Dont Shoot The Messenger

Property vs Stocks: The Real Reason Most People Pick Property

• Chris Ball • Season 1 • Episode 18

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Why does property feel easier than stocks for so many people, even smart, high-earning professionals?

In this episode of Don’t Shoot the Messenger, Chris sits down with Lámidé Elizabeth, an ex-investment banker turned entrepreneur and investor to unpack the real psychology behind property vs stock market investing.

We cover:
- Why property feels more “understandable” than stocks
- The psychological comfort of bricks and mortar vs market volatility
- Property vs stocks from a risk, liquidity, and cash flow perspective
- UK vs Dubai vs South Africa property opportunities
- The dangers of being asset-rich but cash-poor
- Why diversification matters more than choosing sides

This content is for educational and informational purposes only and does not constitute financial advice, investment advice, or a recommendation to buy or sell any financial product or asset.

All views expressed are personal opinions based on experience and general discussion. Individual circumstances vary, and investing involves risk, including the potential loss of capital.

You should always seek independent professional advice before making any financial or investment decisions.

Past performance is not indicative of future results.

If you want to see what life in Hoxton Wealth is like, please visit: / @hoxtonlife

For more information on Hoxton Wealth careers, please https://www.careers-page.com/hoxtonwealth.com

For my videos by Chris, please visit his Youtube: ⁨@ChrisBallHoxton⁩

SPEAKER_00:

So, welcome back to another episode of Don't Shoot the Messenger. And today I have a very special guest with me, Lamaday.

SPEAKER_02:

But when I first started, I was in my final year of university and I was just like recording videos on my iPhone.

SPEAKER_00:

When when did you realise initially, ah, there that you know I can actually plug this into something else?

SPEAKER_02:

Was just focused on just put the work out there and you can perfect it later.

SPEAKER_00:

How how do you take people from watching your content online to bringing them over to someone that you want to work with and they want to work with you?

SPEAKER_02:

There's a certain level of trust that people have been able to build because they're like, we've seen her do it herself. It's a high-quality audience and so a lot of people want access to them.

SPEAKER_00:

What initially sparked your interest in property then?

SPEAKER_02:

This just feels like it's more tangible.

SPEAKER_00:

Do you still hold those beliefs now?

SPEAKER_02:

Do hmm. Yes.

unknown:

Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

I do. And I do wish I got started with those things earlier as well.

SPEAKER_00:

Risks of investing in property.

SPEAKER_02:

It's really, really difficult.

SPEAKER_00:

Everyone always tells you about their winners. Everything is like TikTok shop, TikTok, TikTok, TikTok. What's your business model look like for 2026?

SPEAKER_02:

More of the same, really.

SPEAKER_00:

So welcome back to another episode of Don't Shoot the Messenger. And today I have a very special guest with me, Lamaday. So she started her career working at Citibank in financial services. So not financial planning, but she was working in the city, and she's had a shift in her career, I think, is the is the best way to describe it. And we will uh we will get into that. But she now uh owns the studio that we're currently uh recording in, which is really cool. Um and she also uh they also have co-working here as well, a co-working space, and she also has uh a really really successful YouTube and online presence that she's cultivated, which helps other people invest in various different uh areas or you know, and in particular property, which is what we'll be talking about today. So thank you very much for coming on and great to have you.

SPEAKER_02:

Thank you for inviting me. I'm excited for the conversation.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, me too. So I'm really, really keen to hear or understand your shift from financial services to entrepreneur and how that, you know, how that came about.

SPEAKER_02:

Okay, so um, so I guess I'll give a little bit of a background because it'll probably make a little bit more sense. So I grew up in London in Hackney, very much like low socioeconomic background. So when I was at uni, so I studied at the London School of Economics, my like way to sort of like make it was to work in investment banking because obviously if you're in London and you're a graduate, the best paid graduate jobs are in finance um and particularly in invest particularly in investment banking, so that was like the goal, but also at that sort of like university, that was everyone's goal. So it was like, okay, get into investment banking, and then at that point I would have felt like I've made it. Um so, but I think thankfully, as Gen Z, we also were, you know, grew up partially with like the internet and social media and stuff like that. And so at the point, so this was 2017, 2017, yeah, that's when I started university. Um, and then there was so the the the dream grad role, the starting salary was 50k, right? That was like the dream grad role in investment banking. And I was watching this YouTuber who was like a hair influencer, and she was like, Oh, um, she was like, I think it was January as well, and she was like, Oh, gonna set my goals for this year, but I'm also gonna set my goals for this month, and this month I wanna make 50k. And I was sort of like, did I hear that correctly? Like, is this so surely this is not right? So I went through the comments, and everyone in the comments were kind of like saying the same thing, like, are we sure? Like 50k in one month. And I think that sort of just opened my eyes to like, you know, because of like the internet and you know, people being self-employed or just being able to take a bit more control over how they earn money, this sort of like correlation between intelligence or like how hard you work and how much you're earning, not that influencers and stuff don't work hard because now I do a lot of content creation, it is very hard, but like that sort of relationship between those two things is sort of divorcing itself. So just because you went to a good university, you had good grades, you got into a good job, doesn't mean that you are going to be earning lots of money, right? So we've seen, and now we see it even more, right? Like I actually just saw like Mr. Beast the other day. Um, he tweeted that he made nine figures just from like YouTube AdSense revenue, like just YouTube AdSense, nine figures. So it's like the the world had changed so much. So I think I started off like just wanting to get into investment banking, but then I started to see how much creators were earning, and so I was like, okay, I at least want to initially I was like, okay, I'll try to balance the two, so have a corporate career, but then also start doing some creative stuff on the side and see where that goes. Have you always been a creative? No, no, I don't even think I'm a creative now, to be honest. Um, not not been very creatively inclined at all, really. I guess like prior to content creation, as it feels in and of itself, the creative people were the people who did music and art. And so if you wasn't really doing like musical art or like videography or photography, you weren't really seen as creative. So I definitely did not consider myself a creative at all. For me, I was like, I saw myself as like an academic, quite rigid and stuff. Um, and even when I came into the creation space, it was still focused on stuff that was quite academic or like work-related, corporate related. So yeah, no, I didn't really see myself as a creative.

SPEAKER_00:

Um, did you so do you treat YouTube like a process then? Do you because you know the content you produce is fantastic. And I know from watching it, you know, I've learned a lot from watching your videos, and I know lots and lots and lots of other people have learned a lot as well. And I'm, you know, I work in financial planning, it's my job to it's my job to to look at investing. How do how do you treat how do you go about how do you go about building it?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, so now like I don't even say like I'm a YouTuber, I don't even really say I'm a content creator, I literally say that I have a media-powered investment company. So like the mindset that I view it with is completely different. Because I think when you sort of just view it as like I guess it depends, like if you want to be seen as a creator or an influencer, then you might just say, Oh, I have a YouTube channel or I have a, you know, I'm I'm a creator, I'm an influencer. But if you want to be seen as like an entrepreneur, then you really have to brand it in a different way because then people are gonna take it differently. Um, and so in in terms of what we do, like the actuality of what we do is that you know, we use media to help people invest. Because at the back end of it, how we're actually making money is that we are supporting people to invest. So whether that is purchasing property in the UK, whether it's purchasing property in Dubai, um, fundraising, like if founders are doing fundraising and raising invest um angel investment routes, like we're part of that. So I view it completely differently, and I do view it as a business, there is a team, there's processes, it's not just like a oh, I'm just putting out content and sort of we'll see how it goes. There's a lot of intention behind it.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, so you've got a you've got an end goal in mind, and that's why you're doing it. So rewind back, you've obviously you know you're you're very polished and you come across very well, and obviously, you know, as you said, there's a structure and there's a team behind it, and there's obviously method behind the madness. Clearly, to be as successful as you have been, there would need to be. But what was it like when you first started? Because you know, that I think one of the things that you know the viewers listening would be interested in is it's not always been that way. So when you first started, was it difficult? Did it take a while to get up? How long before you started seeing success?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, so when I first started, I I started during um so there's the podcast, and then there was me as sort of a creator. The podcast is what really took off and what has enabled a lot of like what I'm doing now. But when I first started, I was in my final year of university, we just went into lockdown, um, and I was just like recording videos on my iPhone, and then I didn't have very much space on my iPhone, so I'll record for like five minutes, upload it to my laptop, delete it, record the next five minutes, like recording a like maybe like a 20-minute video, but like having to like cut it down into different sections because all I had was an iPhone, and so I was like, I'm just gonna use what I have. So it was very, very scrappy. Um, but I just was just focused on just put the work out there and you can perfect it later. Um, I think that a lot of people try to start and they want it to be launched in its perfection, but like you really and the thing is especially when it comes to like content and putting stuff out there and like just this whole media world, you kind of have to use feedback to know how you are going to move forward. And so if you're trying to let everything be perfect before you actually put it out there and get that like social validation of like what's working and what's not, then you're gonna waste a lot of your time because you might have to change everything up and change the name or change the process or change the sort of the way you're doing content. So when I started, it was very much like I'm just gonna focus on putting content out there, and every single time that I put out a video, um, I'm gonna try and do something a little bit better, or like you get feedback in the comments. It's like, oh, maybe the music, the background music is too loud. Okay, let me lower that down. Or, you know, um, you need to film during the day. So you had daylight, especially this time when I was just using my phone, right? So when I started, it was very much just scrappy and I was just trying to focusing on getting better each and every time. And then in 2020, end of 2024, November 2024, is when I moved into doing the podcast. Um, and that was really helpful because then I sort of switched from one having to be like, because obviously when you're the creator putting out YouTube videos every whatever, wherever, every week, I had to keep coming up with content and like thinking and racking my brain and stuff. I was like, okay, well, if I have a podcast, I can just leverage other people's knowledge and share that. Um, and so with that, I felt like that was much more easier for me um personally to sort of like systemise. Um, and then I would do things myself first, and then I would think about okay, so which part of this process can I then get someone to help with? Or like, can I write an SOP? Can I, is there a way that I can like break this down into something that's more structured and then offload that to someone else? But I started off doing everything myself as much as I could, and then like um after time, then allowed other people to sort of like jump in and help.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, it's definitely definitely the best way initially is to try and do as much as you can because then you know exactly, and then you can, I suppose you can hire the experts with it. And I think the other point that you meant uh mentioned as well, so we had uh Pete Matthews for Meaningful Money. I don't know if you've ever come across Pete's like podcast. He's he's got is it 70 million uh uh views or something? He's been doing it since 2009. Oh yeah. And he started off in the beach on a beach with a um with the and he had actually had the camera which was really cool that he started off with, like this really old digital camera that you would never film with today. But his thing was exactly the same as what you said. It was you know like don't worry about being perfect, make sure just start doing it and just start putting it out there and um and you know and focus on trying to get better with it as opposed to um as opposed to being this perfectionist and you know it's I suppose it's I don't know say this kind of tongue in cheek, but it is quantity over quality initially.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00:

Literally. So you you obviously mentioned as well that you have this whole business now that essentially your content powers and we're kind of seeing that more and more with various you know it's it's not just industry-specific um financial services that you know you have people producing content and it and it's you know uh going into services at the back end, like it's you know, across multiple different industries, across multiple different service lines. When did you realise initially uh there that you know I can actually plug this into something else? And how did you go about kind of how did you go about connecting them? Because obviously there's a lot of people that watch your content, but not all of them will be potential clients. So, you know, how how do you take people from watching your content online to bringing them over to someone that want you want to work with and they want to work with you?

SPEAKER_02:

Because I started off creating content focused on like giving value and there wasn't necessarily a service attached to it, um, and also the things that I was talking about and I have been talking about, they have seen me do. So even if they're new and they come across my content, if you go to my old, like older videos, you will see a video of me saying, Oh, I'm going to go and visit this property, or like, oh, I'm going to South Africa, I'm gonna buy a property there. This is this is like the property that I bought. This is um sort of the questions that I was asking, like this. So they've seen me go through the journey and they know that I'm not just talking about something that I'm not doing myself, and I think because of that, there's a certain level of trust that people have been able to build because they're like, we've seen her do it herself, and then now she's talking about it and bringing other people to talk about it, and they are also validating what she is saying. So I think there's like the positioning as well that you have to um sort of do. So I guess like you were saying that you know the the viewers of this is for like financial planners, and it even in general, like now, sometimes I do like be forced to do workshops to like tell people like how they can make sales through their social media. I think you first have to position yourself as like why should people listen to you in particular? Um, and I think that naturally through my content, I have been able to position myself in a way that it makes sense as to why you would want to, um, why you may want to listen to me. So I will, you know, speak about the fact that, you know, this is the university that I went to, this is what I studied, these are the banks that I've worked at, this this is what I've done in terms of my own portfolio. And so I think then naturally um people then come to you with the questions, uh, like, you know, okay, I'm thinking about doing this, how should I do this? Or I'm thinking about doing this, how should I do that? And then you sort of just realize actually I can serve these people. Um, and then and then yeah, I guess like the first couple of times other people actually approached me and they were trying to sort of get access to my audience to do the business themselves. And then I thought, well, I can also do that as well. Um, and so that's sort of like how that's sort of the the way it worked. It was just like people, I saw that people saw value in my audience, especially an audience where you're building it based off of, you know, it's a large proportion of high net worth individuals or like people who are sophisticated investors or people who are, you know, have good corporate jobs. Like these are it's a high quality audience, and so a lot of people want access to them. And I was like, okay, well, if they are seeing the value in that, then I should also see the value in that, and why that we could sort of come up with an offering um that where we could help people, and that's how it started.

SPEAKER_00:

Nice. So do you have like uh do you have obviously it's not you necessarily speaking to every single person that comes through? How does that work, that side of it? So someone that expresses an interest, what's the process from there? How how do you take them through?

SPEAKER_02:

So I actually do speak to everyone who comes through.

SPEAKER_00:

Wow.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, okay. I didn't expect that. But so we use a calendarly. So the calendly is the like lead qualification. Um, it basically does the lead qualifications for us. So it will ask you a set of questions, and then based off of that, only the people who fit the criteria of who we would actually be able to help are allowed to book the call. So it's like hundreds of people who are like going through that link, but I only would have a call, and it's only 15 minutes as well, with maybe in the month, maybe like 30 to 40 calls. That's still a lot. Um, yeah, it probably is a lot, but it's like 15 minutes very quick. Um, and I like that because I do want people to know that I am involved for now, anyways. I do want people to know that I am involved. So once they get in touch and we have that initial call, then I make a second assessment of like, do I think this person is actually like sort of ready to invest or not? And then if they are, then I sort of like bring in my team and then they help to like push things over the line. Yeah, but yeah, Calendly is like very, very helpful in terms of just having a routing form and then just not allowing those who may not be the right um fit to be able to like book the call. So I'm not wasting my time.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, definitely. Yeah, I was you would you would have a lot of uh a lot of 15-minute calls, but 30 to 40 a month. I mean, you know, look, so we uh on average sit as a business a hundred first meetings, um, a hundred first meetings uh a week, um, probably a bit over now. Um so let's say four or five hundred a month. Um yeah, that that's a lot and that's going some. Um so it's very interesting to see that you as one person uh are doing 40 on your own in in a month, is you know, it's fantastic. And then obviously not all of them come and turn become a client, clearly, but you know, they're high quality, high-intent people, and I suppose that's the power of the audience that you built up in what five years?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, yeah, literally. And so but sometimes it's like I don't do um so like the other day I was like getting my lashes done, it was like 9 pm. And because I'm here, and then some of the clients are like maybe in the UK or the US, I was getting my lashes done, my eyes were closed, and I just had my Google Meet on, and I was just chatting, and the lady was doing my lashes. So I don't like it's not like oh my god, I need to sit down, I need to like office background or whatever. I try to just weave it into my day-to-day life so it doesn't feel too much of a burden for me because obviously I've got so many other things to do, and yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Obviously, I I know I believe to be great, so I mean you have to be passionate about it as well. So would you say property is your passion?

SPEAKER_02:

No, I would not say property is my passion. I would say that I am more passionate about people doing better with their finances and like building wealth for themselves and opening their eyes to all the things that their money can do for them and being able to safeguard portions of their wealth through the use of use of different vehicles, and property is just one of the vehicles that I like, but I wouldn't say property in and of itself is the passion.

SPEAKER_00:

Okay, and what's you know, what initially sparked your interest in property then?

SPEAKER_02:

I think really and truly the interest was sparked because that is, and I think we sort of talked about this when you came on my podcast. It's just the first way you know of like how to invest, because you know, everybody need to have you need a house to live, right? So it's sort of like the first thing you come into contact with. Um, and so I think for me, I went to whilst I was at university, um, I went to this sort of like talk and stuff, and there was this lady um who um used to work at Goldman Sachs, and she was saying that she quit and she was able to do that because she was able to build up passive income streams from property. And so after that, I was like, oh that sounds good. Um, so why don't I get started with property as well?

SPEAKER_00:

Um so obviously, there's you know various different forms of uh investing. We you know, you and I talked on your podcast at great lengths, and I kind of put my side across, and you are kind of putting your side across. And you know, obviously I'm I'm very interested to to keep taking that on and and you know, also educating people within our within the profession that I work in are very, very much fun, stocks, bonds, you know, minded. And I imagine that would have obviously been very similar to City, although I suppose you know there would have been big scale real estate investing as uh as opposed to individual units. But why did you choose property over more traditional uh you know, stock or equity or fund-based uh investing at the start?

SPEAKER_02:

So um I guess for myself, from a work perspective, so I actually first started at JP Morgan um in London. I did City when I was in Dubai, and um there's like two sides of the investment bank. There's like your market side, so that's like your trading floor. You have your traders, you have your salespeople, and they are making like very fast decisions, buy, sell, blah, blah, blah, hectic. Like all of the movies, most of the times that you see about investment banking are usually based on the trading floor. Um, and then there is the investment banking side, um, or like the private side where you're sort of working on deals. Um Doing mergers and acquisitions, um, you're like uh lending, doing lending to finance lots of different things and different projects and stuff. So I was on that side of the of the bank. Um, I'd always been in general more less of a macro, even like studying an econ at uni, I'd always been less of a macro person and more of a micro person. And then going into investment banking, I was did not like the market stuff. I just felt like there was too much going on, too fast, feels like too many decisions. Whereas on the other side of the bank, on the private side, it felt like we could take our time a bit more to make decisions. You know, you would create a deck first and you're sort of having conversations with the company. So I just liked the tangible element um of this other side of the bank. And so, just in general, actually, one of the first things I did was open, I think early during COVID, my first investment. I did open up um one of these brokerages accounts and I made some investments. But then when you work on the private side of the bank, because you have access to um information that will move the market, you're actually not allowed to just invest normally like an everyday person, because that would be inside of trading. So I had to close all of that down. And I think that also just made me be like, okay, maybe markets is not for me. I mean, you can still invest, but you have to declare every single trade that you and it's just like this. I just can't bother to do that. So I was like, first of all, this stuff, I don't even fully know if I understand it. Like markets just seems very overwhelming. Then it's like a bit of a hassle when you're working on the private side to be able to invest. Whereas property, I can see it, you know, it's there. I understand the process of like getting in tenant and like paying the rent, and then I understand the process of capital appreciation. This just feels like it's more tangible. Um, and I understand it. So let me just start there.

SPEAKER_00:

Nice. And what's what's pro and you just do you still hold those beliefs now? So that's the next question.

SPEAKER_02:

That what?

SPEAKER_00:

That do you still hold the same beliefs that you would now that you know you would see property. What I got from that was that property is probably more easier to understand than uh essentially how the the markets work. Do you still hold those beliefs now?

SPEAKER_02:

Um yes.

SPEAKER_00:

Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

I do, I think, I think for your average everyday person in general, I think they would understand the process of buying a property, renting it out, getting that income in, understanding the way your mortgage works. Um, and then the idea of capital appreciation, if you kind of understand a little bit of inflation and just I think it's easy, I do think it's easier to understand. I think it's easier to teach as well. Whereas now, do I invest a lot more in other things outside of property? Yes, I do, and I do wish I got started with those things earlier as well. But um, yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

So you know what the next question is gonna be what are what are those things?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, so I mean I've massively now, especially with the help of the podcast, and that's one of the things it really helps me to do is sort of sit down with people who are like very, very like stock pro stocks and stuff like that. Um, and so have been able to just increase my stocks portfolio, um, physical, um, what's it called? Physical metals and all of the other stuff that I've been able to just um increase on the side, and that stuff is actually easier to actually get started with it because you don't need large sums of capital to get started. You like if you wanted to uh, you know, buy gold today, you could do it, right? By the end of the day, you could do it. And so I yeah, I've been sort of focusing a lot more on that and just building up that side of the portfolio, also just from like a diversification perspective, right? It doesn't make sense to just only have property. Um, and obviously, property is also very illiquid, yeah, whereas you know, these other instruments are a lot more liquid, so it just provides a level of like diversification. Um, also started to get a little bit more into angel investing as well. That's cool. Um, yeah, that's been cool, and then becoming like an LP in a in a in a fund as well. Um, yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Nice. Yeah. So let's talk more about your angel investing. So I always find that stuff really interesting. Like, what makes you want to invest in a business?

SPEAKER_02:

Oh, so I am not the and this is one of the reasons why I decided to become an LP in a fund because at first I was like, let me try to figure this whole angel investing thing out, but then I just realized like it's so like it's really, really difficult. Like it's really, really difficult to identify a company in its very early stages and have a good level of like because anything could happen. Any, anything could happen, and most angel investments are gonna go to zero, anyways. That's why they usually say that you want to have a basket of a few, and it's probably going to be like one or two or three um of those um angel investments that have made are actually going to be the ones that give you the entire return, and most of them are gonna die. So I was like, okay, I don't know if I want to be the person who is literally picking this all out. So I actually just um found like made some contacts, some connections of people who like this is their everyday job in terms of like finding the right investments and stuff. Um, and I basically used their support to sort of help guide me, and then um this guy that I met, he was also like open tightening up a fund. Um, and then I so I decided to become an LP in that. So I still because with that, we still get to have uh some sort of like a an opinion and view on the the deals basically that are coming through. So you kind of get to learn how other angel investors, how they're asking questions, you know, what sort of ticket sizes they're throwing at it. But then because you're in a fund, you're you're spreading out your risk a bit more.

SPEAKER_00:

100%. I think that's the thing with VC in general, isn't it? That's what they say is you know, if you invest a hundred, you can always look, you know, you've got to go into it knowing that you're gonna lose a hundred, but that hundred could turn into a billion.

SPEAKER_02:

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00:

Uh and you have to make lots and lots of those different investments to to to actually get the unicorn, which we you know, everyone always tells you about their winners, they very rarely tell you about their losers. Um and it's uh it's it's a very tough gig. And those that do it have to have uh nerves of steel and also uh you know the it's yeah, you shouldn't really be putting money there that you're definitely expecting back.

SPEAKER_02:

So if you're doing it, you kind of just want to be like, okay, this is is probably gonna go, and then maybe if I check back in five years, maybe I would have made lots of money. But you shouldn't be investing money into it that you're dependent on.

SPEAKER_00:

Do your investors ask, so your investors, do you people that listen to your podcast and your listeners, do they ask you for tips on things like this as well?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, they do, they do. They ask for a lot of advice on so many different things. But my approach is always to just bring in an expert to cover the conversation. Um, and so we do a lot of that. We also do like outside of the actual podcast, we also do like webinars where we bring in experts to like deep dive on stuff. We did one on angel investing as well, where it's like a deep dive um into that those topics.

SPEAKER_00:

Nice. In terms of your property portfolio, you've obviously got assets here, and then you've obviously got assets in uh South Africa as well, and then you also have assets in the UK. But uh if you had to pick a market now, what market do you think is the not necessarily the hottest, but what do you think has the best, what's offering you the best value at the moment? Where are you if you had money to place today, where would you be placing it in what market?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh um if I had money to well, so it really depends, because it depends on what you want to get out, because each of those different markets are quite good because they offer you very different things. So I think obviously when you're investing in the UK, there's a level of security that you can have, especially if you're a you know, you're a UK citizen, at least you have that sort of comfort. The reason I would say that is because, you know, in Dubai, most people are not going to be citizens, right? So you're a resident, and even though you know you're not expecting anything negative to happen in terms of your residency and you can get a 10-year golden visa, etc., you're still not a citizen. So at any point in time, there could be something that could happen that could mean that not that you have to be a citizen to invest in Dubai because you really don't, um, but there's a level of security that for myself, you know, you know, uh having a British passport and having some um investments in the UK that it gives me because worst case scenario, I'd be sent back home and I'd go back to the UK and at least I'd still have some investments there. Um, but I think that because it's a matured market, there are some opportunities that you're just not going to get there. Like you're not going to see capital appreciation rise as fast. If you're investing in London, for example, you're not going to see the ROI that you might see in Dubai or in South Africa because property prices are really expensive. But then, for example, if you're someone who is interested in doing flips and you're interested in getting like large sums of capital out from property, like let's say in a year's time, London could be a good place to do that because there are so many rundown, or the UK general, there are so many rundown properties that you could take, you could renovate, um, and there's so much like financing that you can get to support that, like bridging financing that you could get and then sell it and then take out tens of thousands of pounds, sometimes even hundreds of thousands of pounds as well, that you can get out from like doing these renovations. So that's an opportunity that the UK presents that those other markets may not present. Whereas if you're going into South Africa, um, the capital appreciation is not gonna be as good, especially if you are then thinking about converting that back into AED or to USD or GDP. Um, at least that's what history has shown. I think the RAND is sort of like improving a bit more now, but that's what history has shown. So it's not gonna really be a capital appreciation play. But let's say if you're someone who likes to have like a Pieditaire where you want a property in a place that you could, you know, maybe in Cape Town where you can go, you can like have a vacate, a vacation, a vacation home and sort of enjoy it and then also then put it on short-term rentals. It does really well because property prices there are relatively cheap, you can get really good ROI. Um, and it could even still be ROI once you convert it back to whatever currency you're needed. So that presents a different opportunity. Whereas if you're in Dubai, you're in a city that is in its growth phase, and then that presents different opportunities like off-plans. Like how you're not gonna see that many off-plan opportunities in the UK as you would see in Dubai. So if you're someone who's like, you know, I really want to invest in property, maybe I even want to buy in cash, but I don't want to put all the money up front, but I also don't want to get a mortgage, and so I want to spread my payments over like two or three years, it presents a different opportunity, right? And then in Dubai, um, I wish I really wish I had invested like 2020 time into I wish I would have done a bit more of that, but it's still in its growth phase. There are so many areas that are coming up, um, and so that presents a good opportunity for both capital appreciation and ROI. So I think it really does depend. Um, but I guess for me, I'm still more focused on more so Dubai now. Okay. Um, and then we're doing like projects and stuff in the UK.

SPEAKER_00:

Okay, cool. Yep, Dubai is a very, very buoyant market, and I think that anyone that uh says that, you know, 2020 was a tough time to invest, but I think Warren Buffett says it best when he says, you know, you should be fearful uh when people are being greedy, and you should be greedy when people were being fearful. And in 2020, everyone was very fearful with the Dubai property market. Um I remember the house next to me, um, it was up for nine million dirhams. Um, and my wife was saying, you know, we should look at it, we should buy it. I was like, Oh, you know, so I don't know if we're gonna be here forever, and no no no, get a million one different reasons. Anyway, it's worth 25 million now. Yeah, yeah. Um it's gone up, uh it's gone up substantially in that time. But I think you also have to realise that they are one in once-in-a-lifetime opportunities as well, and they don't come around every day. Um, but it's I think my concern with Dubai, I think, and I I'm interested to hear your risks after this, like what you think are the risks actually of investing in property that people don't necessarily look at. But I think one of the biggest risks in Dubai is the amount of off-plan units that are coming on to market. I think it's something like 59% of all units or something like that. Last year were off plan, yeah, uh, which again presents uh a problem, developer risk. And I think a lot of people when they invest off plan sometimes, uh, aren't a hundred percent, you know. It's really important to choose a big solid developer because there are a lot of smaller developers coming up because you do take on development risk when you purchase off plan.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Um, but I'm really keen to hear your take on the risks of investing in property and also you know, your perceived risks as well of investing in stocks and equities and how you balance the two.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, so I think every strategy, everything that you when you're investing, there is always going to be a risk. So in Dubai, you are right. I think there are actually around maybe 3,000 like registered developers, but you'll probably see around like 300 or so active. Yeah, and so you really do have, but the good thing though is like there is Dubai land department, and you can you need to check the history of like, is that does that developer div deliver on time? Like, I know some um friends of mine who had bought a property that was supposed to be completed June last year, and they're only 20% done, right? So you really have to do your research like into the developer and look at their track history. And if they don't have a track record, then that might be something that you need to be a little bit conscious of, and maybe you pay a little bit more of a premium for a developer that is a bit more reputable that you know that can deliver on time because yeah, you are you are taking on a risk when you are purchasing off plan. But I think that with the Dubai market, I think thus so so. I remember like the stats for last year, there were still more people moving to Dubai um to become residents than there were um off-plan properties being handed over. So I think as long as the trends around the world continue to be that people are like sick of the UK, sick of the US, or like you get the people like flowing in, we should be good. If those trends change, then I think that would definitely have an impact like on the market and stuff. But um I think it just in general, with every sort of investment that you make, there are lots of risks that you I mean, there's so many that like it's like I don't even know where to start. Like you might have a risk of a tenant not paying or a tenant damage in your house or like a boiler breaking down, or you want to sell and it's not the market for selling at the moment, right? So there are so many risks. Um, but I think that's also why you have a diversified portfolio so that you're spreading out the risks that are occurring, um, and then you just sort of take it as it comes. And I think one of the things that you have to be careful for when you're making an investment is that you're never putting yourself into a position where you are overstretched because the point of investing is that it provides you with the level of security, you're sort of building for your future. But if you're investing, and let's say, for example, you just bought, let's say, a house, for example, you've put all your money into a house, and then something happens in your life, and then you don't even have like, let's say this event is like is now cost 5,000 pounds, which you know that could be a lot for a lot of people, and it's like, oh my god, where do I get that money from? And let's say now you then have to go and take out some sort of a loan to cover that five, to for cover that 5k expense that you have. And it's like, okay, you might be rich in assets, but then you're actually poor in your day-to-day life because there's there's no um, you don't have that source some sort of a buffer to actually deal with day-to-day things. So I think just in general with investing, like make your investments, but you should still have things like an emergency fund, etc., such that when certain risks arise, arise, you can, you're like, you don't have to go crazy about them. Because I think all of the reasons why a lot of people lose out with investing as well is that when things happen, they sort of like panic. And then, you know, it could be the case that maybe you bought a house in in Dubai in 2019 and they promised you that, oh, everything is gonna go up and whatever, whatever. 2020 comes and then you're like you're strapped for cash, you're panicking, you sell, and then you realize if you just held for you know two more years, you could have sold for X plus, you know. Um, so I think that with investing, there are so many risks. Like I I can't even imagine to like list of all the different risks, especially for the different asset classes and stuff. But when you're investing, you also still there's still an importance of like having cash flow and having like an emergency fund and a buffer to sort of help you protect yourself against you know the ebbs and flows of investing.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, definitely. It's in mate, it's always, always, always important to make sure that you're not having a sell during a bad time and that you're not having a panic, you know. Yeah. No, and and I think you summed it up great uh earlier when you've seen the making sure that all your eggs aren't in one basket.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

So how hands-on are you with your investments, your property investments? You obviously mentioned with the angel investing, you've now almost like passed that on to you know to to the fund. Obviously, you have a say in that. But with your individual property investments, how hands-on are you?

SPEAKER_02:

So I'm not very hands-on at all. I have management for everything. Um, yeah, I don't like stress. I don't like stress. And I think for me, all of the investing that I do, it's so that it's I want it to feel passive. I know people are like nothing is ever truly passive. But I mean if you hire someone, it really can be. So for me, like I don't even I don't even know what's going on. I just look at to check if the money is there, and if it's a little bit short one month, I'm like, okay, what happened here? Oh, we had to, you know, she locked herself out, we needed to change the key or whatever. I'm like, okay, cool. Um, but I have just passed that stress, paid to pass that stress on to other people. So because I've got other things like my main streams of income that I need to focus on, right? So I don't want the things that I'm using for like wealth preservation to take up the time that I need for wealth generation to actually like make the income. So I just pass it on. So it's really, really passive for me.

SPEAKER_00:

Nice, so it's super easy and you've and you've geared it that way. Do you advise other people to do it that way as well, or do you normally advise people, you know, because again, you see, you know, you said at the start with you know, YouTube, you were doing everything yourself. So you've got to that point now. Have you always done that? And when someone's first starting out, do you advise them to do as much as they can to try and learn the ropes or do you literally just to pass it over?

SPEAKER_02:

Bruh, I think, and also I remember someone said this to me when I first got my first property. She was like, Oh, you know, for the first couple of months, it's good for you to sort of like, you know, get get used to things and then try and see if you can, especially because it this was a uh buy to let, right? So it's supposed to be rel, it's not like an Airbnb, right? So it's supposed to be like relatively low touch. So I was like, okay, cool, I I won't, I won't get a management company. Um, and so like maybe three or four days after the tenant moves in, till this day, I don't know what he was talking about, but he called and he was like, Uh, you haven't sent us the XYZ, and therefore, if you ever wanted to like something like kick us out the property, you wouldn't be able to because like section four of this, I was like, Why are you even that's like I don't even know what you're talking about? And so after that, I was like, no, management company, like, because I think when you because you you have to choose whether you want to have expertise in that thing, and I don't want to have expertise in managing a company with YouTube and stuff. This is like how I'm generating money, it's like my business, so I want to have expertise in that. But when it came to like managing stuff, I think you should never just give things to people blindly because then you people can take advantage of you. Um, but I think especially if you're like a busy professional and you just wanna, you know, just start stacking away some of your attending some of that income into wealth. I think it is good to hire experts to support you in what you are doing because you can't be the best at everything and you can't know everything. And if you're trying to do that, then like you're all of your energy is gonna get sucked up in trying to do stuff. Like I remember even with my the um management company, he just when I I see I met up with him maybe like a year after I first bought the property, and I was just saying, Oh, like everything's been going great, like you've been going, he was like, Everything has not been going great, like the they broke up, and I had to like bring them together and like counsel them through their relationship, and then she was like, you know, he's not paying, and he and he went through all of this stuff with the tennis, and I was like, Okay, yeah, I would not have the mental capacity to deal with people and their relationship problems and etc. And so I for me, I think there are times where you should just pay for an expert to do their thing.

SPEAKER_00:

100%. I think that's why a lot of people hire hopefully financial planners, and obviously why a lot of people come to you when you you know when they want to invest in property. Uh, it's it's you can't be in it, you can't be an expert in everything. I think you kid yourself, and normally look, you want your day to be spent earning your you know, where the wealthy. It's going to come from to investing these things, like you said. Exactly. So you know, let's loop back around to that thing, because I am really interested in the whole you know process and how you have built yourself up on social media. So what team do you have around you now? It's obviously, as you said, it's not just you, you've invested into your team to keep growing your business. Yeah. Who who do you have around you now?

SPEAKER_02:

So um mainly editors. So the team we have, like two, like VAs, social. So the VA who just helps with like all the little things, like description box, contacting the guests, reaching out to guests, lining up the meetings, all of that sort of stuff. So especially as a podcast um person where you constantly have to be in contact with people, booking and stuff like that, definitely someone to sort of manage that and also manage the outreach. Then a social media manager that like does the posting, um, the scheduling of the content, looking at like trends and stuff like that. Maybe we should try this, maybe we should try that. Um, and then a lot of different editors as well. So, like short form editors, trailer editors, full podcast editors as well. Um, that is mainly what the team is. I feel like I'm now like I need to recruit more like of an AI team to help with some of like the mental stuff. Because I still, there's still a lot of my brain energy, like in terms of like thinking about titles and thinking about thumbnails, I still do a lot of that um because I know that it's so, especially when you're meant social media, but also like YouTube in general, because that's my main platform. Like, title and thumbnails are everything. Like that is the main reason why a video is going to perform or not. And so I spend a lot of time of my brain racking my brain still trying to figure that out. So it's something that I'm trying to we literally have been, I've been getting my like my VA to sort of support me in like trying to like create a GPT that will help us do that better so I can cut down the time that I spend on doing that, and then also trying to again use AI to sort of help with like outlining podcast questions and stuff, because that can also take a lot of time as well. Um, but yeah, a lot of it is just editors, VA, social media managers. I think it's a bit I found it a bit harder because all of my team are not based like in the UK or Dubai. It's like I have maybe I think I have got like a lot of the editors, okay, they're in Africa, so we have Nigeria and Egypt, and my VA is from the Philippines. The person who makes our thumbnail is in like South America, so they're all like all over. But I sort of need someone who is a bit more on the strategy side of things, who is a bit more like myself to sort of like because they're not necessarily plugged into the things that I see. They don't know, for example, if we're looking for guests, obviously you can go out and search, but they don't come across that in their like feed and their timeline in their space. Um, so that's why I'm trying to like figure out a way to like sort of train up some sort of AI thing to sort of help me with like the strategy side of things. But yeah, mainly it's like editors, VA, social media managers.

SPEAKER_00:

And when you're when you're putting out your content, are you mainly focusing on views? Are you making are you focusing on conversions? Are you focusing on watch time? Like what are the metrics that you use to track your success?

SPEAKER_02:

I think it's a little bit of both because you have to realize that some content that you put out may not get views, but it may convert, and that can actually pay a lot more. Like if I'm able to convert a client into you know supporting them and purchasing their property in Dubai, that will make way more money for me than views. So you have to kind of get that mix between some content needs to go out for views because you need to reach people, right? So you want some content to go out for views, but then you want some content to go out for conversion, and the content that goes out for conversion may not be the same one that gets the views. It's not necessarily that the case that content with lots of views is what's going to convert. Like it that's not necessarily the case. So some content for views, some content for conversion, and then some content for just sort of like nurturing your audience. Um, so it's a mix of the two. So we pay attention to a lot of different metrics um as it pertains to it. But on YouTube, if I if I want it to do well just in terms of YouTube, we are paying attention to click-through rates or how many people are actually clicking on it. Because again, YouTube, the with YouTube, your focus is on getting people to just click the content. Like once they click, then obviously the content matters, but clicking is the most important thing. Whereas if you're thinking more about like TikTok, then your hook is the most important thing, like your first three seconds, because people aren't necessarily choosing to watch your content, they're just scrolling through a a timeline of of content. So then your hook is the most important thing. And then for Instagram, you're kind of looking at a little bit of both. Sometimes it can be the hook because there's the reels feature, but then also it sort of feeds it to your audience first, so you want to be able to nurture them. So it really differs depending on the platform, but a little bit of everything.

SPEAKER_00:

And with with TikToks, I think we've seen more financial planners now start to use that means to try and connect with it a younger generation. Uh, YouTube definitely feels well, Chloe and I were looking previously at like the the age range, and it definitely feels like it's an older demographic actually on YouTube. Although my kids they sit there scrolling on YouTube. You know, YouTube is I I watch YouTube more than I would watch Netflix now, and I know Netflix are really worried as a business about YouTube in itself. So, you know, I I do think do think it appeals to all generations, but TikTok is a really interesting one. Like, what what have you found success on that? And you know, what kind of content have you put on there that grabs someone in those first three seconds, like without doing something completely outlandish, you know, adding crazy line to get their attention the first three seconds?

SPEAKER_02:

You know what? Of all of the platforms, I would say TikTok is the one that I've cracked the least, and I think it's the one that I kind of care least about to crack.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

Because when I think about my backend in terms of who my investors end up being, they are usually 40 plus, and so they're not really on TikTok as much. So my audience is mainly on like YouTube first and then a little bit of Instagram and LinkedIn. So TikTok I care a little bit less about. I think I think it can work, but I I'm always a bit worried about like the quality of leads that might come through TikTok. So I honestly I haven't cracked the TikTok algorithm yet. This year I'm trying out different stuff a different style of content where I'm doing just less of like just like the podcast content, but I'm doing more like talking to the camera and trying to focus on like the hook and seeing if that sort of pulls people in. It has actually worked a little bit, but TikTok like like controversy sells on TikTok, which is why I'm just a bit like do you want to be out there just for the sake of it? Yeah, exactly. So, and also your audience isn't as sticky on TikTok as it is on all the other platforms, so it's not a huge focus for me, as this with the sort of business that I'm trying to do, where you want to have multiple touch points with people, you want them to sit with you for an hour or 30 minutes or so, because that's when they really begin to build that trust. Whereas with TikTok, if you're doing like a product business, it's really good because there's a lot of impulsiveness on there and like trendy trendiness on there. So my friends who run product business, like this, everything is like TikTok shop, TikTok, TikTok, TikTok. But for me, it's not my main platform of concern. Or if you're trying to be a content creator and you want to earn income through brand partnerships, TikTok is also very good. But I don't know for what I do, I don't think it's like it's not my top platform.

SPEAKER_00:

What's your business model look like for 2026?

SPEAKER_02:

Oh, um, more of the same, really. Um, I think my words of the year for 2026 is sort of like in a simplify and intensify. So we are just focused on doing, I'm just focused on doing what I'm already doing better, um, which is supporting more clients in terms of their building their wealth um without borders and investing across the UK, across um Dubai. So we're doubling down on that. And then obviously we have this workspace and podcast studio, which we just launched. So we're obviously focused on trying to um get this to full capacity over the over the next couple of months. Yeah, but I am going, I'm just trying, I we are focusing more on the media side, trying to get more views. So we really, really um did really well on YouTube last year. I think we like 11 million views, so we really did really, really well. Yeah, we grew over 100,000 subscribers in a year, so that was good. And now we thank you, we want to like keep that going, but then also add on more uh traffic from the short form platforms as well. So that's sort of the focus.

SPEAKER_00:

I suppose long form, which is obviously predominantly what you what you do, yeah, is really where you're gonna get your clients from, yeah, isn't it? Yeah, it's like they're the people that are really interested. If someone sits down and watches an hour, hour and a half long video of you speaking with someone else in a in a you know in some podcast or you know, you talking to camera for a certain section of time, they really get to know you, don't you?

SPEAKER_02:

Exactly. And you that's how you build that trust, and then when you build a trust, that's how they become clients.

SPEAKER_00:

Fantastic. Well, look, that's been really, really useful, and I really, really appreciate your time uh and giving it up and you know speaking to our uh audience. Um where can they find you, Lamaday?

SPEAKER_02:

So on YouTube the podcast is called Building Wealth Without Borders. Um on Instagram, also Border Wealth Without Borders. You can find me personally on LinkedIn, Lamaday Elizabeth, on Instagram as well, Lamaday Elizabeth.

SPEAKER_00:

Awesome. Thank you very much, and thank you very much for tuning in. Uh and we'll see you soon. Thank you. Thank you.