Naked at the Top

Building Trust in a Broken System | Naomi Anderson

• Paul Banks • Season 1 • Episode 12

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When tragedy strikes, some people crumble. Others rebuild the system that failed them.


 Naomi from Care Advisory is one of those people. After witnessing first-hand how broken the aged care industry can be, she set out to create change – building a business grounded in ethics, transparency, and trust.

In this episode of Naked at the Top, Naomi shares how she turned heartbreak into purpose, defied expectations, and created a business model that puts people before profit. She opens up about the personal sacrifices behind her success – from single parenting and burnout to late ADHD diagnosis – and how she learned to lead with courage, compassion, and conviction.

If you’ve ever felt torn between doing what’s right and doing what’s easy, Naomi’s story will remind you what real leadership looks like.

🎧 Subscribe to Naked at the Top for honest conversations with leaders who are redefining success through authenticity, purpose, and heart.

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Aleyx:

Hello, and welcome to another episode of Naked At the Top. Today I am joined by Naomi from Care Advisory. Hi Naomi. How are you?

Naomi:

Thank you so much for having me.

Aleyx:

Thanks for joining us. Could you just start by giving us introduction to Care Advisory and what it is that you do?

Naomi:

Sure. so Registered Nurse by Profession Care Advisory helps families navigate the full spectrum of aged care from the very beginning of their journey, right through to placement into residential aged care. a nutshell.

Aleyx:

So what led you to Starting Care Advisory? What were you doing before? Before that?

Naomi:

I was nursing before and I've been in the aged care system for about 20 years, and there are a number of events that kind of led to me. Identifying that families really needed support in this area. And so when I started Care Advisory, it was really towards the tail end of their journey, so placement into Resi Care. And that really occurred after one final incident that happened where a lady was admitted into the home where I was one of the care managers. my, objections to my boss saying that she's not the appropriate fit for our facility and that we wouldn't be able to care for her, and she ended up passing away after sustaining a fall. and the injuries that went with that, within 24 hours of being admitted and knowing what I knew. the families were really in quite a desperate situation. They were vulnerable. They needed to make decisions quickly. knowing the industry so well, there's no way I would've placed her in our home because I would've seen all the other things around her. I guess for me, it's ironic that. my whole life and my career trajectory completely changed by this one person who never even met me. yeah, I guess that's where the journey started and evolved from there.

Aleyx:

Yeah, it's often a moment in time, isn't it? That, that sparks a change that you want to see. So what, are you doing differently with care Advisory and, what do you hope to see moving forward?

Naomi:

Yeah, look. for us, what we do differently, we don't have many competitors, but the competitors that we do have work very differently. We are. Incredibly client centric. So we are fee for service, meaning that we only work for our client and we have unbiased views. it also means that we're not bound to contracts that we have with providers because we don't have any. Whereas some of our competitors will take commissions and kickbacks from providers rather than being paid by the client themselves and then advertising their services free. and then obviously I'm a nurse and the majority of my staff are also nurses or have some sort of caring background. Yeah, and I guess in terms of what I'd like to see in the industry is to have some sort of legislation and governance oversight in our type of role. Just like there is, within financial planning. Our service goes hand in hand with financial planners, especially if they do. care advice, and eventually what I'd like to see is a change to the industry that not just anybody can start a business like ours, but ultimately has the client's best interest at heart.

Aleyx:

Is there things that you can do, to, push that change? Or is there anything happening at the moment that you're aware of?

Naomi:

Not yet. obviously, a lot of people wouldn't be aware, but the Care Finder program rolled out a number of years ago, and that is similar to what we do. however, it serves a different demographic and that was rolled out by the government, the federal government. we weren't a big enough company to be able to take on a tender like that at the time, so I do think there is some underlying, oversight there. That we could use to our advantage down the track and use as a bit of a case study I, as to why is needed and why there needs to be oversight and governance. Yeah.

Aleyx:

It's, great to hear, it's great to speak to a founder and you've got a really clear mission and purpose behind what you do. and you can really see that from, the way you speak about it. And I spoke to a few people ahead of this interview and, they all said how passionate you are about what you do, and the, how the clients come first. And you can just, you can hear that through. The way you speak. So it's, really lovely to see.

Naomi:

Yeah, I think when I get my B, like a bee in my bottom about something, I just gotta let it go.

Aleyx:

That's good. That's good. We need more people like you, Naomi, to, to make a change for, vulnerable people. the elder are vulnerable and they need support and help from businesses such as yours. So I'd love to just, step it back and learn more about, Naomi and, what got you to where you are now. So could we go back in time, to, growing up and you, are there any moments in time that shaped you and that led you into the career that, that you've come into?

Naomi:

Look, I think, upbringing was quite influential in where I've ended up. My parents were quite a lot older when they had me, and I've got three much older brothers. two of my brothers could actually be my parent. so I was the only girl I grew up in a very strict religious family. And I grew up on a farm as well, and my parents are European, and so my entire life I feel like I was quite sheltered, but also brought up with a lot of older people. And so I think that probably shaped. Why I like to work with older people now, and I think me as a person, I do have a bit of an old soul. I've tried to leave aged care many, times and it just keeps drawing me back. But, I spent a lot of my childhood, probably a alone, because everybody else was so much older than me. I just kind of had to, You know, if I'm my own entertainment and a daughter of, business owners, I think that probably also shaped me into wanting to have something that is my own. I have to say I'm probably not a very good employee because I'm quite opinionated and I will stick up for things that I believe in, especially when it comes to the care of residents, for example.

Aleyx:

So growing up on a farm, that must have been interesting. Did you get involved in the farm work and thing?

Naomi:

yes. voluntary labor since I could walk pretty much. it was a strawberry farm and every single, summer holidays, after school weekends, I was expected to help as were some of my brothers. good work ethic, I think.

Aleyx:

Yeah. So that's certainly where you learnt your work ethic.

Naomi:

definitely.

Aleyx:

And then what about, what about, after leaving home and, what drew you into nursing?

Naomi:

so I went straight into nursing after school. Ironically, I got a very low end score is what they used to call it back in year 12 when I did school. and I didn't think I'd make it into university. I'm really not an academic. And somehow I still got in. I did a couple of non-A award subjects, which then I did really well at and they accepted me into nursing. my dad didn't actually speak to me for a few months'cause he wanted me to do accounting and he was very upset with me that I did nursing. And yeah, I went straight through. I had every intention of going back and studying midwifery, but everyone kept telling me, wait until you have your own kids and then go back. But it just never occurred. And I found my love of care from, I guess my very first year of nursing because I went into working in the field straight away.

Aleyx:

What is it? what, is it that draws you to age, care, and caring for the elderly?

Naomi:

I love their stories and I think that, we as a generation, as I just feel like we. Don't actually appreciate that people in aged care specifically have lived full entire lives, that they have stories as well. I think we take that a lot for granted, and we see them in one snapshot of their lives. But have such amazing stories. They've accomplished great things. They've traveled. and I, that's what I really love and that's what I'm drawn to. And I feel like that needs to be protected at all costs.

Aleyx:

Yeah. Yeah. If you give them, if you give them the opportunity to sit and share their stories and, talk to you, there's so much there. I'm very close with my gran and, she's got dementia now, but I used to love, sitting with her and chatting and, they've all got lots of stories, but often, like you say, we just. We, just, we're busy with our lives and we don't sit to ask them questions and understand them a bit more. Did you get a chance to, I imagine nursing's a busy profession. Did you get a chance to sit and speak to them when you were working? I,

Naomi:

Yeah, not so much. I would make time.

Aleyx:

yeah.

Naomi:

with nursing being so busy, if you really want to get to know somebody, you take the time to do that, and often that comes at the expense of the amount of hours that you work. but I've been really fortunate in my life, especially now that I'm a business owner, I get that opportunity far more readily and I. To spend that time with them and get to know them, and I'm not so rushed, and I guess that's probably why I like my job so much.

Aleyx:

And with Care Advisory, I imagine you spend a lot of time with the families as well and really get to know the entire family.

Naomi:

Yeah. generally when I see the client, the family are there, but then we do outside of that case management, meeting as meetings as well. So a lot of time with our clients and there's a lot of handholding and what we do as well. Yeah.

Aleyx:

So then going back to that moment that you described with the resident and what happened to that, that per resident and you were just like, you had to speak up what, take us through the next steps. How did you go from that to, just having care advisory and, moving forward, and what were some of the challenges in those early days?

Naomi:

I guess biggest challenges for me were that. At the time, no one did really what we, what I was trying to do I was told by numerous people, no one would ever pay me for that. After the incident occurred, I probably only stayed for a few months at that workplace. After that, I just needed a little bit of stability. At the time, I was a single mum, so I started the business. I worked. Full time. But I also did this on the side for a little while until I felt like it was too much of a conflict of interest and I had to, something had to give. so I left. After that, I then met my now husband and he really encouraged me to give it a really good go. So from there, we went down the networking route and that completely changed my business because it put my name out there. as people got to know me, they believed in what I did as well. And then it was all word of mouth. We've never actually had to advertise or anything like that. And look, it has taken a very long time because not long after that we were hit by COVID, and that really impacted the business because I couldn't go into homes. A lot of people didn't want to be admitted into homes. And so essentially the business stopped. At that point I had to go back to work. and it wasn't really again until around 2022 that I could pick up where I left off, and it's just snowballed from there after that.

Aleyx:

Wow. so many people would, given up in that moment, with COVID, like you said, you had to get another job and you hear that story so often, what was it within you that kept driving you to be like, no, this will work and we've gotta.

Naomi:

a couple of things. So one, I'm really stubborn. I have a really deep belief in what we do. And that we're genuinely helping people. And I think what drives me behind that is the relief that we see on families faces knowing that we have their loved one's best interest at heart. and thirdly, like I said before, I'm a really bad employee. I hate working for somebody else. So I knew that something had to give. I wanted to create something, aside from having this drive and deep passion for helping people, I wanted to create something that my son would be proud of. he and I had grown up together. I had him, relatively young, not as young as some people, but I wanted him to be shown that women can do it too.

Aleyx:

yeah. And you mentioned before that you were a single mum when this first started. So you were working full-time, you were doing this on the side, and I'm bringing up your, child. How did you, handle all of that?

Naomi:

it was very hard and I think looking back at it now, I have a lot of mum guilt because, he spent a lot of time at daycare, and kinder and being looked after by, by my parents or, other family members. And back at it now, at the time, I was just doing what I had to survive. we have a really good relationship now. He's nearly 14 years old. so I think I have been able to teach him that hard work does pay off, and as a result, now I get to spend more time with him.

Aleyx:

Yeah, there's, always a trade off, isn't there? I resonate with that as well. I've got two young kids and sometimes when my 4-year-old says, oh, mum, you're always working. And I, it hurts you a little bit. But then I. I try to reframe it to her and be like, mommy's building this business so that we can, enjoy life and things. So it's, there's always a, trade off and you can never get it.

Naomi:

No.

Aleyx:

You never get it. Perfect.

Naomi:

look, I think even as moms, if we spent a hundred percent of our time with our kids, there would always be some form of mum guilt that we've never done enough. and it's taken me 13 years to that out. that I did what I could and I did the best that I could at the time with the resources that I had.

Aleyx:

Yeah, absolutely. And you're building a life for, as you say, for you and your son and your husband, and you can enjoy each other's company. yeah. And, it's hard because you also want, as a mum, I know certainly for me, and you, want something for yourself too. You want something that you've built and everyone's different. And I. hands down, respect all work. stay at home moms because I could never do it. I actually found it incredibly hard when I was on maternity leave, and I think if I didn't have something for me and something I was working on, I would resent that a little bit. So I think it's finding what works for you and your family too.

Naomi:

Yeah, I do think I have raging ADHD that I got diagnosed late, on in life. And looking back now, when I did have some time off when Zane was first born, I was always looking for something to do. So had I have left it a bit longer, I probably would've been in a similar boat.

Aleyx:

Yeah, it's, hard, doesn't it? I've, I don't, have ADHD, although people think, I do, but I'm the same. I was always like, I've got to do something else. yeah. so where are you now in terms of how, long have you had Care Advisory?

Naomi:

It's about eight years now.

Aleyx:

Eight years. Okay. And you said it's, doing really well now.

Naomi:

Yes. I think really in the last 18 to 24 months, we've hit our stride, stride and, look, we are growing quite rapidly. The last six months is where we've seen, a lot of growth and I think that really is because I've made a lot of mistakes coming up until this point. And unfortunately probably listened to people who didn't understand my business the way that I do when I really should have just followed my gut. And so when I started making those changes towards the end of last year, everything changed. and I'm really proud of what we've achieved and I'm really looking forward to seeing where we are going to be in 12 months or even five years.

Aleyx:

Do you have a vision for where you want to be?

Naomi:

yes and no. I am a very big picture person. I'm not in the details so much, but I would hope that in the next three to five years, we are completely national, so we service nationally now. and we do have casual staff and contractors all across Australia really complex cases. I tend to go into state to meet these people, because of my work history, but I would like to be, a national name with offices in the capital cities so that we can help more people locally.

Aleyx:

Fantastic. So what, what does your actual day to day look like between, obviously running the business and, mum and everything in between. What does, a typical day look like for you?

Naomi:

usually very long hours. I start my morning quite early. I try to anyway. I am feeling a little bit burnt out now, I have to say, but usually try and start a little bit early. What the last five years has taught me is that I actually really need to put myself and my health first because my health really took a, hit in the last couple of years. so starting off and exercising, I find that for my, even my own mental health, that helps. and I've really made that a focus in the last 12 months. after that I then generally get ready for work. I will then sit down on my computer before my son gets up, up on anything that's left over from the night before. Then we do the school run. Then after that we have team meetings, or I'm out on the road seeing clients directly if I still need to see them. Then a lot of reporting, a lot of contact with providers, up with specialists, gps for our clients. then I will try to pick my son up from school. So one of my big goals is to make sure that I'm always there for drop off and pick up where I can be. then generally in the afternoons I try and, time block a little bit more. So I will usually do all my Zoom meetings, whether that's with referral partners, families, business development, the team, whatever it is. I tend to create, content either early in the morning or in the early evening. I'll do lives on TikTok and things like that, and then up with any reports that are outstanding, any emails that I need, to get back to. and then generally finish off my day quite late, seven, 8:00 PM sometimes even later. and then Darren and I will usually have dinner together and just debrief for the day.

Aleyx:

Yeah.

Naomi:

Yeah.

Aleyx:

You, sound very organised, Naomi.

Naomi:

Oh look, I probably think I'm. Less organised than what I actually am. saying all of that makes it sound like I am organised, but I tend to get distracted by a lot of things. And we'll start something, then it will start something else and then come back to that. So it is a little bit messy during the day, that's just the way my brain works. And instead of trying to fix that, I just have to go with the flow and I put supports in place to support me to do that. Yeah. Yeah, it's definitely accepting, the way you are and working with it and leaning into it. You, mentioned a couple there,

Aleyx:

but I was wanting to. To ask you what are your non-negotiables, in terms of, making sure you have, I hate to use the word balance'cause I don't believe in it, the balance between, family and work. I, I heard two, but what, are like non-negotiables for you?

Naomi:

so obviously always the school pickups and drop offs. There are some times that I just can't, early mornings just for me because that's before everybody in the house gets up at 4 30, 5 o'clock in the morning. And if I choose not to, exercise that day, I'll do something else for myself. and my evening with Darren.

Aleyx:

Yeah. Yeah. Nice. Yeah, I've had it before where people ask me, why do you get up so early? I was like,'cause that's the, that's me time. It's the,'cause if you don't do that, then you roll into work and then you've got, whatever you need to do in the evening and you never, you find you never have any time for yourself. And that's that, that then has a knock on effect on the rest of your life.

Naomi:

And I'm really not a morning person. I'm a procrastinator when it comes to bedtime because I feel like that's when I get my time back kind of thing. And doom scroll. but I've learned that really. In order to be able to recoup and, make sure that I am okay, I need that time all by myself, and that's the only time I can get it.

Aleyx:

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. we've, I'm hearing from this conversation we've got quite a few things in common, but there's one thing, we've got in common and that's a competitive streak. your husband may have told me about your competitive streak, and he told me a funny story about you go-karting with your son, which I, thought was hilarious. I wondered if you could share it with us.

Naomi:

Oh, look, I, when it comes to a competition, if there's a game I'm winning. Like I don't care and yes, last school holidays, my son and I do something in the school holidays every, single time. So I'll take the day off and we can do whatever he wants. And then last school holidays, he wanted to go-karting, so I'm like, righto. And, he was being all cocky and because he'd been go-karting before and I hadn't. So he was the man so I thought, this is game on. And I la him twice, gave him the queen wave as I la time. But it's not something we discuss'cause he doesn't wanna hear about it. But, I think that's probably what's driven his competitive streak as well, because I push him, to be better. And I think that's just a big part of my personality that if I can gamify something, I'm going

Aleyx:

Yeah.

Naomi:

even if it's not something that I'm interested in.

Aleyx:

Yeah, I love that. I love that. And when, I say people, I'm competitive, often it is with myself. I set up a little competition with myself, but I think that's an important lesson to teach your kids as well. I don't believe in letting your kids win at everything, because that's not how life is so

Naomi:

no.

Aleyx:

on You can laugh at them.

Naomi:

Yeah, exactly. And he plays basketball, he plays ref I have played basketball nearly my entire life, so he's seen that competitive edge in me it's probably what's, you know, attributed, or accounted towards some of his, competitive edge as well.

Aleyx:

Yeah. Yeah. So you've given them a gift there.

Naomi:

I hope so.

Aleyx:

I spoke to a couple of people that you work with ahead of this, and everyone described you as compassionate, generous, and patient. But they also said that you're, you're laser focused and you know where you're going. So how do you hold all those things together, how do you, how are you compassionate, generous, give people the space to, do what they need to do, but then still be really laser focused at the same time.

Naomi:

That's a hard one to answer, and I think it comes down to, again, my personality traits in that, if it doesn't interest me, I won't do it. that stems from my ADHD and it's again, something that I never really realised growing up. It's probably why I wasn't good at school. I wasn't really good at uni. I'm not an academic, but if I find something that interests me and gives me, some form of accomplishment, that's what I focus in on. And so if I, I have this drive to help people and build a business that's going to outlast me. all of that kind of falls under that umbrella. So I'll give my time to my staff. I will educate them. I'll come back. And listen and help and be part of the boots on the ground, not just, a leader from the top, not involved in the day-to-day operations. I still see clients myself, and all of that is part of the bigger goal. So it is. I know they seem like two very separate things, but they're intertwined very much so in my mind.

Aleyx:

Yeah. So it's, it comes back to that having, that, that belief and purpose and mission behind your business is really just driving you. it also, your team members told me that, you're, you let them take ownership and you really interested in them to, do what they need to do, absolutely don't micromanage. Does that come naturally to you as well?

Naomi:

It doesn't, it probably does more so now, but at the very beginning of the business, I felt like nobody could do things the way that I do things. and. I am an avid reader when it comes to personal development and business development. Anything else doesn't interest me, so I won't read on that. But, it's taken me a lot of professional and self-development to be, to realise or hang on, I can give them the structures, I can give them the boundaries, and they're likely actually to do it better than I am. And that's okay. And that's what's better for my client. At the

Aleyx:

Yeah.

Naomi:

day. it took me a really long time to let go of certain things. but now it's more about I need you to make this role your own. long as we get to a specific outcome, and we get there in the most efficient way possible, then you know, I'm happy for you to create your own standard operating procedures.

Aleyx:

Yeah. Yeah, that's fantastic.'cause everyone's got a different way of how they do something, and I've, I've had a few guests on the podcast before saying, give them the outcome and then let them do that, and always there to support them. But, everyone's gonna do things differently,

Naomi:

sometimes there are times where I have to intervene if things are going completely off track and it's going in a direction where I have tried and potentially failed before, just to bring them back to what the outcome is supposed to be. and that's really the only time that I interject. But other than that, I try and give them. Reign to be able to get to that outcome on their own.

Aleyx:

Yeah. What would your advice be to listeners?'cause I, know this is a, difficult one for especially founders when you start the business and then you've got to relinquish some of that control. What would your advice be to maybe a early founder that's just starting to build a team and not sure the best way to approach that?

Naomi:

having the end goal in mind is probably something that I, it took me a really long time to learn because I was in the roots all the time and I couldn't see the bigger picture. Whereas now I'm like, okay, so where is the end goal and how do we work back from that and who do I need to support me in order to get there? always, also improving yourself, learning new things. I'm never going to know everything, and I'm going to still continue to make mistakes. But get advice. Do your research. Always be striving to improve yourself, because that's where the magic happens. And as you and your mindset change, then. unlocks a whole heap of doors for you as well. I was really stuck for the longest time thinking, wanna make all of this money and, I will, create this huge business. But I was my own bottleneck. I was my own worst enemy. And you have to be able to do it with other people. Yeah,

Aleyx:

On, that point with advice, you mentioned something earlier that I was intrigued by. So you've, you've, had advice from different people and. The best thing you learned was to actually go with your gut. that can be really difficult right when you're starting out and when you're building, because you do look externally a lot of the times, and it's important to have mentors and things. How did you find now in terms of looking at the advice you're getting versus trusting your gut? Like how did you, find trust in your gut eventually?

Naomi:

Mainly because I'd had some business coaches tell me that I should be doing things a certain way because that fits in their tick box system. When my business is so incredibly niche that there is no tick box. template for me and knowing the industry so well and how to get somebody through that process of, whether it's home care or into residential aged care. What I came to realise is that nobody understands system and the industry like I do. And so that changed my whole perception of everything because I needed somebody to work with me based on my knowledge and my experience of the industry and build the business around that. rather than, there's even business coaches that do a lot of NDIS businesses and things like that, but they're so incredibly different to what we do because we're consulting, we're not providing, care services or direct care services at all. so unfortunately just took me a really long time and a lot of mistakes along that, way. And instead of looking at those mistakes as failures, it was more about, okay, so what have I learned from this? For the longest time I felt like they were failures and so I, it was just a vicious cycle. I kept doing the same thing over and over again, and it wasn't until I changed that mindset that things began to change.

Aleyx:

Yeah. Yeah. Seeing those failures as, as, long as you can learn from something, then it's not, a failure. I, they say you've got a, you've, I, heard a quote somewhere, probably on a podcast. if if you're not failing, you're not trying enough, you're not trying new things enough,

Naomi:

exactly.

Aleyx:

Yeah.

Naomi:

But also like doing those failures as well. If you are still doing the same ones over and over you really haven't learned anything from it. And that took me years to work out.

Aleyx:

Yes. Yeah. So have you found, like a business advisor or a coach now that you will work with your knowledge? Like you say, listen to your knowledge and then work around that? Yeah.

Naomi:

yes, I currently have two advisors and I'm actually a firm believer that if you are doing a good job, you will outgrow your advisors and you'll need someone else. I am also a very firm believer that, everybody should have an advisor of some sort, even the advisors themselves. so yes I do, and I think I'm almost at the point probably in the next six months about growing them as well.

Aleyx:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's, it is always having someone in your corner, but then recognising when it's time for, a new one. Yeah. Fantastic. we're coming towards the end now, Naomi, but I always do a, I always like to do a quick fire round, before we close out. so yeah, just first thing that, that comes to you. don't overthink it. So what was the last thing that you asked chatGPT?

Naomi:

so that I do quite a bit of posting on TikTok and I wanted to break down a certain topic to make it easy to understand. I use ChatGPT all the time.

Aleyx:

Yeah.

Naomi:

Yeah.

Aleyx:

Yeah, it's great. favorite time of the day and why?

Naomi:

probably five o'clock because I know that I can then get some work done and not have the calls coming in. And it also means that I get to start winding down and be with my family.

Aleyx:

Yeah. Perfect. something people get wrong about you.

Naomi:

Oh, that's a tough one. Probably in the last few years. Not so much now, but in the last few years, would probably think that I'm quite soft because I come across as quite kind. And, ultimately that means that. I will just say yes to everything, but I am quite assertive as well.

Aleyx:

Good, good. And the last book that you read, or Current book.

Naomi:

book that I read was, escape the Middle was the last book that I read. I'll get you the author one sec.

Aleyx:

Yeah, I was, that was gonna be my next question.

Naomi:

By Todd Polk,

Aleyx:

Ah, what's that one about?

Naomi:

switch a millionaire mindset and build wealth that outlives you. So it's about, escaping the middle class essentially and

Aleyx:

Ah,

Naomi:

something great.

Aleyx:

was it good? Did you get, a lot from it? Yeah.

Naomi:

three quarters of the way through. So yes, very much It's about leveraging the funds that you do have to create something better.

Aleyx:

Amazing. Amazing. and then the last question, Naomi, for you, this isn't the quick fire round, is just to leave a gift for all the listeners. so what's one lesson or belief that you'd want to pass on to anyone who is unsure of their next move in business?

Naomi:

your mindset will determine everything. So if you have a mindset that things won't work out, they won't. You need to believe in yourself and you know that a positive mindset will lead to better decision making, especially if you have an end goal in mind.

Aleyx:

Yeah. Fantastic. That's a lovely advice to end on. Thank you so much, Naomi, for joining me on Naked At the Top.

Naomi:

you for having me.

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Aleyx Ward

Host

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