Extra Section at the Gus Grissom Memorial

I found astronaut Gus Grissom's Gemini spacecraft in rural Indiana.  Inside the Spring Mill State Park is the Virgil I Gus Grissom Memorial.  My guest on this Extra Section episode is Wade LaHue who manages the property.

Transcript

Paula: 0:01

For the Best Aerospace Era this is mansplaining. Here is the host Anthony L. Sealey

0:10

Welcome aerospace enthusiast to this extra section episode. Now the US has over 6,000 state parks. In these parks, you will find hiking trails, natural wonders, and historic landmarks. I wanna tell you about one state park that something more, something unexpected. At this park you can see a pristine lake view, scenic hiking trails, a recreated pioneer town. And a real Gemini spacecraft that was commanded in orbit by one of the greatest astronauts in history, an astronaut who helped open the door to outer space. This is Spring Mill State Park. Home to the Virgil I Gus Grissom Memorial, located in Mitchell, Indiana. Our guest today manages and maintains the Lakeview Activity Center and the memorial dedicated to Gus Grissom. Welcome everyone. Wade Lahue. Alright. Thank you so much. It's great to be here Anthony. Thank you for coming on Mansplaneing. Now before we get to the Gus Grissom and the memorial, tell us about Spring Mill State Park and how you came to work here. Spring Mill State Park is uh, an exceptional park here in our Indiana State Park system. It's our. Sixth Park, uh, we're coming up on the Park's hundredth anniversary here. And, uh, so 1927 to 2027. So we'll be doing a lot of celebrating. I am grew up, uh, nearby in Salem, Indiana, and so remember coming to Spring Mill for field trips and stuff like that. We had family gatherings here visiting the Pioneer Village and. Uh, picnicking into butternut and Sycamore shelters. I started my DNR career actually at Hardy Lake State Recreation Area. Um, I worked at the Dwight Chamberlain Raptor Center. Uh, I worked all the way from a volunteer cleaning, feeding, picking up bird scraps and cleaning bird poop off the walls to, uh, managing that facility and rehabilitating, uh, hawks and eagles and owls. I lived there in a residence and took care of the 13 education animals and. I, uh, met a girl and got engaged and she lived in South Bend and I lived in, around Madison, Indiana, Austin, Indiana. It was a four hour drive, so, uh, PO Kagan State Park in northern Indiana opened up, and that was a closer commute, so I moved in with her, and then we were working at, she does the same work that I do. So she was at Potato Creek State Park and I transferred to Po Kagan and then, uh, McCormick Creek State Park. Opened up in Spencer, Indiana, and that's the park that she started at. It's her favorite property. It's Indiana's first State Park. She's very passionate and Spring Mill was open at the same time and I grew up here in the community, you know, in Salem and, uh, knew the park. So we both double transferred out of Po Kegan and Potato Creek and came to McCormick's Creek and Spring Mill. So that's how I came to be here for last. Year and a half now. Awesome. All right, and just for reference, spring Mill State Park is located in Mitchell, Indiana, about one and a half hours south of Indianapolis. According to the internet, Mitchell has a population of around only 4,000 people, but it also is the birthplace of Virgil. I Gus Grissom. Was born on April 3rd, 1926. Can you gimme some background and the character of Mitchell, Indiana? Well, like I said, I'm from Salem, so I didn't grow up here in Mitchell. Most of my experience before working here was just driving through on the weight of incenses. It's a small town. It's originally a planned town, so they planned it on the railway. Um, so it didn't, it didn't come up on its own. They built it here on purpose. Uh, but for a small town, my experience with Mitchell, it is a bold town. It's a, it's a small dog with a big voice. They, they get a lot done here for, for the community. Very engaged, very proud history. Um, and a lot of people who. Work very hard to maintain the integrity and the image of the community. So it's a, it's got a lot of character. The Persimmon Festival here, uh, is a big event. Right. And the community loves Spring Mill. Uh, we have a lot of great support from the Community Foundation and uh, just the folks that come out to support our events and. And attend. So we've got folks who have been coming here for almost as long as the park's been here. They've been coming as family reunions and things like that. So there's a lot of history between Mitchell and Spring Mill and like I said, very passionate community. Despite maybe not being the biggest town, it's got a lot, a lot of passion, a lot of heart. Gus Grissom was announced to be one of the Mercury Seven people knew his face, people knew his name. He became a national celebrity. But I don't think that many people could point at a map and tell you where Mitchell, Indiana is. No. Now at the memorial, I really like how you profile his entire life. What are some of your favorite exhibits from Gus Grissom's early life? Yeah, so we try to. Uh, position the exhibits in the memorial so that you walk through the years. and so we start off with exhibits, you know, pictures of him as a child and his childhood home. Pictures of the community and what Mitchell was like, uh, at that time. Uh, the, I think the most exciting exhibit, the, the key part of that early section that we talk about when I give field trips and we give tours, we have a selection of his, uh, report cards from when he was in school. And it's always good to, to show those, you know, people think about the perfectionism, you know, that goes along with a career like his and, and the things, the, the excellence and quality of, of working hard and. You know, not everybody starts off their life in a position, uh, where they, where they're maybe thinking that way. So he, his report cards aren't perfect scores, you know, he didn't get perfect grades and everything. And, uh, it's, and I think it's. At least in my mind, it's encouraging to give that to students who come to the park so that they can have that to relate to maybe if they've got lofty goals and aspirations, and, and big dreams. You they don't, it's okay if they're struggling in math or, or writing or something.'cause even heroes like Grissom, you know, they started off with struggles too. So, yeah. I believe it said he had a C in English. I think that's all. Yeah. Now he was a scout from what I see in the exhibits. So is it possible that he camped here as a kid, or did he ever bring like dates as a teenager here? Uh, well, yeah, we know that he came here as, when he was young. he was in scouts. We have a lot of artifacts from his time in scouts, pens and things like that. We can talk more about that here in a little bit. But, um, he, uh. Was born in t uh, 1926 and the park was founded, like I mentioned in 1927. So he, and the park grew up side by side, living into the community. It was a big part of the community. And so I'm, I'm, you know, he came here and spent time here growing up at the park. As far as the date, I, I don't know, maybe very possibly, but I don't have any written or, or evidence that I'm aware of, uh, of, of, of that. So. One other thing I like about the exhibit is a lot of people gloss over astronauts aviation career before they've joined nasa, but y'all don't do that here. Can you tell me about some of his exhibits from his aviation career? Oh, yeah, sure. Um, we've got pieces from, uh, so from a young age, Gus was, very passionate about flying. He, one of the, the trips his family took was the family went and knew someone who had a plane and they all took a ride in the plane. And this was a big, big keystone event in his childhood. They say that later on he had a birthday and he got a BB gun for his birthday. And he took it back to the guy who owned the plane and traded him the BB gun for another ride on the plane. So he enlists in the army. He wants to, wants to fly. so he enlisted in the Army right at the end of World War ii. So the war ended before he got to get off the ground and make any progress towards his aviation career really there. But that put him in line for the GI Bill. So when he came home, he went to Purdue. Uh, right as he, you know, goes through and gets his degree there, right As that part of his life is ending America's in another conflict, the Korean War. So he enlists, uh, and serves there. We have his dis distinguished flying cross on display. Um, some of the other, uh, um, amenities, his Bow Randall knife, that was made, part of his career later on. And we have a whole section about his time, uh, in Korea with quotes from him and his experience about not realizing for the, for the first time he was being, it was under fire, not realize he thought it was something, maybe it was wrong with the plane or there was an issue.'cause he didn't recognize the trace rounds. It took him a second to figure out that he was being shot upon. So he serves there and earns his cross and returns. So after, after Korea, he goes, um, we have a section on the test pilot. Uh, he actually came back and he started working, with the, air as an air, plane instructor right. To teach others to how to fly. But he had a wife and a son. And at that time, that was considered one of the most dangerous. Occupations that a pilot could have. So instead of teaching others how to fly, he decides to pick the second riskiest activity and goes, and he goes to Edwards Air Force Base in California and, uh, gets training to be a test pilot, to test out, uh, you know, new aircraft. So just slightly less dangerous than teaching other people how to fly. And then he comes back to Wright Patterson in Ohio and they live there and he. Tests out a lot of different aircraft. We've got models of several of the craft that he piloted in his time in Korea, or test piloted, uh, there. And of course that would go on to be one of the, the attributes that allows him to qualify in mercury. Yeah, that's great that y'all show all that. Also, I wanna mention that before you went to Purdue, he was working to install doors on school. Buses. That's right. Carpenter, uh, was a plant here in Mitchell, Indiana was a big, uh, business. Uh, they made a lot of different types of buses, but they made school buses, predominantly and he was putting doors on, buses. So, and he did not enjoy that. That was after, after he came home from, his time. That was before he went to Purdue. Yeah. He was working on that. And he was, he, he was not happy. Betty, Betty talked about him, how displeased he was with that work. Yeah, I liked in that video y'all mentioned how he was not content with just installing doors on school buses, but there is a theme of doors and hatches, which we'll get to later on. Now before we cover the displays on his NASA career, I wanna bring this awesome quote up you have from Gus Grissom. If we die, we want people to accept it. We are in the risky business. We hope that if anything happens to us, it will not delay the program. The conquest of space is worth the risk of life. I love this quote. I get the sense that Gus Grissom, who was one of the best test pilots and one of the most important astronauts to the program, knew this endeavor for space was bigger than himself. It was worth continuing no matter what the risk was. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that, you know, having that in the memorial for people to read, especially young people. I think this is a sentiment today in a, in a age of, you know, independence and it's a very self-oriented culture and that we live in, you know, there's a lot of selfies and self-help. Um, not to say that those things don't have value, and it's, it's a wonderful age for those, those mindsets. But this is a thing that, that, you know, this was a time of. The group and the goals being more important than the individual. I think a, that sort of way of looking at things, seems bold and outlandish maybe to some today, and it's important to, to bring these universal, or at least at that time, this patriotic, you know, thing that so many people were, were involved in as a community together. Right. And, and the evidence of that comes through when? Gus talks about the importance of the the mission over the importance of his own individual life. Now let's talk about the scale model of his Mercury Redstone rocket in the Mercury display. Yeah, so, uh, that's actually from Betty. His wife. She donated a large,, number of artifacts. So a lot of our collection is from his wife, Betty Grissom. Uh, and the, the Redstone Rocket, uh, is one of those artifacts. Of course, uh, he was selected, right? Like I mentioned, when we talked about being a test pilot, his. Test pilot hours and service there helped him to qualify to be part of the Mercury program. So they invited a certain number of different people that qualified. They reached out to them and gave them the information. They did physical tests, they did psychological tests and whittled that number all the way down to the Mercury. Seven. Right. And Gus, of course, was fit all the criteria in the categories, uh, to be one. So he, uh. Is the second of the Mercury astronauts, uh, after Alan Shepherd. So he, his flight, uh, early on the goals, you know, we we're, we, with the hindsight, think about the program and the fact that Apollo would take us to the moon, right? Think about all the things we've done now in space. But the, the goals of the Mercury program were as simple as to put a man in space and for him to survive. That was pretty much the line that we were, were trying to cross. So the first two, Alan Shepherd and Gus, both of their missions were very short. They were sub, they weren't orbits, right? So they sh shot them up and they fell back down and that was all the tests was. So only about 15, 20 minutes. So. Alan goes up, becomes a national hero. He's the first American to make it up into space. Gus's test, and with each of the tests as, The, the Mercury program would double each test. So they would do one Allen Shepherd's flight to go up and come back down. Gus's flight was the replica to make sure that that wasn't a fluke, and you could do it more than once. So each, each of the tests was in two stages. So Gus's test, of course, was to go up and come back down. Uh, unfortunately his was a little bumpier than Alan's. He went up and he came down just like we expected. All was well. But when he came down in the Liberty Bell, uh, which was the name of the craft landed in the Atlantic, uh, the door, uh, came off. So there were bolts fastened into it that had explosives, so the door would be bolted on with explosive bolts. And the idea was that in the case of an emergency, Gus on the inside. Or crew on the outside could deploy the explosives and pull, knock the door off in case they need it in inside. Otherwise, the, the proper opening is at the tip of the capsule. And there was a chute that he would have to go through to get out, right? So that would be the preferred method of entry and exit. So Liberty Bell hits the water and the bolts detonate and the door comes off. And so the craft starts to fill up with water. Gus swims out into the Atlantic and the helicopters comes in and of course, deploys the chains to, uh, attach and pull Liberty Bell out. And the craft has filled so much that it begins to tug the helicopter down. So they have to cut the cables and abandon, and Liberty Bell sank to the bottom of the ocean. Gus floating next to it is waving frantically at the helicopter, and the pilot takes that as a sign that he is safe and they're free to try and haul it out. He's waving because the ports on his suit are also open and his suit is floating with seawater, so he's sinking. So luckily the second craft comes in and is able to pick him up and take him over to the aircraft carrier where the ship was waiting. So NASA was a little displeased. Uh, they had expected, that Gus must have panicked and deployed the bolts to get outta there. And the, it wasn't until 1999 that they were able to dredge up Liberty Bell seven, and it's generally believed now that he's not responsible. And it was a wiring error and the impact with the ocean water and caused the door to come off. Yeah. I am glad you brought that up. And there's part of a quote that you have that I wanna mention here. He says, after the water started flowing in, he says, I've never moved faster in my life. In the you everyone's seen the spacesuits that they wore. It sounds like a nightmare trying to tread water in one of those. Oh, absolutely. Yes. Now let's talk about your center attraction, the Gemini three, the Molly Brown, the actual spacecraft he commanded in space on March 23rd, 1965. What does it mean to have Gus Grissom's Gemini here? Oh, it's an incredible, you know, uh, privilege. It is the centerpiece of our, uh, exhibit. It was built, you know, into the building when they, they brought it and lowered it by crane into the center of the building as they built around it and stuff. So it's, it's a, a great honor and a great privilege to house an artifact like that and to, to care for it. And it's, it's, you know. A display has changed over time. The, the, the quality and condition as we've had these artifacts longer, we've learned more about how to take care of'em, and we've continued to update the. The standards of which we, we preserve it. The case there was case around it, humidity monitor fires or the, the, the, that monitor the, humidity and things like that. We have a light monitor that monitors how much light can enter it and interact with it.'cause the, you know, back then. We didn't know what, what, you know, they would be like and how they degrade over time. But as we've had these, these artifacts longer, we continue to make those updates. So, uh, it is, it is his, uh. Craft, I mean he, after Liberty Bell, of course by that point we'd already decided we were going to the moon, right? So we needed the Gemini program, uh, as an interlude. It was a lot to think that we could take a 15 minute up and down that he was doing on the Liberty Bell and somehow turn that into landing on the surface of the moon. So we had a lot to learn. So after the Liberty Bell incident, Gus was very active, very engaged with the construction of this graft. He went to the McDonald facility in St. Louis and was on the ground working all the time with the engineers. They called this, uh, the Gus Mobile, right? The Gemini Craft was, was nicknamed the Gus Mobile. And you know, we take that as a good. Nickname or kind of a condescending one. He was apparently a pretty dri driven task master about the things that he wanted. He fought and advocated for more astronaut control. Right. There was a big push that, that, you know, from the, the other side that most of the rocketry in any. Piloting that should all be done from the ground. And Gus pushed the other way and wanted to advocate for the control and the maneuverability and the, the astronaut's ability to interact with the machine and get it to function, uh, as their their needs. They're the ones that are up there. They're the ones, you know, they've got the hours and the test pilot and the training,, to do it. And so he advocated for that on the ground and at the McDonald facility. So he actually wanted the craft to have wings that could be deployed so they could pilot and land the Gemini craft so that they wouldn't have to be won and done. They didn't obviously go for that, but that was an idea that came back around if you think about space shuttles, right? That Reland wing. So he, that was, he was. Early on advocating for things like that, Yeah. I really love just looking at it. You can get an up close view of it and you can look at. This is where he sat. This is where he designed to where he can reach this control. He can reach that control. He is flipped that switch. It's amazing that you can just have it and it's not a model. I've seen models, but this is the actual space graph. It's amazing. Oh yeah. And I don't know much about musicals, but he named it the Molly Brown because, or the Unseeable Molly Brown after a play. That's right. Yeah. He names the craft. Uh, after the, so it's about the Titanic. Molly Brown is a character who, who does not syn with the Titanic. Right. So, uh, NASA does not take that very well. So that's, that's part of the, the Gemini three, uh, struggle. So they, they were not happy with the name'cause it was a play off of the fact that the Liberty Bell seven. S San and then his hope was that this one would be unsinkable. So NASA was a little frustrated. And then of course, John Young Gemini had two astronauts, whereas Mercury Craft only had one. So Gus, Grissom, and John Young went up. John Young had a sandwich. He had a sandwich so that he pulled out, and so that one of the things that were tested in the Gemini program was food and what kind of food you should eat in space. And he had a corn beef sandwich from Wolf's, which was the diner near the. The base and he brought it up, snuck it in his spacesuit. That's not the kind of food they were supposed to be testing. So, but he pulled it out and Gus took one bite of the sandwich. They passed it back and forth in there, and it was just oil everywhere, you know, from that greasy sandwich inside. So they, they packed it away. No technical issue from the sandwich. But NASA was also not pleased with that. So. And also you have the Titan two Missile Scale model, which I think is awesome, but we'll get back to the scale model here soon enough. Yeah. Now we have to talk about a difficult subject, the tragedy of Apollo one. Yeah. Um, really a dark day for the American Space Program. The first real major accident. Uh, after, you know, taking the lead on the Gemini program, Gus was put in charge of the first of the Apollo missions. So he and Ed White and Roger Chaffee were the three. So again, we've gone up from Mercury one astronaut, Gemini, two astronauts to the three astronauts of the the Apollo. And, uh, there was a big change between the Liberty Bell Seven's design and Molly Brown's design to this new Apollo craft. As far as the wiring, the structure, the, the way it was made. John Young even mentions in our, Uh, display a video that plays about, there were a lot of concerns. All the astronauts involved knew that there was a lot of wiring issues and concerns, and he makes the, you know, the comment that they were astronauts, they paid him to fly. They didn't pay him to worry about wiring. So there were a lot of concerns internally about the, the, that system. So Apollo one's mission was just to do a lot of tests with this new equipment to orbit the earth as the others had with this new craft. Uh, unfortunately, they're on the launchpad. The, uh, doors were, sealed, uh, from and would open inward. So instead of outward to try and prevent an accident like Liberty Bell seven. So the doors were sealed, uh, they were on the launch pad doing an exercise, doing just pre-launch all the way up to launch, and then they would leave. So after a long day inside of there, they're talking about how, you know, uncomfortable stuff is, and. Uh, there a spark from the wiring inside the capsule. The oxygen environment in there was a hundred percent oxygen in that capsule, and with the door pressurized, they couldn't open the door from the inside. And, uh, all three of the astronauts passed away. it was a really tragic story and this, we had to learn this lesson, a painful lesson about the. We gotta make sure the wiring's better. And a lot of people pointing the fingers at North American who made the, Apollo spacecraft. But I wanna bring up this story'cause the Soviets learned this in another painful way. All the way back in 1961, there was a Cosmonaut named Valentin Bondarenko Now part of their training, they would be putting in a, a chamber, you know, in a pressure chamber by themselves for 10 days and they had a oxygen rich environment. And on the 10th day he started taking off his sensors on his chest to monitor his heart and whatnot. And he used,, a piece of cotton, which was soaked in alcohol to help rub away, you know, the, the sticky part that held on the sensor. And he just absent it madly, just tossed it. And it happened to land on a, a heating plate, which he used to make food. He landed on that instantly. He was engulfed in flames, and this was 1961. And he, uh. He actually lived a few hours, made it to the hospital and agonizing pain, but he died not long after. So that's why the Soviets didn't use oxygen rich environments either. And, yeah, there was no way for them to warn NASA even if they wanted to, none of the engineers because they'd be treason and they'd be shot.'cause this is the Cold War and you're selling information about top secret, you know, space, age, technology. Also, one other story I wanna bring up, uh, Roger Chaffee wasn't originally on this crew. It was supposed to be a astronaut named, Don Eisele, but he suffered an injury to his shoulder. So his backup, Roger Chaffe took his place, which is interesting story I just recently came across. there's a reason why Gus Grissom was on this crew. He was the prime astronaut. Like, this is a prime crew. This, this crew could have been to the moon. Absolutely. Yeah. We would be talking about Gus Grissom instead of Neil Armstrong. Absolutely had this, you know, not occurred. Now, do you have any special events planned for Gus Grissom's, what would be his 100th birthday next April? Yeah, so it was, it is coming up. Um, I can't put forth any details right now. We are gonna plan, you know, at least some activities, I guess you could say unfortunately for the, the, the program here, I'll be on new parent leave. So I will not be here in the park to oversee that, uh, activity. So we'll have some options, uh, put together and I'll be working with property management to get those squared away before I leave on new parent leave. But, uh, we will have an event yes, on his birthday, uh, in April. That sounds awesome. Well, I wanna share a few thoughts I have here at the end, but in the meantime I want to thank you for coming on talking to us on Mansplaneing, and I wanna thank everyone here who works on the Spring Mill State Park and the Virgil I Gus Grissom Memorial, who maintain it and keep this place running. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much. I highly recommend you come visit the spring mill state park. After you come through the interest gate, you will see the Virgil I. Gus Grissom Memorial, right on your right. Check that out. First, learn about his life and accomplishments. Look at the exhibits from his report cards to the scale models of the Red Stone, the Titan two, or the Saturn five rockets, and of course, the Gemini three. Afterwards, go hit the hiking trails and see the lake, the caves, the pioneer town and the cemetery. I recommend you bring a date, your family, friends, or come alone and get away from technology and social media. We all need an escape from that. And where else in the country can you experience the Pioneer age and the Space Age in one place? And here are just a few thoughts I have on Gus Grissom should know his name and know his story because he was one of the greatest astronauts during the best aerospace era. As I said before, there's a theme of doors in Gus Grissom's. Life from installing doors on school buses in his hometown in Mitchell to the hatch that inadvertently blew open on his Mercury Liberty Bell seven to the hatch of Apollo one that tragically cannot be opened in time to save him, ed White and Roger Chaffe. But for Gus Grissom, the most significant door in his life was the door he helped open to explore space for America and mankind. I'll close this out with a profound quote from Gus Grissom. If we die, we want people to accept it. We're in a risky business. We hope that if anything happens to us, it will not delay the program. The conquest of space is worth the risk of life. Thank you so much for listening, and remember, there's always a light at the end of the runway.

Paula: 30:48

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