Remarkable Minds
Remarkable Minds is a show for people who want to level up their professional growth. Hosted by leaders at Daniel Stark Law, each episode dives into the habits, mindsets, and insights that have led us to remarkable results. Whether you're a business owner, leader, or just someone who refuses to settle for "just okay," Remarkable Minds will challenge you to think bigger, perform better, and stand out in the professional world.
Remarkable Minds
How to Stand Out When Applying for Jobs
Text us your questions, comments, or what what topics you'd like to see next!
Searching for a job can be an emotionally draining process, but it doesn't have to be.
Jessica and Amy join us to share their perspectives as leaders in the People and Experience Department (Daniel Stark's version of HR). They explain how the difference in landing your dream job can be something you may have not even thought about.
Learn tips for building your resume, hear interview horror stories, and be better prepared for your next job search.
Ready to stand out from thousands of applicants? Listen now and discover what hiring managers are really looking for.
This podcast is brought to you by Daniel Stark Injury Lawyers, a personal injury law firm that protects our clients from getting SCREWED by big insurance.
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In the background, as we're interviewing him, the fire alarms are going off because we see flashing and he is at a student center and we're looking at him like what's going on? You, okay, and he's like, well, the fire alarms are going off, but I'm not sure if I need to move somewhere else and so. But he was very calm and cool, collective like, and then somebody actually had to approach him and be like hey, sir, you have to, you have to leave the building.
Speaker 2:Oh he was. You have to leave the building.
Speaker 3:He was committed to doing the interview. He was staying on the interview, no matter what. He was going down with the building.
Speaker 2:I love that, but that is true and even though that didn't go, he may have probably like oh man, that was a disaster. We saw that, as this person stayed calm, he was collected and cool, he's going to do good under pressure, so that's a really great insight.
Speaker 3:Get ready. Drop the confetti, get ready, get ready.
Speaker 2:Get ready, drop the confetti. Welcome to Remarkable Minds hosted by Daniel Stark Leaders. Here we unbox insights for professional growth. My name is Claudia Yanez. I do marketing sales here at Daniel Start and today we are joined by Jessica and Amy. Amy is our chief financial officer and, jessica, please remind me again of your role, because I know what you do and I feel like it's and I know it's the people and experience department, but what's the actual title?
Speaker 1:So my title is people and experience. Team lead.
Speaker 2:Oh see, I would. I should have just guessed and I would have nailed it. So today's topic and why I'm so excited that y'all are here is we're going to talk about how to stand out in a pool of applicants. And I want to first talk about cause. We just had one of our plannings and y'all showed the amount of resumes that y'all like sift through. So just, let's just and we are a pretty prominent and law firm in central Texas we do get quite a bit, and for other people and other businesses, depending on size, this may vary, but for us, what was that for? For this year, how many?
Speaker 1:We had a number of applicants, a little bit over 2,000.
Speaker 2:Over 2,000. Okay, it's a great topic because for the people that are joining the workforce and this is going to be how to stand out from that pool of applicants there. So the first thing I want to talk about is just first impressions. So real quick, jessica, tell me kind of what your, I guess, walk us through a little bit of the workflow and where that first impression really comes from.
Speaker 1:So, like, the first impression that we get is we see the application. So one of the things that we look at is did you answer all the questions? Because if you didn't, then it's an incomplete application and you're pretty much not passed forward.
Speaker 2:Can you tell us, amy, like what? Why do we not maybe respond back like hey, you didn't complete it, or hey, you know, we're going to give you a chance to finish it if you want us to review it. And why does it go to an automatic reject?
Speaker 3:Well, because we're looking for self-starters and we're looking for people that that can read instructions and follow them, and if you can't, at a minimum, read an application, an application, and complete it, then you're probably not the person we're looking for. You know, we're looking for people that will do it all, do it right, do it now. So that's one of our core values and we need you to read everything. Read to the bottom, check your emails.
Speaker 2:That's extremely important too, because we are a law firm and there's so many details the devil's in the details so we do require that high level of you know, attention to detail, and so that is absolutely already a first impression.
Speaker 3:Well, and our questions are very intentional. So we are looking for a very specific type of person, so we ask very specific questions. So if you choose not to answer them, then you're probably not our person. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And that's hard for someone like listening. If you've been on that like, oh, I didn't fill out the application. But when you are going through that many applications to sort through, like you are competing with so many others who have put in that effort, who did you know, schedule the time and put in the energy? And we're very intentional about you know, I'm going to complete my application, I'm going to make sure I responded to all of those, make sure I researched, maybe the company and that they have put that forward, and so that is already out of the gate kind of what you are up against. And then you have what's the next thing that you'll look at? Do you have the application and you have the personality trait assessment. Can you talk to us a little bit about what is that? What is that meant to give us? And, on their end, what do they see?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so it's a list of words and so you just take time to look at those words and see what best describes your personality. So from that list of words, I think it's over, like what, 100?
Speaker 3:Yeah it's a little over, and we can take those words and determine. You know what is your personality style Like. Do you like to have fun? Are you more serious? Are you super critical? You know what's your productivity level going to be and we have different metrics within those. Those words and those key points that kind of tell us what type of team member you would be, and it also depends on what department. So in accounting it takes a different type of person than maybe marketing. So we have different metrics for each department.
Speaker 2:So we have all taken this personality assessment and I think it's by the model. Is the flip in profile? Is that still?
Speaker 3:Yeah, the company is called Behavioral Essentials Essentials now.
Speaker 2:And great company. We've used them for a very long time. It measures, like you said, the high productivity of yourself critical, how much emotional support you're going to need. What's your, your free spirit, how are you with change management and how important is networking or social networking for you? There's all these different components and I love that because, again, it gives us an insight. So, someone who needs high emotional support, I'm going to want to place that person preferably in an office where there is a leader or maybe multiple leaders in that office. I'm not going to want that person in a satellite spot because they're not going to thrive in that environment. And these are really key for us and identifying that type of personality trait, so I know not just where and if we have the leadership that would fit their style, to just give us the most advantage, knowing upfront what kind of environment and coaching this person is going to need and if we can equip that for them.
Speaker 3:Well, and that helps us set them up for success. We don't want people to join our firm and then automatically fail, so we're also looking for how can we position them to be their best version of themselves. I love that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and to piggyback off that, it actually pulls a report for the hiring manager if that person does come on board and gives them some conflict tools if those arise, or how they can make themselves better and perform well at the job.
Speaker 2:I love that. I don't know, I don't think I've taken advantage of that feature. So yeah, that's awesome.
Speaker 1:It's a new feature within. It's pretty new.
Speaker 3:And then the other thing you can do is you can take maybe one of your high performers and you can put their line chart on with an applicant and you can see if they have similar traits, how they're going to complement each other or if they're just not going to work. You know, so you can. You can look at it from a different area yeah, love that Cool.
Speaker 2:Yeah, all right, so they fill out the assessment. Hopefully. Now you have the application, now you have the assessments. What's next?
Speaker 1:So we sent it to the hiring manager for review. So the hiring manager will review their resume, as well as their application and their assessment, and so from there, based like you said, you'll look at it from a marketing standpoint and if it's something that you would like to move forward with, then you will let us know and we set up a screening interview.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, and you said something that I want to make sure we clarify, because every organization is different on who the hiring manager is. Traditionally, or maybe for really big corporations, this is normally someone that's in the people in experience department or a traditional HR department. That's not our case. Our case, the hiring manager is different. Can you talk a little bit about either of you, about why that is? Why do we have a setup that way?
Speaker 3:Yeah, we empower basically, our team leads in each department to have the ability to build their team, build their department and we are the most non-corporate HR ever, so we keep us. You know we follow all the rules but we don't want to be stuffy or we don't want to. It's not about being in control. We want to empower our leaders to build their own teams and have some say-so, if you will, and the ability to make some decisions that's best for their department. We're not in their department.
Speaker 3:So we're just here to facilitate getting them what they need.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, and as someone who's come from that background, who's come from a very corporate structure, what do you feel have been like the pros and cons of doing doing the structure the way that we do it? I have so much to say about that. Yeah, no, please go.
Speaker 3:The pros are everybody feels invested, they're bought in, they're a part of the process. The cons are you never know what they're going to say. Sometimes you have to be like, hey guys, that's, we can't really do that, or you should never do that again, or let's talk about it. But that's kind of what makes it fun. You just never know what is going to come across your desk and how you can help them.
Speaker 3:But I very much love giving the these you know, these young, young leaders the ability to learn a new skill set, because this is not something you're born with.
Speaker 2:In general, oh yes, and it has been even for me very educational, uh, even though I have been kind of in the hiring manager role on and off. You know my tenure here. I learned so much more once you came on board both of y'all and then you hosted, like the Zoom session. Okay, guys, these are the do's and don'ts of when you actually conduct interviews.
Speaker 2:And you know, claudia, you're not allowed to say all these personal questions you ask and those are like, oh, wow, like I, there are a lot of these like rules and things that we got to be in compliant and we want to make sure that we are protecting that person and ourselves as well. So that's really good Good information to have and thank you all for not making it so structure and so like it's just enough structure and just enough autonomy, because that's right, it's the hiring Like I want to have that, I want to have that be bought in to the people that are coming in, because I've also vetted them and y'all put in so much of the work already and making sure that the people that do come through have at least gone through this process. And I guess a little bit more about that and talk about it from a hiring manager perspective. Now, like what we go do we sift through them and we're looking at resumes and my favorite things that I love looking at resumes. I love when they immediately include a picture, like, okay, now I have personalized this person, I have a picture of them and I'm just kind of reading through yes, the compliments are great, the objectives and what they've done. Most of that information I'll get in the interview, kind of like what your role was, what some of the highlights, and also like what didn't work out in your roles. I'm looking for transparency there, but most of the things I get I'm looking immediately is the organization Like is it telling me a story? Like can I identify? Just have you summarize enough to where I know that I want to take the next step and meet you in person. And the immediate turnoffs are grammar issues, spacing issues, like when the document is not formatted or someone maybe used a template from like LinkedIn and just downloaded it and uploading that without just double checking.
Speaker 2:And the reason why that to me is so important again is because we're in a. We work at a law firm, like for our particular, and what we do creating documents and writing, you know, pleadings, briefs, all kinds of things that we write. Yes, any other law firm that's critical. It's critical to have an eye for that and we want to make sure that we write. Any other law firm that's critical. It's critical to have an eye for that. And we want to make sure that we're hiring people that were ready to like hit the ground running and not have to go back and show them like the basics.
Speaker 2:And if people can just pause and look at what you're actually submitting, is this a good representation of who I am? Like if all they're going to know about me is this one document, that's the other thing. Please look like the more, the harder it is to like go through. So like one page is just perfect and keeping it relevant to like your most recent experience rather than you know those things, it's helpful in making that decision quicker. Those are kind of like what I look at. What are some of the and there are some more obviously I look at like how often they've been employed. If there's been these random breaks, maybe we'll like you know, I'll notate that down maybe something to talk about.
Speaker 1:What about?
Speaker 2:for y'all. What are those things that y'all look at?
Speaker 1:I love one-pagers Like I just want an outline of who you are, what jobs have you had in the past, and then during your interview you can explain all the rest of it so you can give me like little bullet points of what that job obtained or had within that position. But I love the one pagers.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I like something that's not. I like it well-structured, not distracting. Some people get super creative with their resume. The other thing, like Claudia mentioned earlier, is you've got to show us that you put some effort into this. So you know, make it a PDF, because when it gets loaded in our system, if you've used a GIF or a Word document, it comes across looking really strange on our site and you may not know that, but by the time we look at it it looks like it was developed, you know, by an elementary kid.
Speaker 2:Save that PDF. Yeah, Just PDF it by an elementary kid Save that PDF.
Speaker 3:Yeah, just PDF it. Make it organized. Check your spelling. No special fancy colors. Typically I like that. You said you like a picture. That's a very marketing thing to say. That's not usual. I would say, out of the 2000 applicants resumes that we received, I would say maybe a dozen have a picture, but they're probably exactly what you're looking for, yeah.
Speaker 2:A lot of.
Speaker 2:That's right, because a lot of the people on my team that I do remember hiring, most of them had a picture and it just immediately I just I personalized you Like you stood out Now that when now when I see the name Jane Smith, I have a picture that comes like, oh, is that one person, and I can identify you easier.
Speaker 2:You're top of mind where, if you didn't have a picture, most resumes look the same to me and it's so hard for me to identify you out of a group of just applicants like that, and so that just makes it so much easier for me. The other thing I do love about what I see about resumes when you just give me one piece of nugget about you, that's just not about your corporate life, not about your work history or accomplishments in college or in high school, and so when people include their hobbies and maybe fun things that they love to do, I love that as well, because then I can connect on maybe a little bit more of a personal level, or I know they're going to connect with somebody on a personal level. So, like I enjoy fly fishing, I was like, oh, these people are they're going to yeah, we have a lot of.
Speaker 2:You know I love hunting and you know this is Texas and a lot of people here hunt and I was like, oh you'll. People will immediately be able to like, relate to you, and it gives us an opening for like the interview as well and love to talk about people's passions. That's one of the things we're really big on as well, and so when they include that, that's always fun.
Speaker 3:So I like a cover letter, because it's just enough personal information that's not work related that you can have a little dose of their personality on paper and then you kind of know, you know what it's going to be like going into the next interview. Yeah.
Speaker 1:To extend on Amy. So whenever you send a like a file through WordDoc or GIF, it comes over. As do you remember WordPad?
Speaker 2:Oh, yes, yes.
Speaker 1:And that's what it comes over as, and so it's a bunch of words all jumbled together, and so it's very hard to read.
Speaker 2:So just on the safe side.
Speaker 3:PDF it all the time Make it pretty in.
Speaker 2:PDF.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Okay, so the hiring manager looks at it. They look at the resume Okay, we have enough relevant experience. This looks like a person that can do the job that we're asking them to do. Great, I send that over and I tell people in experience, I like this person. I'm looking at their personality trait chart and I'm checking all these and again, we look at everything holistically together and so if there are any things that we identify as maybe yellow flags, I normally note that down, so I know I'll talk about those.
Speaker 3:But there are definitely some maybe are there any immediate rejections that come from the personal? Okay, yeah, talk about that, yeah.
Speaker 2:So specifically productivity.
Speaker 3:you know we we look at it has to be 80% or higher, unless you know this person or you know there is a chance. Nothing's perfect, so there is a chance. Either they were nervous when they were taking it or something. But typically we look at productivity and we look at order. And then the other thing we look is if they're a very high order person and they're very adverse to change. And we we're a very fast paced environment here. We're always changing, we're learning, we're doing. Sometimes those two in combination can be really hard. Sometimes those two in combination can be really hard. The other thing is, if you have a really high free spirit and exhibitionism, which you like to be in the spotlight, sometimes you typically will end up being kind of the class clown and so you've kind of look at the other traits to make sure that there's a balance.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah. So we want people to have fun, but there needs to be balance. So we look at the resume again that looks great. We looked at the personality that looks great. We have identified things we want to talk about. I tell you, hey, through our HR software system, I'm ready to pull this person forward move them forward.
Speaker 1:What happens next? So they'll receive an email from us where we talk to them about scheduling a screening interview. So the screening interview will be about, we say, 10 to 15 minutes. Some go a little bit longer when we get the conversation started, and so it'll be hosted via Zoom. You'll meet with myself or one of my team members and then it'll just be over Zoom and we'll answer about 10 questions about yourself.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and what are you trying to get from that interview, like what's your main objective?
Speaker 1:I think we're just trying to build a personality based on that person. Can we connect with that person? One of the cool things about what we do in P&E like even though they may apply for that position and we might see a better fit for them in another position, we had some front desk people apply for a position and we actually said, hey, you know what, we got a pre-lit position open. We think you might be a better fit for this one. So it's really trying to see like hey, will this be a good fit for our company? And then also, is this the position for you as well?
Speaker 2:What have been that you can remember, some like immediate turnoffs, Like oh we have some good ones yeah share a couple of those um, let's see, we interviewed one?
Speaker 1:um. The first couple questions are just yes and no's and by the third question it was about his um. What about his background? Um, there was a lot of yelling of why we wanted to know about his background because he had a lot of criminal defense.
Speaker 3:Yeah, he had a record. He had a record and so he got very defensive, starts yelling and screaming in the middle of the interview and it got. It was wild.
Speaker 2:Oh, wow, you didn't know that you were about to trip over that, no, what you were stepping into there. And of course we don't do criminal background checks until, like once we're correct, once we have a hiring or an offer letter out to them, and then, of course, to employments, to contingent on that coming. So we didn't know that, oh, interesting. So those are very obvious immediate no's.
Speaker 3:Another good one was both Jess and Madison were on a screen call together and they asked a question and the answer was you know what? I'm going to save my answer for someone higher up.
Speaker 2:Oh, wow, yeah, but that shows like just ego. Come on, and we talked about this and you know, in another episode where, like our social contract and that really goes top to bottom, our social contract and that really goes top to bottom, it doesn't matter. We should hold each other, every single person, accountable to it and who we agree to be as people and a lot of that like humility. It's like everybody should be treated with respect, from the owner to the front desk, to the janitor, and if you can't show that early on, that's just so sad.
Speaker 1:I think we read a book about the ideal team player Was that it? And it talked about how the front desk person is also the interviewer.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love that. That's always a great one because if you can come in and treat the front desk person with respect and they should like we adore all of our front desk people.
Speaker 3:We couldn't do it without them oh absolutely, and I hate that.
Speaker 2:I hate that name. I feel like, you know, at some point we'll probably change it or something, because it's so traditional and it doesn't really encompass all that they do and the people that we have sitting at the front are like the first impression to the, to our environment, and they're warm and they're just so inviting, and so that frustrates me for you as you went through that Okay. So yeah, the ego that comes through. Obviously you tripped over something on the other ones and some issues there.
Speaker 3:Well, sometimes people get to talking and then you don't realize that they just they end up just needing to talk to someone. So we get lots of life stories. We get sometimes some tears.
Speaker 2:Oh, we get it, you just never oversharing. Yeah, has that ever been like a baffling, like when someone that we've turned someone down because it was just too much?
Speaker 3:I would say it's not the oversharing there's. Sometimes there's too much drama involved in whatever we don't do drama here at all, it's also part of our social contract and if we feel like that's what they're going to bring to the team, we're not looking to disrupt any team in our entire company with extra drama?
Speaker 1:Oh, absolutely yeah, and bad mouthing your prior employment.
Speaker 3:That is a big one, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:If you're gonna talk about about them, what are you gonna say about us? Respect the transparency when they bring about, like what went wrong or what happened. But it's in the manner that you do it that I that means the most to me, because it says more about you than it does about them. And if you're able to talk about something that really frustrated you or something that you felt like was a colossal failure, but you do it in a way that's professional and still holds the integrity of what happened, yeah, kudos to you. I like that. Yes, I want that on my team if you're able to really address it in that way. And so that's kind of you know, we're talking about our process and every organization is different and they may have a refined, more refined process, shorter process. Ours is a little bit lengthy because we're a little bit more slower to hire. I'm going to get the right people on on the team, of course. So after they you go through that first screening interview, what happens after that?
Speaker 1:So during, also during the first interview, we also tell them the process. So we tell them, hey, we have a three step process, this is who you're going to meet with. We tell them about our location and who Daniel Stark is. We kind of give them a breakdown of, hey, this is what's going to happen. So, if we like them during that screening interview, then we automatically schedule the skill set. We have the authority, the autonomy, to go ahead and schedule that skill set interview with the hiring manager.
Speaker 1:And what is that three-step process that you just mentioned? So we have the screening interview first, which is with my team, the P&E department, and then the next step would be the skill set interview. So the skill set interview is with the hiring manager and one of their team leads, and then the third interview is really about our culture interview. We go over our core processes and core purpose and so that one's usually held in person. It can be with anyone throughout the firm, and so it could be from the front desk to all the way to an attorney, so a director level. So, yeah, we tell them about that.
Speaker 3:Well, in fact, it's typically not in the department you're going to be working in. Yeah, so we'll pull people from all over the firm to sit down and discuss our core values with them and our social contract and let them know you know what our culture is and how we work like to interact with each other.
Speaker 2:Yeah, For the most part, I don't. I think I can remember on my end where I haven't passed people on culture. I think that the few that I have is just at at this point. Sometimes maybe they're just kind of. They're kind of done, they don't, they don't finish strong, um, and or they don't really care about the culture. They're just looking for a job.
Speaker 2:And that's hard because we want people to love it here. We want people to enjoy the culture and not that you got to be like all the way, like drinking the kool-aid all the time. That's not what we're looking for, but someone that that does believe in the work and and believes in what we do, has true value to our clients and that's really what I'm looking for and that they have the right tools to like. One of our core values is work hard, play hard. We want you to give it your all here and be able to give it your all in your passions, and that they have really good rituals in place to recharge Because what we do is challenging and it is hard and making sure people have that skill set already in place so they go through that process, they get all the way to the end. Is that it Is that the end? No, she's like no, but wait there's more, there's more.
Speaker 1:So if you're an attorney, we go through attorney shadows. It's kind of just between you and another attorney and you kind of just talk about the day to day cases. What's the case look like, what's the paralegal setup, things like that. And then well, for attorneys are different.
Speaker 3:So everybody else, if you've made it through the skillset, you've done the screening. You've done the skillset, you've made it through core values then, and social contract, which is the culture interview. Basically, they take whoever has been passed through of all that, because everybody submits their feedback and then typically, an applicant is chosen from there, an attorney. We take it extra. So, depending on what level or where you're coming in, there could be a dinner involved, there's attorney shadows involved. We ask for writing sample because attorneys are super important to what we do and we need to make sure that they're going to, they're going to fit in.
Speaker 2:No, absolutely. And so once we do have the selection and we're like everybody agrees like this, is it, um, we're going to hire this person. And for me, I know that if there's been maybe like they pass culture, but there's been some um, some concerns that were brought up, I will have like just a one conversation with them. I'll talk to them about some concerns and issues, and what I'm looking for there is I'm not expecting the perfect candidate, but I'm expecting someone who is committed to continuous improvement. Are you willing to be coached on it? Are you willing to put in the work to get better at this? And if you are, then I will take the chance.
Speaker 2:I will work with you if I know that it's not going to be harmful or a detriment to my team. It's different if you're going to hire someone that's like okay, this person has a lot of drama, they have no coping skills, they don't really know how to compartmentalize that and keep it at home. They're going to bring it with them. I'm not going to take on that kind of a commitment because that will be detrimental to the team and that will hurt the team and productivity levels and just our environment, and so that's not what leaders should commit to. It's some of the other ones like can you take constructive feedback and maybe some confidence, like learning how to build your confidence and just kind of in that area?
Speaker 3:So the culture interviews being in person are very important because I'm typically not in a lot of them but, I watch, I want to see the interaction amongst the team members in the office as the applicants coming through. What's their body language like? What is their attire like? Did they put effort into coming? Are they excited to be here? So, there's a lot you can see, just as observing the situation Absolutely.
Speaker 1:One of the things we didn't really talk about, though, is when you're doing the screening interviews, being aware of your background.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so yes, we have a great story and I just want to put on the record I did hire this person and they are fantastic, but when?
Speaker 1:they were on their Zoom call.
Speaker 3:The background made it look like they had horns and so not being aware of what's in your background or what's in your screen. Another one is you should get all the way dressed. So we had a guy that chose to get dressed halfway Correct but at the same time, in the background, he was taking an interview from his bedroom. His bed was unmade, his laundry was on the floor.
Speaker 2:We learned a lot about this person just through a Zoom call and for those that may be like, well, it's just focus on the person. Well, you tell us how much to focus on. Because if you're going to put all of that in, like visible, then take some responsibility for what you're going to show. If you don't want people knowing that, then don't put it on the screen Absolutely. And there's so much more about charisma, communication. You know that we learned from entre leadership. That's really great there.
Speaker 2:And how people present on Zoom, even from, like how close you are to the screen, how what you're doing, like talking with your hands, if you seem close off, you're just your tone and your inflection points, you seem engaged.
Speaker 2:All of that, like we don't even know that those, all of those things are forming a, an opinion of this person. But you, to take all of that into consideration seems really overwhelming. Like, oh, there's so much stuff happening, so I think it's just so easy, like just go to a room, maybe, that you don't have nothing in the background. Or if you do want to show your personality, then pick a room or pick a background that you feel like really showcase your personality. And even I think that makes it a little bit more memorable sometimes than just having a solid background too. So it just kind of depends on the person. What would you recommend? Or I guess, how do our more quiet applicants come across? You know, versus, like, how can they compete against the people that are like super bubbly and just they just overwhelm you with personality, versus those that are not in their quiet?
Speaker 3:Oh, I, we dig so we don't, we don't give them the opportunity to be super quiet or the interview goes very awkward fast. But, uh, we try to dig it out because not everybody is going to be in your face and and super confident. In fact, most people are nervous when they get on the call with us. So it's more about connecting with them and letting we're real people and letting them know that we are human just like they are, and then typically they'll open up and start talking. But I know Jess is perfect at. She always finds something that they're, they have something in common, and I don't know how she does it. It's a skillset that I don't, you know, I admire about her. But she, she'll find something that they have in common and that she builds from that, and typically that works with all styles of people.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like we just recently went through an interview and this one got really like, really personal and she did overshare a little bit, but we moved her on through the process because we we could easily connect with her. Like she said, she shared something so personal with us that was like, oh my gosh, so heartfelt and she already felt as if she was a part of the team already.
Speaker 2:Well, I know that we're slow to hire and we try to keep those moving pieces, like with quick turnaround, so that we are not losing great applicants.
Speaker 2:And I think, like you said, setting those expectations like this is what the process is going to look like. We're going to communicate with you, let you know where you're at. It's very helpful and I think for anyone just listening is, this is really an opportunity for you to just show the most truest and most trusted version of yourself and that's the impression you want to leave. Be authentic, be you and show how you would make value at this firm. And vice versa, we want to show how we want to benefit you and grow you and give you an environment, a place where you can come in, master something, have purpose and have autonomy and really love your job and how all those things kind of combine, work together for both of our benefits.
Speaker 2:And I love our process. I love how we hire high-performing people here, high-energy people and kind of just reviewing. I know we're talking a lot about our process, so let's just kind of step back and just talk about people just applying in the workforce in general. What are some of those important things that they can do to just stand out?
Speaker 1:I think having a creative resume first. Let's not use the templates from Indeed or LinkedIn. Let's be creative here. That'd be my first tip.
Speaker 3:I would say make sure you sprinkle your personality in through your when you're answering our questions or when you're doing your resume, or if you include a cover letter. Just throw your personality in there a little bit and let us see who you are, because you are competing against. So of the 2000 applicants we move about 400 to screening. So it's not very many and you need you know a hook to get us, you know interested.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I love that because you can easily identify people that are just selling you what you think you want to hear and it doesn't feel authentic, and that's mine. It's just be authentic in your application.
Speaker 3:Well, and if you do get interviewed, I would tell you when you're in an interview, bring questions, ask us questions, don't make this one-sided.
Speaker 2:You will definitely stand out if we can tell you you've done your research, you know a little bit about us, you've put some thought into it before you get here, and that makes you stand out. That goes a very long way, especially one of the questions that I know that people get asked about, like tell me a little bit about a recent failure, or tell me about your weaknesses, or tell me about your constraint. Don't hold back, Be transparent in that, and what we're looking for there is that resiliency, that your ability to learn from it and turning it into something that has made you better, and so share that whole part of the story and don't come with the answer.
Speaker 3:I was like I work too much Like well, and my favorite interviews have been where people come in and they have their own personal core values and they tell us what they are and often they mesh with ours very well. So you know someone's gone in and thought about their life and they've reflected and they know what they want and have their own core values. Those are fun interviews.
Speaker 2:I think the other thing that you can really do to kind of stand out and be more engaged especially if you're coming in for in-person or I'm sure there's a way to do this on Zoom is I want to know that you're listening right, that you're actively listening. So maybe summarizing what I said or just saying back okay, this is what I heard you say, and then adding to that conversation so it doesn't feel like I'm just talking at you, like that there's an actual dialogue happening and I really enjoy it when they are in person, that they come with their, like notepad, they're taking notes, they're saving their questions, they are actually engaged and that tells me that they're more committed and that this is something that they actually want, versus someone who just goes and is like I got nothing for you, I don't have any questions for you, I'm not writing anything down because we do cover a lot and just want to know that this is actually landing somewhere with you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you can tell which ones are listening. They're preparing for the next question before you've ever even answered the first question. Oh they've already moved on. So you're right, being active in it and having some back and forth is makes the interview a lot more fun.
Speaker 2:So kind of going back to the do's and don'ts of like when you're in a Zoom interview. I know you have some interesting stories of things that have happened, that and maybe they've've overcome it and that's great and what would be some really good practical advice for people in an interview.
Speaker 1:So we actually hired this person. He was actually going through his screening interview and in the background, as we're interviewing him, the fire alarms are going off, because we see flashing and he is at a student center and we're looking at him like what's going on? You, okay, and he's like, well, the fire alarms are going off, but I'm not sure if I need to move somewhere else and so. But he was very calm and cool, collective like, and then somebody actually had to approach him and be like, hey, sir, you have to, you have to leave the building.
Speaker 2:Oh, he was committed to doing the interview.
Speaker 3:He was staying on the interview, no matter what he was going down with the building.
Speaker 2:I love that, but that is true Like and even though that didn't go, he may have probably like oh man, that was a disaster. We saw that, as this person stayed calm, he was collected and cool. He's going to do good under pressure. So that's a really great insight. Yeah, is there any other ones that you can?
Speaker 3:think of. I will tell you the only other one that's kind of funny is the applicant schedules their own screening call, so they pick a time and a date that's perfect for them and without fail, we'll have people taking the call from their car or wherever they are, so you know, taking time to make sure you're actually available in a space that you know you're comfortable interviewing in is super helpful.
Speaker 2:No, absolutely. I will say that doing an interview in your car probably don't want to do that, and this is probably a time where, like, you do want to make a little bit more effort, like even maybe going to a quiet coffee shop or, if it's if you can't do your home, or. But I think that's great and that's a great point because we do allow them to schedule their own, their own time.
Speaker 1:So especially like technology issues and maybe your phone dying in the middle of your interview, like those are all.
Speaker 3:Well and be on time. You pick the time.
Speaker 2:So we have folks that are late.
Speaker 3:Don't be late to your first interview.
Speaker 2:It goes without saying. But we gotta, we gotta keep saying it.
Speaker 3:Absolutely 74 times.
Speaker 2:Just be a little bit early in your own time right, there you go, love that so many people can relate to this, and people who are just joining the workforce for the very first time or just kind of again, because times have changed, things are a little bit different, and so it's always good to keep up with to what's going on and what kind of employers are looking for and how to really stand out again in the pool of applicants. So that's all of the insights that we're going to unbox today, but if you have any additional comments or topics or even questions about today's conversations, please send those over to podcast at DanielStarkLawcom. Thank you all so much for being with me today. I hope that you all had fun. It's always great talking to you, ladies, so until next time, stay remarkable.