Why AI Will Never Fully Replace Human Coaches | Susan Power

In this episode of Success Leaves Clues (formerly Career Coaching Secrets), Pedro sits down with Susan Power, founder of Power Up Leadership, to discuss how coaching is evolving in the age of AI while still keeping the human connection at the center. Susan shares her journey from HR consulting to executive coaching, helping leaders and hyper-growth companies improve leadership, emotional intelligence, and team performance.

They dive into scaling a coaching business, preventing burnout, building strong leadership systems, and why AI should support coaches instead of replacing them completely. Susan also opens up about vulnerability in leadership, coaching transformations, and the real impact coaching can have on both professional and personal life.

If you're interested in leadership, coaching, AI, business growth, and personal development, this episode is full of valuable insights and real conversations.



Connect with

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanpower/
Website: https://www.powerupleadership.ca/

Transcript

Susan Power 0:00

Well, I mean, I think AI definitely has a role in coaching. Wh where I wouldn't take that approach of a hundred percent replacing the human. I I think he's missing something important there as far as the human connection and the emotional connection and coaching. But where where we use it is certainly in the the note taking function so coaches can listen better to their client. They're not writing down the notes and it helps capture, you know, like the note takers do the actions and the themes so we can dive more deeply in the analysis of what's coming up on the calls from call to call to call to call. And also like using it during the coaching conversation. Many of my coaches have told me they'll be using it to prompt their next question sometimes. So it's kind of like a right-hand assistant in the coaching call, you know, or to recommend a resource. So they're using it hand in hand, some coaches, while they're having the conversation. But 100% replacement, I wouldn't personally welcome to Career Coaching Secrets Podcast.

Pedro 0:53

I'm Pedro, and today I'm joined by Susan Power, founder of Power Up Leadership, who has spent the last eight years helping CEOs and HR leaders across Canada build stronger leadership and talent systems that actually support growth. She has logged over 3,000 coaching hours across 100 plus organizations, tackling the real issue most companies ignore. Not strategy. Yeah, you guessed people, right? So from a misaligned teams to leaders promoted without guidance, Susan brings both the strategic lens and practical tools to fix what is actually holding organizations back. Welcome to the show, Susan.

Susan Power 1:36

Hi Pedro, thank you so much for having me. And you totally agree. It's the people issues that people don't pay enough attention to. It's funny, it's been a recurring theme as long as I've been working, you know, it just is ongoing.

Pedro 1:52

You know, I had I had people in the show that pivoted from consulting to coaching, and usually that's the reason, right? They they're facing the big boss, which is people, because they're trying to implement frameworks and systems, and they're just not sticking, right? So I'm right there with you. I get where you're coming from. Now, you know, at this part, what I really like to do is rewind a bit, get to the origin story, you know, Susan, because every coach has that moment where they look at their life and say, Yeah, I guess this is what I'm doing now, right? So when was that for you?

Susan Power 2:24

I remember when I really got hooked into coaching, I was working in a corporate executive director HR role, and they wanted me to figure out leadership effectiveness. And the instructions I got was start by updating the job descriptions. And I remember scratching my head thinking, if we have a leadership effectiveness problem, adding it to the job description is not going to be the fix. Like if only it was that easy. So I started to research well, how do you even approach building better leaders, especially if they're not working with effective leaders? And I came across coaching as far as getting at the mindset, the beliefs, the internal operating system to help people show up as better humans, better leaders. And it's not a light switch. It takes, you know, more than 10 minutes, of course, to address, but that's what kind of got me hooked into it.

Pedro 3:20

Okay. So adjusting the job description, the first task, was almost like uh a wake-up call for coaching, right? Because you had to peel off the onion a little bit more and get to the true intention, right?

Susan Power 3:33

Mm-hmm. And there's my dog barking, lucky. But you're absolutely right, Pedro. It's getting to really the key behaviors that you're trying to drive. And I guess getting clear on what those are is a is a good first step, but you can't expect a leader just to read them in their job description and be able to show up as that type of leader without any support.

Pedro 3:56

Okay. Now, the moment you started Power Up Leadership, which was around eight years ago, right? I want to understand one thing. When did it shift from that coaching wake up call from I'm helping people trying to figure this out to I'm building a real business around this? You know, I'm not sure it's the first invoice, it's when you you had a first paying client. I'm just trying to understand when the coaching hat got into play, but towards a CEO business.

Susan Power 4:21

Yeah, we started off as Power HR Inc. and very much HR consulting. And then shortly after I got certified through International Coaching Federation as a coach, and we rebranded to Power Up Leadership. It was the worst time to do this. It was just before COVID when everyone turned off the taps on discretionary training, coaching, spend. But I knew it wouldn't be forever. So we just kept marching forward. And ironically, that was the time that so much shifted in the workforce, as far as you think about hybrid virtual work and really the resilience tests that the pandemic was. So, in a way, I didn't realize it at the time, but in a way, it was the perfect time to enter coaching. And because our world changed so much, and leaders as it continues today with AI, etc., they are so stretched, so stressed, so burnt out that they need every support they can get. And coaching, I think, is just gonna continue to grow as an industry.

Pedro 5:19

Okay. Now let me ask you this. You shifted for right from HR consultancy to somewhat to an extent coaching, right? I got that right? You get that right. Yeah. Okay. Now, let me ask you this, because at this point, I wouldn't understand if you had a like your avatar, your ideal client profile shifted with you as well, you know, because you're coming from uh a change in your own business. So did you saw that happening or did you cap the same people?

Susan Power 5:47

We definitely pivoted and we do still offer HR consulting, but we're we're much more focused on leadership transformation. So the ideal client we pivoted to is hyper-growth businesses that might be growing through May, and what got them there isn't going to get them to the next stage of growth. So they either need to really support their leaders to elevate their leadership capabilities and business management capabilities, or they need to hire from outside. But either way, the process is the same where there's a talent review process and someone looking at growth from a people lens. Like I had a round table yesterday with two um two specialists in the MA space that have done hundreds of global acquisition team integrations. And it's it's so interesting, like that the people issues, to your point, Pedro, when we kind of opened the call, it's what causes most deals not to realize their full value in an acquisition, but but it's not paid attention to until there's a problem. And I think it's because at least these specialists were saying it's because it's not as easily quantifiable as the financial metrics when you're looking at acquisitions. Well, it doesn't get paid attention to until it's kind of an afterthought, but huge, huge lost opportunity for organizations.

Pedro 7:11

Okay, that makes sense. Now, how do those hypergrowth businesses, right, usually find their way to your business in the first place, for example? The marketing-wise, right?

Susan Power 7:21

Yeah, I think we're still figuring that one out a little bit, but we get a lot of requests. People find our content online. So we're always pushing out thought leadership, whether it's a a blog or a round table or a podcast. So people often find us online, but I think marketing is is uh evolving area, like it's very complex. So I always ask new customers, where did you find us? And typically I hear online or referral.

Pedro 7:52

Okay. Now let's pretend I'm one of those potential clients, right? I'm one of those businesses. I hired you through a podcast or found your website, whatever. Okay, and that resonated with me. Okay. I felt like, hey, this seems like it could help me. Eventually I go through the sales process, right? There's alignment. I ended up becoming a client. Okay. Now, can you walk me through, and you can and you can pick if you have different offers, right? You can you walk me through the point of view of a client being on board at in your own business and the and the potential outcomes I can expect.

Susan Power 8:25

Yeah, it's a great question, Pedro. So the first thing is do they have a problem we can solve? So we don't take everyone that reaches out to us. If we can't help them, there's no point in even proceeding. But if they have a problem that we solve, which is, you know, often building confidence, the right mindset, really elevating their leadership skills. We'll look across our bench of coaches. So we have coaches across Canada and the US from coast to coast, and we'll look at their intake form of where do they need support, where do they need coaching. And then we'll match them with the coach that specializes in the area they're looking for support. They have a complimentary coach fit chemistry call. They need to feel comfortable and like they can communicate easily. It's a very trust-based relationship with a coach, and they pick from the two coaches we match them with. They pick who they're most comfortable with, and then the coaching journey begins.

Pedro 9:23

Okay. Now, let me ask you this. You have a a bench of coaches. You mentioned to me that. Now, something that I see a lot of coaches out there, sometimes they're struggling with, it's how to scale their own coaching business, right? And so my question to you is how did that felt when you were doing more like coaching and you start hiring your coaches, right? Did you feel like, oh my God, like are they gonna tarnish my brand or or oh my God, this finally I can, you know, scale this? Because that's sometimes a cross-road. I see a lot of coaches. They're they're got, you know, troubled with, I would put it like that. How did that play out for you?

Susan Power 9:59

Yeah, it is a really good point because coaching is an unregulated profession. So there's a lot of difference in quality. So we have a benchmark that our coaches are all certified by the global body, International Coaching Federation, which in itself helps us mitigate that quality risk. But I personally, as a CEO, will do um a vetting process where no coach is added to our roster until I get to experience their coaching for 20 minutes. So it's a chance for them to demo their capabilities. And that process has seemed to work quite well. We've had positive reviews from our clients on our coaches' capabilities. So I think, yeah, I think it's really important because that is the service we're delivering. So you're right, it gotta match and align with our brand and the quality needs to be there.

Pedro 10:50

And how do you not sure if you've developed quality control, but how do you you keep that in check, you know? So you you're making sure uh the clients are getting the outcomes they want, but at the same time, it's not the coach's fault, you know, because that's a little bit tricky. And that's one thing I I see a lot of coaches that are curious about how to keep quality control in check.

Susan Power 11:09

Yeah, because you can lead the horse to the water, but you can't force the horse to drink, right? So the client needs to do the work. So it's a partnership between the coach and the client. So we we do our best. Like we have a very clear coaching agreement going into the engagement where the coach and the client will define well, what does success look like? And what's realistic? Is this a three-month engagement? Is it a year-long engagement? So let's get really clear and define what we're going to focus on in the coaching calls. And I think that helps optimize the probability of success as well as we measure and report, especially if there's a group of coaches from one organization, we'll measure the percent of goals achieved and we will get feedback at the midpoint and after the first call and the end of a coaching engagement. Is the coachy getting out of it what they're expecting? Are they, you know, showing up for their calls? And what could the coach do more effectively? And we provide that feedback to our coaches. We're all learning and growing as we go, but measurement, communication, clear goal definition, I think that helps with performance.

Pedro 12:23

Okay. And let me ask you this whenever they're trying to, you know, like like let's say I'm I'm on boarding, like I'm a client, and I'm like, hey, but I want Susan, right? Because sometimes you're the face of the company, you're the CEO. How do you manage to do the handoff, right? To know, hey, you know what? Yes, I'm not even sure if you coach still, but let's say you you need to do the handoff for other coaches, right? How do you frame it?

Susan Power 12:46

Yeah, that's funny because when you are the owner, you are the face of the company, as you would know. So certainly that happens from time to time. I always encourage them to sample different coaching styles, like and say you there could be someone who's a much better fit for you than me. We had the initial communication touch point when they learned about the offering. But usually people are open-minded and they will have a chemistry call. I do coaching myself, so I'm pretty selective on who like I really like to work with CEOs of hyper-growth companies. So that is the typical client I'll pair myself with. But I find when people have that chemistry call with other coaches, they're they're floored. Like they get a lot of value from even the complimentary chemistry call because that first 20 minutes, two coaches no obligation to move forward. They get to sample the coaching, and then they realize that's the best way to choose, right? What resonates most from those two calls?

Pedro 13:49

Okay. I mean, from CEO to doing your own coaching sessions, I mean, your work seems pretty hands-on, right? Pretty involved in the day-to-day. So how do you think about capacity? So don't stretch yourself too thin, you know?

Susan Power 14:03

That's a hard one, Pedro. How do you do that? I don't know. I got that one figured out.

Pedro 14:10

Yeah, I mean, and the reason I ask this sometimes is because we see a lot of coaches out there and they're like advocating against burnout, for example. Right. And they're wearing all the hats, right? That from the marketer, the salesperson, and you do have a team behind you that helps you with that. So that's the reason why I I sometimes throw that curveball. So we're still managing it then.

Susan Power 14:31

So we'll walk the talk. If you're coaching people on burnout, don't burn out yourself, is what I'm hearing you say. I've had to work hard on that one because I love what I do and I I love growing a business and I love coaching. Like, you know, even a couple years ago, I'd be working every weekend and working nights. Like I, because it didn't feel like work to me. But at some point, I I don't know, I had a flip of a switch. I realized my kids were growing up. I wanted to spend more time with them. I was not prioritizing other things that were important. And I I stopped. Like I, it's very, very rare now I'll work past 6 p.m. unless I'm traveling and I'm already stuck in a hotel or something like that. So you gotta really have the desire, I think, to cap the capacity until I reach that point where I'm like, it's more painful not to be doing what I should be doing and spending time with my kids, etc. That was the switch for me.

Pedro 15:30

Like whenever I say yes to something, what am I saying no to? Right. So it competes with the kids, and I have two boys, so I'm right there with you. Okay. So yeah, I'm in the same boat, still figuring it out. Now, one thing I like to dive in sometimes, and especially since you you've been in the game long enough, right? And and this is like a hot topic for coaches, but we're not talking about hard numbers, okay? It's pricing and how to package their work. So how do you think it, you know, about it today and pricing subject? And were there any lessons along the way that shaped how you landed where you are?

Susan Power 16:03

Yeah, pricing is so fascinating. And I think my eyes opened up on it through some of the coaches I hired to coach me. And like one of them, uh I did a half day in-person coaching session, and the amount of money it costs, like it was, I think it was fifty thousand dollars to spend a half day with them. And I I don't charge that, nowhere close that. But the fact that I was willing to pay that because I knew the value that this person would help me generate in my business, made me think, you know, well, people are less price sensitive if they truly are feeling the value and and they believe in your ability to help them, which in this case was through the content this person was producing on YouTube, social media, like their free content had helped me so much. I knew if I had dedicated support coaching through my business and helping me grow my business, it would be even exponential to that. So it shocked me. At the time, I'm like, I can't believe I'm writing a check for $50,000 to spend and flying across the country to spend half a morning with a human being. This is insane. I have a mortgage. Like, what the hell am I doing? But it also made me think, well, if I'm willing to do it, there's other crazy people out there that might be willing to pay me more too.

Pedro 17:22

There are other crazy, yeah, that's hilarious. Okay. I love that actually. Now I'm curious about where you're taking all this, Susan. You know, looking ahead a bit, where do you see the business going? Are you thinking about scaling even more, hiving, hiring even more people? Is there a next step you're excited about, you know?

Susan Power 17:38

Yeah, we're growing through acquisition. So I think that's a smart strategy because you're taking the years of growth from another business and all their capabilities, their team, their IP, their customers, and is saving you that time from building it, you know, all on your own. So I can't go into details right now, but I'm excited about an acquisition target that we're in discussions with. And that will, you know, allow us, assuming that moves forward, to serve our existing clients more effectively and to bring coaching to their clients as well.

Pedro 18:16

Okay. You know, and of course, whenever we're aiming towards the next chapter, there's always something we're refining in the present, right? So what are you currently trying to improve or tighten up in your business right now?

Susan Power 18:28

Yeah, I think really processes and systems. We have been focused on this the past few years. But as you know, Pedro, like if you think of all the areas of business from marketing, sales, finances, operations, there's a lot of processes. So to me, if your team can replicate the work and deliver seamlessly when you're on vacation, because you have those clearly documented processes and systems and you've trained your team on them. That's a big part of the value of a business, right? That they're not, it's not dependent just on the founder. So that's our ongoing focus, really, to to create better playbooks, systems, processes, and use AI to help us do that.

Pedro 19:13

Yeah, the SOPs are a key asset. So you can actually scale the business and and it aligns with the acquisition you just mentioned, right? So it's a smoother transition, I would say. Now, I want to tap into your experience for a second because people listening can really benefit from this. You know, have been in the game long enough to hear all kinds of business advice. Some are good, some are bad. So, what's one piece of business advice you hear all the time that you think is overrated or misunderstood?

Susan Power 19:41

First thing that pops into my mind is spend more time working on the business than in the business. I'm sure you've heard people say that. And it's pretty obvious and it's it's true. But the hard part is okay, well, where am I gonna find this time? Because there's always fires, there's always client requests, you know, employee uh challenges, etc. So I think it's kind of overrated advice in some respects because it's not really that clear of, okay, well, how? How do I do that?

Pedro 20:16

It's more like uh an oversimplification of it. It's just like, just do the thing, and you're like, okay, how do I do it, right?

Susan Power 20:23

Yeah, exactly. It's like telling someone who's completely unmotivated and not feeling the pain to go to the gym. Yes, they know they're they're overweight and they don't have energy and they they they probably know that they need to get to the gym, but nothing's gonna change until they actually really want to go to the gym. So to me, like, I know I drink the Kool-Aid a little bit, but to me, when I think of coaching, it all comes back to mindset. Like in life and business, you gotta start with how you're feeling and thinking about something because otherwise you're not gonna take the action.

Pedro 20:59

Oh my god, I felt personally attacked. That analogy was on point to my exact situation. Okay. I should be hitting the gym, FYI, but it's all good. Eventually you'll get there. But I love the reminder. I love the way you framed it. Okay. Now, on the other side, what's a piece of advice which more people actually took seriously? You know?

Susan Power 21:22

Piece that they need to take more seriously?

Pedro 21:24

Yes.

Susan Power 21:24

A piece of advice that they need to take more seriously. I think the first thing that pops into my mind, this feels a little bit cliche, but do onto others as you want others to do on onto you. I think it's a little bit of a function of our social media world today. I think in our society and people in general are having fewer children. So I think there's a lot of contributing factors, but I think people are very self focused today and less community focused, at least in in in I'm in Canada, North America certainly is is is that way. And I think. It really hampers people's growth. And they don't always think about how they can show up better for other people. They're really looking for what they can take. And it's not their fault because I think it's kind of the filter that we have with social media. But I I think like I remember my grandmother saying that like, do unto others as you want others to do unto you. And and and it's just something that I think most people could do a better job of, my myself included.

Pedro 22:28

Yeah, great reminder. Now let me ask you this. Like, I'm I'm really curious about this because I I've I know you have a team of coaches under you, and I've talked with people in the space, and I keep reminding you of this guy. He told me he was going to replace his 20 coaches with AI. And I asked him how he's gonna check for accountability. He mentioned he was going to gamify it. Now I want your opinion on AI and replacing coaches, you know. I mean, do you see something like that happening or not at all?

Susan Power 22:58

He was gonna replace his entire team with AI coaches?

Pedro 23:01

Exactly.

Susan Power 23:02

Well, I mean, I think AI definitely has a role in coaching where where I wouldn't take that approach of a hundred percent replacing the human. I I think he's missing something important there as far as the human connection and the emotional connection and coaching. But where where we use it is certainly in the the note-taking function so coaches can listen better to their client. They're not writing down the notes and it helps capture, you know, like the note takers do the actions and the themes, so we can dive more deeply in the analysis of what's coming up on the calls from call to call to call to call. And also like using it during the coaching conversation. Many of my coaches have told me they'll be using it to prompt their next question sometimes. So it's kind of like a right-hand assistant in the coaching call, you know, or to recommend a resource. So they're using it hand in hand, some coaches, while they're having the conversation. But a hundred percent replacement, I wouldn't personally go that route. Yeah, that makes sense.

Pedro 24:05

Well, to be candid, I don't think that's gonna fly. I don't think that's gonna happen. I was reading, uh reading uh a guy that was like a specialist in AI like last week, and he mentioned something like the face-to-face experience is gonna be the last one, even if people are gonna be able to replace that, you know, with AI. It's more about, I think, the efficiency bit that you mentioned, right? A hybrid approach of helping the coach to deliver because it always gets backs to me. I'm I'm just trying to pretend I'm being coached by AI, you know, and there's the one thing that I think it's key, it's the accountability bit, which is like the human component, right? It's so easy to ignore a notification from a chat bot or whatever, but it's not that easy if you have someone waiting on you on the other side that you even create a connection with, you know. So that doesn't really land for me, even if it's just a chat bot that I also talk with people in the space that were like, yeah, I'm just gonna create a chat bot and this is gonna be the coach. For me personally, I don't see it happening, but that's just my take. I'm not sure if you agree with that.

Susan Power 25:06

Yeah, it will be interesting to see generation to generation how it evolves, at least over our lifespan. But like, can you build a relationship with AI? Can you trust AI to truly hear you in a way where you feel understood and that they can share their lived experience? Like they don't have a life, a family, a like you know what I mean? Is it not that emotional connection, the relationship piece? To me, that's so key in feeling understood and having that trust with the coach. I I wouldn't trust AI to completely run my life. I rely on it every day, but I that that's a gap.

Pedro 25:45

You know, there's another thing that pops up to mind, which you mentioned. It's like the origin story we were talking about when when you you woke up to coaching was like something that you mentioned is like the job description, right? Pretend that's AI, okay, Susan. And you have the leadership team, they're like throwing the job description and saying prove this so we can do X, Y, and Z, right? What AI does, it's not gonna call them out, it's not gonna do the research you did and understand that this was actually not a right path because AI is so based, at least at this point point, right? It's so like, hey, how do I do X, Y, and Z? And we'll give them the job description that it's adapted, but it's not gonna call them out. Like and say, hey, are you sure you should be doing this?

Susan Power 26:26

You know, exactly. It's not gonna really be able to help them stay accountable and the whole governance ethics piece of it too. I know they're working on this, but I I don't trust AI to connect all the ethical dots and the governance of really like knowing what's important and and the level of importance. Like it's just, I don't know. It's it it's a little bit scary when you think of the ethics of it.

Pedro 26:52

Yeah, a hundred percent. And it's super agreeable too, right? It's like it's it wants to, it wants to like it. Sometimes it it tells me I'm almost a genius, so I know it's way, way off, right? Okay. I mean, and if someone listening, okay, wants to connect with you or follow your work, Susan. I mean, where can people find you and connect with you? I mean, we're gonna have on the description, all the links and all that, but if there's a place that you want to send people more, you know, it's it's a temple.

Susan Power 27:17

Our website has a lot of great material. We have many free download coaching resources that folks can access if they want to self-direct their own coaching, and that's power up leadership, P-O-W-E-R-U-P-leadership.ca. And you can see our coaches there if you want to set up a complimentary uh chemistry call and and check out what we're we're working on in our events as well.

Pedro 27:42

Okay. You know, there were uh a few things you shared today that really I would say stayed with me. Okay, I'm gonna highlight some of them. I would say when you gave that reminder that clients still need they still need to do the work, I think that's a pretty powerful reminder because sometimes we get into those guilt trips, you know, as a coach, and we're like, oh my God, what am I missing that this person not doing X, Y, and Z? But sometimes it's just about them, it's their story, and they need to put in the work too. So that's a powerful reminder. Also, how vulnerable you were during the entire episode, right? Still figuring marketing, still figuring out capacity. I think I always say this on the show. It's like I think that's a key asset for a true coach is being vulnerable because sometimes you you're gonna ask hard questions for your coaches, right? It's only fair, and and you're gonna, you know, dive into some points that are not that easy to navigate. And it's only fair you do the same on your own, you know, and you're like meeting them on the same level. Like I'm still I'm I'm really like I'm still vulnerable too. So that makes a lot of sense. Um, I really like the the last reminder gonna bring here because I see a lot of coaches with uh I would say I don't want to call it scarcity mindset, but it's kind of a fear to let go when you're scaling a coaching business, right? And they're just sometimes thinking about the downsides, right? And then you brought up the fact that one of the coaches you hired actually opened up your eyes to pricing, right? And something that that you're like, oh, the way I see it now is different because I I got in contact with that person. So I think it's not just the the downside, there's uh also the upsides, you know. But this is my my long-winded way of saying that I appreciate what you do. I appreciate you being here and sharing so openly today, you know? Great having you on, Susan.

Susan Power 29:26

Yeah, I appreciate that, Pedro. And what you're saying about vulnerability. When you are on the receiving end of coaching, it can feel like you're under a microscope, right? And and really looking for what are my blind spots, what do I need to really address? So I think it does create a safer environment if if the coach is is real and and shows up in a way that encourages the other person to feel comfortable and not judged and and and willing to kind of go on that journey because it's not always fun, but the transformation if they go on it is like I remembered. Can I just share a quick story if there's a moment?

Pedro 30:04

Absolutely.

Susan Power 30:05

I had a client, uh, I think he was out of the US, and he was a middle-aged guy, family guy, and he was having trouble regulating his emotions at work. He was getting frustrated with his team, yelling at them, swearing at them, and he was looking for coaching on that. He said, I know it's not getting the result, but I just get so angry when we have the same conversation over and over again. So we work on it, and fast forward to our end coaching call, he comes on the call in tears and says, Susan, what I didn't realize was better regulating my emotions has helped me have better conversations with my teenage children because I was having similar, like, you know, outbursts when I'd get frustrated with them. And now I can calm myself and and take a deep breath and have a deep conversation with them and show up as a better dad. And to me, that was like such a gratifying day because I realized the impact that he did the work, but it had a huge impact on him professionally and personally.

Pedro 31:10

Yeah, you ended up coaching the whole person, right? That's the I think that's the magical thing about coaching. And you ended up like helping them as a as an individual, not just in the business side. And of course, there is a business component in your own practice, but the way you framed it, it's so cool, you know. And seeing that happening, I imagine it's magical, right?

Susan Power 31:30

It is magical. It's a good way to put it. Yeah.

Pedro 31:32

Susan, great having you today, okay?

Susan Power 31:34

Great. Thank you, Pedro. Appreciate the opportunity.

Davis Nguyen 31:36

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