're like it always comes down to that, like what's the real reason here? Isn't that like? Doesn't it feel kind of validating? Yeah?
Speaker 1:it's like I'm working, I'm important to answer this, yeah.