BONUS Episode: The Coach's Playbook and the Mental Performance Summit

In this special “From the Other Side of the Mic” episode, I join Cindra Kamphoff on The High Performance Mindset podcast to discuss leadership and mindset in the realm of high performance. We also preview the upcoming Virtual Mental Performance Summit (Friday, April 17th) and explore practical ways coaches and leaders can elevate how they think, perform, and show up for others.

Learn More About The Mental Performance Summit:

• You can learn more and register here

Learn More About Zach:

• Get 1:1 coaching with Zach -- Schedule a free call here
• Subscribe to my free newsletter here

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Every now and then I like to flip things around and share what I call an episode from the other side of the mic. Now, instead of me being the host for the conversation, it's an opportunity for you to hear from me as a guest. Being asked questions, expanding on ideas in maybe a different way, and just giving you a bit more of a long form look into my work, my thinking, and the things that I'm currently exploring. Well, today's episode is gonna be one of those. Now, I actually had every intention of releasing a new guest interview, uh, kind of in my traditional form, one that I've been really excited to share, but the at the end of last week I had an impromptu conversation with Sindra Kampoff on her own podcast, The High Performance Mindset, and it felt worth bringing to you now. The timing made a lot of sense because this coming Friday, if you maybe haven't come across this yet, Sindra is hosting a virtual mental performance summit. It's a half-day event featuring six different practitioners and leaders who've worked across a range of different settings, including professional sport with top NCAA programs, as well as some big companies in the corporate world. And it's a really strong lineup, and I'm honestly extremely just humbled and honored to be part of it. So if you're someone that's looking to elevate your own mindset or help the people that you lead do the same, I think this is going to be a really valuable event. And you can learn more or register at mental performance summit.org. That's mental performance summit.org. Now, in this conversation here, Sindra and I talk about some of my current work, we give a preview of the Mental Performance Summit, and then I also share a little bit about what I'll be diving into during my session this coming Friday. And the good news is that if you can't join us live, then registering for the event will still give you access to the recordings that you can watch on demand and whenever it might be most convenient for you. Now, one last point. Again, I'm the kind of the type of person, like I don't just loosely hand out recommendations. I don't like to just put my endorsement on anything unless I'm really confident in it, and I can promise you that I'm just as excited to learn from these other presenters as I am to speak. Sindra's brought in some awesome folks, and I'd be willing to say that this is the type of event that you probably don't want to miss. Now, and again, for those that maybe were expecting kind of one of my traditional guest interviews on my own show, I'll be back later in the next few days with a new guest conversation that I've been really excited to release actually for a while. I had planned on releasing it today, but again, kind of last week things kind of shifted a little bit with Cindra and I's impromptu conversation. And who I'm gonna be bringing to you later this week is someone whose rise as a coach has been incredibly fast and whose playing career is just about as decorated as it gets. She's widely considered one of the greatest of all time in her sport, and I think you're gonna really enjoy that conversation. But for now, I hope you enjoy this From the Other Side of the Mic episode and my conversation with Sindra Kampoff on the High Performance Mindset podcast.

SPEAKER_01 3:02

Today on the High Performance Mindset, we're diving into the question of how can I thrive? And that's why I'm really excited about today's conversation. Today I'm joined by Zach Brandon, a nationally recognized performance, mental performance and leadership coach who spent years helping elite performers win more and live better. So Zach is the founder of MVP Mindset Consulting and has spent seven years as the head of mental performance and coach development for the Arizona Diamondbacks, where he supported players and coaches at the highest level of professional baseball. He's also worked with elite athletes at IMG Academy, consulted with Olympic performers. And so beyond sport, Zach has brought his message to organizations like NASA, Gatorade, and USA Baseball. So he's also the host of the Win More Live Better podcast, and someone who really understands what it takes to both build mindset, performance, and well-being. And what I'm really excited about is Zach is going to be one of our featured speakers at the upcoming Mental Performance Summit, which is this coming Friday, April 17th. You can still register at mental performance summit.org. And the best part is you get a free copy of my upcoming book called The Confidence Habit. So, and even if you're listening after April 17th, you can still go there and um you can get the recording. So check it out, mental performance summit.org. And so today, welcome Zach to the high performance mindset. I can't wait to dive in.

SPEAKER_00 4:35

Me too, Sindra. Um, first off, thank you for the kind words and the introduction. Also the invitation to be part of next week's event. I'm so excited for this for a number of reasons. One is because there are just some people in this world that like they just naturally like radiate this like positive energy. And I very much put you in this category. Like you can't help but feel better after a conversation with you. So any chance I can be in the same space, whether it's in person or virtual, sign me up. So again, thank you for doing that. But I think the other thing that's really exciting for me, you know, yes, I'm excited to share, but I'm also super excited to hear from those that you brought in because I think you've put a lot of intentionality into who you've invited, not just people that have exceptional resumes and backgrounds, but they're also people that are very thoughtful uh of like and willing to share, willing to open up about the work that they do and share practical systems and tools and things like that. So I'm excited. I'll have my notebook ready and uh just grateful to be part of it.

SPEAKER_01 5:37

Yeah, it's gonna be awesome. And we got Josh Lifra, um, who helped the Cubs win the World Series. We got Lauren Johnson, who used to work for the New York Yankees. We got Carrie Guest, who works with the Boston Celtics, Chris Goodman, who works for the Tampa Bay Rays. So I'm like, you know, this is like an amazing lineup to like learn from just top mental performance coaches on how they help people train their minds. So I can't wait. So mental performance summit.org. And um, you know, Zach, I wanted to ask you this question to get started. You know, you've worked with so many elite performers, obviously, seven years with the Arizona Diamondbacks, Olympic athletes, IMG Academy, elite coaches. You know, what have those environments really taught you about what actually drives high performance?

SPEAKER_00 6:30

I think first and foremost, one of the things that's a common thread amongst all those performers or coaches and leaders is their ability to implement systems for themselves that help them produce consistency on a more regular basis. Like there are so many things that are constantly trying to interfere with our success and our effectiveness as performers, as leaders, and so on, many of which are outside of our control. Sometimes those are also self-inflicted. And so, so I think on one hand, have systems for yourself to grow and how you go about um developing uh as a leader, as a coach, as a performer, and so forth to me is kind of first and foremost. I think one thing that I've the more I've been around, the more I've been super impressed by the guys that can go from good to great, great to elite, they just they don't compromise those standards. Like there's so many moments like day to day where your standards can get kind of tested and you can cut corners and you can um kind of fall by the wayside with habits and so forth. And not that you have to be perfect, certainly at all, but do you at least have a system that you kind of consistently fall back on and then help nudge you uh back on track when you inevitably kind of drift off course? So for me, that's I think one big one. But I think the other one too, um, this kind of ties in. Um, I think we're we're thankfully in an era where people recognize the role of mental strength and how important that is in that equation for high performance. It's certainly not the end all, but it is certainly a key component. One of the biggest, I think, lessons that's been revealed to me over time is that mental strength maybe is less about you have to have this positive thinking all the time, as much as it is mental strength is can you take positive or purpose-driven action, no matter what you're thinking or feeling? Because I think sometimes there's this illusion or perception that elite performers, they're they're always confident, they don't have self-doubt, they don't have insecurity, they're they're they're always fearless. I mean, if you've been around performers yourself, like I know many that are extremely successful and thriving, and yet they experience all those emotions. And so, what the difference though is how they choose to act in spite of those thoughts and feelings and not let them kind of hijack their performance. So I think those would be two big ones initially.

SPEAKER_01 9:00

Okay, awesome. I like what you said about um, you know, positive driven action, despite how they think and feel. And so many times we, you know, we do overthink that. And even the even when I think about confidence, like the action of confidence sometimes comes before the feeling of it, you know. So um, what is an example of a system that you think elite performers use? Like I'm thinking about there's lots of different kinds of systems. It could be like a system of the how they spend their morning or how they reset, or you know, like um how they plan their day. Like, what are some examples of systems you see?

SPEAKER_00 9:38

That's that's a great example, first and foremost, that we can kind of maybe build off. I think, you know, a lot of my work has has shifted, I guess, towards coaches and leaders predominantly. And, you know, one quick example would be there's a few things that matter significantly to those individuals that they have to protect that are finite resources. One, their time, two, their energy, and three, their attention. You know, we don't have a unlimited supply of those things. And yet many coaches and leaders sometimes are just reacting their way through their day. And you're you have a never-ending to-do list. There are fires that are always coming up. You're the person that people come to with questions, and you're supposed to have answers and so forth. And so there's a lot of things constantly trying to hijack those three important variables. I think one thing is like, do you have a system for how you kind of protect that? So I'll give like one maybe concrete one, and I'm uh very guilty of using like a lot of analogies and things like that, but I think this one will hopefully make sense. Yeah, hopefully, at least in my own brain. Uh, so the analogy is think of like a lion hunting in the wild. A lion can either hunt antelope or can hunt field mice. Now, if it hunts field mice, it's not very difficult. It's very low stress, low strain on them, and there's quite a bountiful supply of field mice. However, a lion consuming field mice all day, the caloric intake doesn't exceed the energy expenditure. So, in other words, they would hunt all day, and then therefore they'd actually eventually starve themselves to death. Now, antelope, on the other hand, much more sustaining, a lot more challenging, much bigger, takes a lot more skill and so forth. But if a lion's able to hunt uh successfully hunt an antelope, it actually can help sustain them for a longer period, even if they're not catching quote unquote as many. I share this because one of the things that I will sometimes do with a coach or leader is help them identify their antelope. Day to day, what are the things, you know, if let's say it's the night before, tomorrow, what are the two or three main things that you're like, okay, this would make today a success? What are those main things that I need to make sure I am protecting on my calendar? Because again, your calendar is a reflection of what you value. And if it's not on there, then it's very easy for it to get swallowed up and taken from by other things. So that's that's one piece of it. Then it's obviously the other side is like, what are the field mice that are getting in the way? What are the things that you're allowing to hijack your attention and your energy in a way that's actually not moving the needle closer to you? So I think a really easy one in coaching is you can't delegate relationships. You like connection matters immensely as a coach. So if, but again, when your calendar is so thin and you, if you don't deliberately carve out time for setting time up for connection with your players or your staff, that time is going to be hard to just find reactively. And I think that's been a cool theme. And some of the conversations I've had with coaches on my own podcast is some of them have talked about like I deliberately carve out time for these things and connection just being one of them. But I think that's that to me is something that can show up as like, okay, what's your system for protecting your capacity as a leader by protecting those three things?

SPEAKER_01 13:11

I love it. Time, attention, what was the last one?

SPEAKER_00 13:14

And it and energy.

SPEAKER_01 13:15

And energy. Uh, those are not like unlimited. Um, I've called them needle movers before, but I like the I like the analogy of like the antelope, right? Like, and you're right, I think about this for myself. What is like the two things I have to get done today? You know, one of them is talking to you. Um, so you have this podcast, which is an incredible podcast. And I want to talk a little bit about um what what the title of the podcast means to you. So you talk about winning more and living better. And I love that because I think so many high achievers, high performers feel like it's one or the other, like winning more or living better. So, how do you define both and why is that balance so hard, in your opinion?

SPEAKER_00 14:00

Yeah, this is this is a great question. Um, and I think you're you're spot on where it does feel oftentimes like these two things are at odds. And I just know I've I've just had so many conversations, I think, with coaches and leaders over the years where they felt like they were maybe being quote unquote successful in one area, but it was coming at an immense cost in the other. And with that, there's guilt, there's with that, there's you know, frustration, disappointment. They feel like their um their time is fragmented and then um they just don't know how to kind of protect some of that. So for me, the show was really about sharing principles and inviting perspectives on to help like how do you do this? Like, and not that people have got it all figured out, but it's like, what can we all learn from one another to better protect ourselves so that way um we not only win between the lines, but we win at home. We win as fathers, as as um mothers, as spouses, and so forth. Like, I didn't I didn't like that feeling. There's too many people in our profession, not only in mental performance, but as coaches who I I've had countless stories with coaches who have said um, you know, their kids maybe like they're not in a family photo when they go home. Yeah. Or there's a there's a memory that their family are talking about that they weren't there for. And so just helping them, not that all of a sudden now you can completely find quote unquote balance, but just how do you do that in a way that's meaningful to you and um do so at where it doesn't come at a cost. So that's really what the show is about. But within all of that, it's like we want to be elite. Like we want to be like most of us, like that's that's those are fun people to be around is those who are trying to be the best in the world at what they do. And inevitably that will come at a cost at some point in other aspects. And so just figuring out, helping each individual person figure out what that means for them. And so the way I kind of um have distinguished it is we have two scoreboards in life. There's society scoreboard, which evaluates things like fame, fortune, money, championships, accolades, awards, and so forth. All things that those that are high achieving, like, yeah, like we we chase many of those. And that and I think that's okay. Like that's actually very like inherently human. And I also have had experiences either through my own journey and or others where you achieve things and they feel hollow, or you realize that afterwards there's like this culmination, this moment where like I even firsthand, people ask me a lot about, you know, when we went to the World Series in 2023, and like, what are some of your most vivid memories? For some reason, one of my most vivid memories was two days after we were eliminated, walking into the locker room, seeing it empty, cleaning out my locker, and thinking, you know, like we would have done this a month ago, let alone like having done it a month later after an incredible run. But I was like, my life hasn't changed all that much. Like I gotta go home, I gotta run errands, I gotta go clean the house, like I gotta go do all these things that I put on hold, or that, you know, we think sometimes that winning will all of a sudden totally change things. And the reality is, is if if you win on society's scoreboard, but it's not also rooted in your own personal scoreboard, which to me are your values, your why, your the things that matter to you, that I don't get to tell Sindra what hers is, but I can help you define that if I want to help you win on both. And that's for me, some of the work that I try to do, especially early on with coaches, is help them ensure that they're winning on the right one. And and really it's also winning at both more than anything.

SPEAKER_01 17:50

Yeah, I love that. Um, and I I wrote down what does it look like for you to be the best in the world at what you do? And I I think that's a really powerful question uh because it helps you kind of keep always leveling up. And you're right that people want to be around elite performers. And I think we all have this desire to like be the best in the world at what we do, right? Um, and it gives us just a higher standard. What do you see like when you think about some of the people that you've been around who are literally the best in the world of what they do, if it's coaches or elite athletes, um, what do you think they do to become the best in the world of what they do?

SPEAKER_00 18:30

I mean, I hate to say make this sound like so quote unquote simple per se, but like if you if you want to be different, if you want to be an outlier, like then you have to do outlier things. Like you have to be different. You have to be like uncommon. You can't just expect the same same results that others do and and think that uh or do the same things that others do and expect different results. Now, with that, I think this is also where I'm a big proponent that like life really only changes for any of us through this like paradigm of action. In other words, you can't just sit like declare that you want something, right? Like nobody gets a gold medal for positive thinking. Like it's about what it's about, it's about what you do with it now. Again, irrespective of what you think or field. So for me, I think um, what is it that separates like the best in the world? Like, I think they're willing to like sometimes do things that maybe others aren't willing to do. And I think that takes a lot of courage. Like it takes a lot of courage, you know. I know you talk so much about both courage and and confidence. And and I think that that's something that irrespective of your role, if you're in pursuit of high performance, I do think that that's important. You know, one thing that's come up, two quick examples is like, um, I'm a big fan of the quote Um, you know, if you want to lead the orchestra, you have to be willing to turn your back on the crowd.

SPEAKER_02 19:55

Oh, wow. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:56

Like that's a really powerful thing. Like, if you want to lead, like you have to put your full focus and mission to those that you're serving and that those are in front of you. You're gonna have critics, you're gonna have people that disagree with what you say or what you do. Like that's kind of what you sign up for as a leader. Now, can you still do that in a way where it's still grounded again in in your values and your standards and the vision that you have for your program? And and it's it's easy to say this. And then it's another thing when I mean, you know I think we're seeing this now in the current landscape. Like, how many coaches two years ago had an incredible season and then they have one bad year and they're they're fired?

SPEAKER_01 20:34

Oh, isn't that crazy?

SPEAKER_00 20:36

You're hearing more and more examples of that. And so to do it on your own terms and and to stay grounded in your values to me is important. The other thing, um, kind of along this line and courage, this is kind of like a fun quick side story, but I think it it illustrates it. It's came up, I was reminded of it recently. So, Wilt Chamberlain, like one of the greatest NBA players of all time. And in 1961, 62 NBA season, he he averaged over 50 points a game. He had an 100-point game, which is like mind-blowing to this, like unbelievable. Like records that still like I'm not sure that they'll get broken. And um yet what a lot of people don't know is that he had a uh one aspect of his game that was not very good, which was free throw shooting. And it was the one year of his career where he actually shot well above, significantly above his average. Um, and in that game, he was had 100 points. He was 28 of 32, which is a great like for anybody. That's a really good free throw percentage. And um, but what people may not know is that he shot all of those free throws granny style.

SPEAKER_01 21:46

No way. Like under like meaning like his through his legs.

SPEAKER_00 21:49

Underhand, underhand, like he's okay. So he gets up to the line and underhands to the basket, and he learns this uh again from from others that had done it, but like it. Again, that's very unorthodox. Most people wouldn't do that. And he literally has come out and said in his his autobiography, he's like, I knew it helped me. I knew it was good for me. And yet I couldn't keep doing it. Like he's like, I felt weird. I felt silly doing it. But I share that from the standpoint of I think to be an elite performer, you have to be willing to do some things, irrespective sometimes of what they look and appear. And I think that's to again, like how do you how do you do that on a consistent level? It's it's how are you willing to do things that others won't in order for you to get results that others can't? And that to me is I think where um there can be separation.

SPEAKER_01 22:41

Thank you so much for sharing that. And I want to also, Zach, ask you about, you know, this next Friday, we're doing this upcoming mental performance summit. And the title of your session is um the coaches playbook, Strategies for Winning More and Living Well, right, which we've talked a little bit about the winning more, living well. But tell us about the coach's playbook and give us just like an overview of your philosophy around that.

SPEAKER_00 23:09

You know, I think um we're in this space where coaches pour everything into their players, into their programs and teams, and and so much of what occupies their time, their energy, their attention is is those around them. And yet what I think sometimes doesn't happen is coaches having a space for them to turn the mirror towards themselves and take care of their own needs. And I think this really matters because in leadership, like you can't give away that which you don't possess. So, in other words, like if you want to help your team be more present, but you don't model presence, right? If you're scattered, if you're distracted, if you're showing up to practice without prep or being prepared for it, like then it's it's not gonna work. Like you, it's like parenting, like do as I say, not as I do, just doesn't, like eventually you lose credibility. And so one of the big things that um, you know, and this kind of ties in one of the sentiments that we often share is that, you know, in coaching, one of the things that's important is like making sure that your audio matches your video. In other words, like, is what you do the set equal to what you say, right? Like you can't just say one thing and then do something other. Like I, and so that to me is is is really crucial in all this. But I say all this because coaches have game plans for their players, they have game plans for their teams, but do you have a game plan for yourself? And to me, that's really what um to the kind of the coach's playbook is is really all about is helping you create what's that game plan for you? So that way, not that you have to be quote unquote selfish, but that way a better you can create a better environment for those that you lead. And that to me is I think the thing that I've become maybe the most passionate about is helping coaches understand that um one of the best ways to drive player development is to ensure that those creating the environment, coaches, leaders, and so forth, have the capacity to lead effectively and to create a rich environment for them. And so the coaches playbook is going to be a great opportunity to just kind of share, I think, some of the things that I've used with coaches, leaders, and so forth that they're finding maybe are the most simple but practical things that they can use to kind of help them start to um, you know, not that you have to make wholesale changes overnight, but how do you ensure that you build a good foundation? The the last thing I would say with it is um, you know, I've I've shared this a while back that um, you know, nobody would try to renovate their home while it's on fire.

SPEAKER_02 25:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:55

We do this all the time from like a mental well-being standpoint. Like we wait till crisis to then be like, okay, now I'm gonna work on myself. Now I'm gonna work on who I am and my foundation and those types of things. And so for me, I think a lot of the work has become how do I help you do that in a more proactive way? And and also too, just have a second set of eyes or a thought partner alongside you to kind of help guide you in that process.

SPEAKER_01 26:22

Yeah, that's so great. And as I was thinking about, you know, where you work with coaches, I mean, that can relate to like leaders too. You know, anybody who's listening, it's like, how are you, what's your game plan for yourself as a leader? Because your energy is contagious. And when you have a better you, you have a better environment, right? Um, Zach, tell us a little bit about your thoughts on this idea of like interference and your philosophy around that.

SPEAKER_00 26:49

Yeah, um, so I I've spent a lot of time. I mean, this has been, I think, building or um developing for for years, but I think in particular over the last year and a half, I've just I've just shifted so much of my energy and time to really paying attention to coaches' needs, they're they're the things that they're they they want, the things that they're most passionate about, the things that are also holding them back. And some of that is outside of themselves, and some of that is um sometimes self-inflicted. So what I've done is I've uh distilled, I guess, my framework for helping increase a coach's impact to kind of this equation. And it basically is hey, a coach's results or outcomes are going to be a product of one, their individual capabilities times the environment conditions that they create for those that they leap, minus interference. So as you kind of noted, um, you know, we've kind of now talked through like, right? So when we go back to like the hunting antelope and protecting your thoughts, your uh, I mean your time, your energy, attention, that's the individual, right? How do I help you thrive? You know, at a team level or an environmental level, it's about how do we create better systems for feedback? How do we help you develop better connection with your team, build your culture and so forth? But to me, the fun part of the job is interference. And this is where, you know, if if you're working with someone who uh like I'll give a quick example. I was working with a front office director in another organization in a in another sport, and I it's our first meeting, and I'm asking him about, you know, what his dream is. What's what's the ideal outcome for him that he wants to move towards in his career? And he shared, he's like, I want to become an assistant GM. I was like, great, like that that sounds fantastic. Okay, so then it was starting to ask ourselves, like, okay, well, what's different about that version of who you want to become and who you are today? Like, what do you what do they do that you don't do? What do they believe that you don't believe and so forth? Figure out the gap. But this was all rooted in uh uh what he initially reached out about was hey, I'm in this new role. It's like I've been asked to start learning how to fly the plane while it's like it needs to be patched up. And my co-pilot used to be the pilot, and they it wasn't their choice to move into the co-pilot seat, was kind of what we boiled it down to. So it was kind of a messy situation. So in his instance, when you think of interference, there's genuine external interference. He was working with someone who, you know, maybe there was some toxic environment, there was some difference in leadership styles and like process differences and so forth. But on the other hand, though, too, what we came to find out was that what was sometimes getting in the way was his own self-doubt, was his own, when there were these moments where he had the opportunity to say with conviction what decision the group needed to make, he had this internal voice that was second guessing himself. And and so that to me is one form of interference can be external, but it can also be internal. And so I think a lot of the the fun part of the work is is helping people get out of their own way. That's what coaches do for players all the time. And how do we help ensure that you're you're not preventing yourself from becoming the best version of yourself? And so, um, and it was cool. Like for this particular coach, what we or this particular leader, what we landed on was, you know, at one point in the conversation, I I asked, like, well, if you were your the assistant GM right right now, what would you do? And he was like, Oh, that's actually a good point. Like he was like, I'd probably trust myself and I'd give myself more permission to not be perfect. I was like, okay, like that sounds pretty good. And yeah, that was kind of what we we we built off of. Like that was our kind of our starting point is like inevitably when you start to hear that internal voice, ask yourself, okay, well, what would the assistant GM version of me do right here? All right, and what would they say and so forth? And so that's just like one example, but I think that's a manner in which it kind of shows up in sometimes the one-on-one conversations I'm having.

SPEAKER_01 31:08

So, can you give us, Zach, an example of a strategy or a way that you might help a coach or a leader, either if it's like reducing their interference or along with kind of your coach's playbook idea and making the best game plan for yourself?

SPEAKER_00 31:25

I think um one piece of this is it's very easy for, and I'm guilty of this too, is like like I love personal development, like I love growing and I love like I love reading, I love going to conferences, like I love being around like-minded people like yourself. Like I I love those. And they're all I think, and I think they're all valuable.

SPEAKER_02 31:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:50

And and I think I see this sometimes with coaches or leaders where you know they're they're so infatuated with figuring out like what's that new edge that they can acquire or learn. Um and yet I think sometimes what we forget is that sometimes the biggest upgrade for coach could be how you talk to yourself.

SPEAKER_02 32:12

Right.

SPEAKER_00 32:12

And I there was an awesome clip of this recently that I I came across. Um, I think it's the Brothers and Sisters podcast. I want to say is what I thought. Hopefully I said that right. But it was it had Coach K from from obviously legendary coach, right? Uh Duke. And and he shared this awesome story about this camp that he hosted every year. And like years later, this was it recently, he ran into a gentleman who attended his camp decades ago. Okay. And this gentleman said, Man, I loved your camp. I learned so much. And you said something to me that I'll never forget. And Coach Kay was like, Really, like, what was that? And the gentleman said, You asked all of us who's the most important person you talk to in every day. And Coach K and Coach K said, yourself. And it was like this cool lesson that decades later this gentleman still remembered. And I think that awesome. It was really cool to hear this snippet because I think this is something that we obviously see a lot in in the line of mental performance work is helping people. You say a lot of things to yourself that you would never say to a teammate, to a friend, to a loved one, et cetera. But we think that it won't affect us. And in reality, it's it's like that's a lot of wishful thinking. So I I think going back to that idea of like ways in which you can really enhance yourself is is to recognize too that like sometimes the most impactful work you can do is internal, is turning that mirror again towards yourself and and becoming a better version of you. So I think that that for me is one. I'll I'll give one other very quick little adage. Um, you know, I interviewed uh Stephen Voat, who's the head, uh he's the manager for the Cleveland Guardians in Major League Baseball. And he was cool because it's kind of a full circle moment because we worked with one another when he was um in Arizona as a player with us. And he's kind of one of those players where like you knew he was going to be an unbelievable leader someday. And um he uh he shared something that he would use a lot is like when he would start to notice his thoughts work against them, or he'd have a thought that was self-questioning, he just would ask himself, is that true? Or what's true about that, right? Just a way to poke holes in it and see, is there evidence for it? Because sometimes we we have a lot of thoughts that we hold at face value. And then when you peel back the layers, uh there's there's not evidence for it. So that for me is um, I think um, I'm sorry, I don't even know if I answered your question, but you did because you said I said what's one strategy or tool.

SPEAKER_01 34:50

So okay.

SPEAKER_00 34:51

So I think just yeah, being mindful of how you talk to yourself to me is is a big one.

SPEAKER_01 34:55

Yeah, that's so great. Um, during our mental mentally strong conference in January, we had a virtual conference and henna prior um provided this kind of similar idea where she she was one of the speakers and she said, Is that true and by who? And I thought that and by who was cool because it's like, you know, has anyone actually ever said that to you? Is that actually true? And actually, whoever said that? You know, most of the time it's like, well, no one's ever said that. It's just maybe the assumption I've made or the conclusion I've I've drawn, been been drawn to. So um I love that.

SPEAKER_02 35:29

I love that.

SPEAKER_01 35:30

Yeah, so good. All right, two final questions I have, and one is about confidence. And uh I asked you this question because I got uh a book coming out September 1. Zach, check it out. I just got the galley copy today. So let's go.

SPEAKER_02 35:46

It looks so good. It looks pretty cool.

SPEAKER_01 35:49

It's called The Confidence Habit of Seven Core Practice is a transform self-doubt to self-belief. And you know, uh writing a book takes years, and then finally getting it, you know, out in the hands is pretty wild. Um, but what is your thoughts about uh confidence and how coaches and leaders can build confidence with their their, you know, their people, their athletes or their um the people they they lead?

SPEAKER_00 36:17

I think um I love it. I can't wait to read the book too in its full entire. I'm I'm so excited. Uh the um, you know, I think one is like, you know, for a quick moment, if we were kind of go more of a theoretical approach here, one thing that we do know is like one of the biggest drivers of human motivation and behavior is the sense that you're making progress, the sense that you're building skills or you're building competence in what you're doing and you're getting better from when you started. I think what happens sometimes in the realm of sport, and really in any context, I think that's high achieving oriented, is we get so fixated on what's next. We get so fixated on our goals and where we're trying to get toward that we sometimes forget that, like, oh my God, like I've actually come a really long way. Like I've actually done a lot. Or like, and I think as coaches, as leaders, you play such a powerful role in helping people sometimes shine a spotlight on how they've grown and how they've improved and the progress that they're making that's sometimes not always visible. And that's I think one of our obviously the bigger challenges in sport sometimes is like you can do everything right, you can do everything you're supposed to. And it doesn't mean that you're guaranteed it pays off. And that's kind of um, you know, how it all goes. And so I think that's where coaches can play a really critical role. Um, one way that I've so I I bring all this to confidence because I think sometimes I've heard coaches say, like, um, this player's lost his confidence. And I kind of cringe at it because I'm like, I think more often than not, they don't lose it. They just stop focusing on why they should possess it in the first place.

SPEAKER_01 38:08

Awesome.

SPEAKER_00 38:09

And so I think that for me is where coaches play a big role in a very like applied way, maybe that they could consider approaching this is um one way to also sometimes sabotage our own confidence is when we look to others, right? We compare ourselves. You just because there's always somebody that's gonna be faster, shot more intelligent, like has better hair than you, you know, all of the jazz.

SPEAKER_01 38:30

Like there's always someone, like and um maybe that was a personal one, but um I think to myself there's always someone who's taller than me.

SPEAKER_00 38:39

Taller, yeah, right. Like generally, we can who at and fill in with whatever blank you want, there's always somebody generally ahead. Um, but to me, I'd actually argue that comparison is not problematic as much as it is when it's misdirected. So I I like to think of like backwards comparison. How am I different today in comparison to yesterday? How have I improved today in comparison to who I was a year ago and so forth? And like when we compare backwards, what you do then is you invite people to see their growth, see their progress that sometimes we uh we overlook.

SPEAKER_01 39:18

I love that, Zach. And I love multiple things that you just said. It's like we don't really lose our confidence. We just possess, we don't possess like um exactly. Say how say it one more time how you said it because I didn't write the whole quote down.

SPEAKER_00 39:31

That's okay. That's okay. You're doing a great job. I give you kudos. As like as a fellow podcast host, it is hard to like ask thoughtful questions, follow up, and like you're doing, you're amazing. Um, I uh um you don't lose confidence as much as you stop focusing on why you should possess it in the first place.

SPEAKER_01 39:51

Why you should possess it in the first place. That's awesome. Because I think you're right. It's especially high achievers I've worked with. It's like we can be so focused on an outcome which is completely out of our control, or like um, it makes me think of the book by Dan Sullivan called The Gap in the Gain. You know, we're so focused on like the gap where we want to go and how we need to get there. Instead of like, wow, what can we celebrate and what progress have I made? And you're right, like mental performance coaches, leadership coaches, leaders, athletic coaches can help people do that. Parents, right? We we take a really important role in like helping our kids even see the progress that they've made. Um awesome. We're gonna talk so much more on April 17th during our mental performance summit. Uh, Zach, you know, one of the things I love about the what you do, you I love so many things about what you do. Um, I love the practicalness of today's conversation and things that people can implement. I also love following you like on LinkedIn because you provide such great videos of just like about mental performance. And I love just the current examples that you always find. So tell people how they can find more information about your work um and then how they can follow you on social media.

SPEAKER_00 41:09

Yeah, I think um, well, thank you. I appreciate that a great deal. Um the uh I think there's a few quick ways that I think are kind of easy and and uh and also free too, which is nice. One is the podcast. So uh again, it's win more, live better. Uh so again, the way I've kind of set it up is periodically I do these interviews with um a lot of coaches, a lot of thought leaders, experts kind of in this space, and we explore again this kind of this conundrum of how do you win more and and also live better in the process and what goes into kind of the psychology of leadership and high performance. And then um, so that's one. And then during the week, I share a lot of kind of these like little analogies and principles and so forth. So um, for those that might be interested in some of that, that's what the the podcast is about. I do have an email newsletter, it's called Winning with Words. And so it's kind of a build off of that as well. So if you like the stories, you like the analogies, every kind of piece is kind of in the same uh framework, which is here's the what, what's the story about, why it matters for you as a coach or performer, and then uh a way to implement it. So I try to make it practical. And then yeah, um, social um LinkedIn's probably the one that I typically am the most consistent with. I do use X or Twitter, whatever we call that now. Yeah, whatever you call it now. I've started Instagram, but I'm also ready to can Instagram. So I don't know. So by the time this comes out, I don't know if I'll still have it or not. But anyway, all of those I think I'm pretty easy to find. Um, and those are probably the best places um where if you want to um, you know, kind of have um an inside scoop as to things that I'm sharing in real time. Like I it's kind of my filter. It's like if I wouldn't share this with an athlete or coach that I work with, then I generally don't put it out there. So you're getting a lot of the stuff that um I'm trying to share daily in my work.

SPEAKER_01 42:58

Amazing. Uh I so appreciate you being on today, Zach. I loved how we talked about um taking positive, uh purpose-driven action despite how you're thinking and how you're feeling. Uh, we talked about like considering what the best in the world um do and don't do. We talked about like what's your antelope and like what's the main thing that you need to get done. Uh, I love your idea of your capabilities times your environment minus interference. And interference can be both internal and external. Um, and this idea, what we were just talking about at the end about like not losing confidence, but just um stopping to realize how you possess it and taking a step back and really thinking about how you can capture your wins more often. So uh, Zach, thank you so much for joining us on the high performance mindset. Keep crushing it.

SPEAKER_00 43:49

Yeah, likewise, Sindra. I appreciate you a great deal, and I can't wait for next Friday.