GABRIELLE STONE: CHAOS, COMPASSION & THE COURAGE TO NOT GIVE A F***!

This week I’m back with my longtime friend, Gabrielle Stone, for an unfiltered conversation about showing ourselves some much-needed compassion. We also dive into her recent health scare and how it shifted her view on vulnerability—not just in life, but especially in parenting.

Gabrielle shares the raw realities of juggling motherhood and personal struggles, reminding us that it’s okay to not have everything figured out. We talk about the pressure to appear perfect, the beauty in embracing our flaws, how we can learn and grow through the chaos and what it means to actually believe you deserve to have the life you want.

If you’ve ever felt overwhelmed or uncertain, this episode is your reminder that you’re not alone. Grab your headphones and join us for a chat that’s equal parts insightful, relatable and empowering. 

Let’s get into it.

Transcript

Speaker 3 0:00

This is Unsided.

Speaker 1 0:02

Unsided. Unsided.

Speaker 3 0:03

Hey everybody, it's Kristofer. Welcome back to another episode of Unsided. I'm always happy to be here with you. And I have with me one of my best friends in the entire world and someone you've heard from before, Gabrielle Stone. Hi, Gabrielle.

Speaker 0:17

You better be like extra happy and excited to be here because I'm here with you.

Speaker 3 0:21

Wait, hold on. Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of Unsided. It's Kristofer. I have Gabrielle Stone with me. I'm so excited. Is that better?

Speaker 0:28

So much better. Hi guys. Happy to be back. How are you?

Speaker 3 0:32

One of my favorite things about talking to you, Gabrielle, as you know, is that you question like everything that I say. Like you don't take you, you are constantly questioning like the things that I say, or if I say something that seems surprising, or if it feels like I've led however many lives you say that I've led. I think it's you always seem to really be listening to me and to reflect back what I have to say. So just, you know, while there's not a specific agenda of something I want to talk to you about per se, I just think you're a fascinating conversation. Aside from the fact that I love you, I think you're a fascinating conversation because really you and I are so different in our upbringing. We're different in who we are. And yet something, there's a spark of something there. You make me think about a lot. And I know you've been going through some tough times lately.

Speaker 1:21

Yeah, this, like, I don't know if you've experienced this or people listening, but you know, we came out of this like snake shedding year that ended in February. Um, and then the fire horse year started, and it was like every fucking TikTok psychic that was on my page was like, This is gonna be the year and the month that your life explodes. And I was like, Okay, cool, I'm ready. And then it just like kept getting worse. And I was like, okay, where's the reprieve? Um, and I think in our world, in our society, like everyone's just really collectively been feeling the weight of like what the fuck? Yeah, with with everything that's been going on. And it it makes us feel like our little first world problems, as you could call it, um, are invalid and they're not. Like it's important to still be like, okay, A, B, and C is still affecting me and upsetting me. And I need to be able to sit with that and give validity to that and give compassion to that, even though like the whole world is currently on fire.

Speaker 3 2:27

Yeah. Hey, listen, I think about this a lot. Like for a recent example, you know, Mo, for those of you who don't know, Mo is my husband, but Mo recently started working with as a behavioral therapist with autistic children, which is a fascinating job from what I'm learning, and and really kind of uh the um a new frontier of of therapy for you know this kind of spectrum that we're only really coming to understand or embrace recently. And one of his clients, I don't know, I don't know why this resonated with me per se, but one of his clients, one of the children, um, is the child of a very successful uh athlete. And they live in a very beautiful place. They have all of the they have all of the luxuries, the trappings of life, but they have this child, and I I I can't speak correctly to it because I'm just learning. So forgive me for those of you who are more educated around autism, but he's he doesn't function in the world in the way that they might like him to function in the world. I feel like I'm tiptoeing around it, but I just don't want to be insensitive.

Speaker 3:31

Um no, it's a hard conversation to have it.

Speaker 3 3:33

It is a hard conversation, but it it made me think when he was telling me, you know, he was like the the mother can't even get away to take a shower.

Speaker 3:41

Yeah.

Speaker 3 3:42

Because if she doesn't have someone there and eyes on that child and they have they have all the resources that they could have, but you know, they can't just surround him with strangers all the time. So she wants to be there. And it makes me think about my own life too, because it's all relative. That's one thing I know for sure. And the older I get, the more I realize it doesn't matter how much you have, where you are, what you're doing, what your title is, what your status is. I hate Instagram. You know, I don't even post on Instagram. I'll tell you why I fucking hate Instagram. I never curse on this podcast, but I'm going to He's like, I'm gonna tell you.

Speaker 4:10

I'm gonna tell you right now.

Speaker 3 4:12

You know, because I think it's fucking with people's mental health.

Speaker 4:15

Well, sure, we've been having that conversation for so long that it's just a highlight reel of everybody's life.

Speaker 3 4:20

Yeah, but why are we continuing to do that? So if we've been having the conversation for so long, why are we continuing to do that? One of the things I appreciate about you is you use your social media to sh to show your whole ass life. Like you show everything for bet for better or worse. For better or worse, and that's super important. And then there are people who are, you know, kind of just dumping their shit. I wouldn't say you do that, but you've you've been through some stuff lately that you shared. And here's what I I want to talk about that might be a little sensitive, but you went through a a major health scare, right? You want to tell me about that?

Speaker 4:50

Uh-huh. Yeah, I actually oddly enough, when you're like, this is kind of sensitive topic, I'm like, actually, yes, please let's talk about it because I feel like, and this is not a um uh dig on anyone in my circle or my family, but like I feel like it almost wasn't talked about enough that like I went through this big, like life-altering thing where I was terrified that I was gonna die. It was just like I went and did the thing, and then it was like, okay, carry on and now like get back to your toddler and let's move. Um, because that's life. But it almost felt like there wasn't enough space held for it. So I'm more than happy to talk about that. You had spinal surgery. Um, I had yeah, I had spinal surgery. And it started with really bad symptoms. Um, I was having numbness in my fingers, it was going up my arms, and then I was having skin sensitivity, like really hot or cold sensitivity, um, deep muscle fatigue, just complete exhaustion. And we were running all of these tests, and there were really scary things being talked about, like maybe it's MS, maybe it's ALS, like all of these things that are like really terrifying. And I'm parenting a two-year-old that I just brought into the world. So when we finally got my MRI back, you could see how clearly like my two discs were um pushing down and like making the jelly sack in the middle, super technical terms, I know, um, bulge into my spinal cord so severely that it was causing all of these symptoms. It's called spinal cord stenosis. And when I met with my surgeon, he was like, Look, we normally book like three to four months out for this. You need to come in in the next two weeks. Because it was at the level of like, if I got into any type of an accident and it like jammed further, it could sever my spinal cord. Wait, I didn't know that part. It was it was bad. That's why the symptoms were like so severe so quickly. Like it literally, I felt like I suddenly had a chronic illness that I was living with overnight. And it was just wild. Um, so we got the surgery scheduled, and then all like the trauma starts coming up. Um, little bit of backstory. I lost my dad traumatically as a young girl, walked in, found him dead on the floor from a heart attack, lost my high school sweetheart in a car accident when I was 18. Have a lot of like shit around death that we've worked through and healed, and you know, but this put that front and center, like right out a list of like all of the things that people need to know in case you die in this surgery. And like, to be fair, like my surgeon was like, look, I know it's really scary. This has become kind of routine at this point. Like, I do these a lot. It's kind of like my bread and butter. They go in through your neck, they, you know, do the whole little thing. It's, you know, it's a week or two of recovery, and then, you know, don't play football for the next like three to four months. But for me and all my trauma around death, like it brought up a lot of fears. It brought up a lot of fear for my husband, who lost his mom when he was younger. Um, like a lot of our people in our lives have like just up and died on us, super rude and inconsiderate. And so, like, here we were, like being faced with this like really scary situation. Um, luckily I went in, my surgeon was fantastic. I did the surgery, I was fine afterwards. My symptoms are completely gone. I still have like a little bit of tingling in two of my fingers, like like once or twice a week, it'll I'll notice it, like, but super minimal. Everything else is completely gone. I'm so thankful and so lucky. But I do feel like I jumped back into life too quickly and didn't allow my body enough time to rest and recover. We I I went back into parenting my toddler and then we moved houses and there was like lots of different stressors going on. Um, but it's even like now, like when I'm I I just this last week went through this crazy depressive like swan dive spiral where I was like, I think I need to be on medication. Like, I'm not, I am unwell. Um and through that, through talking to you, through talking to a couple of my friends, people were like, you know, kind of mirroring back to me. They were like, you know, you almost died. Like you went through like a really big thing that like was very scary. Like, have you even taken time or space to process that? And are the people around you in your day-to-day life like processing that and like giving you space for that? And I was like, no, no, we we were like, we just have to push forward and keep going. And that's kind of what my mom, who, you know, has always done her best for me, has always done. When my dad died when I was little, she like came back, did his celebration of life, put me on a plane, went back and finished filming the movie. Like it's just like there's a trauma, cool, let's handle it and keep going. And this needed a little more time and space for that. And I don't think I gave myself that. And I think that was kind of like the start of the things kind of mounting this year that caused me to completely crack last week.

Speaker 3 9:52

Yeah, but you cracked something open. Like you're not that that's what I think. I mean, I'm watching you talking to you from a distance, but here's what I think is interesting because I I also come from a family that like when my dad died, I buried him and then I didn't I just was right back to life. And that was just a couple of years ago. Different than your scenario. Here's what I want to ask you. You found yourself in a position where you're a primary breadwinner.

Speaker 10:19

Yeah, we've talked about that openly on my podcast as well.

Speaker 3 10:22

Because here's what I think here's what I have found for myself. And and and I think anybody around me who loves me might take offense to this. I was gonna say umbrage, but that's like a really ridiculous word to say.

Speaker 10:35

Say it and I'll see if I take offense to it.

Speaker 3 10:37

You won't, you won't. I think that as much as people around me wanting to care about when things happen to me or when I don't feel well or when my dad dies or whatever, they want to be there. They're also dependent upon me for their well-being and their livelihood. So if I'm down too long, it scares the people closest to me. I watch it happen. It's it's it's not that there aren't people who will give me space. And so what I do is I overcompensate for that. I'm like, don't worry about it. I got it, I got this, I'll take care of it. I got it. So it's not so much that they wouldn't give me the space if I insisted on it, but I can see that the idea that I might be sick, like you know, or or something has happened to me, or I can't get my emotions together, or I'm having a hard day, is scary for the people that are used to me being the rock.

Speaker 11:27

Yeah.

Speaker 3 11:28

So I try to stop them from being afraid or feeling anything by being the rock.

Speaker 11:34

And that's that's fascinating to me because I know you're talking about it from more of a financial standpoint. I don't resonate with that in my scenario as far as like I I don't think that's why I felt rushed to get back to life. But I think I do that with my husband, with Tay, because he's always so uh the rock in the sense of like he's always like really happy and like pretty balanced. And when he takes a dip, I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, where did like my happy husband who's like supportive and loving and wonderful go? Like it's it makes me panic. So I can resonate with that on like the other side of the people who are like, wait, wait, wait, you're supposed to be my safe place in my center. What do you mean you're having a tough time? I need you to not have a tough time. Well, I'm having tough time.

Speaker 3 12:20

I think I might be saying a little bit of that too. I did come out the gate talking about finances because I just think that's a piece. I think it's a piece of it. But um, what my husband will say, or not as much anymore, but he what he used to say was you're not fluffy. Why aren't you fluffy? I need you to be fluffy. You're the where's my Christopher who laughs? Where's my Christopher who jokes around? And right you know me to be that, but I also like anyway, not to make it about me, but I think that like I watched you just in our few interactions jump right back in. And I wonder if you did that or if you felt like you had to do that.

Speaker 12:58

I think a little bit of both.

Speaker 3 13:00

Yeah, because I think a little bit of both because of your child.

Speaker 13:04

Yeah. I there was a lot of mom guilt around the whole thing. Um, like the first week when I was at my mom's recovering on like heavy pain meds. Um, I like planned for his nanny and my friend and the uh her little boy to all go to Disneyland. And I was like hysterically crying because I was like, I should be the one going with him. Like it just that shit crazy, you know, that we do to ourselves as parents. Um, but it it was partly because of that and partly because it's like, what else am I gonna fucking do? You know, like they're I think you're the same way is like there's only so much that we so much rest that we feel that we've earned until we start feeling guilty about it.

Speaker 4 13:49

Yeah.

Speaker 13:49

Um, like I can, I, I, we can work really hard, but I can also chill really hard. Like I can fucking binge a show for days on end and like rot in bed. That's what I miss most about my like pre-child life. But now with the child and the home and the family and the all the things, like I feel like I can only give myself so much of that, or I start feeling guilty. Like I should be working or I should be using my time in a more valuable way.

Speaker 3 14:15

Uh we're kind of talking about the same thing. I mean, I just made a I just made a TikTok about this that we were kind of joking about, but you know, standing in the middle of the forest is where things kind of come to me. And I've been feeling a lot lately, like, you know, my kids are older, they're 14 and 16 almost, but where I think like, wait a minute. Where's the place that Christopher actually vibes? I okay, first of all, I started therapy again. I think I told you that. And where I used to be in cognitive behavioral therapy, now the therapy is called Act, and I can't remember the whole acronym, but it's acceptance and compassion are the first two pieces, which is new for me. So, like accepting the fact that while I also like to couch rot and binge a show and I can do that with the best of them, I'm actually better when I'm moving. Personally, and I wonder if you like because there's a tug in the pool, you have to move, you have to move, but don't you think Gabrielle is actually like your vibe is to keep moving? You're not someone who wants to.

Speaker 15:10

Oh, 100%. Yeah. But to keep moving when I'm doing something I love and I'm passionate about. And that's what's been really difficult for me in this journey into motherhood. For reference, my my beautiful little boy is two and a half. My gosh.

Speaker 3 15:26

Um he's awesome. I yes he's the best.

Speaker 15:28

He is awesome. He is the best. However, um, I am not super happy um constantly go go going and running and chasing a toddler and like doing all the things that parenting encompasses. I am happy when I'm like going to a book event and then having to like go read a script that we're about to launch. And like I'm happy when I'm go-go-go on the work side. I am not so happy when I am go go go in the burnout of being a mom. It I just have to say, for anyone that's listening that might resonate with this, anyone that is on social media that is saying parenthood is fucking sunshine and rainbows and is just this blissful like little bubble, fucking lied. And if they told us how hard it was, no one would fucking have sex to have kids because it's really fucking hard.

Speaker 3 16:19

I think about that.

Speaker 16:20

And that doesn't mean you don't love them, and it doesn't mean they aren't wonderful, and it doesn't mean I wouldn't do it 10 times over to have him here. And the shit's really fucking hard. I yeah, you know, like when I'm getting ready to put my kid down for a fucking nap and he's overly tired and he's ripping the skin around my scar from my spinal surgery and smacking me in the face, and you can't get mad at him because it's an overly tired developmental thing that every toddler does, that's fucking hard. Like I never claimed to be a patient person, and boy am I fucking getting a heavy dose of patience trying to be a fucking mom.

Speaker 3 17:02

Dude, I I there are some times with my children, although I have girls, it's a little different, I think. But but particularly as they've gotten older and it's been more emotional, there are times when I think if I wasn't able to see myself and my personality within them, I would be like a tap out. I'm like, I don't I don't even know how to like there are just sometimes when they act a certain way, and I'm like the only way that I can get past this and not completely explode is because you're being me.

Speaker 4 17:32

Right.

Speaker 3 17:33

Like I see myself in your eyes. Um I often want to talk about parenting, and apparently it's just bubbling up because like it's now part of all of my conversations recently. But I really would like mo I would like people to admit that parenting sucks. And a lot of times if people had the opportunity to not be a parent after they decided to be a parent, that they would choose not to be a parent.

Speaker 17:55

Yeah, people people have said that and they get fucking reamed.

Speaker 3 17:58

That's why I haven't said anything. That's why I haven't made a video about it because I don't feel like dealing with people who are looking at the what I have to say in two dimensions. But for anybody who really, really is honest, I think there's a moment in every parent's life, or maybe many moments, where you're like, what did I do?

Speaker 18:15

Oh yeah, dude. The in the fucking two to three age, that moment happens daily. It's like you're in a constant circle of like, this was the worst decision of my life. Oh my God, this is the cutest, most amazing thing I've ever experienced. Oh my God, what the fuck did I do? Like it's it's constant. And to circle back to what we were talking about earlier with Mo and how he's on this new incredible journey, um uh helping teach these these kids with autism, even hearing you talk about that story, my first thought is and how ridiculous am I that like my healthy, happy child um who is just fussy and developmentally, you know, going through all the stages of toddlerhood. And I have a grandparent that participates, a dad who's 50-50, a nanny that's with him a couple days a week, so I can work. Like, what the fuck am I complaining about? You know, that's what we do to ourselves. I I compare myself to the moms who don't have any help and have two kids and are working a full-time job. Like it's it is the I know, I know that's what we do.

Speaker 3 19:28

But I mean, I'm just saying that out loud because you know it and I know it, but we can't do that. First of all, one thing I know for sure, whether it's parenting or anything else, is tr is feeling, emotion, pain, stress, it's all relative. The feeling we're feeling is exactly the same as somebody else who's just somehow adjusted to their situation. I mean, like, I'm not gonna say someone who has a child that cannot take care of themselves at all and has to take listen, I'm gonna be really honest. In those moments, I'm like, I I look at that and I think I don't know if I had would have had the strength. Yeah, I I I honestly don't know. And I think it it makes me a better dad, honestly, to ask myself those questions. I have to believe that it does because you know, particularly as the kids get older, I'm very clear. I know some parents are gonna completely disagree with this, but that's okay because you've said it to me and I support it.

Speaker 20:16

So if they want to disagree, that's fine. That's just not their personal preference.

Speaker 3 20:20

There are some there are there are moments when I think, you know what, my kid there my kids are either they're not learning a lesson, they're not figuring something out, they're not like showing up in the way that I believe they need to show up. And they also have a mother who deals they have a very complex relationship with their mother, and we're divorced household and figuring out all that out. But there are moments when in my head, I think, you know what, if you don't get your shit together by the time you're 18, I'm hands off. Like get it together, figure it out. And that doesn't make me the parent who's like, oh, come back to me no matter what. I'm it's not that I wouldn't be there, but I don't have that super soft, touchy thing about my children that I thought I would always have. I love them. I love them so much it hurts my heart when things like I can't figure out how to get past a certain thing. But kids are humans who are awesome sometimes, and sometimes whether it's their personality or whatever they bring with them, they're not they're they're pains in the ass.

Speaker 21:13

Yeah, it's a fine line between uh love and enabling in the in the older years, at least for sure.

Speaker 3 21:20

But like just this idea that I like my marriage is b exponentially better than my last marriage because we talk in reality about how hard it is. I think that the truth of the of happiness for parents has to lie somewhere between Gen X and now. Like Gen X, they were like, Do you know where your kids are? It's 10 o'clock, and they have no idea where we were. But but now there's this like you're supposed to be the perfect mom, Gabrielle. You're supposed to do everything perfectly and hold down your career and be a wonderful wife and daughter.

Speaker 21:47

Yeah, and and gentle parent, the whole thing. That's what I'm getting at.

Speaker 3 21:50

The gentle parenting, right? Because it's real, yeah, but the pressure to be perfect at it, yeah. I know you feel a lot.

Speaker 21:59

Yeah, I totally. Do. And look, my mom from the outside, and even like for me growing up, was the quintessential perfect mom, and I still got fucked up. The kids are gonna fuck themselves up no matter what you do. You can literally do everything right. And like it's not, I am aware that it's not something you can quote unquote win at. You just have to do your best.

Speaker 4 22:19

Yeah.

Speaker 22:20

I would like to make a hard left and ask you have you ever had a like that you can look back and reflect on and categorize it as a spiritual awakening?

Speaker 3 22:33

Oh my god, that is a hard left. I love it. Thank you. A spiritual awakening.

Speaker 22:39

Yeah, it is absolutely okay. Can you tell me about it?

Speaker 3 22:42

Oh my gosh. Well, I've had multiple spiritual awakenings. Um the first one was well, let me see if this qualifies. The first one that I can think of in the moment where I really just started to break out of the dogma that I was being taught and that was around me was when I was about 16, sitting in a church pew and hearing them talk about something called the age of accountability, meaning if you're over 12 and you haven't accepted Jesus, you go to hell. If you're under 12, you get a pass because you didn't know. And I remember that first moment I was like, okay, all this this Christian stuff that I'm being raised in is there's a problem. Right. So that then took me into my early college years and being kind of a heathen for the first time. Like I didn't drink in high school, I didn't go to parties in high school, I didn't smoke anything in high school. I started doing all of that. I got a lot of that out of my system, figured out my sexuality. And then I was sitting backstage when I was 21, right after I had met your, or no, excuse me, like 23 or 24, right after I had met your mom. And I started reading Conversations with God.

Speaker 23:51

You know, she still gives me shit that I haven't read that book, like to this day. And you know what I told her the last time she gave me shit about it? What? I was like, mom, I read the first two chapters, and I was like, I already know all of this because you've taught it to me.

Speaker 3 24:04

Yeah, well, there you go. So so you don't have to. I didn't know.

Speaker 24:06

So respectfully, shut the fuck up. Anyways, continue.

Speaker 3 24:09

Respectfully. So I was sitting backstage doing a one or two-night performance of Masada, which was this this story. I can't even fully tell you the story, but it's a religious story over in Israel. In one of your ten lives. Yeah, in one of ten lives. And I was reading it and there was a there was uh the beginning of a chapter or around the beginning of a chapter, it said Hitler went to heaven. And I was like, I have to know more. I have to know more about what it means to expand my mind so much to try to understand that phrase that sounds absurd. Yeah. And that was I'll never forget the feeling because I was like, oh, just the the fact that someone wrote that down and I'm allowed to have that thought so that I can explore morality in that way, it began it, it was a trajectory, it was like a rocket ship for me. Because I had been raised with biblical dogma.

Speaker 25:04

Sure, yeah.

Speaker 3 25:05

Right.

Speaker 25:06

Um do you remember like when you start like that was the like the literate moment that you experienced, but what was going on in your life? Like, did you feel like things around you were like crumbling? Were you having difficult times? Like, was there a an energetic experience that happened in tandem with like you literally reading, you know, the word and having the aha moment?

Speaker 3 25:31

I'm gonna be so real with you right now. Yeah. Um, I didn't lie to me because I'm gonna lie to you. I'm gonna be I'm gonna be like maybe more real than I've ever been in talking about this, but um I don't believe I'm of this earth, and I've never bel thought I was of this earth. I've all and I didn't know what that meant, which is why I sought different religions and things. I have always felt like I was thrown back into this experience, and everybody around me was lying to me, and I knew the truth what the truth was, but it fucked with my head so much because everybody around me seemed to be so unconscious, so unaware of how their actions, their choices were were inexplicably intertwined with everybody else. People were lying to me about their emotions, people were lying to me about the truth of their like it just always felt like people were lying to me. So when I read that book, it was the first time that I felt like someone was telling me the truth. That was someone was saying, like, because we, if you if you think about it, so what was going on in my life was the finally I was on my own and I was like just trying to break out of this kind of I don't know, all of the ways that I was supposed to show up in the world, all of the things I was supposed to believe. This is who Christopher is, this is the so that's and but but to say that something specific was happening in my life right then, no, I feel like the course of my life has always been like me trying to break out of this fucking cocoon or some kind of a shell, which I think is why snakes appeal to me, honestly, because they shed their skin. Right, um and even now as I as I'm older, I'm gonna be 52 this year, it's like okay, like now I know for sure that I know how all of this shit works. And so I'm now at the place where in my next kind of spiritual awakening where I'm like, okay, how do I actually continue forward? Because now I know it's all bullshit. But Gabrielle, we're living everything around us is a fucking imagination. It's a lie, if you will. There is no truism because it's all happening at once. Everything, every possibility, every scenario, everything is happening at once. I recently uh did some guided work with uh Scylla Sibin. You know this, I told you this. Yeah, but it there was one one experience where I just suddenly so clearly realized that nothing had any meaning except for the meaning we gave it. So in that sentence, uh Hitler went to heaven. Who is Hitler? What does Hitler mean? What does Hitler represent? What is heaven? What does heaven represent? They're just words, right? Right, right. The idea that we can we can challenge the meaning of words or experiences that and interpret them as we would interpret them was so freeing to me. And it's just kind of been like an entire lifelong process of continuing to question everything. Now, when I was in my marriage, I went I went dark for a while. What's interesting to me is I would have thought if you had asked me, like once you start having a spiritual awakening, that you just continue to have that and you never step back.

Speaker 28:31

Right.

Speaker 3 28:31

My experience has been that I fell way back.

Speaker 28:34

That's really interesting.

Speaker 3 28:36

Because I wanted to conform.

Speaker 28:38

Yeah. I ask, and I thank you for sharing that. I ask because I have felt that this last this is so fresh that like we're even discussing all of this, but like this last week where I really it was like Sunday to Thursday where I was like were like my husband was like, this is scary, like what's going on. And then once I like kind of came back online a little bit and like reset my nervous system, things started to click for me. And it was actually something that you pointed out when I called you, um, completely spiraling. And it it was without like taking too much time to explain the backstory of this. I have attracted a few different people and situations into my life as of recent that have reflected back to me that I am entitled. And I I really took a hit when that was presented to me because I have worked so hard in my life to get away from that. Um, there was this one moment where I was sitting um in the house, the house that Tay and I bought um where my book was doing really well and um I was like had more finances in place than I ever had. And I remember my mom calling me and being like, I don't know what to do. I feel like you don't need me anymore because you're like so okay. And it was like this like epic moment for me in my like young adulthood. And so these these recent experiences where where people, some that are very close, one that's very close to me, one that like I could care less about and means nothing to me, but I think I attracted for a very specific reason, um reflected back to me that they felt that I was entitled. And I took this as such a hit and like felt so much shame around that. And when I came back online after this to like depressive breakdown, um something clicked for me. And you had said something along the lines on the phone call of like, maybe it's time you get angry, maybe it's okay like to be entitled. And I started to like process that, and then it clicked for me that you know, my mom is a spiritual teacher, and this my my whole upbringing, she has raised me to believe if you want something, you can have it. Is that not the definition of entitlement? Um, why isn't being entitled negative? And then I was like, wait a minute, isn't that the whole fucking like construct around manifestation? Like being Dululu enough to decide you want something and that you deserve all of it and more? I deserve all the money, I deserve the house, I deserve the health, I deserve like the perfect man, I deserve all of this, bring it to me. That is manifestation at its core. So why am I apologizing for being entitled? If I know that I deserve things and I've earned it, why are we apologizing and being made small for asking for what we want and being like, yeah, fucking bring it to me, bitch, on a silver platter. Thank you. Yeah. And it was this like big shift in me. This other, you know, expendable person that I had attracted is one of our contractors, which has just been complete hell. Um, as we've like renovated um this big housing project. And even with that, like I was still in my people-pleasing mode. And I was like just trying to keep the peace, just trying to get through, just trying to like, you know, mosey on and like get it done. And we had this walkthrough today, and like the inner cunt in me came to the door. And I was like, look, bitch, you knocked, and like now she's here. Like I am so fucking kind and chill and like really supportive until you push me to that place, and then I'm gonna make it everyone's fucking problem. Yeah, and it's like sometimes like you have to get pushed into that energy to realize, oh yeah, like I am that bitch and I do deserve all of this. And now I'm gonna go fucking create it. And it ended up being such a gift for me to reframe what I have been working so hard to get away from my entire life and feeling shame around to now being like, oh, that's actually a superpower. Let's lean into that. Let's go, let's go manifest some shit. I fucking and so that that was kind of like it it has very much so felt like a spiritual awakening in that sense. And, you know, everything you read about growth and change and spiritual awakenings are like everything around you crumbles and you just feel like the world's on fucking fire. And as the butterfly, you know, cocoons is a caterpillar, they just have to like let everything fall and get really dark and allow yourself to wallow, and then they come out as a beautiful fucking butterfly.

Speaker 3 34:04

Yes. I'm gonna do something I don't often do on here, but I'm gonna recommend a book. And since you haven't read Conversations with God, I highly recommend Neil Donald Walsh's book. I don't know what year it was published, but it's called The Only Thing That Matters. And it speaks to this very thing. It speaks to the fact that we live within contrast, and the only way to know something is to experience the contrast. So if we want, if you want to, if you want to know what love is, you must experience it, which means you probably need to experience the loss of love to understand what love was in some capacity, because we have to know. You can't, you know, it's the old adage, you can't know hot unless you know cold. You have to know one of the things, and that's where we live right now. Like that's that's the world that we're in. It's a world full of contrast. But back to what you said, it's this this idea of entitlement. That the word entitlement, it's just a shitty word. It's a word that people use to say, fuck you, like you think you're better. But the word is ostensibly the same thing. If I'm entitled to it, I deserve it. Deserve is a much better word, right? It's a much more friendly word to ourselves and our psyche. But here's where I lean in with my husband and my my daughters a bit, because as you know, I'm queer. And so I What? What? Can you believe it? But I'm a white man born in American. I I think about the intersection of privilege and not privilege there a lot. And and to stick with the privilege and entitlement and deserving part, what I know for sure, also something I'll talk about a lot because it'll piss people off, but uh privilege is only a mindset. Now, people will say, what are you talking about? If it's dangerous to be a woman somewhere, it's dangerous to be like you can't, the world's not so okay, sure. But you can feel privileged in any place. There have been plenty of times like when I don't have a table to sit at. Because people will be nice, but like the straight dudes don't actually want to give me a seat at their table, and the queer guys sometimes, but also I believe everything belongs to me in some capacity because I was raised a white man in America, because that privilege was instilled in my brain that the world was set up for me. That's a piece of that's a mindset. So you finally kind of like opening uh a thought up to, I don't want to say finally, that sounds terrible, but opening a thought up to wait a minute, I deserve to be angry. I deserve to feel that I deserve this because I work my ass off. I I first of all find that sexy, sexy beaning. Like it's just it's it's admirable, it's awesome, it's what we want our children to learn, but the world doesn't want you to think that way. So the people who are telling you that are the people who never really had the courage to step into their own privilege.

Speaker 36:44

100%. Yeah. Yep. And I think it's you know, so many people are operating knowingly or not from a victimhood mentality. And so when someone steps in front of them in a deserving mentality, they're like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, no, no, no. And it triggers them, and it should. And like you're welcome for the mirror to then go hopefully heal your own shit. Yes. But like, don't make me feel bad about being in my energetic power.

Speaker 3 37:16

Yes, that's right. I wish that it's one of the things I wanted to, I want to really work on with my children. I told you that my older child was talking to me and she was having some trouble with her girl trouble with her grades, and we were talking about what it takes to like, you know, create the life you want. And she was like, started saying a list of things that, you know, oh, it's gonna be hard because of XYZ. And I was like, let's look at your words, let's look at creation, let's look at what we believe. And then she, I told you, she launched into like the whole, you're a man, you're a white man sitting in your pretty little house. The world has been set up for you. Well, okay, so I listen and I took it all in. I know your reaction was like, girl, like that's where are you getting that from?

Speaker 37:52

But it was real-I was like, Let me give you the laundry list of what your father's been through. Shut the fuck up.

Speaker 3 37:57

I gave her something.

Speaker 37:58

But it's okay, express express your opinions.

Speaker 3 38:00

Exactly. But as we're listening to it, I thought, okay, first I got triggered, and then I was like, wait, I gotta figure out a way to sit through this with her because what I want her to have is the privilege I have in my brain. How do you impart that to someone? Like, what do you think it was that actually made it finally start to click for you a little bit that however you're feeling is perfectly your right?

Speaker 2 38:20

Whatever you believe is yours is perfectly your right.

Speaker 38:26

I don't know if it was one thing. I think it was feeling so low at the bottom of the barrel and being stripped of all the power internally. And then when my nervous system was reset and came back online, and then if people are like, How did you do that? Like, I took a Xanax. No, I'm just kidding. Um, I went to a sound bath and got a massage and like started doing things that I knew were going to like calm my nerves and help me like reset and rebalance. I meditated a lot. Um, when my nervous system came back online, it was almost like there was this little voice inside that was like, Can you remember who the fuck you are and who you were raised to be? And like, why are we like letting all of this outside bullshit infiltrate you? Stop it. And you know, like I look, I know this is a touchy subject. I know that there's validity in the concerns that your daughter was presenting for a lot of women in the world. I know that I am a white woman. I know that there is privilege in that. I was raised in privilege as far as I never had to worry about food on my table. I was afforded the luxury to go try different sports and different passions and encouraged to do so. Like there's privilege in that. I am aware I'm acknowledging. However, I have never had an experience where I'm like, fuck, it's because I'm a woman, or being a woman is hard. I mean, like being a woman has been hard for me because like my periods have kicked my ass, like literally into the fetal position. Um, being a woman has been hard because of like the hormones that have fluctuated throughout me, um, or the immense toll it takes on your body to like bring a child into this world. But I have never been in like a workplace or a societal place where I've been like, oh, this would go differently if I was a white dude. Um and the reason I'm saying this is to pose the question, is it because I felt entitled to that? Is it because I had the mindset that, like, no, I can do anything a fucking dude does? Like, and I was walking through life experiencing that and therefore attracting situations that would prove me right when other people are walking around with a different program playing in their head or a victim playing in their head. Um, I'm not saying one is right or one is wrong. I'm just saying that that was has been my experience. So I think if you're listening to this and you are of the you're never gonna understand because being a woman is so hard, and this and this and this, and the laundry list of reasons why, like do an internal check and be like, am I creating some of this in my reality? Because there can be like truths in the world in politics, in you know, everything that's going on, that doesn't have to be your truth in your world. So you have the ability to change that, even if the overall consensus is this is how things are. I don't I don't relate to that, yeah, because I'm creating it differently.

Speaker 3 41:50

Agreed. You know, I I've had more than one conversation that I've had to step out of in my life, so many, where I challenge people's need to be a victim, and I can see the anger come so fast. And and I would challenge anybody actually who's listening who can think of someone in their life or even think of themselves. If you were to ask yourself or ask another person the question around the thing that they feel most victimized by, whether it's their gender, their sexuality, economics, what that where they whatever it is, and they defend their right to feel that way, then they're a victim. They're stuck in victim. If you ever say, Well, I I should feel that way, look at all the things that have happened. No, that's actually just your choice.

Speaker 4 42:35

Right.

Speaker 3 42:36

Because the fact is, uh everyone, almost every one of us could make a list of shit that's gone down and wrong in our lives and the way ways we've been mistreated, and we can find a thing to blame it on. However, it can all of those same things can happen to another person who's basically the same as you, and that other person can choose to look at it from a different lens that is not victim-centric.

Speaker 43:02

Yes.

Speaker 3 43:02

That is a tr that is a choice. And I find out that I have like with my daughter, I had to really step away from a and come back so I could put my dad hat on and stop listening to her being a victim and try to figure out okay, how can I be present? And it turned out in that day she just kind of needed to talk it out. But I think that I would never describe you as a victim or having a victim mentality. I would describe you, I think one of the reasons we get along so well is because you are always asking questions, even when it feels like you've asked the question a hundred times.

Speaker 43:34

And sometimes, like to be fair, like it's okay to have those moments. Sometimes you need to like woe is me and like take a day to fucking like wallow and spiral, like I just took a few. Um but that is different than living, moving, and walking throughout life in that victimhood mentality. There's a big difference.

Speaker 3 44:00

Also important to note that first of all, there are sometimes you need help to do that.

Speaker 44:03

Sometimes which is totally okay.

Speaker 3 44:05

Which is totally okay. I don't have I don't have any problems seeking help and nor should you. There's nothing to be ashamed of there. But also this idea that you're supposed to somehow come to a place where you suddenly just like love everything about your life and love everything around you. I learning learning that two things can exist at once have made it easier for me to pull myself out of the place when I become a victim from like I can I can lean into that too.

Speaker 44:40

Yeah.

Speaker 3 44:40

But learning that like okay, I can feel this way simultaneous to the to to also looking at what's happening in my life and feeling empowered. I can feel those two things at the same time.

Speaker 4 44:50

Yeah.

Speaker 3 44:51

Right. That's I think been the most powerful thing for me as far as not feeling victimized by the world. Um, because I always thought I think at a certain point I I would get to a place where I would have done enough, said enough, created enough, made enough that I would be like, okay, I'm good. And I don't, that's just not how it works. But I think the reality of being human is that you love being a parent at the same time that you hate being a parent, that you love, you know, you love being a wife or a husband at the same time that you hate it, or vice versa, or whatever that's the experience. And one of the things I I really appreciate about you is that you do you go hard into whatever you're feeling, which I admire and I have learned to do more of since we've gotten closer, honestly.

Speaker 45:36

Thank you. That's the Scorpio. It's a blessing and a curse, to be honest.

Speaker 3 45:40

Well, you've you've blessed a lot of people with it in your community as well. And for those of you who've not listened or to Gabrielle before, don't know. Um, you're a best-selling author multiple times over, a creator, writer, actress, director, and you have a very large and dedicated community of people who've read your books, who've helped, who've healed with you.

Speaker 46:02

Yeah.

Speaker 3 46:03

So many, so, so, so many people who've healed with you. And so you going big and going hard and doing that in a public way is a huge service to people.

Speaker 46:14

And um thank you for that.

Speaker 3 46:16

Yeah. Have I never told you that before?

Speaker 46:20

Um sure, in so many different words, but it's nice to hear it now. So thank you. You're welcome.

Speaker 3 46:25

And I think about it, and I was thinking about it a lot yes the other day when we were talking. You know, I appreciate that you you you have opened up more lately about how tough it is to walk through some of the things you're walking through, particularly as a parent to a young child. And I just I think that that is um it's such a beautiful next step in your life because you you teach other people who listen to you, who know you, who have the the the um who are blessed enough to know you in some capacity to be a little more gentle with themselves as they're walking through some shit. And um I don't think that's any different here than you know, with what you're sharing and this spiritual awakening. And I think kind of life is just a series of those.

Speaker 47:09

Yeah, that very much so. And I think that it was it was having the call with you uh towards the end of it, you were like, I mean, I know this sucks, but like you're you're growing some shit right now, and it like almost helped me refrain a bit in my brain because it was like, yeah, it like can't see the light right now, but like this is always when the big shit comes, is when you are able to be in the uncomfortable spaces and sit in it and then shift it somehow and figure out a way to claw yourself out. So it was uh a nice reminder that it's only a moment, a blip on the scale.

Speaker 3 47:53

And for those people who don't have someone to listen to or to listen to them, it can be harder. Yeah, really hard and isolating, and that's tough. Um, but then they can pick up your book.

Speaker 48:05

I was gonna say that's when people turn to the books and the podcast. And I often think when I call you, I'm like, there's gonna be one day where he's like, Gabrielle, again, we're having this call. I need to talk you off a ledge again.

Speaker 3 48:18

No way. No, you know what? The the next step is for me to let you learn to talk me off a ledge more. But if you haven't noticed in our friendship, I've I've started to do that more.

Speaker 48:28

Yep.

Speaker 3 48:28

I've allowed you more.

Speaker 48:30

I take note. I take note. Every time I get that call, I'm like, yes, he's having a menti bee that I get to take care of. I'm kidding.

Speaker 3 48:37

No, but you lead by example, and you know, for some people, men, women, whatever, depending on how we're raised, it could be really hard. That's that's a super vulnerable thing to do.

Speaker 48:45

Yeah.

Speaker 3 48:46

And so you so, you know, all of these, all of these conversations, all of these questions, we're all we I do believe we all know the answers. I really do. I think we're all just at different levels of understanding, but we all, because we're all a part of the same thing, we all kind of know.

Speaker 49:03

Yeah, right.

Speaker 3 49:04

And we're serving our part, whatever that is.

Speaker 49:07

Well, thank you for being my person that I go to for all of those things. And I hope people listening that don't have a person like that have found some something that they can grasp onto in this conversation. Um, you you always have really great eye-opening and like thought-provoking conversations on this show. So thank you for having me again.

Speaker 3 49:28

Thank you. Thank you for being back here. You know, I always appreciate it, and um, I know that the people listening do as well. Although there's this large crossover between our listeners, between my very, very small group of listeners and your very large group of listeners, but hopefully they learn something new too. And you know I love you and I appreciate you. And um, we'll do it again. Yeah.

Speaker 49:48

Anytime. Anytime.

Speaker 3 49:49

Okay, everybody, until next time. Take good care. Bye-bye.

Speaker 1 49:53

Unsided, unsighted, unsided, unsided.