Dana DeVito Reveals the Truth About Leadership and Accountability

In this episode of Career Coaching Secrets, host Pedro sits down with Dana DeVito, a seasoned business coach and consultant who has spent over 15 years helping executives, business owners, and managers unlock growth, improve leadership, and build stronger organizations.

Dana shares powerful insights about leadership, difficult conversations, and why most business problems are actually people problems. Drawing from his experience running multiple businesses and coaching leaders across industries, he explains how organizations can improve results by focusing on clarity, accountability, and developing their people.

You’ll also learn why the “grind mindset” is often overrated, how leaders can handle tough conversations effectively, and why successful businesses prioritize relationships and culture over pure operational efficiency.

If you’re a coach, entrepreneur, or leader looking to grow your business while building stronger teams, this episode is packed with practical wisdom and real-world leadership lessons.


Connect with

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dana-devito/
Website: https://eliteperformanceassociates.com/

Transcript

Dana DeVito 0:00

In a in the same alignment about difficult conversations, so often I think we get stuck with trying to prove either some but something wrong or myself right. I've gone in a lot of businesses where, you know, again, that's they've got some operational excellence and and but they're blaming their staff. And and if those are out like if our results and our on our in the staff that we've got aren't in alignment, the question's not about what did everything go wrong before, but what do we need to change to get where we're going? And so I I always try to frame even the tough quant, even the tough talks with this idea of what does a successful outcome look like? Or what is the next, what's the the result that we're going for? I don't care what happened yesterday, but if we agree that something's got to change to move forward, then let's test our our assumptions. If it's bad people, well, what's telling us it's bad people? What characteristics can we qualify and quantify? Then if that's if that's not true, if it's just I think and I feel, then let's take what we know and start to work through and develop the people in that organization.

Davis Nguyen 0:59

Welcome to Career Coaching Secrets, the podcast where we talk with successful career coaches on how they built their success and the hard lessons they learned along the way. My name is Davis Wynne, and I'm the founder of Purple Circle, where we help career coaches scale their business to $100,000 years, $100,000 months, and even $100,000 weeks. Before Purple Circle, I've grown several seven and eight figure career coaching businesses myself and have been a consultant at two career coaching businesses that are doing over $100 million each. Whether you're an established coach or building your practice for the first time, you'll discover the secrets to elevating your coaching business.

Pedro 1:30

Welcome to Career Coaching Secrets Podcast. I'm Pedro and today's guest is Dana DeVito, a seasoned coach and consultant who helps executives and business owners across several industries gain clarity, define strategy, and unlock growth and profits. With 15 years plus of leadership and business ownership experience, they specialize in helping leaders break through self-imposed constraints to achieve their full potential. Through their firm EPA Coaching, they guide top performers and leaders to make transformative changes, combining the intensity and focus of a professional athlete with proven business strategies. Their work is about developing leaders, not just managing people. So clients can level up, achieve elite results, and lead the life they were created to lead. Welcome to the show, Dana.

Dana DeVito 2:25

Thanks, Pedro. Appreciate it.

Pedro 2:26

Yeah, it's great to have you. I am a dad, but I'm gonna avoid the obvious joke about the Danny DeVito, you know, stuff. I'm I'm gonna, you know, hold myself back a little. Okay.

Dana DeVito 2:39

And I'm you know that you're you're the first then because everybody says it. And uh I just wish I were related. That's it.

Pedro 2:45

Oh my god, I can relate with that. Uh, last time someone asked me, hey, are you by any chance related to a famous guy? I'm gonna I'm gonna say it. I'm like, I wish. I wish I had I was because I would have had some money. Now I want to backtrack a little, Dana, and talk about the origin story, you know, because you could be a plumber, you could be, I don't know, a sushi master, anything. But you decided to be a coach. And every coach has that moment where they look at their life and say, yeah, I guess this is what I'm doing now, right? So when was that for you?

Dana DeVito 3:15

Yeah, that is a great question and and a little convoluted, but the front end, I'm gonna start with the front and then kind of work back. Uh 15 years ago, I was running my own businesses. I had uh restaurants at the time and was doing that uh realizing that I wasn't happy with just making food and serving customers. I really found that my enjoyment came from developing my staff. And so as I was developing friendships and relationships around my community, uh, I started sharing that kind of presentation. And a close friend of mine happened to be in the process of developing and growing his organization and preparing it for sale. And he asked if I would help him through that process. And my first response was, nope, not a chance. I'm doing my own thing. But then I started thinking about it that if if someone can take benefit of the innumerable amount of awful mistakes I've made over my career and the just the wrecks that I've done to my home business, then why not? And so he was kind enough to ask for my help. And in humility, I stepped in and walked alongside him. And we uh we were able to, after a couple of years, get his company up and running and and to a point where we ended up selling it and getting him retired, and that was great. So that's the the front end of it. Prior to that, when I was in uh first year of university, I shifted over from being really motivated to become a physical therapist and I wanted to get into education. So I started the education degree, and that's my first uh my bachelor's degree is in education. Although I never went into teaching, I got pulled out of right after graduation into some startups and I started working up with some founders. And as I started working with founders in their organizations, it really motivated me to get into my own business. And then, like I said, transitioning from my own business into helping each other. I've just found once again my heart for what drove me to want to become a teacher. I really enjoy helping others find their success. I just it makes me um it is probably one of the most enjoyable things I do is seeing somebody find either a vision accomplishment of their vision or maybe even getting through their hurdles that they didn't think they were able to get to. I just I just love helping people find joy in achievement.

Pedro 5:33

I think that's so unique. That story is so unique, and I'm gonna tell you why. Usually when I talk with business owners, they're like, and I I worked with uh uh a landscape business coach, right? We talked about that in a pre-interview process. And um that what always brings me, and I think this is so unique, is because we see a lot of business owner owners that are passionate about the operations, right? They're like, oh, I wanna do X, Y, and Z because I love cooking. I love, you know, do this stuff. And eventually they find the obstacle, which is people. You're the opposite, right? You love working with people, not necessarily cooking. Do you see like your own clients going through that type of mentality, or is it something that I'm just tripping out here?

Dana DeVito 6:17

No, what a what a great question. I find that the majority of my coaching and my conversations really are about how to engage with and develop personnel and people, because it's not things that we're we're really taught through school. We're we're kind of left to our own devices and trying to figure it out. And that's what, man, I've made so many mistakes in, and I I've employed personally close to 6,000 people. And it I've made a lot of mistakes over the years. And so to your point, what I'm finding with when I step into organizations, we start like a lot of the doors open because we want to get better financial results through through, again, operational excellence or you know, setting up. I'm an operations guy, so setting up SOPs and scaling that way and helping them build the structure of it, but inevitably it boils down to people and who are in the right spot doing the right things. And if I could ask the question of you in return, working with a landscaping company, how did that go? And what did you find in regards to, you know, it because it is a technical skill, but really dependent upon the people that are doing it? Did you find that same kind of hurdle?

Pedro 7:19

Definitely. It sounded like they always hit a ceiling when they're like working 60 to 70 hours per week, and they're like trying to manage everything, especially their perfectionists, right? And they're trying to have the best of the best because nobody gets their level, the employees they don't care, they don't love. And eventually it was like future telling. You could see a guy that's gonna get divorced, he's gonna burn out himself, and it because he doesn't trust the people around him, or he's not willing to trust. So that was pretty clear. It's a it's what's going inside here, the mindset. Now, I'm very curious about the shift, and I'm gonna call it a shift because you're coming from a hybrid type of experience and background, right? Business owner, the health part, and all of that, the physical part, and and you studied that. Now, I wonder when did it shift it happened to to I'm helping people in the coaching space to you know what? I think this is a real business now.

Dana DeVito 8:19

Yeah, I can tell you exactly when it happened. And I'm and I'm sure this is probably not unusual, but it was a really tumultuous time in my life, and it would happen to be through COVID. So my my personal businesses were booming. We uh we had record years throughout COVID. Being in food service and especially with drive-thru business, our sales were just crushing it. But our staff, there was one my story that I one of my restaurants, I needed a base number of staff to be about 22 to 25 people on staff. And that was the bare minimum number. And I would do better around that 35 to 40 people. I woke up one Monday morning with seven people. And and that was just, I had five facilities open, five units open. And so to have, I mean, my stomach just sunk. And I I didn't know how to do how to survive it. And in that same span of time, my between my wife and I, we lost both her parents and and my dad. So we had three significant family deaths, just this overwhelm from the from the practice of business. And I still had clients that I was working with. On top of it, I was I was getting up at three o'clock in the morning uh and getting to bed midnight to do it all over again. And it was just juggling between my own businesses, being behind the counter, being working with the team, trying to recruit people. Uh I ended up opening two coffee shops during COVID and trying to serve my clients who I had one client in oil and gas, when they lost, when oil, the cost of a barrel of oil went upside down and it was minus 25, they had to lay off 90% of their staff. The CEO went to work with another uh company so that he could sustain and maintain a skeleton crew. So through their, I stuck with them just on pro bono because I it was they're going through the worst of times. How can I walk away from them? So I helped their senior leadership team hold things together. They did all the hard work. I was just a shoulder to lean on, uh, and then doing that with my own business. And so as we started coming out of the that mess, I have to say there was a part of me that was just a little broken and a little tired of seeing my future exclusively in brick and mortar, but then realizing the tremendous value I had, especially with that client where they were, they were upside down. It was it was boom years prior and then a just a cratering that was devastating. And so I really, my wife and I spent a lot of time talking about it, praying about it, and deciding that this was the direction that my career needed to go. And so I started divesting myself of most of my brick and mortar businesses, partnering up with my now business partner uh Dave Richards and and really driving into elite performance associates and growing that as my primary form of business.

Pedro 11:02

Interesting, P of A. Okay. Now, since we're talking about elite your business with David Rice as EPA, since we're talking about that, let me let me understand one thing, you know? Because you joined that, and after you got rolling, I want to understand who are the people that kept showing up. Because as it sounds like you s you help a lot of different industries, right? But I want to understand the commonality there. Even if you got to that point, the ones you realize, okay, these are the people I help them I can help the most, you know?

Dana DeVito 11:30

Yeah, yeah. Great, great question. I find and and Dave, I think would say the same. We tend to, well, I will say this. My primary groups, I either deal with business owners or mid-level managers. And I know that's a that's a big swing with business owners. It's it's really walking them through again, kind of kind of segueing out of just the operational excellence and moving into how do I grow my people? Some of it's succession planning, some of it's identifying, you know, how do we, how do we start to delegate and hold accountable well. Uh and then on the flip side, when I get into organizations, as ownership is looking to grow and scale or even exit, it's that next generation. And so I do, and I really enjoy this is working with mid-level managers, and especially in group settings and walking them through the process, just like I was talking about before, where and I made a lot of screwed up engagements with relationships with my team members and with my staff. And so helping them better understand it as they're growing in their careers. Like, how do we do this well? Caring for the people around us, growing them in accordance and just to get this cycle of development from boots on the ground through mid-level management to even senior leadership and then ultimately ownership. I mean, that's yeah, people are everything. I it it Doug, I don't care what widget we make, what thing we uh what thing we sell.

Pedro 12:47

Basically, the business owners, right, and the mid-level managers, those are the people you can help the most with DPA. Okay. Now, I want to understand one thing, the marketing aspect, right? So, how do those people actually find you, you know?

Dana DeVito 13:01

Yeah. So for we have been exclusively referral-based. And that's this, you know, some of the three questions that you sent over to me are what are some of the growth opportunities moving forward. This year in particular, we are for the very first time going out and starting to market to industries. But what uh primarily we have done is is find success in in either a community or a or a group of clients and they'll refer us to others. And it has been non-stop for for the almost 15 years that I've been doing it, or the almost 14 years I've been doing it. And uh when I partnered up with my business partner, Dave, uh, it's just it stayed the same. So that being said, we well, I'll let you uh ask any questions, but I can go down any any hole you want to. Sure.

Pedro 13:45

No, yeah, what what I actually want to know is like like pretend Pedro, me, I'm a referral, you know, we got from a different client, another client, and like, hey Dana, I saw your website, I saw your stuff, really resonated with me, you know, I really want to work with you guys. So, what does that experience look like right now from my perspective? Like, let's say I'm an unboarded client.

Dana DeVito 14:07

Yep, it's really about asking great questions and figuring out where a potential client is in their where they're at today, where they want to go, and what's the disconnect. So if I can start to understand that, then we and again, I really love using questions above anything else. And that's where I find that coaching is is that oftentimes, Pedro, if you're coming to me, you you already have a sense of the answer. And so if I can ask the right questions and we then then you can feel like I'm shoulder to shoulder with you and we're looking down the same road together, and that I'm gonna be able to help you get to where you want to go. And so through just a good series of questions, really, I don't have fixed questions, but I have principles upon which I operate. And again, it's it's getting to know you, getting to know your goals, getting to know your priorities. And then if that's an alignment, uh, then I'll offer my services at that point. But if I don't feel that there's an alignment, I really feel that it's a it's an interview in both directions. I think that I work well with certain people and I don't work well with others. And I've got to be okay with that. To me, it is people that are humble, people that are driven, that are considerate of others or mindful, uh, and that really have a heart for excellence uh and doing the best they can. I those are the people I want to work with. And I'm okay saying no to those that aren't. And so if I through my questions can figure out that that's a good alignment, then that's when I start offering up my services to walk alongside them.

Pedro 15:30

Okay. I'm gonna highlight two things. You mentioned being humble and driven, right? And you mention uh to an extent like alignment. That's a key aspect of it, of being able to be coachable, right? So my question to you is we have a lot of coaches out there and and they're like struggling, they're trying to pay their bills, right? And sometimes they hear this and like, okay, but I could, you know, be being able to land a client, and especially in the early days, I I guess most of coaches they have this carcity mindset. Like they want to impact people, but bills are knocking on the door, right? So how do you juggle that on the point that you're like, okay, I have ownership of this, I'm not gonna close or I'm not gonna serve this person because this is not aligned with me. Do you see like an internal struggle to for that eagerness to to land that client or not? How do you see that today?

Dana DeVito 16:26

Yeah, certainly. Um, and and I don't know if there's a there's a great answer to that because bills out of, we've gotta we've gotta pay those bills. And so I completely understand it. In my own experience, though, the frustration that stems from working with somebody that isn't in alignment with you. When I go into my clients, I think this is one of my selling points and why some of my clients I've had for for almost 10 years, I get really sticky with them because I I view it as if it's my own business. And I I step in with a with a clarity and confidence in that same manner to where I'm gonna go in and serve you as if this were mine. But that means sometimes it's late night, sometimes it's uncomfortable conversations or difficult calls, or or doing what I need to do when I need to do it to help them achieve what they want to get to. There's a couple of clients where I've had to walk away from where they they weren't following through. They weren't accomplishing what we had both agreed that they would go out and accomplish and do. And at some point, if you're just blue in the face because you're repeating yourself, you know, there that that's a great opportunity or a great window to go find another client. And um so I so I again I I know the bills add up, and I know that's true. And and we get that scarcity mindset where we're too worried about letting go. But man, I I can't tell you, my wife has helped me through process through this as I've been up at two o'clock in the morning thinking about how am I gonna get this client to move forward. And and she's like, Dana, you're killing yourself for them, and and they're not doing anything different. So for your own sake, you gotta let go of it. And so bless her, because she's she's my my my angel like holds my hand through these difficult choices. And and really, I couldn't do it without her support in that. She she really does give me the confidence to say no when I need to say no, you know, trust the information that I'm being told.

Pedro 18:11

Yeah, that's an interesting aspect. Like I had in the past people that I was like, there were clients and we were reaching out to them, and it felt like code outreach sometimes. Like, hey, am I the only guy who's trying to actually help you? And uh, I feel like that is a powerful reminder for for coaches out there because at the end of the day, it's like we had a lot of people, I'm not sure if you agree with me, because I donated money to some gyms out there. We have this mindset of like, I'm doing something when I'm actually doing the thing. It's like I'm it's just to get a better night of sleep at the end of the day. Like, oh, I'm pretending to solve X, Y, and Z. Do you see that happening? Like when you have that client and they're not putting in the work and you're questioning yourself, but it's in reality you should question their commitment.

Dana DeVito 19:01

Yeah, it that's the that's the risk, right? Because that when you're so close to a client, those lines blur. And when you when you're in the middle of it, like, is it me? Am I just not saying it right? And and and am I am I not good at what I do? What's going on? And I've had all those fears and worries and doubts. And I I appreciate that because it helps me get better, right? Because I I think those are really good questions to ask before you make a really critical or big change in whatever professional relationship you have. I mean, you should question, am I doing this to the best of my ability? But then if I can go to sleep at night and say, yes, I'm providing the best service that I can, the best information that I can, and then that it is good and valuable, and you're still not getting any results, then then I would encourage, I don't think we do this enough either, is have that tough conversation first. And it's not a threat. I wouldn't suggest that. It's it's the the metaphor in my head is it's like a wave coming to shore, right? The wave is coming ashore. So if I'm saying, hey, if we don't make changes, then I'm gonna have to move on or we're gonna have to part professionally, that's just a wave coming ashore. It's not mad, it's not frustrated, it's not sad, it's just go in that direction. And that's how I would have that tough conversation. Just say if we can't, if we can't agree and see consequential change moving forward, then we're gonna have to part ways for your benefit and and for mine. Because I'm we're not seeing what what you're paying me for, which is growth and development in your industry. If we're not seeing that, then then why are we doing this?

Pedro 20:31

Okay. And I'm gonna jump on right on on that bowl that you mentioned, the tough conversations, right? Because I find it very curious, especially in the business side of coaching. It's like sometimes, and not sure if that happened to you, that's the reason I'm asking. It's like, have you ever been hired by, for example, a business owner or mid-level man or whatever, that he hired you, blaming the team. And when you arrive there, you're like, you're actually the problem here. And how to navigate that chat. That's your client.

Dana DeVito 21:02

Yeah. You know, this is a great question. Boy, man, you got an hour uh or two or three. This is that's a that's a deep one, but I'll be quick about it. This is in a in the same alignment about difficult conversations. So often I think we get stuck with trying to prove either some but something wrong or myself right. And so I've gone in a lot of businesses where, you know, again, that's they've got some operational excellence and and but they're blaming their staff. And and if those are out, like if our results and our on our in the staff that we've got aren't in alignment, the question's not about what did everything go wrong before, but what do we need to change to get where we're going? And so I I always try to frame even the tough quump, even the tough talks with this idea of what does a successful outcome look like? Or what is the next, what's the the result that we're going for? I don't care what happened yesterday, but if we agree that something's gotta change to move forward, then let's test our our assumptions. If it's bad people, well, what's telling us it's bad people? What characteristics can we qualify and quantify? Then if that's if that's not it's true, if it's just I think and I feel, then let's take what we know and start to work through and develop the people in that organization. Uh and and I will say most organizations need a bit of healthy turnover when I first come in. I think we we don't know how to really, as a broad brush, identify the importance of culture in an organization and really set up a healthy environment for people to develop, grow, and operate. And so first we need to get an owner to buy into what does that look like with clarity? Then we can start to disseminate the idea behind that and teach people what it looks like and then hold them accountable. So setting expectations, delegating, and accountability. I mean, it's it's all simple stuff. It's just not easy.

Pedro 22:44

Yeah, I think it's the emotional triggers. It's like I had like an example, I'll give you an example with a guy that I worked with back in a uh back in the day when I was out uh working with that business coach. He was like, I had like 10 to 12 employees, okay, and I'm solo now. And I'm asking him why that happened. He's like, I had an employee that was stealing gas from my trucks, and I vouched for him when he asked for more health benefits, a package and all of that, and he and he actually fought for that. And the guy did that, but that's an emotional response to a systems problem, which I asked him, okay, but how do you track your trucks? How you didn't caught that? How did that guy land it in your business in the first place? How does it look like your hiring process? You know, so you you're you're trying to understand the mindset behind the emotional trigger, but at the same time, it's a business which consists on systems. Do you see that happening? Like if you could challenge someone, let's say the guy hires you, okay, and you're looking at the team and he's saying, Yeah, my team sucks. And why does it suck?

Dana DeVito 23:55

Yeah, yeah. You know, the I'm sorry, go ahead.

Pedro 23:58

No, I mean it's like peeling off the reason behind it. Oh, they don't have a very good conversion rate. Okay, what does the marketing have for how many no-shows do you have? You know, and start peeling off to really understand the real answer and from a neutral perspective, not trying to confirm a bias, right? Is that something you see happening?

Dana DeVito 24:18

Yeah. So I think what we've done across all industries and in business, and I have to say, I uh the largest organizations I don't I haven't had a ton of opportunity to work with. So I'm mid-sized, maybe 500 employees and less. But but what we don't do is really give leadership direction on on what type of conversations they should be having with their team members. We we tend to promote up because of technical skill, but we don't teach them when they're in leadership to what talks do we have with a poor performer? What talks do we have with an adequate performer, and what talks do we have with a superstar? We we tend to let the superstars alone, tell once or twice what to do for the people that need development, and then we focus a lot of attention on mitigating the damage that problems have. And so I really think, and this is where I've come in and spent a lot of time kind of processing through this in my head, is if I could come up with a tool that would tell ownership and leadership not who they should be having conversations with, but that they need to have the conversations constantly and consistently with everybody they're responsible for and what type of conversations to have, that's really helpful. Because I I think what what you were highlighting is if he's vouching, if you're I was vouching for somebody and there was compensation associated with or some reward to that, man, how do you how do you vouch for somebody doing something that you don't you don't you're not aware of? Meaning like you weren't aware of his theft. You weren't aware of his poor behavior, you weren't aware of his, that means you're not, you're not in a relationship with that person. You're not, you're not there walking alongside him in an intimate enough fashion to know, is that person doing their behavior the right way? And so I that when I go into organizations, I in a really brief way to do it, I say everybody within your organization is in one of three categories. They're either a partner, a project, or a problem. The partners are the people that are really good. And and but you need to you need to walk with them because they shoulder more than they should oftentimes. They're left alone because they're good at what they do. Those are the people that get burned out, leave for another organization, you're like, what happened? You were so good. Well, it's because you said, Hey, you doing you doing okay? They're like, Yeah, I'm okay, I'm good. And they never talk with you about it. The projects are the people that you need to work with and say, okay, I see excellence in you. Let me be there for you. But it's like you said you had young kids. It's like teaching them to tie their shoes. You don't teach them once, you don't teach them twice, you teach them five, 10, 100 times. You, but you put in the effort, and then the problems, problems are just like that guy that was stealing from one of your clients. You got to move on from them, but you got to know it because you're talking with them. And so that's kind of the framework I give people. And it once they get clarity, then I can start to have conversations with ownership and leadership on how do we develop your staff and which ones are the important ones to have a long-term vision for, and which ones are important for us to move on from. Because without that, you know, what problem will have a good week and then a bad week, or a good month and then a bad month. And, you know, they'll have good sales numbers and then they'll have bad sales numbers. And we're like, wow, he's so good at one point. Or somebody's a star salesman and crushing it, leading your your company with with revenue, but can't work in a team. And so you lose your turnover rates at 120%, uh, except for him, because he's the he's the rainmaker. You're like, you're killing me.

Pedro 27:33

So I love that. Especially if I'm thinking out loud, right, about my kids. Like if you have I have two, right? And one is more of a rebel. And the other one, the older one, it's like his like his more like, you know, not so much of a rebel, let's say it like this. But when when you it's I think the key word is attention. It's when when they're misbehaving and you're giving a lot of attention to the younger one, the other one is like, oh, so misbehaving equals attention. So I'm gonna misbehave myself. I'm not getting attention like in the company. If you have someone like the guy is always like a discussion point, they're always talking with him, they're like, hey, maybe he's getting his pot light, you know? And I'm not. It's like I'm just doing the bare minimum and nobody cares. And actually, that's a star player. And you're like, you're you're doing things, you know, in the wrong direction. It's like up more. Okay, yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

Dana DeVito 28:24

Okay. And and and tell me, Pedro, if you see this too, is as people grow up in leadership and and even into ownership, at the end of the day, we like showing what do we, what do we do today? And so they get stuck in the processes, which are necessary, but as a as a as a senior leader, you know, if you're not pouring in your people, if that's not the biggest part of your day, in my opinion, you're you're you're misallocating your time. Because like you said, the attention, there's an attention vacuum. And you're like, then these people are like, well, the only time I get get a call or get to talk to the boss is because I'm in trouble. But yeah, it's just we we gotta have more engagement and relationship.

Pedro 29:01

Yeah, I think business owners are great at getting themselves busy in projects. They doing like low-value tasks to at the end of the day say, hey, I am the guy that works the most, I'm the guy that loves the most the business, you know. But at the end of the day, that's not really productivity. It's just looking busy, like unbillable hours and something like that. Well, the landscapers I work with, they were, you know, top performance and looking busy. Like they should be selling closings, uh, you know, and they were like, Well, I'm gonna, you know, do a mechanic part-time job here, spend three hours in stuff that I shouldn't. But yeah, I did my stuff, you know. So how'd you how'd you break them of that? Well, that's a hard one. I mean, especially with blue-collar people, right? Sometimes the coaching mindset, it's hard. It's part of an awakening. Sometimes well, we have a saying here in Brazil, okay? Not sure if you guys have there, but sometimes it's like, where's that dog sitting on a nail? Well, it's not heartening enough, you know. And sometimes they need to go through a process to suffer to a point that they realize this is not good enough and they need to try something different. I mean, I know it sometimes it it f it feels like that's pretty raw and uh not very, you know, cool on my end, but sometimes people have to go through their own path to understand what bad looks like to search for good. Does that make sense?

Dana DeVito 30:24

Yeah. I think that's part of the coaching process as opposed to consulting, is you're you're helping them the struggle is is part of growth. And I think as a coach, you can walk with them through it, you just can't do it for them.

Pedro 30:36

Yes. Now talking about walk, let's talk about EPA, right? Because I'm curious where you are where are you guys going? Where are you taking all this? Looking ahead. Uh, where do you see the business going? Are you thinking about scaling, hiring, or is there a next step you're excited about?

Dana DeVito 30:52

Yeah, great. Uh 26 uh is a great year. So, like I alluded to before, first year we're gonna go out and do some marketing. We are we've had coaches and we do have coaches working with us underneath us, but we want to scale that a little bit more. And I love one-on-one time. Hours in the day are limited, though, but I I'm not getting any younger. So this is the year where we've we've decided to start to really formalize our processes and our systems and train others to do that. We've partnered in a great guy. I know one of the pre-questions was who who's who have we been coached by? We're working with a guy named Luke Mulcher from Growth Strategist. He's uh he's operating as our fractional CFO, our CMO, sorry, and helping us just get our vision put together with some clarity and hold us accountable to it. You know, it's it's funny how all the words that we say to our clients, he's telling us, and it seems new for the very first time. It's like finally, you're right, you're right, Luke. I am an idiot. I'm sorry. So he's been he's been fantastic in helping us get some some clarity. And and uh both my business partner and I, we're we've written books, uh, they'll be releasing this year, which is great. So it's a big scaling year for us. Uh, we've also partnered up with, or in the process of developing a partnership with a gentleman by the name of Bill Foch. He's uh comes from the Great Game of Business and uh working with a hard Harvard Business School, uh, has done some research in the last few years on a diagnostic tool for business economic evaluation and diagnosing where opportunity for development and growth is within an organization. And it's got some quantifiable results. So anxious and excited to move forward with that. He's got a couple articles going out through Inc. and Forbes coming up. So yeah, really, really gonna be a good, good fun year. So lots of new, uncomfortable areas for us because I'm like I said, I uh we have not done marketing before, so it's not something I'm uh, you know, familiar with. So it's good, it's good to be stretched. Okay, and it's a stretching year.

Pedro 32:51

Sound sounds exciting, sounds like scaling season. And also I need to highlight the fact that you mentioned, like, oh yeah, I'm an idiot because uh, you know, I'm doing the things on my own that I'm uh advising people not to. But come on, this is coaching, right? It's like that's the main reason coaching works, and at least in my experience, and at least in on my perspective. It's like you're not inside the noise. So it's so easy for that guy to pinpoint exactly what's holding you guys back because his not inside the I'm not gonna call it hamster wheel, but it's not inside the eye of the hurricane, right? So it's so much easier. It's like seriously, it's like when I'm talking with my wife, I'm like giving her this analysis, like super well thought, but 50% is bullshit that I'm telling myself that I'm not gonna do it because blah, blah, blah. And then and then she's like, why don't you do that? Or why are you doing that? And I'm like giving you okay, I never thought it like that. Or maybe um yeah, that that's bullshit. You're right, you know. So I wouldn't say like that this is like a bad thing. I see it as a vulnerability uh key aspect that turns you into a good coach. It's like realizing you also need one. So that makes perfect sense. Now, Dana, I want to tap into your experience for a second. Because I think people listening can really benefit from this, you know. You've been into multiple industries and you hear all kinds of business advice. Some are good, some are bad. So, what's one piece of a business advice you hear all the time that you think that's overrated or misunderstood?

Dana DeVito 34:35

That's a that is a great question. You know, you kind of talked about this earlier is just doing more, putting in the grind and up at 4 a.m. late nights, being the first of the office. I mean, it can make you feel good because you can hang that kind of on the wall and say, hey, look how cool I am. Uh and I think it's just overrated. I I you know, the older I get, just turned 50, the value and rest and space. Somebody told me this the other day. That was brilliant. How do you put it? He said, I just need some feet on the desk time. And so he sets an hour a day, just to put his feet up on the desk, no distractions, and just to think and process. And I think as we go, if you're in any type of leadership or or ownership, you can't run all the time. Because you're doing a disservice to the future, whether it be tomorrow, next month, or years down the line, you have to be able to have a rhythm of peace and quiet and space to process through. So this, this, and I know I'm not the first person to say it, but the grind for the sake of grinding, man, I think quality far outweighs quantity.

Pedro 35:42

Yes, I agree with that. A hundred percent. Now, if someone listening wants to connect with your follow your work, Dana, where can people find you and connect with you?

Dana DeVito 35:51

Yeah. Uh right now, the best is gonna be on LinkedIn. That's where most of my presence is. With the rollout of my book later this year, I'm gonna have an Instagram presence as well. So so that's it. I'm not a big social media guy. Like I said, it's been mostly referrals and personal relationship, because I'm a big relationship guy. But if you want to reach me on on LinkedIn, it's at Dana Stavito and reach out. I'm happy to have a call, talk, chat. Man, I love I love just talking with people. So it'd be great. Any any and everything. So, or just message me.

Pedro 36:18

Okay, Dana, I have to highlight some stuff based on this conversation today, okay? First of all, the fact that you're so open about the mistakes you made, right? You're not trying to play an act here. It's just Dana by Dana. It's just you. I love the authenticity. And I will always hammer that's a quality for a true coach. And in case you're wondering, Dana, you're not a consultant, okay? You're a true coach at heart. I I can tell just by connecting with people. I mean, as much as you have a background in systems, and you can understand uh that that's a key part of the business, it's not just about mindset, which I get it. I think that's a true testament to being a great coach, you know, and asking the right questions and peeling off that onion, you know, to understand the true intentions. I would highlight also the fact that you stayed and did some pro bono work with those clients that were in a hardship. Because at the end of the day, yes, we want to make money, obviously, but money means to an end, right? It's not just about the money, it's about impact. If they're going through a bad moment or bad time, it's only fair. Like you're like, hey, let's sit down, have a conversation. I think everything starts with a conversation. Even if we're talking about saying goodbyes or saying hello, we need to have a conversation. People sometimes they they have that noise in their head and they're like imagining what the outcome is gonna be based on the expectations, but that's so much bullshit. It's just like just have the chat, man. Whenever you have it, sometimes it's just like not that big of a deal, and you just sit down, have a a decent human contact and move forward. I mean huge. I think that's huge. And you know, the bias you mentioned about something wrong, or am I or is something really wrong, or am I trying to prove myself right? I think that bias, that intention, that will will tell you what this client really is looking for validation or actually trying to solve the problem, you know? And having that neutral perspective really, I think it would make the difference. And I like how you you handle that, you know. I think overall, you know, talking about the grinding mindset that always brings back to my dad, who was like in his 70s, start still a uh a dean in the university, and you were like, hey dad, you know what? They're not gonna build a statue, you know. Whenever you leave there, it's not gonna happen. I know the the students they love you, but maybe time to look for something else, which he did, and he's grateful for it. But sometimes you have you have to to have those conversations, you know.

Dana DeVito 38:56

That's uh I was just gonna say, you need to have that conversation. How cool for you to have the courage to say it and for him to have the humility to hear it. So it's pretty cool.

Pedro 39:05

Yeah, I appreciate that. And also, like last try, I promise, guys, it's like when we're talking about the grind mindset, right? It's it always brings me back to the root cause and intention. Is that like whenever we say yes to something, what are we saying no to? What are you saying no to if you're working 60 hours a week to your family for some good quality time with your wife? You never know, but you have to think about that, right? Instead of just pushing it. So this is my long way of saying, Dana. I appreciate what you do. I appreciate being here sharing so openly today. It was great having you on, man.

Dana DeVito 39:41

Thank you, Pedro. Man, anytime this was cool. Thank you so much for the conversation. I appreciate it.

Davis Nguyen 39:46

That's it for this episode of Career Coaching Secrets. If you enjoyed this conversation, you can subscribe on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you're listening to this episode to catch future episodes. This podcast was brought to you by Purple Circle, where we help career coaches scale their business to $100,000 years, $100,000 months, or even $100,000 weeks, all without burning out and making sure that you're making the impact and having the life that you want. To learn more about our community and how we can help you, visit join purplecircle.com.