From Chef to CFO: Building a People-First Hospitality Brand – Adam Hayes | Episode 10

Adam Hayes, CFO & Co-Owner of Larkin’s Restaurant Group, shares his journey from fry cook to executive chef to financial leader — and how he’s building a people-first hospitality brand that thrives.

In this episode, we talk about:

• His transition from chef to CFO
• Building a leadership bench across multiple locations
• Scaling culture without compromise
• Why “Be NICE” guides every decision
• How to hire and retain the right people
• The unexpected leadership boost of a kitchen pushup challenge

🎧 Watch & Listen:

• Full Episode on YouTube: https://youtu.be/9_cvNzHkBzs
• “Be NICE” Teaser: https://youtube.com/shorts/BANepIgLIrg?feature=share
• Pushup Challenge Teaser: https://youtube.com/shorts/cW7t9TRVL_w

🔗 Resources & Links:

• Learn more: https://www.jasonebrooks.com/podcast 
• Join the Leadership Circle: https://www.aimdrivescale.com/

Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction to Adam Hayes
• 8:38 From Chef to Executive Leadership
• 15:04 Building a Balanced Leadership Team
• 25:16 The "Be Nice" Culture Philosophy
• 34:57 Leadership Lessons and Inspiration
• 48:41 Celebrating 20 Years of Larkin's

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:05

Welcome to the Leadership Table. Today's guest is Adam Hayes, a hospitality leader whose journey spans from executive chef to co-owner and CFO of Larkin's Restaurant Group. That group includes local favorites like Larkin's Limoncello and Grill Marks, each known not just for their flavor but their focus on people. What makes Adam's story so special isn't just the culinary path. It's the commitment to culture, clarity and coaching, whether it's hiring with intention or developing future leaders. Adam brings a mindset that every operator can learn from, and in today's episode, we're diving into that journey, starting right at the kitchen line, with Adam's story. In his own words, let's get into it, ok. So, adam, I've been looking forward to this conversation. There is a lot to unpack from, from your days behind the line to your role now leading people and numbers. I want to first start with your journey, though You've gone from fry cook to executive chef, to co-owner and now CFO. Was there a defining moment that pushed you to trade in your chef's coat for a seat at the financial and ownership table?

Speaker 2: 1:33

Yeah, I think there was. I think there was a moment in time where you know you have as a chef and every chef is different, right but for me in particular, my journey, you know I was cooking a really high level. It took a lot to do that, you know, and you hear this a lot. It's a lot of time and a lot of focus, a lot of energy. And I happened to be up in Cashers, north Carolina, at Canyon Kitchen and I was cooking up there and I was just surrounded by some really great chefs and we were just working together, hand in hand, creating these really great menus.

Speaker 2: 2:04

But I realized I was kind of, I was kind of bipolar. You know, up there it's a seasonal restaurant, right. So Memorial day to Labor day is really when you're busy up there. You got some shoulder season before that and after that, but then pretty much the winter, you know there's nothing going on up there in the winter. So you don't really you don't really work, you don't really chef.

Speaker 2: 2:22

So you know, kind of by that second, third year, I started realizing I was real almost like bipolar. I was a husband and father. You know, in the wintertime and summertime I was just gone. I was, you know, seven days a week working. I was going up, you know, I was getting up at seven, up there by eight, eight, 30, you know, not getting home till midnight or one and just going, going, going, going all the time with that and it just was not sustainable for me at that time and I started really questioning what I was doing, why I was doing it, how much I still loved it. And I think that's really the thing you gotta love. You gotta love being a chef. You gotta love cooking. I still love it. I just don't love it seven days a week, you know, 365 right now. Um, you know, I I started coming to grips with that and started saying what else in this business can I do? What has this being a chef taught me? What kind of skills has it given me that will apply into other other facets of the business? And, you know, then it started leading me towards. Well, I'm an open mountain restaurant, right.

Speaker 2: 3:17

So we lived up in Brevard, north Carolina, and that was my plan. I was going to open a restaurant there and my family and I were going to run it. We're going to do this whole thing. So you're talking about middle of. That would have been middle of 18 to like beginning of 19 was trying to make all this work. Uh, luckily we didn't make it work, because 2020 would have crushed us and, uh, we'd have just been, you know, flat out then. So you know, I just ended up taking a job here in Greenville as a culinary director because I needed a job. So I was like, all right, well, be back in the kitchen, but this will be over multiple kitchens and I'll be able to do some stuff there. So I really kind of focused in getting in here.

Speaker 2: 3:59

And once I got here, it wasn't long after that a gentleman had been with the company for a long time went and opened his own place and the owners looked at me and my partner, christina, to be, uh, executive vice presidents and at some I had no idea what that meant. I was like, yeah, sure, whatever, we'll figure it out. You know that's how life is and I did. I started digging into just common sense stuff. For me was digging into p and l's finally like what's this for, what's that, that for? Why are we paying this? How much is that? Why is that so much? You know, really started chopping at the P&L and expenses going out of the businesses and really started to really dial them in.

Speaker 2: 4:34

And then, you know, I think in some ways don't hear me wrong, but in some ways the 2020 COVID pandemic on restaurants was kind of a positive thing, and the positive thing that came out of that is we're really able to shed off things we just didn't need to be paying for. And did they come back after that? Not really. Like you know, larkin's and Grill, marks and Lemon Child have been known in the community to donate something to everything, right To everything. You email us, we'll send you a gift card. You're doing a silent auction for whatever something in a whole nother county and we're going to send you a gift card.

Speaker 2: 5:13

And I was just like that don't make any sense for us. I don't. You know, I get there's a cause and that's something great, but unless it's really close to someone on our team, I don't know why we're doing it. You know it doesn't make any sense. It's just a random person emailing us for something. So we just took the approach. If it doesn't help somebody on our team or directly affect someone on our team, then then we're not going to do it. And, um, we make those decisions day by day. Um, so if a you know, if I got a manager or even a server who's kids, you know, softball team or is trying to raise money for a trip and they want a hundred dollar gift card, we'll do that in a heartbeat because they're on our team, you know they're, they're with us and that's going to directly benefit them. So you know, and then it kept going.

Speaker 2: 5:56

So, to answer your question, I kind of going down a rabbit hole. You got to be careful with me. But to to sum that up, I mean once we became executive vice presidents, I mean we're essentially in a role where we're already partnered at that time and we're both working closely together kind of an ownership mindset, as I've always been my whole life and just really we're attacking everything we could attack to make the businesses stronger and more profitable and really benefit everything. So it's kind of when that all happened and I just realized you know there's something about being in that position with the knowledge base I've gained as a chef and my ability to be able to really communicate with all sectors of life, and that all came from my experience in kitchens. I mean, I bounced around some kitchens and in all different types of cities and all different parts of the world and everything still applies. I mean, you just got to be able to be someone that can lead others, that they look up to and that you can inspire them. And eventually, you know you don't see it right now, but I got a ton of energy. When I'm in a kitchen it's just a lot of fun for me, you know, just so much fun for me.

Speaker 2: 7:06

And here recently we've been short staffed at Larkins, you know, so we've been, we've kind of gone through our staffing was there. So I've been spending time in the kitchen just helping out where I can, filling holes, you know, working on the menus, developing the plate ups, like working harder there in terms of what my skills can apply. And it's funny, we got this kid he's, I don't know, he's busting my chops about something and I was going right back at him with it and I was like dude, I've been doing this like my whole life. Like what are you talking about, you know? And he said something else and then he made some comment about. You know, I couldn't even do 40 pushups.

Speaker 2: 7:40

I said right now I said right here in the kitchen floor. So I went and got my Jason, one of our operations managers. I brought him back. I said you count them off. We're doing it right here and every I mean you know what happens there. Jason, which is comical, is like that is such a morale booster off the silliest stuff. I mean I'm probably on everybody's Snapchat right now. That works in our restaurant. Everybody has their cameras out. You can't do anything without somebody videotaping.

Speaker 1: 8:06

Not these days, though. There is always a witness.

Speaker 2: 8:09

I can just feel them around me. They're all like what's going on in there? Oh my gosh, chef Adam's back there, what's he doing? And then I mean, we just went head to head. I did 50. He did 33.

Speaker 1: 8:26

And I just not going to happen. It's just not going to happen, not even with pushups, not with serving plates, not with the best bills, not with recipe specs and not with pushups.

Speaker 2: 8:36

Absolutely, oh man so first, you know those are those leadership things we talked about. Right, like you know, call it what you will, it could be silly, whatever. But you know there was a moment there where there was like it was a little bit of a call out, like you're not gonna call me out, but there's also, like you know, like he was pumped up after I mean, we, you know, we kind of shook it off and I say you know, they're real non-confrontational in a kitchen nowadays, so they have a hard time like motivating each other if that makes sense, like it's, um, you know, like in my day I won't use all the proper words that we use with each other, but it was always like if I was on a station and you were on a station and I was killing it and all my orders were going up and I'm waiting on you, I'm, I'm busting your chops.

Speaker 1: 9:21

Call it out.

Speaker 2: 9:25

How much longer. You know, oh my God, do you need to go find somebody else to work that station with you? Like that kind of stuff. You don't have any of that in the kitchen now. They don't do any of that. So, um, there was something about that, I think, in in growing up in the business and cooking that was really inspirational, that would really motivate you because you were, it was like peer to peer. It wasn't like I needed a chef to get on me, it was that peer to peer that really pushed, pushed you to be better and more efficient, um, to be able to keep up to all that stuff.

Speaker 2: 9:56

And I look back on those days. I mean I was at Mimosa grill in Charlotte in like 2001, 2002, somewhere around there, and you know the convention center was right next door. And you know the convention center was right next door and you know I had an Iranian general manager, nasser Razmir, and that dude, that dude bonus on how much money, he did not care, he just brought it at us and 450 seat restaurant and they would see he would seat the whole restaurant at once and you had to put the food out. There was no like option. There was no complaining about it. There was no sitting in the corner crying about it. It was like you got to get me the food, like go, go, go, and that's when we would really banter with each other.

Speaker 2: 10:31

So I mean those were like the old days, I say, but I mean I couldn't imagine what they were before. That I mean it's just like you know, it's not like an old man right when I was your age, but you know, even before that was, you know, it's just different levels of stuff and that's something that I've been learning to adapt to and find different ways, I guess, to motivate, to challenge, to inspire, like those are all the big things that you keep learning about, and sometimes it's the silliest things like a push-up contest in the middle of the kitchen. I mean it's the silliest thing. Things like a push-up contest in the middle of the kitchen, I mean it's the silliest thing. And they were all hyped up about it. Everybody's talking about it, everybody's buzzing, everybody's happy, everybody's going into the evening. It's a Friday, saturday night, I can't remember which one, but they're all going in and out super excited and laughing and having a good time, and so it will morale boost.

Speaker 1: 11:21

You dropped so many gems, so many. I'm gonna go back to to the actual start, though, and listeners, you may need to rewind this because, first of all, western north carolina has a lot of gems. If you've never been to cashers or brevard, absolutely go there, even during peak season, when, whenever it is busy but it is gorgeous out there there are some amazing restaurants, some incredible chefs, the views, everything about western nc. It is just top notch. Even after those storms did some damage to western NC, it's still amazing out there.

Speaker 1: 12:04

Now, your shift from chef into a leadership role to a ownership role.

Speaker 1: 12:13

It takes a lot to be able to break that mold, because even whenever I was a sous chef in downtown Fayetteville at the Hilltop House, buying my first pair of Wusthof knives, some Birkenstock chef shoes and plucking herbs from the garden that was right outside the doors of the bar area and helping to create specials, there is this thing, there's this pride that is there about creating something that people fall in love with, and that anxiety of is it good enough and can I teach this to the other chefs?

Speaker 1: 12:53

Yes, I am on my station in charge of my features once I got to that point, but still teaching others what that build is and teaching these servers how to sell it. There is that special connection with you and the food. And then to shift from that into ownership yes, you still get hands on some, but you're kind of leaving behind some of what was built. So I was going to ask some of the biggest leadership lessons learned from stepping into that role from a active chef, in which you still are, but into that ownership and more numbers role. Some people are like no, I'm bored out of my brains. But you talked about how you were able to take multiple things learned through leadership in different kitchens and then help to apply that today, even in environments that are very different from what you came from. That's amazing.

Speaker 2: 13:56

Yeah, it's even more challenging, you know, to you know, as far as multi-unit, there's a skill in that alone. Multi-unit leadership management is a skill in itself that I've never really had, I guess, in terms of I've never really been responsible for more than you know one location. Until you know I was at a resort in Daresville, georgia, called Barnsley Gardens Resort and I was there and you know you had a catering operation. You had, you know, three restaurants. You had, you know, all this stuff and it was like that was about the gist of my multi-unit management experience and that lasted for me for like 10 months.

Speaker 2: 14:29

I just didn't, you know, wasn't the best place for me in the world, and you know. So we ended up that's when we ended up moving back to Brevard and got that, you know, started working up in cashier. So you know, going into a role like that, you had to. You know you had to be present, you had to be a leader with you know, five corporations it's really six in my brain because we got a catering operation too. We have a corporate office that had people working there. So you know, you had to lead those groups and had to lead each restaurant and catering is a juggernaut.

Speaker 1: 14:59

I mean, that's its own other planet. Most people think, oh well, I just sell it bulk now. No, that's, you have to be very specific as to what you offer when it comes down to catering. Sorry, not to cut you off.

Speaker 2: 15:11

Well, no, no, I mean, that's the. I always say you got to be spry there, right, you got to be able to bounce around and do like, figure it out fast, and sometimes in a situation where you know you don't know the territory at all, so you know. Great example we had a catering sold up in Brevard about a month ago. You know, and I know the territory like I know the terrain. So it's like, okay, well, you know, I'm not, I wasn't directly involved, but I became involved because they needed my experience and knowledge in the area. But then we started digging into it more, christina and I, and our experience combined in that department is pretty strong. So we started really bantering about the plan that was set forth by the team. I said, well, this plan is not gonna work. I hate to bust your bubble, but this pretty strong. So we started really bantering about the plan that was set forth by the team. I said, well, this plan is not going to work. I hate to bust your bubble, but this ain't working. So we quickly had to make an audible. You know, within a week's run, make an audible, found an Airbnb. You know, put the team up, three, three team members up in the Airbnb and then had to get a refrigerator truck because we didn't have enough refrigeration at the venue to hold all the food cold. It was a weekend long event, right, it was Friday, saturday, sunday, multiple meals per day, you know. So the kids are up there, isolated, basically. So Christina and I drove up on the first day. We made sure we set everything up, we made sure everything worked, we made sure everything was there, like that was the thing we needed to to do. We couldn't just send them without the experience level. I think they were super appreciative. And then we took them to a friend of mine's restaurant up there and and picked them out and gored them out and they were super stoked about that. But, um, but they did a great job all weekend. We're set for success.

Speaker 2: 16:41

I mean, I think that sometimes half the battle is teaching some of that stuff. I mean I learned it through time. Christina's learned it time, but these kids are learning it right now, at this time, and I think that's the hard part for me. I keep going back to that. It's like what I learned and how I learned it. I keep questioning that how did I learn it? You know who actually taught me that? Or how did I? How did I get here?

Speaker 2: 17:03

And I think that I have to go back in time and say, okay, well, I've got, I say, kids. I got people in their, in their moment right now, learning, and so how do I better teach them? And so a lot of times I will spend time with them, whether they like it or not, philosophically, or this is why I made this decision, this is why you do it this way, this is why it makes sense, and really trying to develop that mentality on it. And you know, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Sometimes people look at me like I'm an idiot. You know, like, oh, you're so stupid. And then sometimes you know like I'm cooking on the line with a guy the other day and I'm like, hey, man, how long have you been cooking?

Speaker 2: 17:46

He's like 30 years. I said me too, that's crazy. And we're sitting there. He was like you guys have been cooking for 30 years. Yeah, man, he's like God, no way. I was like, yeah, you might want to listen to us. We might actually teach you something along the way. We've seen a thing or two.

Speaker 1: 18:08

We've seen a few brunches with this conversation. I want to personally invite you to take it a step further inside the leadership circle. It's my small group coaching experience, designed specifically for operators and owners who want to scale smarter, lead stronger and build teams that truly care. We meet regularly to work through real challenges, sharpen leadership systems and create a culture that actually sticks. If that sounds like something you've been looking for, head to jasonebrookscom or just click the link in the show notes. Now back to the episode, see.

Speaker 1: 18:45

But this is the thing here Every question that you're posing to them, everything you're teaching them, is the foundation of culture. It is the actual foundation of culture. Some people, they don't know how to put their thumb on. What culture is? You just defined it by taking you and Christina's experience and thinking through that region, that territory. What are those? What are those logistics that need to be done for this to go well? Now, how do we take our team, put them in the right situation, the right environment, and how do we teach them about these things? And now, how do I also make that connect within the restaurant, for whether it's someone that's been cooking for 30 years or for three years, that is the power of culture, and I do believe you posted recently about gratitude for your team and the power of culture and the power of culture.

Speaker 2: 19:53

What is something that you've learned about hiring for heart and not just skill. I mean, I've learned that one a couple times ever. Honestly, you know we talk a lot about when you're talking to someone, what kind of like. What are you getting out of that person? Right, like, what are you looking for? Is this the right fit for what we're looking for? But it's also, if I'm talking to you and we were hitting it off and ask a few questions and I'm like this guy's great, like he needs to work for it, where could he, where could he fit into what we're doing?

Speaker 2: 20:27

We then start doing that kind of stuff. It's almost like well, I'm interviewing you for a bartender. Well, I don't think you have quite the experience From my conversation. Maybe you're super personable that goes a long way in a bar all day long, right, but you don't have the technical skills. But maybe there's a different position that works for you. Or maybe, like, after talking to you, you're like you could be some like almost like liaison between the customer and the restaurant, like all the restaurants, because you're so personable, and maybe you know I can develop something out of that.

Speaker 2: 21:00

And then my brain starts going down a road and it's really starts becoming more about who's this person in front of me, what are their skills, what are they doing? How do they contribute? What I really like about them? And that's funny because when we just did the whole StrengthsFinder again right, so that was a big deal for us. We were hiring people, point O, they weren't working out. We're hiring them on gut, we're hiring them on feel, we're hiring them on all the things you would do skill, experience, all that stuff. And so I was like we got to do something different. This was all at Larkins and we kind of went through a couple of managers at times and no, we're doing the Strength Finder all over again, like we're just doing it. And I did mine just for fun. And you know I'm an arranger, you know that's my strongest skill, so I'm able to take the things that we have, the people we have, the resources we have, and I'm able to put that in a way that makes sense and that's my skill.

Speaker 2: 21:49

And luckily, our, our executive team all has different skills in that realm and started and started as a strengths and it keeps us a real balanced team. I mean there's really four of us there's, there's Scott we call him the wolf and then we've got Jason and I call him the captain. And then there's Christina and myself and um you, um, you know we sit around and we got. You know, we've got a woo guy. You know, jason's a real positive woo guy. He keeps people motivated, keeps engaged, very engaged, with the people.

Speaker 2: 22:16

So he's he's the captain, but he's our people and products guy. So he's really focused on people, training, staffing, hiring, developing processes. And then, on the product side, it's about standardization make sure all of our liquors match up to our standards, all of our wines match up to our standards, beer, food. You know, if there's a food crisis, a price spike, we need to make an adjustment. That's, that's his responsibility, that's his focus. Um, you know, the wolf is, you know, just like in Pulp Fiction man. He's. He's the guy you call when there's a problem, you know.

Speaker 1: 22:46

Wait, did you say pulp fiction? Oh, I love it I love it.

Speaker 2: 22:51

He's the wolf. He shows up and fixes it, all right. So that's when you call the wolf, but he is literally our operations director. I mean, he really keeps all the nuts and bolts moving, he fixes problems, he's you know, he's our toast expert on the POS. He's in and out of that thing. I mean it just really you got to have people on your team that specialize in things and you know I've got the fancy CFO title. But you know, whatever that means, I just make sure that we're putting some money in the bank and that we can afford to pay for all the things and future expansion, future growth, investment back into the business, investment to our people, monitoring a lot of that stuff is really what my title ends up being at the end of the day. But the four of us really come together. So I think I went sideways. On your question. What was your?

Speaker 1: 23:40

original question no, no, no. It was about the power of the power of culture and how you hire for heart and not just skill. But you went through your four pillars, your four pillars of the four people that are on your team that help to create that culture. And it's good that you're able to put a picture, a concept, a model of where they fill in to help build those things that help you to hire for heart and not just skill. And the StrengthsFinders 2.0, because of the turnover going through management, and they help you to keep those things in check. Now, most people have that challenge with just one location. You have multiple locations.

Speaker 2: 24:37

So we did it at all of them. After doing it there and getting some people hired, we got a great team hired. Then we did it at all the restaurants and then the wolf got even crazier, the Wolf got even crazier and he started putting all that into AI generators and started piecing, you know, managers together based on their strengths and how they would fuse together, and we had pretty much everybody in the right sense. Some moves we could have made, but they were happy where they were. So we don't muck it all up, but you know it's just really being able to take another approach, another look at it. No-transcript. We're in a simpler time, a simpler thing. So, you know, I started spending a lot of time thinking about this. I felt like it was very important to have something that was short, that was simple, that really resonated with hospitality, really resonated with a direction that we're going at this moment in time. It could change, but right now it's like a direction in time and it reminded me of this thing my wife put in my reminders a long time ago, which is every day. It pops up and just says be nice. So we just went with be nice. And you know that's what we tell people Just be nice, be nice to each other. That's what we tell people Just be nice, be nice to each other.

Speaker 2: 25:49

And we broke down. The N is nurturing, the I is intuitive, the C is compassionate and the E is experiences, and experiences are both internal and external. Yeah, so that's our people coming in, but it's also our people who work with us, and I think what I'm constantly coaching the management team on is that nurturing and compassion can be taken advantage of real quick. There's a two-way street there, so you got to be careful being too nurturing or too compassionate with everything that's going on in the world. You know employees, I mean they'll take advantage where they can. It's just in nature, it's just how it works. So you got to be careful with that when you're like doing these things and make sure they understand. Like you know, for us as manager and leaders, you know we're nurturing people, we're teaching them, we're developing them, we're giving them the resources, tools they need. I mean we can be compassionate at certain times about certain things.

Speaker 2: 26:42

People go through things in their life all the time. That's where compassion kicks in, but don't take it, don't let people take advantage of that. And that's where compassion kicks in, but don't let people take advantage of that. And that's where we really are right now is just keep saying it. So if you do something nice, I'm going to be like nice, and if you're doing something that's not nice, I'm going to tell you to be nice. Yeah, be nice. And that really redirects everybody's focus. So we have that everywhere and we'll probably even take it to another level with just the management team and have another one which is just care, and then we'll break that one down.

Speaker 2: 27:12

It was a couple it's still in the design phase, but there's some in there in that care piece, which is accountability really is in the A. And then you just got to be relentless. I mean, that's the R. You got to be relentless in our business. You can't stop. You just can't stop. You know you just can't stop. You just got to keep grinding, keep going, keep pushing and keep pushing people forward and that's what they want.

Speaker 2: 27:39

Ultimately, now we can go. Culture is different for everybody too. Like I'm learning, like you're in a day and age now in the world where everybody has their thing and you don't know what that thing is unless you find out what the thing is. Like I was having this whole like I'm trying to figure it out. This was probably four years ago, maybe five years ago. I'm trying to figure out, like why are we having these issues? Like what is this? Why is that?

Speaker 2: 28:05

And then I was having a conversation with one of our associates and she said that she just doesn't polish glassware. Like she just won't do it, I'm not doing it. And I'm like, oh okay, that's weird. Uh, you're a bartender. Um, part of it, I mean, it's part of the job. Why won't you do it? She's like I just don't like doing, I'm just not gonna do it. I always make somebody else do it, and I think that's when it hit me.

Speaker 2: 28:24

I was what is that thing?

Speaker 2: 28:26

You know that Jason's not going to do. What are you not going to do, jason? I mean, what is that thing? I got to find out what that thing is and I got to either develop that into you or I got to figure out a way to work with that or like whatever it is, but it is a different thing for every every individual person and that's a lot to keep up with.

Speaker 2: 28:42

I can barely can remember what people's favorite candy bars are. Sometimes, you know like I forget my own parents' birthdays some days. I mean like I'm the worst at that remembering stuff. You know I'm a go go, go visionary, creative guy. You know like I just kind of kind of live out in the cloud sometimes.

Speaker 2: 28:57

But I think figuring those things out and just understanding them and being in and finding some compassion in there, um, that can really. That can really help them feel like they're at the place they want to be. And sometimes, you know, people jump jobs for whatever reasons. We just want to be an employer choice. We want to make sure you're coming into a warm environment where everyone's nurturing, they're happy and they're taking care of you and that you're able to come earn a living in an environment that you want to be in and take care of our guests that are coming in to help support the whole thing. That's how it becomes sustainable. Without that, without having that service mindset first and having that really hospitality forward mindset. The people coming in to spend the money will quit coming in and spend money and the whole thing will not be sustainable.

Speaker 1: 29:45

I will tell you what my listeners are probably turned on top of their head right now because they have probably never heard a CFO be as people and culture focused as you are. So although you have that title, there is a lot of layers or personalities under Chef Adam's hat there, so people should be cautious. Now we can tell you're not just crunching numbers, you are teaching people how to lead. But let's get technical, though. What's one metric? Restaurant managers probably overlook that they should not be overlooking when it comes down to running a successful business as a restaurant manager.

Speaker 2: 30:34

That's a tough one. I mean, you're looking for a financial metric, you're saying.

Speaker 2: 30:38

I mean right now you know, they tend to know they're two biggest, it's labor and cost of goods. They tend to know those the most. I think the one that they fail to really dial in, which is one that I was really good at and I shouldn't have been as a chef, I shouldn't have been really good at it it was linen. I mean, if you're using any napkins, bar towels, bar rags, aprons, any of that stuff, that line can really creep on you. I mean it can be two percent or it could get up to five percent, and really the ones that are really good at that, um, really can dial in and drop a point, even a point and a half in some cases, if you really are focused on it, if you really say like, look, the lending companies aren't perfect.

Speaker 2: 31:23

I joke with them all the time. I take pictures texted to the, the district manager, all the time when I'm in larkins, like you know, there I could get perfectly pressed linens but it's like three times the cost of a regular linen right. So one of them I want them packed right and that seems to where they're messing up. They're like folding it the wrong way and then refolding it the other way, right off the ironer and and then it's got like these double seams and it just looks stupid. I always send them the picture.

Speaker 2: 31:46

I'm like dude, help me out here, like you know, and they may issue me a credit here or there, but a lot of times it's I say linen, but usually it is also the credit chasing and really getting credit for a product. That is not right, that's wrong, that came in bad. You know, that's a game in itself and you really got to be focused on that kind of stuff to really be able to figure that, figure that stuff out and find those, find those deals. But I've been spending most of my time here lately. Really like to. The first part of this is really going in and having conversations with every manager. That's on duty. If I just walk in, I'm gonna start having a conversation about something, something I see or something that I think could help them, or something that was relevant to what was happening at the moment. It could have been something that was in their nightly report from the night before. You know, hey, this was a problem, this happened. And then I can say, hey, tell me about what happened and explain what happened exactly, and then have an opportunity to really talk through that and find and teach some other ways to handle that situation. That's ultimately, where we're going to have the best opportunity to make the most money and reduce our expenses. It's upfront, it's giving them the knowledge base.

Speaker 2: 32:55

The P&L will look at it and it can be daunting. I mean you can look at it and be oh my God, I don't even know what I'm looking at here. What is all this stuff? And I remember looking at some P&Ls first early on in my career. And I remember looking at some P&Ls early on in my career and I said what is this? And I was lucky to have a general manager walk me through it. I mean he sat with me, scheduled the time sat with me, went line by line, explained to me how it worked, and I just did that this year on our budgets, with our budgets. Normally I would write a budget and this is what we need to hit this year. I let the GMs just do their best shot. I said here's a blank one, figure it out, let me know if you need any help. And of course they called the Wolf and the captain and they asked them 20 million questions. It was more a project for them than it was for the GMs. But when they came, they came with their budgets and I said, all right, let's pull it up, let's look at it. And I had a big giant screen. Pull them up. I got theirs on one side, I got Blank one on the other side, and then I've got, like the years past QuickBooks open and I'm just like, all right, we're going to bounce around, let's just see what it looks like. And then we would just have a conversation I remember this with Richard Kessler.

Speaker 2: 33:54

He owns Kessler Hotels and I had opened the Grand Bohemian in Asheville and he was with who was that? Scott Schreiber was with him at a time as president, and then we just opened hotel. I think we opened in april, so may first of june. He comes back for a visit and at that point we were I mean, we were killing it as a team. Restaurant was vibrant, it was packed, it was full, it was a lot of volume, a lot of stuff going on.

Speaker 2: 34:18

I remember him, they wanted to meet with me, so it was, you know, the president of the company, the owner of the company of me, and I was puckered up man. I was like, oh God, what is this about? You know, like did I do something wrong? You know kind of stuff goes through your mind at that time. We just sit at a table in the restaurant and he pulls out a menu and he's looking at it.

Speaker 2: 34:38

He went menu item by menu item he said he said you know how's this calamari sell? I? He said you know how's this calamari sell? I said it sells like number one seller every night and the number one seller hands down. He said what's your food cost on it? I said about 30, 28, 30, somewhere around there.

Speaker 2: 34:53

And he says think you can get another dollar for it. I said oh, yeah. So he marked it off and marked it up a dollar. I mean we did this exercise down the whole menu and I was able to tell him all the food costs. I knew all the costs of goods. I mean it was like a test on how well I was doing. But can you get another dollar? I said, yeah, I think you can get another $3 actually. And so he marked it off, mark it up $3. So we kind of did that exercise. But again, that's something I learned I took away is like a really cool experience for me. And so I did this I've done this a couple of times with some other people in the restaurants and I've done it with the budget and I was like hey, do you?

Speaker 2: 35:28

Yeah, really you need, you know you need 10% of this line item. Can you get it to eight? Can you cut two points here? This will be this number. This is what has trended the last three years. You know like this is what has actually been. So let's you know. Let's put it here. Let's put some more there. Know, you need more money to take care of your staff. Don't be tight there. You want to spend money taking care of your people. So that budget line. I always tell them either you spend it or I'll spend it somewhere else. But you're not getting it. It's not going to help your bonus. Exactly, you spend it or I'll take it. You see, it's one of the two. All right, use it or lose it period.

Speaker 2: 36:03

Yes, Consider this my money I'm giving you to go spend to take care of your people and our people, and if you don't, then I'm just going to take it back. It's not going to make you more money, I promise. That's not how this is going to work. And so they've been really good about doing that. It's just a matter of again teaching them when to do it, when it makes those impacts, when it has the most impact and you know this is a funny one that just kind of came to mind as I was talking about that.

Speaker 2: 36:34

My 2025 goal is to not use the word busy, like I'm just not going to use it. You know my life is already, in most people's case, busy, but in my world, it's just how my life is. There's a lot going on. I've got a lot of responsibilities. I'm raising two children still my daughter's 20, my son's 14. I'm trying to live that life with them too. I've got a wife trying to take care of that travel, see things, do things and I've got five corporations to run and a big catering outfit to stay on top of. So my life, in most people's cases, is considered busy and my life is considered normal for me. So it's identifying. When you talk about things at a restaurant level with management and they say you know, today was busy, okay, well, that doesn't tell me anything because your definition of busy at Grillmarks on Main Street, which is the highest revenue generating grill marks restaurant we have, versus busy in columbia, which is second to them, but not quite the limit, about half of that. So when you start looking at that you're like, well, there's two different words, there's two different meanings for that word right here alone in this report that I'm reading today. Busy has to be a number or it has to be a headcount. It has to be something that you can quantify and you can't just use it as a reason for things and so like, oh, today was busy, well, that doesn't tell me anything.

Speaker 2: 37:59

If I go back two years from now I'm trying to figure out why we did $10, know $10,000 on a Saturday and I got a manager says it was busy. Well, well, nowadays $15,000 is $18,000, is kind of the norm, that's a normal day. You know, $25,000 a day would be considered an astronomical day. But three years from now we hope the $25,000 becomes the norm and so you keep you kind of keep climbing that ladder on what is busy to you and just quit using the word busy.

Speaker 2: 38:26

Like, was it busy tonight? No, no, it wasn't. Actually it was. Uh, you know, we did about $5,000 for dinner. That was not good. We need more than that. That's, that's extra slow in my, in my, definition. So, uh, it's just something I think that helps when you're talking about what we do. You've heard it, you've been in the business, you know what I'm talking about. Like, if you say you know it was busy, well, what's that mean? You and I two different busy? I mean busy for me was what 450 people sat all in one time in downtown Charlotte and I'm cooking 50 bass at one time, you know, 50 salmon at one time, and all the sides and all the all the stuff. Now that's busy. And uh, that's what busy feels like to me. If I had to just use one singular word, but I just quantified it by saying 50 sea bass, 50 salmon, all the sides that go with it, that's a number that you can relate to, and I can relate to trying to cook 50 pieces of fish at one time, perfectly.

Speaker 1: 39:23

Well, I got to say my wife took a look at your menu and the sea bass, she has been biting at the chomps. To go at that table, to sit at that table, to be invited by the owner, by the executives, and to have a seat and to be at that table, that's a huge accomplishment in any chef's eyes at any point of their career, in any chef's eyes at any point of their career. And there are a few questions, because this is the leadership table that gets us to that point of sharing your experience with your first times sitting at those tables. These two questions that I'm gonna ask you next are some of our staples that we ask to every single guest. So if you could sit at a leadership table with three other leaders, whether alive or from history, who would you choose and why?

Speaker 2: 40:41

Oh man, you should prepare me for these Three other leaders. Three, you need three of them, right? Three they could be alive.

Speaker 1: 40:55

They could be from history, they could be from way back in the day. Just three leaders that you could have a seat at and have a conversation at a table, at a table. Who would you choose, and why?

Speaker 2: 41:10

I think the first one that comes to mind would definitely be john maxwell, because I listen to his minute with maxwell podcast pretty often and there's a lot of good stuff that comes out of that and I cooked for him actually once at candy kitchen, wow, and I was like like starstruck to go out and talk to him. You know, um, he's a, he's a, he's a great guy, um. Another one that comes to mind is Nito Cubain, which is the um. He's the president of high point university and his book, extraordinary transformation. I'm only like two chapters in right now, but there was a, there was a chapter. Two was um aim for extraordinary act with urgency and that I read that chapter at the exact moment I needed to read it. So it'd be pretty cool to talk to him more about that book and about that process, because I feel like we're kind of in that process, where we're, you know, we're in this extraordinary transformation phase as a restaurant Me personally, but also as a restaurant group with new ownership and new leadership and new direction and new focus.

Speaker 2: 42:10

And I think you know I need to get through that book, but I tend to pick up other books along the way, so that's part of the problem. And then I don't know. I mean, I think there's a lot to be said. I was trying to think I think leadership through battle is something that is very interesting to me. I just think that there's somewhere. At one point I was going to be in the Air Force, I wanted to be in the military something, I think somebody in that realm, I just don't know who I could single that out to be. You know like you know like a general probably come out of the mind.

Speaker 2: 42:48

General pack probably jump off the plate at you. You know I'd be curious on some of that. I mean, I've always been fascinated with Ronald Reagan and just some of the stuff that he was doing. I think military leaders are really, you know, really sharp cookies and really poised and really calm under pressure.

Speaker 1: 43:09

So anyone in that realm would be fantastic to speak to. Ok, last final question at the leadership table, we believe in conversations that inspire, lead and elevate. What's one conversation and I know you've had many, I know you've had many, but what's one conversation in your career that profoundly shaped how you lead today? Again, I know there's many conversations you've had to help shift sands of how you do what you do, but what's one that you can remember that stands out the most?

Speaker 2: 43:49

That I had about my leadership. You mean, is that what you're saying?

Speaker 1: 43:53

That you had with a leader. It was a manager, a owner, a director, an executive, someone with a chef, someone within your sphere with a chef, someone within your sphere that there's one conversation they had with you that shaped how you lead others today.

Speaker 2: 44:12

Wow, that's a good one right there Trying to think, you know, my time at the Bohemian, when I was there, like that was really one of the strongest teams I probably ever worked with in terms of all around. Like every department was a strong leader, and it really is because we had a strong leader at the top. John Luckett was our general manager and I spent, I mean, countless hours in his office talking to him about different things. You know I'd be, you know I'm a chef, so there'd be a lot of energy coming off of me. It'd be like you know, like everybody's stupid, you know like everybody's stupid, you know, or like something like that. I just be frustrated with something you know and that's like, but you could always vomit that in his office. He was fine, he knew how to take it. You know he wasn't taking, he knew what I was doing, but he was always good with advice. I mean, it was usually simple, short, sweet and you know, one in particular was, you know, like I was. I was. So that was my first executive chef job. By the way, I was a sous chef or chef de cuisine for 10 years before that. I was the chef's right hand and I was always, you know, doing the load right. I was doing all the work.

Speaker 2: 45:13

And so when I had my first executive chef job, like I was like super focused. I didn't want to fail. So I was going in at like six in the morning make sure that we're all set for breakfast, and then I was prepping all the food from the line, I was setting the line up and then, you know, I'd go into lunch, I work lunch and I work dinner and I was leaving at like nine or ten o'clock at night and going home, you know, and I think after doing that for about three weeks, I was like so frustrated because the cooks were coming in at night and they're just like walking around making espresso shots for themselves, getting coffee. You know I'm like getting. So I've been here all morning working my butt off. You know, I'm like so mad about it. I go in there, I'm like venting about it, and he just broke it down and he's like you're doing all the work for them. You know that's why you're so frustrated. You're doing everything for them. So they're coming in and my perception I went from, you know, all about me, all about wanting to get it right, very focused on that part of it and I wasn't utilizing my team in a way that they could work, basically do this work for me, so through coaching, mentoring and developing them.

Speaker 2: 46:21

So it really switched the way I was looking at that whole thing at that moment in time and I really think it's what just catapulted everything. I mean from there it was, like you know, I had production lists, I had production schedules, I had assigned to people, I was delegating out the jobs, the prep that needed to be done per station, per person, kept it balanced, kept it within a timeframe that I could expect them to get it done, and that really, I think that was really the moment that it really changed the way I was looking at my leadership role. I've never really been at the, at the top position. I was always the worker guy right and I only knew to do what chef told me. Or make it special on the fly, and you know, hey, we got this fish, why don't you make it special? And I put something together together in about 30 minutes. You know, just get it done, bang it out. But that was really the transforming moment.

Speaker 2: 47:08

I feel like, if I go back in time and I look, I had a lot of other great inspirational leaders. I mean Dennis Quaintus at Quaintus Weaver Hotels. I mean he is like a ball of energy. He had Lucky University and just taught you a lot about it. Took all the leadership stuff in the world, all the great leadership books, and kind of put it together into one big training thing. So it's when you join as a manager, you went through lucky, you, lucky, lucky university and you learned all this stuff. But, like for me, there was a lot of it already in there. So having the knowledge that, oh, this is how, oh well, that makes sense, I connected the dots really quickly. So really that also really guided me into the next role and that was before I went to the Bohemians. So I think that transformation process in that timeframe you got to think was like a seven year transformation, yeah, which seems like a lot of time, but it really isn't. It's like seven years.

Speaker 1: 48:06

I was able to really catapult through my chef career, just through those, really through those two people. I love that. I love that. Chef Adam, you've been quite amazing.

Speaker 2: 48:21

But before we close out, though, where can listeners connect with you or learn more about the Larkin's family of restaurants? Well, we've got all the websites. So Larkin'sbl, uh, limoncello, gbl, uh, grill marks official. Those were all of our main restaurant web pages. I'm pretty easy to find. I'm, I'm at chef a hayes on the instagram and the facebook. Uh, so I don't post a lot, but, uh, when I do, it's something decent, it's something of quality. Well, it's me horsing around with my children. The most recent one was Father's Day on the lake. They snapped a picture of me. I had my sunglasses on, and then I had my readers underneath my sunglasses. So they snapped a picture of me. So I turned it black and white and made it my profile picture and said, yeah, still getting work done, but I'm on a bus, love it Still working, still Still getting work done, but I'm on a

Speaker 2: 49:07

bus, love it, still working, still answering emails, doing what's needed, that kind of stuff. But that's probably the best place. Or come to Greenville and have a staycation. Stay, have a vacation. If you're in Greenville, have a staycation and come downtown and hit all of our restaurants. We're all in walking distance from each other and love to have you in, love to see you in the restaurants. I mean, that's what we do. We're just serving people.

Speaker 2: 49:27

20 years we're celebrating this year at Larkin's Congratulations which is super rare for restaurants in general and we're having a big 20-year anniversary party on July 31st and we have tickets available on that through Open Table.

Speaker 2: 49:44

So it's going to be some throwbacks from 2005, some throwback 2005 dishes and basically we have some time slot seatings where you can do, you know, basically like a four-course with auction tasting menu, and then we go down to our event venue, which is just down the street called the L, and we're going to have a big dessert display and we're going to have a randomonium playing music and a big bar set up down there. So it'll be a little party down there and then you can do dinner and the party, or you can just do the party or you can just do dinner Like you've got plenty of options. You know that's how we roll, but just you can see that through Open Table we do all our reservations for Larkin's the Roping Table, so find us there. It'll give you more descriptions, more details than I'm probably giving you now, but all I can tell you is it's going to be a good time and we're going to be celebrating 20 years.

Speaker 1: 50:30

Well, look, I'm going to put all of those and all of that information into the show notes, but I can guarantee my wife and I will be down there in order to partake in that event. So thank you so much, and thank you for pulling up a seat and sharing your journey with us, your insight into leadership, training, culture. I mean, it is just so amazing, so heartwarming, not to say coming from a CFO, just because we have this mental picture of data driven leadership, but you show that your culture is a lot more than numbers, and that's exactly the kind of conversation we aim for here at the leadership table To our listeners. If this episode resonated with you, please subscribe, leave a review and share it with a fellow leader. You can find more leadership tools at Jason E Brooks dot com. Until next time, keep leading with impact and remember manage, lead, coach, repeat. Thank you, adam, have an awesome day.

Speaker 2: 51:47

You too, jason. Thank you, adam. Have an awesome day. You too, jason, thank you.