
Mama of the Wild Crew Podcast
Mama of the Wild Crew Podcast
Hosted by Alexis Schmoker – wife, mama of two, nurse, and Jesus lover. This podcast is all about embracing the beautiful chaos of motherhood, finding joy in the messy moments, and leaning into faith through it all. Whether you're navigating sleepless nights, toddler tantrums, or the everyday miracles of raising little ones, you're not alone. Join Alexis as she shares real-life stories, heartfelt conversations, and encouragement to help mamas everywhere find grace, laughter, and purpose in the wild adventure of motherhood.
Let’s find the joy in the chaos—together!
Mama of the Wild Crew Podcast
Church Hurt, Cringey Photoshoots & Bingeworthy Shows: A Conversation with Elizabeth Hert
What happens when church trauma shatters your faith, but motherhood calls you to rebuild something authentic for your children? Today's raw conversation with my high school friend Elizabeth Hurt dives into exactly this tension.
Elizabeth, now a mom of three spirited girls (Holland, Lennon, and Iverson), opened her heart about the devastating spiritual trauma her family experienced. The aftermath had her and her husband questioning everything they thought she knew about faith. But rather than abandoning belief altogether, she found herself becoming what she calls a "spiritual newborn" – stripping away the performance of religion to rediscover what genuine faith actually looks like.
"I just want my life to be the proof of Your love," Elizabeth shares, explaining how she's moved away from the checklist Christianity of her past toward simply loving like Jesus. This transformation hasn't been quick or easy, especially while raising three young daughters who need their own foundation.
What resonated most powerfully was Elizabeth's approach to protecting her children while nurturing their spirituality. Having experienced "church hurt" firsthand, she's intentional about empowering her daughters with agency over their bodies and teaching them their voice matters. "That is your body," she tells them firmly, ensuring they know they can always speak up if something feels wrong.
The conversation takes a beautiful turn when we discuss how motherhood itself becomes a path back to authentic faith. Elizabeth shares how seeing her cousin live out genuine Christianity without judgment became more healing than any sermon could be.
Between motherhood chaos, rebuilding faith, and finding herself through creativity with her business Wooden Okie, Elizabeth reminds us that healing isn't linear but it is possible. Sometimes, the very things that broke us – in her case, religion twisted by human failure – can be reclaimed in healthier, more authentic ways.
Whether you've experienced church hurt, are questioning your faith while raising children, or simply need to know you're not alone in the messy journey of motherhood, this conversation offers both validation and hope. Join us for this heart-to-heart that proves sometimes our deepest connections come through our most vulnerable struggles.
Follow Wooden Okie by Elizabeth ⬇️
https://www.instagram.com/woodenokie?igsh=MXM4a3cybTN3YWl6
🎥When Christians let you down- Craig Groeschel
https://youtu.be/mzpzMCLfuv4?si=H3amcu7zEdG8t5IJ
🎥Why Do We Need the Church- Matt Thomason
https://youtu.be/Agydv4QYdPs?si=htfokS3A-i5iR_rX
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XO, Alexis Schmoker
Mama of the Wild Crew
📸: A heartfelt thank you to Jordan Allen of Cr00ked Teeth Photography for capturing this stunning cover photo.
Welcome to Mama of the Wild Crew podcast, the podcast where we embrace the messy, wild, beautiful journey of motherhood together. I'm your host, alexa Schmoker, mama of two beautiful kiddos, wife, nurse and lover of Jesus. Motherhood is full of hard moments, unexpected chaos and those days where you just really don't have it all together. But in the midst of it all, there is so much joy. On this podcast, we're diving into the real, honest conversations about motherhood the challenges, the triumphs and everything in between. We'll hear the stories of incredible moms from all walks of life, share wisdom, laughter and let's be real probably a few tears, and we're going to discover how to embrace the joy in this chaos. So, whether you're rocking a baby to sleep, folding that never-ending pile of laundry or sneaking away for a quiet moment with your coffee, welcome mama. You're not alone here. Hit, subscribe and join me on this wild adventure of motherhood. I can't wait to do this journey with you. Hey, wild crew mamas, and welcome back.
Alexis Schmoker:Today's episode is extra special because I get to sit down with someone who has been a part of my life since high school and now, all these years later, we're walking through motherhood together, kind of like reconnected. Elizabeth Hurt is not only a mama of three fierce and fun little girlies Holland, lennon and Iverson, but she's also a creative soul, a faith fighter and the heart behind wooden oaky. Whether it's crafting that birthday magic or navigating the raw and beautiful mess of motherhood, she brings honesty, humor and a whole lot of heart. Her story is one of rebuilding faith, finding joy in the small things and raising daughters who are not both just, or who are both princesses and wild adventurers. And I just know you're going to connect with her, like I do.
Alexis Schmoker:We're already cracking up over here who are both princesses and wild adventurers, and I just know you're going to connect with her, like I do. We're already cracking up over here, so let's welcome my sweet friend Elizabeth to Mama of the Wild Crew podcast. Hi, thanks for having me Of course, tell us a little bit about yourself and about your husband and your girls.
Elizabeth Hert:Okay, yes, I'm Elizabeth, my husband is Channing and then, like you said, I have three girls holland, lennon and iverson. They're four, so everyone's about to shift in age too. So it's about to be five, three and four months. So I know that's a good everyone's all close together yeah, you know cozy and uh, yeah, been married for 2013, so almost 12 years this year. That's crazy.
Alexis Schmoker:I remember going to your wedding yeah, you were like kind of one of my first friends to get married. Do you feel like that?
Elizabeth Hert:20 we look back and we're like that was too young, but it was great it was great it worked out, but we couldn't even like have champagne at our wedding. We had chocolate milk.
Alexis Schmoker:It was chocolate milk, we were babies. Yes, yes, I remember that, but it was so pretty, it was like a barn-esque theme.
Elizabeth Hert:I look back and it was so Pinterest-y, which I still love, yeah, because I'm like maybe not what I would do nowadays, but you know like wedding style.
Alexis Schmoker:But I look back at your wedding and you're not like oh my God, yeah, yeah, it was pretty, so cute. And I was telling you too that I remember like a time whenever we were in Nottingham.
Elizabeth Hert:Like someone was driving around. Do you remember this?
Alexis Schmoker:I don't remember we ran into Chan and you guys were like in the talking yeah.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, we were like in the talking. Yeah, yeah, we were always like texting back and forth and he would like. He's just like a serial flirter like he even stills like my grandma and my grandma he's always like hitting on them and flirting on them like he's just, like he's so funny and he's a charmer and so yeah, we would always just like text on and off and it would just like never, we'd never hang out yeah, and then he just it was.
Elizabeth Hert:So it was like after we graduated yeah, like finally, he just invited me one night I don't know if I told you this story. I was like working at Andalini's at the time and I had homework to do from starting college and he texted me and was like come to the church, this thing at the church at OFA. And so I was like, maybe, like I have homework, and he was like, just come up there. So I like came when I got off work or something, so it was like nine o'clock at night and they had had like a concert and it was already over and so then, I was like talking to him and like Jason Boggs and everyone was there
Elizabeth Hert:then they were like all right, now, come to Waffle House with us. And I was like I'm gonna come on Waffle House, I just want to go home. And he was like I'm going to come to Waffle House, I just want to go home. And he was like, get in the car. And so I got in the car, like we went to Waffle House ate and then like he drove me back and I like got his hoodie I know it was serious. It was serious and he like dropped me off my car and he just like kissed me and then drove straight to my brother's house. Because they knew him, because my brother's wife, michelle, worked with him at JCPenney's and so she was like, oh, she would always be like Channing's asking about you and like who you're dating and stuff.
Elizabeth Hert:I'm like whatever, he's always just flirting you know leaving me, and so I drove straight there and I was like Channing her just kissed me and they were like what that?
Alexis Schmoker:Oh, I never knew that story. I also love that you worked at Andalini's and you worked at JCPenney's, because I feel like everyone in Owasso. I did not work at Andalini's because I was, you know, a Baja Jacks girl. But all of my friends worked at Andalini's.
Elizabeth Hert:Like everyone that I know. Yeah, literally. There's even girls under me, like at Target, that are young and I'm like they're like we. I've worked at Anne Delaney's before. I'm like, listen here. It's like a sorority.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, I used to be, you're like I'm at the sorority of Anne Delaney's, I'm paying away for you at Anne Delaney's. You are and I was, like they probably don't. And that's such a shame for them.
Elizabeth Hert:I should put a picture up in the back. I should have a picture Like I made this playlist this playlist that is still playing.
Alexis Schmoker:I made that, did you really?
Elizabeth Hert:That's great I limewired that baby. Yes, yes, you're welcome, yeah, you're welcome. Yeah, you're welcome. Ever was our last anniversary gift. I actually got him a black and white framed picture of a waffle house like it's just a cool picture of like waffle house and I gave it to him and he made him tear up a little bit.
Alexis Schmoker:Yes, I got him. Well, and do you listen to the jonas brothers?
Elizabeth Hert:yeah, we play that. The girls love it too, so I love, okay, jordan, and I love jonas brothers.
Alexis Schmoker:Oh man, they really came back they were good back then and then they came back and I was like well, I wasn't a jonas brothers man like back in the day and, to be honest, I kind of it was like selfish. I feel like I was like too cool or something I was like.
Elizabeth Hert:I mean, they were kind of like we were it was on the table yeah, growing up.
Alexis Schmoker:Um, but man, I love jonas brothers. We went to their concert last time they came to tulsa and I was like that is the best concert I've ever been to in my entire life.
Elizabeth Hert:Oh gosh, so good, like it was just like fun, and oh my gosh, and they're just so talented and I was sitting there like I felt.
Alexis Schmoker:I felt convicted by the jonas brothers. You started putting your hands up like amen, yes, so good.
Alexis Schmoker:Hey there, wild crew mamas, some super exciting news. If you're like me, these days any day is a hat day. Literally probably every day is a hat day, and we have two new hats for mama of the wild crew podcast. I am so excited, and huge shout out to my sister-in-law, brie, over at smoky designs, for taking these ideas and bringing them to life. We have Mama of the Wild Crew podcast hat and we also have the cutest hat. It says motherhood is my ministry. And ain't that the truth, guys, head on over to our Instagram at mamaofthewildcrew underscore podcast, dm me or comment on one of the posts and let us know that you want your hat today.
Alexis Schmoker:Growing up, our parents had a super special tradition. We kept this big stork in our garage and whenever someone, either in town or one of our friends, had a baby, we would all load up and go over to their house and put this stork in their yard to help them celebrate. It was one of my favorite childhood memories and my sister, addison Sewell, has carried on that tradition. She is the proud owner of Owasso Storks, offering personalized stork deliveries to families celebrating the arrival of a new baby, whether it's a baby announcement, a baby shower or to celebrate the birth of a little one, owasso Storks is the perfect thoughtful, sentimental gift. There are even options to celebrate proud big siblings and even those furry little family members.
Alexis Schmoker:For a sweet, memorable gift, reach out to Owasso Storks. Check them out on Instagram. That's at Owasso Storks, at O-W-A-S-S-O-S-T-O-R-K-S, and you can find their contact info in the show notes. Guys, this is just the sweetest gift. I have personally been blessed by a stork from Owasso Storks before. Owasso Storks was a thing and it was just the sweetest thing. So definitely reach out to Owasso Storks, okay, so we're going to get into the podcast question. Um, so you know, literally we were texting last night because you and miranda are going to that movie theater in bixby that has like the playground to see lilo and stitch. So we took the kids last weekend to it and that play we'd never been there and you can like get up on, like know how they have different levels in a playground.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Alexis Schmoker:So Crew like climbed up on the level and there's like a spinny wheel, so she grabbed onto it and like flipped upside down like she was being a monkey or whatever, and I saw her and I was like, oh hey, crewsy, like look at you Cute. Well, anyway, let go to wave at me. Boom, it was like five feet.
Elizabeth Hert:So far that was our first, big like boo, boo, like that.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah. So of course, jordan's like looking at her like frozen trying to assess the situation and I like go in the playground with it's not easy to get in there.
Elizabeth Hert:It's not easy to get in there.
Alexis Schmoker:No, and of course there's so many kids because it's like the grand premiere of lulo and stitch yes um, and she's losing it and there's just blood everywhere and that makes it worse.
Elizabeth Hert:Like yeah because it's so vascular, you know.
Alexis Schmoker:So like it was her mouth, her nose, everything. So we finally got settled um, but that was my mom, phil uh, surrounding what you guys are doing today. So have fun, yeah, be safe it was.
Elizabeth Hert:It was a nice morning yeah, be safe anyway. What's your ball? Fail, oh man I kind of have two, okay, okay, one for each kid yes, yeah okay.
Elizabeth Hert:So for holland, one time we were at fantastic island playing on the you know splash pad, doing the whole thing. She runs up to me and she's like look, and she has candy in her mouth and I was like hey, where'd you get that? And we were there with our friends. I was like did michael give you that? And she was like yeah. And I was like okay, cool, go on, she's eating it. Then later I went up to our friends and I was like hey, did you give holland candy? He's like no, I'm like went back up to her. I'm like where did you get that? And she's like on the ground and it was like like jolly rancher, ish. So I'm like there's not something that was like stuck to that and yeah, so yeah.
Alexis Schmoker:Just blue mouth.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, I knew when, I saw it because I was like why do you just have random candy? You know, yeah, and it was a random candy, yeah.
Alexis Schmoker:It was a random candy. Yeah, it was fun.
Elizabeth Hert:Immunity you know, yeah, you just build it up that immunity. Yes, oh. And then Lennon she, when we were in Target, you always let your kids stand in the basket, you know it was like easier. At the time, Holland always wanted the seat they would fight, so Lennon would just stand up. It should be like one and a half maybe, and I was trying. So don't get that Target Circle app because it distracted me it distracted you.
Alexis Schmoker:I was looking up deals on my phone to try to scan Before I was telling you I'd like. Still, I don't know what it is, I haven't downloaded it, but anyway it's saving.
Elizabeth Hert:Here you go, this is your saving. Oh my gosh. So I'm looking for the deal. I'm like that and all of a sudden I hear a guy behind me go like like that and it's because she's climbing over the edge and she falls to the tile floor. Yeah, bawling my eyes out because she had to hit her head, and thankfully, like a person checking out and a lady who worked there, came up to me and they were like we're nurses like, I just want to let you know, like let me check her out, she's fine, and I was like, yeah, made me feel better.
Alexis Schmoker:They came up to me, yes, oh, and then you're like feeling guilty, oh man so guilty so now I'm like don't you dare stand up in a basket you know, yeah, they want to ride on the edge all the time I'm like ptsd yeah, well, crew fell forward out of the wagon one time I think I remember you saying that story, yeah yeah, so yeah, we actually just yesterday we were at the park and she was like standing on the front of the stroller and we were like sit down because one time, one time you fell out of the wagon.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, okay, so you and I've known each other since high school and back when we were wrapping ankles and fetching ice and making gatorade ice too, watching svu on our breaks and doing photo shoots. Because everyone, everyone, I think listening to this is at the age where you did a photo shoot. You did and you know you did with your camera, at the park, with your friends, you did. Or at sleepovers.
Elizabeth Hert:When we did it for the managers and like the trainers, a desperate house. I think back to that. I'm like, why did they let us do that? That was so scandalous. Why did they let us?
Alexis Schmoker:do that. Oh my gosh, we're going to have to find that picture and share it with you guys. I don't know, that's not how I saw myself. It was so random for us to think. Or how I see myself in the future. Yeah, okay guys. So we were athletic trainers for the sports teams and we decided to do a photo shoot for, like our calendar stuff, I guess. Yeah For like the program or something right For the program, as Desperate Housewives we all had like apples in our hands. Yeah, I didn't even watch that show.
Elizabeth Hert:I mean, I wouldn't have had any reference. It must have just been big. It definitely was big at the time, I don't know.
Alexis Schmoker:But yeah, we did that at Jenna's kitchen, yes, which is such a beautiful kitchen, but yeah, anyway. So now here we are, walking through motherhood, looking back. Did you ever imagine life would look like this? I did not.
Elizabeth Hert:No, that's crazy, that's so crazy, even just saying, like our story me and Channing me, like there's, that wasn't even on my radar, you know, until I like met him and like got up with him, thinking about having like kids, kids and yeah, that's crazy, oh man.
Alexis Schmoker:And we both walked through just like crazy high school boyfriends and stuff, and I think back on that and I'm like, oh yeah, I think if one thing I could like teach crew I don't even know how to approach this, but like just dating intention, that's like one regret. I have Obviously everything worked out for me, but just like dating more intentionally or protecting your heart better.
Elizabeth Hert:I don't know Like me teaching them to be like less of a people, pleaser.
Alexis Schmoker:Like.
Elizabeth Hert:I feel like they're going to be strong enough to be like boy bye you know kind of thing yeah.
Alexis Schmoker:Like yeah, we were sneaking in the locker room to check boyfriend's phones while they were at practice. Do you remember that?
Alexis Schmoker:I mean doing the thing, doing the thing, and why did we put up with that anyway, I don't know. But okay, so when we first started talking about like you coming on this podcast, I remember you told me like you felt a little inadequate, and I'm glad that you said that, because I feel I feel that way, like quite often, even like doing the podcast or posting on social media or anything, I feel like, oh, who am I to like do this? I guess. Um, but Channing was really like the one that you said encouraged you to go on and share, and you said to me like that's the beauty of it, he meets you where you're at, like you don't have to meet his expectations and his love for you. So I love that.
Alexis Schmoker:And then also, I've been watching the chosen lately. Okay, have you watched that? You guys need to watch it because I feel like it puts it in such like different light or perspective. Like obviously you read the Bible, you know the stories, but something about like watching Jesus and the apostles and everything, like you really see, like these are just some ragtag guys, right, like Like visually seeing it.
Elizabeth Hert:Yes.
Alexis Schmoker:Visually seeing it and like connecting with the characters and you're like wait a second, Like they also were, like I don't know what I'm doing, right, you know, like Just human.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, they were just human you know, and like they were flawed and imperfect and really didn't know what they were doing. But the whole thing was that they had faith, yes, they were following, even though they felt inadequate. And I mean, we all are inadequate, we are, we're equipped through him, right. So I like that. We kind of talked about that, yeah, because I'm like that's something I was struggling with too. But what has it been like for you letting go of the pressures and just being who you are, in your faith and through your motherhood?
Elizabeth Hert:I think that's like generally the only way like I have that's a coming back down to like roots and like even walking through it. Like I still have to tell myself like it's just like about loving Jesus, almost like that's what I tell myself, like that's it, you know, yeah, like I'm there's gonna, I'm gonna do things that are people don't agree with or but like as long as true to myself, like I just love, like Jesus.
Elizabeth Hert:It's like the we've been listening to a lot of for king and country and it's the proof of your love song like that's what that's just been hitting home for me, because I'm just like, I just like want my life to be like the proof of your love song, like that's what that's just been hitting home for me, cause I'm just like, I just like want my life to be like the proof of your love and I and that's not what it used to be for me, like my faith used to be like, how can I look the part and how can I, yeah, how can I play it and how can I be perfect?
Elizabeth Hert:And oh, I'm, I'm inadequate if I do an X, y, z, you know, kind of thing, and it's not that at all and that, I think, was not. You know, like I didn't get any love through that. I mean, I did, he loved me, but like to myself, like I didn't let it hit deep because I just was like so worried about the looks of it and how to play the part and the emotions and you know so just coming back and just being like, just love, love like Jesus and love Jesus, and that is pretty much yeah.
Alexis Schmoker:That's kind of how we are too, Because our church, their motto I guess I don't know how you would say it Mission statement, whatever it may be is love Jesus and love like Jesus. And it's so simple. Yes, but it's something that literally like we have to, we say multiple times a day, I say to myself multiple times a day Sometimes when literally, like we have to, we say multiple times a day.
Alexis Schmoker:I say to myself multiple times a day, sometimes when I'm not feeling like it, you know. But then also, like crew understands that too Like it's something that like it's so simple that I understand, jordan can understand, we can get really deep with it but also, it's so simple to where, like, you can tell your kids that and like, use it in daily language and talk about it. King for King Country, are they the ones they have a movie, don't they?
Elizabeth Hert:Do they have a?
Alexis Schmoker:live movie. I feel like I heard them talk about it one time on another podcast.
Elizabeth Hert:I need to see because, honestly, I haven't listened to them for a while and when I went back to see they had a bunch of soundtracks. So I imagine that you're probably right and I feel like maybe is it Rebecca.
Alexis Schmoker:Is that who's in it? This might be completely wrong information, but I think someone has um a book that they just put out with their husband too, or something, and it's one of them or something. Yeah we'll have to look it up and if this is wrong guys, don't quote me, because it might be, but I think it might be right.
Elizabeth Hert:So you're on.
Alexis Schmoker:You're on the right page I might be on the right page. Yeah, yeah, so we'll have to watch it.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, yeah I saw them at uh frontier city, I don don't know. Six years ago or something it was like one of the best concerts I've ever been to Really One of their main albums. I don't know that was around that time that has Fix my Eyes on you, which is like one of Lennon's favorite songs, right now Like we get in the car. She says fix my eyes. That's what we play.
Alexis Schmoker:It's been fun listening to them again.
Alexis Schmoker:That is fun. I think some of it too and this might not be true for all like young girls, because I see girls that do not like walk it out the way that I did. But I feel like just maturity to you know, whenever you're younger like I was listening to a sermon earlier and it was talking about just like how there's different ways that christians can I don't know not like look like Christian, like we think so one of them is just like being a baby young Christian, like you're just not mature yet, and so I think that comes with time, um, and just fixing your heart on Jesus and not saying that, even though we're 31, 32, whatever, like we still have maturing to do, you know, and there's things that we still mess up, and so I think it's just giving yourself grace too, but repenting, because, man, you're always going to be imperfect. But that kind of leads us into like a little bit more of a heavy topic and I want to like go in with a disclosure that we are not like pastors or preachers or experts at all on this topic, like this is just us talking about some experiences and like maybe thoughts or things that we've learned or how we hope to look, but we're going to kind of talk about church hurt like quote unquote.
Alexis Schmoker:Church hurt, I guess, is kind of the phrase that people say because it's so real and I know many listening have experienced it in one way or another. And, liz, your story involves deep spiritual trauma, like on a very large scale. Please share as much or as little with listeners that you would like. How did walking through this with Chan impact your marriage? How has your motherhood played a role in slowly rebuilding your trust with God? And now, as a mom of three girlies, how are you finding ways to protect them but also empower them with faith, even though you're still healing yourself?
Elizabeth Hert:It's hard, it's still like figuring it out, like when you're saying like maturity, I'm like a newborn you know like back into faith. Um, I guess, just like starting from it like I grew up in church, but it was like, like you said, just casual. Like we went to a Baptist church when I grew up and we would I think we would probably go every Sunday, but like I was sleeping in the pews, you know, and like.
Elizabeth Hert:I don't think I was. I didn't go to Sunday school and stuff like that. I would go to like a BBS or something and then, like into high school when we moved here, I would go to like youth groups, like hang out. I definitely got stuff out of it, but it was still again just casual, like my family wasn't going on weekends. No one's like encouraging me to have like a personal relationship. I remember one of your episodes and she said that like she never had, like no one was teaching her to have personal I knew what church was.
Elizabeth Hert:I knew what God Jesus, everything, but like no one taught me how to be.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah a figure in a book. Right, that's what she said.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, not not like not like your deep personal yes and so that I mean I went to like a church camp and so everything just surface level ish, you know. Um, yeah, and then when me and Channing got together, he, his family members, were involved in the church like pastors and assistant pastors, and so then I was like that again, where it's like I need, okay, I need to people pleaser. I'm like how do I? Because when we first got together, I remember his mom being she doesn't care, I guess, if I say this because but she being like they didn't want us to be together, because I'm like not involved in the church with them and stuff, even though he was like rowdy, you know, you had no idea but he was.
Alexis Schmoker:He was like the church kid, like whenever I think back, like that's how I guess one of his identities not his identity, but one way that he was known was like being the. He's a pk.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, he's a pk yeah, and so the pks are wow, yeah, but and so like I remember not feeling like good enough to be dating him. So then I'm like how do I transform into the person you want me to be, which is like I'm going to dive in, and we don't say any cuss words? We don't watch movies with cuss words. I'm down. We're crossing off the boxes Right, and not really because I think that spiritually it will help us, but because that's what we're supposed to do.
Alexis Schmoker:That's what we do.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, that's what we do, which puts strains on our marriage too, just because I'm like controlling it and nagging if, like, these things are happening and like not being a free spirit person, like it's like do these things, you know, which is what he grew up with too, so he's like this is not fun.
Alexis Schmoker:You know yeah.
Elizabeth Hert:But that's where we're deep into that. I mean I did start to develop like more than just like a surface level relationship too by doing that, like it's easy, like read the bible and like okay, I'm getting something out of it, but also still just walking. You know, talking the talk, walk and anyways. Then we had some stuff come out. It was like seven years ago maybe where um a family member we found out and was sexually abusing a child in his family and looking up to that person as a pastor.
Elizabeth Hert:Then I mean that just yeah, rocked his world and our world on many different levels right you know levels of man hurt, and so I just um, I don't know how much longer after that when it came out, but obviously that's a struggle and he already didn't. Wasn't like because he had grown up in it and it was controlling like, wasn't like he was super deep into church or like his relationship or anything either he was already starting to pull away. So then when that happened, I remember we sat down and we like went to lunch at Qdoba and on Cherry Street and we like sat down. He was like I think I'm, I think I want to be atheist and like it shocked me on a world that was like how does that look for us?
Elizabeth Hert:You know, not like wow, how he, how he must be hurting, like obviously I felt that for him, but it was like what are the people going to think of us, you know, and like that's my first thought, which, when I think back to now, like that, breaks my heart. You know, that's, that's what I thought.
Elizabeth Hert:And so, and so I mean, we walked away from that conversation like good and like you know we're going to get through this, you know, but that's, we just pulled all the way back and like there's, for a while it was like even had like resentment. You know, like people like, oh, we go to church and I'm like you know like good luck, see how that goes yeah do you know what happens?
Elizabeth Hert:you know so, even kind of some resentment and stuff. And then I think just over time, like obviously I feel like god's working in the background too, just like softening it, softening it. And then we had gone to like church on the move a couple time for for like Easter or you know some holidays, like just easing back into it and like him coming to me and being like do you want to go, do this? I think I know for him to like I'm not speaking for his faith or what. This is his own journey but like him being like willing to.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, let's go and let's see what it is.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, feeling that pool again. So it is, yeah, filling that pool again. So I mean, yeah, just being real, like we're still newborns in it, like getting back in it, and just I stripped it down to like I don't, I'm not gonna judge you, I don't care, like I'm gonna love you because that's what jesus says, like just gonna love you. Like I had one of my nephews, like when we I was like deep into like the, the churchy, I don't know part of it was came out as gay, you know me judging him hard and versus loving him through it, and like I look back and like apologize to him and stuff, you know, because I'm like that's not who I am, like I, I love you, I don't care if you come to me, like I don't have to promote that you know, and I don even care, but just like judging you through it and not loving you through it. Right, you know, and I I don't want to be that person. Like I want to. Like Jesus would have been like, hey, I love you, yeah, yeah, I love you.
Alexis Schmoker:Well, absolutely, and again back to the chosen.
Elizabeth Hert:Yes, you promoting the chosen.
Alexis Schmoker:But, um, that has put such a different light in me too, just just seeing, like I know obviously the actor that plays Jesus is not Jesus but seeing just Jesus's like interactions and compassions and like him in human form, like he is being human in the way that he does, like interact and love people, you're right Like he is not here to judge we are not, we are not the judgers Like we are just simply here to love, like Jesus, and Jesus loved everyone and even the people like you read the stories and everything again, you know, like these are the sinners, these are. You know, jesus hangs with sinners or whatnot. And then in this you're truly able to see like, oh, these are kind of people that relate to people I know or things I have done, or it's just like easy to connect that right, um, so, yeah, I mean because it's it can be so hard to not puff yourself up, I guess, whenever you get on your high horse.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, you feel so holy and it's like come to church with me, cause like I'm doing the right thing. You should be more like me.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, and it's not like you don't want to be like me, like you want to be like Jesus, like we're just all striving to be that way. Um, I've kind of like had two sermons fall in my lap as I knew that we were preparing like to talk about this, so I will link them below. But, um, two sermons that I kind of like listened to and watch, that I found helpful, just like kind of thinking through this topic and situation and everything was um, on YouTube Craig Gershell, his sermon on Christians let you down, okay. And then Matt Thomas, in that first church, just this past Sunday um did a sermon. It's like a series of why, like it's taking all of these questions like hard questions against Christianity and kind of going through it and it's why, why we need the church. So those are also good.
Alexis Schmoker:I'll link them below. But in the sermon with Craig Rochelle he makes a quote of brennan manning and he says the single greatest cause of atheism in the world today is christians who acknowledge jesus with their lips, then walk out the door and deny him by their lifestyle. Um, that is like what the unbelieving, what does it say? That is what an unbelieving world simply finds unbelievable. So it's like that atheism is due to.
Alexis Schmoker:I think is what it's saying like seeing a christian seeing a quote-unquote christian yeah, not acting like jesus and then he really dives into talking about um, like the church didn't let me down, god didn't let me down like a person that's what I have to tell myself a lot of times, like when I was going through, like the resentment and stuff is like that's just a human, you know, it's just.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, it's hard, so hard Because it was just like in multiple facets of your life.
Elizabeth Hert:We held to such a high you know, like and then that didn't, I guess, answer the part of like protecting the girls and stuff too, like that is a paranoia for us is like oh yeah, going to church and putting them in a class so that it's just like telling them, like this is your body, like no one touches your body besides me and dada and we don't even want to do that. Like you're a big girl, you go to the potty. Now we don't need to do that, you know. Like that is your body, you know, and so just like empowering them to like always speak and tell people no, you can walk out of the class and go find another adult. You can always tell us you know and like, not that it's only going to happen there, but just like yeah, that's where it's connected for you, and yeah.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, so just teaching them how to use their voice? I don't think I was taught when I was little how to use my voice. It was like like I thought I saw some recently. It was like the good girl syndrome, where it's like so you build up over time. Or it's like go give them a hug Like you don't want to go give. Just go give them a hug Like they're fine. Go give them a hug.
Elizabeth Hert:You don't want to but then you're like your parents telling you you have to, yeah, and so like, okay, she doesn't want to hug right now, or like, yeah, she doesn't want to say I love you like my dad.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, I just want to say he's a pawpaw you know, and he's like I love you, and if they don't say that I'm like they love you. It's fine yeah, you know, they love you they love you.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, yeah, high fives you know yeah waves so hard, especially because they're little right now. I mean, so you're just like in that like mom fight or flight mode and I kind of talked about this before too, whenever Amy Bray came on, who was an early childhood director. But like I am that crazy mom that even my we've been touring schools lately, like for next year, oh yeah, so I I go and ask for a tour. Like I know we have open house, like I don't great, I will also be at that. But like I'm also like oh, I've gone to multiple schools now, like sitting down with the director, like I want to see, I want to go to each classroom, like like I went during school while they were doing instruction, and like playing, which is kind of crazy, yeah, but I'm a little crazy and so I think it's okay to like also do that.
Alexis Schmoker:If you need, yeah, to know that, and obviously too, you also such a hard balance, because then you're, you know you're like I need to trust God. These are his children, I'm here to steward them and it's, I think for me it's hard to like find that balance between, like God, I trust you, these are your children, you will do what's good in their life. But also you chose me to steward them and protect them, right, so, like what, I don't. I have a hard time with that balance sometimes and I'm still working on that?
Alexis Schmoker:Um. So I don't know, like, what are you kind of said, like talking about honesty and things with them? Do you think like anything will change as they get older, how you kind of talk about that? Or like, do you guys do school? How do you like approach school and slumber parties?
Elizabeth Hert:school and slumber parties, and I mean, our day was different. Yeah, I think we're gonna be, you know, maybe at this outside the door, maybe more parents are doing that right now too.
Elizabeth Hert:But like slumber parties for us is a no, and I I think I saw somewhere recently on Instagram where another mom had said that like that's a boundary, because it's just like you can go and hang out late, you know, and then you can come back and stuff, but it's just like that's such like a I think it was even saying like, even if nothing happens to your child, but like late at nights or when other people, like adults maybe you're watching pornography or movies that too old for your child, like stuff, that like they can also just see yeah, another person's house that you, it's true seems like a bad word, but like, yeah, you're trying to protect them and keep them innocent.
Elizabeth Hert:Maybe the other people don't have the same view as us for their boundaries and I don't know that's for us that would be something that's a no for us.
Elizabeth Hert:And then I think one time we were in, we lived in Oklahoma City for like a little stint of time and we were going to Life Church there and we had gone almost like one one and a half, we in a life church there, and we had gone almost like one one and a half. We had dropped her off at like class. We were like, let's just try it, you know. Mainly honestly, at that point I think we were just like we need a babysitter we don't have family, so like we're gonna go sit in the lobby and drink coffee
Elizabeth Hert:you know, and everything was fine. She loved it and then, like we went again next time, we were sitting there and Jenny was like we go check on her like he just had, like this, he had like a feeling and he hadn't had that before he went in there was a male teacher in there that wasn't in there when we dropped her off, he was fine. Yeah, nothing happened, but I just thought it was awesome that like he had that intuition, the holy spirit like gave him.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, it was like go check on your baby you know kind of thing, and I was like oh yeah, there's a male that gives me the chills, yeah, yeah because it's just like him showing up again too, like, hey, I know your trauma and like your fear so even if nothing's happening like, you're not gonna be comfortable with this when you when you pick up, when you go to pick her up, yeah, so I think it's okay that you tour and do all that, because I'm like you do you want to know the surroundings and yeah your judgment on character.
Elizabeth Hert:I mean even females and stuff like that it's not just males, but like you are a good judgment character of like people so it's like gonna meet you and just kind of fill out. You know it's the vibe here so well, I feel like.
Alexis Schmoker:That's like, discernment of people's character is not one of my strong suits. Um so jordan, I feel like, is more so my youngest sister avery, like can sniff it out from across, like across the field, like she'll like look at someone she's like and maybe sometimes in a judgmental way, maybe it's not, you know but like her dessert, like she's just a discerning person, yeah, whereas I'm like, oh no, she seemed really nice, like um, they were great, that's me at work.
Elizabeth Hert:I work. I don't know if we said that on here too, but I work at target part time and like I think there was a lady one time that was like coming in and she was like always chat with me. She was so nice protection there and they'll kind of like give us a heads up if this is like returning people who have like theft, or like they can just already tell in the store that they're like you know doing stuff, so they'll like hey, watch this person.
Elizabeth Hert:Oh interesting yeah, because I work in style so always be like at the fitting room they're like, count what they have, tell them to bring it back out like they have people that they watch, just so you know.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, they watch you all right people. Just so you know. They watch still and they watch. I stole sunglasses from Target one time on accident.
Elizabeth Hert:Well then, they must know that it was an accident.
Alexis Schmoker:They must yeah.
Elizabeth Hert:Or maybe your face is like on a wall somewhere and they're like watching you.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, if she ever comes back in, no it was when Prue was an infant and I still think about it.
Elizabeth Hert:That's fine but I was like this lady's so nice. And then one time they were like hey, watch her over there, because she like she comes in like every Sunday or something, like gets away with stuff. And I was like wait, what is that? That's my bff. Like dang, she fooled me, yeah me either wow, that's a good example.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, yeah, man, it's so hard it is. It is so hard, um some is.
Alexis Schmoker:It is so hard Some things I obviously chat GPT'd to ask ask chat GPT, what we should do. Okay, so some teaching of our kids. Discernment, yes, is important. So chat GPT told us to ask questions instead of blindly following. Okay, I thought that was good. Yes, compare what they hear to what they know about God's character, so his love, his grace, his justice, his mercy. So if someone's telling you because that's another thing that I worry about too Sometimes I think like, obviously my husband's a public school teacher, we love public school, our kids will probably go to public school.
Alexis Schmoker:But then that brings on to, like who's pouring into them? Yeah, I don't know. You know, she just left a Christian preschool and it like was bomb. It was so good, you know, and, like her two teachers there, miss Christina and Miss Caitlin, just walked with Jesus and it was so apparent and just the things that she would come home saying and talking about, like was so beautiful. It literally can make me cry right now. Um, but that's something that I worry about too is just like I want them to know, like who Jesus is, what he stands for, what he says and what he does. And then, like, if someone's telling you something that you're like, ah, like, does it come, does it align with what God says? And that can be true with us, with adults too Um, trusting the Holy Spirit's prompting inside of you, just like you said with Chan, um, a small voice that says, like this doesn't feel right or this doesn't sound like love or this does sound like love, you know, like um, so just kind of like listening to the Holy Spirit.
Alexis Schmoker:Another side note I was listening to a podcast not too long ago. I think it was For the Girl. Do you listen to For the Girl podcast? Okay, you need to. It's these two girls. They're moms now, but they're both named Mackenzie, and it's Mack and Kins and they're super cute. Yeah, it's so good and I think it's more towards girls in their 20s. Okay, um, but I still listen to because I'm like practically in my 20s too.
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, I still think um yeah so I think it's also.
Alexis Schmoker:It's for the girl and it's for me. Yeah, too, you're the girl.
Alexis Schmoker:Um, I am the girl, but they had one of their friends come on and she was talking about how she prays for her kids to like, feel and hear the holy spirit and like see them in dreams and she says like they are so, like they are not that far distance from have been, like have been in heaven or with god and jesus, like they're I mean, wow, there's 10 months out, like iverson's, four months out, like. So. That was something that I like wrote on my notes in my phone, because if not, I'll just forget and like screenshot it so I'd see it whenever I got out.
Elizabeth Hert:I'm not going to forget this.
Alexis Schmoker:Um, and so I started like actively praying about it, like I remember praying about it right then, and then, like I wrote it down in my Bible, like in the front you can see, like I have, like I'll write down like whenever I think of things, um, just different prayers, um.
Alexis Schmoker:but I started like really pouring myself into praying over that, and whenever I'd remember I would just like stop and like just say a quick prayer like, dear Lord, please, you know, let my kids have dreams of you and visions of you and feel you. And then, not a week later, crew was sleeping on our floor, like on the end of our bed, and she woke up in the middle of the night and she stood up and she was like looking at something and she said, okay, jesus. And then she like crawled in bed with us and then fell back asleep. But it woke, jordan and I both up and so we were like what?
Alexis Schmoker:and I hadn't told jordan this, yeah, and so in the morning, jordan's the one that said like who? Are you like what you dream about. Last night, like you woke up and you were like talking to someone and she said Jesus. And Jordan said what did he say? And she said that he loves me. And I'm like that is wild.
Alexis Schmoker:And then I told him like actually I have been, I heard that and I've been praying about that and like I wrote that in my Bible on 514, like wrote that I wanted to pray for this and everything, and then that was 519 yeah, is that not wild? And it was like I feel like that's something that I was praying over and like was kind of like I hope that they do this. And then it was the holy spirit being like hey, I know that you don't need proof from me, but like here's some legitimate proof and especially like dealing with your littles too.
Elizabeth Hert:Like how much more of like a love sign of love, could that be like? Hey, you're praying and it's about your littles and I just want you to know. Like confirmation, like like I'm.
Alexis Schmoker:I got you in all the areas.
Elizabeth Hert:But like here's an example of like yeah, and normally she sleeps on the couch.
Alexis Schmoker:So it was like an odd thing that she had. We had taken welder's crib apart and so like his crib mattress was on the ground in her room so she brought it into our room and slept on the floor.
Alexis Schmoker:So she never does that yeah, and then that night, and then that night, like we both woke up to it like so that was just kind of crazy and cool. So obviously, like I know, we all like pray for our kids all the time, but it was just crazy. I like tried to intentionally pray about that and then it came up, just like you said, like confirmation. It's so wild. That is awesome. Um, any anything else on this topic that you want to talk about, just like church hurt raising your kids, protecting them.
Elizabeth Hert:I mean, I guess, just in a reminder to myself too, that like, yeah, it is, it's not God that did it, it's not I mean cause I think that struggle too, like why would you allow this to happen?
Elizabeth Hert:You know, but like understanding that we have free will and people make bad decisions. But yeah, just me saying this and recovering myself is like Jesus didn't do that, even still, like I am tiptoeing into a church and it's hard not to feel like the church as a whole. You know, and that's not true. You know, it was just a singular person you know so that yeah, and then just raise your kids to have a voice because, that's going to be one of the most important things, I think, is you can say no you can tell people like even if you didn't say no in the in the moment, whatever it is, you came to us later yeah, you came to us later and said this was uncomfortable and I didn't like this.
Alexis Schmoker:Okay, we'll be your voice, you know. So, yeah, and it doesn't have to be like big or small, yeah, like it doesn't matter what it is.
Elizabeth Hert:My friend said this I didn't like this. Okay, Well, yeah, how this could you could say them or whatever.
Alexis Schmoker:You know. Yeah, I think responding with it too, because I don't know. I feel like sometimes I think back when I was little and I would tell my dad something that he's just like a, a boisterous person you know like just he's italian, he's stuck and he's like, well, I'll go talk to him and I'm like, don't come on man, like don't go.
Elizabeth Hert:My mom's like, yes, I'm getting involved. I'm like I just want you to listen to me and not yeah yes, oh.
Alexis Schmoker:So I'm like I'm gonna have to be mindful of that too, because I can be you know, Jesus wants us to be slow to speak. But I am working on that, yeah, because I can be very fast to speak. And then later I'm like, why would I say that?
Elizabeth Hert:oh, dang it. I was thinking about that on the way over. Here is like I'm just, I've accepted that I'm an awkward person. And it's that meme where it's like you bet I'm gonna lay in bed for the next 30 years and think about that one awkward thing I said to that one random person. You know that's me.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, oh, that's me too. I think about literally all the time. If I've ever said anything awkward to you, I promise you I've thought about you multiple times, multiple times. Uh well, and then another thing that he was kind of talking about in the sermon Craig, or shell in that one sermon um, was that like at the end he stopped and like apologized, like if this has happened to you, he's not like saying like I'm not trying to minuscule what happened to you because it's very big and it's very real, and like, but just know that like that is not the church, that's not God, that was a person. And then he said to like jesus goes through and says hypocrite in the bible, however many times. Like woe is the hypocrite, um. So jesus didn't like hypocrites, right either right.
Elizabeth Hert:So that's that has been. A big healing thing for me too is just seeing christians walking through like one of my cousins like I can't. She's just like a normal person, you know, and it's like but loves jesus, and I've never felt like judged by her. I've never felt, you know, and it's just like she's the most giving loving person, like she'll. One time she was down visiting my grandma, actually in the neighborhood too, oh yeah, yeah, and she took.
Elizabeth Hert:She was like you guys want to go target me, took him, came back and like bought them toys, not that that's like, yeah, you know, but it was just like that's so sweet like it's just like everything she does is like to give you want to be like them I see jesus in her you know and like I've never once felt her judge anyone. Yeah, you know, like, even if you're like oh my gosh, this, this person, and she's like oh well, maybe it's this yeah, it doesn't gossip, it doesn't. Yeah, that's one of the most healings actually seeing the Christian who doesn't walk out the door and act differently.
Alexis Schmoker:They're just themselves and they love Jesus you know, yeah, that's healing, that is healing, that's good. Okay, so let's jump into your creative side. Uh, you describe yourself as a creative heart and you're free spirit. I totally see that in you. Always, you've always been that way, um, and I love watching your magic through wooden, oki. So how does creating whether it's being crafts or decorating or just dreaming about different ideas bring you back to yourself in the middle of motherhood?
Elizabeth Hert:Yeah, that's definitely like my form of me time is like one reading, like I've really getting into like reading books yes and then just being creative like I. I will always try to be like oh, I should try and sell this, but jenny's like, just do it because it makes you relax, you know, so it'll be like oh, I think I'm gonna learn how to cross stitch, or I think I'm gonna learn.
Elizabeth Hert:We just built the girls beds, like I saw that so I was like we can do that right it was a lot harder than I thought it would be, but it was fun, like learning how to do that and yeah, so that just is always like my, my me time and like reminding myself that I'm a person and not just a mom Cause it's hard to get lost in that, Like when Holland was first born, I remember feeling like I don't even know what music I like anymore.
Elizabeth Hert:You know, like there's just so many things that you get consumed and like a kid and you watch the kid shows and you listen to kid music and it's fun. But then you're like what do I like?
Alexis Schmoker:what do I?
Alexis Schmoker:like yeah, so creating is always like a a good downtime for me yeah, I think that's so important to try and find hobbies, because I'm the same way, but, like when I first had crew and honestly, even before I had kids, jordan would be like what is your hobby? And I'd be be like, well, you know nursing, like I'm a nurse and I love that, and he's like that's your job, that's not a hobby, like that's what you do for work, and I'd be like, well, I like to go to brunch with my friends. And he's like so you'd like to eat, which is also required. I'm like I do love that, I love to do that, I love to go to brunch with friends, or coffee dates or something. But yeah, since, like after having crew and trying to like find my own hobby, it's like now I like to read and I guess maybe that's it.
Elizabeth Hert:Maybe I just keep switching.
Alexis Schmoker:But it is important to have like do this podcast.
Elizabeth Hert:I like to do this podcast yes, yeah, this is a hobby, this is a hobby.
Alexis Schmoker:Yeah, yeah, it's a passion. It is, it's a passion, and so I think just finding those things that kind of bring you back to yourself, yeah, and I know you do things for fun, but you do also sell things, yes, yeah. So at Wood, different things you made, like the cutest little cupcake toppers and cake topper for that's my favorite thing to do right now.
Elizabeth Hert:It's like a couple of different ventures like wooden signs and stuff. And what did I do? For? I tried to make like baby signs, you know, like one month old and stuff like that. I was just not very active on social media.
Alexis Schmoker:I think that's like you need to be like yeah, but I've gotten better at it too.
Elizabeth Hert:But, yeah, so the birthday stuff is my favorite. It's so cute.
Alexis Schmoker:So if you have birthday parties coming up or anything, um, reach out to Liz because she does a great job. I'd love to yeah.
Alexis Schmoker:Well, is there anything else that you want to talk about? Oh, my gosh, I don't think so. Thank you, Thank you, yes, Thank you for being so open and vulnerable with us today. Your story is a reminder that motherhood isn't about perfection. It's about presence, resilience and creating something beautiful right in the middle of the mess. I love seeing how you love your girls so fiercely, create fearlessly and keep showing up for your family and your faith, even whenever it's hard.
Alexis Schmoker:And for anyone who's listening and wants a little handmade magic or just a dose of real mom honesty, go follow Elizabeth at Wooden Oki. That's at W-O-O-D-E-N-O-K-I-E. That's on Instagram, and you're on Facebook too right On Facebook and remember mamas even when you feel like you're stumbling through. Your love is shaping something wild and wonderful. I'll also link those two sermons in the show notes too. Those are great resources of people who do know what they're talking about to go listen and kind of just uh, make up your own mind on things. Uh, until next time, stay rooted, stay real, stay wild. Guys, we love you. Thank you again, Mama. I'm so grateful that you took time out of your busy schedule today to listen to Mama of the Wild Crew podcast.
Alexis Schmoker:I'm Alexa Schmoker and I hope you love this conversation and that it resonated with you. Thank you so much for opening up your circle and letting us in as we walk through this wild ride of motherhood together. Remember, in the chaos of motherhood, there is always joy to be found, so keep looking in those little moments that make it all worth it. Be sure to follow along on Instagram at mamaofthewildcrew underscore podcast. Please don't forget to like, subscribe and share our podcast. I'd love to hear from you. So comment, tag me, DM me, let me know what you think and let me know what you'd love to hear from you. So comment, tag me, DM me, let me know what you think and let me know what you'd like to hear next. Mama, I am praying for you, I love you and I cannot wait to see you next time.