How to Be Unmessablewith in Life and Career with Josselyne Herman-Saccio

In this episode of Career Coaching Secrets our guest is Josselyne Herman-Saccio, a transformational coach, speaker, and founder of the Art of Being Unmessablewith. With decades of experience empowering individuals to break free from limitations and design lives they truly love, Josselyne shares powerful insights on personal transformation, leadership, and creating authentic success. She is passionate about helping people become “unmessablewith” in the face of challenges and align their lives with purpose and possibility.

You can find her on:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/josselyne-herman-saccio-9b9752a/

https://www.instagram.com/beunmessablewith/

https://beunmessablewith.com/

Transcript

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 0:00

Almost everybody does, even if they're really high powered CEOs. It's it's shocking. Like they might be really good at keeping their word to their clients, but their word to themselves, it's that's the biggest thing that messes with people is self-trust. Like so you'll say, Oh, I'm gonna work out five times a week, whatever, and then you wake up and you don't feel like it and you're a little tired and you got a lot of s emails coming at you, and you justify why you're not gonna honor your word, and now you're gonna just get designed by life versus designing life.

Davis Nguyen: 0:28

Welcome to Career Coaching Secrets, the podcast where we talk with successful career coaches on how they built their success and the hard lessons they learned along the way. My name is Davis Wynne, and I'm the founder of Purple Circle, where we help career coaches scale their business to $100,000 years, $100,000 months, and even $100,000 weeks. Before Purple Circle, I've grown several seven and eight-figure career coaching businesses myself and have been a consultant at two career coaching businesses that are doing over $100 million each. Whether you're an established coach or building your practice for the first time, go discover the secrets to elevating your coaching business.

Kevin Yee: 0:59

Welcome to Career Coaching Secrets Podcast. I'm Kevin, and today we are joined by Jocelyn Herman Saccio. She's been a coach for over 35 years and the founder of The Art of Being Ambassable With. Welcome to the podcast, Jocelyn.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 1:13

Thanks, Kevin. Thanks for having me.

Kevin Yee: 1:14

Yeah. Well, 35 years, I think this might be the longest, the most experienced coach on this podcast.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 1:20

The oldest coach, is that what you're trying to say?

Kevin Yee: 1:23

Or old.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 1:24

Like ancient.

Kevin Yee: 1:28

You know, as I think about it, that's just as old. I'm a little bit older, but that's just as old as me. And so I kind of want to get into the origin story, the lore. What made you become a coach and eventually turned it into your own business?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 1:40

Well, I began doing transformative programs when I was 11. I was, I mean, obviously, I'm not like Googling transformation at 11, but my mother and father separated, and my mother did a transformative workshop. And then a year later, my dad did the same workshop and they got back together. And they're 94 and 92 now and have been together 65 years. So they put me in the young person's version of that. So I've grown up in the realm of coaching and transformation my entire life for the most part. I mean, I'm 58 now. So, you know, if you do the math, it's 47 years. Then in my late teens, early 20s, I started doing courses again in that same ecosystem and fell in love with transformation. So I just started getting trained as a coach way back then when I was 19 years old.

Kevin Yee: 2:24

Oh wow, that's so crazy.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 2:26

Yeah, and I've been doing it ever since. So it's, you know, it's kind of like my blood.

Kevin Yee: 2:29

Yeah. Can you tell me how you actually transitioned into being a coach? Like I know that you started at 19 year old years old, but I would love to hear the story.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 2:38

Well, I started leading seminars and courses for a company called Landmark at that point. And at the same time, I had this lifelong dream that I had put to the side to be a singer. I really didn't think it was possible because when I was five years old, my father and I were sitting in the car. I mean, you know, it's five years old. I'm just sitting with him. And I noticed he used to paint a lot, like when he was home, and he had stopped painting. So I asked him innocently, like, why'd you stop painting? And he just kind of flippantly said, Well, you can't do your art as your career. And I latched on to that like it was the truth. Like God had come down and said, You can't do your art as your career. So in that moment, at five, I decided I wasn't gonna pursue a singing career and I would be in business, you know, or be a lawyer or something, you know, where you could do it as your career. So flash forward, I at 18, I'm running a company and making more money than most of my friends' parents. You know, I graduated high school at 16. And in another transformative workshop, you know, because I'm now engaged with getting trained, and I have this insight like maybe that's not the truth. Maybe you can't do your art as your career is something I made up at five and then believed and looked at life through that lens for 15 years. So I kind of disappeared that belief as the truth. And within three months, I got a record deal. And that record ended up going number one in on the charts. We knocked Whitney Houston out of the number one spot after she had been on the number one spot for 14 weeks with I Will Always Love You. We were the next number one song. So it was like so quickly, I was able to fulfill on a lifelong dream that I thought was completely impossible three months earlier. So that's when I said, okay, that's it. I want to train people to be able to live their dreams now, not someday, and be able to fulfill on anything that they want. So that was the turning point where I really got committed and have given my life to making a difference for people and developing them in what I call the art of being unmessable with, which doesn't mean being tough, it means being able to fulfill your dreams and not be thrown by circumstances or people saying no or anything really.

Kevin Yee: 4:39

Yeah, that's so interesting. Well, that's a crazy story. Congratulations, by the way, for that.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 4:43

I know that you were probably not even born yet, but yes. It was 1993 we went number one.

Kevin Yee: 4:51

So hey, I was like five. I was five. Okay, there you go. So yeah. And I'm so curious, since you you turned coaching into a business, how did you kind of decide who you wanted to help? Because I can see a lot of people benefiting from coaching, but is there a specific type of person or like kind of well I've worked with all kinds of people for the last, you know, 35 or 40 years now.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 5:11

40 years, I can't even believe it. You know, I've led programs for more than 200,000 people, and they're all different walks of life. And especially when I was uh leading the forum and the advanced course for landmark, I mean they just whoever was in front of me, I would transform. That was it. But when I left landmark a few years ago and started the art of being unmessable with, I wasn't really focused on any type of person, but organically what has arisen from the programs that I do is it's a lot of creative people, obviously, because that's my background, but also entrepreneurs, founders, and executives. That seems to be who gravitates towards me and who ends up working with me.

Kevin Yee: 5:47

And so my background is pharmacy, right? And I always think about symptoms and stuff where people come up to my counter, they ask me, Oh, I have a stuffy nose and stuff. For the coaching, for your the people that are coming up to you, do you notice certain symptoms or patterns of problems that people are asking about?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 6:02

Uh yeah, definitely. I mean, I think with entrepreneurs, a lot of times they feel like they're successful, they produce the results, but they're not fulfilled or satisfied, even though they have the metrics and they have the trapping. Another thing that I find messes with people quite often is what people call imposter syndrome. But really, you know, having self-doubt and not really having self-confidence, even though you have the resume, but you don't have the reality of yourself as somebody who's, you know, worth listening to or worth investing in or whatever the worth thing is. And, you know, time and money messes with people, obviously. But the biggest thing that I've found that messes with people and really what I design my work around is their relationship to their word. Because what I've discovered is no matter how high performance you are, the areas that mess with you, that throw you off track, have to do with a weak relationship to your words. Where people are killing it is usually where they have a word in the matter. They say something and they do it. They say something and it happens. And where they're weak is where they say something and then reasons get in the way, or circumstances, or justifications, or explanations, or considerations end up being bigger or more strong than their words. So I work a lot on the muscle of word. In fact, in 2026, I'll be launching a very brand new course I've never done before with people called the Word Boot Camp. And it's all about building muscle with your words so that you can say X and have X happen, no matter in what area of your life. So I'm very excited about that.

Kevin Yee: 7:30

Ooh, okay. We'll talk about your different offers in a bit. But speaking about business, I'm so curious. In your current business right now, how do people typic find out about you? What kind of marketing are you doing right now?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 7:41

I mostly just, I mean, I'm not doing any ads or anything like that. So it's mostly referrals, so word of mouth and social media. And then there's people that find their way to my list either through my podcast or being on podcast, but mostly it's social media and and word of mouth.

Kevin Yee: 7:56

What social media platforms are you on right now?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 7:58

Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook, TikTok. I think that's pretty much it. And then I have my own podcast called Be Unmessable With, and that like 150th episode is airing right now. So that's you know, a way to really highlight other people's messages, but two episodes a week out there. So we have YouTube, you know, the YouTube channel is doing all that. You know, we're pretty much everywhere, everywhere but X.

Kevin Yee: 8:19

Uh, I see. Are you noticing any uh platforms that are driving more like attention than others for you?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 8:24

Not really. Uh I'm not tracking that stuff. I have a team that tracks that stuff, and you know, I just keep creating content. You know, I want to keep focused on my zone of genius, and I love creating content. I love creating courses, I love creating no evergreen courses and in-person courses. I have a year-long mastery program that I work with entrepreneurs and founders, so I focus a lot on that and my group coaching programs. I'm mostly focused on the design and delivery, and I let other people deal with the marketing.

Kevin Yee: 8:51

Yeah, you mentioned that you love creating content, and I'm assuming that you've created content for a little while now. What kind of content have you kind of gravitated to over the years?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 8:58

You mean video content, or what do you mean what kind of content?

Kevin Yee: 9:02

Like type of content. Like people have different formats, right? Or they talk about certain topics or certain things. Some people like listicles, some people like other different formats.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 9:11

So I'm just kind of curious if there's I mean, I create my solo episode of my podcast every week, which we use as reels. I create, you know, short content. I create things that'll make a difference for people in their ability to live their dreams and not be thrown by the circumstances, no matter what life throws at them, to be able to be unmessed with. So all my content is designed around that and around impacting people's ability to fulfill on what they want.

Kevin Yee: 9:35

I see. So it sounds like your core content is like m mostly the podcast then, and everything else like streams out from that.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 9:41

I mean, sort of. I've trying to design it that way to economize my time, but I have a lot of content. I mean, it's not just the podcast, it's I, you know, I do international speaking, so I have, you know, I have TEDx talk, I have, you know, like I have a lot of stuff. And there's no shortage of material. I do free workshops, I do, you know, a holiday workshop every year to teach people how to be unmessable with during the holidays because that's a time of year where people get very messable with. They go to their families and you know, they become like a six-year-old again and react to everything rather than staying in that space of creations, interviews and written articles and press, and so you know, there's just a lot of content. I I don't know how else to say it.

Kevin Yee: 10:23

Okay. So you're creating lots of content out there, and people are finding out about you. They choose to work with you. And so I'm so kind of curious what are the different coaching modalities that you're using? You mentioned that you have different offers and all that. I would love to kind of hear what your offers look like.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 10:37

I have free things on my website. It's you know, the freebies page of beunmessablewith.com. Tons of free things from you know, burnout workshops to money workshop to, you know, I do a money workshop that's free with one of my dearest friends, Robin Quivers from the How Howard Stern show and our money coach, Tyrone Jackson. So we have three of us leading that work, that's free. And I have things on how to instantly reset from reaction to creation. I have things to not be stopped by not be motivated. I have an imposter syndrome thing. Those are all free. And then I have paid things. So I have some things that are more like quick, you know, little five-day things that you can, like a dream source discovery process where you can kind of identify what your vision is as distinct from your goals. And then I have a calendar workshop, which is one of my most popular offerings. It's like 20 bucks, but it it transforms your relationship to your calendar. So burnout and overwhelm, that really deals with that. I have a group coaching program, which is three months long. I do that twice a year. And then I have foundational Evergreen program, which is like a five-week pre-recorded do-it-your-own pace program. That program's like a good entryway into my world. And it's, you know, you can do it at your own pace and you have lifetime access to all the materials. So that's a pretty good sampling. And then I have year-long mastery programs with entrepreneurs. They're very small. I try and keep them under 20 people, and they're about minimally doubling your revenue while increasing your element of freedom in your life. So it's about mastering performance, creation, which is like shifting from reaction to creation and freedom. Because one of the biggest problems I see with entrepreneurs is they build this empire, let's say, or even a small empire, a company, and they become a prisoner of what they created. And then they end up burnt out and overwhelmed because they're trying to do it all instead of have it all. So I'm a real master at that. You know, mastery is they say it takes 10,000 hours to even begin to talk about mastery. Well, I've got like hundreds of thousands of hours, and this is something that I am you know masterful at. So I have designed programs to empower people to be able to do the same thing that I've done. You know, 10x my revenue and reduce my work week to 15 hours a week. I mean, that's what people want. So I was like, all right, I'm gonna teach them how to do it.

Kevin Yee: 12:44

Yeah. Speaking about mastery, how do you you have so many different projects and all that? I'm so curious. How do you manage it all? Like, especially with all the client capacity and all the different projects.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 12:54

Well, I design it in my calendar. That's why the calendar workshop is so important, you know. I use my calendar as my canvas. So I create, you know, from three years out, two years out, one year out, and then backwards plan it. And then I design it where it's like, okay, if I don't want to work on Fridays, Saturdays, and Sundays, I'm gonna block those days out and Wednesdays from this time to this time, I'm not working. Then I have a certain amount of time slots left, and I won't take on more clients than I can fit into what I've designed because I'm committed that people have a life they design, not just one that fills up by default. And life will fill up by default because people, I mean, I get requests all the time. I don't say yes to everything. I try to say yes to everything that speaks to me, but at the same time, I look in reality at what is my time and am I willing to do what I need to do to fulfill on my word? Because once I give my word, that's pretty much law in the universe. Which is why I want to train people in that. Because if you can say something and have it happen, if you can say double my revenue next quarter and have it happen, that's like power. Or if you can say intimacy in my marriage and have it happen, that's like being a magic person. I'm committed that people have their word like their wand and be able to create, you know, magic results with it. And mostly people's relationship to their word is weak.

Kevin Yee: 14:04

I actually noticed that too, about like even myself and stuff like that. That's something I've always kind of struggled with, right? Like my whole entire life and all that. And I can imagine other people struggling with it too.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 14:15

Almost everybody does, even if they're really high-powered CEOs. It's it's shocking. Like they might be really good at keeping their word to their client, but their word to themselves, it's that's the biggest thing that messes with people is self-trust. Like, so you'll say, Oh, I'm gonna work out five times a week, whatever, and then you wake up and you don't feel like it, and you're a little tired, and you got a lot of emails coming at you, and you justify why you're not gonna honor your word, and now you're gonna just get designed by life versus designing life.

Kevin Yee: 14:43

And I do feel like it diminishes your own trust to like deliver, like if you're in the client like delivery world, it diminishes your own trust on what you can deliver to people and all that and those promises. So it does, yeah.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 14:55

And it's promising is a huge access, Kevin. Like, if you want to develop muscle with your word, I use pro I've written two books about promises because I find that making a promise, first of all, it's so powerful and profound because you're creating a future that is not going to happen anyway. So if I promise to have lunch with you on Friday at 12, whatever was happening Friday at 12 is no longer happening. I just put something in the future that wasn't there. That's magic, you know? And abracadabra in ancient Aramaic means literally, I create as I speak. So I use promises as a mechanism and as like a fun way to have people develop muscle with saying X and having it happen. I have like a cute little, it's cute, but it's profound, it's five-day promise game. It's free again on my website, where every day you get a new promise and you kind of like, you know, create that in your life. And it's not just the doing of it, it's the space that it creates. I promise to make people five people smile today. The space of joy all of a sudden starts to show up in your life, but you did that. You know, you created that. So it's a very powerful tool, promising.

Kevin Yee: 15:59

Yeah, you mentioned something really interesting, like how you can just say something, and it's almost like magic where it kind of manifests, I guess. Like when you said double your revenue, like that really stuck out to me. And so, one of the things that a lot of I guess coaches listen that what I've noticed is that they struggle with things like pricing and pricing strategy. Maybe part of it is a bit self-conscious about like what they think they can charge and all that. If you're open to it, uh you don't have to give it hard numbers, but uh, I think if you know I'm not a secret about anything. Oh yeah, okay.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 16:28

I mean by the time this airs, my prices might change, but this is yeah, but I have no.

Kevin Yee: 16:33

I think what's interesting is like I would love your thoughts about how you structure your price and where you go about it. Because I know some people do project-based, some people do value-based, some people do retainers. Like, I'm so curious on how you think about it.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 16:46

Well, I mean, my programs are whatever price they are. So that's a tuition and that's what it is, you know. My one-on-one coaching, which I do very little of and I only take on a handful of people, is a retainer based. It's retainer and it's based on a certain amount of calls per month, and then chat access, like WhatsApp chat access for you know, little touch points here and there that are needed. And then uh, I guess that's really it. Everything else is really program-based, program or product based. So and I make up my price. I mean, I just make it up. It's like no, there's no right way to price your stuff. It's like, okay, well, I mean, when I first started, my one-on-one was lower than it is now significantly. And one of my clients said to me, You're not charging enough. I was like, really? And he goes, No, you gotta at least double your price. And I was like, I don't know, double my price. And so, like, I was a little bit hesitant because I have a little bit of like, well, I don't, I wouldn't pay that, you know. But I inched it up 50% and nobody was not signing up for it. So I was like, okay, well, good. So he's sort of been a lot of my barometer of when to raise my prices. But I also have a coach. You know, any good coach should have a coach. And if they don't have a coach, I would not hire that coach because you can't see what you can't see. And coaching is really a game of mastery. So if you're not committed to developing yourself and you think you've gotten somewhere, then you're the the uh not a good coach. So I have a coach who I bounce things off of and I say, you know, what do you think about this pricing? Da-da-da-da-da. And and you know, she'll say, Yeah, I think you could do more, or I think maybe a little less on this one. And you know, she's a good guiding DAR person.

Kevin Yee: 18:16

I love that. So it sounds like you base your prices off intuition, but you work with a coach to kind of hone that intuition over time through feedback with your coach and all that.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 18:25

I'm so what do I want to make? What am I willing to spend an hour doing for how much? That's a lot of it. It's like because I'm not just willing to just do what I anything for, you know, ten dollars. I'm not gonna do that, you know. So it just depends on what stage you're at in your life. You know, what what game are you playing? I'm not playing the game of make lots of money and yeah, I'm playing the game of impact and quality of life, you know, and revenue is a natural fallout of that.

Kevin Yee: 18:49

Yeah. Let's talk about the impact stuff. Something I am very interested in because, like I said, you've been in the game for about 35 years. And so I guess where do you want this coaching business to take you in the next few years, the next chapter of your life, I guess? Like, do you have any secret dreams that no one knows about, big ambitions, desires to scale even more? I'm kind of curious on your end.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 19:07

I want to scale in my evergreen products. I do want to do that. I want to get those out there to more people because they're really affordable as opposed to maybe group coaching or the mastery program might not be as accessible to certain people. I want to amp up the knowledge of that, so to speak, you know, that people know about those programs and have more and more people doing that. And then the place where I see I can scale is my group coaching program. I typically have about 30 people in that group, but I think I could scale that to, I mean, I've led for hundreds of people online, so I could easily, not easily, but I could easily lead to a hundred people online. So I want to scale that because it's not extra time for me, it's the same amount of time and it'll have the same amount of impact on people. So I think that's really where I see myself scaling. My mastery program is uber small, so that's really by invitation or application only. So that's always gonna stay small because that involves a one-on-one component. It's combination, it's a hybrid of group coaching calls, one-on-one calls, and in-person workshop three times a year. So I don't wanna go crazy with that and have a hundred people in that. It's just I'd have to have a hundred one-on-one calls every month. I'm not doing that.

Kevin Yee: 20:14

Yeah, it's also I think you would probably go insane with that.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 20:17

Yeah, exactly.

Kevin Yee: 20:19

So it sounds like the goal is to scale your evergreen products and then scale your group coaching program. As you're thinking about scaling, are you noticing any like challenges or bottlenecks that you're noticing in this season of your business right now as you're thinking about scaling?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 20:32

The biggest challenge I've had is building my list, which, you know, I because I have a really strong base of my list. My list is, you know, 50 to 60% open rate, you know, 8% click rate. So those of you that know about that stuff, that's like apparently very high. It's driving people to my list that I haven't cracked the code on. I'm still experimenting with, you know, different social media free offers, downloads, and things like that. I haven't tried advertising yet, which I might do maybe next year, but and I do also want to write a book next year. So I'm backwards planning that to make sure that I have the space to do that. I've been working on the idea of a book, and now I'm kind of gonna hone it to, you know, put the whole unmessable with methodology into a book. So that that's another way that I can scale to get out there and make sure that people have these tools because I really think people deserve to have the life of their dreams. So many people walk around with reasons why they can't have what they really want or justifications or considerations, and that's optional. You don't have to be stuck in a reason or be married to a reason. You can actually fulfill what you want. You just might have to disappear a blind spot, like I did with you can't do your artist, your career. I had to disappear that as a truth to be able to fulfill on what I wanted. But once I disappeared it, I fulfilled on what I wanted really fast. I believe people have the right and that they deserve to have that kind of life. So I want to get those tools to as many people as possible.

Kevin Yee: 21:54

I'm excited for this like next phase of your life. I can just feel like I can just feel I can just see the momentum. Like as you're talking about your career, the exciting part is like I can see each phase of your career and how it's like the exponential curve and all that. It's really interesting.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 22:08

I'm excited. I mean, in the last three years, what I've been able to build has been so fulfilling, and the people I've been able to work with are so amazing. And I'm just so blessed that I, you know, but it's not by accident, it's by design, it's by using the very methodology that I teach people. So it's like I walk my talk, but the question is just what am I creating next, right? So that's really where I am right now. This is the time of year where I sit down with my husband and we look at the end of next year, what do we want to fulfill on and start designing a backwards plan? Because if you plan it from here forward, Kevin, you're limited by your current circumstances and resources and thinking. If you plan it from the future backward, you're free to really create anything and then look at, okay, what's missing in terms of my team or in terms of you know, structures or systems to be able to fulfill on what I want to fill on in a year and a half from now.

Kevin Yee: 22:57

I've noticed that. Like I know Alex Hermozzi talks about it. I forgot what they call it, like Solomon's, like it's basically your future self advising your younger self. And I love that. And that's actually a great reminder because I tend to like when I think about my businesses and stuff, I sometimes think about the present me planning forward versus like the opposite way of reverse engineering, actually.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 23:17

Yeah, well, the Merlin principle is the basis of what I use in terms of the backwards planning. And I don't know if you know the story about Merlin the Magician.

Kevin Yee: 23:26

I don't well, actually, yeah, I'll do the Cliff Note version.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 23:29

Yeah, he he was from the King Arthur's time and he's known as the magician from all those movies that you've ever seen about King Arthur. Merlin is the magician. And the story goes that he has a cabin in the woods, and King Arthur is a young boy, and he stumbles upon his cabin, and there's two places set for lunch. And he comes in and Merlin says, Will you join me for lunch? And he goes, Well, it looks like you already have somebody joining you. He goes, No, I set that for you. I live my life forward from the future. So he already knows the future and then he just fulfills on it. And that's kind of what I do with my clients is I have them create the future that they've always wanted and then fulfill on it. We design a plan so that they can fulfill on it. And then if they're not executing that plan, what gets uncovered is what messes with them. So it's kind of like a win-win. Either they're gonna produce miraculous results or they're gonna uncover and unearth what messes with them, and then I can dismantle that with them and create a strategy or system to shift back over to the world of being unmessable with.

Kevin Yee: 24:23

You know what else is really interesting about you? Like you mentioned the the art of your business. That's only you started about two or three years ago pre-podcast. That's what you told me. I think the interesting part is that you spent the majority of your career just coaching, working on the art of coaching, like focusing on getting really, really, really good when starting a business versus like starting business ASAP. You know, I find that really interesting about yourself.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 24:46

Yeah, well, I started a business uh 28 years ago to manage the careers of actors. So when I got the record deal, you know, after I retired from being a pop star, I and went to have kids and stuff, I was like, well, I really do want to make people's dreams come true. In the entertainment industry, let me start there because all my friends were actors or artists. So I started a company to do that as a manager. And I still have that company, and I still manage the careers of about 60 to 80 actors. I don't have a lot to do with that company anymore. I have people that run it for me, but I oversee it all. So I immediately started a company to fulfill people's dreams. And I did career coaching. Different though than transformative coaching. And I really am committed to I am doing my art as my career, oddly enough, right? And my art is coaching. Like now I get to really fulfill on the 47 years of training that I have had. And when you think about that, it's kind of staggering. 47 years engaged in mastering a language, right? And now I'm creating my own language with it. I create my own methodology. And I've always designed curriculum and I designed courses for landmark way back when. So when I retired from landmark, I gave myself three months to do nothing and see what emerged. And what emerged was the foundation for being unmessable with. I designed that course. I was like, I'm a course designer, that's what I do. I'm gonna design that course and fulfill on that. So my whole business got created out of that, really out of nothing. And then what emerged?

Kevin Yee: 26:07

The beauty of space sometimes, too. Like sometimes we like to like, at least for me, sometimes like the like I tend to jam-pack everything, but having that space is where the magic usually happens. Yeah.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 26:18

You can't create from something, you gotta create from nothing. And there's not enough nothing in people's lives.

Kevin Yee: 26:23

I do want to play a play game with you if you're open for it. This is a surrounded around investments because you know a lot of coaches invest into coaching. Like you mentioned earlier, you invest into coaching and all that. People invest into team members and all that. The game I want to play is really great for stories for getting stories out of people. It's called First, Last, Best, Worst. I learned it from the storyteller Matthew Dix, and he won like the moth storytelling contest or something like that. I'm gonna prompt you a phrase, and I would just love to hear the first thing that comes to mind. Okay. First business investment you remember.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 26:52

First business in my lemonade stand.

Kevin Yee: 26:54

Ooh, how old is that?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 26:55

Oh yeah, I was five. It was actually Kool-Aid back then. And I went into Central Park with a pitcher of Kool-Aid and little plastic Dixie cup. And this is when, you know, like over 50 years ago when people would let their five-year-olds walk around by themselves. And I lived in New York City and I went into Central Park and I came back with like a hundred dollars. And my parents were like, What did you do? Like, how much what did you charge people? And I remember I said, Whatever you think is fair for the cup. And people would just give me like all this money for the Kool-Aid, you know. So people were really drinking the Kool-Aid, let's put it that way.

Kevin Yee: 27:29

That's such a great answer, too. That's pretty funny. That's awesome. Okay. Last business investment you made.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 27:34

The last business investment I made was in a new video editor social media company to edit my content. So that was recent, and we just started rolling out that content. So that was in June, I guess, July. I mean, that's not really true because I invest every week in my team and all that, but that was the last new business investment.

Kevin Yee: 27:52

Yeah, interesting. Okay, you're really doubling down on content. I love it. Best business investment.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 27:58

My team, no question. The people that work with me are gold.

Kevin Yee: 28:02

Just kind of curious, who is on your team right now? Like, it seems like you have quite a substantial amount of time.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 28:07

No, I have a you know, a marketing advisor, I have the content specialist, I have my, you know, executive assistant, my husband is my COO, I have my coach, I have my financial coach, I have, you know, like that kind of the team. I have a trainer, you know, so because physically you need to, especially coaching on Zoom of the day, it's very sedentary. So you need to take care of your body and make sure that you're not just becoming job of the hut sitting at a table. So yeah, my my personal trainer, that is a very good investment for me for sure, for my well-being. You're you can never invest too much in your well-being and your development, you know, because that's your body, mind, and spirit. And if you don't have that, I don't know what you're gonna do.

Kevin Yee: 28:45

Well, especially with coaching, it's just so intimate, too, and it's an energy exchange. And if you're like coming with exhausted drained, I can only imagine how the coaching sessions would.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 28:54

Oh my god, that would be horrible. Yeah, horrible.

Kevin Yee: 28:57

And then worst investment that you kind of wish you got your money back from.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 29:00

It was a I mean, I'm not gonna say the name of the company, but it was also having to do with YouTube. Not also, but it had to do with YouTube and growing the YouTube thing and the thumbnails and all this stuff. But it was just I could still maybe get my money back, actually, but I haven't pursued it. I'm sort of like of the ilk if I pay somebody and they do what you know, they do their services, even if it's not a good match, I don't want to like you know, try and get money back from them. But they did have some sort of a money back guarantee, which maybe I should go pursue. But I felt like that didn't really and maybe we didn't do it the way it was designed, but it didn't deliver what was expected.

Kevin Yee: 29:33

As you're reflecting on kind of these like investments, I guess like I'm kind of curious how has your decision-making process and what to invest in changed over the years, if at all?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 29:42

I think in my early days of not just in the coaching business, but just in business, I had a thinking that it's like try and spend as little as possible and get as much as possible. I think that's like beginner's mind thinking, and that has completely altered for me. I am in a different mindset now when it comes to. To not only money and spending money, but also like what I'm willing to invest in and what's the return. So I look at the ROI a lot more than I used to. You know, it used to just be like, just don't spend, you know, like whatever you need to do, not to spend. Barter, do whatever you need, you know. At some point, that's really not smart business strategy. I don't do really much bartering. And if I do, I try and have it have some exchange of money so that everybody's got skin in the game because I find the bartering stuff does. If I'm gonna give somebody a gift of one of my workshops, fine. That's a gift. But to expect something back from them or nothing, I don't do that. It's not worth it.

Kevin Yee: 30:33

I'd agree. And money is like honestly, I think it's a magical thing where it's like also energy exchange. It's just stored energy exchange, right? So yeah. Also, what's really interesting, like what I'm taking from your answers before, is like you think you see the world a bit differently. To have like a what do you say, five-year-old at the lemonade stand?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 30:51

Like whatever, like you're gonna be like, Well, I couldn't be a singer apparently, so I figured I'd go into business right there.

Kevin Yee: 30:59

That's a crafty five-year-old right there, man, right in Central.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 31:03

I was very resourceful, and I was always raising money for charities. I mean, I was raising money for the hunger project since I was 12 years old, and I was, you know, writing songs and entering content. I mean, you know, like I never wanted to ask my father for money because I had this like relationship with my dad, not anymore. Now he's in all my group coaching programs. It's amazing, right? He's 92. But there was a time where I was afraid to ask for even $20, you know, because I was afraid he was gonna like yell at me or something, I don't know, some whatever it was, you know, how people are afraid to ask for money. I am not afraid to ask for money anymore. I had a huge breakthrough with that in my early 20s, and I just started asking people for money. So I've raised like $90 million for charity since my early 20s because I just asked. And the worst thing that can happen is say somebody says no, big deal. It doesn't mean anything. People get so weirded out by making requests because they're afraid somebody's gonna say no, or worse, they're gonna say yes and then what? And you know, people are just weird about making requests. So I train people in that in my programs in how to de-weirdify yourself around making requests. And if you don't have money, it's because you're stuck at asking for it. That's I'm clear about if you don't have what you want, forget about money. So, as I was saying, if you don't have what you want in your life, it's likely because you're not good at asking for things, and that's one of the biggest muscles that people who want to be effective and successful and fulfill on their dreams need to get worked on is making requests. So promising and request are two things that create a future that wasn't gonna happen anyway. And getting mathful with both of them would be useful. So, yeah, raising money is the same thing as charging money is the same thing as you know, getting investments in your company. It's making requests.

Kevin Yee: 32:34

This is my last question to you, and I love your insight on this because you clearly kind of got over the money thing. I noticed that money is a very taboo subject, like in modern day society, business. The reason why I asked the way the pricing strategies the way I do is because people feel weird about money. Why do you feel like that is?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 32:52

Well, we're not really educated about money for the most part. You know, getting a financial education is like it's not really in school, so we don't talk about money. Our parents don't talk about money with us mostly, so it seems like it's not something you're supposed to talk about. I talk about money all the time with my clients because my job is that they minimally double their revenue. So we're always going over numbers and did-da. And I found for myself, just in my own personal life and developing my own wealth strategy and all of that, you have to be able to talk about something, including, you know, your weight. If you wanna you're like weird about how much you weigh, how are you gonna reduce it? You can't deal with anything in reality without being powerfully related to that thing in reality. And most people have a mindset about money that is either scarcity, it doesn't matter how much money they have, it's their relationship money that messes with them. That's why I have that from Fear to Freedom freebie on my website about money with Rob and Quivers and Tyrone Jackson, because it's a mindset, you know, he teaches stock trading, but it isn't about stock trading. It's your mindset about money that messes with you. So I've worked with people that don't have a lot of money, I've worked with people who have tons of money. And it's regardless, if their mindset is scarcity, then that is going to be in the world of being messable with and reactive rather than creative, rather than, well, how am I gonna create what I want to create? So, okay, my daughter's getting married. How am I gonna create the money to pay for that wedding? I mean, not like, well, we only have this much, or this this is, you know, this is your budget. It's like, what is my vision for this wedding and how am I gonna fill on that?

Kevin Yee: 34:18

Yeah, it's really amazing too, because I've been fortunate to meet like really high net worth individuals, and sometimes these people still have a lot of money, but sometimes I see people stuck in their own prison because of their scarcity mindset. They're like penny pinching, they're scared that they're gonna lose it all. And it's very, very real. So I'm glad what you brought up about the money mindset as well. Like I think it's really, really important.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 34:39

It is important, and it's funny because, like, you know, I remember when I was beginning trading and Robin and I were talking about this money, that money, and she, you know, we're we were making money in the stock market like every week or every day. And then I was sick, and my husband called me and he's like, Well, what do you need? What can I bring you? I said, I really want some matzo ball soup. You know, it's like their comfort food. He's like, Okay, so he goes to Katz's deli and it's like $25 for a matzo ball soup, right? So he buys two. Now he comes home and I see the ticket, $50 for two soups. I was like, Are you insane? $50 for soup. And Robin was like, Jocelyn, we just talked about how much money we made in the market today. You're worried about $50 for soup. And I was like, Oh, yeah. So every once in a while it's like meeks out, you know, that old constraint.

Kevin Yee: 35:24

It's so true. Like, right now I'm in Vietnam and everything's pretty cheap here. Like, just for context, kind of like an Uber ride here is like a dollar or something. But sometimes when there's a surge and it's like $1.50, I notice my mindset and being like, oh my god, is this? But then I'm like, dude, Kevin, it's like 50 cents. Like, why are you stressing me?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 35:42

I know it's like even I keep track because I'm in Paris right now, so I keep tracking the euro to the dollar, and I'm like, it's dollar eighteen now, and I should have bought some when it was one sixteen, and my husband, like, it's two cents, it's a two cent difference, Jocelyn. Like, really? I'm like, Oh, okay, yeah, that's right.

Kevin Yee: 35:59

Oh well, thank you for gotta catch yourself.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 36:01

Yeah, Lizzie. Thanks for the opportunity.

Kevin Yee: 36:03

Yeah, Jocelyn, how do people find you and connect with you?

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 36:06

Beunmessable with.com is the website, and you can find the freebie page or the work with me page, or you can subscribe to the podcast be unmessable with on all your podcast things, or Instagram be unmessable with, so pretty much be unmessable with.

Kevin Yee: 36:18

Okay, cool. Well, thank you so much for coming on. I really appreciate it. Like you shared so much. I I I'm taking away so much, like everything from the five-year-old lemonade story to the money mindset to just like inserting more space into my life to let the magic happen. So thank you so much for coming on today.

Josselyne Herman-Saccio: 36:34

Thank you so much for having me.

Davis Nguyen: 36:37

That's it for this episode of Career Coaching Secrets. If you enjoyed this conversation, you can subscribe to YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you're listening to this episode to catch future episodes. This conversation was brought to you by Purple Circle, where we help career coaches scale their business to seven and eight figures without burning out. To learn more about Purple Circle, our community, and how we can help you grow your business, visit joinpurplecircle.com.