Blue Hen Outdoors Podcast
Hunting,travel,outdoors,comedy
Blue Hen Outdoors Podcast
Episode 82: Spook is back
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This episode we have the legend him self back Spook Spann we talk what’s on his hit list for this year, some recommendations/ what goes into his preseason prep, as well as some travel hunting what goes into it as well as getting permission for hunting and trusting a good guide, as well as controversial topics of Tags, OTC, and game and fish laws and regulations being abused
Welcome back to another episode of the Blue Hen Outdoors Podcast, brought to you by Grit and GameCo quality hunting apparel for all your uh outdoor adventures and dirty duck coffee. My personal favorite is the cinnamon teal. For grit and gameco, use code Hunter C at checkout for money off your order. And for Dirty Duck Coffee, use code Blue Hen at checkout for money off your order. And now let's get rolling into the episode. Alright, guys, welcome back to another episode of the Blue Hen Outdoors Podcast. I'm blessed and pleased to have back with us Mr. Spook Span. How you doing?
SPEAKER_00Good. How are you doing?
SPEAKER_01Good, good.
SPEAKER_00Good.
SPEAKER_01Got working a little bit, so but it's Friday and I got vacation next week, so well good. Oh yeah. Me and the family are going down to uh Myrtle Beach for a week with my son, so it should be fun.
SPEAKER_00Awesome. Yeah, that will be good. That'll be fun.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah. Well, let's get started. What's your uh what's on your hit list for this year, man? Where are you going? We got any cool, good big deer you've been seeing.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean I got uh I actually have found several bucks so far. I actually have a a nice deer here at home that I'm excited about. Uh it's the best deer I've had on camera here in probably 15 years. So um nice, pretty pretty happy about that. He's not a monster, but for Tennessee, he's really nice and he's six and a half years old. So he's definitely uh on the hit list here locally, and then um uh got a Kansas tag this year and and found a couple of really big ones in Kansas. Super excited about that. We had one of them just showed up here this past week, and so I'll be going up there soon and getting everything ready. I'm gonna go ahead and get my blind and my stand out, and um uh yeah, just just getting ready, getting ready. It's that time of year. Pictures are popping up, getting new pictures every day from all over the country. And uh so uh found a big one up in Canada. Hopefully, uh I'll be able to make it up there and chase him to him also.
SPEAKER_01Is he that same big one from up there that you talked about last time you were on here?
SPEAKER_00Or this is this one that we have this one that we have a picture of right now is a different one. Now that buck that that buck is still there. We we assume we he hasn't been seen so far yet, which is not unusual. Usually don't see him till the fall, and uh so you know we'll we're constantly looking for that one. Um, and he's been there two years in a row, so we're I know he didn't get killed last year unless he died from something else. So yeah, we're we're always looking for him for sure.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah, yeah. What goes all into your pre-season, into season prep, like as far as like putting food out or making food plots, e-scouting.
SPEAKER_00So a lot of it right now is getting food plots ready, um, and and trying to decide what we're gonna plant and where we're gonna plant it and and the way we're gonna set up. And um, so that's something that I'll be working on diligently over the next 30 days, uh, getting ready, getting food plots ready. And then, you know, I also use some other things uh to help with just, you know, uh keeping deer in the area. I mean, normally, very rarely, it's always so funny to me how people think that if you can feed or hunt over feed or anything like that, that you're automatically just going to kill a big buck. And that's just so not the case. You know, uh very rarely, I mean, almost never, do we kill a big deer coming in to feed? What you're hoping to do is mainly, and when I say feed, I'm talking about something that you put out. You know, yeah, they come into come into alfalfa and and soybeans and and food plots pretty good, but not not a you know, a pile of corn or this or that, you know. And um so what I what I my my goal is always to kind of try to uh have or institute like a community center. I just want to have activity. And so if you've got deer coming in and out of there, generally he's gonna come check it out uh at some point and and at least walk by. And and then in the rut, a lot of times I've had several giants over the years that they won't come in for anything, but they'll follow a doe in and stand out there 30 or 40 yards and watch her. And so then you'll have an opportunity. And so uh, so yeah, it's just a matter of you know, staying with it, getting ready. You know, I've got I've got uh several things that I use for, you know, to help keep deer used in the area, but um my favorite is just natural food plots. Um uh I use uh flawless white tail um seed blends with you know clover, chicory, and and brassicas and other things like that that I really, really like. And then um, of course, if you've got the ability and the a spot where you've got alfalfa is always awesome. Soybeans are awesome really early and then really late. And of course, standing corn is magic for a lot of the year. So it's just um, yeah, and and of course I try to make plans with my food sources that are gonna last from September to January, and um, and then also have some residual there for the deer to you know to get through the winter, even after seasons close. So, because as soon as as soon as you get to the end of season, I'm already planning for the next year.
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah, and plus having that residual food keeps them there throughout the year and exactly.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you want them you want them to know that they've got something there year after year, month after month, day after day. And um, that's that's part of you want you want a button buck to grow up thinking that that food source is gonna be there. It's been there his whole life, and you want it to be there when he's five, six, and seven. And once he gets accustomed to that, that's one of the important things I don't think people realize if is if a button buck grows up with a food source that he's been used to going to since the time he was born, he's gonna be more apt, more way more likely to visit it during hunting season when he gets old and mature.
SPEAKER_01Now, do you tailor your food plots and stuff to like the area, or do you kind of use the same kind of stuff you're planting wherever you're at? Like, say for example, like you're down in Tennessee, would you plant the same stuff that you'd plant where I'm at up here in Delaware or like versus out in Kansas?
SPEAKER_00Pretty much, pretty much. I mean, you know, obviously whatever's the most hardy that will last, you know, like you're further way further up north, so we might take a serious consideration on what's going to handle the winters better. Uh so that would be obviously something we'd want to look at really hard. But I mean, alfalfa, I mean, I've hunted over alfalfa from Tennessee to Canada and all out west. So it's I've had great experience with it in all conditions. Of course, corn is is standing corn works great everywhere, except it's alfalfa and corn are hard to grow south of Tennessee. So when you get, you know, when you get down in the southern states, it get that gets a little harder, especially alfalfa can be very uh actually, it's all obvious not even worth trying in the south, but um but clover, chicory, the brassica blends, uh oats and wheat and rice, they all work well pretty much everywhere. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Outside of food, do you do much like uh e-scouting on maps or like you know, I know a lot of people like to run cameras. I'm not the biggest fan of cameras, but I mean I've ran them in the past before. Like, how does that kind of play into your business?
SPEAKER_00Well, yeah, we run a lot of trail cameras. I mean, and put a lot of faith in trail cameras, mainly on making decisions. You know, we want to know, we want to be able to find our buck, identify him, um, and and you know, we're trying to hunt the biggest buck we can find. So trail cameras are a big part of that. And then trail cameras are a big part of it in the season when you're trying to decide which buck you're gonna hunt and when you're gonna hunt him. And you might have a buck that you know about that disappears for a month or two, and then boom, when he pops back up on your camera, that's a good time to to try to drop in there and hunt a few days and and hope that he's still in the area. And that works really well. Uh, and and you know, a lot of times these bucks will be nocturnal up until a certain time, maybe it's a moon phase or a weather pattern, and you get a picture of him, and then you can drop in there and and hunt for a few days, and and uh what of course while you're there, you're evaluating the camera, and it helps you just figure out when and where you want to hunt. And and then, you know, I mean, always you're always scouting, you know, different opportunities on just like you know, pre-camera days, uh, with um, you know, learning travel patterns, pinch points, funnels, uh, saddles, uh, just kind of like just the kind of places you look for trails, rubs, scrapes, and then you make plans. You know, a lot of times I try to hunt those kind of places in the mornings in the middle of the day during the rut, and then in the evenings, you know, a lot of times moving out to either the edges of the food sources or just back inside the woods, say 100 yards from the food sources. Because so many times if I'm if I'm consistently getting pictures of a monster 15 minutes to an hour after dark, then my thoughts are I can move back about if I can figure out what trail or what what the way he's accessing the area, I can move back a hundred yards or two hundred yards, and usually that works really good.
SPEAKER_01Nice kind of on that topic you see a lot of people, especially nowadays with like YouTube and social media and everything, the travel hunting has kind of been a bigger thing, and you've been doing that for years and years and years. How would you say someone should get started into that? As far as like, you know, like not getting caught up in the hype, so to speak, but like start out their own kind of way. What would you advise?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, the main thing is you, you know, you gotta find you know a place to hunt and you gotta establish relationships and and create opportunities, whether that's door knocking or you know, a friend that lives somewhere that that in an area, say Kansas or Ohio or somewhere, and you just you know trying to trying to find places to hunt. And and the people that I know that work really hard at it, like myself, I mean, if I if I say I'm gonna go spend a day in Ohio knocking knocking on doors, I've always gotten permission to hunt at least one or two properties. And and so, you know, that's that's a big part of it. Now, when you're that's getting permission to hunt a property is is generally fairly doable. It's when you are targeting a specific buck in a specific area, and you need to be, you know, say there's only like four or five properties that are really gonna benefit you, that's when it gets very challenging to say that now you've narrowed your narrowed your pool of opportunities down to just three or four or five properties, and getting permission to get on one of those is where it gets really challenging.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Now I know door knocking is very daunting to the people that don't really do it. I mean, I've done it a couple of times, and it, you know, I've had door slamming to my face, or I've had, oh, you know, they're like my pets, you know, why would you be out here?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So it's awkward. You just have to know it's kind of like it's kind of like uh dating when you're a teenager. You're just gonna, you're gonna, you might ask, you know, you might ask out, you may have to ask out 10 or 15 before somebody says yes.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, true.
SPEAKER_00And you just have to be willing to take the negative, because you know, we know we all know how this world works and how it is, and it's there's a lot of negativity, and and people just, you know, they don't want to have to deal with it. But generally, you can you can find somebody who is is not that way. And um, if you present yourself well, you know, you're you know, I don't I don't go up dressed in camo in my big four-wheel drive truck and pull up in the yard and you know, I I and wait till hunt season. I try to go in the summer, you know, um wear some, you know, nice casual clothes clean cut and you know, trucks cleaned up or a car. A lot of times I'll take my wife with me. I used to take my kids, my dog, everybody with me, you know. And once they see somebody who looks responsible and and and is nice and I'll talk to them. And a lot of times if I see something around the house that or the farm that, you know, I was like, man, that's a I love that old tract, that old 40, 20 John Deere tractor out there. How long have you had that? I've got a I got one of those myself, you know, just anything to create conversation, uh to to basically get somewhat off topic of what of the hunting thing and just just talk to them. You know, if they got kids, they got, you know, you talk about kids, they just whatever you see, being able to evaluate your surroundings and adjust really fast and accordingly helps a lot. And that's you know, some people are some people are good at it and some people aren't.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Because it's like you hear stories just like, oh, you you know, people start to sh try to shoe you way up then it's like you start trying to change the conversation and exactly get a better understanding of each other, and then usually by the end of it, you might have permission for the next year, or they'll be like, hey, I'll think about it, then they'll call you back or something.
SPEAKER_00Exactly, exactly. A lot of times I'll leave my number. A lot of times you'll you'll talk to one one of one or other of the spouses, and they're like, Well, I need to talk it over with my husband or with my wife. And I'm like, Yeah, I'll be glad to. And I said, if it helps you any, I'll be glad to speak to you together. So you want them to know that you're not intimidated or bothered by meeting them, talking to them. I stopped and talked to a landowner yesterday afternoon, and and at the beginning of, and Marty, my wife, was sitting in the truck, and at the beginning of the conversation, it looked like it was going to be really bad. By the time it was over, the guy was shaking my hand and patting me on the shoulder and said, Man, I really thank you for stopping by and and letting me know, you know, who you are. I was actually already had a place next to him to hunt. And I just saw him out in the yard and thought I'd stop and introduce myself because you never know when sometime your truck won't start or have some kind of I mean, I fell out of a tree one time and had to walk to the neighbor's house to get help. And so you want them to at least kind of know who you are so that if you something happens or you need something or or whatever, they they know who you are.
SPEAKER_01Right. Or in like the event that like if you're hunting and a dog gets out, and you know, you know you kind of know like where they're at, you can bring another dog back, or if it you know, you get a deer and it goes back when they're properly.
SPEAKER_00Exactly, exactly. And when you do something like that, you help a neighbor put up a mailbox or pull his truck out of the ditch or jump his tractor off or whatever it is, you you've got a friend for life, you know. I mean, and and they'll tell everybody in the community, and then and then what that allows you to do, you can say, Yeah, I'm friends with uh Mr. So-and-so down the road. He's he thought that I should come visit you and see if you might. Oh, you know, you know, Mr. Henry? Yes, sir, yes, sir. Oh, okay. Well, yeah, if you know him, then yeah, we we can work something out. It just relationships like that, that's just how how it starts. I mean, I've even gone to the local cafe, uh, just uh uh the local farm store. You can go hang out at the local farm store and get in a conversation with uh uh one of the farmers or one of the guys working at the counter or something like that and get a lot of mileage out of that.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah. Yeah, especially those guys behind the counter because everybody's talking to them about anything and everything.
SPEAKER_00Exactly.
SPEAKER_01You're almost like the bartender at the bar.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I met a guy at a at a store, uh, a farm store here just in the last year, and come to find out his uncle was one of my best friends. Oh wow, and we didn't even know each other. And uh and he's he's like, I I I think you were friends from my uncle Mike. And I was like, and I was like, Yeah, and he has he had passed away, actually had a motorcycle accident and passed away. But um I was like, Yeah, and well, ever since then, we're like, I mean, it's like we've known each other for 30 years, you know. Yeah, and and anything I need, he's like, Man, you need anything, just let me know. I'll if I don't have it, I'll get it, and you know, just you know, so yeah, those kind of things. I I literally have done that in every state and province and and and from Canada to Mexico, and that's how I've set up my network over a 30, 40 year period of finding big deer, getting help, uh, you know, getting the food plots planted, getting all the things done that go into it in multiple multiple places around North America. That's the way I've done it. Just like that. It's just a everybody thinks you're just going in throwing money around. That's not the way it works. Most of these people don't care how much money you got or what matter of fact, the best way I know to turn somebody off is to be thinking that you can buy them out or something, you know.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I mean, uh yeah, sometimes somebody's like, well, so-and-so offered me a thousand dollars for a lease or something like that. I was like, well, you know, if that's what you need, I can I can do that. You know, if you if and so sometimes, yeah, you have to pay a lease or pay for an access or something like that. Uh, but everybody, uh so many people have a misconception thinking that if you've got money, you can just throw at it. And you are I know people that spent millions of dollars and have never killed a big deer. And you know, and it's it's still come the deer has no idea how much money you've spent.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00He has no idea. He it doesn't stop him from walking across the property to the other side of the river or the other side of the highway or whatever. Has nothing to do with it. It all it does is just it sometimes it helps you have access to a place to hunt. But you know, you have to have it to buy fuel and hotels and food and and seed and tree stands and bows and arrows, and so yeah, it you know that's just part of it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Now, kind of the other side of that coiner spectrum, guides and outfitters. You know, you have some guys that want to go get into like travel hunting and going to cool places, but they're working 40-50 hours a week and can't really do all that work that goes into it. Well what what's your opinion on that?
SPEAKER_00Well, I I have a lot of friends who are guides and outfitters around the world, and and most of the time I don't go with somebody unless I've got a really good recommendation, which is one thing I suggest that if you're going to use a guide or an outfitter, you need to, you know, it'd be nice if you've got somebody that can recommend uh them that person or has experience or a reference, and then um, you know, spend some significant time talking to them, let them know what your expectations are. I actually um was uh messaging with a couple just up right up until I got on the podcast. And and um then um they can be, I mean, a good outfitter is awesome, you know, even though it's their business, most of the time they're doing it because it's also their passion. And so um, but establishing a relationship with a good outfitter and becoming a friend and hunting with them over and over is normally a very good way to do it. Now, the problem with guys, and I used to be that. Guy. You know, I had to work all the time. I had two weeks vacation a year. And so trying to strategically plan that two weeks would give you the best opportunity to kill a deer or whatever it is thereafter can be that's that can be challenging and difficult. And you're relying on Mother Nature so much in the weather. And most of the time, if you go on a five or six or seven-day hunt, I mean, realistically, if half of that, if you have good weather on half of that hunt, you've done really good. You know, so you know, so many times you get somewhere and it turns off hot and and uh you know there's just the the movement's really down, and it's just but you know you you got to do what you gotta do, and um and the more flexible you can be with your schedule and your time, the the better you can make it. But if you're having to designate a week months and months ahead of time, and you don't know what the weather's gonna do, it's gonna be challenging for sure.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah. And usually it's like guys in that situation are like, I just want to be the most successful I can, you know. Like I like I like we said, I got a week off of work, I'm just trying to make sure this week counts. And not saying that good outfitters and guides won't accommodate or try to help them out the best they can with the knowledge that they give. But like you said, there's a lot that goes into it outside of that, like planning so far ahead, it's like what really could happen. So that's where it's important to have that good relationship with a guide or outfitter.
SPEAKER_00Exactly. And and that doesn't happen overnight. You can't just expect to book one hunt with somebody and establish now the way you really establish rapport and and uh uh you know have is when you're if you're in camp and you're respectful and nice and appreciative and thankful and all the things that you know and what you want them to say is man, that that was a good guy. We had a good time. I'm you know, I'd like to have him back. When you get their attention by you know being that person, then it goes a long way. And and that's another thing that's really helped me through the years. You know, uh it, you know, it's important to me that when I walk out the door and I leave uh a place like that, that they have enjoyed the experience as much or more than I have, and they're anxious to have me back. Because there's gonna be times when you when that happens, you're gonna get a phone call and a special opportunity is gonna come up. And that's just from you know being a good, honorable, nice um person.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Have you ever um I don't know if too many guys were after us through this, but like have you ever helped to like or offered to help like in the offseason with some stuff for them?
SPEAKER_00Oh, all the time. I just got back. I just went to Kansas and helped my my outfitter buddy out there for a couple of days doing sets and stuff, and so all the time. That's that's a great way to help show your sincerity and your you know, your commitment and everything. Absolutely. I mean, that's one of the best things you can do. You nothing, nothing is gonna, that's the that's so much of what happens behind the scenes that people don't realize that you have to do to. I mean, when I find out a if there's a like like I'm messaging three guys right now, I just started talking to here this week. I told them, hey, if you need something, if you need me to come up, if you want to meet, if you want to hang out for a couple days, you need me to help you do something, I'll be glad to do that. I want you to really get to know who I am and what I'm trying to accomplish. And and I want you to be comfortable and I want you to have fun, as much fun with it as I'm gonna have. That means a lot to them, you know. Absolutely. That's I mean, that's a good that's a great way to yeah, you know, move yourself up the ladder really fast.
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah, for sure, for sure. Especially like in the off-season when they don't have too much help but really doing it themselves.
SPEAKER_00It's like exactly, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Outside of whitetail, getting into like mule deer and elk and kind of stuff like that. How would you suggest somebody start trying to get into hunting those or get into like trying to go for those species as a first timer?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so it admittingly, it's getting harder and harder just because it's it's gotten so expensive. Uh outside of you know doing a do-it-yourself hunt, uh, where you you know either buy a tag across the counter or you um, you know, you you have a a drop hunt where somebody drops you off or a pack-in hunt or something like that. You know, the those hunts are fun, especially if you do it with a couple buddies and you you you're you know all about the experience and all. I mean your success ratio drops tremendously, you know, when you when you're doing that. But but the and I've done it, and and I I had a good time, and sometimes I killed and sometimes I didn't. Most of the time I still was hunting something really big. I mean, the first elk hunt I ever went on, I hunted nine days and I passed up. I never killed an elk before, and I probably passed up 20 bulls, 330 and smaller, because I was like, I'm not I'm not shooting a bull, I'm shooting a 350 plus bull, or I ain't killing one, and I never even killed one before. So when you and I came home empty-handed.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I mean, I almost killed a big one two or three different times, and it just didn't work out. I was hunting in the Gila in New Mexico, but um uh you really so there again, a lot of times it comes down to what you're willing to do and what you can afford to do. Obviously, that is something that if you can afford to spend a little bit more and go with an outfitter who has a good reputation and a reputation for quality animals and a quality area, that's gonna it's it's a little bit different than white tail hunting. Uh you know, I'm just gonna, I mean, mule deer and elk hunting, uh everything is easier than whitetail. Every species is easier. A lot of it just comes down to what you can afford to do and how much time you've got. And uh if you, you know, if you can afford, you know, the difference between going on a do-it-yourself hunt somewhere in Colorado where you, you know, you might kill a 260 to 300 inch bull and you're gonna spend, you know, maybe $3,000 on tag and food and travel versus going to White Mountain and spending, you know, $25,000 and you you know, you're probably gonna kill a $350 plus bull. So it's just uh that's that's a lot of difference. And so it's just a matter of finding, you know, finding or knowing what your limitations, what your expectations are, and what you can afford, how much time you can get off work, and then you gotta plan accordingly.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01What do you think about the access to tags? Because like you kind of see uh OTC tags are kind of phasing out a little bit as far as like with all this.
SPEAKER_00Well the whole tagging thing in the United States is so different, so many different species. I mean, it it is the places where you can apply for a tag for like a mule deer or elk or sheep or whatever. I mean, that's the lotteries and things like that. Uh, a lot of people like though, a lot of I know guys that do that every year, and and you it's a lot of times after you know 15, 20, 25 years, they they get drawn. I I've never been, I I just those having to send in and apply for those tags are exhausting to me. So I just never have done it. I've I've bought some landowner vouchers and some um states before, but I mean I think that the states should have some over-the-counter tags for, you know, every state's different. It's kind of just according to how you can't treat every state and every unit the same because they're not the same. And so you just have to decide, you know. Unfortunately, I just don't have much confidence in any game and fish department making that decision. Because it just they don't for me, to me, what I've seen over the years and and all the people that I've talked to, most of the time the decisions are that are being made have little to do with the deer or the animal itself, and more to do with political and governmental and financial reasons. And so um, and I'm trying to be as nice as I can about that. I could talk about this for days, but um uh yeah, I mean, you know, over-the-counter, but there's still a lot of places where you can get, you know, over-the-counter tags. Uh, it's just and and um uh I I personally don't like, let's just say Kansas, which is one of the most popular or maybe the most popular deer hunting state. Uh I think that they should go back to the landowner voucher method, just because I believe if you're a landowner, you should be able to, and you're not a hunter, but you're a landowner. I think that you should have the opportunity to have a tag that you can transfer to somebody else, which is the way it used to be. And so what what what was uh aggravating, so the reason that changed, and everybody can say what they wanted to, but I it's all about money, the state realized that they weren't getting the landowners were selling their vouchers for $500 or $1,000 to a to a uh a non-resident or to an outfitter, and the state realized they weren't getting anything out of it, so they changed the law. And and uh I think that if you own land in a state, uh you should be able to uh to get a tag there. Now, you you do you do get a tag, but if you're not a hunter, then what your tag didn't do you any good.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_00So you can't transfer it. And that's the problem. And uh so uh, you know, I'm a big I'm a I mean I have a lot of people that hate on me because I believe that if you're a landowner, if you own a land of a certain size, and let's just say um uh what's a fame uh what's a famous one one tag, one tag state. Um let's just say uh Ohio.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00You get one tag in Ohio. If you own two thousand acres, I think you should, in your landowner, I think you should be more allowed more than one tag.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Now, you you you know, I think you now, you know, then you come up with the argument, well, you uh are we giving that tag away? Are we selling it? Well, we know the government's anything associated with the government, they're not gonna give you anything. So let's just say you have to pay $200 or $300 or whatever for the additional tag. Uh, I just think that you should be able to get an additional tag for your if you're a landowner. Uh, I know there's been some uh talk about, you know, in um like say Oklahoma about going to uh one tag instead of two. You know, okay. Well, that's that's okay for some people, but if I know some landowners out there that own 10,000 acres.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_00I think they should be allowed. And everybody's like, oh, you're just for the rich, or you're just the no, it has nothing to do with that. You're you own the land, you're the one paying the taxes, you're the one you know creating enormous amounts of income for the state and the area, you should be able to get another tag, if not two or three more tax, right?
SPEAKER_01Especially if you have that like a couple thousand acres and stuff like that. Like exactly, exactly.
SPEAKER_00And that's not enough. If you're trying to manage your property, it's it's it's almost impossible to do it with one tag. And um, uh so you know, I'm a firm believer in that. I don't think you can treat everybody the same because everybody's not the same. You know, if I'm a non-resident and I'm going to a state to hunt, to hunt on public land, I should be able to get a tag, one tag. That's it. You know, and and if why is it why would it be why is it fair for the a landowner right over there, a resident of that state that's got two or three thousand acres or even a thousand acres to get the same amount of tags as me, and I'm a non-resident coming up there hunting on public land or any land for that. Yeah. And uh so I mean, I catch a lot of flack over that. I commented on uh rack junkies or something not long ago, and I know that guy was thinking me because it just exploded, people lost their minds when I said that. But I mean, it's just you know, it just is what it is. Now, I also think that those tags should be transferable for the landowner who doesn't hunt, right? Just like they used to be in Kansas, and uh you can I think you they still have landowner vouchers in Colorado. I'm pretty sure.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I was gonna say, I think New Mexico and Colorado are kind of the landowner that can transfer the tags over, exactly.
SPEAKER_00So, so I like that. I think that's a fair and of course I think the whole thing in Iowa is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard in my life and is come 100% non-constitutional. How can you tell me I own land anywhere in the United States of America and you tell me I can't hunt it?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00That if somebody will take that to the Supreme Court, they'll beat it. Some if somebody'll take the time and the money, I'm shocked that some of the wealthy guys that I know that have uh bought land in Iowa over the years and can't get a tag haven't haven't challenged that. I just don't think people have thought about it. There is you just can't tell me that you can tell a person that owns land and just because he doesn't live in the state, he can't hunt it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I'm I'm I'm I'm calling BS on that.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, because I'm not too too familiar with it, but I think correct me if I'm wrong.
SPEAKER_00I'm very familiar with it.
SPEAKER_01So if you if you I used to own the own land and live in the state, you can get it now? Yeah. I was saying if you if you own land in Iowa and don't live there, you can't get a tag.
SPEAKER_00You have to you have to draw just like a non-resident who doesn't own land. So how are you gonna put me in the same if I own land in Iowa? How are you gonna put me in the same category competing against somebody who's applying in Iowa who doesn't own land or pay taxes?
SPEAKER_01Right. Yeah, that's not right at all.
SPEAKER_00No, it's the only state that does that. I mean, that's ridiculous. Did you did you realize that?
SPEAKER_01No, I I knew it was something screwy or weird about it. I just didn't know that the whole particulars to it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and and and if you move to Iowa, you get three tax. See, I disagree. I disagree with that. I think it should be based on how much land you own. Now, I think you should get a tag. Don't get me wrong. That's what my previous argument is. I definitely think you should get a tag, but I don't think you should just be automatically you can you can own an acre in Des Moines and live in the city and you still get three tags. And then the guy out here that owns two or three thousand acres to paying all these taxes and farming and and doing it, got tractors and all this stuff. He's working, and he's only he gets the same amount of tags as you get. That's why I'm saying there's there's so many variables that people aren't taking into consideration. And what's what's funny is uh, you know, uh so many times anything to do with the government is so income uh driven, they can actually generate themselves more income by doing what I say, what I the way I'm talking about.
SPEAKER_01Right, because you got I think you have people coming in to buy hotels, food, you're you're paying for tags, you're paying for ISD licenses, you're paying for you're it's it's pretty much almost like another tourist attraction, so to speak.
SPEAKER_00So you have a whole nother that's exactly that's what it is. That's exactly what it is in a plain term. It's a tourist attraction. Coming to hunt in a state that has big bucks or good pheasant hunting or or whatever it is, that's a tourist attraction. In in so many words. Yeah, I may not be driving around looking at a monument or uh you know something like that, but I'm I'm I'm choosing to do my time there as a hunter, it's the same thing. Oh, yeah. I mean, we're we're spending tons of money, yeah. I mean, the tax revenue that's generated is so enormous it's not even computable in the hunting industry. But for some reason, uh our uh game and fish departments just continually want to suppress it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And discourage it.
SPEAKER_01Well, I mean, that's even kind of like the thing that's going on in Oregon. I don't know if it still is or not, but have you heard about the bill they're trying to pass in Oregon to ban uh hunting? There's a there's a they're trying to pass a bill in Oregon that bans uh uh like farming, like cattle farming and stuff, hunting and fishing and trapping.
SPEAKER_00Wow. Unbelievable. Yeah, yeah. See, I don't that's not that's that whoever whatever happens that they need to take it to the Supreme Court. That's unconstitutional. You can't do that, right? Period, period. That's just ridiculous.
SPEAKER_01Well, and then you also see on the other side of that you have states like I think Colorado is one of them, and I think New Jersey's getting ready to be one too if they pass it, but they pass they're gonna try to pass hunting as a constitutional right.
SPEAKER_00Well, that it should be. I mean, it's I mean, that's it, it's it absolutely should be. Of course, I I personally think there again is another thing that's very, I'm sure a lot of people are gonna lose their minds over. I mean, personally, I think if you're hunting on your own land, you shouldn't it shouldn't cost you anything. I mean, and and you know the fact the the the claim that they try to make that the deer or the animals belong to the state, that's that's that's terrible. That's a terrible claim.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00Well, I mean the next time I hit a deer with my truck, you need to pay for getting my truck fixed.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00You know, I mean, it's ridiculous.
SPEAKER_01Well, even in uh areas where you're like uh where states border each other, like you know deer walk to and from each state, they don't know state lines.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it the it's the whole it's just ridiculous the mentality, but it's it's uh it's uh it's all about they don't want a landowner to be able to hunt their own land because they're again they want to generate they want to generate uh sales out of that, and so they they're gonna they want you to have to buy a little piece of paper that says, oh, well, okay, now you can hunt. It's ridiculous.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah, it's yeah. Hopefully they get uh wized up in the Supreme Court can step in a little bit and try to try to get the biggest thing.
SPEAKER_00About towards helping uh hunters and fishermen. They're so engulfed in all these other political, what they consider bigger headlines, uh that they they don't um they don't they don't care you know they they appoint just like um you know our governor here who I like I know him I used to have his phone number uh he's he's he's personal friends with personal friends of ours and I thought that when he got into office that he would appoint somebody at the head of game and fish that actually uh you know could make a difference but what they do is is they use it for a position he appointed somebody who knows absolutely nothing about it you know he just they just nothing has changed it's just as corrupt and and mishandled as it's always been and you know that's it's it's somewhat the same at the federal level I love Trump I love Trump's family I I like everything he stands for for the you know the way he's do running the country I think he's basically saved our country but I'm disappointed in Eric and Don Jr. Because they've done nothing to help with the game and fish laws that are misrepresented and miswritten and everything else. I mean the Lacey Act is one of the most hideous laws in the history of mankind and they're in the perfect position to get something done. Now I know their dad he's got bigger fish to fry. Totally get it that's why it should be on them to get something done you know and and uh and if you can't tell me if his two sons bring in uh you know something that's makes sense that you know maybe they had a committee or whatever that that I mean I was actually supposed to be on a a national committee to um uh oversight and review uh game laws here in the United States and nothing's happening.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_00And uh you know they they just we're gonna sit around and everybody's gonna is going to just uh you know sit around and watch this term go by and and nothing's gonna get done. I mean we still can't import polar bears we still can't import uh uh ivory elephants and lions from Africa and all these ridiculous um rules he needs that all should have been changed by now already yes there I there I don't see anybody doing anything to help the hunter yeah exactly except I mean you know uh NRA fights your right to bear arms very strongly and does a good job with that but that's not that doesn't have anything to do with hunting right that's just that's just your you know us being able to have weapons and uh and so you know and all these organizations that claim they're doing this and that they ain't doing squat none of them doing nothing to help the hunter they're all doing it to help themselves yeah it's it's all gotten political and ballot box quote unquote ballot box biology when they should let hunters and people who are knowledgeable about these things make these decisions yeah well that's a that's another big problem you get into is most of the politicians the congressmen the representatives and at the state and national level they they don't know diddly squat about hunting they don't know they they can't differentiate they come in and they've got some some uh you know uh game official telling them one thing and then they got somebody else like Ted Nugent or somebody else telling them another and they they they don't have sense enough or enough knowledge to differentiate what's what's real and what's not and what makes sense and what's the truth and what's not. We dealt with that here in Tennessee we're trying to get the baiting law passed and and uh the the guys had they just don't know and then the uh game and fish brings in people whom they call experts and uh trying to say one thing well they're they're they're not they're not basing you know there's they're trying to say that um you know uh well for for they for years they just tried to say that feeding was unethical.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_00Well that's not for you to decide that's for each hunter to decide himself what he considers to be you know uh ethical for himself. And the other so then they tried to get on this um you know well it's not good for the deer it's it's uh you got CWD and blah blah blah and they just use every lame brain excuse they can to you know because the more laws and the more rules and the more technicalities they are the more tickets they can write. Right exactly and and that brings money back into the exactly they have no oversight they're just running them up there's nobody that nobody that oversees them because the their positions are uh paid for by hunters and license sales and and fines and different things like that and so there's there's nobody over they have no government no and and not that I'm for any big government or making the government bigger but they somehow somewhere they've got to have some oversight and they got to answer somebody right now they don't have to answer to anybody and it's it's become a real big issue and problem. I mean they've taken a lot of the fun out of hunting by you know um uh you know the way they've mistr the way they're mistreating and it's not about the uh protection uh or the uh the resource which is our game it's uh there it's all about just trying to catch somebody with a big name so they can try to make a name for themselves exactly and even me I know personally growing up it's like my dad and I've had friends that have told me that like US Fish and wildlife game boards and all that have more power than the police sometimes. And it's like well there's a lot of misconceptions about that. That's actually for the most part not true. That's just what they've told everybody through the years and nobody's challenged it. Yeah and and uh uh you know judges most of the judges and attorneys can't stand game and fish because they're constantly bringing in these little pinny anty nothing things that are technicalities or they've they've entrapped somebody in something or just falsely accused somebody and what happens is they know where the pain threshold is they'll put a fine on you and it's like well he'll never go hire an attorney because if he hires an attorney it's going to cost him more than a fine. So so many people just choose to pay it and go on rather than fight it. And that's how they just and then and then that's just snowballed it gets a little bigger and a little bigger and a little bigger until they just think that they can just do whatever they want anytime they want and nobody ever challenged it and they they spread these rumors well we can come in your house anytime we want no you can't no they can't yeah they can't do that they tried that with me and I you know I challenged it in court and and we won you know so they can't they can't do that.
SPEAKER_01Yeah that's good to know now.
SPEAKER_00What's that?
SPEAKER_01That's good to know to know now.
SPEAKER_00Well I mean it's just I mean they they they have that I mean they have power or whatever yeah they try they they abuse the open field at what they're like open field clause if they called it saying that there if there's a a suspicion of uh illegal activity they can just automatically come on your property and then they make up some they make up some mistruth about saying well we got a call we got a report no they didn't okay who was it well we can't tell you that's that's confidential bull you didn't get a call you just you're just doing what you want to do and of course we got that changed here in Tennessee they can't no longer come on your property without a search warrant yeah and which is really big for really big and and there's other states that are slowly other states are coming on board with that same thing you know and it's and you know if the FBI and the CIA can't come on your property without a search warrant why in the world would a game warden be able to exactly so it's just it's just you know I mean I you can tell I'm really you know I've had I've had um you know a lot of bad experiences from them and and and they just do a lot of really you know bad uh uneth unethical things yeah and and they've just gotten away with it for so long that people just have this this misconception that they can do all this stuff and and they can't yeah but nobody's willing to go nobody's willing to spend the money it takes to go to court and fight it most of the time most of the time if you take it to court it gets thrown out yeah because it's but it costs you three times more to do it right yeah yeah and that's where you your point of is it worth it paying all that extra or just pay the fine to yeah yeah and and and so that's that you know that's one of the problems and and in the beginning it kind of started out little because when I was young this kind of stuff didn't happen this has all just happened in the last um you know really 40 years and it's just gotten worse and worse and worse and I've I've heard so many nightmare stories from all over the country it's in it's crazy. Yeah crazy yeah yeah I can only imagine it's it's actually really it's actually really sad. Yeah it is sad a sad pitiful uh you know a sad pitiful pitiful uh situation when when somebody targets a good person over uh basically nothing you know they they just you know they and if you're the more successful you are the more likely you are to get targeted and harassed and ticketed and and have to deal with it for sure yeah well switching topics a little bit I know we could probably go on about this for hours and hours I'm not gonna change I get so aggravated by it I'd like to talk about something more fun yeah I I seen you've been out at a couple shows this year how how was your experience at the uh trade shows I've seen you were at the Deere Expo and NWTF I tell you I've been so blessed so I don't even know what the right term to use um the support and um just uh I don't know I hate to say it the wrong way but just you know I just believe Spook Nation is stronger than it's ever been um we've just you know so many kids that are still watching my content uh you know a lot of I mean every show I've been to I'm having eight nine ten eleven twelve teenager year old teenagers college kids coming up and I'm at I'm you know I had some some kids come up to me at uh at different shows and at uh ATA and I signed autographs and put my picture and just talked to them you know really enjoyed it and I asked the parents I was like how do they even know who I am you know and it's like they watch you on YouTube and they see you on Facebook and stuff and I was like that's awesome and so I'm really getting I'm I'm right on the precipice of um really blowing up uh and putting a lot of really awesome content on YouTube and uh my social media is really just exploding right now. And um being at the shows and just talking and and and I hadn't been to ATA in a while and I really didn't know what it was going to be like. I was like shoot I'm not sure anybody here will even know who I am you know not that that matters but when you're trying to do the things we're doing it helps if people you know know a little bit about you and oh it was it was awesome. I mean I I had uh so many great positive conversations and met new people established new relationships friendships uh met you know a lot of uh people who still watch the content and and um were encouraging to you know they we want to see more we want this we want you to do this you know and so same way at NWTF and then at the expo the other day was just was just awesome I can't I can't uh I'm so happy uh to just know that having a positive uh you know effect on especially younger people and uh you know I just think it's real important to for you know to be a good Christian person let them see that you're a believer and and you know that you love to hunt love to you know enjoy the outdoors uh have a good enjoy your time with your family uh you know be a a you know God-fearing church going person that and I I I think that kids and people need to see that to get and you know also too on the other side just being I think it's important people to realize how important good health is and somebody that you know tries to be healthy has a good a great marriage uh great kids grandkids and just you know all those things to set an example of how you know uh a life that they would like to try to to try to have and strive for and so uh I'm very excited uh all the things we got coming up for sure.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah do you have any uh shows you're I don't know if there's too many coming up more this uh towards the end of this year but do you have any more that you're going to this year or you just kind of getting them up for next year?
SPEAKER_00Probably not just probably getting ready for next year because we're getting close enough to hunting season now that um uh I'm I'm in 100% uh hunt mode or preparation mode and so every day it's we're getting ready we're doing I'm doing something every day I got a lot of traveling to do to go uh I I found a really big buck in a state yesterday uh that I've got to spend some significant time figuring it out and and and uh so I'm gonna be pretty much just full blown getting ready. I've got you know a couple of giants on camera that I'm so excited about that's gonna people are going to lose their minds over. So and and I got some really good footage that uh I'm gonna come out with on YouTube um this fall and that I've nobody's ever seen before that I've just had in the in my library that I just hadn't hadn't used yet.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah can't wait to see it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah I I'm excited.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah well thank you spook I appreciate the time as always man it's always a pleasure having you on enjoyed it I appreciate you having me definitely we'll have to get you back on like I said before in the future anytime anytime happy to do it and the Obe Envoy always still stands if you're ever up this way and want to go hunting or get into some stuff just let me know man I appreciate that very much and hopefully I can bump into you at a show this year because I'm trying to get out to a couple more shows and yeah yeah that'd be all face to face for sure absolutely absolutely thank you again and thank you all for another episode of the Bluehead Outdoors podcast