How to put together an excellent funeral? | David Cook, Sandy Grant and Gary Coleman

Not every funeral is great.  Sometimes they go too long, sometimes the gospel is not clear, sometimes the content overlaps. 

How do you create a funeral service that God would be pleased with, connects well with people, honours the deceased and serves the bereaved?

David Cook is former Principal of Sydney Missionary and Bible College,
Sandy Grant is dean of St Andrew’s Cathedral Sydney,
and Gary Coleman is former chaplain to the Motor Racing Industry. 

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Transcript

Why Some Funerals Fall Flat

The Pastor’s First Steps In Grief

SPEAKER_03 1:15

How to put together an excellent funeral. The standard line after the funeral service is that was a lovely service. Thank you. But not every funeral is great. I went to a funeral, the man who died was Christian. The church was full, the singing was powerful. I think the main problem was length. It went for two hours. The many people who gave eulogies each went too long, they overlapped significantly in content, and the people who gave the eulogies were less Christian than the man who died was, and very little focus on the heart of his Christian faith. And by the time the preacher got up to speak, well he didn't have a chance of holding the attention of the now restless group. Today we are talking about how to put together an excellent funeral. What is an excellent funeral? A funeral that God would be pleased with. It is the Pastor's Heart. It's Dominic Steele and our guests are Sandy Grant, Dean of St. Andrew's Cathedral, David Cook, former principal of Sydney Missionary and Bible College, and Gary Coleman, Gary, former pastor, former motor racing chaplain, and lots of funerals in the motor racing fraternity, particularly. Let us start with the pastor's heart. And David, you get the phone call. Could you do the funeral or somebody has died? And what goes on in your pastor's heart?

SPEAKER_02 2:35

Uh, first of all, prayer. Uh think about the circumstances of the death, the age of the person who has died, make contact as soon as possible, face to face with the family, because they are going through a ver uh often a very strange experience which they've never had before. Uh, you have had that experience before. You want to go into the situation and be human without being too professional, and you want to minister to them and just walk them through their grief and preparation for the funeral itself. So I think you've got to be prayerful about that. You've got to be prayerful about every contact you have. You're about to preach at the funeral service to people who may never hear another Christian sermon. So uh this has got to be the focus of your preparation uh for the coming days.

SPEAKER_03 3:26

Walking a family through grief, Sandy.

SPEAKER_04 3:29

Sure. Uh Dominic, whether or not the um the loved one who's died was a Christian or not, or you might not know. Uh I'm always certain that there'll be a Christian somewhere in the congregation that day. And I'm wanting them to have the encouragement of the gospel being out there helpfully, clearly. I think what David said is absolutely right. You've got to see the family in person, uh, if at all possible. Very rarely people are flying in and you've got to do it on the phone, and that's never as good. Uh, but I I want people to think if I was going to go to church, that's the kind of church I'd like to go to. That what they said made some kind of sense and help me in this situation.

SPEAKER_03 4:14

Gary, a lot of the funerals you do are funerals for non-Christians.

SPEAKER_00 4:19

That's true. Within the motor racing community, uh, there are a few that have been believers, but mostly are non-Christian funerals. And my first reaction when I hear about it is I've probably talked been in a relationship with this person for a number of years. Uh whether it's a regular person on a team or one of the old people who used to be involved in motorsport and the older community.

SPEAKER_03 4:44

Um let let us just jump straight to the sermon. David, what do you think? Um what's the goal? How do you do it? Sermon.

SPEAKER_02 4:52

Oh, wait that that that that that really is determined by the type of funeral that's going to be. Uh if it's a teenager and or if it's a um it'll be a shorter sermon if it's a teenager, because there's so much grief. Yeah. You don't want to be imposing on that. Uh I would always take a text of scripture and I talk about the attractiveness of Jesus. We have an answer to death. And I think that I always I almost look upon it as a pre-evangelistic occasion, though I do preach the gospel. That's what we've got. I want to give people an opportunity to engage with the truth of the gospel. John 11, I am the resurrection and the life. And I want them to understand that, but I want them also to know where they can get more information as a result of that. The other thing I think, just on what Sandy said, we recently had a funeral at our church, as someone who wasn't terribly well known, but he was an occasional uh uh attender at church. And the pastor said, There's going to be lots of people here, lots of family. Please, please bring a plate. And it was wonderful how the church responded to that by providing food. Um, and and this was a welcoming place. Yeah. And I think just showing the attractiveness of Jesus and his people, it's it's vitally important. I guess my major concern is that most pastors give maximum attention to their Sunday sermon, which is good, and they might treat this the funeral sermon as secondary. But this is the only sermon a lot of people will ever hear. And so I think spend time in preparing this sermon.

SPEAKER_03 6:26

Sandy Graham, still on the sermon, uh, because you've done a lot of them. What are your thoughts there?

SPEAKER_04 6:31

Well, for me, the sermon, uh, its effectiveness is also built on what I'll have done before. I prepare a eulogy, which means I spent time trying to understand the person, even if I don't deliver the eulogy. But then that will give me material that will connect into what I want to say from the text of scripture I select. Uh I agree, uh, I'm not such a great storyteller as some of the preachers here. Uh, but for example, I married into a farming family, and so the 23rd Psalm or John 10, Jesus the Good Shepherd. If I get the choice, they're often good places to go. Um, someone said when I was a young minister, funerals and weddings are a good time to make a little bit of ground with a lot of people. So I'm not trying to explain the mechanics of the atonement. I'm often trying to give the personal uh assurance. Uh first funeral I took was 25. I was just in a suit, not a dog collar, because it wasn't a religious area. And the young undertaker's assistant said to me, Uh, what are you doing a job like this for? That's for old people. And I said, mate, because of the resurrection of Jesus, I know where I'm going when I end up in one of those boxes. Um, and I didn't have to go into the evidences, I didn't have to do the intellectual work. It's just the testimony that Jesus is alive, he can take care of what we're facing today. What David said about follow-ups, important too, and I just want to put a plug in um Simon Manchester's little book at a time like this, less than 20 pages, I think, from a third meeting. I give it to every next of kin, and I say, you may not feel like reading anything right now, but in a couple of weeks when everyone else has gone back to work and kind of forgotten about it and you're left with your thoughts, this would be a good book to pick up and read.

SPEAKER_02 8:21

David And also, uh it's good to just note the anniversary when the death occurred, put it in your diary for next year and make a contact. I know today's a special day, yeah. Remind you. Uh the other thing that that struck that struck me, uh, in my student days, I was at Randwick Presbyterian Church and we had a lot of cremations at Eastern Suburbs Crematorium. So I had lots of experience in that, where they'd give you about 15 minutes. Uh, but uh nothing prepared me for weavar, a country funeral. So that the first funeral I had there was scheduled to begin at 10 a.m. But we didn't inter the body until 8 p.m. that night for various reasons. Well I talked about a long funeral before, but for various reasons. But it was amazing to me the importance of a funeral in a country town. The hearse would always go down the main street on the way to the cemetery. Every shop would close its door out of respect for the family. Uh our church was a large building with a large um uh outside pathway and speakers outside. And I was like, what do they have the speakers for? Because so many people come to a a a church building in the country, but they don't come inside. For some reason, they won't come inside. So you've got to have your speakers outside too. The other thing to note, I think the late Tony Morfitt used to stress this: the best family gatherings are the wake after the funeral, where everybody's seeking to make up for the loss of the loved one. And people have just come into contact with a message about eternity and their own death, like going to a wedding reminds you of your own vows. Going to a funeral reminds you of your own death to come. And people are very open at that point to to talk to you. I think when a minister's invited to a wedding reception, often they don't really want you to come. But when you're invited to the wake, they want you to be there. And uh, I think you you you must be there and and be ready with a a pack of tracts or whatever to do because people are very open to talk about what you've said, hopefully.

Eulogy And Sermon Placement Choices

SPEAKER_03 10:25

Um, Sandy, as you've talked to the I mean you talked about preparing the eulogy and preparing the sermon. Uh I I want to put a thesis to you and ask you to respond. Um I have found that as I've prepared the funeral sermon for a Christian, often I will weave in and out uh uh with examples from the person's life. Whereas when I've prepared the funeral service for a non-Christian, I've separated the eulogy at the beginning and then not spoken into their life uh in this in the exposition sermon part. Do you want to just comment on that?

Keeping Eulogies Short And Honest

SPEAKER_04 11:38

I think that it's always good to have the eulogy separated from the sermon, uh most obviously perhaps by the Bible reading. So if I'm doing the lot, some families don't have articulate. Even if there are other eulogies, I'd still separate them from the sermon. Right. Uh and uh I still think that sometimes if you've done your preparation well, there will just be little connection points. It might just simply be in the acknowledgement of life's not always a bed of roses, as we just heard. Uh or um Yeah, there's any number of touch points where you're not delivering just a straight exposition that somehow is completely detached. But I'm certainly not making pronouncements about the person's status if I have no particular evidence about what they believed, or in the absence of evidence that they were a believer. I'm talking in general about how people respond to Jesus. I'm not trying to make promises that I'm in no position to make, not being the judge of all things.

SPEAKER_03 12:44

What about the negotiating about eulogies and length of eulogies and content of eulogies? Um wisdom there. Gary?

SPEAKER_00 12:55

Well, oftentimes I'll say to people, I don't want five five pages closely typed, which I had it a couple of times, but I I get to oversee who's going to give it and how long they've got for it and how many. And uh 'cause one of the difficulties is uh if it's close friends or business friends, they want to give their uh their emotional reaction to what has happened, which is not what we want really, but to talk about. But that's times sometimes the only time they get that out of them when they start to give that in an extended. But I normally put a time limit on as to how many people there, and I cough in the background, and sometimes I've got up and tugged the back of the person's coat. Really? Knowing that if it goes over time, they've got to pay double for the uh chapel and for the crematorium.

SPEAKER_03 13:46

Right, okay, yeah. So if it's outside of church, yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that kind of the ones I've done have been here, so there's there's no no paying double.

SPEAKER_00 13:53

But one of the things I was wanting to say when I start my sermon there, I'll point to the casket and I'll say, and so and so is not here. And people will get a bit stirred. I said, This is the house they've lived in for sixty-seven years or seventy-five years, this is the body they lived in. They have now gone to give an account to God. And I say, and we need to do the same thing. Be prepared to go and give an account to God. That's all I'll say about that person there. But I'll move from there to say, let me tell you the reality is that people who have a belief in Jesus Christ are now in heaven with him, and that's the great promise we can leave with you for you to think about afterwards, and I will stick around for two and a half hours if you want to talk about it.

SPEAKER_03 14:42

David, when you've talked to people about um eulogies, what's the guidance you've given?

SPEAKER_02 14:46

Uh uh could I just say something else that struck me? I'd you probably heard the story of Simon Manchester when he came to North Sydney, he was the chaplain to the North Sydney Bears. And when the coaching the football team, rugby league team, uh when the coach introduced him to all the players as their new chaplain, uh, the players said, one of the players said, Well, what can you do for us? And Simon said, Uh, well, they say I run a good funeral. And I I I I I think if you look at the later census, I I go to a Presbyterian church, uh, the Presbyterians are doing really well in the 85-year-plus age group. So you think, now, uh, Presbyterian ministers, I'd urge you, uh, do a good funeral service. A couple of weeks ago, I was talking to a boat from Victoria. How'd you get converted? Well, he said, I live in regional Victoria. I'd go around to all the funeral services, and this one church ran a really good funeral service. So I I decide to keep going back there. And eventually I got converted. So I think we need to be expert in running really good funeral services. And um, and I uh so and that takes work and preparation. So I urge people to to work at it and and and preparate. But you've got to find something. I remember going out of the piliga scrub one time and to meet a family, and I said, Well, tell me about you know the loved one who'd passed away. And it was quite clear that he wasn't a loved one.

SPEAKER_03 16:12

But you've got to find something to say. That's one of the things that I found. Somebody told me once, um, uh if in that pastoral conversation beforehand, if you don't know the person, I said, Can you just tell me, is there something else that everyone else who's there is gonna know about this guy that I'm not gonna know? And the bloke said, Well, you probably should know my brother was a thief and a liar. You know, I thought, right, actually, that's a really helpful piece of internet just um prep discussing the eulogies, sure.

SPEAKER_04 16:44

Sure. Um at the cathedral, that's a really big issue, uh, but it's been a big issue all along. And not only that, also the video photographic testimonials, our rule for that is one song radio length song. So three minutes. Three, four minutes. Yeah. Uh with the eulogies, I explained to the family every page of notes takes you five minutes to deliver at least. So if you get three eulogists and they each have two pages of notes, you've got 30 minutes gone right there, and people are starting to get restless. And that's why we politely say to you, we want you to write it out, and we've got to limit the number of speakers and the number of pages. At the cathedral we have a 1200-word limit, and we know that actually they'll probably end up even up to 20 minutes. But if we can keep it somewhere below that. So you're saying 1200. 1200 is 12 minutes, yeah. But in reality, they add lib a bit or slow down in the emotion. Uh that's kind of helping us not get to the two-hour territory.

SPEAKER_02 17:49

Yeah. Yeah. Uh the it's the value of preparing for your own service as well. That um my wife and I have got five kids, so I've allocated all the duties for the funeral, and I've got asked one of them to give the eulogy. And so you you're limiting the number of eulogies to just one.

unknown 18:08

Yeah.

Tears, Authenticity, And Visiting The Dying

SPEAKER_00 18:10

Yes, it's a way of engaging the audience, and normally I say to people, please write out for me. I had one race, old race driver, wrote out about his mother, and she was the centre of all social activity for 30, 40 years. And he gave to me to read, and I said, Uh, Bob, why don't you come and stand next to me while I read this? And as I started reading, he said, Let me make a comment there. And it went, let me say something else. The whole audience were involved because they knew what he was saying, and he wanted to be part of that, which gave me a greater platform then for being more and of course the problem is when I get to do that, I'm a hard time emotionally getting through that sort of thing. And that's often I'll be in tears at some point during the service. And that's when people were walking out and said, You meant that, didn't you? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 18:59

That was what you said you you were in tears during the service. When I was talking to you, David, and ringing you up saying you should get Gary because he there's an authenticity to the way that do you want to just talk about what you've admired about Gary's funerals?

SPEAKER_02 19:14

Well, I I first Gary and I are on a board together, and uh sometimes we go mutual to board members' funerals. And I notice that Gary generally leads, and I've never been to one where he's actually got through without tears. But often in the board meeting, Gary's got tears as well, giving his reports. And I I think it's human. I mean, uh that that's right. Sometimes if I'm conducting the funeral for a close friend, um, you know, I have to go away because you can't get up to be a blubbering mass. You mess. You've got to you've got to uh run the funeral. And um, and I think it's important that you get yourself ready, but don't be ashamed of your own tears, because death is a dreadful thing. It's a dreadful incursion into the purposes of God. If I just tell one more story. Uh one time I was with Sir Marcus Lone, and he he I I said to him Former Archbishop, yeah. Former Archbishop of Sydney, what do you do these days, Sir Marcus? And he said, I I conduct and speak at the uh funerals of my friends mostly these days. And uh he said, it all starts, I always go by the bed, and I if they're dying, and I say, I always ask them, Do you have peace with God? Never assume that they are at peace with that God is at peace with them. And uh and I thought that's a good thing too, to make sure when you're visiting a a dying person, to make sure that they have assurance that uh Jesus will walk them through the valley of the shadow and bring them to the Father.

SPEAKER_04 20:44

Sandy, one of the best things if you are called to visit someone who's dying, especially someone who's not been a churchgoer, is pick a good passage to read to them, short, because when they come back to you for the funeral, the family won't have a clue what Bible reading they want. And you can say, Well, the last thing I read to your loved one was, let's have that.

SPEAKER_01 21:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 21:04

And it gives you the actual personal connection. You were there with them and you prayed with their loved one, even if you never knew them for the other 60, 70 years beforehand, you were there and that's your connection. And you can say, and these are the things that I said.

SPEAKER_02 21:20

Yeah. I rem uh uh I on I in that conversation, Sir Marcus said he'd visited Howard Guinness, who was the rector of St. Michael's Fort Clues and did much to establish the uh work of the Evangelical Union at the University of Sydney. And he said to Howard Guinness, Do Howard, do you have peace with God? And Howard, who had a throat problem, shook his head, no. And Marcus leant forward and Howard gasped, joy, unspeakable and full of glory. Isn't that just lovely? Yeah, yeah. Not peace, joy.

Working Well With Funeral Directors

SPEAKER_00 21:57

Yeah, it's been a privilege to visit with a number of elderly people whom I've known through the years who are dying. And one of the questions I ask, if you had any religious background. And uh if they say Catholic, I say wonderful. You know the basics. Jesus died for our sins, we need his forgiveness, we need that confidence of going to heaven, and heaven's a reality. And they said, I said, uh, let's start there and confirm that. Do you believe that Jesus is the Son of God? Do you believe he died to save us from our sins? Do you believe we need to have that faith to go to heaven? And most times they're nodding their heads. And if they've come from a religious background, even in childhood, they know that. And then to confirm that, and uh over the last couple of years to lead uh a a a dozen or so people to Christ a day or two before they die.

SPEAKER_03 22:48

David, um, when you mentioned Howard Guinness a moment ago, uh, I was reminded of uh Ian Powell telling me that he did a hospital visit in a similar situation, and he leant over to the guy, and uh the guy he said, Ian, I'm so excited. That's right. I'm looking forward to heaven. Yeah, that's right. Sandy, funeral directors. Um we've talked negotiating families with eulogies. What are some of the complexities these days negotiating with funeral directors?

Church, Crematorium, Or Memorial Service

SPEAKER_04 23:19

Look, almost all the funeral directors I've worked with over 30 years, very professional, very sensitive. Uh, and they're just they're trying to be helpful to the family and they're also trying to organize their their business. But it is becoming more and more uh the trend that uh The funeral directors will ring up and say, We've got a funeral booked for Tuesday at ten and we want a minister. And they kind of presume I think we sit around six days a week doing nothing and busy on Sundays. And there's just no playgroup on Tuesday. Far from the reality of the busy church life that pastors always led. Um, and certainly in modern uh cities and so on. And so we've got to be able to say to them, I'm sorry, if the family said they want a minister, you need to talk with the minister first about a mutually suitable time and don't just bring us up. So I I am once I start to get knowing funeral directors in a place, I say, listen, remember, we are busy people, our diaries are full. Um, we can't just always be available, and the church isn't just always available. It's it's busy several days, many days of the week. You need to say to the family, if you want a minister, we've we've got to check in with him about when he's available as well as when you're available. And that's that's hard. Much better to have that conversation with the funeral director than with the family who have you know already been kind of stitched up for the time the funeral director finds convenient. Talk to the funeral directors, be proactive and courteous, of course.

SPEAKER_03 24:54

I prefer doing funerals in our church to doing them at the crematorium. What's your take on that?

SPEAKER_04 25:02

Well, I I'm used to all things, uh church, then the crematorium or the graveside. I think that if the P family wants that that wake time, that afternoon tea time afterwards, it's really important to think about not losing them along the way. If you have the church service, then go off to the crematorium, could be half an hour plus the service time and a half an hour back. The people who don't go to the crematorium won't then come back to afternoon tea. So you've got to say to the family, have a private committal later, or alternatively, have a private funeral first, and then a memorial service. That's a funeral without the coffin present. And then you can go straight to your wake or your afternoon tea and maximize the chance for that informal talking, processing, grieving, and hopefully ministering.

SPEAKER_03 25:56

I've found success in farewelling the coffin out the front of our building. That's another great option. And then and so the whole thing happens here. Yes, the the farewell comp happens out the front, and then there's a morning tea immediately, and so it's all kind of contained.

Headstones And The Last Witness

SPEAKER_04 26:17

Dominic, I think that's a really good option with just this little caveat. Uh it can sometimes you miss the finality of closure, either the closure of the curtains or the lowering of the coffin and the putting on of the soil into the grave. And that can be particularly important, that final closure, if it's not it, not an elderly person, if it's a more sudden death for a younger person. Uh younger people there kind of need to know this really is it. And sometimes doing it all at the church, it's uh at at a bit more clinical. Yeah, where it's yeah, and and it and and you never quite know when is the moment that we've said the final farewell. So ordinarily, I think your option is a really good one. I've promoted it many times, but you do want to think about the needs of the individual family, David.

SPEAKER_02 27:12

And just just finally, I think think about your headstone, because that your that's your ongoing message to future generations. So it's always good to walk through a cemetery. So when my mum and dad, who'd become Christians uh in their 50s, uh, when they died, they they were Presbyterians through and through. They loved the Presbyterian hymn book and they loved Jesus. But I I I I was the only son, two sisters, and we had to decide what to go on the headstone. Um, the family hymn was uh I I heard the voice of Jesus say a Bonner hymn, but it didn't fit. But we found another Bonner hymn, and I think it's brilliant. Upon a life I did not live, upon a death I did not die, upon another's life, another's death, I staked my whole eternity. Jesus Christ, they're all. Now that's on the headstone at Wavely Cemetery, and it'll be there for a long time, and it's speaking to people, isn't it? And I I I think it's a it's a great head just think about your headstone.

SPEAKER_03 28:11

Give me um give me the line on the difference between rest in peace and at peace as headstone lines. Uh Dominic, I haven't thought too much about it. Um I'm sorry, let me put it out there then. One of my thoughts is rest in peace on the headstone is a prayer which says I don't have confidence that I will be at peace, whereas at peace is a statement that um that this person is at peace. So the person who actually has the full confidence in Christ and has thought about it is going to make the statement, not the request. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 28:49

I I think to be honest, people aren't thinking too deeply theologically about common cliche lines like that. I'm with David. If if we are talking headstones uh or plaques, I I would try to have something brief about Jesus and not just me.

SPEAKER_03 29:06

Yeah. Thanks so much for coming in. My guests on The Pastor's Heart, Sandy Grant, Dean of St. Andrew's Cathedral, uh, David Cook, former principal of Sydney Missionary and Bible College, and Gary Coleman, Gary, motor racing chaplain and former pastor, and a zillion funerals under his belt. It is The Pastor's Heart. It's Dominic Steele. Thanks for your company. We'll see you next Tuesday afternoon.