Braving the Brightside
Life gets messy. It breaks us. But it also offers us the chance to rebuild.
Braving the Brightside is a podcast about what happens after the fall—how we find strength in struggle, how we reclaim hope in the dark, and how we choose to keep going even when it hurts.
Host Dan Bradley invites real people to share real stories—of resilience, recovery, and the quiet bravery it takes to face each day. From moments of rock bottom to unexpected healing, this show is a space for anyone learning to stand back up.
Whether you’re clawing your way through the storm or finally feeling the sun again—welcome. You belong here.
🌞Where resilience meets radiance.
Braving the Brightside
The Shame We Carry, The Life We Rebuild with Kipp Grange
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Send a message into the Brightside
What happens when shame stops running the story?
In Episode 31, Dan sits down with Kipp Grange, founder of Sonder Mountain Apparel, for an honest conversation about addiction, recovery, identity, and the difficult work of rebuilding a life from the inside out. Kipp shares his journey through alcoholism, rock bottom, sobriety, mental health, and the perspective shift that changed everything.
This is a raw, thoughtful episode about letting go of control, facing what hurts, and finding meaning on the other side of survival.
Check Out Sonder Mountain Apparel: Traditional Tattoo Apparel - Apparel with a Purpose | Live Vividly – Sonder Mountain Apparel Co.
Official Brightside Playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1QnOBVBM8NRC9nFtxcPEpd?si=uGOTwlqyTRSqggcMCJhzSQ
The Rethreadery-Sustainable Style: therethreadery.com-Use Code BRIGHTSIDE for 15% Off!
IG: @the_rethreadery
Haven on Adullam Lake Retreat: havenonadullamlake.com-Use code LITTLEDAN for 10% Off!
IG: @haven_adullam_lake
The Library of Daniel Bradley: Patreon.com/daniels666time
Braving the Brightside Hub: https://www.buzzsprout.com/2498205
New episodes every Friday at 2 pm on all major podcast platforms. Interested in being a guest or perhaps just wanna chat and share opinions or concerns? Email me at Bravingthebrightside@gmail.com or slide into the dm's as the kid's say @braving_thebrightside
Appreciate yous.
Love,
Dan
I'm in Philly, so yeah, all right. That's you know, people are angry.
SPEAKER_01But yeah, I mean at some point in time, you know Seriously, you guys are born fucking angry.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I mean we wouldn't be able to do that.
SPEAKER_01Yelling at your mom for being inconvenient. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, we come out of our mom and put up a lawn chair in front of a parking spot immediately and then screaming up a cigarette. There are moments in life where you wake up and realize you've been surviving more than you've been living. You're showing up, you're handling responsibilities, you're smiling when you're supposed to smile, maybe even convincing people around you that everything is fine. But somewhere underneath the routine, underneath the noise, there's a quiet voice asking if this is really it. I think a lot of us know the feeling more than we care to admit. The feeling of carrying things we don't talk about. Shame, regret, old stories, versions of ourselves we'd rather forget. The moments we wish we could erase. The habits that became coping mechanisms. And the masks that we learn to wear just to make it through yet another day. But here's what I've learned. People are not broken because they struggle. They're human. And somewhere along the way, many of us were taught to hide the very things that needed understanding the most. We become experts at pretending we're okay. We learn how to perform strength instead of actually feeling it. We learn how to stay busy enough so we don't have to sit quietly with ourselves. This podcast exists because I believe there is something powerful about honest conversation. Not polis conversation, not perfect conversation, but honest conversation. The kind that reminds us that struggle is far more common than we think. That behind closed doors, people are carrying battles that you would never see just by looking at them. Addiction, shame, fear, the quiet belief that they've gone too far to come back from. And yet, time and time again, people find their way back to themselves. The kind that reminds you that you are not the only one figuring it out. That healing doesn't always arrive in a big dramatic moment. Sometimes it shows up very slowly through perspective, through connection, through hearing someone else speak the words you've been too afraid to say out loud. And maybe that's what growth actually really is. Not becoming somebody entirely different, but slowly returning to who you were before the world convinced you to hide. If you've ever felt stuck, if you've ever questioned yourself, if you've ever looked in the mirror and wondered how you ended up carrying so much weight alone, well, this space is for you. Because there is still a version of you worth fighting for. There is still light, even when life feels heavy. And sometimes the bravest thing we can do is stay open long enough to find it. My name's Dan Bradley, and this is Braving the Bright Side. Boy, howdy, it's the uh it's the first day of May, which is arguably the best month of the year. Uh yes, I may be slightly biased because it just so happens to be my birthday month, May 24th. Just throwing it out there. Um, I hope you're hanging in there. Hope you're all finding some small moments in your day that actually belong to you. It's important. Maybe that's like reading outside for 10 quiet minutes or snuggling up with a furry friend, going for a hike, re-watching a comfort movie, or I don't know, apparently building a ballroom. I've been told that that's super important too. Whatever your version looks like, I hope you've been protecting your peace a little bit, because it gets pretty loud and noisy out there. Life moves fast, and sometimes taking care of yourself isn't some big grand gesture, right? Sometimes it's just remembering to slow down long enough to literally just breathe. That's pretty important. And hey, if you happen to be listening to this before 5 p.m. today, May 1st, I'll be speaking at an online event called Life on Fire. I'll be joined by some incredible humans sharing stories about resilience, rebuilding, purpose, and what it means to reconnect with yourself when life pulls you right off course. The link is going to be in the episode description. It's completely free. There are free gifts involved. Honestly, a suspicious amount of free things happening here. But it's all really, really good stuff with some really, really good people, and it should be a lot of fun. So come on and hang out if it feels right for you. If you have some time to kill. Now, this segment is where I would give you something that we honestly don't get enough of. Because if you open your phone for five minutes, it feels like the world is kind of collapsing in real time. Bad news spreads fast. Fear spreads faster. But good still exists. Quietly, consistently. Sometimes in huge ways, sometimes in tiny moments that people never hear about. So this part of the show is a reminder. Not everything is chaos. Not everything is broken. There are still people helping people. Animals being saved, ideas making life better. This is your good news segment. All right, number one. Police rescue ducklings from a storm drain. In Washington State, police officers responded to a very serious emergency. Five ducklings trapped beneath a storm drain. Officers carefully lifted them out one by one and reunited them with their mother waiting nearby. No arrests, no drama, just full-on Disney ending. Number two, whale rescue mission successfully frees Timmy. A young humpback whale named Timmy spent weeks stranded in a shall in shallow waters off of Germany's Baltic coast. After multiple rescue attempts, a team finally transported him back into the deeper ocean water, where he safely made his way back towards the North Sea. Number three, scientists found a way to turn trash into hydrogen fuel, kind of similar to an article I read two weeks ago. Slightly different. Researchers developed a method to convert old battery acid and plastic waste into clean hydrogen fuel, meaning things we normally throw away could eventually help power the future. Uh, which is one of those stories that quietly reminds you that science is still doing some pretty incredible things behind the scenes. Also, I don't know about you, but I never know how to get rid of batteries my entire life. And no one's really given me an answer. So, uh, number four, firefighting donkeys are helping prevent wildfires. That's a fantastic headline. In Spain, donkeys have been protecting a national park for years by eating dry vegetarian. Okay. Dry vegetation that would otherwise fuel wildfires. Man, I really botched that one. They literally reduce fire risks just by wandering around and being hungry. Nature's lawnmowers, but with way better PR. That's kind of a cheesy line, but I love it. Number five, puppies rescued from Georgia wildfires are finding homes. After wildfires tore through parts of South Georgia, nearly 20 rescued puppies were transported to safety and are now up for adoption. Animal shelters stepped in fast after our local shelter was destroyed, giving these little guys a second chance instead of letting disaster define their story. Tiny Paul's big comeback story. Number six, volunteers built 10,000 beds for kids in just one day. More than 6,000 volunteers gathered in North Carolina and built 10,000 beds in 24 hours for children who don't have a bed of their own. Think about that. Thousands of strangers showing up to make sure kids have somewhere safe to sleep. That's humanity at its absolute best. Number seven, uh rescue groups save 130 cats from unsafe conditions. Animal rescue teams in Tennessee recently saved 130 cats and kittens from a property where they were living in dangerous conditions. Multiple shelters teamed up to provide foster care, medical attention, and safe placement. It's one of those reminders that compassion often looks like people quietly doing hard work behind the scenes. No spotlight, no fame, just consistency, kindness, and showing up for animals that needed somebody. Kip Grange is the founder of Sonder Mountain Apparel, a brand built around perspective, connection, and the reminder that every person you pass is carrying a story of their own. But behind the company is a deeply personal journey, one shaped by addiction, recovery, rebuilding, and the difficult work of learning how to come back to yourself. In this conversation, we talk about shame, sobriety, identity, mental health, and what it really means to start over when life has brought you to the absolute edge. Kip's honesty is raw, thoughtful, and incredibly human. So settle in, take a breath, and let's get into it. Here's my conversation with Kip Grange. But behind the message is a man who had to learn those lessons the hard way. Kip, welcome to Braving the Bright Side, my friend. Appreciate it, man. Yeah, I'm glad you have you here. Um, how's it going over there in Colorado, right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's been beautiful. Yeah, I'm out of uh Denver, born and raised here. Uh spent most of my life here, lived a little bit in LA. Um, some of my childhood in New Zealand, but most of my time here. It's been the warmest winter I think we've had, at least since I've been alive. Oh, really? It's 90 degrees the other day. 90 in March. In in Colorado, we're supposed to be the snowy place. Ski resorts um have barely opened up. We're already in a national drought. It's been a wild winter.
SPEAKER_02Damn, that's that's we had the exact opposite. We had like the most brutal coldest winter, I think, I've seen in a in a in a minute. It was yeah, that's what I heard. Yeah, it was awful. It was I would uh good for you for the 90-degree weather. I mean, I'm jealous of right now, but obviously it's not great for Colorado or skiing, but yikes, dude. Well, let's um, you know, you're the the founder of Sonder Mountain um apparel. Love the name. For those who aren't familiar, why don't we talk about how did you come to that name? Saunder Mountain.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so Saunder has been my favorite word. Um I think probably since beginning of high school, it's probably when I figured out what the word meant. Um, saunder means the realization that anyone around you is living as vivid of a life as you are at any given point. Yeah. Um, I think it it just struck me because especially as a as a high school kid, I lived in this with this mentality that I was sort of the center of of the world. I was certainly the center of my own world. Um and you know, I had parents that reminded me all the time that I was not the center of the fucking world, but but to put it into context and then squeeze it into one word that literally means the people that you're walking by on the street uh are living a life just as huge and bright and full of trauma and happiness and sadness is yours.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um so I I've always just felt like it was the most powerful word in my entire life. Um and mountain, obviously, it it's more based out of Denver. Right. Um I uh I tooled with that with the Sonder Mountain. I thought that it it it always sounded good in my head, but we are not a mountain apparel company, you know, we're not an REI type North Face deal. And I think when we started out, so many people would start reaching out and say, like, you know, do you guys sell backpacks and hiking sticks and shit like that? And it's like, you know, I kind of I messed up on the on that scale, but uh as our name grew, it it you know, we stuck with it, and you know, that's where the name came from. I mean it's I'll try to balance down the answers a little bit, try to get through all of this. That's great. Yeah, you tell me.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and you've talked about it. Let's wrap it up. We gotta, we gotta, we gotta end this now.
SPEAKER_01Thanks so much for having me.
SPEAKER_02Um, that's cool. You know what's funny about the difference there is that I actually didn't even know. I had to look up, I had to Google Sonder. So you know, my favorite word in high school was taint. So I feel like you're off to, you know, just much more highbrow. Yeah, taint. Oh yeah. Yes, yes.
SPEAKER_01That's how much more highbrow you will. Yeah, I stretched my taint getting out of the hot tub the other day. So yeah, I know what that is.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, you get it. I'm not gonna make an apparel. Maybe I will make an apparel with that. I don't know, we'll say apparel. Yeah. Taint Mountain isn't, I don't know, it doesn't sound terrible.
SPEAKER_01No, I don't think you should do that. Yeah, I should probably be more confusing than Saunder Mountain.
SPEAKER_02Uh um, well, Kip, what I like about, you know, I re I reached out to you because obviously your the clothing, the the apparel itself is fantastic, and I love the look of it. I love the feel of it. Um, but then I actually started reading about the store. And um, you know, what's really cool about it is it's really steeped in mental health awareness, which really ties into the name really well. Um, how did that come about? How did you decide that you wanted to launch this thing, but also, you know, have it a big part of it still steeped in in mental health awareness?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I mean it's if you've ever visited uh the shop, there's a portion of the website uh that's our story. And it's essentially my story. Um it's so it's very clear, it's not a secret that I am a part of a huge family of uh recovered addicts. Um I I spend most of my young adult life drinking my life into the ground. It started off as a party, ended, you know, in the gutter multiple times. Yeah. Excuse me. Um but you know, so I I spent my well I think around seven years trying to get sober. Um four treatment centers, countless detox, um, sober living houses, IOPs, therapy, everything. And finally, you know, I hit a a breaking point, and it was death or or sobriety. Thank god I chose sobriety, and and I think that's the point that you need to get to most of the time to get sober, um or long-term sobriety. But during my seven-year stint of on again, off again, um I I spent a lot of time in the recovery community, obviously. Um, I mean, towards the end, I was just living in the recovery community.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And so I saw, you know, these communities all over the country that I was becoming a part of struggling to really survive. And it was, you know, trying to figure out every way possible to keep the lights on and in these treatment centers and sober livings and um and it was not like your typical uh healthcare community type deal where insurance was taking care of it, or it was it was really like where is our next dollar gonna come from? Right. So in those seven years, I had always wanted to, since I was a kid, create uh a clothing line, but in those seven years of getting sober, I started to see a need for supporting these communities. Started doing research, realized that beyond your typical uh you know, community donations and nonprofits, there was no financial support from other companies. Um what I also noticed was every treatment center I ever went to, they had their own apparel or swag or whatever, but it said, you know, like so-and-so addiction recovery. It's like who the fuck wants to wear that? Yeah, who's gonna add it? Yeah, and unfortunately, we live in a society where it's frowned upon if you are in recovery or if you're an active addiction. And so it was like, well, you are missing out on a huge portion of money that you could be making just by. Switching up what your you know your sweatshirts and your t-shirts look like, you know, because families want to support their family members that are in this, but nobody wants to walk around with like my son's a fucking addict, right? Um, and has ruined all of our lives, you know. And so I have uh a background in the arts, I have a degree in music, I've spent most of my life in the arts, and I started designing uh apparel for these different communities and was doing it for free. And then I started hosting a website with all of their uh their different you know communities listed that they could sell and all of the profits would go to them. That was my way of supporting them without having any money myself at the time. Um, and in that process, I created Sonder Mountain, which was really like the foundation of it. So Saunder Mountain brings people in, and then if you buy any Sonder Mountain apparel, a portion of our profits go out to support people who are in their recovery um process. If you buy any of our partners in recovery any of their swag, then it all goes to them and it goes to those specific communities. So it's evolved. I mean, we've only been around for a couple of years and it it's grown.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, and um that's pretty badass, man, to be able to give back to that community that is wildly uh underfunded, and you know, seems like more and more is overlooked anymore.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and you know, there's you you always hear the stop the stigma. Right. Um, but there is such a stigma around it that even donations going in from nonprofits, larger donations, they will go to the big contenders almost always. So you've got these small companies scattered throughout the United States that have about as good of a chance of staying alive over a period of five years as someone opening a fucking restaurant, like yeah, it there is it is purely out of the goodness of these people's hearts. Nobody wants to donate towards their money towards something that has that sort of stigma, just like people don't want to hand money to the guy who's tweaking out on the side of the road, right? Right, you know, and so what we're doing is trying to normalize it because the reality is if you are not an addict, then somebody very close to you is, you know, it it is that widespread, and I'm not just talking alcohol, fentanyl, um meth, heroin, cocaine, I'm talking any sort of addiction. We're all addicted to social media, we're all addicted to our phones, those are real addictions where you can actually go to treatment for now. Um but eating disorders and sex addictions and porn addictions, and I don't think there's anybody in the United States who doesn't struggle with one or multiple addictions. So us coming out and saying, this is fucking normal, let's pull it out of the couch and like let's deal with it. I I said pull it out of the couch because I was looking at my couch. I don't know what I mean. Pull it out from the rug. It feels like a JD Vance type.
SPEAKER_02I was gonna say, is that a Colorado thing? Is that a vice president dig? I wasn't sure.
SPEAKER_01It's where we hide all of our skeletons. It's not in a closet. We don't have closets here. We put it in the bucket couch.
SPEAKER_02We put it in the couch here in Colorado. Um yeah, that's that's yeah, that's that's a really it's a really good point. I mean, what you said is we are surrounded by addiction. You each and every person is addicted, whether it's their phone, social media, you know. Um and it's dirty. People don't like to admit it, people don't like to talk about it, you know?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and the you know, I grew up in an addict family, but I didn't know until I was really the first person to get sober in my family. Yeah. Um got uh I have two two sisters, okay, but extended family. My grandmother uh has been sober for 50 years. You know, I had no idea that she had been going to AA for 50 years, like we just didn't talk about it. My uncle died of alcoholism, my two other uncles are in recovery. Um, one is in and out, my mom's in recovery, my sisters are in recovery. It's like everybody. Wow, I didn't know anything about it, so I was the first one to go off the deep end, and you know, it was it was really my severe addiction that started shining a spotlight on like maybe you guys should get help too if you can't not drink around me, type of deal. Um but it was so closed off and so hidden from me that I didn't really even know what kind of things people could be addicted to until I went to treatment the first time. I thought it was alcohol, and maybe I would see a heroin addict, but probably not because they're homeless and they couldn't afford to give the same treatment center. But it was like, you know, teenagers addicted to painkillers and and professional sports athletes addicted to heroin, and you know, the guy across the street is addicted to porn, and it was like unbelievable, it was eye-opening. Fentanyl when I first started going to when I first went to treatment, had just really started hitting the streets. So it was interesting when I first went, it was heroin painkillers. Um and then that by the second time I was in treatment, it was everybody was there for fentanyl. Yeah, luckily I had never experienced that, but you know, even being an addict and in in the middle of all of it, I had no idea. I literally thought I was the only one I knew that was that was struggling. Struggling. Yeah, yeah. It's crazy how that works. It was like, yeah, I'm an alcoholic too, and no shit. Well, that makes sense. Yeah, we drank together all the time. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Uh I mean, family history, that's same here. We when we spoke on the phone, you know, my family history, Irish Catholic, you know, it it was the I think the blood of Christ was literally just whiskey for the most part in Jersey. Um for sure. And uh, yeah, it's it's the same thing. I would watch my my family struggle, my uncles struggle, and I'd be like, oh, I can't handle the booze. I'll be fine. Like, uh, I got this. Um and then, you know, my mother was actually the first one to really drive home sobriety and guess over one, sort of putting in the time doing the work and going to the meetings. Um, and then, like I said, shined a light on, you know, as I got older, I'm like, damn, maybe I really need to uh kind of realign here. Shit.
SPEAKER_01So, yeah, and just acknowledging that it's a real thing that most people deal with. Yeah, yeah. Um I was so ashamed of anybody finding out that I was an addict. That at one point early in my journey, I probably would have rather died than really admit to anybody that I so the shame was was so overbearing that you didn't even want to deal with it.
SPEAKER_02You would rather just done right then there.
SPEAKER_01Excuse me. Um yeah, it is a disease that is created by shame 100%. For sure, you know, all aspects that you know about the disease, the anger and the disruption, and um you know, the stupid decisions and the depression, anxiety, suicidal thoughts, it all comes from shame. Yeah, and one of the first things that I learned is that rage and anger are just shame's bodyguard. So I was so angry at the world, but I wasn't, you know, I wasn't actually pissed at my parents for giving me alcoholism. I was ashamed of being an alcoholic. Yeah, I didn't want my life to be over that early, and that's kind of how I saw it. It is a disease that is created by shame 100%. For sure, you know, all aspects that you know about the disease, the anger and the disruption, and um, you know, the stupid decisions and the depression, anxiety, suicidal thoughts, it all comes from shame. Yeah, and one of the first things that I learned is that rage and anger are just shame's bodyguard. And so I was so angry at the world, but I wasn't, you know, I wasn't actually pissed at my parents for giving me alcoholism. I was ashamed of being an alcoholic.
SPEAKER_06Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I didn't want my life to be over that early. That's kind of how I saw it.
SPEAKER_05Hmm.
SPEAKER_02So, you know, you've been through the ringer. What was what was to you your you know, your rock bottom? You said that you're you realized you either got to get sober or you had you're gonna die because you're in and out of a bunch of different rehabs and stuff. Well, to you, what was your your final rock bottom that you decided, all right, well, I gotta do something because this is it.
SPEAKER_01Um man, I had so many rock bottoms.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I mean uh I hit like four before I realized you should probably should probably uh straighten up a little bit here.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I kept drilling to see if the rock would go any further deep. Like this can't be it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. There's gotta be another level to this. I was pulling rocks down with me as I hit another rock bottom. For sure.
SPEAKER_01Um yeah, it rock bottom is interesting. I think I, you know, over the course of the last decade, I've met thousands of people in recovery and heard their stories. And rock bottom, what I have found is just really the point that you are ready to make a change. I mean, it can be that you are you lost everything and you spent the last 10 years living on the street and you're just fucking over it, or you're gonna die. Two uh you lost your job or you had a DUI or something like that. Yeah. My the final straw for me, I mean my most recent rock bottom, uh, I was in a dying marriage. Um my ex-wife, you know, she she had put up with it for a long enough period. We had just had our second child, you know. It was like two babies in the house. I was essentially making money for the family, and that was it. Um couldn't stop drinking, was consuming about you know, a handle, maybe even more a vodka day.
SPEAKER_09Every single day.
SPEAKER_01Every day. By the time I would get to work, I would have 12 shots in me. I mean, from leaving the house to work. Um so and that wasn't even really kind of the rock bottom. Um I had been kicked out of the house and was basically just kind of traveling around Colorado, staying in hotels in Ardean for two weeks, spent tens of thousands of dollars, ended up um completely like obliterated in a hotel room, woke up to my mom standing next to me. She's like, get your ass out of bed, we're going to treatment. Couldn't couldn't even move, had to take a wheelchair out, um, had to go to the hospital, and and by the time I got to treatment, you know, my wife at the time was just like, you know, this isn't gonna work. And at that point, it was really like either I get sober or I'm going to kill myself. There's those are the two options. Um, and I tried a treatment that I had never, it was kind of a last resort treatment. It's one of those that I certainly recommend, but not to any to everybody. It's one of those that you talk with with your therapist about. But I've been working with a gentleman who was really the founder of ketamine treatment and chemine injections. And so essentially he said, You've got about two weeks to live. Like, you don't even need to kill yourself because you're gonna fucking die anyway. This is your last resort, try it. And so I did a really intense ketamine injection therapy session, and I left that and never drank again. Wow. Um, obviously, I put in months and months and months of work, lived in sober living, went to treatment for 90 days or maybe even longer. But that reworking of my brain through this treatment, I went in and said, I will end my life when I walk out of here, no doubt. And when I walked out of there 45 minutes later, I could not fully understand why I would ever want to kill myself. It was that dram, it was that intense. And so that was my rock bottom. And in a two-hour period, I my outlook on life just exploded. I always talk about I I see things, you know, visually all the time, and I was living at the bottom point of a cone, essentially. I was trapped and tight, and everything was crushing me down there, and changing my mindset about everything. I was back at the top of this cone, and I was unimportant and small inside of this gigantic world, and it allowed me to breathe and you know uh and I have never stopped feeling that way.
SPEAKER_02It's incredible. We'll be right back. Hey, it's Dan. Uh, quick question: Do you like stories that crawl under your skin, pull you in, and then still hit you with a grin you didn't see coming? Then welcome to the library of Daniel Bradley, my haunted little archive of original horror comedy tales. Every month I drop brand new stories, eerie, emotional, weird, and occasionally unhinged. Well, let's be serious here. Always unhinged. All written by me and ready for you to read on Patreon. Think VHS Nightmares, Neon Soak Diners, and a hallucinating Easter bunny who probably should have called out of work. If you want in, head to patreon.com backslash Daniels666 time and grab a seat. Just don't touch anything on the shelves. Some of those stories bite back. It feels like we're living in an age where speed and convenience reign supreme. And that old cliche, they don't make them like they used to, has never felt more true. Thanks to fast fashion, clothing has become disposable. The re threadery is a Philly-based apparel and home shop focused on slow fashion, mending quality, reloved garments, and repurposing recycled materials into new, functional pieces. Every upcycled item is one of a kind, made with intention and purpose. If you care about sustainability and clothes that are built to last, check them out at therethreadery.com. And for brightsiders, take 15% off your purchase with the code Brightside at checkout.
SPEAKER_00Hi, are you looking for a nature getaway? A calm place to land as you begin a new chapter? I have just the place. There's a hidden gem in South Jersey, a spring-fed lake surrounded by a quiet pine forest. It's a nourishing retreat we call Haven, where guests can rest, play, and rediscover themselves. There are trails to wander, quiet spots to read or swim, and space to breathe just a little deeper. Come see what makes Haven so special. You'll find all the details in the show notes.
SPEAKER_01Wow. That's good.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Um, so you, you know, you do the treatment, and then you're like, all right, you start doing you obviously you're part of the you, you know, you said you start going to do the 90-day treatment after that, you start kind of getting a sense of yourself again. And what would that feel like, you know, as you as you forged ahead when you started finding out who you really were? Because I imagine at that point, before going in there, you didn't think much of yourself. So, you know, the journey out of there as you start discovering who you were, I mean, what was that like?
SPEAKER_01I mean, treatment is is treatment. Yeah. Um it's difficult because anybody who has been to treatment will probably agree with. There's the pink cloud. You know, for anybody who doesn't know what that is, it is this uh short amount of time between your last drink, your last use, right, to about 90 days of sobriety where your body is trying to find itself again. Um, you have this incredible euphoric feeling of being alive, but really what it is is you not feeling like dog shit every single day. Yeah. Um, so really, unless you have extended stage treatment, that whole time is you trying to navigate through this pink cloud while trying to learn things about yourself and not get too comfortable with you know the easiest thing to do is I feel fucking great. I'm never gonna drink again. This is incredible, I don't need to be here anymore. And then you peace out, and the next day, you know, yeah, you you call in your drug dealer. Right. Life drops you in the face, and you're like, Yeah, all right, well, I tried. Yeah, yeah, it it doesn't take much. Um so I don't know if I really found myself in treatment. It was getting out of treatment. I moved into a sober living home, and I just decided that that is where I'm going to live until um and until I feel comfortable with leaving, whether that is six months or four years. Yeah. And I created this incredible group of friends there. I ended up managing a bunch of their houses, they became my first client um with Saunder Mountain, and through that experience, I was able to figure out who I was, was able to figure out that the divorce was the best thing that could have ever happened to me. Um I was able to a hundred percent focus on my kids. I found my soulmate during that time, um, somebody who supports me for who I am.
SPEAKER_08And yeah.
SPEAKER_01It really opened up everything for me.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's incredible.
SPEAKER_02Um so you know, I feel like now you start Saunder Mountain, right? Through your sobriety and everything like that after after you get out. Or you started Saunder Mountain in the sobriety house.
SPEAKER_01No. Started Saunder Mountain um probably a year after moving out.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I moved out, uh, bought a house, kind of started my whole life. I was still going through a divorce, um, but was in a really serious relationship with this person that I just immediately fell in love with. Um, you know, and it was one of those things where it was like the universe was that was it was rewarding me for finally getting through this. And I had to accept all of the things I couldn't change, not to quote AA, you know, AA is not really a hundred percent my thing, but it the just the idea of not having control over everything in my life allowed all of the things to happen. Yeah, yeah, so true. Because it's like was trying to control everything, and I was so out of control it was insane.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. I was just saying, I mean, same thing. It's you know, whether you're drunk or you're you're messed up on something else, it's a combination of trying to be in control of everything else and also numb to all of it, so you don't realize that you're just setting everything on fire at the same time.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, it's a really weird thing. You are so obsessed with control, and yet you are so obsessed with doing something that puts you out of control. Yeah, you know, my dad is like a freak of nature, he's one of those weird normies, one of those people that you're like, yeah, you don't have any addictions. Yeah, you know, he might not be real. He was that weird guy that like bought NA beer just because he liked the taste. That's that's a wild statement right there, yeah. Yeah. Um he absolutely has to be in control. And so drugs and drinking was never in his mindset where I think I was terrified of control, and then I would desperately try to control the outcome of my uncontrollable you know, thoughts and behavior.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's so true. I mean, I would I was wildly out of control, but then also I almost in a weird way, for me to control my own narrative, I would try to in a way control whatever I was doing or how it would affect somebody and and rewrite my narrative. So even though I would be lying, I would be um torching a relationship, I in my head was just constantly nonstop spinning a certain way so I can control the narrative, so I can spin a story a certain way, so I don't look in any way responsible for any of my actions. And that's kind of how I skirted any of that for the longest time.
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah, every time I got fired from a job, it was like I didn't want that fucking job anyway. You know, yeah, you know, I get get the whole divorce question. It's like I didn't want that that marriage anyway. Right, I'm in control, this is what I wanted. Um, and sometimes things work out the better the better, but I would much rather be okay with not having control over every aspect of my life. Yeah, you know, I there's no way that Sunder Mountain would have survived that I would have kept going if I was a control freak about it. I'm probably now detrimentally uncontrolled. I don't know about like I could give a fuck about anything. I don't know if we're allowed to swear on this, but no, we can't.
SPEAKER_02It's fine. It's happening, so it's just on Netflix or what? It's actually on PBS radio, so it's fine. They love it.
SPEAKER_01It's not, is it?
SPEAKER_02No, not at all. That'd be cool, but no, it's yeah, not yet, anyway. Someday.
SPEAKER_01Um start start the trauma early with these kids. They're like, what are they talking about? You'll learn.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. We're gearing you up, my friends, my little friends.
SPEAKER_01I can already tell you're an addict.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, the way you're cut clutching that red crayon a little too tight over there.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Well, that too much control.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um stop sniffing that mark rate.
SPEAKER_02Um, so yeah, I mean, what I really love about your story is I feel like it's super relatable to a lot of people out there. And it's also um, like you said, you're doing the ketamine um process. I feel like people may not even know about that, you know, might might be freaked out by that, or there's already a prejudice against the idea of that. Um, and I know you mean you're the first person I've ever talked to that's that's gone through that. So I find that fascinating and and I think it's really interesting.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, we again we live in a society that puts tags on everything, good, bad. This is good, this is bad. You know, this is made by a pharmaceutical company, so it's good. Even though everybody and their mom is addicted to it once they take it.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Ketamine is a is a weird one because it is a drug, but it's also been used in therapeutic settings forever. Um, I I couldn't really wrap my head around how is injecting a drug going to help me at all. My thought going into it was like maybe it'll kill me. Come to find out, straight ketamine can't actually kill you. It's kind of like um uh marijuana or mushrooms, you can't really overdose.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, people die on ketamine all the time, but you know, like uh Matthew Perry, you probably don't want to do an insane amount of ketamine and sit in a pool or a hot tub by yourself, you know, because it's used to sedate people in all different settings. Police forces across the country use it to sedate people who are out of control. Uh hospitals use it in anesthesia. Um but I went into it not caring what it did. If it helped, it helped. I didn't believe that it would help. But the effects of the outcome made me incredibly interested in what what I had just done. Yeah. And so I started doing a ton of research about it. Um come to find out that people have been using psychedelics like ketamine um for years and years. I mean generations to help with addiction, trauma, PTSD, uh high cases of anxiety and depression. And what it really does, there's a a Cherokee word that I have tattooed on my um ankle, and I'm not even gonna try to say it, and my it's faded on my ankle now, so I can't even read it. So you can't even read it, okay. No, but it means the snow that covers the fresh snow that covers over the taken path. So you you think of this path that everybody's been taking through the snow, and then a huge snowstorm comes, and that path is completely gone, and you have to make a new one, and and it's never going to be that exact path again. Um, and that's how they describe psychedelic healing. What it's doing is it goes in and it unplugs your uh neuropathways and re-plugs them. So it's stopping all of these places that you've created habits and and re-plugging it back in. You're like you're it's like turning off your phone, right? Right. Reprogramming, it's wild. Yeah, so coming out of it, it was like I had a new brain.
SPEAKER_02I was gonna say, did you feel like not a whole new person, or did you feel like you were like the person you were supposed to be? You know what I mean? What did that feel like walking out of there?
SPEAKER_01Did you just feel so with a new mindset? I mean, it was like I I'm obviously a very visual person. I always thought of it like the filter in my head has not been changed ever, and it is so clogged and dirty and dusty that I'm fucked, basically. Like there's no there's no new filter that I can put in there, it's it's toast. Um, it was like putting a new filter. I could breathe, I had color in my face again. I mean, that 45-minute session, I went out to lunch with my ex-wife afterwards, and she kept staring at me and saying, like, you look like a different person, you truly are. It just rewires you. It's terrifying, but yeah, it's quite the experience. It's incredible. So I'm a I'm a major advocate of responsibly using other forms if your traditional form is not working. Yeah. Always through, you know, professional settings and through the advice of professionals. Right. Um, but there are there are a lot of ways to help you get through what you're dealing with. It's true. And I just needed to find mine.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Everybody's path is different. Everyone's tolerances and viewpoints are different in terms of where they are with their addiction. Um, that's a pretty badass story. If someone listening right now feels stuck, lost, or disconnected like you once did, you know, what would you want them to understand about where they are and then what's possible for them?
SPEAKER_01First off, I mean the the first thing that ever helped me was the word Saunder. And it's not, I'm not trying to promote the company, it understanding that you are not alone in being stuck, and you might physically be alone, but it's not like you are exploring this island for the first time that any man has ever explored. You know, if you can find comfort in knowing that your pain has been felt by others and they survived it. Um, you know, we we always love hearing stories from veterans that came back from World War II, and you know, survival stories or people who came down from Everest, and there is there is huge, a huge amount of positivity and understanding that whatever you're going through, somebody else has gone through, and they made it out. And there are solutions and people who you do not know who want to help, you know, uh, but you've got to pull yourself out of the bottom of that cone because the reality is if you are stuck and everything feels tight and caving in on you, you you have to understand where your actual place is in this world, in this universe, and it is unimportant. Not to be mean, but your place is unimportant, and you are not actually being crushed. It's just internal and releasing yourself up and allowing yourself to expand and and take the help of people around you um is beneficial. Yeah. I mean it's it's so much easier said than done. I think I probably would have punched somebody for saying that to me when I was going through it, but but it is so doable.
SPEAKER_08Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And if you're struggling with addiction, life without that vice, I mean, you know, is so much more empowering. Yeah. And so much less scary. I was worried that I would have to face everything. You know, the reality is I don't have to wake up with the fucking scaries every morning. Like, what did I do? How am I going to save this relationship? How am I going to keep my job? Or you know who am I failing now? Yeah. For sure. Yeah. And when you get sober, you can actually not give a fuck. Yeah. You know, people can't claim that on your addiction. They're just like, yeah, that guy just doesn't give a fuck.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01Not like he's an asshole. He's always drunk. It's like, right, right. It's just kidding. He hasn't called you because he doesn't give a fuck.
SPEAKER_02There's no more excuses at that point. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I I I joked before, but it really does give you the confidence that you need for any moment in time that you can be prepared, but also the confidence to just not give a fuck. And I feel like it's a lot more people knew about that that kind of confidence than more people would would be pushing through for sure. It's it's worth it.
SPEAKER_01Well, and it gives you the confidence to not give a fuck about the things that you don't need to give. And gives you confidence to care about the things that you do want to care about. Yeah. You know, during my stint of of epic drinking, I became so obsessed with making money because it was the only thing that I could do that would prove to people that I was not such a piece of shit. So the more money I made, the more successful I was, the nicer cars I had. People would maybe think, well, he can't be that bad because he's doing really well. He's got a really nice house and a beautiful wife, and drives a Porsche, and it's like I did not give a fuck about money. Yeah. But I had to. And so being able to get sober, I could say, I don't care about that. I actually don't. And I can start a clothing company that makes no money, but I give a fuck about it. Yeah. You know?
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Hell yeah. So give the middle finger to all of these things that don't matter.
SPEAKER_02Right. Right. And you realize very quickly how many things that you used to stress the hell out about non-stop. You realize I don't need to give this any of my energy. Holy shit.
SPEAKER_01So many bosses that I lost sleep over. I used to lose sleep over things like where light switches were put in houses because I would sell, I sold uh new homes. You know, like three nights of sleep because of light switches. Like, I won't ever get that back. But it was because of my obsessive brain that was completely controlled by drugs and alcohol. And the only way I could quiet it was by using, and if I wasn't using, I was obsessing over somebody else. That made no sense.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. The spiral is real, that's for sure. Yeah. Um, I got another question for you. In your mind, if I ask you this, what do you think when you hear Braving the Bright Side, what does that mean to you?
SPEAKER_01I mean, the when I first saw it, it was the first thing that came to mind was the grass is always greener on the other side. Um so I'll talk about that for a second, and I I don't really see it as that. But you know, there's there's this power of talking about there's always a better there's always something better, and and how do I get to that instead of like uh braving what you're in right now and seeing the the bright side of that. You know, I always thought of grass is always greener as you get over there and you realize that the grass was just as fucking green on your side. Yeah, it's a cautionary tip. Yeah, yep. Yeah. Um and so that's you know, that's kind of how I how I perceived it at first. You tell me what Braving the Bright Side is. How well at least what do you think it is?
SPEAKER_02To me, it is the idea that um it was originally born out of looking around and seeing how easily uh people are manipulated by negativity, by anger, by blame. Um, and it just seemed like people were just getting angrier and angrier um and more vengeful. And the idea was that I feel like at some point in time it takes you, it takes more balls, takes more guts to be a point of light in a room that's full of shadows, um, in a room full of people who were rather yell over top of you, point, blame, scream, kick, um, and overall just be vile to each other. And if you hold your ground being a point of light, despite everybody else being a point of darkness, I think that takes a lot of guts. And I think it's really, really important, especially nowadays, more than ever. Um, because that's the only way you're gonna be able to spread more well, more light in this world is by being a point of it, despite what everybody else tries to push on you to tell you what you should be angry about, what you should be upset about, or what you should be yelling about. And if you stand your ground and say, no, it's that's not what I feel. I feel this is important to me, and I'm going to continue to treat people with kindness and with empathy, despite when you tell me, and despite everybody else around me being vile, I'm going to continue being a point of light. That was the original idea as well, as as from the for the podcast, anyway. Um, and really also like for me personally, braving the bright side is you know, especially I was I was a piece of shit for a while as well. And you know, everybody has those demons, everybody has the shit that they go through. And if you are going through it and you're just on the bottom, like the rock bottom that you that you talked about, and and or just overall feel like an absolute failure, no matter what you're going through, if you can still show kindness and empathy despite your own um shit, you know what I mean, despite anything you're going through, if you can still be kind to animals, to humans, to show empathy, to listen to others, to look out for others, even when your life is falling apart. I think that takes a lot of bravery. And I think that's braving the bright side as a whole is continuing to be a point of light, even if you're yourself is surrounded by darkness and you don't see that yourself, to still be able to be that for somebody else, I feel like, is takes bravery on Hollow level.
SPEAKER_01And you gotta get out of the East Coast. I know how it is, man. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you do. My mom's from Austin. Uh so I know what you're talking about, and everybody's being mean to you. That's a phenomenal response right there.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's us Philly folks, you know.
SPEAKER_01This idea is hugely important even when Donald Trump is not president. You know, but with any politics there there is a really dark side. But I feel like Trump's previous four years, and now this last year, year and a half, you see it just so deep in our core. It is like good versus evil, and everybody thinks that they're the good one.
SPEAKER_04Right.
SPEAKER_01Um, which makes it more damaging. And you've got families that are being torn apart because of their politics, which is was never really a thing. Um how should we treat citizenship and people who don't look like us, and um I think one of the reasons why I really wanted to come on this podcast was because of the time that we're in right now, and it is so hard to stay sober as an addict on a daily basis anyway. But in these times where you are bombarded daily by just shit energy, and I can't even imagine what people who don't look like me uh are are dealing with. Yeah. I mean women, trans people, LGBTQ community, black and brown people, it's like whatever I'm feeling, it's gotta be a thousand times heavier. Yeah, and then you look at that community, and those communities are at a higher risk of addiction and um you know being unhoused or or discrimination. It's it's like if if you are staying sober during this time with everything going on, then that's a straight up miracle. Yeah, you're a warrior, yeah. And so being able to come on uh a show like this and talk about you know, there is a bright side, and and when you look beyond your algorithm on your feed, which mine is just tattoos and negativity, yes, um, and I can't get away from it. It's like uh you do want to watch this, and I'm like, Yeah, I do, and I feel angry, and then I see a tattoo, and it's like um if you get outside of that and you start to look at the bright side, eight million people, eight million Americans came together on one day that has never happened to support other people. I mean, you are getting people like me, privileged white males, out on the streets protesting for the lives of other people. I am not really getting hit that hard with all of this. It's just hitting my soul.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_01You know, I I do not fear for my life. I don't, I'm eighth-generation white male and uh American, you know, my my family has money. I I do not have the fears that these other people have, but it is this massive brightness that not only is most of our country coming together in support of one another, in support of women's rights and LGBTQ rights, and black and brown rights, and voting rights, and uh gender rights, but the world is. You're seeing other countries protesting for our freedoms as well. It is always a minority that is in the dark, yeah, and they are the loudest and the scariest, but it's never majority. Because if it was, we wouldn't be here. Right.
SPEAKER_02Right. And that's why that algorithm is so dangerous sometimes because it really does make it seem like holy shit, we are we are we are all of our rights are stripped away, everyone's rights are getting stripped away. We can't say this, we can't do that. You know, it really does feed on your fear, and you're like, no, no, no, I need to stay informed, you know, as I punch the drywall.
SPEAKER_01Um freaking out, and it's not really staying informed, it's staying informed with what they want you to stay informed with, correct? Yeah, distract, distract yourself with this. Yeah, going out and protesting, I did for the first time in my entire life, and hell yeah. I I was worried, you know, my wife like put something in my pocket with my phone number to give to somebody if I was to get arrested. Because all we see is people getting beaten down and shot at and killed and reneged, and and so my mind is dude, you are going into a fucking battlefield, and it's time, like, do it. You always talk the talk, and you're supporting your community, but it's now time to get out there and do it. Went down there and it was like free love hippie shit, yeah. But bunch of boomers walking around, and yeah, you know, I'm in Colorado, so everybody was high and was like, Yeah, but we had you know hundreds of thousands of people protesting in Colorado. Yeah, the whole state was like, fuck all of you.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. It's incredible, yeah. And that's I mean, that you're right, and that's the bright side, is you have to sometimes I do a segment on the show where I just I do feel good news segments because thirds are impossible to come by anymore. They'd rather just tell you all the awful shit. But you have to, unfortunately, in this world, sometimes claw and dig and pull open, you know, good news and like the bright side, and you have to look for it because they make it hard for you to find it. When you find it, you realize, oh shit, there's there's a whole shit ton more of bright side out here. There's like a there's a a lot of light that I didn't even know was out there. I thought it was all falling apart in despair. And the fact that, you know, maybe at one point it was worse than it is, but I do think, you know, the silver lining of what you're seeing now is people have had enough. You're seeing the good, the good part of a lot of good human beings out there stepping up and saying, okay, we're done.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and there's a bright side to to any drama or trauma. Yeah. Um, you know, I think about the what's going on in Iran, Iran, Iran, Iran. I'm not gonna do that. Yes. I ran away from my responsibilities.
SPEAKER_02Um now I know what you're talking about.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, you know, and the closing of the strait, and this the entire world at one time realizing how insanely reliant we are on pulling dinosaurs out of the earth and using it as fuel, you know, and how reliant we are on this little piece of ocean. And if that doesn't work perfectly, then the whole fucking thing crumbles. The bright of that that I don't think that anybody really considered in you know, in the government was like, well, I'm just not going to rely on gas and yeah, because we live in a society that doesn't need to, and it's fucking stupid. So there's there's these things that come out of like this horrendous attack on countries that we don't necessarily need to be attacking, or at least this way, to okay, there might be something positive come out of this where the world changes. Trump is a piece of shit, in my opinion. The positivity of it is if Kamala had gotten elected, you wouldn't have eight million people in this country coming together and joining together in one central organized focus. We would be robots focused on our day-to-day, just like we were with Obama and we were with Biden. So there's this positivity that comes out of there's a light that comes out of this darkness every time. Yeah. And if we survive it, just like addiction, it always is bad. At least we know who's racist. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, you're like, God, dang, really? You? Yeah, right. It was like 20 years of them being at Thanksgiving, and you had no idea they hated black people.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Suddenly they thought it was okay now. So yeah, it's like getting those glass sunglasses from the movie I live They Live in the 80s, and just all of a sudden for all the reasons.
SPEAKER_01Exactly. You racist glasses now. Yeah, and talk about cutting out things that don't don't support your right. That don't add to your life. Yeah. Yeah. It's been a cleansing for me. I would love to do this again.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And love to ask you more questions.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_01This was so focused on on my answers.
SPEAKER_02Well, no, I mean, I'm glad, you know, it was it was a way to get to know you and uh for the audience, get my audience get to know you and stuff like that.
SPEAKER_01So you're out in Colorado.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Listen, I got some friends out there, so you know, I might take you up on that.
SPEAKER_01I'd love uh maybe you just need to move here. People are a lot nicer. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I've heard. I've heard. Actually, there was a point in time where I went to Denver like five times in a row, five years in a row, but it was for the Great American Beer Festival. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So yeah, a lot of beer, a lot of weed, but people come out with their like hikers on. Yeah. They're born here with you know, like uh REI tent. Yeah. And Patagonia, Patagonia diapers.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Brand new, barely even touched. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Um, well listen, let's uh for those who don't know, where do they where can they find your uh for where can they find Saunder Mountain Apparel?
SPEAKER_01Online, our shop is Saunder MountainAparel Co. com co. It's a long uh drawn out domain. But it is what it is. Uh shop app, you can find us on Instagram, Facebook, good shops there as well. Yeah, and we're ever expanding. We've got a new uh drop coming out middle of this month uh that we're super excited about. Oh yeah. Some huge collaborations, and so it's it's getting there. We're excited.
SPEAKER_02Hey, you guys are on the up and up, man. I saw the sleeveless footies not too long ago. I need to get myself one of those. Those are badass. Oh, dude, they're great. I love the colors on them, man. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Um thank you.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'll send you one. Okay. All right, won't say no to that. It's great. For sure. Um, check out Saunder Mountain Apparel. Um, especially it's like an old school style tattoo. Um, I mean, just some really cool stuff from the hats, from the hoodies, from t-shirts. And I saw you guys are getting into this the pants game now, too, huh? Yeah. That's good shit, man. Um, yeah. Kip, this has been great. I really appreciate you hanging out with me for a little while on the bright side.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, man, I appreciate it. It was a good a good break from from my day-to-day. So thank you. Thanks for reaching out, man.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no, I um I appreciate you. Keep fighting the good fight out there. And then uh sure. Yeah, I'm gonna see you in Colorado at some point. I'm just gonna show up like Michael Scott at one point and just expect you to welcome me in. It's gonna be great. Kip, thanks for uh thanks for stopping by the bright side and you take care of yourself, man.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, you too, brother. I'll see you.
SPEAKER_02There's something powerful about hearing someone speak openly about the parts of life we're often taught to hide, like addiction, shame, fear, identity, and the long road back to yourself. Because the truth is, so many people are carrying struggles quietly, convinced that they're alone in what they feel. In conversations like this, remind us that they are not. Kip shared a story with a level of vulnerability and perspective that I think a lot of people are going to connect with. Not because every experience is identical, but because the emotions underneath it, the search for meaning, the desire to just feel and the need to rebuild are deeply human. So, Kip, thank you for showing up honestly, for sharing your journey, and for bringing so much openness to this conversation. I truly appreciate you taking the time to be here. And for everyone listening, I hope something in this episode reminded you that healing is possible. That change is possible, and that no matter where you are in your story, you're not stuck there forever. And with that said, if you're struggling right now, please remember this. None of us are meant to do this alone, and you don't have to. If something in today's conversation stirred something in you, or if you just need someone to talk to, I'd generally love to hear from you. You can reach out anytime at braving the bright side at gmail.com, or find me on Instagram at braving underscore the bright side. And if you've got a story you feel called to share, well, maybe your voice is one we need to hear on this show. Thank you for spending a little time on the bright side with me today. Until next time, keep braving it. One step, one sunrise, one honest conversation, and yes, one sober day at a time. I'll see you next time. Take care.
