Shooting the 2026 PSE Bows: Mach Series Upgrades & Sicario Results

Forget marketing numbers—let’s talk verified speed you can actually shoot. We put PSE’s 2026 bows on the line and dig into the two big stories: the new FDS cam and the Sicario’s shockingly manageable velocity. We share real chrono data, how the draw force is front‑loaded to your strongest range, and why dynamic brace height at full draw matters more than the spec on the limb sticker. If you’ve ever wondered how to get heavy arrows moving fast without turning tuning into a chore, this one’s for you.

We break down the feel differences between the FDS and EC2 cams, explain why the Mach 33 still sits in the sweet spot of forgiveness and stability, and show where the Sicario stretches the envelope without punishing your shoulders. You’ll hear our exact setups, including vane choices to avoid contact on the Sicario’s 5.25‑inch brace height, limb-driven vs cable-driven rests, and arrow weights that keep broadheads flying straight in the 280–295 fps “tunes easy” zone. We also talk stabilizer weighting to tame post‑shot pop and how the larger bearings and recessed posts on the new FDS cam boost longevity and consistency across the lineup.

Beyond specs, we zoom out to what actually helps you shoot better: honest fits, reps, and access. We cover dealer realities, why demo days and TAC presence change minds, and how PSE’s carbon durability and repeatable EZ.220 shims cut downtime. If you’re choosing between the Sicario for raw speed or the Mach 33 for everyday confidence, we lay out who benefits most from each, plus a practical gear build for both hunting and TAC.

If this helped you dial your next setup, follow and subscribe, share the show with a bow buddy, and drop a review with your arrow weight and speed—what’s your sweet spot?

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Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome And 2026 PSE Overview
• 2:45 First Impressions And FDS Cam Upgrades
• 7:55 Draw Force Curves And Real-World Feel
• 14:10 Why 80 Pounds Is Less Necessary Now
• 19:30 Dynamic Brace Height And Full Draw Stability
• 25:50 Mach Series vs Competitors On Shootability
• 31:15 Sicario Specs, Valley, And Speed Reality
• 36:30 Tuning At Higher Speeds And Arrow Choices
• 42:40 Brace Height Pitfalls And Rest/Vane Setup
• 47:20 Post-Shot Feel And Stabilizer Weighting
• 52:00 EZ.220 Shims And Practical Tuning
• 56:20 Who Should Pick Sicario vs Mach 33
• 1:01:10 Building A Sicario: Rests, Sights, Arrows
• 1:07:00 New Arrows: Victory VLR vs Axis
• 1:10:15 The Archery Project Resources And Clips
• 1:14:45 FDS Defined: Force Distribution & Stability
• 1:20:00 Durability, Carbon Riser Strength, Reliability
• 1:25:20 Aluminum Decree: Strengths And Weight Tradeoffs

Transcript

Zakk Plocica: 0:00

All right, guys, 2026 PSE bows. I've got JR and Brian here, and we are going to discuss the new new from PSE, right? A lot of talking points. The big one being the Sicario, which I think is what everybody's talking about, the new speedbow from PSE. But we're going to cover some of the things we've looked at. I mean, because finally we've had a little bit of time to shoot these bows, digest them, do a little bit of testing, get some feedback on them, and now we're going to discuss and talk about all the new stuff. So again, welcome back to the Archery project, guys. I'm your host, Zach Placea. Thanks for joining me. And we are going to go into depth on these things. So what do you guys think? First impressions right out of the gate. What's your opinions on the new the new, I mean, the upgrades to the mock series and then the new Sicario?

Bryan Gay: 0:49

So first impressions just look, it's it's got more of a lobe to the cam. Um and then you get behind it and you just feel it just feels different than the EC2. The EC2 to me is the pinnacle of CAMs because I've shot it for two years now. And it's just the smoothest I've shot with uh still getting performance. This gets um a little bit more performance. Um in my case specifically, but there's a ton more little things that they've done to increase the value, I think.

Zakk Plocica: 1:23

I agree. Yeah, the the F I I personally think the FDS cam is a massive upgrade, no matter the the whichever platform you're on, whether it's the Mach 30, it's the the 33, the Sicario. I haven't messed with the decree yet. None of us have. Um, but I think it is a huge step up from the EC2 cam, just with the features that they've enhanced with it, right? The one being the the draw stop uh and then the recess post, uh, and then the increase in the size of the bearings, right? I mean, because PSE is known performance, speed, shootability, right? Right. They're designed to perform whenever you're in the field. They're designed for the bow hunter. And I think they do that very well. The bows are very shootable. So, JR, what do you think? I mean, as far as just first impressions of the bow, what's your opinion?

JR Gettler: 2:11

I love the changes, like especially what you said, the string stop. That is my biggest um upgrade that I like the most.

Zakk Plocica: 2:17

I think that's like massive.

JR Gettler: 2:19

Yeah. Um, the new cam, I really like it a lot. It almost looks like uh a combination between the EC cam and the E2 cam.

Zakk Plocica: 2:27

Like they had a baby.

JR Gettler: 2:28

Yep, exactly. It's like they had a baby, and it's making a great performing cam, in my opinion. Um, you're getting more speed out of it without increasing draw uh the draw cycle. You know, it's not increasing the draw curve much. Right.

Zakk Plocica: 2:43

So funny you say that, right? I've been reading YouTube comments, and there's some there's some pretty intelligent individual individuals that are commenting on our stuff, right? And bringing some things to light. And apparently I am the minority uh when it comes to probably you as well, Brian, when it comes to um capability of drawing a bow, I guess, right? Because it one of his his comments is you're you're not a good person to judge draw curve. He's like, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. Because he's like, you guys shoot 80-pound bows, it's not relevant to the rest of us. And I'm I'm like, I took it for granted that all of our subscribers, viewers, and listeners are strong as can be.

Speaker 4: 3:22

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 3:23

Like I just assume most of our guys are strong. Then they are like the majority of the people that we deal with, where we're at, are pretty stout individuals. So I took it for granted that everybody can draw an 80-pound bow. And I get it, not everybody can, right? Uh, but I do think the bows are very manageable. And going back to the draw curve of this new cam, for me, it doesn't feel any stiffer.

Bryan Gay: 3:48

And you don't need 80 pounds.

Zakk Plocica: 3:49

And you don't need 80 pounds on this. But but that being, you know, the way it draws versus the EC2 cam, I I I personally thought I'm like, dude, there's no difference. Like it's as smooth and you get more performance out of the bow. And um this one guy actually broke it down, uh, Jay Wilde 5360 from uh the Extreme Outfitters YouTube channel. Um and he was just talking about the draw curve. And let me see if I can pull it up here. Um he's talking about the speed is gained from the brace height, it would be 2.5 feet per second. That's the only difference in brace. Uh it's draw force, force curve, whether some of us feel it or not, is there very simple to measure with the curve. If I could post a picture, I would. I posted the DFC numbers above for you to reference. Hopefully, this helps some people. So whenever I drew the bow back, I'm like, man, this thing is incredibly smooth. And yes, I think if you look at paper, there the draw for force curve, there's obviously a difference. But to the the person that just picks the bow up and draws, I don't, I don't think most people are gonna feel the difference. Right.

JR Gettler: 5:00

No, it's it's very subtle, in my opinion, and it's it's very hard to tell. Like even shooting bows, both the bows, cam, both the cams back to back, it's very hard to tell a difference.

Zakk Plocica: 5:08

I can't tell different, especially in the Mach 33. Right. Maybe the Mach 30. It's a little bit stiffer.

Bryan Gay: 5:15

It but it's at the beginning. They put it at the beginning where everything is primed. So I can give you a pillow and you can hold it close all day long. But if I tell you to put it at arm's length and stretch it out, you're not gonna hold it very long, I promise. No, that's the point. It's where they put it, and that's where the draw force curve is, is where your initial pull, that's where the most of your strength is gonna come from. Right.

Zakk Plocica: 5:36

So I think it's a fantastic feeling. Um, and the performance you get at it, like we said, is phenomenal.

Bryan Gay: 5:42

Um it's there's there's no reason right now. This is point in case, my very specific why did I go to 80-pound Matthews last year? Because I wanted to be at 300 feet per second at a 440-grade arrow. Because I don't change my arrow setup for attack for hunting for anything. That's why I went with it. I can shoot 285 out of the Mach 30, but if I get a Mach 30 with the FDS cams in it and still shoot 300 feet a second, why would I not do that at 70 pounds? That is exactly why I went to an 80-pound mod on the Matthews last year if it was to get that speed. Yeah. So there's no reason for it now. They they've taken they've I won't say they've taken 80 pound out of the game, you know, but then you get into those 310, 12, 20, 30, 40, it's gonna be like you said, a nightmare to tune.

Zakk Plocica: 6:35

Especially with a broadhead.

Bryan Gay: 6:37

A fixed blade broadhead is gonna be a nightmare.

Zakk Plocica: 6:40

Yeah.

Bryan Gay: 6:41

Going that fast, you're gonna, I mean, spine of arrow comes into play. I mean fletchings, the knock, the I mean, everything comes into play.

Zakk Plocica: 6:50

Yeah, I agree. I think, and you make a good point, like you want to shoot at a little bit heavier arrow faster. The FDS cam allows for that.

Bryan Gay: 6:58

Absolutely.

Zakk Plocica: 6:59

And you don't sacrifice everything, and that was one of the things that I noticed is like you gain everything from this cam and you sacrifice nothing. That was my big takeaway from it. So the Mach 33 in particular, I think is is very easy to to to key in on that and identify that, right? So we did some testing. Um me and JR have played with these uh, I would say quite a bit since we've got them. Uh, but I did some more testing versus the EC2 cam versus the FDS cam at I think the arrows uh it's an Eastern Axis four mil at 443 grains, right around. And uh I shot the EC2 cam at 28.5 inches, 70 pounds with that arrow at 85% let off. I got 284 feet per second. I went to the FDS cam, same setup, right? Same arrow weight, same draw length, same draw weight, and I gained 10 feet a second at 293 and a half feet per second. So that's massive, in my opinion. I mean, and and the thing about it in the Mach 33, you cannot feel I understand what the paper says, but you cannot feel a difference in the draw curve, in my opinion. Yep, that's just my opinion, right? Going from the EC2 to the FDS cam.

JR Gettler: 8:09

You can't. I'm I'm the same way. Like I can't feel the difference in that draw curve at all. So it's a no-brainer right there. I mean, you're you're gonna gain 10 free 10 feet per second. I'm gonna go with it. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 8:18

If you haven't got a PSE bow and you're getting a new bow, I would always opt for the FDS cam at this point.

Bryan Gay: 8:23

Yeah. For any of them. Yep.

Zakk Plocica: 8:25

I mean, I but if you already have the bow, I is it a necessary upgrade? Absolutely not, right? The EC2 cam is tough, dude. It's a good cam.

Bryan Gay: 8:32

It is. But now let's look at when they changed the draw stop, right? So that was a huge, that's huge for you guys, right? And then for me, the bearing coming from like the engineering background of things, when they beefed up that bearing, because if you have a bow that, especially with the 220 shim system, that is not going to move that cam and you start getting an ins inconsistent paper tear, your your bearings are going, which happens, I mean, a ton.

Zakk Plocica: 8:57

Well, we haven't seen it in any PSE bows prior. Sure. I've we've seen it in Matthews bows.

JR Gettler: 9:01

Yep, that's the only one I've ever seen problems with bearings. I've seen it in a bear bow, too.

Bryan Gay: 9:05

Okay. What the ones where you can't order the uh the diamonds where you can't necessarily make the adjustments. You can't like but I mean it's it's there.

Zakk Plocica: 9:14

It is so you're looking at more problems than that.

Bryan Gay: 9:16

This yeah, this is the same reason that Hoyt beefed up their axles.

Zakk Plocica: 9:21

Well, their axles and their bearings.

Bryan Gay: 9:22

Right. So here we go. Now, I mean, it's it's almost a detriment to PSE because they're you know, well, they're not having to do any warranty work, but there's no reason for you to upgrade. There's no, I mean, you're beefing up the bearings, you're getting better draw stops, you're getting the most efficient.

Zakk Plocica: 9:39

Oh, you're talking about if you go to the FDS cam, there's no reason to upgrade. Yeah, yeah, until next year.

JR Gettler: 9:43

Yeah, right. Well, the only downside with that though is PSC will not retrofit the FDS cam onto the EC2 cam. So if you have a Mach 30 or Mach 33 with uh the EC2, you cannot change to the FDS cam. So you'd have to get the new bow for that. According to who? According to PSE.

Zakk Plocica: 9:57

When did you talk to them?

JR Gettler: 9:58

I asked them on uh last week. Interesting.

Bryan Gay: 10:01

I talked to them this morning. Yeah, will they just ship me cams?

Zakk Plocica: 10:05

Right now?

Bryan Gay: 10:06

No. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 10:08

They can't, they have to just do it for warranty. And I have a feeling that has to do with the overwhelming demand, right? They've got to build all these bows, right? So there, so if there's a warranty issue, PSE, so the cams do fit on the bows, right? There's no limb deflection change, anything. You have to change strings and cables, they said. And you could put a set of FDS cams on your current bow, but they are not doing that right now. I mean, that's been the big question. Everyone's asked us. So I I haven't known. And then JR talked to PSE. I talked to PSE this morning, and they just they don't have the resources, I guess, right now to offer that. It's just warranty stuff. They have to prioritize the new bows and warranty issues if there are any with those cams, which makes sense. Makes absolutely anybody that's asking, you can swap it. Maybe.

JR Gettler: 10:53

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 10:53

So I mean when PSC goes, what route they go.

JR Gettler: 10:56

The other thing with that too is that would that would shoot themselves in the foot.

Zakk Plocica: 10:59

Nah, dude, I don't know.

JR Gettler: 11:00

Because people are not going to want to upgrade to the bow, they're just going to want to get the cams. So in the long run, that will shoot themselves in the foot if they're I don't I don't necessarily believe that.

Zakk Plocica: 11:08

I so I I see that side of things. I get it, because that that's a very real thought. But I also look at if they did potentially do that. I mean, that's you're a customer for life, man. I mean, you're you're you're taking care of your own.

Bryan Gay: 11:21

Right. Yep.

Zakk Plocica: 11:22

So I see both sides of it. Um, and I also stand the understand the position, right? It's brand new. They've got to be able to prioritize new bows, yeah, warranties and stuff like that. That's priority one. Um, later down the line, are they gonna offer it? Maybe. I don't know. Um, but I don't think it hurts bow sales personally. Because think about it like your guy that bought a Mach 33 last year, to gain 10 feet per second, to buy, like they're not gonna go and buy a Mach 33 FDS game. Most people aren't. There's a few, right? But your average guy is not gonna justify for 10 feet a second.

Bryan Gay: 11:54

Right. No, he'll he'll find it somewhere else. Yeah, system X strings, something.

Zakk Plocica: 11:58

There's other things you can do, right? Um, I I don't I don't I don't necessarily see that as hurting bow sales personally because I think they're gonna buy a bow two to three years when there's something new that comes out. So yeah, but they do fit. Yeah, that's that's the question. They fit they do. You have to strengthen change string and cables though, yeah.

Bryan Gay: 12:17

Which makes sense.

Zakk Plocica: 12:18

It does, yeah.

Bryan Gay: 12:18

Because it's a different lobe on the cam, you know. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 12:21

So the thing about the two, so the the FDS cam and the EC2 cam, what does it change on the bows currently? It changes the brace height, right? So the brace height on the new bows is a little bit shorter.

JR Gettler: 12:31

Roughly a quarter inch shorter.

Zakk Plocica: 12:33

Yes, right around, right around a quarter inch between the Mach 30 and Mach 33, right? And you know that that's where the the question for me always is when we talk about brace height, we talk about static brace height, right? The bow at rest. What's the brace height from the the grip to the string? Right. What is the brace height? That's the talking point for forgiveness in a bow, right? Shootability, forgiveness, hand torque, all these things you've got to consider is whenever people look at static brace height. And when they've shortened this brace height up, right, technically the bow should perform worse or a little be a little bit harder to shoot, right? Technically. But the thing about PSE is the talking point is FDS, full draw stability, right? That is the dynamic brace height. The brace height as at full draw, right? So the thing about the PSE bows and the way the cams are designed, especially in the new, the new FDS cam, is the brace height increases at full draw, which is supposed to carry over and make the bow more forgiving and a more shootable platform.

Speaker 4: 13:30

Right.

Zakk Plocica: 13:30

Which makes sense because that test stands true. It's been backed up. Outdoor life and Field and Stream have named the Mach 30 bow of the year 2024, the Mach 33 bow of the year in 2025. And this year in particular, the number one performing bows as far as accuracy goes is the decree, which is a 31.5 inch bow, which is weird. They're aluminum bow, right? And then the Mach 33, best performing as far as accuracy goes. So there's something to be said about the full draw stability system. And these new cams have added to that system, right? Like we talk about the increased size of the bearings and that recessed post where the cable attaches to the cam, which distributes the load on the axle a little bit more evenly, all go into aiding the bow at full draw and improving the shootability. So that's what's kind of cool about it, right? They're able to reduce the brace height a little bit, get a little bit more performance out of the bow while not negatively impacting anything whatsoever.

JR Gettler: 14:28

Right. Because the dynamic brace height is roughly seven eighths of an inch if I remember right on almost all the platforms. So you're increasing, even though you're you're short on your static brace height, your dynamic is increasing almost seven eighths of an inch. So almost an inch increase, which is crazy.

Bryan Gay: 14:43

Yeah. So you lose a quarter inch on the static, but you gain seven eighths on the dynamic, which is so in most bows, a lot of them will actually decrease brace height at full draw. Yes, so because of you know limb deflection, the way that limbs curl over.

Zakk Plocica: 14:57

So they say like Matthews and stuff is pretty bad at full draw as far as like when you look at that measurement, but they say hoyt is cams are pretty well designed as well as as PSEs for full draw for dynamic brace height, right? Hoyt actually increases a little bit too, but nobody does it at the same rate as PSE, right? Which is interesting.

Bryan Gay: 15:16

It's almost like at full draw the limbs grow. Right? Because you're you're extending it out. So the way the deflection is on the limbs and the way the mo the uh lobe is on the cam, right? So it's it's elongating them as they come back. Where like Matthews pulls down, these are pulling back. Extending that extending that brace eye. That's the way that my mind thinks about it, anyway. Sounds right, we're probably wrong.

Zakk Plocica: 15:39

Yeah, that's out. That looking the way you draw the, you know, you make me picture that that sounds that makes sense.

Bryan Gay: 15:45

Their limbs are at static rest, are taller, right? Where Matthews is more flat, and Matthews' limbs curl down as you draw, and PSE draws curls back. So that's adding that hoin's the same way.

JR Gettler: 15:59

And then so that's where your reflux comes into play, and also most Matthews bows are more past parallel with their limbs, so that's where you're gonna get that difference in the draw curve. Correct.

Zakk Plocica: 16:08

That makes sense. Yeah, so the draw curving was interest interesting on last year's or 2025 Matthews bows, right? How it like had two peaks.

Bryan Gay: 16:15

Yep.

Zakk Plocica: 16:16

Um, which again, from me, which apparently my opinion isn't irrelevant. That's just how I feel. Um, the the draw, I don't think any of the draw cycles on any of the bows is really bad. You can tell a difference. You can they all have a different feel, but I mean, like when we look at modern compound bows, the draw cycle on them, all of them is pretty damn good.

JR Gettler: 16:40

Yeah, yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 16:40

Like I mean, Hoyt is stiffer, sure, yeah, but it doesn't honestly, it doesn't, it's not bad in my opinion, whatsoever.

Bryan Gay: 16:48

At all. It's nothing that you're not going to get used to. No, no. You put absolutely any bit of time behind that riser, you're gonna be accustomed to it. It's gonna come down to you know, fit-finish, feel for the average shooter. Yeah. What what what is most appealing to your eye? Because that's what's gonna draw you initially, right? And then how does it feel? Yeah.

JR Gettler: 17:07

Right. I I can't tell you how many times I've had customers shooting different bows, and I'll even have them shoot like a diamond or a bear, and then have them shoot a Matthews or a Hoyt or a PSE, and they say they really can't tell the difference.

Zakk Plocica: 17:19

Which yeah, that's that's an inexperienced archer. When you put them behind them, a lot of them, they're like, Oh, they all feel great. Like it's like, no, there's a massive difference in the way this bow rolls over, how it uh falls into the back wall, the actual back wall, whether it's spongy or not. I mean, there's so many things. And I think it does take a little bit more experience to know what to look for in a bow.

JR Gettler: 17:42

It it does. But I mean, just just to add on to what we're saying, though, it's it's it's very hard to tell differences. Like I I've even noticed it too, sometimes shooting from bow to bow. It's very hard to tell the difference between the draw cycle and all the bows.

Bryan Gay: 17:52

What is it you should do? You should put a blindfold on and draw them back and a and a baker's mitt or whatever that guy did. I don't know, I don't know. Oh my god. I haven't seen that either. Yeah. Blindfold and a baker's mitt. So you couldn't tell the difference in the grip. Like, all right, let's just induce danger.

Zakk Plocica: 18:08

Well, we've dry fired bows, ran them over. Well, yeah. That was fun.

Bryan Gay: 18:12

I wasn't there.

Zakk Plocica: 18:13

Hey, man, off for the views, right? Gotta get the views, dude. What do we gotta do? Yeah, I don't know, man. Uh the PSC bows, I think they've really done a good job. I really want to shoot the decree, though, because I think the decree is a slept-on bow. Um, the EC2 cam on it is phenomenal. I think the FDS cam, clearly gonna be an upgrade for it. But I'm the the biggest, I think, drawback for the decree is the weight for an aluminum bow. It just doesn't hit that sweet spot like some of the other bows do, like some, like the Matthews, like Matthews is stupid light. Like that aluminum bow is crazy light.

Bryan Gay: 18:47

Do you really care about a few extra ounces?

Zakk Plocica: 18:49

Well, when it comes to like when I'm spending my money and I and that's in a determining factor, yes.

JR Gettler: 18:55

Yeah, but your build, you're not gonna worry about a couple extra ounces. No, his mod 30 is actually kind of heavy. Like I picked it up the other day, I'm like, dang, it's got some weight to it. It ain't no bitches.

Bryan Gay: 19:07

So it's uh what it's gonna come down to if it were me would be the price point. Right. The decree is exponentially, I mean $600 cheaper. So yeah, and I think that I can put that into a site.

Zakk Plocica: 19:20

Yeah, well, you know, I I think people when it comes to buying a bow, yeah, if you have a budget, that may that that's a part of it, right? But like if you have flagship budget, like you're like willing to go in and there is no budget. I think the thing people well, I mean, like when we're talking about a carbon guy, a guy that's coming in and looking at he's like, I don't have a budget, I want to shoot base solely what feels best. You know, that his budget is irrelevant at sure point.

Bryan Gay: 19:46

Sure.

Zakk Plocica: 19:47

I think what people need to focus on more is the overall feel and shootability of the bow because people get hung up on a brand, right? That's that's a big that's a that's a problem, I think. Instead of feeling the bows and giving bows a chance, they get hung up on a particular bow because of a buddy or a friend and they're brand specific or brand loyal. They're not willing to give anything else a shot, and they can't shoot that bow as well because the grip, the draw cycle, yeah, the way the bow holds. I mean, there's all these different factors, and I think that's where going into a shop and you're, you know, getting these new bows, you really need to go to a shop that allows you to test them. You know, you have to. Um, because like we talk about all the time, if just because I like the bow and I shoot it well doesn't mean you're gonna shoot it well. Yeah, right. You know, and and I get it, it's kind of hard to do whenever you only get a handful of reps behind it and you're shooting a target that's between 10 and 20 yards away, you know, it's hard to really tell, but it does give you an idea.

unknown: 20:41

Sure.

Bryan Gay: 20:42

And it's I mean, you should be able to tell right away, you know, even you're more experienced, guys. Well, yeah, you know, the feel in the hand, the way it's going. Yeah, and then you know, sitting down with you know, J.R. or or Cody in the background before was like, hey, grip the bow like this this time, you know. Someone I can walk you through it. Yeah, just those little nuances that I think that you guys specifically bring to the table. Because when I came in what, three years, four years ago now, and was like, I want this. And Cody was like, pump the brakes, bro. Let's set them all up. Set them all up. I want you to just see. And I walked out with the bow I didn't even think I wanted. Yeah. Initially, it happens all the time. Yeah. So and that was just like, hey, change your grip here, do this here, check this, you know. XYZ.

Zakk Plocica: 21:29

You know, the yeah, yeah, and I I agree. And and the the thing, um, so back to like the PSE bows and like the new cam right. Um in particular, let's talk about the Sicario. I think the big the the massive issues that I see with their bows is draw length options.

JR Gettler: 21:49

Yeah, so it is kind of weird how it maxes only at 30 inches of the body.

Zakk Plocica: 21:52

Yeah, the Sicario is a um 24 and a half to 30 inch bow, right? The Mach 33 goes to 31. 31, 31, 31. So your long jaw guys don't really got a lot of options.

JR Gettler: 22:03

Mach 35. That goes to 30 to I don't know what the new FTS cam.

Bryan Gay: 22:09

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 22:09

Let's look.

Bryan Gay: 22:10

I mean, it's it's I mean, I believe it's 32. If you're dragging knuckles or putting hands in cargo pockets on a regular basis, then you can shoot the Mach 35. Because that's what Kendrick was so excited about. He's like 32 and a half is what it goes to. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 22:25

So so they do have something. It's just a lot of bow, but typically a guy that's that's long is gonna want a longer axle axle bow anyway. But your guys that want the speed bow, that's a 33-inch axle to axle bow. That it only goes to 30 inches, kind of a drawback for some people, um, or a deal breaker, I would say, because if it obviously doesn't fit you. Right. But that's the talk, that's the talk this year so far, right? As far as bows is the Sicario. Sure. That's what's impressed more people when you look at it. Um, PSE does not um fudge their IBO numbers. No, I don't. I think they're one of the few that do not. Um they hit true IBO, and that bow is rated at 357 feet per second. It is smoking fast. Yeah, ridiculously fast. The surprising thing about how fast it is is if you've ever shot a speed bow, right? Some of the older speedbows. Horrible turbos and all that turbos, like some of the older turbos weren't terrible from Hoyt. Like some of them were good. I think was like the RX1 turbo.

JR Gettler: 23:19

I had an RX3 Turbo.

Zakk Plocica: 23:20

R X3 Turbo. It's aggressive though.

JR Gettler: 23:22

Yeah, it is. Um, stacks a little bit more, very short valley, very short. Yeah, so that's I mean, that's where you're getting all the speed from, though.

Zakk Plocica: 23:29

Yes, and that's what you think speedbow, you're like unforgiving, not shootable, over back wall. It's just yeah, valley super short. The the Sicario is surprising, right? It's got a brace height of five and a quarter inches, so it's a super short brace height, right? Which we were looking at it could be a problem with some uh fletching configurations, right? Depending on your rest option. You're you know, your rat your air, your veins are are right there at that rest. Um, but it's a 33-inch axle to axle bow, putting up blazing fast speeds, legitimately bait blazing fast speeds. It's light, it's 3.9 pounds. Again, draw length goes from 24 and a half to 30 inches. But when we shot this bow, the FDS cam on it, surprising. Very surprising. Like I was expecting it to be much stiffer. It's stiffer than a Mach 30 or 33. It has to be right. The bell curve is different, it is stiffer, but it is a still a very smooth, consistent draw cycle all the way the back that doesn't dump off, right? No massive dump on the back half. And the valley is still it's shorter, less forgiving than like a Mach 33, but it's still not so short that you can't relax whatsoever and it runs away.

Bryan Gay: 24:42

Right. It's not levitate short. That levitate, when I got back to that back wall, was like wanted to run on me. Really? Yeah.

JR Gettler: 24:49

I it must not have been in time then because I think I have a levit I've had a levitate since the first gen, and mine's awesome. I put on an 85%. Hold on.

Zakk Plocica: 24:57

What cam do you have on yours? E2. E2? What cam did you show? It was the E2. It was the E2 cam.

Bryan Gay: 25:02

Yeah, it makes sense. It was just so aggressive just because of that lobe, and it was just as soon as it dumped, it was, but it was so tiny. But the FDS cam on the Sicario does not have that. No, not at all. I feel like you can I can relax, I can settle into it, and then I can just go through my process.

JR Gettler: 25:16

Yeah, yeah. The only thing I think is that that timing must have been off on that levitate you shot. It had to have been. Yeah. Because mine is super forgiving on my back wall.

Bryan Gay: 25:23

Really?

JR Gettler: 25:23

Yeah.

Bryan Gay: 25:24

Oh man. Yeah. Yeah, I didn't. It because it wanted to run, run, run on me.

Zakk Plocica: 25:28

So we we got another question. How does the FDS cam compare to the E2 cam? The levitate with the E2 cam is 348 feet per second with a six and a eighth inch brace height. That's got to be in Sicario territory with a five-inch brace height, JR. What do you think? So how does the E2 cam on the levitate compare to the FDS cam uh, in your opinion?

JR Gettler: 25:50

Like yeah, that's that's a tough question. I mean, it's they're they're very similar to each other. Like, like I even said at the beginning, that you know, it feels like the FDS cam is a mix between the E Evolve Cam and the E2 cam. Right. Um I think it's gonna, I mean, obviously it's gonna be faster. I I believe the FDS cam is gonna be faster than the E2 cam, and it's gonna be a much smoother draw curve too.

Zakk Plocica: 26:11

Yeah, because the the E2 cam on some of those bows is pretty it's a little bit more aggressive. It's a little it's it's pretty style. It was still an awesome cam. I think so. Like, dude, PSC has done such a good job with their cam design over the years. Like the EC cam, the E2 cam, EC2 cam, they had the S2. Okay. The S2 short draws, guys. Yeah, like, dude, that thing was that thing it was fast. It was fast.

Bryan Gay: 26:34

Yes, but I mean that's how you get the speed out of the short draw guys.

Zakk Plocica: 26:36

Yeah, but it was it was definitely one of their more aggressive cams.

JR Gettler: 26:39

Yeah, I actually kind of missed that. Um, so I had a Mach 34.

Zakk Plocica: 26:43

Oh, yeah.

JR Gettler: 26:43

Um, and that had the S2 cam on it, and I actually I could shoot that bow so freaking good, I felt like. And I I honestly regret getting rid of that bow, to be honest, because I I almost want to set that up as a hybrid bow and shoot that as a target bow as well. Like I I actually really love that bow a lot, and I'm still getting really good speeds off of it being a 34-inch actual axle bow.

Zakk Plocica: 27:01

Really?

JR Gettler: 27:01

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 27:02

Wow, we know that so the 34. I mean, I've I've thought the 34. So one of the things that I've noticed when they went from like the Levitate and the Mach 34 to the Mach series, uh, like and we're talking about the Mach 30 and Mach 33 and Mach 35. The the way they redesigned that riser, I feel like the Mach series is a much easier bow to shoot than those.

Speaker: 27:25

It is.

Zakk Plocica: 27:25

Like it's it's as far as like hand torque and stuff, it wasn't nearly as bad as like the Levitate Mach 34. I struggled to shoot those bows. The the um the Mach series that we've got now, I shoot exceptionally well. And then with the new FDS cam, it felt like at full draw, it's even more stable and less less torquey. If that's even a possibility.

JR Gettler: 27:47

So I know they did kind of widen the limb pocket from when they added the Mach 30. So I believe the limp pocket's a little bit wider. Yes. Um, and then they they did have the FDS system in in place by then too, because I don't think that was on the Mach 34. If I remember right, I don't think they had the the full draw stability on the Mach 34. I don't think they did either. So I think that's what's making the biggest difference is widening the limb pocket and then also widening that limb track or the the cable track and everything, too. So I think that is what's making it more stable, more forgiving feeling.

Zakk Plocica: 28:16

Whatever it is, it made a massive difference. Massive difference.

JR Gettler: 28:19

And you're still getting speed out of it.

Bryan Gay: 28:20

Oh, yeah, crazy. Which is insane. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 28:22

So when we, you know, me and JR did some testing on the Sicario. Um, and we shot this bow back uh whenever Mr. Tom, CEO, came, he let us shoot the bow at 58 pounds, right? Incredibly impressive. We were like, this thing is this is gonna be a real problem. Uh it's gonna be popular, right? When I say problem. Um, and we finally got ours in to do a little bit more testing again, and the brace height on it, incredibly short, like I said, five and a quarter. Uh and JR shot the bow at 30 inches, 72 pounds, 443 grain arrow, consistent 314 feet per second. Dude, that's cruising. You're gonna have to shoot a heavy arrow out. You have to out of that bow. Like if you're like us and you want that bow to shoot like mid 280s for like a hunting rig specifically, right? You're gonna want a heavier arrow, which is awesome. You can shoot a heavy arrow just as fast.

Bryan Gay: 29:14

You can shoot a 600 grain arrow.

JR Gettler: 29:16

So I've got adult arrow guys. I've got my FMJ Maxes or 550 grains. I have not shot one of those three yet, which I I need to do that to see what speed we're getting.

Zakk Plocica: 29:24

I agree. I think you definitely need to um to shoot it just to get an idea because that thing is smoking fast. Yeah, and so I got some like um FAQs, right? Some frequently asked questions about some of these bows. And um, you know, one of them being is the the PSC Sicario too aggressive for everyday hunting?

unknown: 29:45

No.

JR Gettler: 29:46

I can tell you right now.

Zakk Plocica: 29:47

No, not at all, right? For nobody.

JR Gettler: 29:49

Yeah, I don't I don't think so.

Zakk Plocica: 29:50

Dude, and even if you get the bow in 60 pounds or 50 pounds, that bow is still gonna be that's gonna be such a great option that somebody with shorter draw lengths that's still Want to run, get the speeds out of a bow, maybe a little bit heavier arrow. That bow is going to check that box. My concern, though, with it is like we've talked about, because we haven't had a chance to take it out to distance and shoot it. Obviously, it's not going to be perform, in my opinion, like your Mach 33 with that greater brace height, right? Because you've got the greater brace height, static brace height, and then you've got that increased full draw stability. That bow is going to be more um forgiving, more shootable, more accurate out the distance based solely off the specs.

JR Gettler: 30:34

Right. And I mean, I feel like that's gonna be more catered towards the average bow hunter. Just your average bow um between the scicario and the mock three. Yeah. Yeah. That I I do believe for the average bow hunter, it it will be a little bit more difficult to shoot that scicario.

Zakk Plocica: 30:46

I do too. But when you compare it to a typical speed bow, it's gonna be much easier to shoot. Much easier to shoot. Like it's I don't even think it'll be comparable.

Bryan Gay: 30:55

No, it's not. It's it's not even in the same league as an average speed bow. Right. Draw force, you know, the ability to repeatedly shoot that bow just to be consistent with it is there. Yeah. You know what I mean? You can draw this thing repetitively on a daily basis to get those reps in to make sure that you're doing your part. I don't, but with you know, like a traditional speed bow, it's just like, oh my gosh.

Zakk Plocica: 31:23

You had the Z1S.

Bryan Gay: 31:24

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 31:25

Dude, I almost blew your bow up. Remember? It ripped the release out of. No, I got to the back wall and it wanted to run. And it wanted to run, dude. That was an aggressive bow.

Bryan Gay: 31:34

Yeah, it's fast. Yes, it's fast, it's fast.

Zakk Plocica: 31:36

But uh, dude, right there, I mean, if you don't shoot a bow a lot, I didn't I'm not a speed bow guy. Like, and I drew that thing back and that thing ran away, buddy. Yep. I was like, ah, I owe Brian a new bow. Damn it.

Bryan Gay: 31:46

Yeah. Well, it was just that was, you know, I went down the I want to shoot a heavy arrow fast. Right path. You know, and I you and I are built kind of the same, you're just a little bit bigger than me, but it's what speed is hard to come by at 28 and a half inches of draw.

Speaker: 32:01

It can be, yeah. You know what I mean?

Bryan Gay: 32:03

Unless you are cons you're you're changing strings, you're twisting strings, you're doing, you know, that's I think we do the our due diligence, you know, with our physical fitness and able to draw 80 pounds.

Zakk Plocica: 32:15

Yeah, and I I would I would also say that the speeds that we're after are not necessarily for a bow. I don't think they are. I I dude, speed is not the final factor in whether you kill an animal or not, right? Like dudes are shooting it with recurves. I understand that. Yes. But I also shoot tack. We also shoot 3D, we shoot long distances.

Bryan Gay: 32:36

And we shoot in eastern North Carolina where your window is because of the brush and the overgrowth and everything like that, maybe an eight-inch box that you're shooting through. And if you don't have time to change your sight move and look for, you know, that arrow trajectory, you want it to shoot as flat as possible. That that's where your speed comes in. You know, I want my first and second pin gaps to be so close that if I don't have to guess yardage, if I know that the animal is at 27 yards, I'm putting both 20 and 30 yard pins on that animal in the vitals and I'm letting her eat.

Zakk Plocica: 33:09

Yeah, yeah. And I think you can get away with that for a lot. And like I said, the speed is not a final factor, but it is a major factor for a lot of people, especially our shorter draw length guys that have only have one bow, right? Because they want to go shoot attack events, they want to do a Western hunt, right? They want something that's gonna be a little bit more, a little bit greater margin of error because the fat the arrow's a little faster. They can shoot a little bit heavier arrow, a little bit faster. So it's a factor for a lot of people.

JR Gettler: 33:32

Yeah, and it's also becoming like a trend too. Like a couple years ago, it was I want to shoot a heavy arrow.

Zakk Plocica: 33:36

Oh, dude, I think we come full circle every couple years.

JR Gettler: 33:38

And now it's now it's the the trend of oh, I want to shoot a fast arrow. So it's yeah, just like you said, every couple years that that changes. I just want a happy medium.

Zakk Plocica: 33:46

There's that so and that's where I think majority.

JR Gettler: 33:48

280s. 280 feet per second, you know, that's that's money in my opinion.

Zakk Plocica: 33:51

I don't think I think most of your people that have been in the game for a long long enough understand that, right? Uh, and they and most of them have a setup depending on what they're doing, right? Guys that have been in it for a long time, but most people understand that have been hunting long enough. It's like you need a happy medium, right? You need an arrow that one and a bow that's tune well. Typically, we see that between 280 and 295 feet per second. That's like the the sweet spot, I think, for most people. If whether you're shooting mechanical, you're shooting a fixed blade, though those speeds just tune well. The faster you go, the north, the further north you go of 300 feet per second, the harder it is to get that bow to tune, and the less forgiving that bow is whenever you're shooting a bigger broadhead out of it.

Bryan Gay: 34:31

So that's that's what it comes down to is the forgiving. Yes. And that's when you have to be honest with yourself. It's like, how good of a shot am I? Right.

Zakk Plocica: 34:38

Yeah, that's so so back to the James Yates study, right? The whole goal with with the bow is and an arrow is to build the most forgiving setup that you can for yourself so that whenever it comes to that pivotal moment, whenever you're on an animal, and if you shank that shot or don't make a perfect shot, the arrow and bow is forgiving enough that you're you're good, right? Right. You don't want something that's so harsh or so hard to shoot that you know you go to shoot it and you're getting a wicked, wicked arrow flight because you didn't grip the bow just perfectly. You didn't have a perfect shot execution.

Bryan Gay: 35:08

Right. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 35:09

Forgiveness in a bow is critical when it comes to making a choice.

Bryan Gay: 35:12

The Mach 33, I think, is the sweet spot, honestly.

Zakk Plocica: 35:15

Yeah. I I think so too. It's gonna be the most forgiving.

JR Gettler: 35:18

Yes, for sure. Yep, if I and the fastest. If I were to pick a bow from POC this year, it'd be the Mach 33, doesn't it?

Zakk Plocica: 35:23

Mach 33 is still my my go-to, man, especially with the FDS. Like that's that's my choice.

JR Gettler: 35:27

Yeah, yep, that'd be mine too. But um, I do feel like this curry, I think it's gonna possibly take the bow of the ear.

Zakk Plocica: 35:33

Dude, I so I I think I mean we need to just take it out and test it. Like, I need to get one for somebody and have them go shoot distance with it, JR. Uh and and um, and just to see, because I'm I'm I am very curious to see how well it performs um at distance, just based off the technology that they've got. But back to it, is it too aggressive for an everyday hunting boat? Absolutely not. The Sicario is a banger. I think for most people it's gonna shoot and shoot exceptionally well. Now, maybe somebody that's shooting those ultra-long shots, 120, 140 yard shots, that doesn't shoot a lot, you probably shouldn't be shooting that far anyway. It might be a little bit more difficult to shoot than like a Mach 33 or a shoot down pro or something like that. Absolutely. Obviously, based off specs. Yes. So no. So, and then the other question what real world speeds did you see out of it? Like we just said, JR shot it at 30 inches, it was light at 70-ish pounds, 443 uh grain arrow, 314 feet per second, smoking fast.

JR Gettler: 36:29

Yeah, I dig I was getting consistently 321 feet per second when we first got it in. So I don't know if there's something changed there, but when we did the video, that was 314 feet per second.

Zakk Plocica: 36:38

So so there was a little bit of deviation, but it was high. It was yeah well north of 300. Well north at a heavy, um, what I would say at average heavy-ish arrow for what we see 440, 450 grains. Yeah, it's a typical arrow.

JR Gettler: 36:52

Yeah, I mean I was shooting that same arrow out of my lift last year at 80 pounds, and I was getting 310, I think. Yeah, so yeah, I mean that's crazy. I dropped 10 pounds of draw and increased over over 10 feet. That's or almost 10 feet. Yeah, that's yeah, that's just bananas.

Zakk Plocica: 37:12

Yeah, that's awesome. So, so there it is. That I mean, that's you want speed, the scicario is gonna be it. And if you spend enough time behind any bow, like Brian said, you're gonna be efficient with it and get good at shooting it. Right just takes reps. Yes. So um what arrow weight pairs Wes with the Sicario? I would say I I've personally, like as a bow hunter, it's gonna be a little bit heavier arrow than what you typically run out of your other bows because of the speed you get.

Bryan Gay: 37:33

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 37:33

So I imagine we're gonna see 450 to 550 grains for most people out of this bow based off draw weight. Like I would say probably 27 to like that 30 inches is gonna be those a little bit higher draw lengths, just if you want it to shoot within that sub 300 feet per second.

JR Gettler: 37:49

Right.

Zakk Plocica: 37:50

Which I think most people as hunters would.

JR Gettler: 37:51

Yeah. Um, yeah. I I like to be, you know, north of 500 for my hunting arrow. So I would say, yeah, 475 to 500 is me a good weight for for somebody to be at to be at 280s, you know, at an average like a 29 inch straw length.

Zakk Plocica: 38:05

Yeah, yeah, I think you're right. So what about for TAC though? I think we're gonna see some light arrows. The I think we're gonna see more of that 400 to 450 grain arrow. That that spot shooting lights out fast. Yep. Like ridiculously fast.

Bryan Gay: 38:18

Super flat, just crazy. Yeah.

JR Gettler: 38:20

Yeah. So like if we take, you know, for an example, like the the bow hunter 300 spine for 29 inch draw length, you're gonna be right around 440 grains. If you if you cut your arrow to your drawing like 29 inches, yeah. 100 grain field point, you know, that's gonna be it should be right around 440 grains. So yeah, that's gonna be a good and you're you're you're gonna get north of 300 feet per second. You should if you're at 29 inches. Yeah, it's crazy.

Zakk Plocica: 38:43

Uh, and then the other thing, one of the other questions we got, um, which I think we covered already, is the brace height potential issue, five and a quarter inch brace height. It's such a short brace height that especially like the ripcord that stands off, the ripcord cable-driven rest, like you have minimal room. We had to run tack two and a quarter inch drivers on it for it to not make contact with your arrow rest. So that's something people are gonna have to be very mindful of. Because the brace height is so short, if that rest sticks out further from the rear of the riser, you're gonna have vein contact. So you're gonna one, either have to figure out what rest you're gonna use ahead of time, right?

Bryan Gay: 39:21

Just at at rest, right? At rest. Yeah. Well, I mean, once you go to full draw and that, you know, it comes up that it should be no issue.

Zakk Plocica: 39:28

Yeah, but if you have one that's stays up, like we're talking about the cable-driven yes, then you you have the the veins, like a max stealth where I mount them, are sitting in within that that arrow rest.

JR Gettler: 39:39

You're gonna run into problems of messing up the veins or you know, having other other issues. So yeah, it's just something to just just be mindful of.

Zakk Plocica: 39:46

I think if you run a Hamsky Epsilon on it, I don't think you should have much of a problem. You might have to run your veins a little bit further back um than where we typically run them, us personally, um, or me personally. Um, but I think once you get that mounted, I think an epsilon or something like that, a limb-driven, you won't have much issue.

JR Gettler: 40:03

Right. Yeah. Yeah, or acuity even. I don't think it should be too much of a problem. Because those don't sit as far back on the mount.

Zakk Plocica: 40:08

Right, right. Yeah, they're pretty close, pretty close to the riser. So you're just gonna have to be mindful of that. A ripcord, um cable driven, the IMS one though, is way back. I don't I would not put it on a Sicario.

JR Gettler: 40:19

Even even on their limb driven, it's their mount sits further back.

Zakk Plocica: 40:21

Yeah, it's not as nice and flush as some of the ones.

JR Gettler: 40:24

I'm looking at it right now. It is, yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 40:28

And and yeah, that's the that's the limb driven one.

Bryan Gay: 40:30

The cable driven one is like yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's yeah, like you said, I think the I don't know where it's at. Oh, yeah, yeah, that's yeah, that's what I'm looking at right there.

JR Gettler: 40:41

Yeah, like the cable driven's on the mark third.

Zakk Plocica: 40:43

It's way back there.

JR Gettler: 40:45

That's it.

Zakk Plocica: 40:46

So uh let's talk about um post shot feel on the Sicario. Surprising.

JR Gettler: 40:51

So I felt like the bow kind of wants to jump out your hand a little bit. There's a little bit more feedback on it, you know, with nothing on there. But I mean, that's kind of to be expected with a speed bow. It's gonna have a little bit more energy, a little bit more efficiency, so it's gonna want to transfer that energy somewhere and it's gonna go forward. Right, right, agree. Same.

Bryan Gay: 41:08

But I mean, like you said, I had the Z1S, which is also a speed bow, and I'm I'm kind of used to that feeling because it's my my backup, so I still put reps in that frequently, but I don't notice it as much.

JR Gettler: 41:19

But that is also an aluminum bow, so you're gonna have a little bit more mass to the bow itself. So I think that's where that's kind of plain that factor right there. That's why I said I want to I want to weight it down and take it out the distance. Yeah, so to me, if you've ever shot a target bow, it almost feels like, especially one of the PC target bows, like a citation, for example, those just feel like they want to jump out of your hand. Yeah. They just want to jump forward.

Zakk Plocica: 41:40

You got a weird vibration too. Yes. I hate a tiger bow feeling. Yeah, I don't.

JR Gettler: 41:45

So it's just something you'd have to get used to. But I mean, once you get used to it, it shouldn't be a problem, I don't think.

Zakk Plocica: 41:49

Yeah, I and I think we shot it for the most part, like we shot it with one stabilizer on it. There is obviously more feedback from that bow than some of the other bows, but the the I think the big thing like JR talks about is it wants to jump forward, which isn't terrible. Just hold on to your bow.

Speaker: 42:04

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 42:04

Um, but you gain you got that much performance, it's kind of to be expected with. But I I imagine too, whenever you you put a little bit heavier arrow in it, um, weight it down. Weigh it down a little bit, put your stabilizer on it. If you run an SOS Hunter Elite system on it, it's gonna kill majority of that feedback, and I think it's gonna change the way that post shot feel is. Um, so it's not bad by any means, but it's definitely different than the Mach 30 or 33.

Bryan Gay: 42:28

Right. Yep.

Zakk Plocica: 42:29

Yeah.

Bryan Gay: 42:30

Well, it's just such a transfer of energy. So much, you know.

Zakk Plocica: 42:33

It's got so that string's got so far to travel.

Bryan Gay: 42:35

Yep. Yep. And that's where, you know, we talked about the consistency comes in because that arrow is attached to that string for that much longer.

Zakk Plocica: 42:44

Right. Right.

Bryan Gay: 42:45

So if you have any hand torque, that's where the brace height comes in if you're not familiar with it. So a shorter brace height, the arrow is in contact with the string that much longer. So if you have any pose shot induction of torque, twist, you know, anything like that, it may translate into the arrow flight.

JR Gettler: 43:01

Yeah, but I don't think it'd be as bad because I mean it is it's still a pretty long axle axle length. It's a 33. So I think it's gonna help kind of offset that short brace height. Sure. Just like how it was with the omen when they had that in 2021 or 22 or something like that, when the omen came out. That was still honestly a very good shooting bow. Right. Um it was just aggressive, it was super aggressive. It was in the E2 cam, it was a bit more aggressive, yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 43:23

We shot it on on both the E2 and the EC, right?

JR Gettler: 43:26

Um, and we also had some S2 cams, I think.

Zakk Plocica: 43:29

No, thank you.

JR Gettler: 43:29

Yeah, no, thank you.

Bryan Gay: 43:31

Yeah, I shot it on the S2 and it was just yeah, you have to hold on to that. Yes, it wasn't even fun.

Zakk Plocica: 43:37

Yep. So PSC kept their tuning system for moving forward, which I think is a is a no-brainer. The EZ220 shim system, if you're not familiar with it, it's fantastic. It's fast, it's easy, it does require a press to take a little bit of the actual uh tension off the string. Um, but it's so fat, it's so it works so well. Yeah, pop those shims in and out.

Bryan Gay: 43:58

If it ain't broke, why fix it? Yeah, you know what I mean? It's but there's no moving parts.

Zakk Plocica: 44:03

There's not, but you know, we do see the trend with everything moving toward to the self people do it yourself tuning where it doesn't require it's like toolless.

Bryan Gay: 44:13

So we're at tooless, pressless essentially is what it is. Yeah. It's and listening to Gaius Carter, which is their you know production manager, he's he's it it requires a press for insurance purposes, air quote, right? You don't necessarily if you have to, if you're in a bench, you can you can change that gym system. It's extremely difficult.

Zakk Plocica: 44:32

The reason it's difficult is because the cam doesn't slide. Right. There's all that tension on it, and you need to take that tension off so that you can pivot that cam back and forth. Because obviously, if you're going from like a um 60, what is it? 60160, 60160, to from like a 100 to 120, there's gonna be a massive shift in the cam on the axle. So you need that tension to come off so that it's easier to slide that cam. Right, right.

JR Gettler: 44:58

Yeah, and I mean also it because if you don't do that and you could get some kind of side load on that cam, you could gouge your axle and mess up your axle too. So yeah, yeah. Use a press.

Zakk Plocica: 45:06

Yep, take it to a shop if you don't.

Bryan Gay: 45:07

It's they have all the shims anyways. Or should they, yeah. Yeah. So and you're gonna after you shim it, you're gonna run through paper, you're gonna do all these things.

Zakk Plocica: 45:16

You know what I'm curious too with the FDS cam. So, like EC2 cam, our typical shim is an 8140.

Bryan Gay: 45:22

Yep, yep.

Zakk Plocica: 45:23

Right? That's what we see most people go to. I wonder what it's gonna be with the FDS cam, if it's gonna change which shim we use the most. Because I hope it does, because the 8140 we can run out of those the whole time. I kind of hope it sticks with like a 100-120.

JR Gettler: 45:35

I guess we'll just have to set one up and actually paper tune it.

Zakk Plocica: 45:37

We will. We'll have to get a couple people through the shop because we've sold a bunch of we've had a massive amount of interest in the new PSE bows. Sicario in particular, the Mach 35 with the FDS cam, which really wasn't even on my radar. We I mean those are selling right away, and we haven't even seen one or shot one. So yeah, I'm I'm curious to see what the shim system most people gravitate towards because the commonality for the EC2 was an 8140. Right. We noticed that. So I'd be curious. FDS Cam, what's it look like? So we'll see. So Sicario, who should pick the Sicario over a Mach 3033?

JR Gettler: 46:14

I would say somebody that might be a little bit more experienced in shooting might be a better option to look at. And I mean, if you want speed, if you're just looking for speed, get the Sicario.

Bryan Gay: 46:25

I would just say a consistent shooter.

Zakk Plocica: 46:28

Uh I mean you can be consistent.

Bryan Gay: 46:30

Yeah, but I mean I don't I I want you to go into it knowing that you spent a lot of time behind that riser and any inconsistencies that you may have are gonna shine because of that. Like I said, it's it's such a short brace height that arrow is staying on that string for just that much longer. But if you have any little bit of hand torque and they're they're full draw stability, their claim they're still adding seven eighths of an inch onto that brace height, but it's only five and three-quarters? Five and a quarter, five and a quarter, five and a quarter. So even adding to it, it's just over six, which is a pretty good brace height though.

Zakk Plocica: 47:03

Especially for a 33-inch bow.

Bryan Gay: 47:05

But right, so but now let's go to the Mach 33.

Zakk Plocica: 47:08

Well, when you compare it to the Mach 33, yeah.

Bryan Gay: 47:10

Yeah, so that's where I'm gonna say a consistent shooter, you have to be honest with yourself and how much time you're gonna spend behind that riser, and you know, how much forgiveness do you need? Right.

Zakk Plocica: 47:20

Yeah, I think um, yeah, it's definitely gonna be the guys that that want the speed out of the bow. Uh, but again, you still you need to be realistic with yourself and your shooting capability, right? Yeah. Because at the end of the day, like attack, I think anybody, anybody that wants speed, it's a great tack bow. Sure. But if you're a bow hunter and you're shooting at awkward angles, um under pressure, your footing's not perfect, and you tip you're maybe you're not the best shot, it might not be the best option for you, right? Um different defin definitely things to consider though. Uh I I definitely think it as far as speedbows go, the most forgiving speed bow we've probably ever shot. Um the fastest. And the fastest for sure.

Bryan Gay: 48:02

The fastest bow I've ever shot is crazy fast.

JR Gettler: 48:05

Yeah. Yeah. The omen was right there though, because that was actually 356. It was IBIO and the Omen.

Zakk Plocica: 48:09

And it was hitting. It was, I mean, the PSC has nailed the IBO numbers for years now. But um they're not fudging anything. That's it. So, and then what about um like how would you guys if you were to build out a scicario, like how would you build it out?

JR Gettler: 48:28

More than likely a ham skew wrist. Yeah. Um I I really like dialed for sights. Uh, I do like the sites a lot. I do want to play with the driver though, so that'd be in the mix.

Zakk Plocica: 48:38

Um you run a pick mount or are you running uh uh dovetail?

JR Gettler: 48:42

I don't know. I mean, I don't really mind either way, to be honest. I don't care. Um I do like a dovetail to be able to really fine-tune if I want for a little bit of torque tuning. Did you do any torque tuning? Not on my hunting bows. I haven't really tried it. Um but it's Cooper's all.

Zakk Plocica: 48:56

I mean, we talked to Cooper and he's like, dude, you're torque. If you ain't torque tuning, you ain't nothing. He's torque tuning everything.

JR Gettler: 49:01

Yeah. Um I I've played with a little bit on my on my target bows. I have I've tried a little bit on my uh my Levitate. I try I did try that a little bit. Didn't really notice much of a difference, but didn't do it a whole lot, to be honest.

Zakk Plocica: 49:11

You know what we when we talk about torque tuning too, like with that being such a short brace sight, how do you torque tune it with that type of error rest? Can you?

JR Gettler: 49:18

It'd be really hard, especially with the rest. Uh, but you can do it with your site. You you can do a combination of that with your site too. So that's where dovetail would come into play better with that. Um man, I'd I'd run a kill shock stabilizer. Yeah, I would too. I like their stabilizers a lot. I'd run a 12-inch, probably throw an SOS system on there. Um their one piece or the uh sorry, the two-piece quiver. I don't normally take mine off anyway. So I'd run that on there and um probably a 5-0, especially for like a attack 3D event.

Zakk Plocica: 49:49

Dude, you'd run a 5-0 in that thing, yeah, dude. I don't I think I would run an Axis 5 mil through it.

JR Gettler: 49:55

I was thinking the same thing. I I've got those 5-0's I built, they're 443 greens, and I'm so you're talking specifically for attacks, more like a tax up again.

Zakk Plocica: 50:04

Yeah, but for like a hunting rig, I would probably run an Axis 5 mil with like 50 grains of brass up front. Easily 50 to 70. And the collars.

JR Gettler: 50:11

Yeah, I I probably run my F and J Max's, they're 550 grains. Oh, yeah. I've got 75 green, the match grade half-out on it, 125 greenhead, um, AE Max Dells.

Zakk Plocica: 50:21

Yeah, yeah. So I I would personally run pick mounted stuff on it. I get it. You know, dovetail, you want to be able to do that fine tune. I'd I personally never done it on hunting hunting bow. I've had no issues whatsoever. Um, I like the pick mounted stuff. I like that very low profile look and feel. Um, same thing with the like IMS style rest. I'd run one of the Hamski Epsilon V2s, the core mounted system on it, and then I'd probably either run so sight options. There's a lot of good sight options. Um, and I don't think you can really go wrong with any of them. I'm currently running the HHA Nitrix pick mount on my 33, and it's a two-pin. So go back to the speed side of things. My bow is shooting honestly faster than what I would typically like it shoot. It's shooting like 299. Um, and I that's what I've been hunting with. But the cool thing about it is uh I've shot with that two-pin out to 40 yards, it's got the two pin. I don't have to dial anything, which as a hunting rig is perfect. I my holds are so easy. Yeah, it's it's simple. Um, but realistically, I if I would to do it again, because the only reason I didn't change arrows is I built those for TAC and I was just like, I'm not building any more arrows. I'm shutting with these. And I wanted to test it. I've never run an arrow that light. It's 420 grains, shot and killed a couple animals with no issues, with no no du no durability issues with the the 5-0. You know, I haven't personally all year. I haven't broke one and uh performed exceptionally well. I think, but though the Sicarium I would probably run either the spot hog or the HHA, or the drive, dude. You can't go. There's too many good options.

Bryan Gay: 51:50

Yeah, I I am sold on spot hog.

Zakk Plocica: 51:52

I mean, durability-wise for hunting rig, it's impossible to beat, I think.

Bryan Gay: 51:55

Yeah, I'm gonna go the boonie three pin all day. It's I mean, there's no question. I've got the vertical on it right now. I'd like the uh horizontal three pin. Uh just because I like I prefer it in my sight picture. Uh it's easier for me. And because I like to be able to see the whole front leg of the animal, right? Because that's where I'm gonna basically see the whole front leg with the vertical post.

Zakk Plocica: 52:16

Yeah, it's I just it's it's a mental thing.

Bryan Gay: 52:18

Yeah, it is.

Zakk Plocica: 52:18

I I'm I did that for a while and I went to a vertical post, and I don't think I'll go back.

JR Gettler: 52:22

Yeah, I like the horizontal. I'm I'm indifferent, I can shoot either one and have no problem. But if you have to choose, um probably a horizontal then because I mean most sides are going horizontal for the three pins.

Zakk Plocica: 52:36

That's where I think Spot Hog does a good job with the triple stack. You can individually adjust all three of those pins. It's a killer design, I think. Yes, it's legit. You can I like those a lot. So I mean, yeah, I think we all would build it pretty similar. There's only so many ways you can build a bow, right? Yeah, but um, as far as like arrow like hunting rig, I would probably run an Axis five mil out of it.

Bryan Gay: 52:54

Yeah, oh yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 52:54

Or I mean they're bulletproof. They are bulletproof, man. Like it's a such a good arrow. How about the new uh victory VLR that's coming out?

JR Gettler: 53:02

I'd be curious to see it. I would too. I I normally do like to shoot four four miles, but this year I've been shooting the five mils and I've been enjoying it a lot too.

Zakk Plocica: 53:09

So dude, a new four mil to the lineup, the VLR, I think it's gonna be super popular this year.

JR Gettler: 53:13

Yeah, looking at the GPIs too, it's gonna be pretty good. Yes. Is it supposed to come in lighter? It is gonna be a little bit lighter, yep. Yeah, yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 53:21

I think uh let's see, what is the actual we talk about the VLR? Let's take a look real quick. Because the HLR was super popular.

JR Gettler: 53:32

Yes.

Zakk Plocica: 53:33

Um and same with the 5-0.

JR Gettler: 53:35

I mean, yeah, those are two heavy hitting arrows. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 53:38

All right, so VLR from Victory, brand new. It's it was we should be getting those in December. I think they're gonna start shipping like 1215. So a um a 250 spine is 10.5 grains per inch, a 300 is 9.0, a 350 is 8.2, and a 400 is 7.7. When you compare that to, let's call it a axis 4 mil.

JR Gettler: 53:58

It's uh almost a grain lighter. Is that what it is? The 250 sounds about the same. Um the 300s are 9.5 or 9.4 on the axis for 300.

Zakk Plocica: 54:12

So uh uh 250 is 9.8 uh for that.

JR Gettler: 54:16

Okay, yeah, that's right. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 54:17

So the axis is lighter.

JR Gettler: 54:18

Yeah, yeah, that's actually no the 300s the 300 on the VLR would be lighter.

Zakk Plocica: 54:23

The 300 is by 0.3 grains. That's that's where your big difference is. The 340 is 8.2 on a VLR and it's 8.3 on an axis. So it's almost identical. Yeah, right. And then you still get the same, so it's it's so it's comparable to an axis for ml. So I wonder how how popular they'll be. I'm assuming it's a new arrow, it's gonna have to be popular.

Bryan Gay: 54:43

Yeah, but all the victory guys, yeah. I mean, their insert system is great, you know.

JR Gettler: 54:47

So I mean, you know when they come in, I'm gonna get some. Of course, you get something of everything. Yeah, I like to play.

Zakk Plocica: 54:54

Yeah, I think and they're coming with their standard 50 grain aluminum insert, which is what's included. The shock TM TL aluminum. The cool thing about Victory though is the dude, the coating that they have on those for pulling out of 3D target systems.

JR Gettler: 55:07

Yeah, the nano.

Zakk Plocica: 55:08

That's my biggest complaint with the 5-0 though, is when you shoot in target, it melts the target and it sticks to the arrow.

JR Gettler: 55:14

So the Sonic was awful with that. Anytime you shot a Sonic into target, they would stick so bad.

Zakk Plocica: 55:19

My last two years at TAC, I shot Sonics, and this year I shot five O's, and pulling them out of targets is a pain.

JR Gettler: 55:25

Yeah, that's the biggest complaint. The FMJ Max has been surprisingly really good. I've I've really enjoyed that a little bit. It's super easy to pull out, so yeah. And it's been super durable too. I haven't had any problems with them yet.

Zakk Plocica: 55:36

Interesting because if you do bend with like there's no doubt, like aluminum is gonna be the straightest shaft you can possibly get until it's not. Once it bends, it holds a bend, it retains that bend.

Speaker: 55:44

So, and they're expensive. Um I don't think they're that much more. No, no, I don't remember though. I take it back then. Yeah, I don't know. I've been super happy with that. Every day, you should know. Yeah, you would think, right?

Zakk Plocica: 55:56

Yeah, you know, and and this is a shameless plug too. Like, say hey guys, so just so you guys know the archery project, you can head over to thearcheryproject.com and um we do our daily articles there. So if you're looking for like reviews on product, um bow hunting tips and tactics, we've got articles going out daily. So head over to the archeryproject.com. The pop the podcast is also hosted on there, so you can check it out there, get all the latest updates. And if you sign up for our newsletter, we send out a weekly newsletter with quick reads, actionable insights, and easily digestible tips delivered straight to you every week. So it's a great resource. That's what the the Archery Project is, right? It's a resource for it's bow hunting and archery all the time. So it's a resource for guys. If you've got questions on things, we do reviews, um, we do tips, and this is all based off people that we talk to, right? So it's not just like one person writing the articles. I put out pretty much all the articles, but they're from people uh and interviews that we've done. So there's a lot of great um tactics, tactics, tips, and it's just a great resource for the bow hunter and the archer. So if you're interested, check it out, thearcheryproject.com. It's brand new. So back to your undy or interrupted whatever.

Bryan Gay: 57:07

It was just a quick commercial break. That was a quick commercial break.

Zakk Plocica: 57:09

Yeah, boom.

Bryan Gay: 57:11

This episode brought to you by the Archery Project.

Zakk Plocica: 57:13

The Archery Project. Oh, this is the Archery Project, the Archery Project podcast, though. This is all things. So that's the thing, right? Everybody digests content differently. Not everybody wants to listen to a full podcast, right?

Bryan Gay: 57:23

Right.

Zakk Plocica: 57:23

So the cool thing about this is like with thearcheryproject.com is you can go there, you can read articles, or you can listen to the podcast. You can listen to the this podcast on any of your favorite platforms Spotify, Apple, watch it on YouTube, watch it on Spotify because it's a video podcast. But the other thing that we're doing too is you know, within these podcasts, is there's like there's full-blown talking points or segments that stand alone. So we've got on YouTube, there's it's called the Archery Project Project Clips. So there's segments, three to nine minute video segments pulled out of different podcasts on a specific topic.

Speaker 4: 57:55

Right.

Zakk Plocica: 57:55

So kind of cool. So there's depending on how you consume content, whether it's short form, it's long, full podcast, you read it, there's a way for you to consume it. Um, we try to put it out all different ways because I like reading, watching, and listening. So kind of do a little bit of everything.

Bryan Gay: 58:09

Yep. Same.

Zakk Plocica: 58:10

Same same, same, same, same. Especially if you're at work and you're not supposed to be on your phone and we got a new, there's a new bow release and you can't watch it, you got to read it first, and then you can go watch it. We offer that.

Bryan Gay: 58:19

I just play the sound in the background and listen to you guys. That's what I do. I just I turn it on like that or YouTube or whatever, and I just let it play as I'm, you know, working away. Oh, so I can hear it.

Zakk Plocica: 58:29

Back to it. So FDS cam, we didn't even say what it means.

Bryan Gay: 58:32

So FDS can't, the cam itself.

Zakk Plocica: 58:35

It's the force distribution system. Right.

Bryan Gay: 58:37

So what they've done is sorry, go ahead. No, no, go ahead. What are they doing? They've mathed it to where the the force, like we talked about, the the peak draw is at the beginning, the first third of the pull, if you were to break it into thirds. So they've mathed it out to where it's the stiffest at your strongest point. So it's not as it doesn't feel as aggressive.

Zakk Plocica: 58:58

Which makes sense. That carries over. You can feel that in the bow. The bow, I mean, feels fan the draw cycle is crazy. Like it's ridiculously smooth. But on the Mach 33, I can tell no difference between the EC2 cam and the FDS. Right. On the Sicario, you can feel it more in the front half. But the cool thing about it is it feels like it does roll over earlier. And that's one of the talking points that whenever you look at the spec sheets, it rolls over earlier. So it's easier earlier.

Bryan Gay: 59:25

Right. Right. It's in that first third. And you don't have that second hump where it's like, oh God. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 59:31

Where you're in a vulnerable position.

Bryan Gay: 59:33

Right. Right. Hoyt, I noticed that's where I noticed with their um not the HBX cams, but the HBX 2. It's the Gen 4. HBX exact cam. The exact cam. That's what it is. This year, there's like almost that second hump at the like you said, the most vulnerable, this third third? Yeah. Well, no, the third third. Like right before the dump over, there's that little bit more of a peak where you're like, oh gosh, there it is. Where they've Mapped it out. The engineers at PSE have done a phenomenal job of putting all of that at the beginning. Right. And and everything I've read and seen and and done. So the cam itself is FDS force distribution system. So it's distributing the force where it's you are at your strongest. Right. And then the FDS for the bow for the lineup is the full draw stability. Right.

Zakk Plocica: 1:00:24

Which improves, enhances the shootability. Right. Makes the bow more forgiving. Increase brace height at full draw. Right. Fantastic. So and then one final thing, I want to talk about the durability side of the PSE bows, right? The Mach series in particular, we've been shooting these bows for the last few years. As far as durability goes, I'm still running the same strings on my Mach 30, just testing it just to see. So are you. No issues whatsoever. Obviously, they do stretch a little bit, but nothing crazy, which is honestly very surprising. And I've had no issues as far as durability goes. Especially one thing that's always concerned me is whenever I leave the state, I want a bow that's reliable, right? That doesn't come out of tune easy. And I uh will say I've been very impressed with how well a PSE, the Mach 30 and 33, stay in tune. After shooting it a lot, bumping it, pulling it up trees, you know, taking on the mountains for tack. It's been very, very reliable and just very durable, well-built bow. So I think they've done a very good job on that. It's a bow you can trust in whenever you leave and you go out of state and there's nowhere, no, no shops around you, that it's going to be reliable.

Bryan Gay: 1:01:32

Right. Agreed. Same. And they put their uh riser, the carbon riser specifically through such a stress test. Yeah, I mean, it's over like 900 pounds of force and it and it holds, is what Gaius was saying. Yeah. So I I mean I crashed my boat the other night with the bow sitting literally on my on my you know um mobile gear tote from trophy line. It was sitting on the top of it. Um and it's perfectly fine. So I mean, I shot it through paper, I shot it at Target, I made sure everything was good, but I mean it was fine.

Zakk Plocica: 1:02:03

So it's hard to argue with, man.

Bryan Gay: 1:02:05

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:02:05

Just reliable. Just they look good too. I think uh they've got a pretty appealing design. Sure. The carbon. And it's the only carbon bow made in the U.S., right? It's hand laid carbon in um Tucson, Arizona, right? So the only US made carbon bow in the United States, which is a big, you know, in my opinion, selling factor, right? U.S. made supporting U.S. companies. Um there's no one else that's doing it, and still at the same price point, right? Right. Competitive price point, the same exact price point as any of the other bows. So they've done a good job with it. Um they've really nailed it as far as like premium carbon bows. I don't think anybody's beating PSE right now. They've taken over as far as lead like leaders within carbon. I think they are the leader within the industry as far as carbon bows are concerned.

JR Gettler: 1:02:46

100%.

Zakk Plocica: 1:02:46

I would love to see them do something with an aluminum bow.

JR Gettler: 1:02:49

Oh gosh, can you imagine?

Zakk Plocica: 1:02:50

No, I mean that's that's my my my biggest gripe is you know that the the carbon bows are are are the primary focus of the marketing, and they've neglected a an a killer bow, the decree.

Bryan Gay: 1:03:03

Yeah. I mean it's shot the best. As far as accuracy goes, it performed everything. Do you imagine if they just put it on a keto diet or something? Dude, that's that's it, man.

Zakk Plocica: 1:03:12

If they could shave a little bit of weight off that bow, a 31 and a half inch axle to axle bow for a bow hunter, that's the sweet spot. Um, it shoots incredibly well. And uh, I wish that they would put a little bit more marketing effort behind it because it is a killer bow, and I think it's really slept on for 2025. Moving into 2026 with the new FDS cam, I can only see it being improved upon. Um, but it is it's the fat kid, man. It's a little bit heavy.

JR Gettler: 1:03:37

Yeah, it's it's been that way for the last couple of years, though. The Fordis.

Zakk Plocica: 1:03:41

The Evolved Evolve 33 was awesome, but it was heavy. Yeah.

JR Gettler: 1:03:46

It was. So yeah, yeah, if they could just cut that little bit of weight, I think that would put them in a much, much better area with that bow.

Zakk Plocica: 1:03:51

It'd be a top contender, I think, as far as aluminum bows are concerned.

JR Gettler: 1:03:54

Easy.

Bryan Gay: 1:03:55

Yeah, especially at the price point.

JR Gettler: 1:03:56

Yes. The grip is super repeatable. Um, yeah, just like like you even said, the the 31 and a half inch axle ex bow, that's a great sweet spot for anybody. That's like my favorite.

Zakk Plocica: 1:04:07

Literally, like most people are gonna shoot that bow and shoot that particular length well because the brace height on it one is perfect, yeah. So if we look at um, like I'm I'm curious what the the Cree.

JR Gettler: 1:04:19

Yeah, the FDS.

Zakk Plocica: 1:04:20

Yeah, what the FDS. The so the brace height on it is six and a quarter.

JR Gettler: 1:04:24

Yeah, okay.

Zakk Plocica: 1:04:24

So it's that sweet spot, man. A 31 and a half inch bow. Um six and a quarter inch brace height, dude. You know what IBO is on that?

JR Gettler: 1:04:33

336. 342.

Zakk Plocica: 1:04:35

347.

JR Gettler: 1:04:36

347, okay.

Zakk Plocica: 1:04:37

Dude, that's a cooking bow too, and they don't fudge their numbers. No, the problem is the overall weight of the bow is 4.65 pounds. It needs to be closer to four pounds.

Bryan Gay: 1:04:46

Sure. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:04:47

In order for them to be competitive, I think if the bow is closer to four pounds, um, and there was more marketing efforts put into it, I think that bow would be a top contender for aluminum bows.

Bryan Gay: 1:04:57

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:04:57

I mean, it's a it's a killer bow.

Bryan Gay: 1:04:59

It is. It's it shoots phenomenal.

Zakk Plocica: 1:05:01

It goes to 30 and a half inches from 25 to 30 and a half inches. So it's gonna accommodate most people that a 30, uh, 31 and a half inch, 32 inch platform should. And um it's smoking fast. It's got a very forgiving brace height, six and a quarter inches. I mean, it's looking at it on paper, it's gonna be a it should be a really good bow for most people. Right. And then the price point you consider.

JR Gettler: 1:05:22

Yep. It's gonna be right at 1300, I think. I don't remember. Somewhere around there.

Zakk Plocica: 1:05:26

Yeah.

JR Gettler: 1:05:27

But yeah, because the prices didn't change, so yeah, it should be should be right around there. Yeah, dude.

Zakk Plocica: 1:05:31

It comes with all of your the the things that we love about PSE. I mean, just in an aluminum package, it's just a little bit heavier, but typically a little bit heavier bow holds a little bit better too.

Speaker 4: 1:05:40

It does, yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:05:41

Pros and cons, man, but when you can set it up next to a Matthews Lift X that's right at like 3.9 pounds, it's you're like, oh man, it's heavy. Is it really that heavy? No, but in comparison to some of the other aluminum bows, it is heavier.

JR Gettler: 1:05:54

Yeah, you can feel it. I mean, you can actually feel it though.

Zakk Plocica: 1:05:57

Yeah, but it's but I mean it's it's tough.

JR Gettler: 1:05:59

Yes.

Zakk Plocica: 1:05:59

So you can definitely feel the weight, but I think if you haven't shot the decree and you're looking for an aluminum bow, um, I would definitely consider shooting the uh the decree with the FTS cam uh this year because I I have a feeling it's gonna surprise a lot of people. Oh, yeah. The accuracy side that you get with it, the draw cycle that you get, and then the speeds that you get out of it 347 IBO. Be another banger, man.

JR Gettler: 1:06:21

Yep. I know we've got a couple coming in, or at least one. I know I'm excited. So I just want that's the one I want to shoot.

Zakk Plocica: 1:06:26

It's honestly piques my interest more and more the more we talk about it.

Bryan Gay: 1:06:29

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:06:29

One, it looks good. I think I like it.

Bryan Gay: 1:06:31

Well, you and I specifically have talked about it. Like they just kind of put a lot of eggs into this driven basket, which is warranted. They've won bow the bow the year for two years running. Three years.

JR Gettler: 1:06:40

They've well two years consecutively, but yeah. The levitate.

Bryan Gay: 1:06:45

Oh, that's right. Yeah. And then now they're coming out with the speed version. So but we but you can't you can't neglect the redheaded stepchild, right? Because that's how many, how many, what percentage of folks that come in here are are buying carbon?

Zakk Plocica: 1:06:59

There's a surprisingly larger than you think. Really? It really is. But yes, but the but the aluminum is a click is gonna be a bigger chunk of the pie, right? Most people that's more affordable because you can get out of the door eighteen hundred dollars build with an aluminum bow.

Bryan Gay: 1:07:13

When that's just starting cost. That's not even starting costs. There you go, right for a carbon. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:07:18

So yeah, I I really hope that PSE puts more emphasis on the aluminum side just because how well they've shot over the years. The Fortis, the Evolves, they were fantastic. But I shot the Evolve 33 attack. It was attack driver. Yeah. Um you love that. You shot it well too. I shot it really well. Uh, and I think the decree is really in that sweet spot, and hopefully uh more people shoot it and pick it up this year because it's gonna it's gonna be um it's gonna be a good bow. Or it it is a good bow, but it's gonna be an even better bow with the FDS system. But I am curious, what is it line up? What is all the new bows that are coming out? How does it compare?

Bryan Gay: 1:07:51

Right.

unknown: 1:07:52

Right.

Zakk Plocica: 1:07:52

Where do you guys think PSC sits as far as line up uh top bows for the or top brands for this year?

Bryan Gay: 1:07:58

Top three. Yeah, 100% top three. Top three, agreed. Yeah, yeah. There's I mean, and you can mix those up however you want.

Zakk Plocica: 1:08:04

You know, Matthews is number one. Um I don't care what anybody says as far as sales. So, yeah, when it when we talk strictly sales number, right, and brand like recognition to recognition and loyalty, Matthews is the number one across the United States. I don't care what anybody says. Yes, Matthews is the number one recommended bow. Whether you like them or not, it you they've done a fantastic job, and their branding is incredible. They make an incredible product. They do.

JR Gettler: 1:08:32

Their bows are great, and their customer services phenomenal. Their customer services phenomenal. I was just gonna say they stand behind it. They do, and they're they're the only company still that will make parts for their own.

Zakk Plocica: 1:08:40

They're old bows.

JR Gettler: 1:08:41

Their very first bow they even make, they can still make parts for and they still will.

Zakk Plocica: 1:08:44

It is so wasn't Mr. Tom talking about that too, the loyalty side of things?

Bryan Gay: 1:08:48

Well, no, haven't being able to get he wants to start bringing into more production. Like if you have something that's older PSE, be able to get that.

Zakk Plocica: 1:08:56

I don't remember.

Bryan Gay: 1:08:57

I I'm not 100% because I know they still have all their old engineering drawings.

Zakk Plocica: 1:09:00

Yeah, I don't want to put words into his mouth. Sure, I'm not sure. But I can I can assure you though, though from what we've experienced is PSE's customer service and warranty is pretty untouchable too.

Speaker 4: 1:09:09

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:09:10

Like when it comes to dealing with a brand for us, like, and I see a lot of the shops, a lot of shop owners dealing with PSE, they are they're fast. Yeah, and they stand behind their product and they take care of their customers. Some of the other brands that these past two years have slipped massively when it comes to customer service. Yeah, as a shop, it makes it a nightmare for us because we got to relay that to the customer whenever the the brand's like, nope, we're not gonna warranty that. And you're like, we know that should be warranted. They should take care of the customer long-term, lifetime value, right? Lifetime value of a customer. Some of these brands have slipped and they are trying to rebuild it. We have seen that.

Bryan Gay: 1:09:45

Um that's tough though.

JR Gettler: 1:09:46

Once you burn that bridge, it takes time, it does. Um, yeah, I mean, you know, PC had a bad rap for years and years with limb issues and and other stuff. But I mean, to be honest, PSE has been one of the least bows we've had any warranty issues with, period.

Zakk Plocica: 1:10:02

Surprise uh that's a that's a big fact. Uh based off quantity that we've sold, we have had probably less issues with PSE bows.

JR Gettler: 1:10:11

Yeah, I haven't had to do any warranty claims with PSE in over a year.

Zakk Plocica: 1:10:14

Yeah, not on any of the mock series or the Cree or anything like that.

JR Gettler: 1:10:18

Yeah, yeah. It's been at least a year, if not longer.

Zakk Plocica: 1:10:20

All the other bows we've had some kind of issue with. Um Expedition, we haven't sold the volume to really tell. Um, same thing with Prime, haven't sold the volume.

Bryan Gay: 1:10:29

Right.

Zakk Plocica: 1:10:29

Um I'm curious to see what those brands do this year.

Bryan Gay: 1:10:33

I know. I know. Dude, that was a well, I mean, Prime can literally do it. They can, but the response has not been good.

Zakk Plocica: 1:10:41

No, the form has not performed at all uh for us.

Bryan Gay: 1:10:48

Right. It's a good bow.

Zakk Plocica: 1:10:49

The core cam is great.

Bryan Gay: 1:10:50

Yeah. And it shoots well.

Zakk Plocica: 1:10:52

But nobody is looking at them. But they do have a whole new lineup that's dropping, which we have those on the way. Um they drop in November. All the bows are dropping like November.

JR Gettler: 1:11:02

Yeah. Matthews, I just got the stuff yesterday.

Zakk Plocica: 1:11:04

I sent it over to you. Yeah.

JR Gettler: 1:11:06

The only thing we haven't seen is Botec. I don't know if you've heard anything yet.

Zakk Plocica: 1:11:08

I haven't heard anything from Hoyt either.

JR Gettler: 1:11:10

Uh, that's gonna be mid-November, it sounds like the same.

Zakk Plocica: 1:11:13

All of them are dropping around the same. So yeah, everything but Botech then, right? Um curious to see how it goes, what it looks like. PSE is kind of, I think, leading the way as far as carbon bows go into 2026. Um, I don't see them being dethroned this year as far as carbon goes. No. Uh, and I see them as one of the top three um manufacturers in the industry at this point. They have done a good job moving the needle in the right direction. And internally, everybody that they brought on, their new CEO, Tom, is awesome. I don't care what anybody says. That dude is incredible. He comes, he's willing to interact with customers, not identify himself, right? He's just helping train draw lanes and stuff at a dealer day. Um, sitting down. I mean, he texted me yesterday. He's like, hey, how's it going? How's everything going? You need anything? Like, oh, things are good, man. Looking, congratulations on a successful launch. And uh, they're doing their production times are incredible. Yep, lead times are great. Warranty customer service has been good. They've got good people in-house taking care of warranty, their customer service. They got guys on the ground at um TAC, Cooper, uh, and Leo were there last year at all the TAC events, giving away bows at every TAC event, getting people to demo them. And I think it's just slowly moving the needle in the right direction for PSE, and they are trending up and they are a top competitor as far as manufacturers go. Shootable bows, killer customer service, awesome warranty. They're doing a good job.

Bryan Gay: 1:12:33

Yeah, they're really that's yes, reliable.

Zakk Plocica: 1:12:36

The biggest issue though for people is the lack of PSE dealers.

Speaker: 1:12:39

Right.

Zakk Plocica: 1:12:40

That's the that's the talking point. That's the hard point for a lot of it. Because I we got people that that message us and like, I don't have a PSE dealer in my area. How do I test these? I'm like, God, I don't know. Come see us. Yeah. Make the trip. Make the trip, come see us. Uh, or if you go to a tag event, shoot them at a tag event. Um, but that's what I would like to see. I would like to see an increase in dealers supporting more of these brands, right? Because you you can go and find a Matthews and a Hoyt anywhere, but people don't have the ability to shoot an expedition, a PSE, a Prime, a Botec at every location. And, you know, it is an investment as a shop.

JR Gettler: 1:13:12

Yep.

Zakk Plocica: 1:13:13

It's a lot. I mean, for us, there's a lot of overhead, right? Those are things we got to juggle. And that's why it's important with the brands that the brands do their due diligence as well, as far as marketing goes. Because it's hard for me to bring a brand in my shop whenever I'm the sole one marketing for it. Right. If you're not pushing the marketing game to its highest level and you don't have anybody behind your product, ambassadors, uh, shooters, people within the industry promoting it, you don't you don't have a strong social presence. It's hard for us, even though you have the best product. No one, there's no one walking in asking about your brand. Right. That's a problem. That makes it hard for a shop. That's why there's a lack of dealers for some of these brands. I think PSE is doing a good job trending up in the right direction. They're getting the right people in there. They've got good shooters, they've got more and more people that they're putting on their books. The biggest thing is their response attack on the ground with people, letting people shoot the bows. That's what changes people's opinions. That's how you get new bows into new shooters' hands, is having the marketing behind it in order to get the bows and get people to test them. Once they test them, they're sold. It's an easy sell.

Bryan Gay: 1:14:16

Easy sell. Once you, I mean, and I I was very much that guy, Hoyt Matthews, right? It's easy to be, man, because they're reliable. Sure.

Zakk Plocica: 1:14:24

You can go anywhere in the country and get those bows.

Bryan Gay: 1:14:25

Yep. And then I shot a PSE.

Zakk Plocica: 1:14:27

I was like, God, that's that's what's gonna separate these, the, the, the brands, right? Your top brands is having the dealers. The dealers are critical to the archery industry. Without the dealers, there isn't an art, you don't have this industry. Right. You have to have dealers. And these brands have got to realize that they need to get their, they need, they need more dealers on the ground. They need to open up more dealers. And how can they do that? They've got to be marketing the bows, they've got to be selling. There's got to be a demand for the product. If there's not a demand, most of these dealers don't operate like we do. These smaller shops, they don't have the social presence, they don't put out the content, they don't write the art, they don't have the capability, right? They don't have the resources.

Bryan Gay: 1:15:06

So I've I came across a shop that you couldn't even shoot them. That's you they had one of everything on the wall, and then you say, I like that one. And then, okay, we have to order it.

Zakk Plocica: 1:15:18

Yeah.

Bryan Gay: 1:15:18

And then and you're putting a deposit down and they let you test it? No.

Zakk Plocica: 1:15:22

Okay, so that's a problem. As a shop, you've got to be able to let people test drive your bows, man. That's what sells them. We, I mean, all of our bows, they go on the wall and people can test shoot them. That's how you sell them.

Bryan Gay: 1:15:30

Yeah, people want. I was like, Can I shoot this? He's like, No, we've only got this one, and you know, I don't know, it's kind of like you know, yeah. Like, because I mean, no one knows if I can, you know, you could just be some Tom Dicker Harry up the street.

Zakk Plocica: 1:15:40

That's how you sell a bow, though. Right. So as a dealer, for us, like our job is to put the bows in your hand, right? So when you come in and you're like, hey, I want to shoot a bow. We're like, okay, cool, man. We help you kind of figure out what's within your wheelhouse budget-wise, right? Your capability, your goals, what do you want to do? We take and we set up every bow within your budget and allow you to shoot it and test it. That's the only way you're gonna be able to form a uh a good opinion on what is gonna fit for you.

Bryan Gay: 1:16:07

Not everyone works that way.

Zakk Plocica: 1:16:09

That's what that's a problem within the industry. As a dealer, you have got to take care of your customers and educate your customers. And education starts with good text behind the counter, yep. A willingness to work and service your customers, right? Allow them to shoot the bows, but then you've got to teach them, right? Because we get new shooters in here every day. People that see things online and they're like, I want to get into archery. And they come to us and we're like, fantastic. We're gonna teach you from Jump Street. From from from if you know nothing, our goal is to make sure when you walk out of our shop, you are confident within the equipment that you buy, right? That that's what we do. So we take you through, we let you test shoot the bows, we show you how to anchor, how to shoot the bow, how to execute a shot. We set the bow up, we tune it for you, we put you on our range, we get you to, we help you sight the bow in. So the bow sighted in after 20 to 30 yards. So when you leave, the bow's tuned set up for you, you're you're comfortable with your equipment and you can build on that versus coming in and now you can't, you just gotta choose one off the wall. That's insane to me.

Bryan Gay: 1:17:08

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's I I've seen it, I think, in two shops now. Yeah, no, that's crazy.

Zakk Plocica: 1:17:14

As so with the archery industry, it takes two parts, right? The manufacturer's got to push and promote their product, and they've got to create a demand for the product. The demand is created, people come in asking for the shops, the shops that can then justify carrying the product. The shops then need to invest in overhead. I think that's important too. As a shop, people have got to invest. Like, you've got to invest in brands. Like we took chances with our brands. We invest heavily. Therefore, like we're premium dealers, top-tier dealers for all of our brands because we've invested and we believe in the product, and that's because we believe in the brand itself. Right. But the brand, it has to start at the brand level, I think, in the manufacturer level, creating the demand so that people are walking in and actually asking to shoot your bows. Because when we put a bow on the wall and no one asks about it, and I got to hard sell it and tell you how great it is, and you've seen no media on it, it's it's it's tough. It's hard for us to justify or grow with you. Like I can't become a top-tier dealer with you and buy your bows whenever you're not doing anything to promote. And that's from your socials, all of the stuff that you're putting out, who you're involved in, who your affiliates are, your pro shooters, whatever it is. There's got to be people on the ground representing you. And that's the only way we can sell your bows, man. It's it's hard.

Bryan Gay: 1:18:28

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:18:28

I mean, you go anywhere in the country and you can find a Hoyt and Matthews.

Bryan Gay: 1:18:31

Absolutely.

Zakk Plocica: 1:18:32

You cannot say that about the other brands, which is the biggest issue, which I'm hopeful PSE, with the way they're trending up and the marking team that they've got behind them. It's it's this is a long-term game, right? We're not talking about today, tomorrow, next year. We're talking years ahead. It's gonna take time, but they've got a good team in place in order to do that. And if they can get more shops to carry these bows, they're going to become more pro popular. There's the demand is there, right? The demand is continuing to grow. And if they can continue to move the needle in the right direction, I think that they will be in more shops, which is only gonna help grow the brand as a whole, and more people are gonna be able to shoot these bows.

JR Gettler: 1:19:06

Yep. 100%. Yeah. I mean, they've definitely got the vision to make this company even better than what it used to be. Yep. It's just a matter of the execution and making sure that everything is is going correct. That's it.

Zakk Plocica: 1:19:17

They're they're putting all they're they're putting everything in their favor. They're doing the right things, I think. TAC being a massive one, right? TAC are the biggest events, and they've prioritized those to go to every single one and let everybody shoot a PSE bow at a TAC event. You can go test it at every single TAC event, and they give away one at every single tack event. So they're driving demand, they're continuing to bring the right people on board, they're doing everything. Um, and I just don't see them not being uh, you know, a top contender.

JR Gettler: 1:19:46

100%. Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:19:46

And um maybe being in top two.

JR Gettler: 1:19:48

Yep. Um, they're also doing these demo days now, too, which is awesome. They're they're going out to the actual dealers and doing demo days. So I mean that's that's another great thing that they're getting out of the community more.

Zakk Plocica: 1:19:58

Absolutely. And and like I said, it goes back to the manufacturer doing their part. You can make a great product, but if you don't have the marketing behind it and no one knows who it is, no one's coming in asking for the shops, we're we can't justify selling them or carrying them. So, I mean, it takes everybody to make this thing work. And I think with these shops, like I said, if you have a great product, you're gonna have to put the marketing effort in behind it. And that's and that's a massive part, and that's hard. I understand marketing. It's hard, but you got to figure it out.

Speaker: 1:20:24

Yep, yep. So that's it.

Zakk Plocica: 1:20:26

What else you guys got, man? PSE Bows, 2026 lineup looks fantastic. It does. They've got some killer bows. We've already tested them. We can uh confirm that they are as awesome as everyone is, you know, as they're claiming to be. Um, but and they're hitting the numbers. They're hitting the numbers.

Bryan Gay: 1:20:40

That is the big thing for me. I mean, we've seen without sacrificing anything, right? And we've seen it over the past three, five years. There's there's been a a pretty big fluff in posted IBM. This has been for years, for me, anyways, that I've noticed realistically. But I mean, they're spot on. Maybe one or two here or there, but that can be it's within a very small percentage.

Zakk Plocica: 1:21:02

Yeah, right. They're close. There's there's that deviation within the the chronograph that you use. Sure. So they're dude, they're spot on.

JR Gettler: 1:21:08

Yep. Yeah, everything's within 3%, which I think is a good margin for any kind of error. Right. Very calculated, JR.

Zakk Plocica: 1:21:14

That's right.

JR Gettler: 1:21:15

That's why we have them.

Zakk Plocica: 1:21:16

That's it, man. Gotta have a numbers guy. Yeah, I have Cody Griffin from Easton numbers. He's telling there's people there's two million, there's two million people in Jacksonville, North Carolina. I'll never forget. We went to the ATA show, and we're this is prior to us having Matthews in here. And they're like, How many people do you think are in your your town or county? He's like, it's like one million. He's like, Wow, really? We weren't even close. It's like a hundred some thousand.

Bryan Gay: 1:21:38

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:21:39

Oh, Cody, he's so funny.

Bryan Gay: 1:21:41

He just added a couple zeros.

Zakk Plocica: 1:21:42

Yeah, it's no big deal though. He legitimately thought though. But and I didn't know otherwise. I'm like, I honestly have no idea. Is a million a lot?

Bryan Gay: 1:21:50

Yeah, yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:21:50

This has been, dude, it's almost a decade ago. It's a whole lot, in case you were wondering.

Speaker: 1:21:54

Yeah.

Zakk Plocica: 1:21:55

Big difference between a hundred some thousand and a million.

Speaker: 1:21:58

Whatever though.

Zakk Plocica: 1:21:59

JR, anything? Any input?

JR Gettler: 1:22:01

Um, yeah, I'm super impressed with the bows. Um, if if you haven't had a chance to go shoot one yet, you need to go shoot one. Um, I think you'd be very surprised with them. Um, excited to see what the outcome is gonna be for outdoor life for 2026. I've already called, I think the scar is gonna win bow of the year.

Zakk Plocica: 1:22:18

I don't think they're gonna let them. Nope. Agreed.

Bryan Gay: 1:22:20

Nope.

JR Gettler: 1:22:22

We'll we'll see. Um, I know none of the other bows have really launched yet, except for I know like Darton came out with their stuff a couple days ago. So uh excited to see that stuff. Um, but yeah, I mean I'm I'm a firm believer. I think this car is gonna be the bow of the year. We'll see.

Zakk Plocica: 1:22:36

Yeah, time will tell. So we should do an archery project bow of the year. You know what? Yeah, I should do that. I should set that up and I should have a handful of dudes come out and test them all. We should do all that, and we should do our own bow of the year. Um non-biased, just see how they perform. So, brands, if you're looking for somebody to send bows to, send them to the Archery Project. We will uh I'll run a full test on them, dude. We'll set them up, we'll run it, we'll do our own tests, we'll figure out how we'll measure everything, and uh, we'll do a bow of the year every year. I'll write articles on it and then we'll do some videos and then we'll do a podcast on it and see how they perform.

Bryan Gay: 1:23:08

That's a great idea. That is a great idea. That's so much effort. It it will be a little bit more. Yeah, but you've got a JR.

Zakk Plocica: 1:23:15

I gotta have a handful of people though. So because I'll what I'll do is I'll I'll put uh a handful of dudes that um probably three shooters. So that would be three bow from each three bows from each brand, probably, and then we'll run through our own series of tests, uh, out to distance. Yep. And uh we'll chrono them, we'll test straw cycle valley, all these things, let off option hold, feel, shootability, accuracy, and uh, and then we'll do a full review on them and figure out how we could um accurately um gauge gauge each and how they each perform and then put them out there. You just gotta yeah, we should do it, dude. The archery project, bow of the year 2026. Yeah, we should do it. All right, I'll figure out how to do it and we'll do it. So, Bo brands, if you need it, we'll do it for you.

Bryan Gay: 1:23:59

Yep.

Zakk Plocica: 1:24:00

Maybe Extreme Outfitters will sponsor it.

Bryan Gay: 1:24:02

Oh, there you go. You just gotta talk to the owner. I just gotta talk to the owner about it.

Zakk Plocica: 1:24:07

All right, guys, that's it. That's another wrap. 2026 Bows from PSC killer lineup, man. Um, I think they've done a good job. I'm really looking forward to all the other Bows this year. I think there's gonna be some absolute bangers. There are every year, man. You you know Matthew's gonna put out some good product, you know Hoyt is. Expedition's got exciting stuff coming out. Prime's got a whole crazy list of stuff that they're coming out. I'm very interested to see that. We got those coming. Um, who else? Botech, I have no idea what's going on.

JR Gettler: 1:24:35

But the Ascendal that's been doing it phenomenal. That ascend that came out a couple weeks ago. That's been a killer bow for the money.

Zakk Plocica: 1:24:40

Mid price point bow. Botec did a good job with it. Hoyt's got their new mid-price point bow that's coming out, which we don't know enough about yet, but it is replacing replacing the Torrex. So we have seen an increase in demand in mid-price point bows, right? Yep. Sub 900, sub 1,000 bows. There's gonna be a lot of those this year. Um, Bear's got some killer products coming out, man. The new Adapt uh HP.

JR Gettler: 1:25:01

Yeah, adapt to HP. Adapt to HP. That's done really well already. Fantastic. Um, they have the Alaskan Pro. That's I think is gonna be a killer bow, too. Um yeah, lots of great stuff coming out from all the companies.

Zakk Plocica: 1:25:15

Lots of good stuff, guys. So if you haven't, head over to your local uh archery shop, start getting in line, testing these new bows. Go check out the new 2026 PSE bows. The Carbon Series is phenomenal. The new FDS cam system is probably pretty untouchable, in my opinion, as far as performance, shootability, and forgiveness goes within a cam system. PSE has absolutely knocked out of the park. Um, yeah, lots of good stuff. So bear with us as we start getting the new bows in here. We'll be doing a lot of reviews, and like I said, hopefully we'll have our own archery project, bow of the year review come out for 2026. Uh, we'll pick, you know, I don't know, 10 bows, figure out what we're gonna review them on, maybe based off over ATA length, something like that. I don't know. We'll figure out some stuff, we'll have some cool stuff coming, some in uh innovative stuff that's a little different uh than what other people are doing. That's the goal, anyway. So the Archery Project, if you're looking for a resource for bow hunters and archers, that is what we are here for. Podcasts, articles, short clips. You want it, you name it. Um, we're trying to put out content for you guys and just provide information for the public. So if you're interested, head over to thearcheryproject.com. Check it out. It can all be found there. Also on the YouTube channel for short clips, uh, bow hunting tactics. There's a lot there. We got a lot of great guests that we take that information from and relay it back to you guys. So that's it. That's another wrap on the Archery Project, guys. Appreciate everybody listening, and uh we will see you guys in the next episode.