House Flipping vs Renting: Which Strategy Builds More Wealth in Real Estate Investing?

In this episode of the Rent-ish Podcast, hosts Zach and Patrick are excited to welcome Mackaylee, a powerhouse in the Kansas City real estate space as an agent, investor, and house flipper with over 10 years of experience. Over the past four years alone, she’s flipped more than 300 units, generating over $45 million in revenue.

In addition to flipping, Mackaylee currently self-manages around 50 rental units, which bring in roughly $80,000 in monthly rent. She’s also actively overseeing multiple rehab projects at any given time, giving her a hands-on perspective across every side of real estate investing.

In this episode, Mackaylee shares her journey into real estate, what it’s really like managing rental properties, and why consistency (and creativity) are essential to long-term success, especially in house flipping. She also breaks down what she’s seeing in the Kansas City rental market, why rental demand is so strong, and the key factors investors should consider when evaluating a property, including curb appeal, market dynamics, and deal strategy.

Whether you’re trying to decide between flipping vs renting, learning how to analyze investment properties, or looking for real-world advice on getting started in real estate investing, this episode is packed with practical takeaways you can apply immediately.

Check out Mackaylee on her website HERE!

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Transcript

Zach (00:00)
going on, everybody? Welcome to the Rent-ish podcast. I'm Zach here with my cohost, Patrick.

Patrick (00:05)
two hosts on a mission to learn real estate investing. On this podcast, we'll share what we're discovering about property management, wild stories, and the lessons we pick up along the way.

Zach (00:15)
that's the fun part. We're learning as we go, just like you. We're bringing the experts to guide us, break down the tricky stuff, and figure it all out together. So let's laugh, learn, and dive into real estate. Patrick, we're on a roll with guests. We've got a lot of awesome people coming to talk with us about real estate and property management. And this one, this episode is no different. we get into everything,

Patrick (00:27)
Yes.

Zach (00:35)
follow The Rentish Podcast on basically any podcast service around the world, Spotify, Apple, we're on basically any service that you get your podcast. questions at TheRentishPod.com if you have feedback or maybe a guest suggestion, or if you yourself maybe are into property management and wanna join the show, feel free to send us a message and come along. We'd love to have you on the pod. like us, us a thumbs up, give us a rating, five stars if you absolutely can, that'd be great. If you could just give us a rating and review podcast services all around the globe.

But enough of that, enough of the plugs, enough of the stuff. got a very, very, very special guest here. Today we're joined by she's a powerhouse in the Kansas City real estate space as an agent, investor and house flipper with over 10 years of experience. Over the past four years, she's flipped more than 300 units, generating over 45 million in revenue. In addition to flipping, McKaylee currently self-manages around 50 rental units, which together generate roughly 80,000 in monthly rent.

also actively overseeing multiple rehab projects at any given time, giving her hands-on perspective across all sides of real estate investing. is also a certified professional with Minority and Women's Business Enterprise, innovation and diversity the industry while creating sustainable housing solutions in her community. We'll be talking with her about her journey, how she evaluates deals, and how she's built a real estate business that constantly delivers results. McKaylee, welcome to the show.

Mackaylee (01:58)
Thank you guys excited to get the conversation going.

Zach (02:01)
for sure. How's your day going so far? you enjoying the what's what's up with Kansas City right now? How's everything over there?

Mackaylee (02:07)
Kansas City is going to be part of the big snowstorm coming this weekend. we've had some pretty mild temperatures, but it always gets cold and it snaps back. So we experience all the seasons.

Zach (02:22)
that is the talk of the town right now. We're based in Cincinnati. So it's like, you know, everyone loves a small talk about the weather and that's the very it's like get ready for snowmageddon. It's it's happening. Like go to your store and get all the milk and bread that you can possibly fit in your trunk. It's time.

Patrick (02:36)
People are acting like it's the apocalypse right now. Like my mom called me yesterday to make sure like I'm prepped for like the end of the world. It's just like, I don't know, we've had snow before. We'll see if it's as bad as they're saying, but.

Zach (02:38)
Yeah, seriously.

Yeah,

see. as we wait out the oncoming snowpocalypse, I think we can talk about real estate and property management, flipping houses. think that's a good way to pass the time. Yeah, right. Tell me about it. So, I mean, basically, I mean, we just kind of want to hear a little bit about you, McKaylee, like about your story, where you came from, like how you got into the real estate industry and like what kind of makes you tick. We'd love to kind of hear a bit about your background.

Mackaylee (02:48)
Yeah, agreed.

Patrick (02:58)
That's such a good, what a segue. Way to go.

Mackaylee (03:15)
Cool, I have been in the real estate industries, like you said, 10 years. I kind of fell into real estate. went to college a little bit, ⁓ not for real estate, not even for business, but for art. I was going to be in the art industry, but I quickly learned that I was making more money as a server in the service industry than I...

Patrick (03:28)
You

Mackaylee (03:41)
was going to in the art industry. So I quickly learned college kind of wasn't my thing. I tried some other things such as network marketing, but ultimately just kind of fell into a path of real estate and I grew to really like it. I am just kind of naturally ⁓ good at marketing and ⁓ advertising. And that was kind of my first role with real estate.

and social media and there that's what kickstarted me.

Zach (04:11)
Okay. Well, when people hear that you manage 50 plus units, 80K a month in rent, what's an assumption that they might make about your work that you just don't think is true? Like, or you're like, like, ⁓ you tell people what you're doing for a living. And then they're like, what's that assumption that people might make?

Mackaylee (04:28)
think at this point, now that 10 years has don't really know the whole story or the full picture or what it's taken to get here. And now, people assume that maybe it's just a passive investment when the checks just show up every month. But in reality, any real estate investor knows that it's a very active business. There's a lot of systems and

and vendors and tenants and things that in into managing property. And it's been built. It just didn't happen overnight.

Patrick (05:07)
like you said, it obviously takes a lot of routine and hard work. What are some of routine, maybe more boring tasks or maybe ⁓ less sexy tasks to talk about that need to happen and are very necessary to get results in the real estate world that people who are not in real estate might not think of?

Zach (05:18)
you

Mackaylee (05:28)
it's a lot consistency, a lot just systems in place that ⁓ have to be built, lot of analyzing a lot of time wasters. I can't even begin to explain all of the time that is spent on analyzing a deal, checking the title on a deal, ready to maybe even close a deal.

and then for everything to fall apart or something's wrong. a lot ⁓ of time invested and not all of it works out. But just kind of due to the volume for me, ⁓ it does work out in the long run. But if you're just doing one or two deals in a month and expecting them all to work out, that's just not the way that it ever goes.

Patrick (06:20)
I have another question, actually. This is going back to your art ⁓ background, because Zach and I were both like film majors in college, actually, or media majors. there anything like, I know this is probably like slightly off topic, but with the background in art, is there anything like creative like that that you still kind of get to do on a maybe daily, weekly, monthly basis in the real estate world?

Mackaylee (06:40)
Yeah, definitely as flipper, I definitely have somewhat of an eye for design. So, I'm rehabbing quite a bit of houses a month, but I like to and I'm not actually in the field either. You might find that a little crazy. I'm really just, you know, I have I have somebody in the field who's taking pictures and videos and seeing the houses, but really any of the houses that I buy and I'm not even really seeing in person, but when I can.

you know, say, hey, let's do an accent wall here. Let's try this backsplash or this color scheme or something like that. That's where things know, I can use my creative touch. Also in a lot of times having to redesign a layout and whatnot, I've learned a few different tools online to be able to ⁓ do that and to visually show, you know, the contractor or construction manager.

my ideas that way. So I think that's kind of where a lot of my creativeness comes into designing and then also, know, some of the what I do online marketing in terms of finding tenants or buyers, I can use some creativeness there as well.

Zach (07:53)
Cool. we talked about Kansas City yet? I mean, we talked, you gave the introduction at the very beginning. I don't know if Patrick brought in, we're so curious to hear from other people when we have guests on the show to talk about, like, their opinions on their specific markets, where they're located, because everything is so different. We have people that listen to the show that are from all different parts of the US. So it's like, why is Kansas City works so well for your investment approach?

Mackaylee (08:17)
Yeah, and just to let you guys know, I actually worked in Cincinnati and Dayton, Ohio from like 2017 to 2020. So I'm pretty familiar with more so Dayton, but you know to get to Dayton. A lot of times we flew into Cincinnati, drove up to Dayton. It's only about an hour, so it's.

Zach (08:25)
Wow.

Patrick (08:37)
Are you a Bangles fan

or a Chiefs fan though? I gotta ask or neither. Okay.

Mackaylee (08:40)
Well, right now neither.

Zach (08:43)
Good

answer.

Mackaylee (08:46)
but definitely go Chiefs. ⁓ We'll be back. Kansas City is kind of similar to Cincinnati in the terms of values, rent ⁓ values. But ⁓ overall, Kansas City, you know, this is most of my career. This is where I grew up. So I know the markets very well, but it has a really strong

Patrick (08:48)
Okay, okay. ⁓

Mackaylee (09:11)
rental demand ⁓ for tenants. you know, not to call you guys out, but some parts of Dayton or Cincinnati, there would just be like several, just like the homes that were just, ⁓ you know, this was five, six, seven years ago, just not occupied, just kind of really run down. Like they should be torn down. ⁓ Kansas city is really, revitalized most of, ⁓ the city and streets.

There's a lot of incentives for both investors and homeowners to fix up their properties and I think overall the population has increased as well, is great. But like I said, there's still a strong rental demand. So it's still attractive for investors to want to buy here. the center of the map.

I think just the low cost of living keeps people here as well.

Patrick (10:04)
And I got to ask, when for properties around you to flip, is the location of the property the main thing that you're looking at, like the actual where the lot is? Or are the bones of the structure and maybe the house or building itself, is that more what you look at? Or is it a mixture of both? What's your main thing that you're looking for when you're looking for a good business deal in real estate?

Mackaylee (10:32)
I definitely stick to the same neighborhoods. I've learned that if I can keep buying in those same neighborhoods, you create more value for those You'll attract more tenants in the same areas, ⁓ things like that. And so one of the first things I look at when I ⁓ see a deal is Google Street View. I look at the house, ⁓ see if it has some curb appeal.

That's like a major plus. Kansas City has ⁓ some really awesome looking properties like you know bungalows with like big porches or Tudor type properties or know, all brick properties like you guys have a lot of those up there And so that is a huge plus and then I'll move to the numbers.

Patrick (11:19)
Okay.

Zach (11:19)
Are there any other like neighborhood signals that you really rely on that maybe other people might overlook when you're looking for those places as well?

Mackaylee (11:28)
of mentioned, you know, if there's a lot of, if there was like a lot of boarded up houses or torn down houses or a gas station on the corner, ⁓ I typically avoid, those are red flags for me.

Zach (11:41)
Okay.

Patrick (11:42)
had mentioned earlier, and maybe misunderstood, but you said you stick to the same neighborhood. Because the more that you invest in that neighborhood, the h-

that those prices might become over time because the neighborhood as a whole is getting nicer, it's getting more investments. Is that kind of your strategy? Like let's say you invest in 20 different properties in the same neighborhood. now that property with those houses have been flipped, all of those properties are gonna kind of go up in value because the whole neighborhood is nicer. Is that the strategy? Did I misunderstand that?

Mackaylee (12:12)
Yeah, that's definitely part of the strategy and ⁓ neighborhoods like there's, know, within 60 miles, north and south, 60 miles, east and west. It's kind of generally, I stay within the same county on the Missouri side of Kansas City. Although I've ventured out a little bit, I've learned that back like consolidated county makes sense, you know, economically, efficiently.

⁓ Yeah, and for the reasons of raising the comps in the neighborhood too.

Patrick (12:45)
Okay.

Zach (12:46)
Would you ever consider, well, you may not, you may have an answer for this, I've with a sense your time in Cincinnati, but like, have you, do you own properties or anything in Cincinnati? Like, or have you flipped any properties in Cincinnati?

Mackaylee (13:00)
So my personal business got started just about five years ago. ⁓ My time in Cincinnati and Dayton was when I worked for another company who ⁓ operated on an even larger scale. They selling 40 to 50 houses in a month. so they kind of stampeded Cincinnati and Dayton owned a lot, flipped a lot there. But I was there often.

with contractors and seeing the houses in person and were renting the properties and big multifamilies out there, which we don't have a lot of in Kansas City. And I personally did actually own one in Dayton. So, I since sold it, but personally, yes, I did. And with another company too.

Zach (13:46)
Cool. would you give any specific advice to someone in a different city applying your thinking of what you look for? You've already given us a bunch of these, like what's a red flag, what's a green flag, all these different strategies for when you take on a project or to close on a specific deal, but like...

the country is such a wide and vast and diverse place, right? There's like so many different real estate markets. And I know Cincinnati is vastly different than Kansas City, but is there any advice that you would give to someone in a different market that's just like curious to get into this whole world?

Mackaylee (14:18)
Yeah, and I think the same goes to somebody looking in Kansas cities ⁓ to know what are the rents in the area. ⁓ The reason target certain ⁓ areas and price points is because I know that if I ⁓ want to sell the property, can. If I want to rent the property, I can and make cash flow. And so that would be my advice and any other.

state or city as well as to know the market rents in the area, know how quickly properties are moving, ⁓ study the property taxes, housing, the way auction foreclosures work, all those things vary from city to city. So even if I was going into a city, I would make sure that I learn those particulars before just diving in, I guess.

Zach (15:13)
Sure.

Patrick (15:14)
And when you get a property, because you mentioned a couple of different options, one would be like flipping it and reselling it, one is like renting it out and getting that cash flow. Are you thinking about which option you want to go with for a certain property, like as you're buying it? Or do you buy the property, fix it up, and then at that point kind of choose if you're going to resell it or if you're going to keep it and rent it out to tenants?

Mackaylee (15:40)
Yeah, I really try to target the and rehab and after repair value to fit the multiple exit strategy scenario. So I want to be in the position when I'm done with the rehab that I can list it on the market to sell it. ⁓ Or if I if that's not happening very quickly, I know that I can.

rent it out and I can sell it to an investor who wants that tenant in place or I can keep the property for my portfolio and get a longer term financing loan on the property. So I really try to stay within those parameters. Although sometimes there's some shiny deals out there that don't fit that particular buy box. And I've just learned that the boring, consistent

you know, buy box that I am in with those multiple exit strategies works way better than ⁓ chasing a huge project or an expensive project. ⁓ So.

Zach (16:46)
Yeah,

makes sense. Well, we had some exit strategy specific questions. mean, there was that I was really fascinated to hear about is that like, if you had an example of a scenario where you had to really pivot your exit strategy mid project, like, I'm sure that there's a lot of examples where you're in a moment, you have a clear idea of what's going to happen and then something pops up and you have to shift your whole mindset. It's like, do you have a example or a time where that's really jumped out?

Patrick (16:47)
That's interesting.

Mackaylee (17:13)
Not particularly in a big way, smaller scales, there's properties where I was totally convinced that that was gonna be a property that sold to a homeowner. And then maybe the market shifted or as we've dealt with over the last few years, the interest rates are all over the place. so really just knowing my cost into the property,

Zach (17:14)
Okay.

Mackaylee (17:38)
has been ⁓ beneficial because, you know, I really try if I'm going to keep the property for myself, I'd like to have zero dollars into the property. a whole topic itself ⁓ on how to do that. But ⁓ in some scenarios, when I'm into the property for too much, I thought it was going to sell to a homeowner and it doesn't, know, then I'm maybe making

less than I would have wanted to monthly. that's all I have on that.

Zach (18:08)
Okay, I said multiple times on the show, we kind of aim towards people that are trying to get into the market. They people that might just like want to just get ready to start investing. mean, if you if someone like take Patrick and I were a couple. Yeah, Patrick just laughed at it. Just me saying take Patrick and I he started laughing. So you know exactly what the vibe is.

Patrick (18:25)
Yeah.

Zach (18:30)
you know, if Patrick and I were going to try and get into the world of investing someone that's like kind of a noob to the industry, like what would you recommend? Like tips, things to start thinking about for the next 30 days, next 90 days.

Mackaylee (18:42)
I would recommend ⁓ building relationships. Realtors are ⁓ a great place to start. Realtors who have investment experience. There's definitely like your typical realtor that buys and sells homes. And then there's a realtor like myself who is knowledgeable in investment properties and cashflow and all the terms. ⁓

And so building those relationships and just taking a stab at learning the rents and all of those processes that I mentioned. I making sure you're in a financial position to, look at buying a property. You definitely want to have some funds for that and, you know, like a lender to work with.

Patrick (19:31)
And for somebody like Zach or myself, maybe hasn't, we haven't purchased property before, would you recommend buying more of like a rehab sort of property as your first property? ⁓ Would that kind of be maybe like an interesting or like safe route to go? Or would you recommend buying a property that may not need as much rehab right off the rip and working our way maybe second, third, fourth property, buying more of a

⁓ Of a flippable property like what are your thoughts on that?

Mackaylee (20:04)
I would definitely buy something that doesn't need a rehab. That piece is stressful, especially if you're in your own market, finding somebody to do the work and overseeing that whole thing is gonna be stressful. If you're buying something that's already maybe already has a tenant in place, that's a good place to start. you could start by maybe...

Patrick (20:08)
Okay.

Mackaylee (20:30)
buying a duplex and living one side and renting out the other, or even buying your own personal home. then later, within a couple of years, you could rent that out and that route. So I think there's options like that.

Patrick (20:46)
was about to flex a term, the duplex one. That's house hacking, right? Yeah, look at that.

Mackaylee (20:51)
I'll second.

Zach (20:53)
I saw that in your eyes, Patrick.

was like, he's going to say house hacking because we've been taught that term on this podcast. That's awesome. Okay, cool. Lots of great tips, lots of great strategies. It's been cool to hear and like under like learn a little bit about you, McKaylee. Thank you for coming on the show. ⁓ Before we depart and say goodbye to everybody today. I mean, did you have anything that you wanted to?

Patrick (20:57)
Yeah, yeah. I know that term. Curb appeal, house hacking. Yeah, I know the terms.

Mackaylee (20:58)
I'm sure you've learned that one. Yep.

Zach (21:19)
any resources that you wanted to plug, any places that people could find you or people like anything that you wanted to shout out there.

Mackaylee (21:25)
Yeah, I'd love to be a resource myself. I'm available. I an email that ⁓ I can be reached at, Kaylee at 1-CFS.com and a website as well. So I would love to hear from anybody, help anybody. I've worked with investors for quite a long time in multiple different markets. yeah.

Zach (21:47)
Cool, right, awesome. Well, Patrick, you good on that? You got any other questions or any other terms you wanna flex before we depart?

Patrick (21:57)
what was... was...

Zach (21:57)
He's pretty proud of that one. He's going to talk about that for the rest of the day. He's like, I brought that term up and I made sure. Yeah, exactly.

Mackaylee (22:00)
Like the light bulb went off.

Zach (22:04)
right. Thank you, McKaylee for joining us for a little discussion. And we'd love to have you back someday to talk about other things, house hacking, investing, know, Kansas city, you know, when they do come back, I'm sure they'll be back eventually. We can talk about that too, in the super bowl next year. So, but all right. Well, thank you, McKaylee for joining us as a reminder, follow the rent ish pod and subscribe.

Patrick (22:20)
Yeah.

Zach (22:28)
email questions at therentishpod.com and check the description of this episode. I think we'll probably put some resources of how to get in touch with McKaylee if you guys would like to learn more or reach out to her. thank you all for listening. I've been Zach, that's been Patrick and we'll see you guys next time.