Milk & Honeys
Milk & Honeys" is the perfect blend of raw industry insights and unfiltered realness. Like the ingredients that sweeten and smooth out a cup of tea, hosts Kayla Becker (TV host of 10 years) and Vanessa Curry (model and actress of 10 years) bring their own flavors to the conversation— Together, they spill the tea on what it really takes to live and thrive in LA’s entertainment scene.
So, grab a mug and sip on some Milk & Honeys—because we’re serving the tea with all the right ingredients.
Milk & Honeys
Episode 14: Healing Through Loss: Moving Beyond Grief
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Grief arrives in countless forms—sometimes through death, other times through separation, and often through the quiet evolution of our own identities. In this vulnerable conversation, Vanessa opens up about losing her father suddenly at 19, while Kayla shares her experience of being torn from her mother at age 9 when her mom went to prison.
The raw emotion is palpable as Vanessa recalls walking into her childhood home after her father's passing and feeling that unmistakable "cold breeze" of absence. She shares beautiful memories of her quiet, kind father who always made her mom's morning coffee and taught her the value of truly listening to others. Meanwhile, Kayla recounts the confusion and heartbreak of being placed in foster care without understanding why, screaming for her mother through the windows of a van as they were driven away.
Both hosts explore how these profound losses shaped their adult relationships and perspectives. Vanessa wonders how different her romantic relationships might have been with her father's protective guidance, while Kayla reveals how foster care taught her to build emotional walls that she's still working to dismantle in therapy. They share the uncomfortable truth that grief doesn't simply fade with time—it becomes part of who we are, appearing in unexpected waves throughout our lives.
Perhaps most valuable is their discussion about what not to say to someone who's grieving. Phrases like "time heals all wounds," "they'd want you to be strong," or commenting on someone's funeral attire (yes, this actually happened to Vanessa) miss the mark entirely. Instead, they suggest simple presence, practical support, and the freedom to express grief without timeline or expectation.
Listen in as we explore how loss, in all its forms, becomes absorbed into our story—not as an ending, but as an ongoing conversation with our past, present, and future selves. And if you're grieving anything right now, we see you and we've got you.
Episode Introduction: Talking About Loss
Speaker 1All right, everyone, welcome back to the show. Today's episode is a little more personal. We're talking about loss, not just the kind that only comes from death, but the kind that reshapes our world. Today, I am going to be opening up about losing my dad, and we are your hosts.
Speaker 2I'm Vanessa Curry and the lovely I'm Kayla Becker and, yeah, we're talking about loss, but not only just through through death. I'm going to talk about what it felt like to suddenly lose my mom again not to death, but to the prison system.
Speaker 1So, and you know, this isn't just a sad girl episode. It's about grief, growth and everything no one really teaches us about letting go.
Speaker 2So hopefully, something that we talk about today resonates with you in some way, because I think, no matter what the kind of loss, everybody knows what that feels like. So the way we're gonna do this episode is I'm gonna start out and kind of interviewing Vanessa here and letting her share her story, and then she's gonna do the same for me after that. So bear with us. Again, this could be a little hard stuff to talk about, but one of the first times that you and I got together in your kitchen, you and I really opened up about these parts of our lives and I think that was one of those defining moments of, like our friendship and just when you meet people who understand, like, the gravity of those emotions and feelings and experiences, like it means a lot and goes a long way.
Speaker 1So, yeah, I appreciate you opening up on on the show, same you too I'm proud of us because, like, like you said, we this was one of the first conversations we kind of had as a friendship. I think that had a lot of depth to it and it's taken us 14 episodes to let you guys in on it, because it is vulnerable and it's deep and it could be dark. But also, I think the good thing is that both of us have been able to navigate the experiences that we've been through. So, yeah, yeah, all right.
Speaker 2You ready.
Speaker 1I'm nervous.
Speaker 2I know I'm like I just got hot.
Speaker 1Me too, I should not have put on a sweater.
Speaker 2I was like, maybe this is like my comfort sweater, but now I'm sweating. Okay, well, we'll go ahead and get things off, kick things off. Okay, well, we'll go ahead and get things off, kick things off. So you know the loss of your dad. Can you take us back to the day or the moment that it hit you, that you know your dad was gone, not just physically and emotionally, but permanently. He was gone.
Speaker 1Dad passed away in 09. It was super sudden. It was a ruptured aorta, so it's kind of as if the doctors told us the London Bridge collapsing and there's no real way to fix that right away. So it was a very, very sudden loss. I happened to be in New York at the time. I was like living my dream life. At the time, I was dancing for Leighton Meester, a good friend of mine, a dear, dear friend, and she was doing pop music, and so I was not even in Los Angeles at the time, I was in New York when it happened.
Speaker 1So it definitely didn't feel real then. Even I couldn't really process, I think. I just had emotions. And then you just kind of feel empty and not until I got home, which was, I think, maybe two days after, I was able to hop on a flight and go home and walking into the house and just not having him there Because he was retired, so he was always home. You know, having him there because he was retired, so he was always home, you could already feel there was just a cold breeze that was going in there and it was very weird. And my mom is how she processed things is she needs to get rid of everything right away. So she already had gone through, even like the next day, like the closet to just kind of clear stuff out Cause for her it's that's, I think, part of her healing process. Um, so, yeah, so just going into their bedroom and seeing the closet kind of half empty was weird, yeah, just strange.
Speaker 2What was he? I'm so sad I was never able to meet the man who had a hand in raising you because you've turned out so incredible, I know. Thank you. He's so proud of you.
Speaker 1But what was he like? He was so quiet, which is funny, because my mom jokes about my boyfriend now Like he's just like very quiet and I am the loud one, obviously. So it's funny because my boyfriend now does sort of resemble my dad in some ways. There's like an interesting parallel there. But he was so kind and very reserved, very easygoing.
Speaker 1He never really raised his voice unless he was watching ESPN or Bill O'Reilly, because that's what he watched on television. He's like screaming at the news or like screaming at sports or something. But other than that he was always the guy that was just like sitting at the table with his screwdriver in hand and just absorbing or, I'm sorry, not absorbing analyzing just what's going on in the room. Where it's funny because some people would always ask him are you having a good time? Like is he okay, and he always was like yeah, no, I'm just here Like listen to the conversation. So, yeah, so he was just like fun too. You know he did sports with us. He took us bike riding, he was a provider, he was just a really kind and great person.
Speaker 2Well, a lot of the traits you just mentioned are opposite of you. Like you said, quiet versus loud. What do you think you did take any part of him, like in your personality or even?
Speaker 1I definitely took his kindness and always wanting to help. You know, he adopted two of my cousins three of my cousins actually on my mom's side, total, you know and those were not his kids, they were not his bloodline, but they knew that this is what needed to be done in order to make sure that these kids have a good life. And that, to me, is very difficult and very hard and I think I took that from him. Also, he would never yell at me. He would always sit me down and say what's going on, let's talk about this, and I think I got that from him being able to communicate because he really was so quiet, but in those moments my mom would kind of give me silent treatment and I would have to come to her and, you know, be like hey.
Vanessa's Story: Losing Her Father
Speaker 1I'm sorry, Like let's talk, but my dad would come to me. Oh, that's great. So I think that's where I do get my. I try to see things from all different sides and try to have a conversation with somebody and yeah, it's a great thing to have inherited.
Speaker 2I hope that's what I took from him.
Speaker 1I hope people feel that way about me.
Speaker 2You are that way very much, because I do try to be that person.
Speaker 1So I think that's what he gave me and his love for Halloween, because he was obsessed with Halloween. That was his favorite holiday. He would always dress up and he was just like he would be so happy in his costume.
Speaker 2Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1He would have loved each other.
Speaker 2That part too. He would have loved each other. Yes, oh well, you know, grief is. It's a funny thing and everyone grieves differently. And then people on the other side of grief who are trying to comfort those grieving. Sometimes they don't know what to do. And sometimes they do things that can make it worse, make it better. Well, you know what are some. You know things that you wish people had done or not done while you were dealing with the loss of your dad.
Speaker 1I think I had such a great troop around me and my family that I don't really think anybody did anything that I was upset about. I will say this going to the funeral, because I was coming from New York, I did not have really like things to wear for a funeral. I just kind of like grabbed what I had with me at the time and like I'm not going to go shopping for the funeral, you know what I mean. There's way more important things to deal with. So I had a little black dress. I put like black tights within. I remember I had these like pink and black, you know, little heel, like Mary Jane shoes, and one of my sister's friends said something about my outfit and I almost lost it on. Her Like said something negative, Like something negative. I don't necessarily remember what it was, but she said something about my outfit and I wanted to be like bitch, are you?
Speaker 2seriously talking to me about my outfit right now, and I'll never forget that Was this at the funeral.
Speaker 1This was at the funeral. She would have been quickly excused from the funeral. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, and I'm just like again. I removed myself from that situation. I did not say anything to her, I just kind of looked at her and I remember. Oh what kind of yeah, so that never talk about someone's outfit at a funeral.
Speaker 2That's the last thing we're talking about, unless it's just like you look beautiful, right.
Speaker 1Right? No, it was not that I remember. But thank you. But I will say one of the things. My best friend was sleeping with me. For a couple of days, like afterwards. She stayed with me and slept with me at my room and I remember this was maybe a week or two after the fact. She had told me that my dad came into the dream of her dream when she was asleep that night of the funeral.
Speaker 2Oh, wow.
Speaker 1And to tell me that he was okay. And she was so scared to tell me because she didn't want to, like, hurt my feelings. She didn't know if I was there yet to be able to process that information, and so, for her, she kept that from me, for you know, a little while, and I wish she would have just told me but, it's not. That's nothing against her.
Speaker 1Of course you know she was trying to protect me and she didn't want to hurt my feelings and again like trigger anything because I was very very I mean, you know I was 19 at the time, I was like very young, so yeah. So I don't think like anything. Anybody did anything wrong, necessarily. And again, people go through grief differently.
Speaker 1so I don't think there's a right way to tell somebody I'm sorry for your loss yeah um, but yeah, I mean like there are things I feel like that people can say that should never be said in a time of grief.
Speaker 2Like commenting on someone's outfit. That's still wild to me. Yes, so you have your sister and you guys are close.
Speaker 1Very.
Speaker 2And, like I said, you were young. What's your sister? Your age difference? Nine years. Okay, so she was quite a bit older than you when it all happened, but at the same time, like being a woman young woman or you know a little bit older losing young woman or you know a little bit older, losing a father that just really like affects you, will throw your entire life for a loop, because having a father is so important as a woman, like what even, like you know, imagining like your wedding day and stuff like that. Like how is that kind of you know, how have you processed realizing that he won't be there for some of these huge moments in your life?
Speaker 1Yeah, no, that has been the hardest part.
Speaker 1I remember the first thing my sister said to me was damn, he's not going to be here for my wedding. You know, just going through that process and realizing this person is physically never going to be able to touch you ever again, to hold your hand, to give you a pat on the back, to give you a hug, to give you a kiss on the cheek, and that's been really hard. It's still till this day. It's hard for me to go to a wedding and see a father-daughter dance, see the bride get to walk down the aisle with her dad. It's always going to be hard.
Speaker 1Obviously, I still love watching it and it makes me so happy just that they get to experience that. But yeah, I mean I think it is something where I decided that like maybe a wedding wasn't really that big of a deal to me because he wasn't going to be there, which I know that's not the healthiest way to feel that way, but I not the healthiest way to feel that way. But that's just the truth. Not to say that I will never get married I would, but I do remember I had a very stale taste in my mouth about that specific topic, or just like what, if I get pregnant one day, he will never be there to be able to hold my baby or just play with them or have go bike riding or dress them up for Halloween. You know things like that. So, um, yeah, it's, it does change your perspective on certain big life events.
Speaker 2When do you think you know how, how long I guess did it take after he passed where you felt like you can kind of catch your breath? I mean, I imagine the first part of it, you probably were grieving, crying every day. You know how long did it take for you to be like okay, you know, I don't think that ever goes away, it just spreads out, yeah so.
Speaker 1So obviously the first I'd say year is I mean, little things can trigger anything, right, but I do think now it just it's a little bit more space when I have those moments. But I still have those moments For his birthday. His birthday is September 13th, but he passed September 11th. Oh, wow.
Speaker 1So just having those big moments so close together, I think has always been really hard. You know, it's like we're celebrating his death and then we're also trying to celebrate, you know, his, his, his life, and it's a tricky situation because you have so many emotions.
Speaker 2How do you all handle that?
Speaker 1we. I always have a screwdriver of vodka, vodka, orange juice for him.
Speaker 2I love that. He was a screwdriver man. Yes, he was a screwdriver man.
Speaker 1So I always have a screwdriver for him and I either have, you know, my best friends come with me, or there's been a couple years where I went home and so I was with my family and we would have like dinner together and just celebrate him, singing him happy birthday. But, yeah, I think also just allowing myself to cry because it is sad. You know, it's like I lost him at such a pivotal life in my I mean a pivotal moment in my life that I could have used him. I don't think I would have been in certain relationships for that long if he was around.
Speaker 1And I can't not blaming him, okay, dad, but like you know, I thought you're a dad when a man's treating you poorly yes, would have been that voice of reason, like like a father would, and so I can, which is crazy because, like, my dad treated my mom like a freaking queen, like he made her oatmeal in the morning and a piece of toast and would bring it to bed like or not, I'm sorry. The oatmeal would be on the morning and a piece of toast and would bring it to bed Like or not, I'm sorry. The oatmeal would be on the counter with the piece of bread and a little like you know plastic bag and then she would, he'd bring her coffee to her every single morning and you know just, he cooked for us, he, he did the dishes. You know, like he he was just, he always wanted to to make things easier for her, was just, he always wanted to to make things easier for her. So it is sad when I think back and I'm like, wow, these men were making things so much harder for me and I almost forgot that.
Speaker 1Oh wait, no, this is not what I was raised with. Like, this is, this is. I didn't even have an example. I'm like starting this example, my own trauma now, and it has nothing to do with, like, even where I came from. Because, like, my parents were super easygoing. They never really fought, they never really like yelled at each other. Yeah, so it's just like it's one of those things he probably would have definitely, like, set his foot down and talked to me and said, hey, look, what's going on. Yeah, you know, like, and I just didn't have that. So that is. That's something that, like, I do struggle with a lot thinking about the past.
Speaker 2Well, and you know, for who's watching you make all of these, these choices, and I don't think any would be considered mistakes. But, like you know, just learning and lessons, and for seeing you now with I mean, from what I know about your current boyfriend he seems to be more on par with someone your dad would probably approve of. How do you think they would get along?
Speaker 2Oh my gosh, I mean clearly, because your boyfriend is so quiet. If your dad's quiet, I imagine them just sitting there watching ESPN, just like huh, yeah, See that. No, but see them watching ESPN together.
Speaker 1they would get like probably riled up and they'd be like yelling and clapping and I know Ozzy would take him to you know the Niner game and put him on the field.
Speaker 2And my dad would probably just be like elated just to like elated, I'll go with it. Yeah, she was going to go with it.
Speaker 1But I was like that doesn't sound right Elated, you know it's like and I feel like they would be able just to chill with each other, though, too, and have a beer. You know what I mean. So I it sucks. I wish that he could have met him and it is something that Ozzy and I have in common, because he lost his dad.
Speaker 1a few years ago too, so I never got to meet his father either. His dad a few years ago too, so I never got to meet his father either. So it is something we both talk about and grieve together sometimes, and I think we both have an understanding that the waves come whenever they want. I could be hiking and all of a sudden I'm crying because I miss him, but then I'm fine, I'll go get some coffee and I'm like okay, cool, Thanks for letting me shed those tears, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2Well, you mentioned some traits that you took from him earlier, like your kindness and you're wanting to give and talk to people and have conversations. What are some other parts of him that live on in you?
Speaker 1Probably his short temper, do you have? A short temper. I don't with people and he didn't with people, but he did with, say, technology. Oh okay, like my dad, when he uh retired, he loved to, which is like so illegal but like he loves to burn DVDs. Oh, I was a big DVD burner. He would go to Blockbusterbuster, and if you don't know what blockbuster is, then you're too young to be watching this.
Speaker 1but he would go to blockbuster, get every single movie that he loved or I loved and he would burn it on a cd for me and then send it to la and because, like that's what we watched, I love that. I had a whole deck of just like black DVDs and my roommates and I we made little name tags so we knew which DVD was which. But yeah, he would go and get like black cases and put them in for us. But he would get so frustrated sometimes if something didn't work.
Speaker 2He'd be like oh shit, like you know, like no, no, no.
Speaker 1And I do that too, like I get frustrated if something's not working or my liner isn't like matching. I'm like what the fuck, I just want to like throw the pen out. I'm like breathe, you're like dad, yeah. So I definitely took his short temper when it came to if something's not like working out, but he didn't have a short temper around people, which is very interesting, because I don't either you know. So, yeah, yeah, I don't either you know. So yeah, yeah, his short temper. I'm sorry, dad.
Speaker 2That's understandable, though Understandable. Listen, that was Bernie's diss could have been. I did that in college and it was always an issue.
Speaker 1Yeah.
Speaker 2If there was one thing that you could say to him, like right now, I'm sure you'd still talk to him. But there's something that you could say to him now. What would it be?
Speaker 1Oh man, oh man, there's so many things, uh, that rushed to my mind, um, but I would just I just would want to hear him say I love you.
Speaker 1And I'd want to say I love you. And then I just would want to hear him be like hey, babe, because, like that's how he talked he always had this like southern swing, he's from louisiana, like baton rouge, louisiana, you know. So he would always just be like hey, babe, like how's it going, you know? And yeah, it's like I wish I had this voicemail that I wish I could have kept for so long because it has his voice on it. But I still, like I can replay it, you know. But yeah, I just want to say I love you, that's all. Just to hear those words, you know, of course, but that's it, that's it. That's all I would love to hear. Well, I'm sure he's saying it to you.
Speaker 1Every day I see a white butterfly. I think of him and I know it's him. I was hiking the first weekend I got back from his funeral and my friend and I were hiking and this white butterfly was just following us on Runyon the whole time. When we got to the very top, it's like the butterfly landed on my shoe. Like what butterflies do that? Like butterflies don't do that.
Speaker 2No, they don't. I'm like you're the one chasing them. Butterflies, do that Like butterflies don't do that.
Speaker 1No, they don't. I'm like you're not chasing them. Yeah, exactly. So you know, I just anytime I see nature, and I think that's why I love being in nature so much, because I just I feel, him so, so deeply, and yeah, you know so, they're always with us and that is one thing I always want to tell people about grief.
Speaker 1It's like let it out, cry it out, it's okay, and when you're ready for them to come in and show themselves to you, oh man, it's such a beautiful experience and it's so lovely and it's so nice. And, of course, it's kind of scary because we're like wait, but they're gone. Well, they're not gone. Gone, they're just in a different realm. You know, they're just. It's just a couple layers between us and them, you know, um, so yeah, like once you're ready, if you've gone through a loss like this, ask them to come in, because they, they will, they're waiting, but they're, but they won't. I don't think spirit guides will come in unless you give them the green light.
Speaker 2They, yeah, they won't push their way in. They don't want to scare us.
Speaker 1They just when you're ready, they're ready and I promise that yeah.
Speaker 2Well, thank you for sharing. Yeah, thanks for woo. That means Let me fix my makeup. Yeah, I'm like I haven't.
Speaker 1I didn't know, I talk about him all the time and never cry. I don't know, maybe it's just a, maybe he's listening right now.
Speaker 1Yeah, he's listening and he's like, okay, you know, no, but you know there's losses that don't involve death. Yeah, but still feel like grieving and you know how about? Let's talk about what it felt like when you lost your mom because she went to prison. I know that that must have been a huge, crazy moment in your life. I mean, how old were you and what did you feel in that moment? Did you even know what was going on in that moment?
Speaker 2Yeah, so I was like nine. So years leading up to that there was a lot of like issues in my life. I lived with my biological mom and my three siblings. There was typically always a different man in and out of the house because she was a serial dater. I think she was just trying to find a man to help provide because she couldn't provide for all of us by herself. So I can understand. And, funny enough, when she had me she had to go. She was in and out of jail then too. So she literally gave birth to me and had to hand me off to a friend to take care of me until she got out of prison then. So it's kind of always kind of been like that. But then she stayed out of jail pretty much until I was nine years old. And then, um, and I knew things were rough. But I thought you know, we're a family, we're always gonna make it and get, you know, stay together.
Speaker 2Never in my like my wildest dreams did I assume that we'd all be separated.
Speaker 2And there was one day I was playing nintendo 64 with my little sister for two years apart. We're just in our bedroom playing and my mom comes and like just leans on the doorway and just is looking at us, just kind of looking at us, like this weird look on her face, and uh, she just stood there for a while and I was like mom, what's, what's going on? And she just looks like, right there she goes y'all can't live with me anymore. And I was like okay, mom, like back to playing video games. She's like no, I'm serious, like you can't live with me anymore. And I was like I at that age I'm like what is she talking? Like what? And then that's when I soon found out we actually went to the living room and she popped in this vcr or this tape in the vcr, and it was like this is where you're gonna live now and it looked like a summer camp I'm like, so I thought she was telling us we're gonna go to summer camp for a few weeks.
Speaker 2I wasn't even thinking like a foster.
Speaker 1You had no idea. I had no idea, it was happening.
Speaker 2And then, yeah, literally like I don't know how much longer it was after that, we I think that's when I went on my first airplane we flew to Atlanta, georgia, me and my little sister and my mom. My two other siblings were older, so they didn't, they were already aged out of foster care and I still I still, at this point, flying to Atlanta, I still wasn't completely sure what was happening. I didn't have a lot of belongings I feel like I had trash bags full of stuff that I had like taken with me. And, um, we get to my grandmother's house, who lives in Atlanta, and then the next day we drive to this big building and it was like the biggest building I'd ever seen and it was the head the Chick-fil-A headquarters, funny enough. And I guess it was the head the chick-fil-a headquarters, funny enough.
Speaker 2And I guess I had, like this long lost step aunt who worked for the founder chick-fil-a truett kathy at the time and truett kathy, for those who don't know, has like 12 foster homes in the southeast of america where he like hires parents to be parents and then places children who need homes. So, anyway, met these strange people. Still wasn't registering me what was about to happen. I'm like we're just meeting these people, whatever. And then the time came for us to load up in the car with these strangers I didn't, I didn't know their names and I'm like my mom is just crying. I'm like what's going on, mom, like what, what's happening? I just remember I was holding on to her.
Speaker 2She goes you have to go with them. You can't come back with me. I'm like what are you talking about? Like we're going back home, like what are you talking about? She's like no, you have to go with them. And I remember I think they were like peeling me and erica like off, like just crying because like we don't know what's happening, like what right?
Speaker 2this is the only person, our only parent and then we get put into this van and it was like, literally I can still see it to this day like the van and everything, and like we're like screaming, crying, crying, and like our hands are on the windows like screaming for our mom and, as we just see her, like it's smaller and smaller in distance and none of us had. We still didn't know why.
Speaker 2Yeah, and so the only thing we thought at the time was like, are we never going to see our mom again? And what did we do wrong? Because we just weren't given any explanation, and so it was literally that quick to where we on, or when I was, I think I just assumed, oh, mom's going to come pick me up in a few days, of course, just kept telling myself that every day. And then the day I realized I was never, I wasn't going to see her again was my foster parents had pulled me and my little sister into their room and like, hey, we have a letter for you. And I'm like, oh my God, mom wrote us. Like she wrote us. So why is she writing us and not calling us? But okay, and so like we read the letter and I don't remember what it said, but I was like okay, well, she's going to come back and get us and my foster parents. They started crying. They're like you got to turn the envelope over. And I was like what?
What People Say Wrong During Grief
Speaker 2So we turned the envelope over and there's a big prison stamp, because that's what prisons do when they send out mail and that's when get to see her anymore. At that moment I was like it felt like my heart was ripped out. Like what? Like, how does? A girl, a little nine-year-old process this like I'm never gonna see my I never thought I was saying goodbye to her and I'm like I don't know how I'm saying goodbye to her. So, yeah, that was.
Speaker 1I'm sorry that you had to go through that. That is never something a nine-year-old should go through. How old was your sister?
Speaker 2She was six, so you're trying to be the older sister I was what like, even like growing up with my real mom, like she was never, she was never there, she was working so much or doing whatever. So I was kind of helping raise my little sister and I was little like I would walk.
Speaker 2We had to walk to school every day, a mile each way, so I would walk her, get up, get her up, get her dressed, walk her a mile. The teachers knew that my mom was absent so her teachers would come up to me to tell me her homework assignments when I was eight, nine years old. I would cook her breakfast Like she was, like I took care of her.
Speaker 2And so I became a mom at nine, and so me trying to explain to her now, like we're not, we're not, she's not coming back. That was even worse.
Speaker 1Cause I could like handle myself like I felt so right up, but like seeing her. Yeah. How do you think the absence of your mom affected you emotionally, like physically, or?
Speaker 2even in weird ways that you didn't expect. I mean, I feel like I still deal with issues like I still deal with, like you know, the feeling of like rejection. Or I think I you never stop feeling like, even though I know my heart like it rejection. Or because I think I you never stop feeling like, even though I know my heart like it wasn't because she didn't want me right, that feeling still never goes away because I just I don't know how to get it go.
Speaker 2It just it's true when your parent doesn't keep you anymore, for whatever reason. You feel like this overwhelming sense of just rejection. And then, um, and then, even when she got out of prison, like four, three, four, five years later, we still couldn't go back like it was, like I still never got my mom again. And then, like the kids and um, school would like bully me. And there was this one girl. I'll never forget her. She was such a bitch, I hope the worst thing that happened to her since then diarrhea forever. She came up to me. I was new and scared and like she came to me, goes hey, new, when's the last time you've seen your mama, you orphan? My first thought was, like you're a fucking idiot. Orphans mean my parents are dead. She's not dead.
Speaker 1Of course, I think I said something like that. Of course, kayla came back with a quick response. Learn your vocabulary words.
Speaker 2Get a dictionary, you stupid idiot. But it really freaking. Freaking if it hurt me. And then um, and then just going through like normal things that girls go through, like like being on your period for the first time I mean like your mom's supposed to be there for that to help you how to navigate that or like liking boys and like you know weird things that would happen in the foster home but like no one would understand.
Speaker 2But my mom and even like I, was the only kid of color, so my mom had three white kids and then me, a mix black, and then I moved to a foster family where everyone was white, so no one knew how to do my hair, but my mom had like learned over the years how to kind of manage my hair. So then I'm in this new foster home where, like this poor new white lady has no idea what to do with my hair. I'm going to school looking crazy every day and I'm getting bullied and I'm crying and just like I just felt so like helpless because hopeless, because I didn't have my mom there anymore, just to like hold my hand and help me through through those things oh okay.
Speaker 1So did you ever let yourself grieve that? Or were you not allowed to? Because I know, you know it's a, you're in a foster home now with other foster kids. Right, it wasn't just you.
Speaker 2Yeah, there was like another like eight kids there, so a bunch of us. I don't think you know it's funny, you just get thrown into it so quickly and and it's like I would definitely cry myself to sleep and me and Erica shared a room so we'd like cry together. But it's like one of those like unspoken things to this day that like the foster kids don't really do. It's like you get ripped awayall should call us mom and dad, because we need everyone in the family to be calling us mom and dad to have like a unit.
Speaker 1You know, and I'm like and how did that make you feel, harry? I'm like what? Did you call them mom and dad?
Speaker 2Eventually I did. I think I called because dad was weird for me, because I've never had a dad, I've never called anybody dad in my life and I was deathly afraid of men up to that point because before that I was like you know every man that came in my life was abusive. So and he's my foster dad, he's an amazing man. We get along great, we have a great relationship, but he's like a six foot four massive, like just. He is a big, scary man.
Speaker 1Loud voice to a nine year old.
Speaker 2So like it took me a little bit longer to like call him dad and they were patient. It wasn't like call me mom and dad right now. Right, just like. Hey, we'd like for you to maybe call us that. And then, and then my foster mom. I was way more resistant to her. Like I remember, one time I said some mean stuff to her Like I was so again, I was so against somebody else trying to be my mom. So my mom is coming back.
Speaker 1Right, I was just so against. Yeah, you're angry and your mom, like we said, was not dead. She didn't pass away, she was still alive. You knew she was on this earth and you're like I cannot wrap my head around why I'm not with her. Um, you know, it's like what helped you get through that time period, even if it was like messy or imperfect, like how did you survive? Kind of having to sort of be okay with that being the outcome.
Speaker 2Um, I think, I think, I think when I had to actually realize that she was never coming back I mean, it's probably after she got out of prison, because the first time I actually got to see her so she got out of prison and we got to meet her in a public park and we were like walking and she was about to tell me this Like I won't get too deep into it, but like that's actually when I saw like a bloody immersing a bloody tampon, like in this park.
Speaker 2And I was like a bloody immersing a bloody tampon, like in this park, and I was like, instead of being grossed out, I got sad because I was, like that had my period, I just started my period and she wasn't there for that. It was like one of those moments. But it was this big moment she was going to finally share with me, like who my biological father was, and I can go into that different episode. And then, sitting there, I'm like thinking, hoping she's going to say well, you can come back, I can come back. And it was like no, like I'm going to be finishing out my childhood with this other family. She can't take us back.
Speaker 2And so I think, once I accepted that because I think I always knew that was going to be the case I had onto this little hope. Once I accepted it, I think I was fully able to let myself be a part of this other family. And they were amazing and they like loved me and took care of us. And yes, there's flaws in every family, but I don't think there could have been a better turnout for a family for me to get placed in in the situation and I think I finally just let myself be one of one of them and then immerse myself more in like school and projects and hobbies and you know, I think that just kind of Did you feel like a part of you, like emotionally?
Speaker 1have you ever felt like a part of you froze emotionally back then and you just kind of put walls?
Speaker 2up. I mean, yeah, I mean look at me now. Like, even going through this breakup, I'm being such a dismissive, avoidant and not being able to really open up. Of avoidant and not being able to really open up it's because I think I always you know the that time in my life where I loved so hard and for it just to be ripped away from me and then told okay, now you have to adjust and reset and again be a chameleon.
Speaker 2And then even in those foster care situation where I was the only black kid and then go into all white school and constantly having to like, not be, and then not black enough, not white, like, I think between that and foster care I just I think I froze into this constant area of like defense and not letting myself feel or love too hard, because it never worked out back then and it always hurt, and so that's something I'm working on in therapy. For sure. It's because I can sense that in my adult life now and I almost feel sometimes like stunted. I'm like I'm 34 years old. There shouldn't be a reason why I have so much trouble with like love and letting people learn at my age, but I think it's because I'm still like that little girl, like I'm very stunted in that way.
Kayla's Story: Mother Lost to Prison
Speaker 1We're always going to have them right here, Like we're always living to. We're always living for that little girl or that little boy that's inside of us. You know what I mean it's like. But you, going to therapy, I mean I feel like you are having breakthroughs and I'm so proud of you for being able to like, open up, because I know that therapy was like a huge like no-no at first, big no-no.
Speaker 1Going to therapy, though do you now feel like you've you're able to kind of process like closure with this situation, or do you still feel like it's that version is still stuck at a loss?
Speaker 2I mean, yeah, I think one of the first things that being able to, or first steps to, being able to have closure, or just accepting that there's something that needs to be closed, and I think that's what I'm just like, or like I think for so long I've just thought that I was broken, or like there was something broken inside of me or something was wrong with me, and it's like no, like you have quite a few reasons to be feeling this way, but we can, we can make you not feel that way or figure out like right, so, yeah, I think therapy in that way has made me realize like it wasn't my fault you know that I'm like this and um and that's just.
Speaker 2I think that's been the biggest help, yeah, and and.
Speaker 1To know that now you are a 34-year-old woman and you can go through therapy so that whenever you possibly have a child, or one day you're taking care of your generational trauma before you can move on into a different part of your life, right? It's like it is a crazy thing to think about Everything that happens as a kid. It really does stick with you?
Speaker 2It does, I know, and that's just what's crazy.
Speaker 1Just to wrap your head around Like we're all just kids, like it's funny when you look at like a little kid and adult and it's like that adult was that little you know, it's just like, yeah, like I look and I look at my, even our parents, right, it's like they were little kids and then now they're adults and then now they're like older and it's almost like we all get to a certain point where we go back and we're like kids again when we're older.
Speaker 2I don't know it's like. It's such an interesting. It is the way that life kind of works.
Speaker 1It's such an interesting, you know, it's like I heard like a little saying that was like oh, we start in diapers and we end in diapers, yeah, that's true. It's crazy. We've got to make the best out of this time in between. Yeah.
Speaker 2And so Be nice to ourselves. Exactly, exactly a death experience, with Ozzy Osbourne dying, a musician that we don't know personally, but it still feels like something that you grieve and an experience but other, like losing a childhood home, could be something that people you know deal with. I dealt with that a lot of times growing up?
Speaker 1how many homes were you in, or was it just?
Speaker 2one foster home. But I was in like and growing up my mom. We were homeless a lot so we'd be sleeping on people's couches. We'd get a get a house to rent, but then we'd be kicked out because she wasn't paying rent. I've seen cars repoed like there was no consistency do you remember that like?
Speaker 1do you remember those moments? I know you were super young, but I just wondering how impressionable that was for you.
Speaker 2oh, I remember five, six, seven, probably like through these things. After thought, probably like, my earliest memory is probably like around like five or six, and a lot of times that's when my mom had boyfriends because it was like okay, they have a house, we need somewhere to stay. But there were a lot of times me and Erica were sharing a mattress on the floor in one of the rooms or like with their kids, and then sleeping on couches or air mattresses. I mean, I was in a different school every year until the foster home because it was a constant. So but the one of the craziest moment I'll never forget my mom getting her car repoed, though Cause that was. We slept in that car and that was just that was your home.
Speaker 2That was the only way she could go to work and like pay for us, and I remember they came and repoed it there. The tow truck was in the driveway and she was like screaming. I've never seen my mom scream and cry so much. And I'm sitting there like helpless, I don't know what to do, but just knew that this was a really bad situation, right. So, but yeah, like that, like that is a huge loss of like just security, absolutely, but but yeah, lots of different, like you know, people losing relationships, losing your sense of identity or security, which you've talked about. Cutting ties, yeah, with people, friends, family.
Speaker 1You know I have the two cousins that you know my parents adopted. We do not have contact with them at all. It is a very crazy thing thing, and I think it has shaped me to be able to let go of people because I had to let go of two people that I really didn't think were my brothers.
Speaker 1They moved in when I was five or six years old, so I grew up with them and we have zero communication and it was really sad for a long time. But then you realize people grow and change and it doesn't matter if you're blood related or not. Yeah, it can happen to anyone, yeah, in any situation, you know. But yeah, that has been a loss where I felt more anger for my mom, because she did all this, because she loved her nephews and she loved my brother I mean her brother, my uncle and I can't imagine how she must have felt when, like realizing, oh, we're not having communication anymore, you know, and you just you do.
Speaker 1You have to cut it off. There's only so many times you could reach out to somebody and and get that shut down until you just don't do it anymore, so yeah, lots of things. I mean death of past versions of yourself, right?
Speaker 2It's like yeah, we talked about that too.
Speaker 1So many there's. We've lived so many different lives and you grieve it. You know that's what.
Speaker 2I've been. That's what my therapist told me with our first session. He's like you're grieving with me going through this transition in my career. My career has been. I think it's also I've been so like big in my career because that was when I was I think I was 10 when I realized what I wanted to be when I grew up and I've been working at this since you were 10. I was doing like little shows on camera with my friends and I was doing the public speaking competitions and I said one day I used to watch talk shows, one day I'm going to be the next Oprah Winfrey. And then literally my life didn't stay on track all the way up until last year when I decided to quit my TV job and that's why I'm having such a hard time.
Speaker 1The loss of that person, yes, and it's, it's it's just crazy how, like the like, death can just come in all different forms, all different forms and, and along with death is always going to come grief, yes, and you have to release it. You have to make those take those moments and cry and, like we said, punch a pillow, scream in the pillow.
Speaker 2You just got the fact I just like tried on this show I know, can we just go back to that?
Speaker 1I think I've been crying so much lately, which?
Speaker 2I never cry. I shocked myself. I'm like what is happening? I think lately I've been releasing so much grief, so now it's like coming. I talk about even with acting, because I'm like I have a hard time crying on camera and it's like because I don't have it in me to cry. And my therapist goes once you start letting stuff cry in real life, then you can like switch it on. It's like, even in acting I try to put on this like I'm not crying.
Speaker 2I want to cry in that scene you know, so it is funny like I now, it just kind of comes out.
Speaker 1Yeah, I just I clogged, clogged pores. Yes, no, I'm telling you, I I feel this energy, this presence of kayla, and I'm just like she is really. You're really doing the work, you're really doing the inner work and it's, it's a really beautiful thing to to witness.
Speaker 2I love, yeah, I love you crying sometimes um so what are some of the biggest lies that were? You know there's a lot I hate like people try to say, like we said earlier, like some people just do the wrong things or say the wrong things don't mean to, but some I hate what some people decide to say right after like someone passes, like time heals all wounds bullshit it I mean sure.
Speaker 1I mean, I guess it heals a little bit it can help.
Speaker 2It doesn't ever heal it's never.
Speaker 1It's like I said I it is what my 2009 I don't know math, how many years ago was that? I still hello. I'm talking about it right now with you guys and I still cry about it in in certain moments or times. But there are times where I talk about my dad and I don't cry. I laugh, we make jokes and all the things, but, um, the wound is still there it's still there.
Speaker 1It's never gonna go away. So, yeah, no, stop telling people that, stop it. Or um one that like, oh the, at least they lived a long life. Not long enough, like because if they're older my dad, you know, he was in his 50s, I believe, when he passed, or maybe 60s. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1So that does not comfort you at all, but that is not comforting Like I, like I just I yeah, it's like I had a friend who passed away at 25 and it's like she didn't get to live a long life, but so does that make his death less important?
Speaker 2than her death, because it doesn't that doesn't make sense to me.
Speaker 1Um, or like, yeah, you should be over it by now. You know, it's been, I think, 13 years for me since my dad has passed and, and, and it's been what. You were nine and now you're 34. So you should be over it by now, and what? No, I'm never going to be over it. I mean, I work through it. I've been able to process those emotions and regulate them better, but I'm never going to be over the loss of my dad.
Speaker 2No, They'd want you to be strong. They'd want you to be strong. Yeah, stay strong.
Speaker 1They'd want you to be strong. Yeah, stay strong. No.
Speaker 2When I die, I hope everyone who loved me is bawling their eyes out.
Speaker 1I don't want anyone to be strong.
Speaker 2Okay, I want to see you mourn. Okay, I want you like thrashing on the carpet because you miss me so much. Don't be strong. If I see a big strong, I'm like they didn't even love me.
Speaker 1Yes, no, exactly. And I'm like also some other things that you can say is like hey, I know you're going through a rough time. If you need somebody to sit with you and just sit and watch trash TV and not talk, I can do that for you. Or hey, if you're not eating, because I know I wasn't eating when my dad passed hey, if you're not eating, hey, I'm sending you.
Speaker 2Well, there wasn't Postmates back then, but now you can just say hey, I'm sending you a.
Speaker 1Postmates, please have a meal.
Speaker 2You know, there's other ways to say it when you write a booklet of like what to say and what to not say to the family when you go to a funeral, because people always say like I mean, I know it's hard, it's hard, I know. People say that you should just study it before you go and just rehearse in the mirror Because it's uncomfortable, right, it's super uncomfortable and it's interesting because I've dealt with a lot of death.
Speaker 1Even growing up I had my abuelita. My grandmother passed away. I had a friend's mom who passed away in the fourth grade and she was a police officer. So we had the bagpipes and everything and you're in fourth grade like whoa, like this is you know, how are we?
Speaker 1supposed to like handle this? Um, so it's just, it is one of those things like for me, like I said, I've it's not that death is like necessarily a scary thing, it's just it is a sad thing. It's always going to be sad Any anything. And, like we said, loss is loss and loss is sad. It's always gonna be sad any anything. And like we said, loss is loss and loss is sad. It's just, it's uh. But yeah, never go to a funeral and say anything about someone's outfit especially the grieving daughter jeez, that's it.
Speaker 1That person just needs a little slap on the wrist you know and it was like me walking into the I will never forget walking into the funeral home that day, not being able to walk to the casket because we had an open casket. And so my mom and my sister are standing there holding me, literally dragging me up there to go see him, and after I have this moment with him and I'm able to finally stand up there and they're able to like leave me alone with him and I was able like to have these like last moments with him. You come up to me and talk to me about my outfit, like I wanted to strangle this person. Till this day I still look at her and like she's not in our life. But like social media you know Facebook people pop up and I'm always like I hate her.
Speaker 2I wonder if she was like trying to figure out what to say and then like that's what came out. She thought humor was going to be funny and it's like.
Speaker 1no, bro, Like back up. Just give me a hug and say I'm sorry for your loss.
Speaker 2I'm here. Whatever you need, just say I'm sorry for your loss. That's the safest.
Speaker 1Safest thing you could say to somebody is I am sorry for your loss, please. Let safest thing you could say to somebody is I am sorry for your loss, please let me know if you need anything.
Processing Childhood Trauma in Adulthood
Speaker 2I'm here. Um, how has, how do you think grief has changed the way you view like time, relationships and even like goals, like now?
Speaker 1it definitely makes me understand that time is extremely precious and to not hold grudges. Yeah, I, I, I. Just there's not enough time in the world to hold grudges Like, yes, people, people move on, people you know, friendships come and go and things like that. But, um, even just taking each day as such a blessing and it's hard because I have anxiety I've been in depressive states before where I don't feel like that day is a blessing. But when I look back on it, I always remind myself that you're alive, your brain works, you're physically pretty healthy and you have an amazing family and great people around you. So let's go and make those trips to go see your family.
Speaker 1You know, like call your 89-year-old aunt or your 75-year-old uncle just to say, hey, what's going on? Like, oh, did you hear about this in the news? And like, pretend, like make up a conversation, just give them. Because I do think some people, especially like our elders, they feel invisible. I remember my grandpa always said like oh, it's so sad getting older because you become invisible. So I feel like I never want that for anybody in my life. I want them to feel seen. Um, if they want to feel seen, you know what I mean. Oh, when I'm old, leave me alone um, leave me alone.
Speaker 2Now we're gonna be on the back porch. But we tell like, like, um, um, like, forgiveness is is important, and I've I struck like I was still very angry with my biological mother up until like kind of recently, where I just didn't want to talk to her because I still felt like the older I got, just the more I realized things that I thought could have been preventable. I think it was around the time I got to her age where I was like, oh, like, if I was in her shoes because she had me when she was 33, I'm like man, like the stuff that she was going through at that time. If I have gone through that at this age, I don't know how I would have handled it. So I let myself start forgiving her because, like, who knows what could happen, like who knows you know how much longer I'm gonna have with her? She had lung cancer back in the day, so like I don't know what her health is and I would be devastated if she passed.
Speaker 2And I still held on to all this anger.
Speaker 2And holding on to the anger isn't doing anything to me either, right, and then I'm missing out on this potential relationship with my biological mother, absolutely, and the same thing with my grandmother. I had issues with her for a few years, didn't speak to her and I'm like she's getting older, I know how much she loves me and just wants to be in my life. So I had to like in the last few years, just let go, just like realize I'm never gonna get the apology that I want, never going to get probably the explanation that I want. I probably not even get the truth about certain things. But if I have any interests and letting go, relinquishing that anger and then letting, also helping them not feel like I'm angry at them because I know it's been killing them too, it's just like just letting it go. Like you said, life is short, it's precious, we don't have a lot of time and is is holding on to something worth them leaving this earth forever. You're never getting to like, yeah, have a relationship or talk about it.
Different Types of Loss Beyond Death
Speaker 1Yeah, I mean there's, there's things that I wish I could have told my dad and just been honest with him about. But I can't do that, like you know, face to face. So I have changed that part, that part about me with my family. That's why I'm so open sometimes too open with my family. They're like, vanessa, we didn't need you to know that, but I'm like, yes, you did. I needed you to know this and so, yeah, it's just being honest with them, and even if that honesty is hard, yeah, work on that.
Speaker 2You know Well, instead of the honey jar, we're actually just going to ask a pre-prompted question. We can pretend it's a honey jar question but just wanted to keep things in the same theme, so it's funny, I have this thing for my first-time friends, which will be when I'm 40. Duh, oops, the mic is sorry.
Speaker 2One second guys, the mic is sorry one second guys. Um, I, I want to have a faux funeral and I want to throw a funeral for myself and I'm gonna be laying in a casket and I want all my friends to come up and say something really nice about me in the casket. So this is if you're, if my friend, you're listening, listen to this part. So what's something you hope people say about you someday when you're gone? This is a cheat sheet for all of you.
Speaker 1Um, I know what I'm gonna say to you. Wait, I know what I'm going to say to you. Wait, I know what I'm going to say to you. Do you want to tell?
Speaker 2me now. Do you want to wait until you're standing over my casket in six years? I'll forget.
Speaker 1You'll forget, you'll forget.
Speaker 2No, you're never going to forget, never going to forget.
Speaker 1I'm going to look at her and be like we're going to take three cleansing breaths together. Literally she would, and I'm going to hold her with her hand and she is just going to be able to take them with me because her eyes will be closed.
Speaker 2No, I'm going to be dead. I'm a method actor. I'm not breathing, all right. What do you hope people say about you someday when you're gone?
Speaker 1I hope that they say I brought a lot of light to their life laughter, honesty, an easygoing friendship relationship. Yeah, I just I think that's what I try to do is like when I walk into a room, if the room feels a little weird or off, I try to pick it up a little. I'm always the one that's going to say, hey, does everyone want to take a shot? I will be the first one to break the ice, so I hope that's what people remember me for is trying to always.
Speaker 1I don't know. I try to do the right thing always and listen to every side of the story because there's, you know, 20 different sides to every story, so I don't know where that twang just came in.
Speaker 2I guess I don't know either, because we're talking about my dad from Baton Rouge, I guess. No, I think those are all good things to hope, to let people say yeah, I guess.
Speaker 1Yeah, that's what I would want. So say those about me. Okay, everyone say those about her, don't forget, or she'll haunt you in a form of a boo-boo. Oh, and it's gonna be a la boo-boo, honey what about you?
Speaker 2um, I think I just really try I hope people just say I was kind, like. I think I just try really hard to be like just kind to people and um, just try to make everyone just feel like seen and understood. I think for so much of my life I wasn't seen and understood or like accepted. So I think I just like I try to make anyone in a room just feel like they're part of it and then they're accepted. Um, I don't know, I think that to me would be like the legacy I'd want to leave.
Speaker 2Yeah, so and then I was really funny and that my ass looked really good in my jeans.
Speaker 1Ooh, yeah, we can't forget about our ass.
Speaker 2You know what? Barely bottoms up?
Speaker 1Yeah, no, not bottoms up, just like to the side.
Speaker 2I want an open casket. It's like this. I want like shape Propos. Give me shape, give me curvature and the grain and make sure my makeup's done and my hair is done, and I don't mean some like no, no, no, no. I need, like top makeup artists to come in there and beat my face to the gods. Yes, I'm literally being sent to the gods. Yes, no, literally I'm not walking through those pearly gates looking like no, honey, and if you could just make it.
Speaker 1So I'm like with like my pretty smile, just like stuck, like that. I walk a little like.
Speaker 2A little. How creepy would that be? Just like this, just like a wink? Oh my god, I'd be like trying to put your eye down and wax my nose hairs because they get a little long sometimes.
Speaker 1So, yeah, make sure I don't have a mustache. Yeah, give us a full wax down. We need a whole like yeah we just I just we need to look fly, yes, okay please, please, please and also it's like play good music, like I don't need this, like solemn, sad shit. Like my dad, we played Santana. People were so weirded out by the music we played. We were playing. Santana just live. He loved Cuban, cubano like music, so we would like always have we had that going. People were so weirded out.
Speaker 2Yeah, it's like it should be a celebration at the end of the day, like we're there celebrating life you know, please again, but please cry, because if you don't cry, I'll think you didn't love me right, just bring no brain a little like eye drops. What do you got to do? Just so? Because, yeah, I will haunt you.
Speaker 1I go first and you do not cry at my funeral okay that is all I'm saying. Okay, this is a p, a PSA. I promise, I promise I'll cry.
Closing Thoughts on Grief and Freedom
Speaker 2All right, guys, a little sign-off message. We all know grief isn't just about death. It's about just change, letting go of the version of your life you thought you'd have. But it also reminds us how much we can love, how deeply we can feel, and how strong we are when we think we are broken.
Speaker 1So if you're anything right now, a person a place or even a version of yourself.
Speaker 2this one's for you. We see you we got you.
Speaker 1How do you feel after that episode? I feel open. Yeah, I feel like we just shared a lot we did. I still feel like very emotional. I don't know, I, I'm just, I'm just proud of us, I'm just proud of us Okay, um, I think that this is really hard to talk about, and uh, but when we talk about it, we get to feel a little more grounded in it and and that's so freeing. So, just free, I feel free.
Speaker 2And.
Speaker 1I think that's like our word for the episode just feeling free and, yeah, like get with people that you feel comfortable. I mean, like the first time we talked it was we just like it was like word vomit. We just opened up and we were like, oh wow, we really just opened up, like about our past and everything. So, yeah, you know, just remember, always find those two people that are going to make those ingredients the best in the tea. And I'm lucky enough that I found the other ingredient to my perfectly tasting tea, which is Kayla Becker. Vanessa, that was a beautiful sign off. I love you too. Okay, we're going to go now.
Speaker 2We're going to go, because I actually need to like fall for a second.
Speaker 1We love you too, Okay we're going to go now. We're going to go because I actually need to like fall for a second. We love you guys, thanks for watching. We'll see you next time. We'll see you next time, maybe less tears. Yeah, bye guys, bye I love you.
Speaker 2I love you too. Bye.
