The Leadership Mindset That Creates Sustainable Success with Kirstin Purcell

In this episode of Success Leaves Clues Podcast, our guest is Kirstin Purcell, executive coach, leadership consultant, facilitator, and organizational development expert who helps leaders and organizations navigate change, strengthen leadership capability, and create high-performing workplace cultures. Drawing from her extensive experience coaching executives, business owners, and leadership teams, Kirstin shares practical insights on authentic leadership, emotional intelligence, resilience, effective communication, and empowering people to reach their full potential. We also explore how leaders can build trust, lead through uncertainty, foster collaboration, and create meaningful, lasting impact while driving business success. Whether you're an entrepreneur, executive, manager, coach, or aspiring leader, this conversation is filled with actionable strategies for developing stronger leadership skills, building resilient teams, and leading with clarity, confidence, and purpose.

You can find her on:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/kirstin-purcell/
https://handshakeinheels.com/
Email: kpurcell@handshakeinheels.com

Transcript

Kirstin Purcell 0:00

So my discovery call is very important. So usually I'm able to sift out issues, right? So bad Pedro, you and I are having a conversation. Typically, I'm gonna sift that out and decide not to work with you. If if you can't be, you know, if you're not open to listening to what I'm, you know, my expertise.

Davis Nguyen 0:23

Welcome to Success Leaves Clues, the podcast where we interview business owners on how they built their businesses and the hard lessons they learned along the way. My name is David Swain, and I'm a business coach and a founder of Purple Circle, where we help business owners achieve their first six-figure, seven-figure, and eight-figure year, all without sacrificing their quality of life. Before becoming a business coach, before founding Purple Circle, I started to scale several seven and eight-figure coaching businesses and have been a consultant at several businesses doing over $100 million each, including some that are publicly listed and doing over a billion dollars each. In every episode of the podcast, you're gonna learn lessons that took our guests years to learn, and you'll be able to learn that in minutes. No matter if you're a new business owner or an established business owner, every episode is gonna give you the clues in order to elevate your business.

Pedro Stein 1:08

Welcome to Success Leaves Clues Podcast. I'm Pedro, and today I'm joined by Kirsten Purcell, founder of Handshake and Heels, who spent 13 plus years watching the same frustrating disconnect play out on both sides of the hiring table. Companies struggling to find the right talent, while candidates were left in the dark about what was really happening behind the scenes. Kirsten built Handshake and Heels specifically to pull back the curtain on the hiring process, bringing clarity and strategy to both employers and job seekers in a space that desperately needed both. Hard work spans retained search, fractional recruiting partnerships, leadership workshops, and workforce strategy development, all grounded in one simple truth. The right people change everything. Welcome to the show, Kirsten.

Kirstin Purcell 2:08

Thank you.

Pedro Stein 2:10

Okay. You know, great to have you. Excited to record with you. And I am kind of a gotta tell, kind of a comic book nerd myself, right? So I love the first editions, you know, the origin story and all what that entails. So let's rewind a bit, you know, because every coach has that moment where they look at their life and say, yeah, I guess this is what I'm doing now, right? So when was that for you, Kirsten?

Kirstin Purcell 2:34

So I it was in 2019. I realized that there was something missing. There was a disconnect between what the candidates were being told as to why they weren't getting an interview or why they weren't um being selected for a position and the hiring managers. So nobody was giving that feedback, you know. So a candidate would miss out on a job and just get a generic thank you but no thank you email, right? We've all gotten those before when we've applied to positions. And so I didn't like that. I said, you know, how how is that helpful, right? How is that how is that helping someone grow or do better or or know, you know, what to do and what not to do? So that's when I decided to start handshaking heels to really pull back the curtain and give that behind the scenes look at, hey, here's some you know, feedback that can ultimately change the trajectory of your job search.

Pedro Stein 3:35

Okay. Now, can you expand? I'm very curious about the name. I think that's first of all, I think it's hilarious. Okay, and I love the story behind names. So can you expand a little bit on that? The handshake on in heels, like just I can have the full picture.

Kirstin Purcell 3:51

Sure. So um I actually have a degree in fashion merchandising. Um, but my love of shoes, in particular high heels, uh started when I was, I mean, walking pretty much. Um, and so your the handshake is your first impression, right? And then I'm always in high heels, so it's the handshake in the heels, which is me. I'm the handshake in the heels.

Pedro Stein 4:17

Yeah, I was looking at uh the company name. I'm thinking Devil Wear Sporada immediately.

Kirstin Purcell 4:22

Oh, one of my favorite movies.

Pedro Stein 4:24

I was like, what's happening here? Right? Nice, okay. Now, um, let me dig in a little deeper here on uh what we sometimes call it like a pivot or the change, big shift that happened in your life. We're talking about 13 years in the game, right? And seven in your own business on handshinking heels. Can you walk us through that shift from, you know, uh employer to business owner? Because sometimes in the early days for coaches, we're testing waters, right? We're like, I'm a coach myself too. So we're like, oh, let's see if this is gonna land. How does that look like? And you start giving advice, helping people, but eventually you realize, okay, I'm building a real business around this, right? I'm not sure how that played out for you, but I would love for you to do, you know, walk us through the that shift in your career, turning yourself into a business owner, please.

Kirstin Purcell 5:20

Sure. So I think so. What happened was um, so career, you know, in staffing, and then I moved over to corporate recruitment. So I was actually working and running my business at the same time, which I think is a lot of times, you know, what coaches do, like how they start out. Um, and so I got on a on a phone call, um, just a random, I think it was a couple days before Halloween, actually, um, or a week or so before. It was in October 2024. And I get on a call, and all of a sudden, HR gets on the call and I've lost my job. So they, I don't know if I still don't know if they fired me or let me go. I don't know. But I was not prepared, right? So I I kind of went into mode of fight or flight. So I was like, well, I've been working handshake and heels and trying to get that off the ground at the same time, you know, working a corporate job that helps me, you know, gives me that security net, you know, and pays the bills while I'm trying to build something for my future, my family's future. And so I said, Well, now's a good time as any, I guess, you know. So, um, and I'm all about everything happens for a reason and signs and all of that stuff, right? So I just said, Well, who knows? You know, if that rug didn't get pulled out from under me unexpectedly, who knows if I would have ever had the courage to make that jump. Because it's scary. You have no idea if you're gonna succeed. Uh, you know, you have no idea you go from a stable paycheck to, uh I don't know where my mortgage payments coming from. You know, like I don't know, I don't know what what's happening. So um, that's where it shifted for me. Um, it was like a slow motion moment for myself where I was like, okay, what's next? I started to write down a to-do list, you know, to figure things out. And I just I just did it. Um made some phone calls to some people that were already in, you know, the coaching space, had their own business. I just, okay, what do I need to know? You know, this is what just happened. I just let me just start checking things off the list and get it done. And I did. Um and I it's it's terrifying, but exciting. And I'm definitely doing what I was supposed to do. I all along knew I was gonna be an entrepreneur, have my own business, uh, you know, and it just kind of my timeline got sped up a little bit um for me. So um, but yeah, and then here we here we are. So um yeah.

Pedro Stein 7:55

Nice. Okay. Now um after you got rolling, because you got you were part-time in your business, and then we're we're setting up the standards for a full-time position, which you're currently at uh in your as a founder of your business. I'm thinking, right? Um after you got rolling, um, who are the people that kept showing up? You know, because in the early days, sometimes, not saying it's your case, but we're trying to help everyone. We're just as you mentioned, mortgage, we have bills to pay, and sometimes you're like, let's let's try to make this work. But eventually, uh, we sharpen the blade, you know, and we we kind of happen to have like that certain type of people that we attract, you know? Yes. What I mean. So I would love for you to walk us through the evolution of who you started serving and who do you serve now?

Kirstin Purcell 8:46

Yeah. So it started off um when I first started Handshaking Heels, it was candidates. So candidate focused, um, so people looking for jobs. Um, that was my main focus, helping with resume writing, um, interview prep, giving the behind the scenes um help to those that were, you know, on the job market and searching for a position. Um, and then it has evolved since into I still do that. That is still an aspect of my business because that's why I started my business in the first place. I'll never give that up just because I feel like it's something that's needed, um, you know, and it's not given to candidates to have that that edge um, you know, against competition. So um, but now I help companies hire better and then retain their employees. So more like consulting, coaching internally um for businesses.

Pedro Stein 9:44

So right now we're talking about both, right? Which we have a B2C component and a B2B, but you're more focused in a B2B, if I got it right.

Kirstin Purcell 9:53

Yes.

Pedro Stein 9:54

Okay.

Kirstin Purcell 9:55

So it's kind of something for everyone, you know, uh just depending on what somebody wants. So it's on both sides of the um the form there. So it's, you know, candidates, companies. And if there's a company I know looking for a position and I have a candidate, great. Matchmaking, that's that's my background, recruitment, you know. So um there's that component as well, the fractional recruitment um in piece too. So it works out very well. Um and I also have relationships with staffing agencies. So, you know, if a client is looking for a specific person, I'll reach out to my partners in the staffing world, um, you know, to match that them up there. Um but yeah, so it it works, works really well. Um, you know, figuring out what a company is needing. So doing like a hiring audit, um, if you will. I know that sounds kind of financy, but um, you know, but coming in and figuring out, you know, what their issue is. Are you having a problem attracting your talent? Um, you know, your employees, are you having a problem hiring? Meaning, are you not asking the right interview questions, you know, to figure out and really sift out if somebody's a good fit for the company? Or are you having an issue keeping your employees? Are they leaving? Um, you know, so figuring out which bucket, you know, to kind of attack and go in and help the companies fix. Um, and then if it comes to recruitment, great, you know, that's that's my you know where I started. So then there's that recruitment aspect where then I pull in the the candidates that either I've been helping, I have in the pipeline, or my staffing um partners, you know, I'll have them do a search um for me if I don't have somebody on my bench.

Pedro Stein 11:41

Yeah, I can definitely see the synergy. It's almost like how you'll peek behind a curtain of both sides, which is like very powerful, as I'm thinking right now and spinning my wheels here. Okay. Now let's do kind of a game of pretend here, if you don't mind. Okay. Let's pretend I am an owner of a business. I want to talk about the B2B side. Okay. I think that's very interesting. Um so I'm your ICP there, okay. So can you walk, like, first of all, let's talk marketing, right? How I how would I be able to find you, you know?

Kirstin Purcell 12:19

So I have um I'm active on Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn. Um, you know, so that's kind of where I'm doing my marketing and and spreading, you know, my business around uh locally. I do things around, um, I'm in Fredericksburg, Virginia, um, serving the DC, Maryland um area, also national. So I can do, you know, pretty much if it's depending on what a company wants, right? Um, and I travel uh to client sites and stuff all the time. So um, but yeah, so Facebook um it is my name, um, Kirsten Purcell. And um Instagram, it's Handshake in Heels. And then LinkedIn, it's my name, Kirsten Purcell.

Pedro Stein 13:02

Okay. So still in the same game. Okay. Um, let's say I saw what you got out there, uh, social media, right? You mentioned Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, or even those local uh meetings or anything like that. Even yeah, you I know you mentioned Fredericksburg, but also national and all that. So let's pretend um whatever you got out there resonated with me. Okay. I'm like, hand shaking heels. Sounds like a cool business. They can help me. I reach out. Okay. And we can speed up the sales process, really up to you. We could say there is alignment, or if you want to add something there, it's totally fine. But what I really want is to have a little peek behind a curtain, okay? An understanding of how it works how it is to work with your business and the outcomes I can expect.

Kirstin Purcell 13:50

Sure. Um, so if you're my um, you know, my client, um, or you're you've seen maybe some reels and posts that I've posted, um, then you know, you reach out, and what I would do, my first question would be, you know, what is your biggest issue in your business? A lot of times it's people. Nine times out of ten, you know, somebody's I've got people problems, right? So then I'm figuring out and kind of do uh a consultation, um, an initial, you know, discovery call, if you will. And figuring out, okay, where where does the issues lie? Is it attracting? Is it hiring? Is it retaining your your people? Where is your people problem? So um doing a quick assessment of that, you know, then uh what I do for companies is that official hiring audit. So discovery call is complimentary, of course. Um, and then I do offer um a hiring audit that I'm coming in, I'm having more conversations with um stakeholders, with leaders, really diving in and figuring out where the problem is. If I'm able to, um I prefer coming on site so then I can just observe and see what's going on. Um and then be able to write out a um a detailed report and give that report to the business owner and let them know, hey, this is what's going on. And then here's how we can fix it, you know, if you want to continue this this relationship. So the hiring audit is, you know, yes, it's you know, you have to pay for that. Um that's a lot, it's it's a lot of work. Um, you know, but then you actually, if you don't want to continue and you just want to kind of do things on your own, you've got a a blueprint where, okay, here's the problems. Let me see if I can fix it, you know. But 10 times out of 10, you know, they'll call me and say, okay, I tried to fix it, I can't. You're the expert. Please help. And I'm glad to.

Pedro Stein 15:54

So okay. Um, same scenario. I have some questions. Uh, the first one is like, well, the people problem, that's a complex one. And I'm picturing my head, I'm your ICP, and I'm like, I know I have a problem, Kristen. Okay, but I'm unsure in how to pinpoint. Like, I know there is a little uh some metrics there, like turnover, you know, and all that, whatever. But I'm like, I'm having a hard time to pinpoint exactly what's the problem, right? So what I would love for you to do is tell me like most common ones you see happening, like a blind spot, you know, that I'm not even aware that was there. Like if you have some like one or two examples, like something that happened, and you're like, oh my god, that was it.

Kirstin Purcell 16:44

Yep. So I uh recently was working with a client that had a lot of turnover in management. And so, you know, you if you've got management leaving, you know, what what are your other workers doing? What are your other employees doing? There's no stable leader, right? Um, so the owners are not, you know, there. They own other businesses, they're you know, they're not in their business day to day. That's what their managers, GMs, and every everybody's for, right? So um figuring out, okay, well, in short answer, you all don't have a leader. There's nobody running things from the top. So you've got people that don't fit the culture anymore, don't you know, uh believe in the mission of the business. So, and that's a problem. So my initial thought is okay, let's clean house. Let's clean house and start over. Because at this point, you know, you can't keep putting a band-aid on something. Like you've got to let's just let's just do it. Rip the band-aid off and let's just clean house and start from scratch. Hire your ideal um employee. And so that's that's what we did. That's what we did. So sometimes if you're an owner and you're not in your business day to day, you can't see that. You you see things are happening and there's problems, and you know, you can't keep people, or people stop showing up for work, or they just they call out a lot, or um, you know, it's it's turnover in in your management. It's how do I stop it? How do I what do I do? You know, because it's going so fast. And at the end of the day, um, you know, you're you're just trying to, you're you're drinking water out of a hose, pretty much, right? And you and you can't stick take a step back and really figure out, okay, what's step one? Like, what do I even do? You know, so you bring somebody in from the outside, it's very obvious to me what's going on. But it's hard if you're sitting in there day to day and trying to figure out what's going on. You don't think you're too close to it, right? So it's hard to see specifically and then come up with a plan because you're like, yeah, but this and but this and but this. It's like, hold on, step one. Go back to basics, like step one, you know. If it let's just clean house and start over. That's gonna, you know, it that's gonna be really hard, you know, but it'll be worth it.

Pedro Stein 19:16

Okay, okay. Bad Pedro steps in. That's my alias, okay. Uh, his like a difficult client, okay. So Bad Pedro is like telling you, hey Kristen, I know exactly what's the problem, need help. They are underperforming, whatever, okay? Problem. Insert problem, turnover, blah, blah, blah. You step in, and I'm like, yeah, you gotta fix this. Thank you. You're going there, and you're like realizing that Bad Pedro is actually the problem. It's leadership, right? But Bad Pedro just hired you, Kristen. Okay, here's the pain customer, paying client. It's like the team is the problem, but you realize I'm the problem. So, how to navigate first that conversation, right? I mean, I'm imagining that potentially happened because you're nodding, like, yes.

Kirstin Purcell 20:07

Oh, yes. I have I am literally please have a client in my mind that I am um that this happened.

Pedro Stein 20:13

Uh walk us through, I I would love to to to know how you you handle that type of situation.

Kirstin Purcell 20:20

So my discovery call um is very important. So usually I'm able to sift out issues, right? So bad Pedro, you and I are having a conversation. Typically, I'm gonna sift that out and decide not to work with you. Um if if you can't be, you know, if you're not open to listening to what I'm, you know, my expertise, right? So a lot of times the bad Pedros, you know, think they know everything. And if you're reaching out to me, great, that's step one. But are you going to implement what I'm gonna tell you? Right. So if they want to pay me to do an audit, fine. My report's not gonna change. You know, if if bad Pedro's the problem, I'm gonna tell you you're the problem. But hey, here's the solution, right? And that's all there's a whole way of saying it based on different personalities, right? So I'm gonna get to know you a little bit better and know maybe how to try to get through to you in a different way than you know, other people have tried, right? So that's kind of fun for me is figuring out how to really have you listen, not just hear me. Right. So um, so yeah, so either way, you know, I get paid and I'm gonna tell you in a really nice report that you're the problem.

Pedro Stein 21:43

And here's how we politely tell me, hey Pedro.

Kirstin Purcell 21:47

Yeah. Bad Pedro, you are the problem, sir.

Pedro Stein 21:50

So Oh my god, Bad Pedro, his time.

Kirstin Purcell 21:52

Um and then give, you know, and then figure out, you know, give them um give him implementation um on how to mitigate it. Here's how we can fix it. You know, that it's you want to be successful, you want your business to be successful. And and that's how you talk to business owners too. It's as as one myself, you want your company and your business to be successful. You don't want to close your doors. You don't want to have to, you know, file bankruptcy or whatever, right? So let's let's you you've reached out to me as the expert in this area. Let's let's fix your problem. Let's fix it. Right? Um, and so if they're open to that, um and I'm not not afraid of a little, you know, butting heads, you know, that's that's fine. Um because sometimes feedback is hard to hear. Um, you know, especially if you're completely blindsided by that you're the problem, you're blaming everyone else, you know, it's it gets a little tough, you know. I mean, I've I've had conversations you know, and it's really been eye-opening to some some individuals, um, you know, that really didn't realize that they were having such a negative impact on their own business. So but but then you have those clients, you know, that uh just don't care, you know, that's you're wrong, you know, it's it's never, you know, bad Pedro, it's never bad Pedro's fault, you know. And so usually if I sift that out in the discovery call and they still want to pay me for a report, sure fine, you're gonna pay me pretty much to tell you that you're the issue and here's here's how we can fix it if you want to move forward. But if not, then you know, you're gonna keep in this cycle. But but I do pick and choose who I work with.

Pedro Stein 23:37

Okay. Good. Now, appreciate the insight. Now you mentioned something uh that you pick and choose who you work with, uh, and you also pivoted when you left the uh that former job you had, and you you you like you went from part-time to full-time in your own business. And you mentioned mortgage, right? Paying bills and all that. So there is a a topic that I really like to talk with you just to get the mindset behind it. It's about pricing, but not necessarily hard numbers, okay, Kirsten. It's more about the mindset behind it. Like, for example, it's a for the coaching industry, I feel like it's very a self-worth path. And uh, you're trading your time for dollars and all that, what that entails. And sometimes I see a lot of coaches out there uh offering free work and they're not even uh landing that type of stuff because there's scarcity mindset, they're trying to just to you know, uh just to get some testimonials to get going, all that. So the pricing thing, I would love to understand how do you think about it today, you know, and what are any lessons along the way that shaped how you landed where you are, considering all the bills we have to pay, and now you you're selecting clients, right? That's a journey that I'm hearing. So please walk us through that.

Kirstin Purcell 24:58

Yeah, so initially, so one of the one of the biggest pieces of advice that I um heard was, you know, you cannot trade your time for money. So it's you're you can't put yourself your worth in an hourly component or you know, billing hourly or whatever, right? So because something that's gonna take me, I don't know, 30 minutes to do could take somebody else two hours, right? Like you're paying for my expertise. You're not paying for for that time. Um and so that's what I struggled with when I was doing pricing. What is worth my time? Right? What is worth my expertise? So shifting that mindset from oh, here's my hourly rate if you want me to recruit, or here's my hourly rate for consulting. No, it's here's a flat rate for what I'm gonna do, project based. Right. So taking the mindset away from the hourly and okay, well, but in your own mind, how you can figure out your pricing, you have a number in your own mind that you're like, okay, this is gonna be worth my time, right? But you don't share that number. So you figure out the kind of work you're gonna be doing, the kind of time that it's gonna take. If you have to do research, you know, what does that entail? And then you pick your flat rate and you say, This is my rate for for X, Y, Z of what I'm gonna do. This is my delivery, right? And typically, you know, they say always have a tiered um pricing. So have your, you know, cheaper um price, your middle, and then your expensive one, because typically people are gonna go with that middle, middle one, it's psychology or something. So um just like how you end your pricing in a seven or a nine, like psychology. It's some kind of, you know, people are more willing to buy from you if it's I don't know if you've heard that or not. That's you know, in some of these business podcasts um that I've listened to, people talk about that. But that was a big shift. Not doing it hourly, figuring out what is going to be worth my time flat rate. So am I coming in and doing workshops and and teaching? Am I um, you know, consulting and coming in and doing a huge, you know, overhaul of the whole hiring process? Um, you know, it just depends. So that's how I come up with my pricing.

Pedro Stein 27:25

Yeah, that's a classic one. Since we're talking about David Worse Prada Prada, it's just like that popcorn example, right? You have the small bucket, the middle bucket, and the huge one, and you're like, what's the best deal that I can come up with? You know, and it's never the small one, right?

Kirstin Purcell 27:41

Or at the at the movie, though, at the movie they had the um purse popcorn holder. So, like, just for Devil Wars Prada, right?

Pedro Stein 27:51

Oh my god, okay.

Kirstin Purcell 27:53

And you had that, right?

Pedro Stein 27:55

I did I didn't want the I mean in Brazil, I think they had this in Brazil, but I I didn't watch the movie that the two the the second movie, right? Yeah, I I I watched the first one. Oh, that the purse, you had to buy the purse, like I have to, right? Interesting. Okay.

Kirstin Purcell 28:13

Now it's the whole experience.

Pedro Stein 28:16

Yes. Wow. Uh love it. No, I I'm curious, um, shifting gears for a second, right? Talk about future a little bit, you know, where are you taking all this? Uh, looking ahead. Where do you see the business going?

Kirstin Purcell 28:30

So um I would love to branch out and offer um, you know, people that wanna that were in the same situation that I'm in, uh, you know, teach them, teach them how to do what I'm doing. Um, start their own business doing recruitment. Um, you know, there's there's a lot of money in recruiting, um, especially if you're doing it on your own. Uh so you know, helping new business owners figure out, you know, how to legitimize a business, come up with a name, you know. I mean, from step one, I I've been there, I've done it, you know, um, since 2019. It's, you know, and it and just give back in that sense to where, hey, you don't have to slowly die and stay in corporate recruitment. Now, if you want to and you have the stability and the insurance and all that, great. That would, you know, a stable paycheck would be wonderful. But for me, it's my freedom that I will never negotiate ever again. You know, being a business owner is hard. Um, I will never say that it's not, but you know, the opportunities that I I have because I have that flexibility, I'm able to spend more time with my kids who are three and five. Uh, you know, it works for me. Um, so if there's anybody out there that wants to start, you know, with that safety net like I did, um, and then work their way to being full-time in their business, I would love to be able to teach that and give back in that sense. So that's something that I'm um that I'm gonna do. And um would love to uh branch out a lot more nationally, uh, you know, because I feel like I can help help companies, you know, all over, all sizes. So you've got people in your companies, you've got employees, you've got people problems typically. So, you know, those are those would be my ideal clients. Um but yeah, and then continue to help the job seekers, you know, giving some advice. Um, you know, I do host workshops so I can virtually so I can reach more individuals, and um, I don't charge as much because it's virtual. Um, and plus if people are looking for a job, they're not gonna have a lot of expendable cash. So I want to, you know, have that in mind. So I will do that, or I'll actually do complimentary ones as well. Um, you know, I'll throw those in there maybe once a quarter or twice a year.

Pedro Stein 30:56

Hmm. I'm thinking about your entire journey, right? Well, how how does this make so much sense? No, no, about about the the the helping other uh people that went through exactly what you're you went through. I'm picturing if you didn't had your uh part-time business, I mean that that would be a problem, right? Because you were able to hit that on full gas and just take off, and now you're you're pretty much settled. But if you didn't have that, and you're I'm thinking, right, about how you're trying to serve past or potentially past Kirstins that didn't actually open chopped. And when uh they hit a pivot, what's next? You know, so I I love that. That's very interesting.

Kirstin Purcell 31:41

Yeah, and it's and I'm glad that I did that. Um, that's probably what actually got me laid off or fired. They probably figured that out. But um, I wasn't really hiding it that well. Um so I don't, you know, but I was I paid my car off, I paid some credit cards off, you know, while I had that safety net that was paying, you know, the house bills. Um, so it was great until all of a sudden, you know, bye-bye stability. Um, you know, and um and I had already, like you said, yes, it was a lot easier because I was already out in networking and you know, doing business development. So I had partners I could reach out to. Um, one in particular, I I call her my lifesaver, um, Megan. So she has a staffing agency and just so happened to get a big client that needed um recruitment consulting. And so it was perfect timing, right? And it just solidified this is what I'm supposed to do. Right. This is what I'm supposed to do. So that helped and carried me um for the first six months. So during that time, I was doing more business development, getting more clients. So then you have residual income coming in. And that's all it is. It's just, it's, it's a game. You know, you're you're kind of just you're going and you're going, um, networking and selling yourself and your expertise to the right people, getting introductions to the right people, getting in the right rooms. Um, I did a lot of of room wasting um when I was starting out, you know, but it's if you can kind of sift through all of that um and really fine-tune your ICP, then you figure out what room to be in and where where that ICP is sitting. Um, and so yeah, I mean, I will never say it was easy, but um, it did help me. Um, you know, because typically, um, I mean, you can make quite a bit of money. You're a corporate recruiter, you're getting a salary, right? But every position you fill in the recruitment world, the fee structure is typically on average about 20% of the first year's salary. That's the fee to finding a candidate. So for numbers' sake, if you're filling a position that's $100,000, 20% of that is $20,000. So someone is handing you $20,000 to find this position. To find this person. You find the person, here you go. Boom, $20,000. You know, so it I mean, and I know that sounds sounds nice, but you know, you've got to have the clients, of course. But I mean, it you can very easily make a pretty pretty comfortable living, you know, off of doing that. So I don't just do that, as I've explained, you know, I do a few other other things too. But but yeah, I would love to love to do that.

Pedro Stein 34:31

Okay. Now, first of all, shout out to Megan, right? A lifesaver. So yeah, there's the lifesaver. Now, whenever we're aiming towards something new, next chapter, always something we're refining, right, in the present. So, what are you currently trying to improve or tighten up in your business right now?

Kirstin Purcell 34:48

So um, I mentioned being in the right rooms. So that has taken me a long time to figure out because I have molded and transitioned and um really ironed down my ICP, right? So it started off as purely candidates, but you know, it has evolved into working directly with companies, doing recruitment, doing consulting, teaching them how to hire workshops, leadership. Um, I do an annual conference every year for leadership. And so, you know, it's just it's it's changed, it's adjusted. So I've had to adjust and figure out, okay, I need to pivot. And that's honestly what business owners do and entrepreneurs. You pivot. Something's not working, you know, you you go this direction. So that's not working, go this direction. Uh, what has been super helpful is figuring, is making connections with people that can introduce me to my ICP, to my people. So it's getting in the right room, right? It's not going and running around all these networking groups. I mean, you can network yourself right out of a business, right out of a company, right? Um, because you're not in the right room. That's not your client. That's not your paid client, right? So for me, if I'm in a room full of coaches, I'm gonna talk about my offer to, hey, let me teach you how to be me. Let me teach you how to, not me per se, but what I've done, because I've done it. I have the blueprint for it, right? But if I'm in a room full of um companies, that's what I'm gonna talk about, right? I'm not gonna go into, oh, I do yada yada yada yada coaching and candidates and resumes. No, no. You gotta be specific and know your audience, but be in the room that you want to do. So, like I'm not typically in the rooms with candidates and coaches as much as with companies because you've got to figure out what makes the most sense. You know, this is your business, your livelihood at the end of the day. Where are you gonna get the most, you know, bang for your buck?

Pedro Stein 36:59

Interesting. Okay. Now let's get it a little bit on a sci-fi territory real quick. Okay. Let's pretend we have a time machine in front of us, and uh, we have one stop. You're gonna be able to pick that stop. Okay. Either it's when you started the business, when you had your job, or it's when you pivoted and you left corporate and you you went full time. So two options. And uh I want you to go back in time, considering we you have that possibility, to give yourself one piece of business advice. You wish you knew when you started, okay? That you know now. Why would that be?

Kirstin Purcell 37:42

That's hard. That's hard because each piece of my journey has taught me something. So I don't necessarily want to take any of those pieces away because I feel like it's part of the journey. You've kind of you gotta put your time in to get to your destination. Right. So I don't I don't I don't know if I if I would, to be honest. The only thing really sticking out to me is figuring out the uh main offer, which you know is coming into companies, teaching them how to hire better and how to keep their employees, right? So working um with companies and businesses, refining that sooner, maybe. Um, refining my offer to come in and do the audit and then provide packages on if you want to continue the relationship, here's you know, here's where we can go from here. But like I said, everything has taught me every step has taught me something, either about myself or about business. I'm constantly learning. So that's what's it's hard for me to to have that ability to do that because if I give myself that piece of advice, is that gonna hinder me from learning something else along the way?

Pedro Stein 39:04

It's almost I'm picturing you going back in time, giving the piece of advice, and you're like, nope, I want to figure it out. I need to go through the journey, right?

Kirstin Purcell 39:13

The hard way, right? Figure it out the hard way. And I just think the lessons are in what's hard. You know, if everything was easy, it wouldn't be worth it, right? Like you gotta go through the ebbs and flows in order to make it worth worth your while.

Pedro Stein 39:30

Yeah, it's like when we were driving, right? We never remember the the green lights, it's always the red ones and we stopped. Right. It's like we just take for granted, oh, it landed, great, next, and then you have a problem or an obstacle or whatever, a challenge. You're like, oh, yeah, that was part of my story, right? It's something like that.

Kirstin Purcell 39:48

Yeah.

Pedro Stein 39:49

Okay, love that. Now, if someone listening wants to connect with you or follow your work, okay, Kirsten, where can people find you and connect with you? And by the way, we're gonna have all the links in the description, but the best way to find you for those who are listening.

Kirstin Purcell 40:04

The email reach out to me directly. Um, my email is my first initial, which is a K, and then my last name, Purcell P-U-R-C-E-L-L at handshakeinheals.com.

Pedro Stein 40:19

Okay. You know, there were certain parts of this conversation that really stood down to me. Let's go back to the origin story. I love the fact that you mentioned that you were not prepared, uh, even though you had your business as a part-time basis, but being open about your own struggles, right? Uh being open about the and owning your story. Like you're not trying to to pretend you're someone here you're not. I was like trust trying to figure out stuff. I love that. Uh the vulnerability piece. I think it's very important for a coach. Okay. That's one. Um, also, I'm a kind of a crystal bro true, too. So when you mention everything happens for a reason, it I felt like a sign. Sometimes I feel like that too, right? Sometimes it's almost like the universe is pushing us into do something. You can call it whatever, you can call it fate, you can call it like, you know, it's just something that needs to happen, and we're pushed into doing that. Okay. So uh I'm right there with you.

Kirstin Purcell 41:21

Exactly. You're supposed to be doing this, so I'm gonna pull the rug out from under you and force you to do it sooner than you're ready, and fig and you're you're just gonna figure it out.

Pedro Stein 41:30

Exactly.

Kirstin Purcell 41:31

I did. Still figuring it out, you know. I will figure out what's going on.

Pedro Stein 41:35

We all are we all are. Nobody's perfect. That's the the thing, right? Um now moving forward. Uh, also when you sniffed out uh bad pager in the discovery call, right? Um so interesting because uh it always goes back to me. I'm a coach too, right? So it always goes back to me on uh distant language. Whenever someone's like, they are doing this, they have a problem. You're the leader, it's your problem, okay? You're the one that that needs to handle it. So not owning, I think that the language is something that really tells, at least on my experience, is like when people are like not just being a know it all, but like it's not their problem. It feels like they're not having that problem, it's someone else's. So there's that. Uh, and uh last but not least, I would say the hourly uh component you mentioned. I did that too, you know, and that like I was treating at what I was being treated as a commodity, you know, like they're comparing my fees to cleaning lady, dentist, lawyer, whatever makes no sense at the end of the day. And always it always uh made me feel weird inside in in certain aspects, which was, for example, if I spend 10 minutes more with them, oh, should I charge them more? Or if I wrap it up early, am I owing them 10 minutes? You know, it gets weird because the transformation doesn't happen in this when the clock hits the 60-minute mark, at least on my perspective, right? Yeah, so this was just my long-winded way of saying, Kirsten, that I appreciate what you do and I appreciate you being here and sharing so openly today. It was great having you.

Kirstin Purcell 43:20

Thank you so much for having me. It was a lot of fun.

Davis Nguyen 43:23

That's it for this episode. This episode, as well as this podcast, was brought to you by Purple Circle, where we help business owners elevate their business through six, seven, and eight-figured years, all without burning out. If you're looking to grow your business, as well as get the time freedom that you are looking for, visit us at join purplecircle.com and see what we can do to help you and your business.