Culture Shift That Helps Businesses Scale Successfully with Jahmaal Marshall

In this episode of Success Leaves Clues Podcast, our guest is Jahmaal Marshall, leadership coach, business consultant, speaker, and organizational development expert dedicated to helping leaders and teams create stronger workplace cultures through accountability, communication, and personal ownership. Drawing from his extensive experience working with organizations to improve performance and engagement, Jahmaal shares practical insights on developing high-performing teams, fostering autonomous leadership, creating win-win agreements, and building environments where employees take responsibility for their growth and contributions. We explore the difference between true teamwork and simple workplace camaraderie, the importance of problem-solving skills, and how leaders can empower their teams to align personal goals with organizational success. Whether you're a business owner, manager, entrepreneur, coach, or aspiring leader, this conversation offers actionable strategies for building a culture that drives results while helping people thrive.

You can find him on:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/jahmaalmarshall/
https://www.listenthenspeak.com/

Transcript

Jahmaal Marshall 0:00

You know, back when I was in the Midwest, I was an addictions counselor. And so that gave me like part of why developed the listen method. It gave me a love for brain neuroplasticity because you know addiction is both mental, communal, spiritual, but it also is neurological. You know, we would anybody who knows that. And I had primarily like all white men, like pretty much 95% of my clients were like white dudes.

Davis Nguyen 0:23

Welcome to Success Leaves Clues, the podcast where we interview business owners on how they built their businesses and the hard lessons they learned along the way. My name is David Swin, and I'm a business coach and a founder of Purple Circle, where we help business owners achieve their first six-figure, seven-figure, and eight-figure year, all without sacrificing their quality of life. Before becoming a business coach and before founding Purple Circle, I started and scaled several seven and eight-figure coaching businesses and have been a consultant at several businesses doing over $100 million each, including some that are publicly listed and doing over a billion dollars each. In every episode of the podcast, you're gonna learn lessons that took R yes years to learn, and you'll be able to learn that in minutes. No matter if you're a new business owner or an established business owner, every episode is gonna give you the clues in order to elevate your business.

Pedro Stein 1:08

Welcome to Successfully Exclusive Podcast. I'm Pedro, and today I'm joined by Jamal Marshall, whose personal journey through chronic procrastination, perfectionism, broken boundaries, and addiction born from a lifetime of people pleasing gives him rare authenticity in the work he does with tech executives and organizations. Jamal was willing to go to the difficult places to uncover the why behind his what. And that willingness dramatically changed both his recovery and the system he developed for his clients. His proven process gets to the root of the mindset behind the behavior through pinpoint analysis, building atomic habits that establish personal and professional boundaries while unlearning the cyclical communication patterns that keep leaders stuck. Jamal's work proves that lasting transformation requires addressing the deeper drivers of burnout, decision fatigue, and analysis and paralysis rather than applying surface level productivity fixes. Welcome to the show, Jamal. Thanks for having me, Vader. Yeah, man. Great to have you. A follow podcaster. Okay, we already established that before the podcast. So, first of all, I am a comic book never mind myself, Jamal. Sorry about that. Okay. Um, so I love the first edition, the origin story, you know. So let's rewind a bit. Because every coach has that moment where they look at them alive and say, Yeah, I guess this is what I'm doing now, right? So when was that for you, man?

Jahmaal Marshall 2:45

Uh, it's funny how people always talk about the moment, and I think that's a little disingenuous of the true life journey. Um, I remember a wise man once told me when I was a kiddo, read autobiography, and it's just like, I'd rather not. But an autobiography shows the highs and the lows and the highs and the lows and the highs and the lows, the hills and the valleys. And so for me, it's been more moments and not just a moment. I really think that's not good testimony. I really think that's a bit of a lie to kind of that's false marketing. And so I would say some of the key, one of the key moments has been in the I would say mid-2000s. I started my career uh at DOJ at Department of Justice. I worked literally on the director's floor, and this isn't the director of our building, this is the director of the whole United States Bureau of Prisons at the Department of Justice. And so I believed in being excellent at all things. And I didn't realize like I used to be the first to get to work and the last to leave. And it did something to me, it fed something in me to get all these compliments. I had outstanding and excellent on every performance appraisal. I always got my, you know, my raise and my and you know, externally that looked like really good. But internally, where that was stemming from was a really sordid childhood. I I grew up uh with a father who was addicted to both drugs and alcohol. And so uh he could be very verbally and physically abusive when he was in that state. And so I end up kind of being the surrogate husband, surrogate spouse, the one who was the answer man, who made everything right, who didn't kick up any dust, who didn't trouble any waters, because if I did, God knows what would happen. And so that followed me into school. I was like a straight A student, you know, even in band, I was first chair. It's like whatever I'm gonna do, I'm gonna be excellent at. And so here in Washington, DC, and in most major cities, and in corporate and nonprofit spaces, you hear the word high performer. And I don't want to put a bad stain on that word, but a lot of high performers are are acting out of a trauma response. You know, and I don't want to, you know, that's that's a huge indictment to just say across the board, but most people they're showing up and people are able to monetize their excellence because they have found a way of living that makes them feel safe. Me being excellent at all things and running myself ragged made me feel safe because if I did slip up, you know, at home when my dad was in that state, it's like there was hell to pay. And so the brain found ways to, okay, if you don't do this, if you don't say this, then you are safe. And and it it began to record that. Even I became a chameleon. You know, there wasn't any group I was in a part of where I could like find out, okay, what's the tone of this group? What is the what's the language that they speak? What's the lingo here? And I I did not even know really what my own voice sounded like because I just wanted to do everything to fit in. I thought every other human being had some X factor that I didn't, because being young, I didn't hear the words, you know, I'm I'm proud of you or I love you for free. It wasn't free, it usually costs something. So I took that uh into my profession. And I would say around 2009, that's when I knew, you know, I was a counseling and psychology major, and I was always told, even when I was in my teens, that you're gonna help a lot of people. I was like, man, I I need help myself. You know, I was taking prescription drugs to wake up, prescription drugs to go to sleep. I was stressed out. I was addicted to all, I had so many different like addictions, and I was like, man, on the outward people would never know, you know, what I was. And I was like, well, before I help people, I need some help myself. And you know, we talked, you know, prehand before this podcast about me not being new to this. I would, you know, one reason why I run the practice I run and I do what I do is because I've made the investment. You know, I went away for 13 months, thousands of hours, thousands of dollars, and invested in my own spiritual, mental, folk, uh, social, neurological, communal health to really understand what was the root of what why my output was the way it was. And in the middle of that time, uh something crazy happened. My dad, you know, uh, I I know my my clients and audience are all people of faith, but you know, he gave his life to Christ. He became a man of faith, and I watched him go from night to day. And I'll be honest, Pedro, I didn't trust it at first. You know, I knew that during the formative years what he was like, and so it took a while, the better part of two and a half years for me to really warm up to him. Um, and once I did, you know, my a person that was my worst enemy became my best friend. And by this point, I had left DOJ after six and a half years of being there, and then started working at the nonprofit that I had gone to. And it was a great place, but it was also very military-driven, and so it had its own toxicity. And it was around 2013 I thought about leaving because I started before uh starting as a counselor, I started in website quality control and also in prison correspondence. It was so boring. Not the prison stuff, but the website quality control and also e-commerce. And bro, Petra, I mean, you talk about wanting to vote, fall asleep. And the environment was, you know, by and large, it was just very military, very hierarchical. And so it kind of sometimes could reinforce those fears and the trauma that I had when I was a kid. And it was around 2013 when just you know, course corresponding with my dad and talking to him, it's like it put this confidence in me that I never had before. Not to ever, I was never raised to be disrespectful, but to face people down and to really, you know, let them know like we, you know, we're gonna both be respectful. And this is people, this is CEOs of whole companies. And so long before I became a coach and and was, you know, doing the things I was doing now, I learned how to move in a room full of snakes and deposit my venom. So um that I think that was like probably the the second breaking through because the director of our residential program had approached me and he said, We don't we feel like some of the clients don't have enough access to you. And like I was one of the one of three senior counselors. Um, I was also traveling, traveling globally, promoting. I was running a remote program, so I had other contracted counselors under me. And I was just like, I was pretty much drained to the dregs, and I was just like, man, how dare this guy approach me like this? Uh, and at this point, my dad was also starting to get sick at times back home. And so it was a great time for me to understand my own power, to understand, you know, that I was a big fish in a small pond. And I know for some people, you know, when that's their bread and butter, that can be pretty daunting, but it was a fearlessness about me, you know. Even after having gotten my certification and and having gotten my degree, I reapplied myself to a lot of modalities of you know how the mind works, how the heart works. And I just said, you know what? Uh I'm not gonna be just another pawn in the game because I watched a lot of quality people get fired. It didn't scare me though. It was a fearlessness about me. And so I realized I was starting to burn out because you know, when you work residentially, you're just always in the thick of it. And I just took some time, some time to myself, some time off. I decided, you know, even on the weekends when they said you should be here, I said, no, that's not what I'm doing. If you want the best of me, you're gonna have to get me who has some boundaries. And so that was a big part of birthing woodless and this week. Is um sounds a long-winded answer to your question, but there you have it.

Pedro Stein 10:23

Yeah, I like a little, I mean, a lot of parts, right? Uh roller coaster of emotions I went through, I'll put it simply like that. A lot of stuff happening, okay. Well, first of all, I like that you didn't frame as an uh ha moment, like you weren't bit by a spider. It's more about a journey, right? And where that got you where you're at right now. That's one thing. Um, it sounds like it was a lot of self-discovery to to get inside coaching into something like that. I I what I really want to understand now is forced a shift from I'm doing this, but now I'm gonna launch my own business that happened like five years ago. Okay, that's listen then speak. That that leap of faith sometimes. That's one thing that I want to understand. And actually, how were you exposed to coaching in the first thing? Right? Like, how how does that look like for hey, I'm a coach now, you know?

Jahmaal Marshall 11:14

Got it. Oh, good question. So around the pandemic, you know, one of one of the tragic things that happened in my life was in 2017 of January, my father had a major stroke. And so I knew I was still living in the Midwest, I was still working at this nonprofit. And I used to keep flying back home on standby, and so I was living in like two different places, and I put in my resignation, and you know, they they I was blessed coming in, blessed going out. Um, but he started to recover over the course of about eight months, and there was a care package and a plan to bring him home. So I get home around the 18th of September. This is 2017. Three days later, he gets critically ill. And we live in a hospital for two and a half months. December 5th, 2017, he takes his last breath. So for me, that was really tragic. I had a lot of anger, a lot of emotions, a lot of man. I've given the best years of my young adult life to all these different works, really putting fires out for everybody else, taking care of everybody else. And this, these are supposed to be the good years, you know. So as a person of faith, I hated Jesus. I hated the gospel, I hated the very things that I laid claim to. And I went through a crisis of faith where I just wanted to leave the whole thing behind. I thought, well, maybe I'll just be an atheist. So it took the better part of a year, uh, where I would just I would literally go to this tennis court and I would just throw up F-bombs and other things that I cannot repeat on this podcast. And that was how I prayed. That's all I knew to say. And I didn't realize because I didn't live here for a long time, that we had these beautiful civil war forts, you know, in Washington, D.C. And I said, Well, man, deer and foxes and wild turkey don't speak English, so I'll just go in the forest and keep shouting some F-bombs. And so, over the better part of a year, being enclosed in such beautiful forests, I went from profanity to prayer to meditation, and I would, you know, have my phone with me. I had this Google Pixel 3XL, and for a minute and a half, I would just have some thoughts and I would record these thoughts on this phone. Mind you, before 2020, 2019, I wasn't on any social media. You can't you cannot find a trace of me. I had a LinkedIn because you know, I was I started working in investigations um in Arlington, Virginia. You know, as I I came back here and I chose to stay in the DC area, and so I started placing these videos on LinkedIn of all places. And so during the pandemic, you know, people were home more. I wasn't trying to for people to watch me or whatever like that. I just knew I had a message and I wanted to just put it out there. I had no idea people were listening. And so around I would say April of 2020, a group called the Safety Justice League said, Hey, we want you to come on our podcast. I was like, What? I'm like, I'm I have a full-time job. My title says Global Lead. And I'm like, I got a full-time job. What they want to know about me? And they said, Well, we're watching your videos. And I was speaking to, because in the country we had had this, you know, killing of a man by the name of George Floyd, and it created a cultural pandemic globally almost. And so I felt the need to speak to that, but not in the way that everyone else did. It was either there's no racism, it doesn't exist, or every white person is racist. And I was like, I don't think that those two are true. I think that there is a middle ground, and I think there's a lot of conflation going on. And so when everybody on LinkedIn was singing Soprano note, I came in as a tenor, and and people just started saying, Well, who's what's Jamal Marshall? And so one thing led to another. They had me on their podcast, and a group in Columbia, Pennsylvania, a website team, actually heard this podcast and said, We heard that, and we have just never seen or heard an interview like that before. We want to actually send you $2,000, get yourself a MacBook Pro, which I'm on right now. And they said, We're also gonna open up a web domain that you can do whatever you want with. That's where Listen and Speak was born. And so it wasn't like I planned this. And then multiple people started having me on their podcast because it was four guys, three guys, and one girl. Girl's name was Abby Ferry, and she said, Are you a podcast host? I said, No, I don't really get down like that. She said, You should be. She said, You are uh a natural, you have a quality about you. So I guess it got established early on throughout that summer that I was gonna be a podcast host. So I said, Okay, well, what's my intro gonna sound like? What's my artwork? And I start thinking and ideating through all these things, and I had this wave of excitement, even though I was still working a full-time job. And this guy by the name, he used to be the head exec at Xerox. And he had he was mentoring me at this, you know, when I was going out to McLean, Virginia, and he says, I want to be your first guest. And I was just like, Because he had gone to work his own business, he was now a five-time best-selling author. And so, you know, I'm full of nerves. I'm just like, What's what's what am I gonna do with this? I had him on, we get through the interview, and he says, he gives me gives me his number. He says, I want you to call me, I have some feedback for you. I'm like, man, this dude's about to rip me like a new one. He says, I've done thousands of these, Jamal. Thousands. He says, I would put our interview today in my top 20. He says, You have a quality that is very rare to pull out of your guests what other people don't. He says, Everybody asked me the same questions, but you pulled the best out of me. And so he says, I want to sponsor your space for your distribution for your podcast. I'm gonna get you a mic so you have cleaner sound. And so, all that to say, Pedro, I wasn't looking for listen and speak. It was looking for me. And the more and more these videos start going out, people start coming to my DMs. I didn't know back then what an inbound lead was. And they were like, hey, are you like a counselor, a mentor, advisor? Because your title says global lead. And I was like, Well, yeah, and I was like, Yeah, but no, I was acting like I wasn't sure because I thought though I felt that those things had died with my dad. And this guy who actually isn't is an atheist, does not carry my faith. His name is Billy Samoa Salibi. He took me under his wing. He said, I want you to meet me every Friday, and he showed me how to use LinkedIn. And he said, Listen, talk about who you are. He says, Your title, that'll go in your experience section, you know, your global lead there. But he says, When I interact with you, I see a public speaker, I see a coach, I see a mentor, I see a counselor. That's what I see. And so I put that, and man, my DMs got flooded with like just inbound leads, and so I didn't know what to do. I was like, Well, how do I handle this like legally? And so by the summer of 2021, that's when I start taking. Yeah, that's when I took like my first client. I had all these Canadians first.

Pedro Stein 17:47

So wow, man, that's a wild journey. And it sounds like you're almost pushed into it, right? It's like it's so organic, so natural. Now I get it. When you you're mentioning the no there is no aha moment, there are uh several moments in your life that got you where you are right now, which is obvious to a point. But people but most people have this misconception of, for example, I'm gonna get my business degree, and then something magical happens when I graduate. It doesn't really work like that, right? It's like the entire journey and where you get where you got where you are. So pretty cool, okay. Now I want to shift yours for a second and understand a little bit more about the uh the side of the business, okay, the listen and speak. Because after you got rolling, you you mentioned yourself, you got a lot of people reaching out, right? But who are the people that kept showing up? You know, in the early days for coaching, eventually, we try to help everyone, we're trying to figure out things, how does that work out? So I want you to understand the ones you realize, okay, this is my tribe. You know what I mean?

Jahmaal Marshall 18:55

Mm-hmm. No, great question, man. That was so funny because, like, when I started off, you know, back when I was in the Midwest, I was an addictions counselor. And so that gave me like part of why I developed the listen method, it gave me a love for brain neuroplasticity because you know, addiction is both mental, communal, spiritual, but it also is neurological. You know, we would anybody who knows that. And I had primarily like all white men, like pretty much 95% of my clients were like white dudes. And when I started, you know, on LinkedIn, I feel like I had become a different person, and so I started drawing a different, you know, I started drawing a different ilk of people. And so now 60% of my clients are women, um, and they're, you know, white women, black women, Indian, Asian, South Asian, Jewish, you know, it's so strange how I started drawing in all these different types of clients. Um, and I wondered, I talked to my co-author about that years ago, and I was, you know, I think because I was talking about the stress, you know, the burnout, you know, the draining yourself to the dregs. And we know as guys, women mostly don't have that chance to be off. You know, when they are at work, they have to be on. They even have to look a certain way. When they're at home, they have to be on. When they're at the social group, they have to be on. And so I feel like a lot of my content starts appealing to them. And when they go to couples counseling, it still is catered towards the man. And she said it's something about the inflection in your voice and the way you present yourself that appeals that a woman feels seen, heard, and affirmed, she feels safe with you. And I was like, I couldn't figure it out myself.

Speaker 1 20:33

I was like, I got a lot of women clients.

Jahmaal Marshall 20:35

And so there was a lot of, and through my podcast, it was weird because in the early days, I would say for the first 40 interviews, Pedro, I never even talked about what I did. I would just interview people. And I would get women, I would have in my calendar leader say, I was like, How'd you hear about this? Like through your podcast. And so I want you to be, you know, my executive coach. I want you to be, you know, I this is the area I need help in. And so I was starting to get a lot of middle managers and senior leaders and government and places like Honda, Nike, Zillow, Amazon. I was just like, wow. So, you know, they would listen to me just talk to another person and say that's the guy I want to work with.

Pedro Stein 21:10

Yeah, I love that, man. Okay, couple things, right? I had a guest a while ago when you know when we're talking about business, I'm talking about unbillable hours and all that. Sometimes it's admin work, whatever that looks like. And she was like, Yeah, I'm a woman. I'm I always have unbillable hours. And I'm like, What do you mean? And she's like, I'm at home, you know. So she's always doing something at home, despite the fact she already is an established business owner. And I never seen it like that, right? I have this mentality of business women, but how women tend to deal with different stuff that sometimes men don't even realize, you know. That's one thing. Now I'm curious about another thing, okay, because you mentioned you would attract people. Okay. So let's say I'm your ICEP right now, I'm your ideal client profile, okay. How would I be able to find you in the first place, marketing wise? I know you have a podcast, but walk me through that, please.

Jahmaal Marshall 22:08

Well, there's quite a few ways to find me. One of the easiest ways, if you just type my name in, I mean you see the spelling of my name. That alone, it's weird, carries super high SEO. Like I'm the easiest person to Google. You know, LinkedIn has horror, it's a great platform, but has horrible search. I'm the easiest person to find on LinkedIn. Um, I'm pretty active there, obviously, because that's you know one of the platforms that I run my business through. Most of my Calendly links are are out there through other podcasts and different platforms. So uh that's the one of the easiest ways to find me is to either get in there, get in those DMs, or come through Calendly. But get ready to work. I definitely uh don't have time to kick the can. I'm ready to do the work.

Pedro Stein 22:48

Okay. Now I'm still that guy. I'm watching you on LinkedIn. I listen to your podcast. I'm like, Jamal seems like a pretty cool guy, pretty chill. You know, I want to work with him. So eventually I got in touch with you. Got myself like uh you're in your calendar. I I don't know how exactly that works, but let's speed up the sales process a little bit. Let's say there's alignment, okay, Jamal? You can help me. I know you can help me, and uh we're in, I'm in, we're gonna work together. So can you walk me through how does it look like to work with you, okay, with listen then speak, and uh the potential outcomes I can expect out of it?

Jahmaal Marshall 23:26

Yeah, so the first thing is you're gonna get an intake form because man, like how we're doing this intense work to reduce burnout, stress, anxiety, all these other things you presented before me by over 30%. And also to highlight what your unique goal mechanisms are. Unless I have an intake form and collect data, I can't roadmap you. This isn't talk therapy, I don't find that effective. Uh I think that's effective to a point, but if you're just bemoaning your own existence and I'm listening to you with a notepad, what have we accomplished? You know, we actually have to do the root work from the inside out. So once you decide, okay, I'm I'm ready, I'm willing, you know, uh you'll get an uh an intake form, you're gonna get uh, you know, a legal service agreement. Obviously, because I'm I'm bound to serve you, you know, you're bound to show up. We want to make sure that we're consistent here. I recommend because scientifically we know it takes 90 days to just change the neuroplasticity of our brain. And so people want that quick work. I'm like, the quick stuff is not sexy. You know, the work I do is not sexy, the quick stuff is not effective. So I always want to, you know, the reason why I have over 70 recommendations on LinkedIn and over 20 elsewhere is because the work is effective. You know, we're literally doing the work at the core. Uh and then obviously you'll be, you know, invoiced for your, you know, if you're on a payment plan, some people just say I'm paying all it all up front. So it depends on who it is. If you're working in a corporate company, a lot of people tend to bring me in as a contractor because that way it's paid for under their personal development budget. And if the person, you know, just you know has the co op and they're in that tax bracket, they're like, all right, well, let's let's get rocking and rolling. So the biggest thing is intake form, legal service agreement. Um, once we get that, you get the invoice, and then you get the calendar link to this is when I want you to schedule your sessions. We want to be have some weekly rhythms. Um, I do tell my clients that those 12 weeks can turn into 14 weeks easily. It may not be 14 weeks of sessions, but I'm hoping that within a quarter of the year you will go on vacation or you will just be human and say, Hey, I got a sick child. I have to reschedule our session, and that happens. You know, when you have you know 60% of the clients that are women or really good dads, that's gonna happen. And so I leave room for reality. You know, when people say this is my this this is the one-on-one work. People say this is my boom, boom, boom. If you don't hit that, it's like I I don't think that's serving your client well. I think that's padding your pockets.

Pedro Stein 25:58

Okay. Love the intake form, love the the well, there's the saying, right, from Warren Buffett. I think it's from him. It's like, if only the get rich slow schemes were more popular, right? It's it's about uh it's step by, you know, every you know, one step at a time and all that. Now, I'm curious about one thing. We're talking about an intake form. Um sounds like a one-on-one component, right? What else does it entail? Or are we talking basically about one-on-ones? Is that is that what it basically the the list and then speak uh helps people with? Like you through a customized plan of action through one-on-ones with you. Is that what we're we're talking about?

Jahmaal Marshall 26:41

It is tailored specifically to the client. Later this year, uh, we'll be doing some group and some community. Um, because that gives me a chance to go, you know, yeah, B2C. It gives me a chance to reach more people. But you know, the one-on-one is like some people like I I think when you do group, it's very effective, extremely effective. But for the more extreme cases, and I don't want to say that because when you say that and you're talking to, you know, middle managers, senior execs, and stuff like that. I'm not an extreme case, let's face reality. We are. Um, those are the ones that okay, that this is becoming chronic at this point, you know, and and I actually need to see measurable results. I can't get to this goal because I'm in my own way. You know, where do we roadmap that at? For that, that's gonna definitely be one-on-one.

Pedro Stein 27:28

Okay, now I have a small curveball for you. Little small, okay, very, very, very small. Here's the thing. Um, I'm a coach myself too, right? And I was in corporate for a while. And when I clocked out, man, I clocked out, you know, I was off. And then I build my practice and all that, and I'm a business owner, and it feels different because it's more fulfilling, right? But at the same time, it doesn't really feel like work sometimes. Okay, and I overstep a little and I work a little bit more than I should. And I see a lot of coaches out there advocating against burnout, and sometimes they're burning out themselves because they're wearing all the hats, right? They're the marketer, they're the sales guy, they are, you know, uh there's delivery, the operation side, right? There's business development. So a lot of moving pieces. So, how do you think about capacity? So don't stretch yourself too thin.

Jahmaal Marshall 28:22

Yeah, that's a great question, Pedro. I would say for people who are doing that, one, you have to know your strengths and know your weaknesses. And I learned that early on, nearly six years ago. I remember my first episode. I tried to do the production, I was up till 2:30 in the morning. Just to give you an idea. Like, I know what I'm inclined towards and what I don't have a strength. I'm the talent, you know, I do public speaking. I also do keynoting, like, that's my strength. You know, the advisor, the mentor, the coach, the counselor, that's my strength. As far as me sitting up on a laptop with a mouse in my hand in front of five or four monitors all night, I'm not good at that. And so also knowing how to delegate. And when you come, you know, I'm I'm honest about my own weaknesses. You know, I'm a recovering perfectionist. You want things a certain way, so it's like, I don't know if I want to hand this off. Be willing to give up that thing that is actually slowing your business down. And also, one of the ways, the things that helped me, especially early on, was that I had my somebody who came in a few years ago and decided to sponsor our production. And they did it for three straight years, which was huge. You know, also had someone sponsor the web domain. And so things that would normally, when you maybe not have as much revenue at first, or you're trying to I live in Washington, DC. So this is not a cheap city to live in. You know, you're trying to figure out where's the best place to put this money, use your platform. Like listening speaks a huge platform now. So when I bring people on, if they cannot, you know, have the revenue to come on because we're in the top 1%, and we also get over from five to nine thousand downloads a day, you know, that that isn't that didn't happen by accident. And so I leverage that. It's like, well, if I'm putting you before my audience, how can I leverage your services? So, you know, understand your strengths and and know where to place your weaknesses. I think that's the way that you're not going to burn out because it's it's just natural for us to have our hands dipped in every pot. And when you see yourself drifting, because the drift will happen. Let's just be honest. Back up and say, Am I working for my business or am I working in my business? And I appreciate your honesty about just having your hands on more than is needed because it's happened to all of us.

Pedro Stein 30:34

Yeah, I like that. Now, let's shift gears for a second. Let's talk about future. You kind of mentioned already, right? Group setting and all that. But I mean, what's next for listen and speak? You know, looking ahead, where do you see the business going? Are you thinking about scaling, hiring? Is there an example you're excited about?

Jahmaal Marshall 30:54

You know, yes, that's I love that question. So the website is getting a complete facelift. We should be done by next week. I'm excited about that.

Pedro Stein 31:02

Uh veryft, it's funny for a website. I'm just cracking here.

Jahmaal Marshall 31:06

I know, right? That's just the linguist, man. But the biggest thing is is now taking this, you know, just renew my passport. I'm headed to Thailand in July. That's that's not for work, that's for a mastermind slash vacation. But I got the big book, and so I'm really excited to now start keynoting at a higher level, you know, at least once a month, you know, being able to travel to go different places to go globally. Because when I keynote and I've gone out, it's always been, even though my first one was in London years ago, most of the ones have always been stateside. So I'm excited to travel. I'm excited to go B to C and to start doing more groups and more workshops. I'm actually developing a collaboration right now with the wounded workforce. Really, really excited about that. And I think the next thing I'm excited about is building a team under me. Like, okay, my website team is sponsored, you know, podcast production, they're doing their thing, but actually build a team of people under me that can offset, you know, the admin tasks that are necessary, but not always as fun.

Pedro Stein 32:05

So okay. Now, whenever we're aiming towards the next chapter, as you already know, there's always something we're refining in the present under the hood. So, what are you currently trying to improve or tighten up in your business right now, my man?

Jahmaal Marshall 32:19

I think the biggest thing is tightening up in the business is for myself. I think people can maybe even come on a podcast like this and talk about nothing but business. But I've had eight-figure, multiple eight-figure earners on my podcast, and they don't neglect personal development. Your business grows to the degree that you do. And so I'm not so much thinking about tightening up things in the business as I am thinking about how do I keep my headspace and my heart space tight. Because when that's tight, when that's high and tight, the business will be high and tight. And I'm, you know, as I I work in personal development, I work in leadership development, but I also drink the very fountain that I pour. And so that is that's my biggest thing is making sure that I myself am a person of character and integrity. Because you could be a billionaire tomorrow, but your character is what's going to keep you there.

Pedro Stein 33:08

Okay, love that. Now, last question before I let you go, okay. Let's talk about like let's picture this. Let's say we have a time machine, okay? And uh you're able to go back in time five years from now and give one advice to past Jamal, right? When he was starting the business, the listen then speak. What would that be?

Jahmaal Marshall 33:32

Vet everyone you think about partnering with. We didn't talk about this, but uh I had four straight years of wins, wins, wins, six-figure surpluses. And 2025 was the tough year of lessons. You know, I hired someone that I did not vet well, and they ended up being a car artist and walked away with thousands of doctors.

unknown 33:53

Oh my god, no.

Jahmaal Marshall 33:54

So hey, you you gotta talk about the losses. That's what autobiographies are for. Um I don't know about their guests, the other guests, but I'm gonna keep it real. So vet everyone, no matter what type of rapport you you have with them, they have to have a Google business page, they have to have a viable website, you have to be able to look them up in different places. If you don't see that, run. And if in the first, you know, people, I don't really like a lot of kindness quotes, or because it's like kindness to me is a fruit of the spirit. You know, you don't just be kind, it's not innate to us. But I was trying to be as weird, uh, as much as I've recovered in my own process. I was trying to be nice, and I wasn't seeing results working with this person, but I kept allowing them to string me along because of the rapport we had. And as a I would tell Jamal looking five years back, like, bro, remember, yeah, you are a very gentle person. You're not a mean-spirited person, but you're a businessman. Remove your emotions from this and do what you need to do.

Pedro Stein 34:51

It's a send cost fallacy, right? You're so into the process that you're like, okay, I've been, I got to this point, maybe this will work. You don't want to, you know, just terminate the the relationship and all that. I think everyone's been there at some point, right? Even if it's a relationship in your personal life or business life, you know. So I appreciate you being so open about that. Now, if someone listening wants to connect with you or follow your work, and here's the thing, Jamal. We're gonna have all the links in the description, obviously. But what's the best way for people to find you and connect with you?

Jahmaal Marshall 35:24

And link with me on LinkedIn. Literally one of the easiest people to find. My name is J A H M A A L. As soon as you type that in, boom, I will literally be the first. There's not a whole lot of people to spell it this way. So you got me there. And once you connect with me there, all my other stuff, the website, the podcast, that'll all be in the show notes. But link with me on LinkedIn. I'm excited to take the journey with you.

Pedro Stein 35:49

Nice. You know, a few things caught my attention from this chat today. I feel the need to highlight, you know. First of all, the origin story when we were talking about that, your father, you know, uh the hardships of life. Uh give then he gave his life to Christ, and then you lost him, and then profanity, and you know, back to the square one. So at the end of the day, man, overall the entire episode showing your vulnerability. I would put it like that. Like, I think that's like a key aspect for a true coach is being open about their own struggles because you're gonna ask tough questions for from for your coaches. It's only fair you do the same. You're open, you're you can manage your own your own stuff, right? And the way you present yourself, keeping it real, you know. Uh kudos to you, man. Like that is super inspiring to to watch. Okay, that's one thing. Also, it's so cool that you got your podcast financed, right? That is pretty awesome. Like, they got you like uh a laptop, your MacBook that were like, hey man, what you're you're talking about here resonates with a lot of people. So that is almost like instant validation to really hit the gas on your own business. So that is also super cool to hear. Um, last but not least, I would say it's the intake form. I like that type of stuff because I have this business mindset, and I love when a coach levels the playing field. Like, we're gonna do some work here, buddy. You know, it's not just about talking about problems, it's not therapy at the end of the day, you know. We gotta have have our and nothing against therapy, by the way. But but it's about getting your hands dirty, and so we're gonna do the work, you know. So, Jamal, this is just my long-winded way of saying it. I appreciate what you do. You know, I appreciate you being here and sharing so openly today. It was great having you on, man.

Jahmaal Marshall 37:46

Thanks for having me, Pedro. Appreciate it.

Davis Nguyen 37:49

That's it for this episode. This episode, as well as this podcast, was brought to you by Purple Circle, where we help business owners elevate their business to six, seven, and eight figure years all without burning out. If you're looking to grow your business as well as get the time freedom that you are looking for, visit us at join purplecircle.com and see what we can do to help you and your business.