47. When “Christian” Birth Advice Isn’t Biblical: Spotting False Teaching in Pregnancy and Birth with Dannette McGrew

In this episode, I’m sitting down with Dannette McGrew — certified doula, childbirth educator, and passionate apologist — for a conversation that is so needed in the Christian birth world right now. Dannette has been doing the deep work of examining the worldviews that have quietly crept into birth spaces, even among people calling themselves Christian birth professionals. And what she’s found might surprise you.

This is not a conversation about outright occultism. It’s about the more subtle, more dangerous teachings — the ones that use biblical language but twist it just enough to lead mamas away from the true gospel. From false affirmations and prosperity gospel thinking to Christian hypnobirthing and declarative prayers, we’re pulling back the curtain and giving you the discernment tools to recognize it.

Whether you’ve sensed something was “off” about a birth course or affirmation you’ve come across, or you simply want to be a more biblically grounded mama in this season — this episode will sharpen your thinking and anchor your heart in truth.

In this episode, we cover:

🌿 The subtle red flags hiding in popular Christian birth content

✝️ Why “God designed your body perfectly” can actually be an anti-gospel statement

🚩 What prosperity gospel thinking looks like inside the birth world

🔍 The problem with Christian hypnobirthing and declarative birth prayers

📖 Practical steps to grow in biblical discernment as a pregnant mama

Mentioned in this episode:

✨ Christian Mama Birth Prep Library - Free birth prep tools, worship playlists & more

💕 Work with Me 1:1 – Virtual Doula Support & Schedule a Private Coaching Call

✝️ Online Christian Childbirth Education - Explore my complete birth preparation self-paced course

🎴 NEW Christian Birth Affirmation Cards - You can now purchase them here

📖 Walking with God through Pain and Suffering by Tim Keller - Mentioned as a beautiful resource for mamas walking through hard seasons in pregnancy and birth.

If this episode encouraged you, please subscribe, leave a review, and share it with a friend.

Let’s keep choosing faith over fear, one decision at a time. Go here for the full blog post, show notes, and all resources mentioned!

Transcript

0:00

Welcome to Faith Over Fear, the Christian pregnancy and birth podcast. I'm Natalie Portman, a Jesus-loving mama, birth doula, and childbirth educator. And it's so easy to make this season about controlling outcomes or proving our strength, but the Lord invites us into something so much better: the chance to love Him more, trust Him more deeply, and experience His joy even in the hard moments. That's what this podcast is all about, and I'm so glad you're here with me. Let's choose faith over fear together.

Natalie Portman 0:33

Today, I am so excited to introduce you to my guest, Danette McGrew. Danette is a certified doula and childbirth educator, a wife and mama of two little ones. One thing I love about Danette is that she is deeply passionate about apologetics and biblical discernment, and she's been doing some really important work digging into the worldviews that have quietly crept into the birth world, even through people calling themselves Christian birth professionals. This is a conversation that is so timely and needed for all believers. Danette, welcome to the show. So excited to have you.

Dannette 1:09

Thank you. I'm so excited to be here.

Natalie Portman 1:12

I mentioned offline, like this really is a conversation I've been wanting to dig into, so I'm really excited to have you here to discuss. So let's, before we get more into the interview, I would love for you to just share a little bit more about yourself, your family, and also just how you got into birth work.

Dannette 1:30

Yeah, so grew up on a little farm, basically, in kind of a different sort of Christian community. and so there's a whole backstory there that we'll probably go into a little bit more. but basically a very rural area. so raising animals and, kind of isolated from the general world. So I had no idea that midwifery care still existed. Um, I thought it was like the thing they did in the 1700, you know? and then in my twenties, I, moved out of that little town and met my, who's now my husband. at the time I was an EMT, so I was working full-time as an EMT going to school to be a vet tech. and Lord just grabbed a hold of me, saved me out of all of the craziness that was going on in my own head. and. We had a whole journey ourselves just moving across the country and, starting a new life in Oklahoma. and then when I got pregnant with my first, it was 2022, so very shortly after COVID. and I had kind of, I had left the whole EMS world behind at that point, I had burned out really bad just because of all the, you know, all the trauma that exists in the. Small town, rural EMS. And so I had left all the medical things behind, but suddenly found myself pregnant. and I quickly realized that. Hospital was not gonna be a place of comfort for me. And so I started looking outside of that and came across this crazy thing called a freestanding birth center. And it was just like, to me it was the wildest thing I've never heard of. but sounded really interesting to me as well. You know, I had, I had become quite a bit of a questioner of all things, you know. Just a questionnaire of the norms. You know, I, I stopped kind of, just doing things because that's the way they were always done. And so kind of led me into, having my first baby at a freestanding birth center with midwives. and it was a crazy experience. I did not get the. Empowering. Wonderful. Proud feeling afterward that everybody talked about, and so I was kind of left going, did I do that right? And so after she was born, I came across, the biblical birth school on my Instagram. and I was like. Wow, there are Christians who do this. This is amazing because I had encountered all of the, you know, the new age things the Christian hypnobirthing was offered to me, and it just felt weird and I didn't do it. but when I saw a Christian doula who was like, you don't have to do it this way, you can. Do this in a way that glorifies God. I was like, this is very interesting to me. So, I signed up for her program and became a, a certified doula and childbirth educator. it felt like it was right up my alley 'cause I've, I've loved medicine since I was a teenager and began working as an EMT. I love educating people. I was always, you know, doing CPR trainings and training other EMTs and it's just something I love to do is educate other people. And so really great to be able to combine. Several of my passions. and the other thing I was able to pull in was my love for apologetics and theology and able to apply that as well. So was, it was so exciting for me to have found something where I could really combine everything that I'm so passionate about and, just run with it.

Natalie Portman 4:49

Yeah. I think before you become pregnant. You are not even aware of this whole world that is like the birth world. And so it's so fascinating that you felt so disconnected to the point that like even hearing about a freestanding birth center just was like the most bizarre thing to you. but we all have to ease into that unless you're surrounded by that. It is a little bit different, especially when, I don't know, 90 something percent of women are, giving birth in hospitals. So yeah, it is a little bit fringe still at this point, for a lot of women to have a different birth experience. but I did wanna touch a little bit more on what you were sharing about, having a crisis of faith and, if you could take us back to that season and what was the Lord doing in your heart during that time?

Dannette 5:39

Yeah, so the group I grew up in, was started by someone who said that they were a prophet. and so I was raised in a very. Very, isolated group where we believed essentially that we were the real Christians and everybody else didn't have this special revelation that we had. It's very hard to describe like the worldview that comes out of it because it affects everything that you believe but through going to a little local church, I started realizing, that, there are other people outside of where I grew up that are true believers. Like these people are reading the Bible, they're studying it in a way that I've never seen modeled. and I was like, man, this is really interesting. during that time, I would say that I was not saved, my general worldview was that I was probably sure I was going to heaven 'cause I was basically a good person. I was trying really hard. you know, I, I tried to do the right things. I tried to be kind to people, but I also like, basically believed in karma. And I basically believed that, you know, what goes around comes around. And eventually, know, justice would happen on this earth. Yeah, so I, I would say that I had basically like a, I think they call it like therapeutic deism. Like I believed in God. I did not have a good understanding of the gospel. and I believe that I was going to heaven because basically I was a good person. and so. I was going to a couple different little churches at the time. during that time also met my husband who was a believer and like during our conversations while we were getting to know each other, that was something that was really important to the both of us. And the way I was talking, he thought I was a believer as well, but you know, it was just like we were using the same terms but with a completely different meaning. and so ended up moving. Oklahoma where I went to a little church, little local church there. That was wonderful. And I will never forget the pastor getting up on stage the first Sunday, and he said, do not believe anything I say, just because I'm standing on a stage with a microphone, check everything I'm saying against the word of God. And I was like completely floored. I've never heard someone. Admit to not having the authority. And this is really interesting to me because the way I grew up, it was, these are the people who have the authority because they can hear from God in a special way that I can't. and so that pastor was, really instrumental. God used that church and that pastor in a, in a great way in both of my mine and my husband's life. He was also, you know, very interested in apologetics. He was an atheist at one point in his life as well. And so, went through a huge time of, just completely reforming my faith from the ground. I kind of say I had to, I don't know if you're familiar with Ginger Duggar. she has a term that she uses, disentangling her faith, and I really like that. I, I really feel like that's what I did as well. go back to the bare bones of, okay, I, I believe there's a God, but why? Okay, then what's the next step? Like if there is a God, how do I know who he is? How do I know? What he has and hasn't said, like, how do I believe I could, how do I know I can trust the Bible? That that's an accurate representation of what, of who he is and what he said. So had to go back to bare bones, building it from the ground up. and by God's grace, during that time, I had several jobs in a row where I was able to listen to podcasts all day. I started out listening to a huge variety of faith-based, non-faith based, progressive Christianity type of leaders. and I started noticing the differences. And so people would say some things and I would be like, okay, but that actually directly contradicts what the Bible says. And I was like, people can do that. Like they could say that they're Christian and then believe the opposite of what's in scripture. How does that work? just had an eye-opening moment of what discernment is and why it's needed. and so that kind of kicked off my journey of trying to understand how I can test teachings and what people are saying and what the standard has to be. So yeah, at one point I was listening to, RC Sprawls book, the Holiness of God, and that was. that was, I don't know exactly when I would say I was saved, but that was definitely a pivotal moment, was reading that book and really coming to an understanding of what the gospel is and reason why I'm getting to heaven. And it's not because I'm basically a good person,

Natalie Portman 10:02

I grew up in a Southern Baptist church and I had a very strong performance based idea of that's why I'm saved is because of my performance. Even though I don't think I would've ever, I would've never said that I would've had the right words to say, but in my heart there was this sense of I am accepted because of what I have done and it really wasn't what Jesus had done for me. and so I think that is such an important difference. Is the good news is not that you can. Do better, try harder to, to be accepted by God. That is not the gospel that is crushing. And it's the antithesis of the gospel. The gospel really is that Jesus Christ lived the perfect life that you couldn't live, died, the death that you should have died and is your righteousness. And yeah, such a powerful difference. So Danette, how did having your faith rebuilt from the ground up shape, the way that you approached your work as a doula and just, as a birth worker in general.

Dannette 11:09

Yeah, so I would say that I am just a skeptic of everything I see. And obviously not, not all the time because I think all of us have areas where we are susceptible to a certain thing or like we already believe it. And so when we hear somebody say it, we, you know, we have that confirmation bias. So I'm not by any means saying that, like I'm impervious to bad teaching, but I do look at everything with a critical eye and just because I've listened to so many different perspectives, I can kind of see where they're going based on the words that they're using, or I can kind of see like, you know, if you're using this terminology that's coming from this thinking or that's coming from this worldview. and so I definitely came into it with a critical eye already kind of looking for, false teaching just because that's what I look for all the time. and I definitely, see it everywhere. I.

Natalie Portman 11:58

And I also wanted to have you touch on ways that you're seeing, like very specific examples of like new age or just like prosperity Gospel or other things, in the birth world, so that, the mama that's listening can maybe identify some of these things in her life that are, contradictory to the gospel and contradictory to the Bible.

Dannette 12:22

Yeah. And you know, honestly I was surprised myself when I started looking into all of the different birth programs that are out there, the really popular Instagram accounts. I was surprised at what I was seeing because what I expected to see was outright occultism, you know, these, and there is all of that, but, that is not. me, that's not the biggest threat because a lot of Christians have enough discernment to say, we probably shouldn't be doing spells with our placenta. You know, we probably shouldn't be engaging in, you know, a lot of these really obvious new age practices like, you know. Using crystals as if they have spiritual healing properties. the more insidious teachings, I think are kind of like we talked about the people who use the same language, who use biblical terminology, but they mean it in a different way. and so what I've been seeing, the majority of the bad teaching that I've been seeing is using Christian terms, but they say things like, God designed your body perfectly. You've been designed without flaw. but they forget to tag on that sin brought in the flaws. and so their whole teaching is based on the idea the woman's body is designed to give birth perfectly. which is in a sense that's true, like God did design us beautifully. We are fearfully and wonderfully made and most of the time. It works, but like everything else in our life, sometimes we get sick, sometimes the body doesn't work the way it should. and so it's, and the more I thought of it about it, the more I was like, it's strange that we have this view on birth, but we recognize that like some people are born with other genetic conditions or some people are more prone to sicknesses, some people, you know, and it's based on of different things. God did design our bodies in a beautiful wonderful way I absolutely love studying the physiology of birth I think it's a beautiful design and I don't I don't take the stance that like birth is inherently dangerous or that we're all you know evolution favored a bad design It's all fatally flawed any of that I do believe that God made us with a beautiful wonderful design but I also recognize the effects of sin and so I was listening to a podcast And she was talking about a doctor that she went and saw who gave her a really good way to view this which is things that go wrong in your body can have a variety of causes And she looked at all of the different places biblically where people got sick or their body failed in some way Sometimes it's the result of your own sin So like if you your whole life your body is going to respond to that in a way that you know like it's just the way God designed it Things are gonna go wrong if you do not take care of your body there it could also be the result of someone else's sin So if somebody around you while you were a child that has an effect on your body or if somebody hurt you in some way that has an effect on your body It also could just be the result of general effect of sin on the world Things are broken things are dying Things are not the way they were designed to be in the beginning Also other times it could be a result of actual spiritual attacks So in the Bible Satan was able to attack job's body in a way that was caused by a spiritual reason and so there's a lot of there's a lot of things that can cause your body to not perform the way it was intended to perform so I think we need a balanced view of looking at the body our own body and understanding that It was designed really well and we should do everything we can to support it and steward it well and take care of it But we also have to understand that things can go wrong sometimes and God is also sovereign over that

Natalie Portman 15:59

That is so crucial, that distinction. And I also, I think that's also why I'm so intentional, when I'm working with clients and on this podcast to have this language of we are simply stewards of what the Lord has given us, but I cannot manifest or will something outside of God's will. And that includes how my pregnancy goes, whether or not I'm even able to get pregnant. How that birth unfolds, how that child's life unfolds. Like all of those things. There are certainly ways you can make that soil, so to speak, fertile for good things to grow and to steward it in that way. But you cannot make something grow the way, like perfectly the way that you want because we are living in a sinful, broken world. And so many of us are touched on different levels of that. So many of us experience that sin in different ways. It just shows up in different ways. And so I think that's a beautiful distinction, to make. And you're right. I think That's also what kind of drove me to make a set of Christian birth affirmations is I was like really sick of hearing these like anti-gospel. Generic phrases about like affirming yourself in birth and if it's not true, then you're just speaking lies over yourself, and why are you speaking lies over yourself? and just being able to, yeah, like the way that you're framing your birth and the way that you're wrestling through feelings of, I am inadequate, my body might fail me. And instead of just like having this like untrue, toxic positivity of just my body's made perfectly. And, I'm a believer so God owes me a good, smooth birth. Absolutely not. He does not owe us anything. And just, being able to separate that is, is so important, to be able to have that discernment as you're thinking through your birth, experience.

Dannette 18:04

And that also something you said reminded me of another thing another big red flag that I say even in Christian courses is that they have a fundamental view of the self as the source for everything and this shows up lot in what you're talking about with the affirmations So there's all these birth affirmations I am enough I am beautiful I am wonderful I am going to have a great birth I am And it ranges you know cause I don't I think that af affirming things is fine as long as you're affirming something that is true but like you said it never made sense to me The affirmations where you're telling yourself something that you know may or may not happen And I was like how is this gonna work for me If I know that I'm lying to myself How can I convince myself because I'm the one saying it and I know that I'm lying So it never made sense to me And then the problem is that when it doesn't work for you then you are the one who's blamed It's you are responsible to have the right mindset and if your birth doesn't go the way you want it to then it's your fault you just didn't you know have didn't say the right things You didn't affirm the right things You just didn't have the right mindset And it's all put on you which is a like you said it's a massive weight and it's a weight that Christians should not have to bear and so I'm all for affirming scriptural Truths but it should not be pointing back to ourself as the source of everything It should be pointing us back to God as the source for everything

Natalie Portman 19:27

Absolutely. And I think that's also why I have really struggled as a believer to get on board with, Christian Hypnobirthing. I feel like it, I had an interview, with Kayla Borgela, and she's been my doula client in person twice. And her first ended up, she had a very long labor and had a C-section. And then as she was preparing for her second birth, and was planning a vbac, just trying to, prepare for that. She came across, Christian Hypnobirthing and she shared that it. To her seemed too much of this manifestation mindset of just like you tell yourself enough that you're gonna have this type of experience, that you're gonna have it. And that is just not how it works. And so her sharing that little piece as I just thought about that more and just like the Lord has just met me in that, the more I'm just like, yeah, I don't even see the merit in having hypnobirthing even with the label Christian and just using Christian kind of terms or words. because I think, again, it goes back to we are not in control. Not in a scary way, like not in a. God is a madman looking to get you kind of way. But he is a good father and he loves us, but he also loves us and allows us to walk through hard things. Not because it brings him pleasure, but because it draws us nearer to him. It certainly can do that. and so yeah that's another thing that I feel like as I, I get more into this birth space and the more I think about, hypnobirthing and Christian Hypnobirthing specifically for Christians, the more I'm like I think we're, definitely missing the mark here. I think We're making it too much about outcomes when that is not what all of this all of life is about, but certainly not our birth experiences.

Dannette 21:20

I think there's a couple things too with Hypnobirthing one is that Hypnosis itself is a whole a whole thing in itself and as Christians we can't just take some works and slap a Christian label on it and say we can do it Now We have to be really intentional about of the source of why it's working and so the more I've listened to and talked to people who have been in the new age and who have been you know practiced hypnosis before I've heard the same thing from all of them which is that it is primarily a spiritual practice and it's designed to take away your critical thinking Essentially it's designed to make you more suggestible they have opened themselves up unintentionally to spiritual forces and that as a Christian should be automatic red flag for us so we can't look at hypnosis and say it's not effective We shouldn't do it cause it is effective There's a lot of people who have had great success with Hypnobirthing who have used it say they had a wonderful outcome But that's we have to think deeper than that We can't just say cause it works we're gonna turn it Christian and make it work I heard somebody talk about how can we decide as Christians if we can redeem a practice and specifically this kind of applies to a lot of more Wellness practices in general what you call non-traditional medicine so how do you decide if we can engage in these things as Christians and they said you have to be able to determine that this practice works based on solely physical properties that God designed in the world So if this thing derived any power at all from a supernatural source We cannot touch it We cannot redeem it We cannot engage with it because God has said like For our good He said do not mess with these things Do not open spiritual doors that you should not be opening And it's for our own good right He's protecting us from something that actually is real It's not just a fun killer you know he's trying to protect us from real threats real dangers and so those are things that if they derive any power at all from a supernatural or spiritual source don't touch it don't mess with it And I do believe that hypnosis falls in that category

23:35

Before we jump back in, if you're listening to this conversation and thinking, "Okay, but how does this apply to my situation?" That's exactly what virtual birth support is for. We take everything you're learning from episodes like this one and work through what it looks like specifically for you. And you can learn more at faithoverfearbirth.com or visit the link in the show notes. Now back to the conversation

Natalie Portman 24:01

another thing that I feel like is important too, when you're discerning those things is not only like, where is this power coming from? Is it spiritual or just elemental, but who's receiving the glory for this? Who's, who is being attributed this healing? Is it the Lord or is it something else? and I mean that's true with anything, not just like healing things, but like again, what is the point of this birth experience going beautifully? Is it for self glory? Is it so that you can tell yourself, I'm so strong. I did it. is it to, be hard on yourself that you didn't do it, the, the way you wanted it to? Like, Oh I failed so miserably birthing the way I was, quote unquote supposed to or whatever. Like, if at the end of the day you come away from it, either puffing yourself up or deflating yourself because of the experience, then you really have to look at then what was I doing all this for? Was it really for the Lord or was it for myself in some, very beautifully worded way, you know what I mean? We can deceive ourselves so much. And not to say God can't redeem that because I think in some ways the Lord has even redeemed my first birth experience where he really met me and there was so much positive, but there was a lot of pride from that experience as well. Like the Lord brought me through so much, it was such a worshipful experience. But then quietly in my heart, there, there were times where I was. Oh man I just, I'm so good at giving birth and that was just easy, and I'm just so strong, which it's not negative to think those things about yourself, but if it eclipses the Lord's glory and the weight of who he is and the beauty of what he's done in your life, not what you manifested in your own life, that's, I feel like a really big difference in, in how you frame that experience.

Dannette 25:48

I love too what you were saying about chasing outcomes and I think that's another thing that I see a lot in the Christian birth world is we are really focused especially probably just like a cultural thing We're really focused right now on physiological birth and I've seen it almost put on this pedestal where it's like this is the highest goal This is what we're looking for This is the best type of birth And then If you can do a natural birth buts in the hospital that's good too But you know if you can do a physiological birth at home you know you've really arrived You know and I think that is such a danger especially with just the direction that health and wellness is going right now and it's such a danger specifically to Christians because we want to honor God with our bodies and we want to Trust him with our bodies and give him glory for the beautiful design that he's made But even like wellness culture itself has started to become an idol And I started noticing it in myself first So I have had eczema since my first was born Like a couple months after she was born developed eczema I'd had it like once a little patch of it as a kid but not consistently And then when she was like two months old it flared up and it has not gone away since So I've had it for Almost three years now and it is something that like because I had stepped into that you know the natural birth world I was like on the wellness train already You know I'm like starting to eat cleaner and getting rid of you know the more processed foods in my home Which I mean a lot of us are doing that And I'm not saying by any means that's a bad thing what I wanna say is that You can't chase the outcome So if my whole goal was to get rid of the eczema or if my whole goal is I must have a physiological birth without any interventions you're already chasing the wrong thing because then if you don't get that thing you've lost your hope You've feel like you're a failure I had to realize that my goal can't be painless birth or physiological birth or getting rid of my eczema and cause I started realizing what is my do I just wanna live forever what am I doing all of this for I'm making all these changes in my life and working out and what is it all for Do I wanna just never experience pain again and live forever that's not As Christians that's not what we should be chasing We should be doing everything to the glory of God And if you are you know being healthy and doing all these things so that you can steward your body that is one thing but we just have to be really careful about in our minds what is the goal What is the main outcome Why am I doing this Is it for my own comfort Is it so that I can not have to experience anything uncomfortable in my life I think We have forgotten the value of suffering in our culture You know we've forgotten that pain-free birth or physiological birth is not the ultimate good Like there is good That can happen through really hard things and really tough things and sometimes that's sometimes the change in your spirit and your relationship with the Lord that occurs during those hard times is so much more impactful and deep than something you would experience if you had no hardship and no pain

Natalie Portman 29:03

Yeah, I could not agree more. There's a beautiful book, I don't know if you're a Tim Keller fan. I listened to his podcast, which is like basically his old sermons and he wrote a book on pain and suffering and it's called Walking With God through Pain and Suffering. I started listening to it when my son was in the nicu and just as like a way to just continue to focus that, that season, that was hard. On the Lord and like just knowing that he is walking me through it. And so if you are walking through a season, or even if you're not, I think it's such a beautiful book to look at scripture and to reframe, why the Lord allows pain and suffering. It has proven time and time again all throughout the scripture, like literally all throughout the scripture. and phrases that you may have heard in Christian circles is things like you're never safer than in the Will of God. And that sounds so good, but that is not biblical. Jesus was perfectly in the center of God's will and he was led to a cross to be tortured and killed. So that is not a safe place to be. The Lord is not solely interested in your safety and in your comfort. he is so much more interested in your holiness and you being, in right relationship with him that is way more important to him. And so he will allow pain and suffering in your life so that you can get to that true end and not just simply to feel comfortable and to feel safe. and that, all is well when it's really not. I think that's the other kind of delusional part of having this mindset of, whatever, whatever I'm pursuing in my life, I just don't wanna be in pain with it. I've read this really interesting post, that someone made a few years ago, and it was like, whether through meditation or medication, we try to, avoid pain. And when you think about it in the birth perspective. That's really powerful. Like it, that really is true. Whether you're trying to do all of the kind of, natural routes or the medication route, we really do try to avoid pain and not that we should be seeking pain, not that we should be trying to add pain as if like it, like some sort of like masochistic thing. truly just trying to avoid all pain is not a biblical, goal. Which is really challenging like that is very challenging to us, especially in our American culture, where that is a constant thing that is preached. and like you're saying, even in the health and wellness space. Everything is meant to provide us more comfort. So it's just, it's very fascinating and I think all of us have to do that inventory in our own heart to discern like what way we're leaning with that.

Dannette 31:57

another one is just the influence of the prosperity gospel on birth right now and I'm seeing it mostly in people who are doing like declarative type prayers and again it's this idea that we should not have to experience any pain and suffering in this world and that we can declare the promises and they're using again Christian language using the promises of scripture but they're twisting them out of their original context and meaning and I was so Surprised And not surprised right When I started reading further into these people who are claiming promises of scripture I saw that they are using all of the exact same phrases and scriptures from the Bible as the false faith healers you see on TV that whole vein of claiming the promises of God they over and over again say by his stripes we are healed Therefore you can claim your healing tonight they use all of the same scriptures to claim that you can have a pain-free birth or a healthy pregnancy in birth all of these things and it's just there's nothing new under the sun right like to me the biggest thing you gotta do is to be in the scriptures As a Christian you have to understand them for yourself You have to know how to interpret them for yourself so that you can spot when people are twisting them out of their original meaning but I see it a lot with the declarative prayers as well where people are saying you can declare Psalm 91 over your children And it's talking about health and safety And again like God is not interested in our physical safety Jesus was killed on a cross right He's interested in our holiness our sanctification and bringing us back to himself

Natalie Portman 33:34

I remember reading Supernatural Childbirth. I remember having a pit in my stomach reading it because I was like, This is heresy. This is not truth. And it was very upsetting to me because it was, using scripture, to justify something that is not at all the gospel. And it reminded me of when Satan scripture, when he leads, Jesus into the wilderness and he's like, throw yourself off of this, cliff and like the angels will rescue you. And all, and it's just like we, we also have to be aware of the way that our own hearts want to just hear what our itching ears wanna hear, instead of, being challenged by the truth of what the scriptures say. And that's something that it takes so much humility. It takes a lot of time and discernment, like what you've been talking about really digging into this, really getting to the root of it. And it's not easy to do that. especially for the ones that are like counter-cultural things that, the culture just accepts as like perfectly normal. But as believers we have to say, I cannot accept this. I cannot go with the flow on this. even if other believers are believing that You're right. Just wanting to seek the Lord by actually getting to know him in the scripture. And that's a discipline that I feel like within only the last handful of years I've really done, is like going through the Bible, like verse by verse and understanding the context, who it was written to. what did these scriptures actually mean in the context in which they were written in. instead of just, through Christ, I can do all things. Okay. And then like football teams just use that to win a football game. That is not what that verse is about. and so I think again, we're all prone to that and especially depending on your upbringing and, America has a very broad kind of category of Christianity. And so it can be really tricky there too, as well. depending on the denomination or all those things. So if a mama listening wants to be more discerning about, the birth content or the support that she's receiving in this season, where is a good place for her to start?

Dannette 35:55

So I think there's a few essentials Number one is I really think it's so important to be plugged into a biblical church because do not underestimate the value of taking a post to an older woman in your church and saying what do you think about this does this raise any red flags for you because sometimes you know especially as a younger generation we're on the internet a lot and that can just We just get used to the language the things that we're seeing and sometimes bringing it to someone who's outside of that can be really helpful in just like shedding some light on it and getting their perspective So being a part of a biblical church is so important for that reason because of the relationships we you have with people And also just because you need to be in the word you need to be part of a church that is teaching the word Biblically exe it faithfully week after week just modeling for you this is how we approach scripture This is how we you know pull it apart understand its meaning and then know how to apply it to our lives I like that you were used the word discipline the discipline of understanding scripture cause it really is a discipline it's a lot like training your body Like you can't Train your biceps one time and then like your biceps are good for the rest of your life It just doesn't work that way Like you have to you train your upper body and then you train your lower body and then a month later you're back to doing the same things because you lost a little bit or you forgot it or a lot the same with scripture Like you study your Bible and then you come back to that book a few years later and you're like oh I forgot about this part And then you remember that it references this other book of the Bible over here And then you're like but how do those two things fit together And then you can dive deeper into it So it's not like It's not like a one and done thing You can't just say I read my Bible and now I understand It's a discipline and you have to be in the word consistently And as moms sometimes it's really hard to find the time to do that even if it's like listening to faithful preachers listening to scripture being read as you're going about your day just thinking about it praying about it just think of it like your discipline It's your spiritual food You're feeding your soul that way So that's really important and the reason is because they always say like in apologetics when People who spot counterfeit bills when they're training They do not touch a counterfeit bill for I don't remember how long A ridiculously long amount of time They only handle real money for like months and months or something crazy and they study everything about the real money And then when a counterfeit bill comes across their hands they know it in seconds Like they don't even have to know anything about it except that it's not the real thing and so that's what's so important about knowing scripture knowing Theology knowing the principles of the Bible is because if we know the truth inside and out if we see something that comes across and it's even just twisted a little bit we're automatically gonna recognize it and know that it's not the truth

Natalie Portman 38:47

Yeah, that's a beautiful way to think about it. One way that I have dove into this discipline of studying the scripture is like the different you version Bible in a year. so I've like read the Bible in the year a handful of times now. The one I'm doing this year is the Bible recap with Tara Lee Cobble. And that's a fantastic one to start. So say you're listening to this and you're like, Ooh, I'm feeling really convicted that like I am not studying the scripture like I should. or like I know like the Lord is like calling me to, that is a great place to start is the Bible recap. and it's just a very simple resource, but yes, so much depth in just even the very dry, like genealogies and like laws that the Israelites got, like all that stuff as, as hard as it is to wrap your heart and mind around those things, at times every single word is God breathed in scripture and it is meaningful and purposeful and serves, the greater meta-narrative and just all the things. And so having the ability to have someone help guide you through that and just, fan the flame of love for God's word is beautiful. And I love that you gave that analogy of the counterfeit money. 'cause it's so true. It's like when you know in and out the real thing, when you encounter something that is not that. you become more proficient at that. it's just a beautiful way to live your life and to experience the Lord having true life and having it abundantly. instead of yeah, scrambling to patch together a version of a beautiful life for yourself. And then realize what have I built for myself? This is so self-serving, it's so disappointing. it's all these things, but like truly the life that the Lord prescribes the way that he has built us and designed us is to experience him and to love him and enjoy him forever and ever. and I think that's, just such a beautiful hope that we get to clinging to as believers.

Dannette 40:52

Yeah that reminds me of the scripture that says submit yourself to the Lord and he'll give you the desires of your heart And a lot of people like to twist that one as if God is like a genie in the bottle that we can you know if we pray just right or if we do all these right things then he'll give me what I want it all along And the truth is that he gives us himself That's the way that he does that is that he makes himself what we desire and he gives us himself and then that's all that we want and then we're fulfilled in that perfectly So your faith and your satisfaction and your hope and your you know feeling like you accomplish something if that is all founded on the Lord in your identity in Christ then you're not ever going to be disappointed by your birth not going the way you wanted it to Any of these other things whether you have a lot of pain or it's traumatic or you know anything long as your identity is rooted in Christ that can't be taken away from you so you're going to be all right

Natalie Portman 41:50

You'll be more than all right? You will, you'll be living in what the Lord has for you. And there is nothing greater than that than to experience him and know him and that is the goal. It's actually funny because, I think by the time this episode comes out, I would've already shared my birth story with my third, who came premature and he was in the NICU and all the things, but. It's so interesting because the Lord very clearly, was encouraging me to pray over that birth, not for any specific outcomes. He was very specific and it was things like that I would come to know the Lord more, that I would, trust him more and that I would experience his joy more. And then to have the high risk premature NICU experience of Isaac's birth. And yet I did experience the Lord's love more and I trusted him more, and I experienced more joy in that experience than I have in my other. Uncomplicated labor and birth experiences and postpartum experiences. So like that, like truly like Jesus is where the joy is. And just to, pull out that little personal experience. But yeah, just to be walking with the Lord in that joy that doesn't come from things going perfectly the way that I expected them to or hoped for them to, or planned for them to, but that the Lord had something greater and better for me, even though none of those things happened the way I wanted them to. and yeah, that's I guess my hope and prayer for the mama listening that she would come to experience that. But any last thoughts before you go? Your wisdom is just beautiful. I'm so happy to have you here.

Dannette 43:36

thank you It's been so good to talk to a like-minded birth worker cause there's so many ways to fall off the wagon right It's not even just there's a road and then two ditches It's like there's so many ditches in the birth world I keep saying and it's like it's very hard to keep yourself in the truth but it's absolutely worth it maybe just one more practical thing I could share Teacher or organization online is gonna be wrong about something at some point because the only one who had perfect theology was Jesus right So you do have to be careful but obviously there are some organizations who are more trustworthy than others Get their opinion on it and then get an opposing opinion and start exercising your own discernment and judgment It's okay to disagree with people who you trust and it's okay to it's actually really good to exercise that muscle of testing for yourself against scripture

Natalie Portman 44:33

And it also makes me want to say as somebody who the Lord has given. like some sort of authority in like the podcasting space. But that especially goes for what I say on this podcast. And what guests of mine on this podcast say everything. Needs to be discerned. and just because I love the Lord and I believe that I'm following him, that to the best of my ability doesn't mean that there are certainly gonna be times where I miss the mark. I don't say the right thing. I don't have the right mindset or, truth about something. and yeah, it, it is it's truly a spiritual battle that we are living, in, and, we don't get a pass from, oh, this is a Christian, so I'm just gonna adopt everything they say. even people that, are generally trustworthy and generally are speaking truth, but there's all, I mean, we're just, we're all so prone to it, like you said, like it's not just like one side of the ditch or the other. It's like there's so many ways in which we can miss the mark. again, thank you Danette for coming on and sharing and, I'm just really excited for the way the Lord is gonna meet, every single mama that's listening to this and just stir up. just hope for the beautiful things the Lord has for them, but also just challenging them that the Holy Spirit would just want to, come alongside them to teach them and, the discipline of reading scripture and of discernment and, just knowing what's true and what to believe and what not to believe. So thank you so much again,

Dannette 45:57

you for having me

45:58

That's it for today's episode. If this encouraged you, I would love to invite you to sign up for my free Christian Mama Birth Prep Library. It's full of practical tools and faith-rooted resources to help you prepare for a peaceful, Christ-centered birth. You can sign up at faithoverfearbirth.com or with the link in the show notes. And if you enjoyed this podcast episode, I would love it if you would take 30 seconds right now to leave a rating and review of this podcast. It genuinely means so much to me, and it also helps more mamas find this resource. Until next time, keep choosing faith over fear