Making Sustainability Human: Storytelling, Systems Change and Nature with Breitling CSO Aurelia Figueroa

Security is the word everyone is using right now, but the surprising truth is that it keeps pointing straight back to sustainability. Carl sits down with Aurelia, a chief sustainability officer and systems thinker, to map where sustainability stands in 2026 after the hype cycle and the hard reality check that followed. We talk about what’s actually progressing (the energy transition and renewables scaling faster than most headlines suggest) and what’s still dangerously behind (nature regeneration, valuing ecosystems, and the widening gap of wealth inequality).

We get specific about why inequality can derail climate policy and why “just transition” can’t be a slogan. Aurelia shares a vivid on-the-ground lesson from the Yellow Vest movement era in France and explains why the success or failure of sustainability often comes down to trust, coalitions, and whether people feel they’re being asked to sacrifice without a believable payoff. That leads to a core idea: science-based evidence is essential, but leading with data alone won’t move society. Stories will. We dig into what a useful sustainability narrative sounds like, including real scenarios that show what life can look like on the other side of change.

You’ll also hear an inside look at corporate sustainability in global luxury brands, from high-risk upstream supply chains to responsible sourcing shifts like artisanal small-scale gold and lab-grown diamonds. We cover why startups are a non-negotiable ingredient for circular economy progress, how communities like Imagine and Villars help leaders stay brave, and how reconnecting to nature can reshape the way we lead. If this conversation sharpens your thinking, subscribe, share it with a friend, and leave a review so more people can find it.

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Transcript

Sustainability In 2026 Reality Check

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Today I am joined by a wonderful thought leader and brilliant mind in the sustainability space. Aurelia, you are a chief sustainability officer at Brightling. But so much more than that. You are a systems thinker, a storyteller who believes sustainability is not only a technical challenge, but it is a human one. Welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_01 0:20

Thank you, Carl. It's really a pleasure and delight to be here with you today.

SPEAKER_00 0:24

I really do enjoy our conversations that we have lately. And I have so many questions, but let's dive in directly. Where do we stand in terms of sustainability in 2026?

SPEAKER_01 0:38

It has been a very momentous past few years for the evolution of sustainability. And in speaking with several of my peers, so I recently had the chance to convene at Terrace and Tuscany, where I was meeting with a lot of other thought leaders in the space and really taking stock of what has happened. I have heard some refer to the last years as a hype cycle. I think if we look back, sustainability became a bit of a trend in 2022 through to 2024. And in the process, I think what's good is that a lot of awareness was raised around the subjects related to sustainability, be they related to the topic of climate neutrality, which is a whole box of worms that maybe we'll open up in the course of the discussion, or to really pressing topics like wealth inequality, nature regeneration. And we have now a public that is more astute. They have seen through some claims that were made by different brands or different entities that we're not really holding water in terms of a meaningful impact for sustainability and a resilient impact for sustainability. So I think that we're per we're in a time right now of needing to reconsider the language with which we seek to engage to really lean into our skills as humans, as storytellers, and of course to always do this in a science-based manner. And if we look at topics like the energy transition, this is something that is progressing well ahead. And I certainly want to highlight the fact that with the ongoing conflict in Iran, there are obviously a number of economies that are heavily affected by what is effectively a carbon tax that has been levied as a result of this conflict. So if we look at Southeast Asia, if we look at sub-Saharan Africa, households and businesses are seeing really meaningful impacts that have serious uh consequences for quality of life and outcomes as a result of this. And the energy transition itself is moving ahead at pace. We are approaching one-third of all energy globally being provided by renewables and renewables even unseeding coal as the key provider of energy globally. So, this is something that is really being able to take hold across economies. The business case for renewables is clear. Where we still have a lot of progress to make is certainly on nature regeneration, and that's for societies and economies globally. There are substantial efforts that we need to take here in order to be able to understand what is our impact on nature, to place nature on the balance sheet, to be able to regenerate nature and to protect natural resources. And we are still faced with meaningful challenges ahead for inequality. Wealth inequality is continuing to dramatically increase globally. And this is having a lot of pressures on societies globally and the trust that citizens hold in their government, the trust we share with one another, and a range of other factors. And throw into the mix, of course, the larger transformation that is underway right now with regards to artificial intelligence. We have more than a few things that are cooking. And as you know, Carl, that's just a very brief overview of the subject right now. So, in short, I think that we are in the process of learning from the last years, rapidly innovating in the very best cases, in order to make sustainability more relevant than ever in a world that is primarily preoccupied at the moment with security. And for me, sustainability and security could not be closer cousins. They are directly related to one another in all aspects of the term. So one of the challenges for me is as security continues to dominate the headlines, how do we begin to raise an awareness that addressing sustainability challenges will help us to address security challenges?

SPEAKER_00 4:56

Very well said. And I couldn't agree more to many things that you have said to join in on what you said towards the end. Sustainability and security. I have been to the Munich Security Conferences a couple of times, and two years ago it was all about resilience in the supply chain. And I was so happy about it because it was at the same time where investors were hesitating investing in impact. Impact funds, you know, had a certain hit. But now we have just a different argument why it is actually important to to invest in circular economy because it is so important for supply chain resilience.

SPEAKER_01 5:44

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 5:47

What like what do you see the future? Where do you engage in most? Uh, what are the key facts where you see that you wanna contribute in the future?

Inequality Drives Transition Backlash

SPEAKER_01 6:01

Moving forward, I think what will be key right now is to really dig into the issues that are most material for society at this point in time. And for me, two of those key issues are really wealth inequality and how this is continuing to destabilize economies and to have negative economic consequences for everyone across the wealth and income spectrum. And it threatens the social license of any number of transitions and transformations that we, some of us at least in the collective, may wish to carry out globally. I was living in Paris in 2018 when the Gilets jaun or the yellow vest movement started that was really protesting, among other things. This is a much more complicated topic than I will boil it down to briefly. Changes related to fuels, changes related to transportation. And I saw personally, I was living in the second district of Paris at that time, and I saw buses burning outside of my window. I saw the discontent, the rage and the anger that was contained in this process. And fast forward, we can see the political implications that this continues to have through to this day. And to me, that references the fact that among the successes that have been realized in sustainability, what can be done better is to really bring a broader coalition of supporters for transformations. And a key way to do that is really being able to achieve just transition. So the green transition that is really contributing from a societal perspective as well, which it absolutely can. And in many cases, a lot of the policies that have been shared can have a positive societal outcome. Not, not, not always. In some cases, it needs to be refined, it needs to be improved. There's a lot of low-hanging fruit that could easily be assembled and brought into those packages. And going forward, the communication element needs to be a lot stronger so that we can understand how do we bring forward the broadest coalition possible to really gain support for transition and transformation processes from the outset and be able to have outcomes that are broader benefiting a much more substantial portion of society. So those are some of the key issues that I see shaping this going forward at the national level, at the regional level, you know, in addition to the broader geoeconomic topics that we were mentioning just now, you know, and you of course highlighted the Munich Security Conference and the focus on resilience and the fact that circularity can bring in local, regional, stable supply chains, while, of course, making a meaningful contribution to employment factors. One of the greatest challenges that we see today in the broader green transition or uh industrial disruption that is occurring across a range of sectors.

SPEAKER_00 9:12

Totally agree. And especially with the current trend, if you will, in AI, uh, that's a question that everybody has, right? What about jobs? You talk about just transition, and I think it's so important. The last person on this podcast who I had a conversation about that was with the HM Foundation, who also talk a lot about just transition when it's about sustainability. Also reminds me of what you say in general that sustainability is a human challenge. How do we take people on board? How do we communicate the right way? How do we get them on boarded that you know the broader audience cares more about sustainability in terms of social equality, but also in terms of the environment, I guess, consumer behavior, et cetera?

Why Stories Move People

SPEAKER_01 10:06

I think one of the things we need to do, and and don't get me wrong, I I I am fully an advocate for, and in all of the work that I've done today, and including my past work as an economic researcher, it was really focused on integrating science-based evidence. And for me, this has to be a key part or the core part of really informing the decisions that we wish to make going forward. That being said, I feel that among the things that can be done better going forward is to not lead argumentation for society from the perspective of science. I think that science should be present. It can be depending on the conversation and the background or the foreground. And ultimately, we really need to lead with storytelling. I've once been told that there is a tribe in the Amazon. Unfortunately, I don't know the exact name of the tribe, I've heard this secondhand, that refers to human beings as featherless storytelling creatures. And that is something that has always stayed with me since I have heard that. And I think that one of the talents that we have and one of the benefits we have to offer the world as humans is to really lean into the storytelling. So, what could this practically look like? I think some of these is to be able to share with the population scenarios of how things can look and not only the doom and gloom scenarios. I think we're able to hear those if we if we want to, we can access those pretty easily across any number of platforms. We also need to understand what is the alternative. In many ways, you know, we are a society that is addicted to many things. We are addicted or have been addicted in the past several years to cheap money. Um, we've been addicted to low interest rates. We've been addicted, of course, to oil. And if you look at any addiction process, part of that is not only understanding the quitting process, it's to understand what can come in place of this. And unfortunately, I think what what I'm missing in society today, I'm missing a clear narrative from for me as a citizen consumer, as a citizen, if I am to make the changes that are being asked of me, and I'm certainly trying to do the very best I can, what can await me? What can await my community? What can await my family on the other side of that? And that's something that I think we've been missing entirely. We are asking people to make changes in their life. There's not much that is scarier than that. We are all trying to get along and get by on a day-to-day basis at varying degrees of suffering. If we are going to be asked to make a change, please give us a hint. What might be on that other side? What might be the vision that we can aspire to as a society to give us the courage that we need to walk to the other side? Because the science is clear. We have all the information. We we know about the theoretical bridge that we need to cross. Now we really need to have a vision, an image, a story that can be shared with us so that we can believe in and have the trust and faith to make this cross to the other side.

SPEAKER_00 13:22

Right. We need inspiration and we need tools and techniques and you know an understanding of how to implement things. To be a bit taken by our hand, right, as a society, to to know how how we can meaningfully make those changes.

Villars And A New Nature Narrative

SPEAKER_00 13:46

You talk a lot about communication and I know that you're very active with the Villars Institute. Do you want to tell us a little bit more about that?

SPEAKER_01 13:57

Yes, absolutely. So I have been able to be a part of the VLars community since 2022 when I was first invited to attend a VLARS summit, which is hosted in March of each year, which has come to be known as the Davos for Nature. And it is an extraordinary gathering of the key thought leaders in the broader space of nature regeneration, climate protection, and ecopreneurship. And as soon as I attended in 2022, I didn't know much about what to expect. I was blown away. I had never been to an event of this nature, and I made a point in the coming years to make sure that I could attend these annual gatherings. In 2024, I was really honored to be invited to join the Board of Trustees of the VLARs Institute Foundation, where I'm joining my really esteemed colleagues who are leaders in the field of science policy, climate policy, nature regeneration globally. And it has been an absolute thrill to see the meaningful work that is being done at VLars to really reframe the narrative around nature. And what we are doing at VLARS is to try to address exactly the challenge which I just mentioned, which is to provide a vision of what the alternative can be. And so, with the leadership of the VLars Institute Foundation, including Susan Craig and all the board members and the contributions of Open Planet Studios, there has recently been the launch at London Climate Action Week of the really exciting feature film, How to Live on Earth. It is featuring Benedict Cumberbatch and a range of planetary guardians, among them Shiye Bastida, who are really leading the charge to support nature regeneration and reconnecting to nature globally. There's really outstanding and practical stories in there about how we can modify our diet in exciting, delicious, and healthy ways to be a part of supporting this transition. How we need to reconsider our financial system to properly value nature along the way, and how communities around the globe are really practically reconnecting to nature and integrating it in their daily lives for a range of health benefits, along with everything that we also have the chance as humans to offer back to our fellow species on the planet. So the launch of How to Live on Earth has been super exciting. It's really part of creating a new narrative for nature. And for me, it is one of the most promising glimpses into how we can continue to drive interest in this moving forward. So we're looking forward to a global launch in September. And after that, the film will be available for free to everyone on YouTube because we absolutely want this to be a film that everyone has access to and can see.

SPEAKER_00 17:00

That's so beautiful. And one of the one of the things that we can do, as mentioned before, one of the tool sets and inspirational tools is that. And I I've seen the trailer, it looks incredible. So I'm really excited to to watch it myself. Um, maybe during New York uh Climate Week. And you I mean, you're talking a lot about communication, you're so active in this. Is that also because of your exposure in the consumer-oriented industry with Brightling nowadays? You've been before in IWC. So is that helping you? Is that what inspired you to take this angle towards sustainability?

From Economist To Brand CSO

SPEAKER_01 17:42

I would say that this inspiration for me started originally in the early 2010s. So I was at that time a development economist at the German Institute of Development and Sustainability Studies, IDOS, which is one of the leading think techs globally on sustainable development. And it was then that I was able to focus my research on economics, on behavioral economics. And some of the research that I did, I had other projects that were focused on science, technology, and innovation for global cooperation, a range of topics focused on energy economics and energy policy. And part of these work programs was to really investigate how initiatives, especially in the global south, so my research was focused in sub-Saharan Africa and Latin America, could be maximized to the fullest extent by communicating in a way that is salient to individuals. And as part of that, I had the chance to run several randomized controlled trials, which is really a gold standard in research, to understand which communication is truly best for each, for any individual community. And this work was being done with intersectionality fully in mind. So really considering both the social and the environmental impacts of our work. Fast forward, as you mentioned, and the chance to work for two major luxury brands, IWC Schaffhausen and Breitling, has really been an opportunity to learn from leaders in the space of marketing and communications and to continue to fine-tune and hone those skills and understand the benefits of simplicity, which spending several years in research as I did, research doesn't always lean enough into simplicity. Sometimes it does. But this was really a benefit to my career and really helped complement the work that I had done in that space.

Gold And Diamonds Without Harm

SPEAKER_00 19:39

Do you want to share a little bit more about how it is to, you know, work in the sustainability space in those global brands? I think that is something a lot of people are curious about. It is something that I look at from different angles. I work with a lot of brands. I help a lot of brands invest in the right innovations. I created with my nonprofit initiative in Germany, Circular Republic, multi-stakeholder projects where we, you know, bring in startups and brands to create multi-stakeholder projects and close the loop and different industries. From a startup perspective, I see how how much there's the need to have access to brands and establish companies. How is it from the inside? Because I I really value you and and what you stand for and what you're doing. So I would love to understand how it is from the inside.

SPEAKER_01 20:36

It's been really fascinating to be a part of these global brands. And I'll tell you, Carl, I never imagined that this would be a part of my career. I trained as a development economist. I really wanted to be focused in addressing some of the core issues of our time. And for me, the luxury industry is in many ways a symptom of one of the greatest challenges we face globally, which is, of course, wealth inequality. It's not a place that I would imagine working at, to be very frank. And in fact, what it has presented is paradox. And for me, paradox is a door to addressing some of the most challenging and confrontational and potentially conflictual issues at the same time. So it's turned out to be an extraordinary opportunity. And I have been able to ply my trade as a development economist, particularly as so much of our efforts have very rightfully focused on the impacts that we have from an environmental and social perspective alike in our upstream supply chain. Take the example of gold sourcing, which has an outsized impact in terms of environment and potential societal outcomes. Think of water demand, impacts on. climate impacts on biodiversity, often in key biodivers, excuse me, key biodiversity areas globally, KBAs, along with societies. In the upstream supply chain, you see you can see horrific examples of human trafficking, all types of labor violations, human rights violations. So engaging there is absolutely an area where corporates, especially brands like Breitling, like IWC Schaffhausen or other major brands globally, can be seen to have a major opportunity to have a positive effect, also by raising awareness around these topics. So I think what it's been like is to really be able to see the spotlight that can be shone by these brands and how it can raise awareness on these topics. At the same time at this moment I can't help thinking about the movie Blood Diamond, which was a fascinating film that instantly raised global awareness among the travails in diamond mining. And I'm personally of the belief that I would love to see a blood diamond for gold. I would love to see a blood diamond for cobalt, for bananas, for cacao, for so many other things that we sometimes term commodities that have real people and real aspects of nature behind them who are being meaningfully affected. So it it has it has been it has opened a fascinating door.

SPEAKER_00 23:43

That is beautifully said we need a blood diamond for so many other commodities. There's a lot of talk about cacao and and about coffee but less of gold and of so many other areas. A lot about lithium but again others less how can I imagine the the main sustainability strategies in a big company like that obviously you have a lot of compliance with the regulation you have a lot of reporting but you want to do I guess so much more. Now you had you know the opportunity to work with brands who are on the when it comes to consumption in ways probably rather sustainable because it's a very long-lasting product handed over for generations carefully produced carefully sourced. But still like what what is it? So it's totally different than HM, right? What are the key other couple of things you can share that you're proud of or where where you really could make a difference?

SPEAKER_01 24:49

I would say among the topics and everything that I'll reference was thanks to the extraordinary efforts of a very large team not only at Breitling but in our entire value chain because the transformations that we made there especially in terms of gold sourcing and diamond sourcing were thanks to the effort of tens and tens and tens of people, hundreds in fact if you look at the entire value chain along the way as we absolutely should because we've all been a part of this. And being able to make such a strong shift in a matter of years. And I think that really shows that if there is the desire to make a change, it can happen quickly. Of course a lot of people cite that we saw that during COVID we we were all capable governments, individuals, schools, companies, etc, we could make a change within a week as we found out. And it was it was the same with with um the efforts that we made and I think the sense of urgency that we all share together and what I think supported that is really storytelling, being able to understand these core issues and the the buy-in of the stakeholders who were present at that time absolutely contributed to it. So I think and and those I I should say the gold and diamond transformation to and I should specify to artisanal small scale gold from specific suppliers in Latin America and diamonds to lab-grown diamonds from specific suppliers in Western India, which was an it which is an industry leading initiative to date that this is something that is really emblematic of the broader shifts that were made in terms of reduction in climate impact, a reduction in water consumption, reduction in biodiversity impacts, positive impacts for local communities on projects that we designed together that directly supported their own identified sustainable development objectives, building a school in Colombia where students from ages five to 67 were studying together. And those are really the outcomes that will always stay with me and that I will always look back upon positively and upon which I'm incredibly proud, you know, to have been a part of this team.

SPEAKER_00 27:14

Understandably so and you are beyond that so engaged in so many other

Startups Make Incumbents Adapt

SPEAKER_00 27:21

organizations. One is I I feel the the startup angle you've been on the advisory board with Modern Meadow, a company I also looked into you mentioned you know there are several others I would generally just love to to go a little bit like what excites you about startups because it's like so different than incumbents in their work. And then on the other hand you're with the Villers Institute you're active with the UN I would love to learn you know those both sides how you're active here and and what what you want to contribute but also like what do those you know opportunities give to you. I mean it must be so rewarding as well.

SPEAKER_01 28:01

Absolutely and as you know Carl I'm just such a fan of everything that you're doing in the VC and startup space it's extraordinary. And these are exactly the types of activities that are going to create the world that we want and need to have and I I totally believe in our ability to reach this new world. And one of the most important functions I believe of startups is that they will eventually extinct those that do not make the change fast enough. This is the reality that we're talking about. Not all brands are going to make it to the other side of this and the decisions that are taken by brands right now are going to be determining their social license to operate in fact they it already is the case. So when we talk about incumbents incumbents can make a change incumbents can decide to have totally different products and services we're seeing it happen on major brands already right now. So this can definitely happen or radical or incremental innovations depending on the nature of the business can also be made in order to ensure that businesses maintain competitiveness. That being said in some cases and in some industries we're not going to be able to get ahead or I take that back in any industry we're not going to going to be able to get ahead without startups. They're just the absolute essential ingredient whether they are a part of the upstream supply chain, downstream supply chain, eventually being a part of MA activity that is allowing incumbents to really maintain their competitiveness, they will be a key part of the just transition from the perspective of environment and society. So I'm incredibly excited to be engaged in this space and to build on the work that I've had as ad as advisory board member. I am engaged with startups now who are still in stealth mode, who are really looking to shake up the current status quo in their industries. Some of them are really moonshot operations and I truly believe in their potential to do this. So suffice to say it's going to be an incredibly exciting 24 to 36 months ahead of us. I think a lot of the changes that are incubation right now will really start to become market ready that we're going to see them going into the pipeline. You cited Modern Meadow in Overa which is an extraordinary material made of recycled tires that is breathable that is better than leather is coming onto the marketplace. So these are all opportunities you know talk about circularity you know you're you're one of the the leading voices in circularity the work that you are doing to be able to bring in business models that are relevant from a regional perspective from the perspective of employment from the perspective of green transition this is just huge. So this is one of the things that excite me excites me the most and what I do really treasure is the chance to have the opportunity to work with existing incumbent brands in some cases you know more than 100 years old. And to mix this with the worlds of startups that are really in their infancy but that one day are going to be household names. So this is this is a a really exciting bridge to be on I totally agree.

SPEAKER_00 31:25

I mean this is my my passion right as you know um uh every day speaking to to all of these brilliant minds and their solutions and and I I love it and I love helping them get access to incumbents and to capital and and um this is what drives me and and I'm so excited about it. You are also an imagined leader like something I am not yet I I got accepted I think for the next cohort in September which unfortunately I can't do time wise but I am looking into the next round. So tell me more what does it mean for everybody who is excited or interested about this what does it mean to be an imagined leader? How does it work?

SPEAKER_01 32:07

Yeah so imagine is the brain and spirit child of Valerie Keller and Paul Pullman who are really brave souls charting a new course for sustainability and business around the world. And we are a community of some hundreds of individuals around the world who are really leading in their space be it in finance, be it in arts and culture be it in corporate sustainability and a range of representatives from the startup world who are doing extraordinary work. And we have the chance to come together it kicks off with an initiation which is always occurring in Oxford which is an extraordinary opportunity to be present in this seat of education and learning. I had the chance to spend one term at Cambridge and for me to be back in the UK and to be at Oxford for the first time was just a fantastic reminder of past studies. And it was imbued with leaders who brought soul and spirit and wisdom and bravery into everything that we learned. We had the most exciting tangible learning opportunities among one of them. In one case we we walked into a church we didn't know at all what was expecting us we walked into a church and there was a choir awaiting us and there was a conductor and we learned that we were to conduct the choir on a piece of music that none of us knew and learning in that moment the process of conducting of orchestrating there were I think probably about 20 members of the choir. So this was really a meaningful task before us and the conductor who was present with us was unrelenting in his willingness to share with us honest and real feedback that I know having spoken to my colleagues who were present there has been transformational. So I just want to provide that as one tangible example of what it looked like and the it was a whole week full of activities like this and really brilliantly held by everyone who was present. I think the only problem is I almost didn't sleep that week um but otherwise it was it was a lot of fun and and I I caught up on on well-being measures like sleep once I get back. But it was extraordinary it's a living community still going on so there are gatherings at the major events that are happening around the world be it London Climate Action Week Davos uh New York uh so it's it's really a fascinating community and and that's what's so important to me is really being able to find those communities where you get the feeling of tribe and vibe. And I really seek that out. I I I crave these deeper connections and I really honor the people who are stepping into that space with so much boldness.

SPEAKER_00 35:24

So I guess that is also one of the most beautiful things of being an imagined leader is less of what it represents to the outside world because it is a prestigious thing to be and not everybody can just sign up but you have a community of like minded people who all together use their impact to create meaningful change. Absolutely you said it so well well we all look for community um I know that you are yourself now transitioning to you know new endeavors.

Next Steps And Reconnecting To Nature

SPEAKER_00 35:59

I don't know to what extent you want to share it already or if you if you even know already all what is awaiting for you.

SPEAKER_01 36:06

Yeah absolutely so after uh six and a half years at Bright Lane I'm really excited to be transitioning into new roles. So I will be keeping the pillars that I have of external advisory and also a core home where I'm really looking forward to leaning more into the topics that are directly shaping sustainability today. So the across my career working across the public and private sector, international diplomacy and social entrepreneurship, I have always wanted to be able to have a systemic impact and moving freely across different organizations and roles to be able to lean into what feels most relevant at the moment. So I hope to be sharing more soon and I'm really looking forward to continuing to be a part of driving forward extraordinary action for a wonderful future that has positive impacts for communities around the world for people around the world for species around the world and for nature regeneration we're coming towards the end and I know personal development and moving forward and never standing still is also something that is very important to you.

SPEAKER_00 37:22

We just talked about something very personal on the personal development side and I mean you're connected to my wife as well who is I mean that's all her world right like with her podcast the mindset generation and her coaching and you know like tell us about what what you have done in that space and and maybe how that also can help you uh in whatever you're planning next.

SPEAKER_01 37:48

Yeah it's a beautiful question. Thank you for asking it and for the past several years one of the core opportunities for me and my personal development has been reconnecting to nature and I for me nature is is my teacher uh for which I'm so profoundly grateful. And I recently had the chance to join the School of Lost Borders for a vision fast. And this was taking place in the Rocky Mountains. It's something I've wanted to do for over a decade. It requires you to go 1000% off the grid for two weeks. So I needed to find the right window to be able to do that. But it was a profound opportunity to reconnect to nature by living in the wilderness including several days that are spent without any shelter any form of communication and no food. And what I experienced there was the gentleness of nature. Among other things I encountered two juvenile black bear brothers who were having the same general area of sleeping as I was as I found out on my first night. And this was a completely safe and peaceful encounter that we shared together. I should say like I said I didn't have any food with me. So that really increases the safety when bears are around. But it was for me the entire experience a reminder of the gentleness and the generosity of nature that is always willing to receive us if if we will open ourselves and open our hearts to that experience. So this is absolutely one of the key aspects of personal development that I'm working on today. And indeed this is one of my very favorite topics I love that you and Adela are so interested in this as well and I'm really excited for being able to continue those conversations together.

SPEAKER_00 39:49

Me too thank you so much for sharing that that is so beautiful. I am such a big fan of reconnecting to nature I just spent myself a week at the Hoffman Institute where you have absolutely no access to any sort of media for a week you do reconnect to nature as well not to that extent that you do but the Hoffman process you can do only once in your life but you can and I think I'm gonna do that every year I want to take myself out for a week and there's so many kind of retreats you can do to reconnect to nature to yourself I think it's so important no matter what kind of work you do. And if everybody was doing it the world would also be a better place. And I think that is our you know closing that loop in our conversation of you know it's about communication it's about taking on society on this train and and you know creating a little bit of a better place and inspiration for that. So thank you so much for all the work that you do it's really inspirational. And everybody only tell uh please you know like follow Aurelia on LinkedIn and and connect because it's really inspirational. So thank you so much. I'm really excited to to witness what you're planning next.

SPEAKER_01 41:04

Thanks thank you Carl it's been an honor thank you so much