Grown Ass Dads Episode 12: Teaching Kids the Value of Money (Without Losing Your Mind)

The Grown Ass Dads are back — and this week, it’s all about money, kids, and responsibility. From acorn-hustling childhoods to $300 hockey sticks, the guys dig into what it really means to raise financially grounded kids in a world where Venmo, Apple Pay, and instant gratification rule.

They get real about allowances (spoiler: nobody’s earning one), generational work ethic, and the lost art of sweating for what you want. There’s laughter, frustration, and a few brutal dad truths — like when “the bank of Dad” officially closes its doors.

If you’ve ever debated whether to buy your kid something or let them “learn the hard way,” this one’s for you.

🎙️ Hosts: Adam, Jason, Jay
👕 New set, new merch, same old dad chaos
💬 Theme: How we teach (or try to teach) kids about money, value, and work.

Listen if you’ve ever:

• Tried to pay your kid for chores that never got done
• Wondered when 13-year-olds stopped wanting jobs
• Been told “but it’s your money” when offering to pay your own kid

🚀 Join the Conversation!
Drop a comment below 👇 and let us know: What’s the hardest part of being a dad? What topics do you want us to cover in future episodes?

📢 Follow Us on Social Media:
📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/growndadspodcast/
📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61574200411933
⏰ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@grownassdads
🌎 Website: www.grownassdads.com 

Transcript

0:00

Welcome to the Grown Ass Dads podcast. Boop boop boop boop boop boop boop. Really good. And there it is. And here it is. That noise means you are listening to the Grown Ass Dads podcast. Bones, great to see you again. Good to be seen it. I love you, Jay Bone. How we doing back there? Dude, I got zero to complain about. We're in our new set. We got merch available now. Things are just. Things are looking up. Things are humming. Like. Like we're we're I feel I feel official ish. Wow. I'm gonna get some artwork for this. Get some artwork for this wall. What are we looking for, like Picasso? No, I mean, I'm more of a Jackson Pollock kind of guy. Is that an artist? I'm just. Yeah, it's all right. I'm just throwing out shit that I've heard. I don't know, Dick. I would really like to have, dogs playing pool behind us. I was just I was just thinking about getting, like, lights and, Oh, no. We're gonna need passion. No, we need. Well, it's. It's officially blue season, so we need some blues. We could make that famous. How how, windbag would it be if we put, like, character, character picture of the three of us up behind us wearing blue jersey. We've been doing that for the last. That's true. Eight episodes. Yeah, we had it in my in the old studio. I don't see why we shouldn't. I mean, we look really. We look really good in it, too. Let me let me set the stage a little bit. Okay. You are listening to the grotesque dance podcast. I'm Adam London. This is Jay Helsing. That's Jason Byrne. Hello. You're listening to a show. This is an official thing. Everyone knows who the fuck we are. I know, but you're supposed to do the thing you're supposed to say. This is the thing. You're doing the thing right? We're doing the thing. The algorithm says we're doing a fine. Spoon feed the audience. What's going on here, you guys? Algorithms. Thank you. Tonight we are going to discuss money. How much money? All the money. All of it. I want all of it. All right. So, what the specifically does surpasses the specificity. It's not a word. It's got to be also known as specifically. Specifically, how we are teaching our children to have a relationship with money and kind of how we're educating them on what their relationship should be with money. Is that a fair? Yeah. Laying of the groundwork. I think this is more so just the absolute absurdity of raising kids and, the money aspect that they have no concept of it. And how do you teach them to have concept and value money? Because I'm willing to bet that my value of money is slightly different than yours, and is slightly different than Jason's. And, all we're trying to look for here is maybe a mild amount of responsibility. Maybe. Yes, I think responsibility is good. And I did not have any I mean, not any zero discussions about money as a kid. None. None. Like I never heard. Yeah. Hey, but this is this is how you create a budget, or this is what, this is what taxes are, and I mean nothing. We didn't talk about it. What the fuck is figure? So. But my my my situation's a little bit different. We did not have conversations like my parents. Like. Not that I remember sitting me down, and eventually we did, but, I literally, as a kid, I can remember this on Jonathan, one of the streets I lived on originally. I would I would ride my bike down the street and I would fill sandwich bags with acorns and then sell them back to the same damn people that own the tree that those acorns came off of, because I knew they would feel guilty that this kid came up to the the door and was like, would you like to buy a bag of acorns? You little manipulative. I was, I was a kid, but I wanted money. Like. But I was also maybe like a five year old entrepreneur. Entrepreneur? I don't know what you do with your money. Then. Did you save it? Did you spend it half and half? Where? Where was your angle? I didn't have anything to spend it on at that point, other than possibly riding my bike up to here in Saint Louis, Ben Franklin and buying Penny candy. Fuck, yeah, I know you. Yeah. I mean, Ben Franklin was the shit, but, I didn't have anything to spend money on, like, I was. I was just interested in having money. That's all I cared about. Yeah, I was a get a nickel, spend a dime. And it it burns holes in my pockets. I am I cannot be trusted with cash. I will, I will see, stand that sells rotten grapes and be somewhat interested in how much I can spend on rotten grapes that day. What can I use those for? Wow. I am, I don't I don't know that I would be classified as, financially responsible because I lean in the world of of bones. And the fact of if I have 100, I'll spend 105. But I have always been able to make money. I grew up in the restaurant industry. I started working literally when I was 13. Busing tables. We've been floors, washing dishes. And I have had a job since I was 13 years old. Yeah. Time out. I don't I don't mean to cut you off. Can kids not work at 13 anymore? No. What do you mean, no? That's. I work at 13. I stopped sausage casings. They can get that. Is that a euphemism? That's a real thing. All right, all right, I I've got I've got a real answer for you. Okay, I need to know because I tell you all the time, like you need to get a job because, like, I can't, I'm 13. I'm like, dude, I was I had a job where I received a check, all right, at 13. So. So here's the situation as, as I'm aware because I'm a I'm an employer. So I've looked into this and I've got kids who want to work. They've made special dispensations for agricultural scenarios. So they, they, they want to make it possible for kids to be able to work on their family farms and make money. Doesn't matter whether it's a farm or a family, family farm or nothing and say, it's cute that that's what you go to instead of child labor for agriculture, but industry. Yeah, but yeah. Fair enough. But, but, but if you go to the websites of the IRS in the most state and all that, that that's what it talks about. So at 14 you can start to work with the right permits, but you're very, very limited on what you're allowed to do. So you can't work on any kind of equipment that has potential injuries. You can't do this. You can't do that. My kids work at chick fil A and they have said they've asked Carter like, hey, you're gonna be 14 come summer. You should come work for us in parties, like, absolutely. Let's do that. Like, well, here's the job you can have. And it's more like sweeping the floors and putting trash away and things because he can't touch anything. Shake. That's what you fucking do when you're 13 and 14. I mean, this is what the. So this is the again the suffocation of our youth and the fact that it is this is not like a, hazing situation. If you start at 14 years old, at a job that 18, 19 year old people are doing, because you just that's all that you want to do, okay? But if you want to make money, you got to do what people want to pay you or can pay you for to make fucking money. Right? And it's in it's it's absolutely 1,000%. And I'm not going down this road in a very deep hole. But it is one of the things that pisses me off. The very, very, very most is I have multiple nephews and cousins that are teenagers, and when I'm doing work around my house and I need an extra pair of hands, I will call some of these kids and they are 14 to 18 years old and I go, hey, I'm doing this project in my yard and I'm willing to pay 20 bucks an hour cash to come help me, and I can guarantee that I know what their answer is going to be because I know them well. Half of them go. I'm their tell me when. Yeah, in the other half go, well, what am I going to be doing? Working for money. Literally whatever the fuck I ask you to do. Well, I mean, like, am I digging, like, am I using a shovel? Am I carrying stuff because that's either beneath them or it's too hard or they don't want to sweat. And it's one of the things that absolutely drives me fucking crazy, because when I started working and back in my day, I was I was working at 13 for $4.25 an hour with my dad taking taxes out of it, in which I was now making like $3 an hour busting my dick in a professional setting. And I'm offering the kids that are two four years older than that, $20 an hour cash to just do some labor. And they it's too hard. It's too hard. But but seriously, next time you do that, give me a call. I might fuck you. Sorry. I, you know, and this was what sparked this conversation and why we're we're on this is, I have I have two kids, 13 and ten. They are drastically different. Drastically different with their view of money. My 13 year old, has no real concept what his Christmas list is this year might be$5,000 of shit my ten year old I will take for his birthday to go to a store and go, dude, you can have anything that you want in here. Let's go. Let's go pick it out and he will go through and find something he likes. Look at the price tag and they go, no, dad, this is too expensive, and put it back without even telling me what the price tag is. In that same world, he is much more equipped. He's my worker. If I'm doing work on the house outside of the house, cutting grass, digging a hole, whatever it is, he is in my hip pocket. What can I do? I want to do this. I want to do this. If he does, you expect to get paid for it. Not even once. My 13 year old. If I reference potential work to be done around the house. He's a fart in the wind. I mean, it is. It is as if he is a world champion and seeker because he is gone. But he expects me to pay for anything that he wants. And so he actually learned a really, he learned a tough lesson. His birthday is in July in May, he said, hey, dad, I want this for my birthday. And I go, okay. He goes, I want you to buy it for me right now. And then that'll be my birthday present, you know, now, dude, I don't I don't know if it's going to work like that. I said, here's what we'll do. I'll split it with you. And what he wanted was $300. I said, I'll split it with you. I'll pay 150. You pay 150. He goes, I don't have $150. I go, cool. What we'll do is we'll do some out of the norm chores and things that I wouldn't normally ask you to do. I'll give you $15 an hour to do this stuff, and I'm either going to pay somebody to do it anyway, or you can work with me, what have you, and I know, keep track of it right here. You got to do ten hours. Nope. You got to do ten hours, and then you and then you're going to get what you want. And, so he did five hours and then was like, dad, I really, really need this for this reason. I'm impressed. You got five hours. Yeah. And I go, okay, I go, I'll tell you what. He. And so he he heard this from somewhere or whatever he goes. Will you loan it to me? Well will you, will you loan me. What's the juice on it the next. The next five, the next five hours. And I said, okay. And I said, okay, no big deal. I go, I will do that. I go, but you have two weeks to do, the next five hours after those two weeks, every week after that, I'm going to add another hour. You have to do. And so and you guys are at 47 hours of work, we legitimately. So that was in. So it was like the second week in May that that happened. We go through the, the full the rest of the month of May. He does zero hours now or June 1st, I'd say, dude, I'm at an hour or two. What you're doing. He was like, what? Why? Like we we talked about this. This is how shit works. And he was like, all right, fine, I'll I'll do this. And I had a list of things he could do, and I wasn't going to remind him. I'm like, hey, here's your list. You knock these things off the list and you write it down and we'll do the deal. 0.0 work got done. Now he gets his birthday is July 25th. So now he is seven weeks into his shoes. So his five hours is now turned into 12. And he, maybe you guys have addressed this already, but what's the end game like? I mean, what what what? He could just let this ride forever. He could let it ride forever. Except for now. It's birthday week. And he was like, dad, here's what I want for my birthday. And I went, sorry, bro. And he goes, what do you mean? I go, the the the call is in you. I go, I'm, I'm making the car. So I go, you can either a do 12 hours of week of work this week or b you get zero birthday present. And he was like, that's not fair. I go, but I don't know how I could be more fair on this. Like, this is what it is. And, so he goes, fine, I'll do the work. 0.0 hours of work, zero birthday present. And, you would have thought that my sister and my mom that I just lopped off his leg there, like you really didn't get a birthday present. I go, I did not get a birthday present. And they were like, what are you what are you trying to achieve here? And I go, I'm trying to achieve some sort of responsibility. And the fact that he asked me for multiple things, I agreed to multiple things, paid for something that he wanted upfront, gave him every opportunity to do. Very easy. We're not talking about digging a ditch to China here, right? We're talking about picking up dog poo in the backyard. We're talking about sweeping out the garage. We're talking to China. It would be really interesting vacuuming the house. We're not. I mean, very, very simple task for a 13 year old to do so. Anyway, he got zero birthday present, and, I wiped his slate clean. And so now takes us to two weeks ago. He was. Oh, hold on. Wait. So for no birthday present that wiped all of this stuff clean, I killed his debt. That was his birthday present. You so killed his debt. So now kind of like that two weeks ago. He wants a new hockey stick. I don't know if anybody out there knows what hockey sticks cost. They're not cheap. 300 $380 is the new latest and greatest hockey stick. Carter never got a hockey stick worth more than $75. Fair Joe has. Joe typically gets hockey sticks that are last year's model, and so it's you call it 280 to $350, $380 stick following year, whatever's left over those sticks end up being 150. Those are the normal sticks that he gets. So he goes, dad, I want the newest, latest and greatest stick. I go, all right, dude, how are you going to do it? He goes, well, the season starts next week. I want you to go buy it. I just did it. I just I just did what I was going to do. I asked you to stick. Well, I go, this is, this is a problem. I go, what are you willing to put into that? And he was like, well, buy it for me for Christmas. And I'm like, nah, that's not going to work. And, so we went through the deal and he goes, all right, I'll, we'll do the same deal. Buy it for me. Now tell me how many hours I got to work. I go, nope. You, you ruined your line of credit. You didn't come through, and the bank's not going to pay for it this time. So you defaulted on a loan once. You don't get the second shot, and he's all bent out of shape because debt. Why aren't you buying this for me? I don't I don't understand everybody else's. Dad buys him a hockey stick every year except for Carter's dad. I. I agree, bro, I agree, and I have bought you a hockey stick every single year. Except you want a hockey stick? That's three times what we normally spend. So you got to have some fucking stake in the game here. And he he is oblivious to it. And so I was, I sat up one night like, what the fuck did I do here? Like, how how has this gotten so far off the rails? That this is this is what this is. And, he's 13, so he's not totally grasping what's going on, but, I don't buy. I need to do something different to express to him the value of money and what it takes to make enough money to get what you want. Yeah. Adam. Situation different for you. Yeah. For sure. It's a little different. I mean, we've we've done a lot of different things, to try to create an understanding of, finances and, and, you know, financial responsibility. I think the first thing that we had to do in order to share or, teach some financial responsibility was to get financially responsible. Okay. So, I, I did a pretty good job of, of digging a hole, you know, over, over a certain amount of time that we then needed to dig out of and creating a system to dig us out of that hole. And being unapologetic about that system, I think, was huge because it gave us some context to be able to then kind of, you know, share with, with the boys and, and really, Harry, I mean, my oldest for sure, I think is the one that probably is going to need to have that conversation sooner than than my youngest. But, Harry, neither boy wants for anything, you know? I mean, our kids are. Our kids are spoiled. Spoiled? They're spoiled rotten, you know, relatively speaking, to from where? You know, how I grew up, my brothers and I grew up, however, I don't want them to be, unable to grasp this idea of, you know, financial health or wealth, whatever you want to call it. So we talk about money a lot in the house, you know, whether it's, how much something costs or, how much, you know, we make or we talk. It's funny. Like, he'll be like, dad, do I need insurance? Like, what's insurance all about? I'm like, oh, my gosh, let's talk about insurance for a little while. So we do talk about those things. I don't think that either one of them grasp the idea of the concept of money just yet. However they both have. They're both cash heavy. You know, they they've birthdays, first communion, all that stuff from the time that they were born. Until now, their coffers are overflowing. They are a first ATM. It is amazing, you know, and it's funny because, they both have different, you know, you know, coffee cans or whatever, holding, vats of cash in their rooms. And they'll. What's your address again? You're right. I have lots of guns. Every, you know, every once in a while, they'll they'll pull it out there, count it. And I'm like, this dude's got like, $2,200 for the cash in his room. Like, let me just, let me just grab a little. Let me go a little 50 spot. But it's really important to kind of share with them in my mind, like how we were able to get out of the hole that we were in. So, you know, I've had the conversation with my oldest of like, hey, you know, we have three different buckets and our money goes into this bucket and then we pull some out for bills, and then we put some over here for taxes. I'm a self-employed, person. So, you know, my self-employment tax and my, my quarterlies are a little bit different, you know, than than someone that's a W-2 employee. So educating them on that is super important to me. However, I still think that they just are like, fully aware that they're on the gravy train. We are walking, tonight we're walking the dog talking about, you know, hey, on on the show, we're going to talk about financial responsibility and talking to our kids. And she just kind of chuckled. She's like, what are you going to say? You know, like, like, are you going to lie? And I was like, no. And she's like, it was. We really, she's like, they don't spend their money. They spend our money. And I'm like, right? But the funny thing is, is as as my oldest has gotten older, he's become way more aware in windows, not not like holistically, but like in windows of, like like like kind of like you're young. It's like, oh, dad, we don't need to do that. Like, you know, that's that's too much. Or, you know, I don't really need that thing, but then they'll be like, well, so-and-so so-and-so joined PlayStation club and it's $23 a month. And what do you think about that? And I'm like, what do you think about that? Like, why don't you pick something up around here, throw your dirty socks down or something? But I honestly think that it's a bigger in my household anyways. It is a bigger conversation than money. It is. I want them to be able to do their laundry. I want them to be able to make their own meals. I want them to be able to do the dishes. I want them to be able to pick up dog shit without just mashing it into the yard. Like the the, the small asks that we have are so laborious to them that you would think that we're asking them to like, do quantum math. And it's like, dude, just pick up the dog shit and pick it all up. Just pick up the poop. It's not that difficult. I'm not asking you to go out there and try to figure out how to grow grass. Just pick up the shit. And it's it is that that drives me insane because the money thing, they'll figure out money's difficult in general, and there's so many nuances to it. Taxes and checking and savings and interest and compound interest and all this different stuff. They're going to figure it out because I think, like, I'm an entrepreneur who talks about money a lot. And Sarah has basically managed our household for forever. And so from a bill, you know, standpoint, she is is very educated on like how to manage a household. And so I think they're going to be just fine when it comes to that. My fear is like they're going to turn 18 and be like, oh, which one's hot water and which one's cold? Food goes here like, like that's where I'm nervous. Like the money thing I don't really care about because and to be totally honest, we are so blessed that that we've worked really hard to put us put ourselves in a position where we, you know, we can have kids that don't want for anything. But at the end of the day, it's like, that can all go away like that. And I'll just go find a different hustle and just go do something else. Hot topic in my family, because we have, four siblings. What is your take on an allowance? They don't get it. My kids don't get an allowance because they don't do shit respectfully like I wish I would. And I and I mean like a regular allowance where you get $12 for doing the dishes or whatever it is they don't do, they don't do those things. Now, if I ask them if I say, hey, take out the trash, they'll take out the trash. If I say do the dishes, they'll do the dishes. But there's no regularity to that. I'm not paying a salary for me to have to put in a service desk ticket for you to take the trash out. Same here. Like we don't have chores. We don't have a regular routine, so therefore there is no allowance. However, we also don't have guardrails on what we spend, what we don't spend on, so they pretty much get whatever the hell they want, regardless of whether they're doing. Would you give them an allowance if they did that stuff consistently 100,000%, because it would be money so well spent. And here's the thing. It's so it's funny because sometimes I'll go to, to my oldest and I'll say, dude, you got to get a job, man. Like you gotta do. You gotta go knock on doors, and we need some of these yard do to sell acorns to the poor lady that's got a pin oak, like, you got to do something, and he's like 13. You need a job. And I was like, well, then you need to do some stuff around here and I'll pay you. He's like, but that's your money. You're just going to pay me with your money. And I'm like, what do you think we're doing now? Yeah, I, I don't know if I told this on the, on the show and if I did. Sorry guys. But it's funny. So we went to the minifig store for for Gus's birthday minifigures. Yep. Okay. It's like a Lego store. It's called the minifig store. Yeah. So we go there and we're walking around and at that, when we went there, Harry, the the Apple Pay or Apple Wallet or whatever was new to him. Yeah. And he had just gone to Six Flags, I think, with Carter and like, I had loaded him up some cash on there, like, so we could get a soda or whatever turkey leg. And we're at the minifig store, and he wants to get a Steamboat Willie. Lego minifig thing. It's like 30 bucks, which I thought was pretty dope that that's what he wanted. Yeah, that's pretty cool, right? So he wants to get it, and it's like 30 bucks and he's like that. He's like, I'm going to pay for it with my money. I'm like, dude, that's awesome. So I go over and I'm talking to Sarah and Mike Harris came up and he wants to buy that himself. And she's like, hey, dummy, who do you think loaded up the apple wall? And I was like, oh yeah. She's like, yeah, Shaq. I mean, I get the sentiment was good, but it's the same thing. It's my money, dad. Now here's something that we did. I'm curious if either of you guys have done. It's been a few years. I think Harry wanted a Wii U or switch or something. And so we made this, this board, this, this cash board, and any time he would do something, he would tell us or validate it with us. We'd put a sticker on there. At the end of that week, we would pay like, okay, so, throwing your walking your clothes to the laundry room was like $0.50. Doing the dishes was a dollar. The cool thing was we made it super expensive to, like, write someone a letter. And at the time, my mom was still alive. She was sick. And so he would write letters to my mom, or he would write letters to Sarah's mom. I think that's freaking brilliant. It was so cool because, like, it was like $2.50 to write a letter. Yeah. And so he would do it worth way more than, oh my goodness. I couldn't even imagine their experience of getting a letter from their grandson. Right? Especially like with my mom going through. But you know, what she was going through at the time was probably awesome. Sure. And like it took months for him to save up this money to buy. I think it was the switch to buy a switch. I would do that a million times over. I would figure out, well, like what the best way of of learning soft skills, like maybe like call your grandma on the phone or something like that. I think it's brilliant. Like he's 13. So the the concept of him wanting money for a car is not that far away. Yeah. And I just don't want to buy a car. So I mean, I'm going to have to, but it's really, really quickly. Mom, I know you're listening. When the boys start calling you more often, it's not because I'm paying them. It's because they. Yes, it is that they want to talk to you, right? Yes it is. All right, so here's the deal. You are I think it's called a chore chart. Have you guys ever done something like that? Have, you're 50% right. You're 50% wrong every time. Yes. Every time. I'm just going to lay it out there for you. I, I got all the answers, I do. I have all the opinions, and I'm right and you're wrong. But I'm willing to listen to you. But you'll still be wrong. Thank you. So I love the idea of writing a letter to somebody. Those soft skills, the the outside of the norm situation and and conditioning them to, you know, reach out and tell people how they feel. Situation. I am adamantly opposed to an allowance for adamantly, adamantly, adamantly, to an allowance for normal chores around the house that make the house go. You're part of the family. We, are you want for nothing? I take you where you need to go. I pay for 100% of everything that you would need. If I am going to ask you to unload the dishwasher or take out the trash, or put your fucking clothes in the hamper, I'm not going to pay you for that. I am very open to paying for other things that are a little bit outside of that norm of the house running. In a normal scenario, if you want to make me dinner, I'll pay you for that because I'm going to pay to go out to dinner anyway. I'm not going to pay you to do the dishes of the plates, forks, knives and glasses that you just used for the dinner that I shop for, paid for, made and am feeding you whatever the fuck you want. And so I am. I feel like you, as a contributing member of the family, need to have some sort of stake in the game, some sort of responsibility that is just you keeping track of your own shit for just you. And so it's, it's believe me, it's a losing fucking battle. But I that's where I, that's where I come down on the situation. I want them to want to make money, and I want to give them opportunity to go above and beyond. But getting paid for just the bare minimum. I'm not on board with, I would love I would love to get to the place where there's an allowance. I will I, I honestly and we and we've talked about it, we've never really put it in place. But I would love to be like, all right, it's Tuesday, you're on dishes today and it's Thursday. You're on dog poop. And it's I think we've even I've even written out a chore chart before. I don't even pick up dog poop. You know what I mean? Every 2 or 3 months it I just different that's a different separate issue. But I do wiser. I would love to get to the point to where it's like, yeah, dude. Like here's your 20 bucks. Like I remember I had I got an allowance when I did my stuff and as a 13, 14, 15 year old kid, like I needed money for cigarets. So my 20 bucks on Fridays was great. Like, you fucking. I needed to buy some cool natural lights from Ever Hearts Pharmacy or Hampton House. Sure, like I needed to go out and do what I wanted to do and that was how I did. It was I would work, you know, do whatever I had to do during the week, and I'd get ten bucks or five bucks or 20 bucks or whatever it was, and then I could go do what I needed to do. So yeah, I think, I think there's some health to that. At the same time, this is where I kind of fall into, I, I probably contribute to the pacification or whatever you called it. But like, I don't I don't think it's in the dictionary. Just in maybe I, I want my kids to be kids for as long as they possibly can. Be sure, for every ounce that they can be innocent or semi innocent children. I want them to be that. And so I will pander to that notion as long as I possibly can. And if it's me spoiling the shit out of them while trying to inject lessons into their brains, you know, along the way, I'm going to do it. Whether it's you want to jump in bed with me because you can't sleep, do it. You want, like it doesn't matter what it is. Be a kid and you don't need to have responsibilities. At nine years old and 13 years old, you can just be a kid. Because at some point you're not going to have a choice but be rewarded for what you. Yeah, yeah. And I and I, I mean to be totally like Frank like all three of us. I would judge as being good, good fathers and leading our children on the right path. So I don't think that there's one way to do it, or any one of us are better or worse than the others. I am just a proponent. And and part of it is because I had a large portions of my childhood robbed from me, and I don't. I don't want that for my kids. I want my kids to be kids until I don't care if they're 17 years old. They wake up and be like, oh fuck, I'm kind of an adult. Okay, let's figure it out now. But I don't want them to think that they need to be something now that they're not. All right. So I'm going to I'm going to bust up my 13 year old, and then I'm going to. And then I'm going to brag on them a little bit. My 13 year old will do the very bare minimum that he thinks he can get away with to earn some sort of dollars. So, I don't know. Let's call it six weeks ago. Pulled out a $20 bill. I said, here's deal. We need to pick up dog poop in the backyard. Who wants it? And Joe was like, I'm on it. I need money because it's it's on fire when it gets into his hand. And I said, okay. One stipulation. You can go out there, pick up dog poop. If I come out there after you tell me that you're done, and I can see more than two piles of dog poop, you get nothing. And then Dan gets to go outside and pick up dog poop. And if he if I go out there and I see no dog poop, he gets your $20. And he was like, that's not fair. I go, you work, I'm going to pay you for a job. We're going to do the job. You're going to do the whole you're going to work at it, and I'm going to give you your $20. Dan is detailed about what he's doing. If he's going to do something he'll do. He'll sit down to do the whole it's he's he's thorough. If he's putting away his clothes, all of his clothes get put away. Yeah. If Joe's putting away his clothes, half his clothes get put away, and then he gets bored with it, and then he takes all the rest of clean clothes and throws them back in the laundry. Yeah. And and and then I, I want to I want to murder him. So. Sure. Shit. I said, dude, I'm telling you, you're you're not. If you don't do it right, you're not getting any. And he went out, picked up dog poop. He was out there for ten minutes, and I've got a half acre yard, and I've got four dogs at my house right now. So there's a pretty significant amount of dog poop. So he comes back and he's like, all done. He reaches, he grabs $20 and I go, oh, I haven't even been outside yet. He was like, go ahead. And I walked outside. Got it all. I didn't even get to the yard. I was just on the patio and I was like, give me my $20 back. And I go, Dan, you won $20. And he was like, on it runs out. I mean, it wasn't even I mean, I'll bet you he didn't get half of the dog poop that was out there. And then he was all furious because his brother stole his money, his brother smarter than him now, one scenario, second scenario, two years ago was 11 years old. They want to run a lemonade stand because they want to make money. They're going to charge a dollar a cup for lemonade. Love it. Love the entrepreneurial spirit. Joe is a leader. Joe is charismatic. Joe tells his cousins and Dan, you guys work the stand. We are back on a cul de sac. It's not a through street like you have to. The only the eight houses behind us are who goes through there. I didn't pay hardly any attention. I went to the store and on the way out of the store, Joe was at the top of the street with a sign flagging people into our neighborhood to sell them lemonade. Mike. Oh, that's pretty fucking smart. Yeah. Right there. Drive a quarter of a mile. Yeah, that's pretty smart. So I, I go to the store, I come back, I don't know, an hour later, my ex-wife is at the house. They're not home by themselves. And, come back, I go inside, they're out there. I mean, they were out there grinding. They set up a pop up tent there. Mix it up. Lemonade. They've got cups. They do all the deal. They're out there for maybe three hours and nice day. And they come in and they're pumped. And I'm like, gosh, you guys really, really good job. And like that was so fun. We made a lot of money. And I'm like, oh, that's awesome. These fucking kids made $250 in three hours because Joe was out on the main street just waving down cars and talking to people and, and and go down and, and sold the fuck out of some lemonade. And that's genius. Super pumped about it if he was super pumped about it. But that to him was fun and he was willing to go all in, and he saw some of the money rolling in. And that was great. So those four kids chopped up 250 bucks in cash. His son had lemonade. His science had helped my my friend Johnny with his broken leg. Yeah. Now, did you did you tell Joe that since he was the salesman that he was deserves an extra commission? Yeah. It was. He did a little bit. We got in there. All right, we got in there. It's just me. Did his part. He does part, but that, you know, that world was great. And if he could have that enthusiasm about what he's doing, but, I mean, it's hard to be enthusiastic about picking up dog poop or doing the dishes or doing whatever, but, you got to be willing to do some shit that you want and some shit that you don't want. Well, and I think is the piece that that resonates big with me and something that I'm trying to work on with the boys, in my house is if you're going to do something, do it purposefully, have some intentionality behind it. If you're going out there to pick up dog poop and you happen to stumble into four piles of dog poop, and those are the four that you pick up. Okay, I get that. However, maybe there's a better way to do it. Maybe you can literally like when I pick it up, I walk in a line, I walk this way, I take a couple of steps. I walk that way, I take a couple of steps because we get a big yard too. And it's like, okay, oh, now I know that if maybe one pile has snuck past me, but he literally will walk out and he'll stumble into a couple Masham into the grass trying to pick them up and then walk in and be like this suck. You picked up dog poop sucks. Is this dog scoopers broken? What is happening right now? It's the same one I use every time. I will say, if you let the dog poop sit there long enough, it all gets hard. It's easier to pick up. It's oh, I can't, I can't do it. Sure. So so the last thing that I want to touch on is it's kind of how we, how we are or are we preparing our kids for, for anything significant from a financial perspective. So for me, it's high school. And obviously, my oldest has an idea of where he wants to go. It's where I went to high school. It's not cheap. And so I, I don't want the men his mentality to be, well, what mom and dad are paying for high school I want and we've we've told him like you can contribute to this. You can contribute to you going to high school. It's with your grades. It's with, you know, the, the and being a part of the NHS, it's like you are going to get scholarship money just by being a good student. And we're going to talk to the school to find out if there's anything else that you can, you know, apply for. And if there is that way to apply, that is how you contribute. I will take care of the rest. Your mother will take care of the rest. But there are ways for you to offset that cost, because once it comes to after high school, it's for you to figure out. But like, I'm not paying for you to go to a four year university in major in keg stands, it's not going to happen. Another day, another episode, another episode. But I want to be to give you the opportunity for a higher education. But you got to have some skin in the game. So let me ask the two of you guys this when do you think that you learned about the reality of money, how hard it is to make money, or how hard it is to pay back money? 34 years old? Okay, like, to be totally honest, I didn't go to college. So I joined the union when I was 17 years old and started pouring concrete and did that for a few years. I was making more money than I should have been making at 18, 19, 20 years old and then went into an industry where I was I was, you know, lucky enough to have a really great mentor and a guy named Russ, Russ Bryant. I'm sure you're not listening, but you should, who taught me how to live in that corporate world and taught me how to be a driven, kind of a self-starter and really had a lot of entrepreneurial spirit, that that he leaked on to me. And that is how I kind of started to understand money and understand the concept of money, but I can't I mean, we didn't have any money growing up. So when I, when I got a raise and I was making 75 grand, I literally called my wife crying, thinking, I'm won lottery. I was like, we made it, we made it. And that I my concept of finances and what it took to live as an adult was so jaded, that I just didn't know until I started having kids, until I started realizing, like, they they need every day I can go days without eating. They need to eat every day, and they're they things go poop goes in places, and I pay for that too. Like, once that started happening, it's hard not to realize that how real it is. Yeah, but you when you real when the money hit you, I don't know, I mean, we already talked about, like, I was five years old and selling bags of of ever of acorns just to make money. I do think, though, that once we got to a point where man, it's a tough question because even through high school, I knew it. I had a job for the first time when I was 16. I, I've done very, very well for myself, I would say, for jobs. So when I was 16, I got a job at, at a company here in Saint Louis called Soccer Master that I was making way more than I should have for a 16 year old. I started with Anheuser-Busch when I was 19, so that was awesome. Plus, I got two cases of free beer when I turned 21, so that paid off in a, in a different way. So I've, I've done pretty well at making sure that I had income, but I, I agree, though, that it wasn't until there was a house involved and a family involved that I realized exactly how much money was important and understanding how to distribute it the right way. Right. So yeah, our kids are a long way from being there and being able to realize that I made a lot of money, as a kid and as a high schooler and in college and waiting tables and bartending. And I had I was cash heavy and I bought whatever I wanted to buy. And I was literally one day, at any point in time from making two, three, $400. So I was never, it it, it helped me and it hurt me because, my view on money is I can make more of it. There's people that are willing to pay you money for lots and lots of other stuff. If I need money, I'll go get it. And, the one time when I say the one time, the first time that I got myself into a bad spot, I was 19 years old and I learned a very, my dad taught me a very hard, very good lesson that people still give him shit about to this day. I for the first time, I'm in, I'm in college and I'm playing volleyball, and and I don't have time to work because I'm going to school. I'm traveling for volleyball, I'm in practice, I'm working out. And, these wonderful, wonderful people met me on campus and they said, hey, would you like to apply for a credit card? Yes. And I said, yes. Well, I'm only 19. I get no, no, no, you you can apply for this credit card. So endless money. So I, so I apply for a credit card, I get awarded a credit card and because of what my history was, that was on my work, how much I've made, they awarded me an $8,000 credit limit at 19 years old, I proceeded, and this is no fucking joke. I, I max that credit card out in 45 days, so now I have maxed out an $8,000. All I gotta do is swipe. And I had a just a just a fantastic salad month. 45 days. Right. Salad months. So, so now I have I have realized I've maxed out this credit card, and, they would like, some money in return. And so, I go to my parents, they go, hey, I fucked up, you know, what did you do? And I go, I opened a credit card, and, I, I spent some money on it, and they go, all right, how, how much you spend? I said eight grand. And my dad goes, how the fuck did you spend $8,000? And very carefully, you know, a little bit here, a little bit there. And, let me go ahead and just detail it for you. So he goes, okay, what's your plan? And I go, I, the, the the plan started 38 seconds ago when I said, dad, mom, I, I fucked up and I did some shit, and, And so my dad goes, okay, I think it's time for you to figure some shit out. And I said, all right, what do you think? He goes, your car is in your name. So the only collateral that you have, you need to go to a bank and get a loan and pay that off. I go, how do I do that? He goes, I guess you should figure it out. I mean, you were smart enough to open a credit card and you make plenty of money, you know, working at the restaurant, doing different stuff. So, I mean, figure it out. Fine. And I was anti-authority and and basically from when I was 17 until now, I had my I never asked my parents for money ever, except for this particular instance because I was buried. So I go, all right. So I drove up to the bank that we bank that I walked in, you know, piss and vinegar and hey, Mr. Banker, I, you know, need to apply for a loan. Okay, cool. I sit down and the guy is like, all right, what are you trying to do? I said, I need, you know, an $8,000, you know, line of credit or loan. And he's like, okay, what's, you know, what do you do for a job? What do you have for collateral? Whatever. And dude was like, dude, I can't give you 8000. I can't give you money and you're broke. It's not gonna happen. So that dude walks me out the door, I go to a second bank, that dude walks me out the door. So now I come back home, I'm like, hey, the bank won't give me money. And my tech was no shit. Oh, I can't believe it. That's not how I expected that to go. So I go, he goes, what's your plan? I go, man, you keep asking me that. I'm telling. I'm trying to figure the fuck out. He goes, well, you can quit school or you can quit volleyball and go back, go to work and you know, you can make a grand and, you know, month and a half, no problem with what you're doing at the bar. And, and, so I go, I don't want to do that. I had to go to school and I love playing volleyball. And they're paying half of my school for me playing. So he's like, okay. So he goes, your mom and I go to loan for the money. We're going to pay it off for you. Oh, but the juice and I go, all right, great. And I literally big deep breaths. Thank you. Yes. Oh yeah. He goes, I think 10% interest is fair. And, he goes, you're going to pay 10% juice on it. And I go, all right, well, at this point in time, I don't I don't know about interest. I'm just learning that, you know, the credit cards charge me 18.5. Ten sounds better than that. So he goes, but, I'm not waiting around for this, and I need a little fire on your ass. He goes, I'm going to charge you 10% a month. And I go, 10% a month. And he's like, yeah, he goes, I'm not. This isn't a fucking charity here. Let's And so he he charged me 10% a month. I ended up paying and it took me four months. I paid it off. And he was he was at me at, like, literally first of each month, he'd knock on my door, be like, hey, you got the you got you got my money. I'm like, I do have your money. And so we went through this and I paid it all off, and and I haven't owed them money since, or anybody. I have a credit card, and I understand where I'm getting myself into problems where I'm not. But, that was a really hard situation. And some of my aunts and uncles are like, Roger, what the fuck? Like, I mean, you just put the fucking screws to him. 10% juice on a month, and I'm Mike and but it taught me something and it sucked. And I thought it was a huge fucking dick for doing it, but I'll never know. Those are, those are those are important lessons I, I think I want to be able to. So you Jay, you had asked like when, when did you when did we learn about money? I want to be able to to have my kids understand the pitfalls that like like that kind of a pitfall before it. It hurts them because that's my fear. Is that like, I can remember we said and I had just bought a house. We were living there for like a year, maybe two years. And I again get get a nickel, spend a dime. I went to a dealership. I drove a brand new car off the lot. I brought it home to surprise her, like she was going to go, oh, this is great. That was not the reaction. It wasn't. It was not great. We were broke and I brought a brand new car home. Two months later, three months later, that car disappeared from in front of our house. I told her it got stolen or towed because I parked in front of a fire hydrant. It got fucking repossessed because I didn't realize you're supposed to pay for those. Oh. All right. So, like, you want they want money in return for you? Wouldn't even. I didn't know, I didn't know those are the types of things that, like, I literally didn't realize that if I just missed a couple payments, I didn't know somebody would come pick it up. I like I thought they would be like, we're serious. We want our money. No, seriously. And then they would be like, oh, you can't pay well, what can you pay like? That was my understanding of money back that instead they were like, we're going to take this shit back. Yeah. It's ours now. This year is are you pay us for what you owe Ian, your credit's all fucked. I didn't realize that was a thing. So, like, that's the type of shit that, like, I don't want my kids to be like, hey, dad, I owe eight grand, to because I. I went to this bar every day for 45 days and bought all my friends all the things. Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. Golf clubs. I got some money. Oh, I'm sure, I'm sure of it. I did the deal like that. But that's the that's the type of stuff. When we talk about financial responsibility, it's not like here's a checking account, here's a bank account, here's a this. It's like, hey man, if you don't do things the right way, you're gonna you could really screw up years of your life. Yeah. So that's, that's I think in my mind, that's why I think we wanted to talk about this of like, what is your plan? My plan is to just talk about money and to just be super, super brutally honest with my kids of, like, here's, here's what me and mom have been through, and here's what we do to combat that. Yeah, I think the biggest thing for me is, I'm trying to not scare them. Yeah, like like I want them to have a healthy fear, but I'm a cheap bastard. Like, there's there's no arguing that. Like, I didn't confirm. Yeah, I have an issue spending money on anything. It's terrible. But that has been imparted to some degree on my kids who are like. But, dad, it costs this. But data costs that I. I appreciate that, but I also don't want them to be worried about regular life expenses that just have to happen, right? Right, right. My last thing on this is I want them to feel some sort of sense of pride of of buying something that they want, knowing they can afford it and doing it the right way. Because I know that I've had a lot of those scenarios of things that I'm like, that's the goal. I want that. Yeah. And instead of that being, here's the old credit card and I'll figure it out later that they are mindful enough, responsible enough that they go, all right, I'm going to squirrel away 50 bucks here and 100 bucks there, and I'm going to do all the stuff I'm supposed to do. And I let that sit. And now I achieved. And now I can buy that and be super fucking pumped about it. Do not feel guilty, not feel stressed, not take away from anything else. And that took me a long time to figure out. Yeah. And do you remember what your first thing was that you saved? You knew it. You knew you wanted it. You saved up for it, you got enough for it and you bought it. Yep. What was it? My big screen TV in the basement when I built the stadium seating. Okay. That was that was the first thing I was 20, 20 years old, and, we did not have cable in the house. I never had cable until I was 21, 20 years old. And we had, you know, normal, standard 28 inch tube TVs, whatever. And I wanted a big screen TV, and I wanted cable, and I saved money squirreled away, remember, exactly where it was. Like, this wasn't in the checking or savings account that's putting cash in a drawer and went in to get a superstore. And I fucking bought and not on Sunday. You didn't. Not on Sunday. Every day but Sunday. But I spent I watched, I shopped, and I bought a big screen, 52 inch big giant ass square box of a TV for $1,800 and put it in my basement. It's like $300 today. Yeah, right. Built stadium seating and had cable installed in my house while my parents were in Germany for two weeks. And that that was the first, like, big deal. But like, I had saved up money for hockey sticks and roller blades and different stuff. But that was the first like real big deal that I was like, I fucking did something here. And that was my that was that one at home. You know, I, I really didn't have I kind of set it earlier, like, I didn't have this, this mentality of saving for anything. I just kind of flew by the seat of my pants. The the biggest thing that I most probably like, proud of my patients and saving was I just bought a new truck recently. It's literally parked outside, right? It's parked outside right now and it cash for that. I didn't pay Big Baller. Good night. But, I put a significant down payment down on it and, I managed the, the payments in a way that I know that it's going to be paid off. Well, well, in advance. And I drove, a a hunk of shit for a couple of years because I wanted that truck. You. I mean, you literally kept trading in hunk for hunk for hunk for, for years because you had somebody that worked at a yes. Yeah. So hunk for hunk for hunk, and then all of a sudden for two for probably three years. Yeah. So my old I had a silver. I made fun of you or made fun of you plenty, I know I, I had a Silverado that I got rid of. It had almost 300,000 miles on or just over 300,000 miles on it. And when that died, I, I kind of told myself of like, I that's I want, I want a new truck and I know I can't have it now because it's going to be an astronomical. And I just waited and I saved and I saved and I saved and I, I mean, we, we put ourselves in a position where lucky enough to, to be able to do it. But when it, when I saw the truck that I wanted, I called my buddy, you know, Mike, Sinclair and, Rob Fulmer, who's an awesome dude who takes care of me. He's been he's been out of my family for a long time. And and they took care of us, and I said, I want that truck. That's the truck I want. And so he's like, come up. And we made it work. And I'm just super excited. Like, I don't buy nice things. I don't require much. But I wanted that truck. You and I, I'll talk the value of cash later because, we need to talk. Okay. But I'm proud of you for buying that truck. That's awesome. I love you, but I feel bad because my my story is way earlier and way less money. But, was it a bag of acorns that contributed to it? It was my first communion. It was a whole bunch of things. But I was so proud. So proud. I'd like I can I can literally close my eyes. Remember walking in a children's palace, no longer their children's palace buying, and then Tendo entertainment system? Yeah. Hell yeah. For 200, $220 or whatever it was. Came with Super Mario Brothers and Duck Hunt. Yeah, I did, I did, yeah, I bought that shit with my own money. That's great. And I, I like, I could still like, just, like literally close my eyes and remember it. And it was a it's not a truck. It's not, it's not nearly as exciting. But it's pretty damn exciting. Dude. $220 at 12. But I was no. Well, how are you? First communion? You're probably nine years old. 7 or 8. 7 or $820 might be 20 fucking thousand. That's a big deal. And and I, I so excited about it. But all right, well in this episode, hopefully the people listening and watching, can appreciate some of the bullshit that we go through that everybody goes through trying to manage your kids through money and through, just the responsibility as a whole. But, had fun with it a little bit. Great work. Dude, I love seeing you. Yeah. Good to be here. Cheers. JJ great work on the ones and twos, as always. Yeah, I appreciate it. If if, if you're listening to this on Apple Podcasts or Spotify or all the mediums, please, give us a, like, a five star, like, and, you know, subscribe to the show if you're listening to us or watching us on, on YouTube, please, subscribe to the channel so that you can get notifications when, when new stuff comes up. On. Do we have merch yet? Oh, yes we do. Thanks for asking. We got merch. Yes, I need some. Com we got shirts, we got hats. So much more to come. But please take advantage. The opportunity right now to go out there, check out the merch. All of your guys purchases go right back into the show. We're looking to add some decor some new technology, all that good stuff. So please, please, please check out the merch on Grown ass dads.com. That's it. All right, we're out. Love you guys. See you at peace. Grown ass dads out.