Episode 81: Paul Puckett

This episode we have Paul Puckett, one of the most interesting and talented artists in the outdoors space, we talk everything from where his art started to doing trophy work at fly shops to where he is at now with his art, as well as talk some fishing and how he loves painting some of the wild places he has been as well as some prime species like Permit,Tarpon, and Redfish. We also discussed how he plans to get to some shows and share his art with others along with how music art and fishing have always been intertwined 

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:02

Welcome back to the end of the Blue Han Outdoors Podcast brought to you by Grit and Game Co. Quality hats, quality shirts that represent the outdoors life, and dirty duck coffee. The best coffee in my opinion on the market. My personal favorite flavor is cinnamon teal. Go check them out and use code Hunter C for great and game for money off your order. And code Blue Hen for Money Off Your Order with Dirty Duck Coffee. Without further ado, let's get into the episode.

SPEAKER_01 0:42

Hello.

SPEAKER_02 0:43

Alright, guys. Welcome back to another episode of the Blue Hen Outdoors Podcast. We have the one, the only, Mr. Paul Puckett. How are you doing tonight, sir?

SPEAKER_00 0:56

Doing great. You're doing great. Thanks for having me. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_02 1:00

I appreciate you sparing a little bit of time for us tonight.

SPEAKER_00 1:04

Absolutely. For sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:06

Oh yeah. So I usually start all my episodes out with where it all started. So how did you get your start into art and fishing?

SPEAKER_00 1:17

Yeah, I uh just like art, just like every other kid. Like I've got a daughter that's five years old, you know, every every kid at that age draws and just free draws, anything that comes to their mind. It's actually, you know, as Picasso once said, you know, it it took him 12 years to learn how to draw and paint, and it took him the rest of his life to do to do art like a kid again. So it's it's fun to watch her draw and paint. And as we're young and we grow up, you just start getting distracted by sports and all these other things that start taking you away from drawing. And that's just something that I never got taken away from. I just kind of kept doing it. And then when I started combining my love of fishing, you know, around middle school, I started doing all my art projects, kind of just kept being fishing related and outdoors. Uh I did a little, I did some duck hunting stuff when I was in college because I started duck hunting a lot in college. But, you know, all my pursuits and all the things I loved, music, I just would always draw and paint, paint them. And uh and I did that all through college. And I went to college for more for graphic design. And uh still on the side when I worked at a fly shop all those years through college, I was still drawing and painting people's fish that they'd catch. And I would do these trophy paintings, you know, of the fish, the exact same size as what they told me it was, and the from the photo that they gave me, I just kind of copied it, and that was the first time I started getting paid to do fishing art.

SPEAKER_02 2:51

Awesome.

SPEAKER_00 2:52

Yeah, and that was that was I I graduated high school in '93, so that was probably when I was really starting to do uh 91 and 93, is when I started really doing a lot of trout paintings and those kind of things.

SPEAKER_02 3:07

Oh yeah. What what was it like working in the fly shop and then doing art on the side, I guess, so to speak?

SPEAKER_00 3:15

Yeah, I've pretty much done that until about 11 years ago. I I the fly shop in Dallas, I started working at when I was 19 years old, and that was right at the peak of when I was just so hungry and excited about this art thing. And it was in Dallas, Texas, and I worked there the whole time I went to college, like the next five and a half, six years. And it was called West Bank Anglers, and they had opened a store from the original one in Jackson, Wyoming. And they opened one in Dallas because they got so much catalog business at the time. So when I finished college, I decided that I wanted to go out and work at the Jackson, Wyoming uh one as well. So, but to answer your question, the one in Dallas, that's where I really started getting used to the idea and the concept of someone paying you money for art. And I was doing those those trophy paintings that I just told you about. And then funny enough, when I worked at the shop out in Jackson, I was out there for four years and I hardly I hardly painted when I actually lived in Jackson, which is crazy because it's such a a mecca for you know outdoor painting and landscape painting and wildlife painting. And I hardly, I kind of squandered it. But at the same time, you know, I was fishing. I I I fished for four years. I I I gathered so many amazing memories. Um, I caught so many fish. I snowboarded. I had never been on a mountain on never saw anything called snow on a mountain because growing up in Dallas, Texas, we we didn't have mountains or hardly snow. So I spent a lot of the winter snowboarding, you know, partying just to call it what it is for four years. I was a fishing bum. It was awesome. I started a few paintings, I just never finished them. And so, and then I worked at the fish hawk for eight years in Atlanta. I left Jackson for Atlanta for some reason. And uh and yeah, worked at the fish hawk for Gary Merriman and started really learning saltwater and loving saltwater, and then started really painting a lot of saltwater stuff because I was going to the red the Georgia coast, red fishing all the time, and that's how I stumbled my way into Charleston because I had a bunch of friends from my Wyoming days that lived in Charleston, so I was always coming to see them. And then I met a buddy of mine, Scott Davis, that was opening a fly shop here in Charleston. I was like, Well, what if I came and helped you with the shop? And then I did that for about two years, and that was about 11 years ago. I stopped working at the fly shop. So I mean, it I think I did about 23 years working in fly shops and painting on the side too, and that's really what gave me all the connections and all the people looking at my art and seeing me every day, and and that's kind of what I mean. It took those 20, 23 years to kind of get get it going for sure.

SPEAKER_02 5:56

Oh, yeah, and that I can imagine how much of a grind that was, just you know, balance of those. And yeah, it's like, oh, it's you know, you always have that little bit of self-doubt. It's like, is this really gonna work out and is the art thing gonna take me to where I want, or should I just stick with the fishing stuff?

SPEAKER_00 6:14

But yeah, and you know, after the last time or the supposed last time, that I'm gonna call my parents and ask them for money, you know, that whole thing. I mean, it's just they definitely helped me a lot. Uh, because flash shop pay isn't that great, especially when you start getting into your 30s, and uh, and then that's when the the painting started kind of taking off. Uh, probably when I was like mid-30s and when it started kind of showing some promise.

SPEAKER_02 6:40

Oh, yeah. I love your stuff by the way. I don't know if I mentioned it to you before, but I just love how your style is so unique. Like, I especially love the I guess you could call it diary art, like how you have like the picture and you have like all like the words around it and stuff. That's so cool.

SPEAKER_00 6:56

Yeah, that's a lot of fun. You know, I used to keep just a journal of just my fishing stories and like what I caught that day. And I never, for some reason, really put art all around it until uh there's an artist in Dallas that I've knew for a long time named Jack Unru, and he's passed away now. But right around the time he passed out, his book came out, and it was all his journals and how he incorporated these little doodles and really good drawings, refined drawings, and very loose drawings, and and then how they tied into some of his finished artwork. And uh, if you want to check it out, his name is Jack Unru, U-N-R-U-H, and his illustrations are amazing. And he was from Dallas, and I used to see him when he'd come into Fly Shop back in the day. Uh, but he he was definitely a big inspiration for that, and I'm just glad I can carry on that whole uh type of thing. He he did. I do it kind of my own certain way, but uh I love those things, and they're they're great conversation starters and conversation pieces like it's shows, whether it's an art show or a fishing show. If I just have a couple and put them out on the table, people love going through them and checking them out, and it it definitely kind of translates into conversations about other artwork and other things and and what have you. So they're definitely a great thing to do and a great thing to have.

SPEAKER_02 8:13

Oh, yeah, for sure. What would you say is your favorite uh fish or favorite kind of thing to paint or draw?

SPEAKER_00 8:23

Probably tarpon. Uh, you know, and and I love catching them too. I love fishing for them, but they're not they're probably not my favorite fish to catch or go for, but they're definitely my favorite fish to paint and draw. They just they have such cool looking mouths and bodies, and they're very unique. And when they jump, they're just the no two are ever the same. They always have some different look to them. They're just and they're they're just so acrobatic, and something about a tarpon in the air and freezing that shot and painting it is just it's fun. It's I wouldn't even say it's really a challenge for me. It's not a challenge, it's more about uh how I can make the light work and the the prismatic yellows and oranges and pinks and blues and just make it look right uh without it being too stiff. I mean, I guess that is the challenge of it, but it's more fun than it is challenging.

SPEAKER_02 9:18

Oh, yeah, for sure. That's definitely on my list to get down and catch a tarpon on the fly, as well as uh some striped marlin and Baja, but yeah, that's a whole yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:30

I haven't done the marlin thing yet. Yeah, I haven't done the Baja thing yet. I want to, uh, but you have to do the tarpon. They're just amazing fish. And the fishery that you're usually catching them in are usually incredible fisheries, and uh, you know, awesome fish live in beautiful places, so that's great. The fun thing about traveling and being a fly fisherman, you always got to go check out the next journey.

SPEAKER_02 9:51

Oh, yeah, for sure. What's you what what would you say your favorite fish to catch is?

SPEAKER_00 9:56

My favorite fish to actively pursue is definitely probably a permit. Um yeah, they're just I don't know what it is. They've got they've got their hold on me, and you hardly ever catch them too. Like it's just you know, I I try not to put them on a pedestal as much as a lot of people do. I just just actively love trying to figure them out, and and just you know, it's just they're they're very difficult fish, and I don't think they're trying to be difficult. I don't think they're difficult by nature. I think they're just squirrely and weird, and they're not purposely built to make you mad or you know, all the all these things. I think they're just an interesting fish, and I think they're persnickety, and I think they're strange and weird, and that just what equates them into being a hard fish to catch.

SPEAKER_02 10:42

Oh, yeah, for sure. And even from the art perspective, like I've heard stories and seen videos that it's like the sun hits them right in the water, they just get the whole spectrum of colors going across them, or they'll have like blues, pinks, yellows.

SPEAKER_00 10:57

Yep, and the same with tarpon and bonefish. If you if you shine even just a tarpon scale, a lot of people have to think that's a tarpon will take a scale, kind of like a little trophy. And if you put that thing perfectly in the light, just the whole rainbow spectrum of all different colors are in there, and that's the same with a permit, same with bonefish. Uh, and same with the redfish, redfish look like kind of boring orangey pumpkin fish, but when you shine the light perfectly on them, they it's amazing the vast amount of colors that are in their scales and skin.

SPEAKER_02 11:29

Oh, yeah, especially redfish. I mean, I've seen I mean, obviously, you just said it the pumpkins, but some of them can like turn more purplish sometimes, more red sometimes, and then depending on I guess how big they are, the tails get like the blues and the teals and the terquise.

SPEAKER_00 11:48

A lot of it is the water, too. Like we here in Charleston, we have some darker tannic water, we have clear, you know, uh kind of ocean water. If that fish is in that water, it'll kind of take on what that that uh environment gives them. So in the darker Ashley River here, you know, some call it mud, but it's really like an algae. Uh but those fish will be very bronze and dark and amber, and their tail is like uh has a lot of blue in it, whereas if you go in clearer water, those fish are a little bit you know, not as colorful and a little bit lighter colored. So it's interesting how that works. Like if you catch a a redfish in the upper keys, like that thing's almost silver like a bone fish. Because the water's clear and they have to kind of adapt to that. So it's definitely blend in. Yep.

SPEAKER_02 12:42

What would you say is like kind of like how you started? Because you mentioned you've done like a couple of shows, like bringing your art and stuff. What was that kind of progression like as you were starting to get bigger?

SPEAKER_00 12:54

Uh shows just in general. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, most of the shows I did were were I've never I have definitely done like the fly fishing consumer shows and had my booth just be art. Most of the shows I've done were when I had the apparel brand, uh, the flood tide company. We did a lot of shows with that, and that kind of uh projected my artwork on clothing and shirts and hats, and uh did a lot of shows with that. And then most of the shows I do now are more kind of not really fly fishing related, they're more art shows like the Si Wee show here in Charleston, which stands for Southeastern Wildlife Exposition. And uh that shows in February. Now, whether I'm actually in the show or not, I still do my own little show at the gallery across the street. So SiWe kind of takes over Charleston, and regardless if I'm literally in the show, I'm still part of Si Wee by having my own little show at the gallery. So I'm always involved in that one way or another. And it's it's just a great time to be in Charleston, which is usually mid mid-February.

SPEAKER_02 13:58

So oh yeah, I know some of those shows down there get to take over the town a little bit, like SiWe Soul Fly is another one that kind of has its own little grip on the town.

SPEAKER_00 14:10

Yeah, it's a blast.

SPEAKER_02 14:12

I definitely gotta get down there for one of them. I got a couple buddies that are usually do some of those shows as or involved with some of those shows as well down there.

SPEAKER_00 14:20

Yeah, no, it's a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_02 14:24

What um what's something that you haven't painted yet that you would like to?

SPEAKER_00 14:33

Um I'm I'm I'm doing I'm doing Western stuff. I like to mess around with and dabble in the Western art stuff. I've wanted to do that ever since I was a kid. Uh I used to used to do when I was younger, and I'm just now it's kind of been festering in me for a long time. And I think just this huge western push in the last four or five years has kind of made me finally just do it. And so I'm I'm messing around with that. Like, like right now, the painting I'm working on right now, this is my home studio, is uh kind of a western scene. Yeah, yeah, and you can kind of see I've got western stuff kind of all in here. So at home, at home at night, uh, you know, my day job is painting fishing, and at night, uh I work on stuff here at the house, and it's usually always western themed for the most part. Uh, so I'm working on a little show that I'm gonna try to kind of promote and sell when I'm done with about six or seven paintings and try to get a little show going for that.

SPEAKER_02 15:34

Nice, that'd be cool.

SPEAKER_00 15:36

So I know that still didn't really answer your question, but I guess uh I'm still trying to emphasize doing a lot, trying to get better at my Western stuff.

SPEAKER_02 15:45

Okay, that's cool.

SPEAKER_00 15:48

And it actually makes me a better artist for the fishing stuff because it's kind of looser. I don't really have to be technical when it when it comes to fishing in a boat and the way you guys casting is it kind of translates into needing to be kind of close to perfect, like everything needs to look right. Well, with my western stuff, I can make it however I want to and stay looser, and some of that's translating to actually making my you know nautical fishing art a little looser and more how I want it. So yeah, because there's definitely other yeah, I would say there's definitely probably a lot of intricacies as far as like when you do the because I've seen some of your like guys on the skiff uh paintings you've done, or like the like you just said, the casting, like there's a little bit more technicality to it than yeah, like if you don't have some things right on it, people will point it out, and you know, it's you don't have a chance with some people, as far as you know, people that can nail that certain push poles and you know polling platforms and certain things aren't quite right, and you can get hammered for it.

SPEAKER_02 16:54

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:55

Yeah. The same way which I'm sure in Western art people will be, you know, are with saddles and you know, uh all kinds of tack equipment stuff. So I'm sure it's the same way in in the Western world.

SPEAKER_02 17:09

I've noticed this kind of as of because I'm more newer to the fly fishing stuff. I've only been doing it the past two and a half, two years. But as I've gone into the community and like learned and seen things, I've noticed that fly fishing, art, and music are all kind of intertwined with each other. How what how would you kind of describe that or uh interpret that?

SPEAKER_00 17:40

Yeah, you know, those are the my three kind of main things that I'm interested in, uh music, um, art and fishing. So they've always been like a trio wherever I've gone. Uh, you know, when we had the apparel company, everything kind of centered around those three things. If it didn't have any, I mean food was one, you know, food and drink. Uh, but it really came down to uh music, art, and fly fishing. And I don't know why they kind of all hold hands, but in my life they always have. And I know for a lot of people they always have. Like uh, you know, I know so many people that fly fish that are musicians and artists, so I don't know why that is. That's just that's just part of the the cosmos, I guess. You know, there's probably you know, there's always the trilogy of things, everything's in matching of three, and that's just that's just that's my little trilogy, but yeah, that's it's definitely a good question. Maybe it's one will never really know the answer to, but they definitely seem to all hold hands pretty well.

SPEAKER_02 18:48

Oh yeah. I mean, especially like some of the because I'm a big video guy, I like watching videos and stuff. Like I've seen some of the stuff about like Jimmy Buffett and all those guys down in the keys back in, I think it was the 60s or 70s, mid-70s, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:04

72 to like 76.

SPEAKER_02 19:06

Yeah, and they were all tarpon fishing and everything, and it's like you have that whole just melting pot of like artists, writers, musicians, and everybody's just hanging out fishing.

SPEAKER_00 19:16

It's like yep, it's funny because well, and I think about that a lot too, and they can look back and we can look back and say how incredible that was, but we also we're always we always feel like we're not in a certain time that's special. And what I think what I need to start doing more often is realize that right now I'm in a certain time where people 40 years will look back and be like, man, it would have been so cool to live in the mid-20s in Charleston. Like we're in those times, we just need to realize that we are. It's kind of like the whole the whole thing of uh, you know, those were the good old days, but you're always in the good old days, you're always in this time warp, and it would have been amazing to have been in the keys in this in 75 with those guys, but they're also thinking how incredible would have been in back in Montana in 1960, you know, like you're always kind of thinking how amazing it would have been when right now it's pretty damn amazing. We just need to realize that and cherish it and not, I mean, as I've gotten older, I've I've realized that you know money's great and everything, but time is probably the most important thing. So when I when I borrow someone, I'm more concerned about you know the value of their time compared to anything else. And so we just need to we just need to cherish the time we're in and appreciate it. And uh once we're older, you know, sometimes we won't really appreciate it probably until we're older.

SPEAKER_02 20:50

Oh yeah. You mentioned you used to do a little bit of duck hunting. I don't know if you still do. Have you ever thought of painting uh like birds or anything like that? Because I know some of those birds can have incredible and beautiful colors in themselves, just like the fish.

SPEAKER_00 21:05

Yeah, I've I've did I've done a bunch of bird studies and ink drawings for Field and Stream uh one and two years ago. And then I did a duck, I did a duck hunting cover for the magazine. I guess it would have been nine months ago uh on the Field and Stream cover. But that was the first time I I I had done a duck hunting subject matter in a long time. And I plan to do some more duck hunting. I don't love getting up at you know 3:30 or 4 in the morning to do it like I did back in the day. It's definitely a young man's game, if you ask me. But uh yeah, I'm I'm intrigued with it with doing it. And you know, I do love doing sporting dogs like quail hunting, uh pointers and that sort of stuff. I love doing that stuff because you know you don't have to be out at sunrise, so that's kind of more my speed. But uh yeah, I'm I'm definitely and I've got a duck hunting scene that I have. To do for seaweed this year, so I am gonna be doing a green wing teal.

SPEAKER_02 22:04

Oh, nice, that'd be cool.

SPEAKER_00 22:06

Yeah, not a cinnamon teal, but a green wing teal.

SPEAKER_02 22:10

Yeah, we we don't get we're not that blessed to get cinnamons over on the east coast.

SPEAKER_00 22:14

Yeah, no. I don't know that I hardly even saw them when I was in Texas back in the day. Hardly ever saw a cinnamon teal.

SPEAKER_02 22:21

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_00 22:22

Yeah, I saw a lot of blue wings, a lot of green wings, but I don't know if I ever saw cinnamon. Saw tons of everything else.

SPEAKER_02 22:30

Yeah, well, it was also kind of funny how you brought the quail and the pointers and upland hunting brought that up. It's like that's like another thing that kind of folds into um fly fishing as well. Like, you know, like I know a lot of guys that'll be upland hunters out west that trout fish for pheasant and stuff like that, or yeah, down south where you're at for quail and all that stuff, and even as far as the parallels of fly fishing and bow hunting, very repetition-based.

SPEAKER_00 23:07

Yeah, it's like the same way, you know, when someone goes and catches a permit, but they were using a spinning rod and a crab, it's it's still cool. Like it's it's fishing, you caught a permit. I got nothing wrong with that. That's fine. But you you always end up asking the question, was it on a fly rod? And they go, No. That's probably the same equivalent of like shooting an elk, you know, with a rifle compared to a bow. I mean, it's there's a lot more work involved. There's a lot more uh, you know, probably pre-planning, pre-doing whatever. I'm not a big hunter, so but I just know I'm friends with plenty of hunters that it's definitely a relevant comparison, fly fishing and hunting to bow hunting for sure.

SPEAKER_02 23:46

Oh yeah. What would you say is like involved? Oh yeah. Oh yeah, for sure. Definitely lots and lots of practice for both.

SPEAKER_00 23:59

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 24:01

What would you say was your main draw to fly fishing as opposed to like just regular conventional?

SPEAKER_00 24:09

Yeah, I used to go fishing with my granddad. We used to fish in all the ponds in East Texas and Tyler, and uh and at the end of the day, I'd be sitting there throwing the plastic worm or the you know the earthworm with the cork, and he'd always end the day getting his fly rod out. Now, at the time I didn't know that there was a big difference, I just thought it was he was picking up a normal rod and just waving it a different way. But I just remember that just that rhythm and that the flow of it and this bug laying out and catching a bass with one of those topwater plugs and and just thinking how magical it was. It was super cool. And then he passed away, and we took my grandmother to Ark or to the Ozarks. And I remember just grabbing his fly rod, it was like a Berkeley rod with a Martin Reel on it, and just knowing I was gonna mess around with it, because I've always just connected trout fishing to fly fishing, and by then I was old enough to know it was a fly rod and what he was doing because he told me he was gonna teach me one day how to do it, but he never did. So I remember still to this day the first time I took that rod out, and there was this group of trout feeding on the surface, and they were probably 40 feet away, and I I couldn't cast that rod. My dad has a video of me. I'm going, you know, back to six o'clock and then nine, I'm just never getting a straight line with it, and I could never get the fly to those fish, and I just knew right then that I was gonna learn how to do it, I was gonna figure it out, and I was gonna come back here and catch those damn fish. So, what we ended up fishing the White River a lot growing up, and uh so I ended up going back there a lot, and that's kind of where I learned my chops how to fly fishers on the White River. I'm gonna I'm gonna switch to this battery and no headphones so I can not lose you.

SPEAKER_02 25:50

Oh no, you're good.

SPEAKER_00 25:53

Alright.

SPEAKER_01 25:54

Can you hear me? Yep. Alright, perfect.

SPEAKER_00 25:59

We're gonna change angles here. Alright. Now we got the guitars.

SPEAKER_02 26:09

Oh yeah. That's pretty cool how you have all your guitars lined up too. That's a nice.

SPEAKER_00 26:14

I've got a I've got a guitar and a cowboy hat problem. Oh, you got them here? Yeah, got them all.

SPEAKER_02 26:21

Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:22

It's just it is what it is. It is what it is.

SPEAKER_02 26:26

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:28

Alright, there we go.

SPEAKER_02 26:31

As far as the fishing goes, do you have a preference or like uh like I mean, I know you're on in Charleston and on the salt water more now, obviously, probably, but you know, do you like reminisce and wish you could go back to like Jackson and be like on the trout streams more than on the salt sometimes?

SPEAKER_00 26:53

Or yeah, you know, I don't I don't really picture it and daydream about it. I probably daydream more about tarpon and permit and even redfish, whatever, just being in the right conditions at the right time, the right place with the perfect current, perfect tide, perfect moon, and being there. Um, but as far as trout go, I mean, it's just I love being like I'm going to Jackson in September. I usually go out there once or twice a year. And uh it never gets old when I'm there. But when I leave, it's kind of like I'm leaving, and I don't I get more sad about leaving the place of Jackson than I do really the fishing. I do love the fishing, but it's just that place is just magical to me. It's changed a lot in 25 years since I moved there, but it's still amazing. It gets a bad rap for how crowded it is, and you know, social media people taking over the place, but you know, whatever. It is what it is, it's an amazing place. But I've got a couple spring creeks that I loved fishing there that I think about every now and then for sure. And I I'll be there in about a month, and I'm looking forward to that.

SPEAKER_02 28:04

Oh, yeah. Now they got browns, rainbows, and some cutthroats out there, right?

SPEAKER_00 28:10

Yeah, the native fish is yeah, the native fish is cutties. Uh, the first place that they ever put German browns in was called the Lewis River, which is part of Yellowstone National Park now. And those browns have kind of made their way down through the snake. So there are some browns in the snake, but it's 99% cutthroat. Uh Snake River fine-spotted, and then you got some Yellowstone Cuddies that have kind of found their way, you know, through some places. But yeah, both Cuddies and then cutbows, browns, and rainbows over mainly in Idaho.

SPEAKER_02 28:44

Yeah. Do um do you enjoy painting trout just as much as the saltwater fish? Because I know some of them trout species can have all kinds of wicked patterns and colors and all kinds of things. Yeah, I used to I used to.

SPEAKER_00 29:00

Not that I don't anymore. I just don't paint them as much as I used to. Um, it's definitely fun every now and then though to challenge myself to kind of to get back into the trout zone. Like I I used to get to the point where I could just paint them without even a reference, look at them. Uh I probably still could, honestly. But you know, it's it's it's definitely fun to have a trout project every now and then. Like I'm working on a painting for the one fly that I go out for in September, and it's it's above water though. It's a it's in a canyon and a drift boat, and two guys casting, so it's more of a you know, a scene than it is about the fish. And then um, but yeah, I'll I still like painting all that stuff. I just don't do as much Rocky Mountain stuff as as I used to.

SPEAKER_02 29:46

Oh yeah. Do um damn, I had a question and I lost it.

SPEAKER_00 29:56

No, it happens, something will come to you when that happens. That's all right. How about so what what kind of fishing do you typically like to do? You're in Delaware, is that what you said?

SPEAKER_02 30:08

Yes, sir. Um typically I like to go for so largemouth is the easiest for me to go for because it's just not accessible where I'm at. There's a lot of like golf courses and neighborhood retention ponds and just nice little cut ponds around my area. Um, striped bass is big around here, bluefish is big, flounder. That's one thing I've been trying. Well, I was planning to try to do this year. I've had a lot going on in my life, but I wanted to try to go on the beach and get a uh flounder with a fly off the beach.

SPEAKER_00 30:50

Cool. Yeah, yeah. I love bass too. I take my daughter to go bass fishing as much as I can. And we're gonna try to get her on the boat more often this fall for redfish.

SPEAKER_02 31:03

Nice.

SPEAKER_00 31:04

Yeah, we're we're we're kind of snake bit with her on the boat. We haven't done too well red fishing, but we're gonna do it this year.

SPEAKER_02 31:12

She'll probably love that, especially catching a nice decent size red and seeing them.

SPEAKER_01 31:17

For sure. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 31:20

Yeah, my question came back. What was your um most difficult or hardest uh trophy penning you've ever done? Or species.

SPEAKER_00 31:32

Yeah, probably uh well, the self-inflicted hardest one was probably a tarpon I did a few years ago. I did every little scale on it. That that took a while, but the the hardest one I probably did was back in college. Uh Bill Wiggins, this customer that I love to death, he had me paint his big like 50-inch um Atlantic salmon.

SPEAKER_02 31:57

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_00 31:58

I want to say it was 50 inches, it was big. But when you combine being a college student and kind of a loser half the time, and this guy wants his painting, and I've and it was a huge fish, and I was just I was scared of the project, so I was more scared of failure, really, than the actual possibility of me pulling it off. I ended up pulling it off, but that that thing sat in that room and it was so big that I stapled it into the wall, like the watercolor paper. I was like, screw it, I'm just gonna repaint these walls one day. And I stapled the watercolor paper into the wall, it was so big, and I had to buy a roll of watercolor paper in order to get a piece of paper the size I needed. And I still have that roll to this day, and that was back in like 1997 or 98, probably, you know, just crazy almost 30 years ago. Uh, but I still remember it to this day, and he passed away, and I would really love to know where that painting is, whether his kids have it or for sitting in the garage or something, and no one's looking at it because I'd love to have it back. I need to I need to figure that out.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:03

Find out.

SPEAKER_02 33:05

That's a good question. That's a good question, too. Besides that one, is there any paintings that you've done that you're like, damn, I wish I never gave that one away and I could have kept it?

SPEAKER_00 33:15

Nothing, nothing that really sticks out totally because when I when I do them, I have I'm such a mindset that uh especially when it's a commission. I mean, I've definitely done some where I've thought to myself, man, I don't know if I can ever recreate that again, but then the next painting happens and it and it just happens. Uh, but I did have a funny story that happened about three months ago here in Charleston. Uh, every now and then we'll get on Facebook Marketplace and just doodle around with Facebook Marketplace, and by then it kind of knows your algorithm that you like fishing and fly fishing and art and whatever and cowboy hats and guitars. And uh and this painting came across, and I was like, man, it looks so familiar. And I looked it out, and it was one of my paintings I had done. It was on Facebook Marketplace. And if you go to my website and go to uh available artwork, it's the Lewis, it's been bought, but it's the Lewis Brown, Lewis River Brown trout. And and it said, it just said trout painting is all it said. It didn't have the name of the artist, didn't have anything, but it was only a hundred bucks. You know, and someone had passed away and they were getting rid of their dad's art and stuff or whatever. And so I bought it instantly. I was like, Well, I'm gonna buy that for a hundred bucks and resell it, you know? And uh, and so I bought it for a hundred bucks. I was on the way to getting it, and he's he said something like, I was getting his address and saying, I can't wait to have this painting back. And he goes, Oh, you're the artist? I said, Yes. And he saw my name and he wrote me back like five minutes later, he goes, Oh my god, I I probably should not be selling this to you. Because I guess he looked at the prices of some of my artwork on my website. But I went and got it. I went and got it for a hundred bucks, and I sold it on sold it on Instagram for a lot more than that, so it worked out.

SPEAKER_02 35:09

Oh, yeah, for sure, for sure.

SPEAKER_00 35:11

I thought about keeping it, like you talk, you talked about, I thought about keeping it for nostalgic reasons, but you know, that's just one of those things. Like it's kind of fun and exciting to sell the art to, like it's you know, just one of those things. Sometimes it's not even really about the money, it's just the idea that someone is spending their hard-earned money and likes your art that much that they're gonna buy it, so that's an equally thrilling thing um to go through and experience without even just the money aspect of it.

SPEAKER_02 35:40

Oh, yeah. I mentioned that striped bass is a big thing up here. Have you ever painted any like fish from up here, like bass or bluefish or anything like that?

SPEAKER_00 35:49

I've done both. Uh bass, I've done two or three commission paintings for stripers. Um, funny enough, the state fish of South Carolina is a striper. They used to all come through the Savannah River and the Edistow River and all these different rivers here. The Cooper River, they still actually have a school of striper that come through the Cooper River.

SPEAKER_02 36:09

Oh, nice.

SPEAKER_00 36:10

Yeah, so yeah, I've done some stripers, I've done a blue fish as well.

SPEAKER_02 36:15

Nice, nice.

SPEAKER_00 36:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:18

What what um I mean we mentioned the Western stuff. What would you say is the besides that, what's like the next thing you're kind of looking forward to or looking to do as far as your art? Like, are you trying to branch out into like any other styles or like do something different?

SPEAKER_00 36:46

No, I think the main thing is just to to keep trying to become a better painter. You know, no matter what the subject matter you're painting, you know, it's it's just like like someone asked me today to do a commission of this photo, had thick four figures on it, and it's on a boat. I'm just that's just not really up my alley. To me, that's a portrait painting, that's more about portraits and figures. I'm not totally against painting figures like I'm painting one right now, but it's it's it's it's trying to get to a certain level of what I want to do, but I don't want to really paint four people on a boat just to do it. And that so those are the kind of things I have to say no to because it's just not really up my alley. And uh I gotta stay true to myself. I gotta commission paintings I'm starting to say no to more often because if it's not in the lane of what I'm trying to get better at, then it doesn't make sense to me right now. And it's hard to say no because you know, at this point in my life, I'm you know, help trying to raise a family, trying to make sure we have everything we need, and and you know, I need three more guitars. So I need, you know, it comes down to so it doesn't always really come down to money, but it it it kind of does. I want to be really responsible of my time and stay efficient and try to become a better painter. So on projects that don't make sense for that, I have to say no to them.

SPEAKER_02 38:15

Yeah. Did you ever see yourself or your art getting as big as it has been?

SPEAKER_00 38:23

Yeah, you know, I don't not necessarily. I never knew what was gonna happen. I knew that I wanted to get better and I wanted to become a good artist, and I wanted to do some fun things along the way too that made people happy. And uh I feel like I have done that and I'm still doing that. And no telling what the future holds. I don't, I mean, the the beauty about being an artist is there's no finish line. You're never, you know, there's never a point where you say you're trying to get to where when you get to that point, you can just be done. Like that's not possible. That's an in that's an impossibility if if you truly are an artist, because you're gonna weave and bob, you're gonna take left turns, you're gonna come back to center, you're gonna keep doing all these things just to get better. And the only day that you're done is the day you die. That's that's the finish line, and that's just what it is. That's it, that's a something beautiful about that too. Like, you don't really ever retire, you just might get to the point where you just can't paint anymore, and you know, that's that's what it is. So that's that's the the course I'm on. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:30

That's kind of like the guy that did that for me. It's a guy we used to um hunt with, and um that's kind of what happened to him. Like he he just got older and got older and got older and got to the point where he just couldn't paint no more. And he's like, I I still would love to, I still want to, but I just can't anymore.

SPEAKER_00 39:48

Yeah, that's how that's how it goes. For sure. It'll happen to all of us one day. Oh yeah. Can't escape it.

SPEAKER_02 39:58

Nope, can't as much as you want to try to, you just can't escape the whole age thing.

SPEAKER_01 40:06

Absolutely, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 40:10

Well, I got one more final question for you, Mr. Paul, as we're getting ready to wind down for the evening. It's my favorite question that I ask all my first-time guests. All right, and it's what's your why that keeps you going?

SPEAKER_00 40:25

What's my why? Like, why do I do this? Yeah, I I think just to see where it can go, like the unknown of the like we will what we just talked about, the unknown of what is out there, what's the future, like 10 years from now, what am I gonna be painting? I might not even even be painting western or fishy stuff, who knows? I don't know. And I think it's just the unknown of how much better at this can I get, will I get better? Uh and you know, and all these things for my family, too. Like, that's the why as well. I want to keep getting better so I can keep supporting my daughter's future, my wife, and all these things, so I can have fun and do an amazing career like art and also support the ones I love. Like, that's a pretty awesome situation to be in.

SPEAKER_02 41:19

Oh, yeah, for sure, man. Do you have any final thoughts, shout outs before we get ready to head out of here?

SPEAKER_00 41:28

Uh, shout outs, uh, I'd say shout outs to like Captains for Clean Water. Gotta follow those guys, what they're doing, amazing stuff. And in awesome, just just your local, your local groups that are trying to make your waterways better. Uh, it's easy to forget about them and think about captains and bonefish tarpon trust, which are both amazing organizations, but definitely support your local organizations. Like here's Charleston Waterkeeper. Um, it could be two or three of the people that are just trying to figure it out and trying to start little groups and organizations. And if they do events, just try your best to go support those events and just be around and and be a body there because that makes them feel good and makes the train keep rolling.

SPEAKER_02 42:12

Oh, yeah, for sure. Awesome. Well, I always like to end also with I always extend the invite. If you're ever up this way or ever want to come up to Delaware, do some fishing, feel free to hit me up. Would love to have you up here.

SPEAKER_00 42:26

Awesome. Well, thank you. I appreciate that. Are you gonna go to the Soul Fly event in Boston?

SPEAKER_02 42:31

Uh I have no idea when that is. I'll have to look into it and maybe see if I can swing it.

SPEAKER_00 42:38

I think it's like September 11th, 12th, something like that. I'm not gonna be able to make it, but you should definitely try to make it.

SPEAKER_02 42:46

Oh yeah. And um I definitely won't get down to Charleston, so if I'm ever down there, I'll definitely have to hit you up and we'll have to maybe get together or something.

SPEAKER_01 42:55

Yeah, holler. For real. Well, thank you.

SPEAKER_02 42:59

Oh, yeah. Thank you, Mr. Paul. I appreciate the time and thank you all for another episode of the Blue Hen Outdoors Podcast.